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216M Spy TVs – The LG Smart TV Problem [video]

• gxs 26d ago
  What will we do when these devices start shipping with their own sim cards and we can’t simply just not connect them to WiFi?
• mitxela 27d ago
  Extremely concerning!
• oceansky 27d ago
  The title undersells it. The TV has multiple mics that can't be disabled, they constantly record everything and upload transcripts in plain text. It gathers data and metadata of all devices on the network, including IP addresses. And even analyzes network data to understand which applications are being run.
  • iueotnmuntoeauc 27d ago
    Did the video actually say this? I scrubbed through and found it interesting, but from what I gathered, microphones were only activated when AI voice input was used. Granted, there was no investigation on how trigger happy the beginning of recording might actually be. Did I misinterpret?
    • anon7000 27d ago
      I haven’t watched it all yet, but I believe they discuss an RCE vulnerability where an attacker can permanently monitor the mics?
      • motbus3 27d ago
        Not only that. If shows that it does capture lots of ambiance conversations and switching microphone recording to be easily. Also there is a scare bit that they show an almost silent stream of audio actually contains audible conversation. Why was it even recording? The "own the glass" thing is the most consumer disrespect I have heard in a while. They claim they own the TV and YOUR LIVING ROOM. They know they are invading your privacy, they know the make it fricking hard for you to be able to disable it. They are pyschos. I'm ditching buying LG forever
        • BLKNSLVR 26d ago
          > They are psychos Totally and absolutely, and seemingly proud of it. Just gross.
        • p0lychromatic 26d ago
          But weren't most recordings manually started in the video? Either through the UI, or via the root access they have? I might be missing something here, but I did not see the TV automatically recording stuff by itself (or them showing it is transmitted somewhere) without a visible UI element showing that the microphone is active. It seems that they turned the TV into a wiretap via root. That is a concern and might give some lessons for LG that they need to invest more into security of their devices (privacy indicators, attested boot, anti-root / anti-persistence measures, hard-shutting off the microphone without privacy indicators)... But you can pull of similar attacks with a compromised laptop / computer or smartphone. Of course, it's a TV, why does it need that stuff? Still though, I think the video itself is a bit misleading that it claims (or many people think) it automatically records and transmits all this stuff, while this was not shown here (unless I miss something).
          • BLKNSLVR 26d ago
            My takeaway was just that the root access gave them the ability to find out what was being recorded, and they were able to play back recordings that it made. It didn't appear to me that they were initiating anything.
    • windexh8er 26d ago
      It did. This was basically all in the first 10-15 minutes.
  • port11 26d ago
    This should be grounds for a class-action lawsuit. It’s lying, it’s scummy, it’s an abuse of consumer trust, and it’s written off LG as a company to do business with. I’m surprised we aren’t already seeing DPAs in the EU take on LG.
  • nullbio 26d ago
    Imagine the amount of power they have now with AI, by recording the conversations of half the planet. Imagine the amount of money they would be able to make in the stock market with this data, by following the trends of these conversations. I'm sure the hedge funds have already been doing this for 20 years. That's really just the tip of the iceberg though. They'll be able to build very sophisticated models of every person, digitally fingerprinted to their voice and location and devices that follows them forever. I want my data deleted from their servers. This is seriously messed up and heads need to roll.
• bspammer 27d ago
  Obviously they'll get away with this in the US, but doesn't this break a LOT of EU privacy laws?
  • simpaticoder 27d ago
    >Obviously they'll get away with this in the US I'm not sure about that. Although this reporting is aimed at the everyman, the problem they describe is far more impactful for elites and corporations. This is pervasive violation of their personal, corporate and legally privileged privacy, and is a vector for systematic corporate espionage. So I suspect US Senators will soon get phone calls from donors really upset about this.
    • BLKNSLVR 27d ago
      > So I suspect US Senators will soon get phone calls from donors really upset about this :pray emoji: Definitely need to find a powerful-adjacent group that could be damaged by the kinds of leaks these TVs represent.
• BLKNSLVR 27d ago
  This seems to be the worst case scenario, put into practice by a highly popular device manufacturer. Are they doing this with all of their other devices as well? Monitors, washing machines, fridges? If they can fit this into a TV, they can fit it into everything else. There's also a fair bit of arrogance from LG: "We own the glass..." leading to this great piece of marketing: "within an LG TV household we can help extend the ad campaign footprint to the other devices in the household" (at ~14:11) Advertising is a mind virus. These people are fucking gross. And this seems to be what all technology companies are turning into. Advertising is the Paperclip Maximiser of the real world. I recently divided much of my home network into VLANs (with "Entertainment" devices separated for this very reason), and this makes me happy to have done so, but now makes me want to do the same to my in-laws network, since they have an LG TV and I regularly connect various of my devices through their network... Tangential point: I recall on a previous article someone commenting on their surprise at how good Gamers Nexus investigative reporting was. This seems to be another example. You go Gamers Nexus. Might have to buy a supporter pack.
  • jw_cook 27d ago
    > There's also a fair bit of arrogance from LG: "We own the glass..." The execs shown in those clips used some pretty revealing language. I also had to do a double-take when they described a customer's (compromised) house as an "LG household," where they "know who's in [it], we know which devices are there... we know how to extend that reach into mobile" and tell advertisers they can "own the living room." The sense of entitlement is so over-the-top that it's difficult to distinguish from satire.
    • mitxela 27d ago
      [dead]
    • BLKNSLVR 27d ago
      I shared this thought with a friend of mine recently, primarily in regards to the use of residential proxies: They don't care about any effect on the individual people. They view their thing in a vacuum with some kind of religious fervor. It's a form of psychosis, and it seems increasingly prevalent in tech company leadership and so spreads into those who aspire to be tech company leadership types.
• ChrisArchitect 27d ago
  Related: LG TVs aren't the only ones spying on you [video] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49575176 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49575176
• mitxela 27d ago
  It's good that at least one tech company still listens to its customers! Ba-dum-tss.
• klipklop 27d ago
  Only a matter of time before they ship with cell modems so you can’t disconnect them from the internet. My LG tv post-update is never allowed on a network and it will never be updated again. Hopefully it never breaks…
  • Quibblingeek 27d ago
    I do the same thing. My concern is that if somebody makes the decision to spin up an open wireless network it’ll just try to connect to that and upload all of the telemetry it’s been holding onto. I’m considering opening mine and taking a desoldering braid to both the RJ45 and wireless antenna solder joints. This might break the TV, but at this point if it does I’m ready to just throw it in the trash and find a commercial display. I bought a television. I didn’t buy an invitation to be watched in the name of surveillance capitalism and until America gets its shit together with data privacy and consumer protection laws this is just going to continue happening. I haven’t had a chance to watch this yet, but I did watch the preview and all of Steve’s latest work has been great so I’m sure it’ll be great.
  • satvikpendem 27d ago
    Other TVs like Samsung are using a peer to peer mesh network with nearby devices instead. LG might do the same.
    • palmotea 27d ago
      > Other TVs like Samsung are using a peer to peer mesh network with nearby devices instead. Details?
  • BLKNSLVR 27d ago
    I wonder whether it's better to connect it to a network that is then firewalled off from the internet. That may prevent it from looking for alternatives. > Only a matter of time before they ship with cell modems I do wonder about the hackability of this. Will it be a purely telemetry connection or will it be able to stream video via that connection as well? (not that data costs as much these days as it used to). Can we piggy back the rest of our internet data on this connection? LG TV as modem/router? Will they include GPS, so they can also connect your home address to the profile they're creating on you? Location-specific advertising value would make that answer: yes!
• avodonosov 27d ago
  Telescreens. Can anyone recommend a non-spying TV brand or a model? (Modern)
  • BLKNSLVR 27d ago
    Possibly use a projector instead?
    • simpaticoder 27d ago
      Or even better, don't watch (or own a) TV. But this response is like when there were meat safety issues in the US and some people said "then buy another brand". People didn't buy that argument (for what I hope are obvious reasons), and so regulation was enacted to protect the public. It's clear that this problem must be handled with regulation, too. I'm all for markets solving problems, but I'm also for recognizing when it can't. I haven't seen the whole video yet, but I have a sneaking suspicion that it's NOT just LG.
      • avodonosov 27d ago
        Another comment confirms that: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49593184 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49593184
  • iamnothere 27d ago
    Sceptre still makes some, Walmart carries many of their models.
  • simpaticoder 27d ago
    I have an older TCL TV that I've never connected to the internet. Of course, that doesn't prevent it from finding open wifi access points and exfiltrating data without my consent. Based on this (really marvelous) reporting from Gamers Nexus, I probably need to double-check what is actually happening. BTW corporate meeting rooms with smart TVs...shouldn't have them.
  • ChiperSoft 27d ago
• hi_hi 27d ago
  “We’re listening?…” https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8duCxY-gnZ0&t=5s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8duCxY-gnZ0&t=5s
• jocelyner 27d ago
  [dead]
• doodlebugging 27d ago
  That was a long two hours. 15 minutes longer than two hours actually. It was well spent overall since Gamers Nexus covered the privacy intrusions that LG has built into the OS for their smart TV line and likely all of their other smart home devices. "We own the glass" and "we own the living room" don't tell the whole story. The enshittification of TV ownership and usage through smart TVs and the apps and other software that runs without user knowledge is a huge problem wherever these devices are sold. The TVs track and log every device on owner networks - smart watches, thermostats, smart phones, etc, anything that uses wireless or that accesses the internet from inside the home. I am so glad that I have avoided "upgrading" our TV, almost montly, for years now by simply sending all the Best Buy texts to spam or deleting them. The best way is to opt out of Best Buy communications and after watching that video I will do that. Our TV is a Panasonic plasma TV from 2012. I need to exit the last streaming service that we subscribe with and that will get it set to an OTA device used when weather int he area is bad enough that having that real-time local weather channel adds value. From the video - RCE vulnerabilities could allow anyone to drop code on your TV that enables them to use it as a surveillance device. Lots of microphones in the device and no way for the user to disable them. The TV is listening all the time and, using the very sensitive microphones, can detect and record voices in conversations happening in other rooms more than 60' distant. They are effectively whole-house listening devices probably using MEMS microphones due to excellent sensitivity of the devices. Users are fingerprinted and everyone in the house can be identified, even children and those who are frequent enough guests to have been ID'd. Everything that happens triggers the recording. I suspect Amazon's and Google's devices were the same with their voice triggers. LG does not allow the user to disable that functionality even after the user has disabled it (apparently) through the deeply buried menu option. LG pushes updates to TVs that improve the tracking ability for LG and their "partners", which includes Microsoft through MS's ownership of Nuance. LG tried to separate their data collection/advert business to circumvent restrictions on ... Man there is so much there. Fortunately the only LG product I own is a dumb monitor. I will be contacting relatives to offer advice about what to do with their smart devices, LG or others, so I know this starts another round of investigation for me. No Samsung or LG at my house. Almost done canceling subscription-based "services" like TV content and gaming (XBox) stuff. I don't have software subscriptions so that's great. And, I should be finished with MS OSes pretty soon and flipped to Linux on new devices. A lot of the shit and shit infrastructure that some of you build is destructive. One day, you will get your just desserts after shafting people with Binding Arbitration agreements, huge TOS and Privacy Policies, and other types of enshittifying end results.
• egorfine 27d ago
  They just won't stop, will they?
  • pluc 27d ago
    They will once they've killed television and they'll get back to the net.
• asimovDev 27d ago
  If I am ever well off enough to consider a home theater, it seems I will need to make it a faraday cage and open up the TV to snip all of the microphones and disconnect the Wi-Fi antennae (or maybe even drill any modem chips on the circuitry if we want to go bonkers) as well as any webcams. Do they make audiophile grade aluminum foil yet? Seems like a neat business opportunity for customers like me
• Lio 27d ago
  In an age where AI can search vast amounts of data having something in your home or workplace turning what it hears into text looks like a problem waiting to happen. E.g. As soon as someone proves LG, Samsung, etc. recorded and stored credit card details and knowingly have weak security this is going to be a massive business liability. That's an easy one to put a compensation figure on but there's probably all sorts of other exploits waiting to happen. I think the most egregious thing here is that if you don't give the TV a network connection that it will actively search for other ways to get the data back to LG such as open WIFI.
  • ErigmolCt 27d ago
    At that point network isolation stops looking like a privacy preference and starts looking like an adversarial relationship with a product you own
    • pferde 27d ago
      ... product you ownꭞ ꭞ Terms and conditions apply
  • bilekas 27d ago
    > E.g. As soon as someone proves LG, Samsung, etc. recorded and stored credit card details and knowingly have weak security this is going to be a massive business liability. My tinfoil hat believes that they've already accounted for this as the price of doing business. They will have already budgeted for the fines that they might incur, pay them off and continue as normal while people become accustomed to it.
  • jiaosdjf 27d ago
    The value of this data to the NSA, Mossad etc is probably the only thing keeping it secure. Never in human history has a government had the means to simultaneously spy on millions of people, to use everyday private conversations to categorise them into various threats to the state, and better yet these tech companies can still sell the commercially valuable side of this to advertisers.
• polotics 27d ago
  GDPR compliance lawsuitssss in 3...
  • marcyb5st 27d ago
    I really hope they do and slap them with the 4% of their total global annual turnover.
  • jck86 27d ago
    Somehow the EU only appears to target big wealthy service providers. I wonder why.
    • gpvos 27d ago
      Please bring your actual argument instead of insinuating stuff. Anyway, the EU's reasons seem to be entirely legitimate to me.
      • jck86 27d ago
        There is censorship of illegal streaming sites crippling the internet (Cloudflare). People are being freightened from illegal iptv boxes to watch free sports because it could be part of a botnet or residential proxy network. There are million or billion euro fines for social media and service providers like google. There is enforcement against "fast fashion". Yet there is zero effort for iot privacy, not even labels or certification for good devices. I don't want to be cynical but face it, the EU really only cares about things that generate money for themselves or big internal market players under the disguise of consumer safety and privacy. Obviously that also comes with some good effects but the perverse incentives are enormous from which we must not be blinded by ideology and warm feelings of our politicians being good and working for the people and the common good.
        • gpvos 26d ago
          I have lots of criticisms of the EU and the censorship is lamentable, but this sounds like whataboutism to me. The EU does more for certification than other governments, but even they can't do everything. Is the US going against any of these things? It is only reasonable that they go for the large players first and foremost. Yes, they should do even more, but even the EU has its limits. And I'm quite in favour of going after fast fashion.
• robin_reala 27d ago
  I mean, I’m not disagreeing, but it’s a bit rich for a site that logs data to 1,745 “partners” to be complaining too much.
• gruelsandwich 27d ago
  As an owner of a (2020?) LG WebOS TV, to what degree can I fight this? Any point in trying Pihole with targeted blocking of certain IPs?
  • bilekas 27d ago
    So I have a tv of LG from the same period. I keep it dumb, not connected to the internet and just use an apple TV, so far it's a clean option. And it's always a good idea to have piHole up to, they usually have the block list updated with LG's and Samsungs urls.
    • chimpontherun 27d ago
      Fun fact: some (most?) Samsung TVs of the last ~6 years can't complete OOB setup if they're connected to a PiHoled network with the most vanilla PiHole filters
    • realityloop 27d ago
      The Gamers Nexus video explained that they will connect to nearby open SSID’s to send the data they have collected. So just not connecting it to your network may not be enough.
      • poolnoodle 27d ago
        Okay, that is nasty.
      • exceptione 27d ago
        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital_punishment https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital_punishment
      • stephen_g 27d ago
        I hear this a lot as a rumour but has it actually ever been demonstrated in the wild?
  • chimpontherun 27d ago
• chimpontherun 27d ago
  the only TV I have connected to the home network (guilty, I admit), Sony OLED 65, ARP floods my network about 12-15 hours after "turning off". On a plus side, it doesn't appear to be streaming anything out: no local DNS hits, not enough outgoing traffic for any meaningful audio stream The choice between privacy concerns and ineptly coded network stack is tough. But that's the choice we're forced to have
  • cyberpunk 27d ago
    Why don’t you just use it as a display and have a more reputable device (e.g a mini pc or an apple tv) feeding it? I’m not forced to give my tv network access at all, since it doesn’t do anything other than display whatever the apple box outputs…
    • regularfry 27d ago
      This is (mostly) the way. Samsung TV without networking configured, XBox for everything - which is problematic in its own ways but it's a known quantity. It doesn't prevent it from "helpfully" hopping on a nearby unsecured network but a) I haven't spotted one of those in a while, and b) it hasn't ever been able to get updates to change its behaviour to make it start doing that if it previously wouldn't.
    • chimpontherun 27d ago
      This is exactly what I do on the other TV, as I suggested in a different message in this thread. But this particular TV is mounted flush to the wall and there's physically no space for the apple TV anywhere near or behind it. Sacrifices we have to make
      • cyberpunk 26d ago
        Is it your wall? We have a fairly modern house and the walls are solid gypsum so i just carved out a small hollow for it, cables are going via a channel with some ducting i then plastered over
• 8fingerlouie 27d ago
  My TVs are on the IoT network so that I can control them from Home Assistant, but they're blocked from accessing the internet. DNS lookups are redirected or blocked (53 redirected to my local DNS resolver, 853 blocked), and DoH is blocked as best effort though it's hard to block HTTP DNS traffic, which again is why the devices are blocked in the firewall. All streaming is done via AppleTV, which is a platform I trust infinitely more than LG/Samsung/whatever.
  • harha 27d ago
    If you're streaming via AppleTV, why do you need to give the TV itself access to the network?
    • 8fingerlouie 27d ago
      I use Home Assistant to turn on/off the TV via automations, sensors, etc. I could possibly do it via HDMI CEC, but I have a couple of Sony Bravia TVs that more often than not completely ignores that, so I prefer having control over assuming it happens.
      • 05 27d ago
        You can do on/off using an IR blaster (broadlink integration with discrete on/off codes). It’s when you want to read volume etc things get trickier
        • _flux 26d ago
          I have an automation that turns on amplifier only when using certain inputs, not just when the TV is turned on. I can easily imagine people would also configure their amps to use different input depending on TV input.
      • harha 26d ago
        Yeah CEC is a bit tricky sometimes. How about auto-off from the TV itself and then a timer for a HA controlled outlet to turn off power after that using automation (i.e., when the streaming device is off for a x minutes)
• trilogic 27d ago
  Is all of them, every "smart tv" does it, even after adb, permission restricting or rooting. Insert a (non infected) usb lamp in your tv and see the lamp turning on when your tv is off. It notifies you about the background activation activity :) Interesting to see when exactly get active (is it keywords or nearby devices or scheduled processes)? Can´t be keywords as that would mean 24/7 active and the lamp says otherwise.
• acd 27d ago
  This is the same behaviour as the german secret police in east germany. The difference now its for ads and by tech. All collected data are probably ai transcribed from audio to text and is fused via data fusion to serve ads. Add collaborative filtering to find similar interests between users.
  • polotics 27d ago
    how do you know it is for ads? how do you know it will always be only for ads if it now is?
    • jiaosdjf 27d ago
      Why not both? Mossad would love to know who to de-bank for criticising Israel, United Health Care would love to know who to deny coverage to based on remarks about their back pain.
      • xyzelement 27d ago
        // Mossad would love to know who to de-bank for criticising Israel "Criticizing Israel" has moved from edgy subversive to lamely pedestrian in the last few years. There's no great secret that Mossad needs to unearth by spying on you watching tv.
        • HDBaseT 24d ago
          +$7,000
    • sixeyes 27d ago
      that's the fear, but it would be reasonable to say that ads are what has gotten us to this point
  • thothless 26d ago
    this is the same behavior as the secret police in 2026 USA, the biggest customers of the ad tech companies. https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2026/03/targeted-advertising-gives-your-location-government-just-ask-cbp https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2026/03/targeted-advertising-g... https://www.npr.org/2026/03/25/nx-s1-5752369/ice-surveillance-data-brokers-congress-anthropic https://www.npr.org/2026/03/25/nx-s1-5752369/ice-surveillanc...
• jiaosdjf 27d ago
  [dead]
• VerifiedReports 27d ago
  Clearly the penalties for this are not high enough, because the scumbags keep doing it. Vizio TVs were caught taking screen grabs and phoning those home years ago.
• userbinator 27d ago
  Almost 13 years ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6759426 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6759426
• Y-bar 27d ago
  notebookcheck.net: > We value your privacy Shares my browsing info with 1745 "partners" with no clear way to opt out (which ought to be opt-in by the way to be compliant with ePrivacy and GDPR).
  • blaze33 27d ago
    "We value your privacy" → "Your private data is valuable" (I guess)
    • robin_reala 26d ago
      ”We assign a value to your privacy”
• zerof1l 27d ago
  I have a rooted LG C4. Beyond blocking things at the DNS level, not accepting terms, not using AI, I wonder if there’s some existing software solution or a documented step-by-step to remove this bloatware/spyware.
  • wolvoleo 26d ago
    It'll be difficult. It's webos of which there's very little custom development. You'd be better off with an android tv which you can poke at using adb and disable services. Maybe even root it. And install alternative software like smarttubenext. Unfortunately there very few Android based TVs left. Phillips recently switched to Titanos, Samsung has tizen, Amazon has a new OS. I think it's just Sony that's left on android now.
    • qingcharles 26d ago
      Surely the Astras and Fables of this world would make light work of setting up a WebOS build environment and be able to create practically any changes you can think of, especially if there is a way for them to iterate the development.
• monkeydust 27d ago
  Wait, do LG Webos TVs have microphones in the TV and/or in the remote? I am aware of the latter only.
• prmph 27d ago
  Just don't buy a smart TV. Buy a good "dumb" TV (or just get a good large monitor), then hook it up to a set top box (with TV capabilities as needed).
  • arkx 27d ago
    If you want a good panel, you're going to have to buy a smart TV. Just don't ever let it connect to the internet.
  • lazystone 27d ago
    "Just a good large monitor" costs a fortune. If anyone could recommend any dumb TV with good panels in EU, you're more than welcome.
    • prmph 27d ago
      If you don't need something much larger than 43 inches, and you are cool with wide monitors, there are a couple ones that seem good: - Samsung 40 inch Odyssey G7 (G75F) Series WUHD Curved Gaming Monitor (https://www.amazon.com/Samsung-Odyssey-Curved-Gaming-Monitor/dp/B0FJYNVR3R https://www.amazon.com/Samsung-Odyssey-Curved-Gaming-Monitor...) -- $699.99 - Acer Nitro 49 inch DQHD 5120x1440 Curved 120Hz Office Monitor (https://www.amazon.com/Acer-Nitro-Gaming-Monitor-UltraWide/dp/B0FS3XHDTR https://www.amazon.com/Acer-Nitro-Gaming-Monitor-UltraWide/d...) -- $549.99 - Acer DM431K A 43 inch Class 4K UHD LED Monitor - 16:9 (https://www.amazon.com/acer-DM431K-Class-UHD-Monitor/dp/B0F3B127L5 https://www.amazon.com/acer-DM431K-Class-UHD-Monitor/dp/B0F3...)-- $334.20 - LG 37G800A-B 37 inch Ultragear 4K UHD (3840 x 2160) Curved Gaming Monitor, 165Hz, 1ms (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0FS3LV3WG https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0FS3LV3WG) -- $598 - INNOCN 40C1R Ultrawide Monitor 40 inch WQHD 3440 x 1440p 144Hz (https://www.amazon.com/INNOCN-Ultrawide-Monitor-FreeSync-Premium/dp/B09N3G9T16 https://www.amazon.com/INNOCN-Ultrawide-Monitor-FreeSync-Pre...) -- $479.99
      • drcongo 26d ago
        I have a 50" Philips screen with no smarts. It's great.
• ionwake 27d ago
  I know its important to put things down to coincidence whenever possible, but a very expensive Bang OLufsen ( I think they use LG ) TV would turn itself off at "the" most interesting split second moments during gameplay , to the point where I thought "if I am being pranked by a friend, does this TV even stream its contents?". Much to my surprise I found out that many modern TVs do in fact come with dev mode that allow some sort of screen capture. Safe to say I turned off all the "allow metrics and market/dev modes" and have been happier since. EDIT> Incase anyone was wondering I did some more research about my model ( im NOT a TV guy ) and came across this regarding what screen content could technically be passed remotely: "Most probable raw grab: ThinQ/SSAP on the LAN after pairing — ~960×540 JPEG. Live Plus/ACR: most probably sends a fingerprint, not a retrievable raw frame." No idea what it means but thought it might be relevant. Remember Im saying in my case it was a coincidence.
  • Nition 27d ago
    Did it ever turn itself off after you made those settings changes?
    • ionwake 27d ago
      Im not here to feed conspiracy theories and paranoia, its most likely a coincidence, and tied to having "excess metrics and advanced features that indirectly cause a kernel panic that turns the tv off". But yes, after turning a bunch of unnecessary default options off, my TV never restarted again just as I was making a clutch moment. So in summary - remember it could just be related to high action moment fps drain, heat, high intensity stuff making the nintendo switch2 compatibility cause a kernel affected restart etc etc etc ( which is documented via the HDMI protocols ) which make it SEEM like something weird is up, but it turns out its a related thing thats not that sus.
      • secretsatan 26d ago
        Ahhh, i had that with my ps5 and a couple of games were terrible in hiqh quality graphics mode, shutting down the ps5, and then through hdmi, would turn off the tv. Both games weren’t particularly intensive, the one i remember last was divinity original sin 2, but i think both games ran on unity. Performance mode mostly fixed it, but blowing out several years of dust from the vents properly sorted it out.
• like_any_other 27d ago
  I will remind everyone again that weev was raided by the FBI, arrested, and had all electronics seized, before getting a chance to defend himself in court, all for the crime of publishing emails he found on unsecured URLs he was able to guess. But we're allowing 1000x worse things, because what, there's a vague line about it buried deep in some EULA, which means laws no longer apply? Lets treat them the same. Raid LG, seize all of their electronics, at least in the US (other countries are encouraged to do their own raids), arrest the executives, and after they're all in jail, and digital forensics are poring over their products and servers to find what else they did, they can argue in court how actually all these crimes are legal. It's only fair.
  • cindyllm 27d ago
    [dead]
• mohsen1 27d ago
  I absolutely loathe my LG smart TV. Just switching to another input requires 3 button press. I hope someone uses their free time to hack the OS and offer a clean and simple interface to make it a “dumb” TV.
  • appcustodian2 27d ago
    You're not wrong, but you could ask your favorite LLM to interact with the LG API's to switch the input for you. At least for my case, it was ~10 minutes of work to develop a small tray app that looks for a specific USB device and switches the TV input if it gets inserted. I don't really even touch the remote anymore
  • givinguflac 26d ago
    I’m unaware of any projects trying to make a dumb tv, but I like the idea. You can start with rootmy.tv and research from there.
• JumpCrisscross 27d ago
  This is automatic liability in California and the EU, correct? Does Illinois consider one’s voice pattern to be a biometric? If so, there, too.
  • c0n5pir4cy 26d ago
    If its not automatic it's incredibly shaky ground in the EU. I'm sure Apple, Amazon and Google got more than a slap on the wrist just for storing a few seconds after the wake word before.
• Gualdrapo 27d ago
  I could buy a tv in late 2014 and happened to be the last batch of bravia tvs pre android tv. Back then I was kind of bummed out that just a few weeks after that they announced the first tvs with android tv and now i was hooked with a smart-but-not-that-smart tv with a bunch of crappy ads, an unusable web browser and a non-customizable os. But they stopped updating it years ago, none of its apps work anymore and the only "smart" feature that still works is screen mirroring feature. The tv part itself still works great. Not a 4k oled 120Hz shiny impressive thing but the image quality is still great. What I thought was an unlucky adquisition back then turned out to be a pretty good one.
  • ErigmolCt 27d ago
    Apps, browsers and "smart" features are disposable software, but a good panel can remain useful for a decade. Makes you wish manufacturers treated the smart layer as optional from the start.
• korzinka 27d ago
  I've bought an LG Smart TV 5 years ago, read t&c where I was supposed to grant them any data they wanted, decided to disagree and kept all network functions disabled. I was ridiculed by my friends for that. At some point, I thought - maybe I'm really crazy to do so? Who am I, a caveman, a luddite? Oh well, I'm not. Not a bad tv though, many HDMI ports!
  • throw93947309 27d ago
    This. Why would you even connect TV to the network? It is well known for like 5 years. Smsrt TVs go through your movies library, and upload screenshots and filenames to internet. Some will start showing ads after firmware upgrade.
    • unixhero 27d ago
      They do screenshot? Do you have a source so I can read more?
      • gnz11 27d ago
        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automatic_content_recognition https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automatic_content_recognition
      • wongarsu 27d ago
        https://www.ftc.gov/business-guidance/blog/2017/02/what-vizio-was-doing-behind-tv-screen https://www.ftc.gov/business-guidance/blog/2017/02/what-vizi... "Starting in 2014, Vizio made TVs that automatically tracked what consumers were watching and transmitted that data back to its servers. Vizio even retrofitted older models by installing its tracking software remotely. All of this, the FTC and AG allege, was done without clearly telling consumers or getting their consent. ... "Vizio collected a selection of pixels on the screen that it matched to a database of TV, movie, and commercial content https://arxiv.org/pdf/2409.06203 https://arxiv.org/pdf/2409.06203 shows LG and Samsung doing something similar
      • patrickk 27d ago
• rob74 27d ago
  Makes me glad I bought a Sony TV which has the microphone on the remote - and is compatible with older remotes without a microphone, so the new remote with its microphone and sponsored streaming service buttons gathers dust (without batteries inserted) while I use an old remote.
  • ErigmolCt 27d ago
    [flagged]
• medwards666 27d ago
  This sort of blanket data collection needs to be made illegal in every single jurisdiction, and have _very_ robust penalties for anyone found in breach of them.
  • pferde 27d ago
    And those jurisdictions need to have people not susceptible to bribery or extortion by the corporations making those data collection devices. That's a big ask.
    • medwards666 27d ago
      True. But corruption by those in positions of power and influence is a problem as old as the ages, sadly. But at least there _are_ rules and penalties in place for those caught so there's an element of risk. Whereas the blanket data harvesting by corporations currently appears to go utterly unabated.
  • afarah1 26d ago
    Legislators in every jurisdiction seem to have more to gain with the data collection than without.
    • account42 26d ago
      That too needs to have very robust penalties.
• ErigmolCt 27d ago
  [dead]
• hypfer 27d ago
  I'm practically certain that there was no ill-intent by LG when conceiving this feature. It was most likely just a convenience thing. But I am also practically certain, that, eventually, any pile of data will attract ideas you do not want attracted.
  • rickdeckard 27d ago
    Yes, unfortunately the investigative video is implying (or explicitly stating) malice on every detail they discovered, which is harming the overall message IMO. They hacked the TV OS, then used the TV UI to do a web search with voice-input and observed (still on the UI!) that the voice input didn't stop immediately on silence but kept extending the search prompt with everything said [0]. The OS-hack was irrelevant for this, the whole sensationalism that a listening process is running (and therefore the device is listening to everything) is just drama added to the sober fact that someone started voice-input, the input field is still displayed on the bottom of the UI and keeps getting populated with new input. There is an important message in this about security hardening, privacy, data protection, but this conspiracy theory that everything is made to spy on you is not helping... [0] https://youtu.be/6IFVTcM28KA?si=OCmfai2KXSaQt1Bk&t=2958 https://youtu.be/6IFVTcM28KA?si=OCmfai2KXSaQt1Bk&t=2958
    • hypfer 27d ago
      I really wish Steve would not have befriended Louis to the degree he has, but.. well. Or rather I wish Louis would limit the "bulldozing" persona to the context in which it is necessary instead of all contexts ever at any time. No issue with people being friends. Just issue in standards deteriorating. ___ Is this how Twitter felt like for journalists back in the day? You see a story, and you think "ah yes, that guy's signature"? End me.
      • rustcleaner 26d ago
        I think the friendship is spectacular, and I think Rossmann should go even harder than he does!
    • 26d ago
• deleted 27d ago
  [deleted]
• xuhu 27d ago
  When the first TV ships with a battery to keep running while unplugged, I'm dusting off my soldering iron and my digital circuits handbook.
• noisy_boy 27d ago
  All devices in my home sit behind adguard. The TV can try all it wants.
  • rcarmo 26d ago
    They are more creative than that.
  • 9991 26d ago
    Adguard only intercepts DNS, right? I would be worried that IP addresses to phone home are hardcoded. Doesn't seem like a resilient solution.
• touwer 27d ago
  Funny, published on a site with 1745 'partners' who fully respect our privacy of course
  • Anoian 27d ago
    Respect for the consumer has long been gone generally except for a few brands. I am still wondering why consumer respecting brands are not emerging more and thriving.
    • usern20260720 27d ago
      A consumer respecting brand sells products. A Consumer selling brand sells consumers so they can be profiled, analysed for weaknesses and exploited economically in the name of Surveillance Capitalism
    • DarkUranium 27d ago
      I suspect because it's hard to differentiate between ones that actually respect the consumer vs ones that only say so, but are actually lying to your face. That and not respecting the consumer is more profitable in the short term (only!), which means more marketing money, buying out other brands, lobbying to increase the barrier for entry, et cetera.
    • fithisux 27d ago
      That is why politicians get rich. But also, people do not generally hesitate in front of an all-you-can-eat bouffe
    • ngcazz 27d ago
      Because there's no incentive to do it. The consequences of being tracked are outta sight outta mind.
    • recurseP 26d ago
      The point is: which brands still respect user privacy? If I were to buy a new TV today, which brands-models should I prioritize? Also, are there brands-models that in which it is possible to sideload a different OS like with mobile phones (LineageOS, GrapheneOS, etc.)
• ninjagoo 27d ago
  Telescreens [1] are here! War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength. [1] Would you like to know more? [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telescreen https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telescreen
  • SillyUsername 27d ago
    The thought police will be after you now for mocking them!
  • megous 27d ago
    Yep. LG was reading Orwell and were like. Wow, great idea! Let's do it.
    • PinkSheep 26d ago
      You need to up your irony. The proles were reading Orwell's 1984 and thought "hey, I shouldn't mind being spied on by (smart) TVs!" because this is the statistically average behavior of the consumers.
  • rustcleaner 26d ago
    Not only the telescreens, but my impression of the world in 1984 is that the surveillance depended on an army of watchers at the opposite end. Today we have models of all kinds: classification models, speech to text models, large language models, etc. Surveillance with our devices is automated, no human army of watchers needed!
    • fuzzfactor 25d ago
      1973 was not supposed to be quite as grim as 1984, but "what goes in must come out". Zappa, "I'm the Slime" - https://music.youtube.com/watch?v=9Pm3uDZxt8w https://music.youtube.com/watch?v=9Pm3uDZxt8w "You will do as you are told until the rights to you are sold . . ."
• rickdeckard 27d ago
  This is quite a mixed set of topics mangled together, which is a pity because IMO a cleaner separation would be more beneficial to get the point across. 1. The Ad data-collecting platform TV-manufacturers are operating, what data they collect and how they use it. 2. The vulnerabilities of the OS in a SmartTV, and the potential issues to exploit them for malicious purposes. 3. The general behavior of the device when connected to your network, with features like voice control, App control, Smart Home etc. enabled, and how it may expose information about yourself. All the points and scenarios in the video might be valid, but they are not sufficiently grouped into one of the above categories. Instead, it just mixes them all together to imply that its all the same, weakening the whole investigation. -- The plain example: Using voice-input for a web-search on the TV [0], make long pauses and observe how it keeps populating the prompt-UI with everything you say. This is a matter of #3 above, accusing a malicious intent already on such a trivial implementation topic is harming the whole story [0] https://youtu.be/6IFVTcM28KA?si=oVqX6NtkxPmqh6R-&t=2951 https://youtu.be/6IFVTcM28KA?si=oVqX6NtkxPmqh6R-&t=2951
  • shevy-java 27d ago
    I find your "summary" much harder to read and understand, though. I prefer the original article and the net-benefit of a google-linked video to explain things that already were properly explained, is rather small, at best, in my opinion.
    • rickdeckard 27d ago
      > I find your "summary" much harder to read and understand, though. Sorry, my grouping of topics isn't supposed to replace the entire research-session. It's merely my observation after watching the actual "investigation video" that they mixed together lots of stuff they discovered into the larger conspiracy that everything is secretly spying on the user to feed a huge Ad-profiling database. > I prefer the original article and the net-benefit of a google-linked video to explain things that already were properly explained, is rather small, at best, in my opinion The article was made FROM the video and takes the wrong conclusions and summaries from it. If you want to form an opinion and are a bit technically savvy, you should watch the video instead. For example: The video actually shows that all audio that is logged was only processed after voice-input was explicitly started on the device, either via the enabled wake-word or by starting voice-input in the web-search UI. The TV continues to show the text-input UI to the user while its transcribing the voice. This is not malicious, this is the expected behavior from user-perspective.
• shevy-java 27d ago
  These are spy devices. It is sad that the industry has become so addicted to sniffing - the problem I see is that they can no longer stop doing so, as they built an additional network around that yielding money to them.
• CommanderData 27d ago
  I posted two comments on similar threads recently. This is only going to get worse. > Not long until companies partner with Amazon and others to send traffic automatically through their near-by devices like smart speakers, disconnecting will be impossible. Not surprised if this is happening already. I don't want to remove radios out my TV.. > Samba, a media intelligence company have several partnerships with manufacturers to take screenshots and collect metadata. Viewer analytics are valuable to companies like Samba, they aren't the only ones. Laws ASAP, these companies will lobby hard to stop anything of the sort.
• CommanderData 27d ago
  "Samba unites TV, digital, and behavioral data through AI to power faster, more accurate media decisions. We help the world’s leading brands and agencies reach the right audiences, measure real outcomes, and access signals no one else has." https://samba.com/ https://samba.com/
  • BLKNSLVR 26d ago
    Kill it with fire. Such a pity the name is associated with freeing proprietary software. The _real_ samba: https://www.samba.org/ https://www.samba.org/
    • Tostino 26d ago
      Yeah...what the hell even is that "I like that name, mine now" for something that has been around almost as long as I have.
• brador 27d ago
  SKorean intelligence on China (and Japan). This will not be easily regulated. The intelligence value is huge.
• randobando772 27d ago
  [dead]
• spockz 27d ago
  Okay. This is insane. First the monitor that uses a windows feature to automatically install a small helper tool with root permissions and then starts showing adds in certain regions. Now a tv that is actually actively snooping around on top of the known fingerprinting. What else is next? In the previous topic I got ridiculed for not wanting to buy LG anymore because I could use an agent to modify to strip out the offending bits. But there must be something better than just keeping to buy things that invade our privacy and homes further and further. Which brands aren’t doing this? Sony? They also announced a partnership for the lower end TVs IIRC.
  • Sharlin 26d ago
    Well, it’s a smart TV. I would assume with extreme prejudice that every single one of them is doing stuff like this and worse until proven innocent. Based on everything I’ve read about these things it seems the most reasonable stance. > In the previous topic I got ridiculed for not wanting to buy LG anymore because I could use an agent to modify to strip out the offending bits. Jesus fucking Christ.
  • gizzlon 26d ago
    Yeah, just keep buying the poisonous breakfast serial. It's easy to pick out the brown bits of rat poison /s
  • afarah1 26d ago
    I think the insane part is that this is not criminal and the executives are not jailed for it.
    • account42 26d ago
      That's exactly why this keeps happening. If I bug your house I'd be charged with all kinds of crimes. If LG does it at scale nothing happens.
      • ryandrake 26d ago
        We need to climb two very difficult hills for there to be any change here: 1. We need our governments to actually start charging companies with crimes, when what they are doing would be illegal for an individual to do, and 2. We need the penalties to be something other than fines, which are ultimately treated by companies as routine costs of business.
• balazspapp 27d ago
  Isn't observation of LG's operation a violation? I mean it may fit the category "Intercepting live telemetry packets as they travel from the client machine to the company's servers can violate the Electronic Communications Privacy Act (Wiretap Act)"
• tombardier 27d ago
  My LG C5 is in a separate VLAN, with no access to the rest of my home network. I've never accepted the terms and conditions, and I don't need anything from it other than to be a display for my 4k player and PC. I guess now I'm going to remove Internet access from it altogether! The thing I'd like is if the remote didn't have 4 buttons for crappy streaming services I will never use, but instead had 4 buttons to select the HDMI inputs directly; but no, I have to press a button, wait for the stupid laggy UI to load, navigate or point and click at input I want, then do the same to the preview window. A tedious pain in arse for basically the one main thing I use the remote for. It annoys me no end, and it seems to me that the last thing LG care about is the UX; they've put all their efforts into underhand and user-hostile profiling. I also have a Roku Ultra for streaming, which I very rarely use. I don't expect they treat their users any better and they use ACR too
  • zerof1l 26d ago
    You can root your LG and install an app that allow remapping any button to do anything, including selecting specific HDMI input.
    • tombardier 26d ago
      Oh wow; I'm definitely doing to look into this, thanks!
• morissette 26d ago
  Why I don’t have a tv
• maxglute 26d ago
  TFW LG OLED without internet access probably flirting with neighbor's connected LG fridge and LG washer and sharing all my gossip to Chaebols anyway. Just waiting for Chinese OLED to commoditize far enough that you can ship a bare panel with outputs for development. Reality is Korean companies do have enough competition / incentive to value engineer down. There's no reason 5/10 years from you can't just buy a nice OLED panel and a 3D printed shell from ali like eink now. Except more sanctions I guess.Seems like just a matter of time gig work license plate scanners also wardrive around with open access points to harvest info from "unconnected" smart devices, if not already.
• rickdeckard 26d ago
  Watching the actual investigation video the article is based on, it turns out that alot of the statements in the article don't really hold up to closer scrutiny. I couldn't find any "smoking gun" or discovery of malicious intent. What's left in the end is the already-known fact in the tech-community: The most-common, most-vulnerable and most-equipped device to spy on you in your home is your Smart-TV. 1. It has all the compute-power and sensors it needs 2. It already does some spying for ad-profiling 3. If a hacker exploits it, it's a problem
  • sebstefan 26d ago
    But also 4. Every single fucked up thing it did was indeed listed in their customer agreement and privacy policy
    • ihsw 26d ago
      [dead]
  • vachina 26d ago
    Reads like a smear campaign in my opinion. Watch for new American product launches in the next few days.
    • gambiting 26d ago
      Tbf, maybe I wouldn't call it a smear campaign, but every NexusGamer video felt like an angry rant for a while now. It was amusing the first 20 times, now I'm kinda fed up with it.
  • miki123211 26d ago
    And it's the only device that "normies" own that has reliable power and reliable internet 24/7. This means you can use it for nefarious purposes, even wastefully so, and it won't show up as suspicious battery drain or prematurely hitting the cell plan's data cap. For a lot of hacker type stuff (esp. botnets and residential proxies), this is exactly what you want. I used to believe that piracy couldn't come back in a significant way because people don't want to use computers any more, and phones are a really bad fit for p2p, even if running some hypothetical non-walled-garden OS that wouldn't have issues with that sort of thing. I entirely failed to appreciate the impact of cheap Android TV boxes here.
• kklisura 26d ago
  Is there a difference between a LG TV in EU and in USA?
  • rcarmo 26d ago
    The EU ones do reach out to endpoints, but mine is currently off and I am not testing that :)
• deleted 26d ago
  [deleted]
• gonzalohm 26d ago
  I'm convinced Google TV firmware does something similar. I have an LED bar connected to the TV via USB and from time to time the bar turns on but the TV is "off". I think it's silently turning on to send some kind of telemetry.
• p0lychromatic 26d ago
  Granted, I only watched one hour of the original video, but I get the feeling the way it is presented is a bit dishonest. A lot of the "silent listening" they show in the video is on a TV they rooted. They start recordings through arecord manually. Or, when they show the transcripts from the recording, the AI voice search is clearly visible on the screen and was manually triggered by something. Now, does a smart TV need all that hardware? Is a compromised TV a security hazard and smart TVs need to learn more in terms of security from modern smartphones in terms of privacy indicators, attested boot and more? Sure. But I do not see enough evidence that the TV is actually voice capturing all this stuff on its own, without any notice. There is plenty of stuff on the video regarding the network scanning, ACR and more that is definitely concerning. And this is something LG actually does by themselves (when you agree to their ToS / privacy policy). However, I think that mixing the ACR / network scanning in with "let's root the TV and actively start recording ourselves" mixes the narrative of "what LG actually does" versus "what a compromised TV can actually do", and makes it seem like LG is just recording, transcribing and submitting voice transcript automatically by themselves. This was not proven here. And I feel that GamersNexus is just risking a lawsuit here by not separating these different concerns clear enough.
• c16 26d ago
  It's been fun to see people re-writing and flashing their own smartwatch software with LLMs. Looking forward to the first TV OS rewrite video.
• deleted 26d ago
  [deleted]
• in_vestor 26d ago
  Serious question: why are people so infuriated by Flock cameras but just completely shrug at this (much worse) TV thing? I want the public to get upset about this. Also, can anyone articulate exactly what data the TV is scraping about your other network devices? IP, name, what else?
• in_vestor 26d ago
  Why are people so infuriated by Flock cameras but just completely shrug at this (much worse) TV thing? Nothing is going to change until people are that enraged by it.
  • datakan 26d ago
    Can't watch football on a flock camera
    • in_vestor 26d ago
      Is it really that simple? Is society really that dumb?
      • datakan 26d ago
        Unfortunately yes.
• alsetmusic 26d ago
  The thing that everyone thinks their smart phones do is true of their televisions and they probably won't discuss it.
• rcarmo 26d ago
  I've had several conversations about this over the years, usually about the EU and how they keep harping on Apple (for instance) because it's a highly visible brand while they completely ignore LG (and others) and their massive data collection devices that (by the way) are in every single European institution. And many government officials' households, too. Just saying.
• edf13 26d ago
  Be interesting to know the true cost of smart TVs without the subsidized benefit of tracking that the "smart" element has. A comparison of a dumb 4k panel vs the equivalent "smart" tv for example>
• hawshemi 26d ago
  https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49563839 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49563839
• alex_duf 26d ago
  What would the HN crowd recommend for a good linux streaming box + hardware with decent TV UX and remote? My LG is completely offline and I'm using an nvidia shield to display any content, but I'm thinking maybe I need to go the extra mile, there nothing preventing an android tv box to do the same.
  • holowoodman 26d ago
    > My LG is completely offline Are you sure? They will seek out open WiFi and other neighboring LG TVs as relays.
    • cr3ative 26d ago
      That is an _incredible_ claim, please back it up.
      • holowoodman 26d ago
        https://youtu.be/6IFVTcM28KA?t=637 https://youtu.be/6IFVTcM28KA?t=637 But better watch the whole video. Then get snarky again ;)
        • cr3ative 26d ago
          "This is a concern broadly and future looking" does not in any way mean LG TVs are doing it now; there would be proof of this if they were, it would be easy to catch.
    • alex_duf 26d ago
      yeah no open wifi in sight, MAC address is banned at the router level, but I appreciate the concern
  • cr3ative 26d ago
    Apple TV.
    • 26d ago
• dwayne_dibley 26d ago
  My 20+ year old dumb samsung TV needs replacing, and has done for a while. But it's stuff like this that makes me shy away from upgrading.
• 1970-01-01 26d ago
  The only appliance that should come from the factory with a microphone is the telephone.
• robk3 26d ago
  Cool when having 3 LG tvs in our office
• testaccount121 26d ago
  has anyone tried to pwn an lg smart tv using a coding agent? would love to turn mine into a dumb tv.
• INTPenis 26d ago
  I've been using a big monitor as a TV for 8 years now. That's all it takes, a big monitor. I just didn't want to buy any TV that was available 8 years ago because they all seemed invasive to me.
• nnevatie 26d ago
  It's unfortunate LG screens are still the best in image quality, even though competition is getting closer. That said, the best way to use LG TVs is to immediately disconnect them from the internet and use an Apple TV 4K for streaming applications.
  • holowoodman 26d ago
    "Disconnect" is not enough. They will seek out open WiFi and other available LG TVs as relays. You need to remove the WiFi card or at least the antenna.
    • gambiting 26d ago
      Source?
  • left-struck 26d ago
    Why trust apple? Sent from iPhone (for now)
• jdalgetty 26d ago
  Is there a list of which LG tvs do this?
• titzer 26d ago
  Why does anyone trust any device? The surveillance capitalism is just sleepwalking towards disaster, but nobody cares because of the pretty screen and the goddamn brainrot content.
• blahblaher 26d ago
  Well that's it. No more LG stuff for me. I bought the C1 OLED TV years ago, great TV, but with this BS, they lost me forever. And yes I connect the tv the wifi for YouTube and for my local media server. No, I do not want other intermediate devices , I want my TV to not spy on me.
  • h43k3r 26d ago
    Unfortunately, there are very few/no options in the market which don't spy on you. Let me know if you get one especially in the OLED space
• ranger_danger 26d ago
  This is a known feature that is not hidden which is not automatically turned on by default. You must set your TV to a different standby mode and enable LG voice control. When you do this, it very plainly tells you that it can listen with the screen off so you can control the TV with voice. Failure of User Awareness, not some nefarious spyware.
• ctippett 26d ago
  I commented this only a few days ago on a different LG related thread. What LG are doing is indefensible and we should all vote with our wallets when considering a new TV... but for those who already own an LG TV you really owe it to yourself to jailbreak it and make it "yours", so to speak. > OpenLGTV[1] is a collective, non-commercial project for legal reverse engineering and research of LG (Smart and non Smart) TVs firmware, which is partially Open Source. > The main goal of the project is to improve the functionality of the TVs by adding new features, fixing bugs and providing new software. [1] https://openlgtv.github.io https://openlgtv.github.io
  • whateveracct 26d ago
    thank you for the link!
  • jascination 25d ago
    This looks old and outdated if you have anything newer than a tv from 2021 sadly
    • ctippett 25d ago
      The chatter on their Discord leads me to believe there's still a pathway to jailbreaking even on the latest version of webOS. I'm still rocking an older TV so can't verify this myself, but I'd be very surprised if you couldn't still get root on a new TV.
• gchamonlive 26d ago
  Pihole blacklist, would it be enough to mitigate this?
• rTX5CMRXIfFG 26d ago
  Can somebody attest or falsify that we’d all be better off with a huge gaming monitor plus an Apple TV? Expensive, of course, but privacy is the main consideration here.
• Unified-Mentor 26d ago
  [dead]
• semiquaver 26d ago
  The source video is excellent: https://youtu.be/6IFVTcM28KA https://youtu.be/6IFVTcM28KA I have two LG TVs so this freaks me out a lot. I guess I’m fortunate to have kept their network permanently disconnected (we use Apple TV for smart stuff) but who knows if they don’t do things like scan for open hotspots or connect without permission to networks you previously used to update firmware and then deleted from history. This company needs to be nuked from orbit. Automatic content recognition is one thing, spying on conversations when switched off is a whole other level of violation.
  • Xunjin 26d ago
    GamerNexus has been so good at their investigation work. I know people who complain the channel does not talk more about Hardware and Games as much, but we live in a timeline that personal hardware and games will not be ours anymore, just see how prohibitive hardware prices are today.
    • sinecura 26d ago
      I just discovered this channel since I own an lg tv and I also realized something peculiar: after I mention something I see an ad about it very shortly after the video explains so much and its obvious now and this makes me quite angry LG should be banned
  • ptx 26d ago
    Probably best to treat the wifi password as compromised and change it after the TV has had access to it. But I suppose there's nothing you can do to prevent it from accessing open wifi networks that happen to be nearby.
    • waffletower 26d ago
      I wonder if my LG will change its MAC address. Going to use my router first and just block it. Won't have to wade through that lame “Smart” UI.
• deleted 26d ago
  [deleted]
• neilv 26d ago
  > During bench tests, they found the TV could capture clean microphone audio while the screen was (or at least looked to be) powered down in standby mode. When the team disconnected the TV from Ethernet, the set continued saving voice input locally and uploaded the stored files once network access was restored. Lawyers: If it is true that the company is secretly recording voices when the device appears to be off, and then uploading the recordings, does that sound like a felony in many US states? (And a felony that is bumping into different laws than the "unauthorized computer access" ones that tech industry has been getting leeway with?)
  • 1659447091 26d ago
    Not a lawyer, but two-party consent states make it illegal to record conversations without both parties knowing. dont know if that means if the tv has 2pt text disclosing the recording in the middle of a multi-language manual and agreeing to plug the tv into power counts as consent or if it even covers tv devices/usage
• sbt 26d ago
  Send the PMs that greenlit this to jail.
• moat 26d ago
  Is there a better answer (or brand) for the privacy-concerned user who is also a normie? I don’t really watch tv, but my wife would want something somewhat modern.
  • cjkaminski 26d ago
    The best simple and easy answer is "Never connect your television to the internet, ever."
• jarym 26d ago
  They used to make some nice equipment but I’ve stopped buying anything from LG and share that recommendation to friends and family. I know I’m not the only one so I’m sure LG are experiencing the results of consumer democracy.
• ajaimk 26d ago
  Question: I recently upgraded my LG OLED and decided to not accept any of the terms and conditions. I just connect it to my Apple TV and it lives on that HDMI port permanently. How safe am I? PS: I do have the TV connected to wifi for software updates (on a pi.holed network)
  • h43k3r 26d ago
    I don't think you need any software updates for your TV. I have a LG oled which I haven't connected to Internet for the last 3 years. Just do a factory reset and don't connect TV to Internet. Everything works without software updates
  • awill88 26d ago
    No doubt the feature that would imply analytics doesn’t function until terms are accepted doesn’t work as intended. It’s not like it’s going to be a priority to test before going to production.
• dillutedfixer 26d ago
  As an owner of 2 LG OLEDs, I am not surprised at all. I neutered these things the first day I was past the return policy. Opened the back and unplugged the WiFi/BT chip, bought a cheap dumb universal remote with no mic in it, disagreed to all T&C in the TV, updated the firmware via USB and just use an AppleTV over HDMI for streaming. Kind of silly to have to go through all of this but hey thats where we are in 2026 in the US. And I am fully aware that I am typing this on an iPhone thats probably doing the same things that this article is talking about LG doing ;-(
  • para_parolu 26d ago
    Why not just disconnect it from internet?
    • dillutedfixer 26d ago
      It's not connected to the internet. The AppleTV is.
      • para_parolu 26d ago
        My question was about why to go and unplug wifi internally
        • dillutedfixer 26d ago
          Well even if they don't do it now, these are just a forced update away from using WiFi to connect to an open AP to do whatever they want. I also really hated the fact that there was really no way to turn BT off. Anytime the TV was on it showed up as a BT device ready to connect, and I would get random neighbors trying to and having to say no to random pop ups approving connections. Now these things are sans any type of wireless, and when it comes time to sell them, it will take me 5 mins to reconnect the internal ribbon cable.
          • Barbing 26d ago
• bt1a 26d ago
  Is anyone else thinking of cracking open the back cover and desoldering any wireless chips found? I have had a firewall rule to deny my LG TV and related domains, but that doesn't look to be enough
  • cjkaminski 26d ago
    IIRC, most wifi enabled televisions have internal antennae. Remove that (or otherwise disable it) and you significantly improve your security posture by ensuring the radio can't hold a connection beyond the TV bezels.
• DudeOpotomus 26d ago
  Ad Tech is a cancer that is / has destroyed society. It is responsible for almost everything that is awful today. Conflating attention for interest and rewarding sensationalism has created a giant stinking hole in our lives. It must be eradicated. Do everything in your power to destroy these companies and their immoral business practices.
  • howunfortunate 26d ago
    This seems quite hyperbolic to me. Newspapers were leveraging sensationalism and attempting to capture attention by any means long long before targeted ads were a driver of revenue. I'd guess there are plenty of pre-newspaper examples as well.
    • micromacrofoot 26d ago
      newspapers didn't follow you and your friends everywhere you went to feed all your metadata back into an addiction algorithm people massively underestimate how insidious having millions of data points about a person is, these companies are literally modeling your behavior
      • howunfortunate 26d ago
        I strongly believe the worst vices of social media would all persist if there were zero advertising. You can see that by looking at more minor or fringe social media sites. Public "liking" is literally all it takes for people to degenerate into performativeness, sensationalism, grandstanding, misinformation, etc.
        • DudeOpotomus 26d ago
          I find it sad that intelligent, educated people can be so blind to the evils building around them. How they confuse the opportunity for a right and how they take and accept awful as normal because they were raised without understanding what they never had... To associate contextual advertising based on large scale demographics and location with spying, lying, cheating and thieving at an individual level, is a great example of this in real life. In the old days, the tabloids were obvious. The sensationalism was easy to identify and passive in its voice. They sat on the end caps of grocery stores, far away from the News. TV news was regulated and there was a strict ethics code in place. Today, all news is tabloid as they all chase attention. They have all become the Weekly World News and as a result, we have clowns and ignoramuses running things. And people fell for it. They actually fell for it...and continue to fall for it. That is why it's a cancer. Ad tech eats everything in its path and destroys everything good in the process. When you cannot tell the difference between fact and fiction, you have lost the plot.
• Zobat 26d ago
  I managed to watch 14 minutes of the Gamer Nexus video (on my computer) before going into the living room and disconnecting the network cable, OMFG. If there's no legal consequences for LG for this I'll be surprised. I'm in Europe, not counting on the US for this, trust me.
  • toofy 26d ago
    i honestly don’t believe i’m being jaded when i say this: there will be no consequences. in this current moment, companies can treat us however they like. again, i don’t think that’s hyperbolic or jaded, i think it’s much more based in reality than the opposite.
• AvAn12 26d ago
  We are on our second Sceptre dumb tv. Cheap, good picture, happy. We handle streaming via Apple TV, though pivoting very slowly to jellyfin.
• myrmidon 26d ago
  Modems becoming super cheap is gonna be a big problem for this, because those make it even harder to prevent such snooping. Just imagine having to jam the devices in your own home just to stop them from profiling you. Better pray to your deer god that modem + data contract is gonna stay more expensive that the expected value from selling more data... We really need regulation to stop this.
  • 05 26d ago
    Disconnect the u.fl to the antenna and it’ll be hard for it to transmit data unless you live next door to a cell tower.
    • mrheosuper 26d ago
      It could include SMD antenna or PCB antenna.
  • pampas 26d ago
    I see the same thing with advertising. The cost of a banner ad in real life is always decreasing. Now every road intersection, shop aisle, plane seat etc has a huge super bright billboard blasting ads at people who can't realistically avoid it.
  • asdff 26d ago
    My house already jams cell signals at least
  • SamuelAdams 25d ago
    Cars already do this. https://www.mozillafoundation.org/en/blog/privacy-nightmare-on-wheels-every-car-brand-reviewed-by-mozilla-including-ford-volkswagen-and-toyota-flunks-privacy-test/ https://www.mozillafoundation.org/en/blog/privacy-nightmare-... https://apnews.com/article/auto-car-privacy-3674ce59c9b30f2861d29178a31e6ab7 https://apnews.com/article/auto-car-privacy-3674ce59c9b30f28... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telematic_control_unit https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telematic_control_unit
• thothless 26d ago
  this is not only LG. many of your favorite devices do this. examine your network when you plug a roku in. then read their privacy policy if you want to see someone give LG a run for their money. then there's our pocket PCs... and don't forget about the biggest customers of this "advertising" data. https://www.npr.org/2026/03/25/nx-s1-5752369/ice-surveillance-data-brokers-congress-anthropic https://www.npr.org/2026/03/25/nx-s1-5752369/ice-surveillanc... https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2026/03/targeted-advertising-gives-your-location-government-just-ask-cbp https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2026/03/targeted-advertising-g...
• SoftTalker 26d ago
  My old Vizio TV is probably too old to do much of that, and it doesn't have a microphone, but regardless it's never connected to the internet. In fact, I removed the Wifi module altogether, as the TV would sometimes lock up and make a very loud, annoying screeching sound. Some online searching suggested it was temperature related and removing the WiFi module would help. It's just a standard board like you might find in a laptop. Removing it did help a lot, the lockups still happen very occasionally but are much reduced.
• movetheworld 26d ago
  Understood: never buy LG devices again.
  • ragequittah 26d ago
    The problem is they really are the best TVs. I have one sitting next to me that thankfully hasn't been connected to the internet in 5 years. Take the subsidies they give you for being able to spy on you then don't let them spy on you is the better move.
• mattacular 26d ago
  I pretty much assume every smart home device capable of doing this is doing it already. Nothing gets connected to wifi. If temporary connection is required it gets a random one time use guest network SSID and pass that I remove after. (Yes they can collect and send setup metadata during this temporary access period but sometimes it is a worthwhile tradeoff)
• mark_something 26d ago
  Another proof of how much our data is worth. But I think they make a loss on me, I can remember only a handful occasions that I bought something based on an ad I saw, which were more informative than seductive, like a monthly bike rental service. But I guess they still sell my data. I wish they would flag the data of rational people like me as "worthless", and not sell my data.
• victor22 26d ago
  wow i'm surprised sn0wd3n only revealed this about 20 years ago
• beej71 26d ago
  What kind of access can the government get, I wonder...
• mancerayder 26d ago
  After researching a new TV (where it only needs an Apple TV, no so-called smart features for spying purposes) the three contenders were Samsung, LG and Sony Bravia (the higher end models). Samsung was the least trustworthy, having played games with firmware updates and adding telemetry, LG was medium trustworthy, and Sony seemed the least likely. It looks like that heuristic was correct. For the Bravia, I put it on wifi just once temporarily to upgrade the firmware when I bought it, and I'm leaving it disconnected. It can't just magically connect to an openwifi and update its firmware to start telemetry. It would need a new firmware to even try that. Folks, never update a TV firmware unless it's necessary.
  • declan_roberts 26d ago
    Just keep the TV completely disconnected and use something like an Apple TV.
    • drnick1 26d ago
      What makes you think the Apple TV isn't also spying on you? It almost certainly is collecting telemetry too. Whether that's more or less than LG I don't know, but my preference is a Linux box with Plasma Bigscreen.
      • RattlesnakeJake 26d ago
        At least you can replace it if that becomes a problem. Firmware built into the TV itself is something that you're stuck with.
      • mancerayder 26d ago
        What do you use when you switch between Netflix, AppleTV, etc? Some of those platforms won't even show you HD unless it's through HDCP compliant hardware and OS, which Linux isn't. That happened with the World Cup.
        • drnick1 26d ago
• BonoboIO 26d ago
  [flagged]
• maxclark 26d ago
  Every smart TV is dumb if you don’t connect it to a network
• vadepaysa 26d ago
  LG TVs have the best OLED displays and the most questionable privacy policy. So I picked best of both the worlds and left the TV off the internet. Apple TV is the way to go for me.
• ck2 26d ago
  This is also why I won't buy any watch with a microphone Even if the manufacturer doesn't do something evil, they may have an exploit or allow 3rd party apps that do whatever Garmin literally keeps the microphone on 24/7 listening for "OKAY GARMIN" There should be a consumer law that any device with a microphone must have an LED physically in series so that if the mic has power, the LED is lit, not software control of the LED which can be disabled. Europe might do that someday but unless California does it too it will never happen in USA
• sunshine-o 26d ago
  It seems Alex Jones was right again
• a34729t 26d ago
  A friend was working at an adtech company over a decade ago, processing smart tv data. Needless to say he advised buying the dumbest tv possible.
• GuestFAUniverse 26d ago
  Why does that company still exist? Just don't by anything from LG. It's easy.
• j45 26d ago
  I wonder if this applies to large LG Monitors too.
• yellowapple 26d ago
  If tech giants could stop trying to make the telescreens from Nineteen Eighty Four for five fucking seconds, that'd be great.
• waffletower 26d ago
  The only thing I hate more than “smart” quotes are “smart” TVs. I groan whenever my LG interrupts. Now I have to spend Labor day wading through a “smart” UI I avoid like the plague to disconnect the internet.
• newhotelowner 26d ago
  Almost all new hotel/hospital TVs have access to the internet, and more than half are LG TVs, and other half are Samsung.
  • SamuelAdams 25d ago
    I do wonder what this does with HIPAA laws. Will TV's need to be removed from hospital rooms, or vetted specifically for microphones and cameras?
• ticulatedspline 26d ago
  I'm surprised this hasn't run afoul of all-party wiretap laws. Even if you could waive your own rights via ToS other people in the house may not have agreed. Theoretically I could see LG or even the TV's owner being culpable. I'd love to see that case hit the media. Average citizen jailed over wiretap violations because they let their TV record a guest.
  • mey 26d ago
    How do guests/children/people in public spaces consent to it? It's a gross violation.
    • jeffbee 26d ago
      Of what? This can only be evaluated in the context of wherever you live. In most of America recording sounds "in public" is a broadly protected activity because that's what "in public" means. You can only get in trouble for this if you violate another person's reasonable expectation of privacy.
      • hdgvhicv 26d ago
        Watching a TV that doesn’t watch you back is a reasonable expectation of privacy, and has been since 1984 was written.
  • godelski 26d ago
    On top of that, the first few minutes of the video suggests it captures your neighbors' device and IP information. I'm sure the ToS has some BS about you being required to inform any guests, but what if your TV is just recording your neighbors because they are close enough? Just wait, I'm sure the "solution" will be that TVs start displaying reminders that you're being recorded... Is our inability to innovate in technology really so bad that we have to just chase more and more spying? Consumers don't want these things. Why can't we innovate on things that consumers actually want? Remember, there was a time where we could build good technology, tech that people wanted, and make buckets of money doing it. That should be our goal, not some cyberpunk dystopia. Honestly it feels like anytime we try to innovate now some manager says "don't make things complicated" or some other dumb excuse, but maybe worse is that peers (other engineers) say "but what's the value" (they always stress that they mean monetary, not utility)? Feels like monkeys attacking each other for trying to get the banana...
• jmward01 26d ago
  What is needed is accountability and transparency. Accountability is criminal charges. Transparency is warning labels on products similar to cigarette warnings. This is digital assault and needs to be treated that way.
• cj 26d ago
  Related: What’s the story with Chrome continually triggering the “Chrome would like to access devices on your local network” prompt on MacOS? It frequently happens when opening ChatGPT on web.
• 6c696e7578 26d ago
  I'm fairly concerned that at some point in the future is will be almost zero-cost to include eSIM with devices and we'll have virtually no way to prevent devices from working as discovery for advert targeting.
  • AustinDev 26d ago
    Remove the antenna.
• jakzurr 26d ago
  I know I'm just paranoid, but when I see LG and these big advertising companies taking bad press from Gamers Nexus, I can't help but think the reporters need to be concerned about their safety.
• kwarcode 26d ago
  So in the living room I should fap less... or more?
• ptx 26d ago
  I don't think the title (edit: of the thread merged into this one!) is accurate. Starting at 16:04, they say that they merely claim that the TV has the capability to be used as a listening device. In the first 34 minutes, they don't seem to show that LG are actually recording audio from the surroundings (only from the content playing) and after that they start investigating whether you could record audio if you take control of the device (obviously yes). So the video doesn't seem to support the claim in the article (edit: linked in the merged submission!) that "LG smart TVs continuously [...] log microphone audio while appearing to be turned off". Of course, all the stuff LG are actually shown to be doing is bad nevertheless, particularly the "Automated Content Recognition".
  • II2II 26d ago
    EDIT: Just to be clear, the parent's post was originally made in relation to an article/thread called: "LG smart TVs caught logging audio with screen off and snooping on local devices". My response was written at the same time. > So the video doesn't seem to support the claim in the article that "LG smart TVs continuously [...] log microphone audio while appearing to be turned off". While it is a bit unclear as to whether the logging and transmitting of audio is happening[1], without hacking the device, they were also quite clear that they made it extremely difficult (if not impossible) to MITM certain encrypted communications on their consumer devices. Combining that with claims they make about advertising makes LG's actions highly suspect. While the video is quite clear that they are not saying LG is doing this (for legal reasons), the set out to prove the capabilities are there and the privacy related configuration options are very weak. For example: the microphone switch only controls one of the onboard microphones. Even if it physically cut off all of the microphones, there are other vectors that could only be software controlled (such as voice enabled remote controls). Either way, whether it is LG or a third party, the capability to log and transmit audio can certainly be exploited. Perhaps it is time we start considering whether we should do something just because it can be done. That is to say: do we really need to control a television by voice, or have other features that require a microphone, just because adding a microphone is cheap and there is enough compute to process the data? [1] I got the impression they were claiming that the audio was recorded and stored on device. They simply could not prove it was sent to LG.
• t1234s 26d ago
  These are great if you just want an old fashioned tv that is just a monitor: https://www.sceptre.com/TV/4K-UHD-TV-category1category73.html https://www.sceptre.com/TV/4K-UHD-TV-category1category73.htm... With no real influx of 8K tvs one of these will last quite a while until you need to upgrade.
  • jeffbee 26d ago
    The tradeoff is picture quality. Those panels are dumb and also bad. That's one of the main problems with the marketplace. The best displays are tied to some shady practices like the one in the OP.
• acd 26d ago
  Can we please agree on calling devices with a cpu and os that spy on the owner smart? I personally think that closed operating systems with spyware is quite dumb for user privacy.
• Animats 26d ago
  Here are LG's contract terms for appliances.[1] They are awful. Not only can they listen in. You have a contractual requirement to tell everyone in range of an appliance that they may be eavesdropped upon. CONSENT REQUIREMENT: You acknowledge and agree that it is your sole responsibility to obtain all necessary consents from any third parties whose voices may be captured by the Product and to notify household members and guests that their voices may be captured and processed, in compliance with applicable wiretapping, eavesdropping, and privacy laws. If anyone does not consent, you should disable the microphone or voice features in the settings. LGE disclaims any liability for your failure to obtain such consent or provide such notification. [1] https://www.lg.com/us/terms https://www.lg.com/us/terms
  • phony-account 26d ago
    And yet what lawmakers focused on was getting your consent for a cookie on a website you were only going to visit once.
    • MetaWhirledPeas 26d ago
      The law has been unable to keep up with tech changes. Let's hope for the irony of AI helping them figure this stuff out.
      • lazide 26d ago
        why would it do that?
      • Glyptodon 26d ago
        [flagged]
      • Terr_ 26d ago
        > The law has been unable to keep up with tech changes. Nah, for the most part the law has been unable to keep up with (or choose to oppose) corporate power, and new ways it's being used. Usually there's no magic quantum doohickey which demands fundamentally new legal theory.
• Brosper 26d ago
  We should start a movement #NoSmartDevice We have sugar-free, lactose free I want Smart free devices!!!
  • adamm255 26d ago
    They’d be like yeah no problem. TV with smart features: $999. TV without smart features: $1,200
    • JoshTriplett 26d ago
      Excellent. Sign me up, instantly. Would buy on launch day.
• deleted 26d ago
  [deleted]
• anonu 26d ago
  Can this be blocked with DNS / firewalls? Anyone done any work on that? Is there a DNS setting in LG? Could it be as simple as switching to a local DNS server on your network running nextdns.io?
  • Joel_Mckay 26d ago
    Unfortunately, "AI" speech to text loggers can run a long time before it ever runs out of memory. Every time you have to update the TV software, a few MiB of your data is sent. The issue is a lot of the TV traffic is encrypted, and given the other issues reported it likely gets a lot worse for privacy advocates. Air-gaps don't necessarily guarantee anything either. =3
  • 7373737373 26d ago
    Technical solutions are insufficient for such disregard, the company needs to be sued out of existence, and laws made to prohibit and punish such behavior
• mindcrash 26d ago
  Now do a analysis on everything else, including the smart fridge in the kitchen. Or what I am trying to say: Everybody has devices which have the potential to spy on you. Unless your first name is Richard, only travel with open source hardware and software, and you have to ask someone to lend you a phone if you want to call someone even when you are at home.
  • spockz 26d ago
    How does that make this right? And that a device has the potential to spy with an update doesn’t mean it does or will. Of course, the AVR will be able to snoop and send what is available. Any smart fridges, ovens, appliances, whatever can. Doesn’t mean that they or should. Also doesn’t mean we should just lie down and give up.
• xyst 26d ago
  Ad executives in early 2010s took note of the public response to whistleblowing of the NSA PRISM program and Edward Snowden leaks. 10+ years later, this is their response. They have learned a large majority of people just don't give a shit. We are sheep. A majority of people just want "cheap" shit, no matter the cost. This world is cooked man. Need an asteroid to wipe this planet clean, bro.
• n0n0n4t0r 26d ago
  I wonder if in the EU, if you refuse everything, you're protected or screwed. Juridically, you should be okay, but is it rational to trust them to respect the law when breaking it is probably more profitable?
• zeristor 26d ago
  I just use the LG screen for my Apple TV. No network connection, apparently the BBC thinks I should use the LG app to watch UHD TV, perhaps they’re in league with LG
• Glyptodon 26d ago
  If we aren't there already we're well on our way to a bizarre dystopia where our own internet subscriptions somehow cost more than our devices, which somehow generate enough money for their makers to justify embedding wireless modems for constant surveillance. If you buys a device at loss, for them spend a monthly fee to give it access to spy on you, because the data is so valuable, what on earth are they using it for? Or is everyone losing money?
• giov4 26d ago
  where could this heavy privacy infringement be reported in EU? should we all report this illegal behaviour and contract terms?
• giantg2 26d ago
  I'm so disappointed at the lack of dumb TVs and privacy focused streaming boxes.
• motbus3 26d ago
  "we own the glass" "We own the living room" How disrespectful one can be towards its customers. I am honestly disgusted by such behaviour. I know the cheeky confidence biz talk, but is that really what you want your customers to hear? And what about the guys making such disgusting business possible. Is that what you want to build?
• cosmojg 26d ago
  If your TV is rootable, you should root it! See: https://cani.rootmy.tv/ https://cani.rootmy.tv/
• hermitcrab 26d ago
  George Orwell imagined a 'Telescreen' that also spies on you in '1984': https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telescreen https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telescreen
• zzo38computer 26d ago
  Most TV sets should not normally need microphones, and if they have that in some models (as long as there are models without), then there should be a hardware switch to disable them. However, "continuously sweep home networks, map secondary devices, and log microphone audio while appearing to be turned off" is also stealing and wasting your power.
  • DrPhish 26d ago
    Every speaker is also a microphone
    • gh02t 26d ago
      Speakers can act as part of a useful microphone circuit but you're missing all the amplifiers and ADCs and other stuff to use it as one in any sane speaker driver circuit. They'd have to intentionally add all that, which maybe they would, but it'd be easier to just stick a tiny $0.05 all in one microphone chip on there.
    • jh00ker 26d ago
      The NSA enters the chat
• hi_hi 26d ago
  I guess this is unavoidable on today’s internet, but…reading a story that decries the (admittedly really bad) data gathering techniques of an advertiser, from a site that itself is plastered with adverts…I don’t know the right word here, but it feels a bit shit. Although I’m glad this is getting the visibility it deserves. I hope this hurts LG where it matters and sends a signal to other manufacturers, but I doubt it.
  • bbor 26d ago
    \#BanAdvertising, my friends. It sounds absurd until you think about it for a minute. If billboards and vice ads and this sort of monitoring should be banned, shouldn't it all?
    • idiotsecant 26d ago
      All advertisement is psychological warfare. It's designed to reprogram you to do things you otherwise wouldn't do.
      • bbor 26d ago
        Wow two amazing replies within seconds! But this is the part that gets me. It's manipulation. That's not an accusation, that's a plain, unbiased description of what it is: you don't want something, then you see an ad, then you do. Also taking this moment to head off two common responses, for ettiquette's sake: 1. The alternative is catalogs! Products are listed accurately and thoroughly, and we deal with edge cases as needed. This is especially tractable in the internet age, of course. See: [the Wells-Fargo Wagon](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fP0E1tbfi2g https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fP0E1tbfi2g) 2. Yes, you are affected by advertisements. I don't care who you are: if you're on HackerNews from anywhere other than shack in rural Montana, you are affected by advertisments. Many (most?) ad spend is on "brand advertising", which isn't trying to get you to take any conscious action at all -- it's swaying your subconscious. This sorta feels like the problem with "rent fixing" via algorithms from a few years back. The system has been bumbling along fine enough for a while, but the arrival of mass computing makes these tactics so insanely effective that they become unfair.
• ed_mercer 26d ago
  Why would you ever connect a TV to the internet in the first place?
  • fhub 26d ago
    1. Onboarding tells you to 2. Convenience 3. Cheaper than buying an Apple TV et al
  • readthenotes1 26d ago
    Because not everyone wants to buy a tv and a Roku or similar device.
  • sgarland 26d ago
    Most non-techie people I know have a smart TV without an external streaming box like an Apple TV, Nvidia Shield, Roku, etc.
  • buckle8017 26d ago
    The average person's house has a gateway/router/wifi thing from their ISP, a smart tv connected to the internet with microphones, and one of those iptv piracy boxes that's actually the source of all the residential proxy ips. Convenience over all else is what 99% of people are doing.
    • mitxela 26d ago
      Residential proxying seems a good trade for piracy to me. However, there's a chance it will attract attention of some authority, who (although proxying itself is legal) will see your piracy box and arrest you for piracy. However, this doesn't seem to happen in practice, perhaps because residential proxying is so common.
  • voxelghost 26d ago
    Because it is a 'smart Tv', and it asks to get connected to the internet during setup? That being said, I have an old LG Tv (pre-android, forget what they call the os), and I never connected it, opting instead to hook up a firetv stick .... (who knows what bad crap they might be up to btw). But the point is, we are a minority, most people go the path of least resistance.
• dabinat 26d ago
  My TVs (Samsung) are the only devices on my network that are locked down and quarantined. But I wonder if there will come a day when TVs contain cellular or satellite modems so you can’t block the telemetry.
  • luqtas 26d ago
    > a day when TVs contain cellular or satellite modems so you can’t block the telemetry finally my startup of faraday-cage rooms will boom /j
  • WhyNotHugo 26d ago
    Some brands have TVs share Wi-Fi with each other, so even if you don't connect it to Wi-Fi, your neighbour's TV will silently share with yours.
    • gruez 26d ago
      Which? All I've seen over the years is people repeating the same rumor.
      • saxonww 26d ago
        This is an assumption that since Amazon Sidewalk exists, smart TVs must have something similar. There's no proof, and I think if it were happening without being documented it would be a huge scandal.
• socalgal2 26d ago
  I wonder how many politicians, police, etc have these TVs and how sanguine they would be to find out all their conversations near the TVs have been recorded
• scosman 26d ago
  Reminder: you can connect it to your network, but block it from the internet at the router. That way you can still use Airplay/Chromecast. I have an LG. Great OLED panel. It's never seen the internet.
  • drdexebtjl 26d ago
    No, you can't. They can just spoof their MAC address and be freed.
    • scosman 26d ago
      Ah yes. Using that OTA update it got via AM radio.
      • jh00ker 26d ago
        or from your neighbor's open WiFi?
        • scosman 24d ago
          why is it jumping through hoops to get online if it's already online?
• bitwize 26d ago
  Sceptre dumb TV bros still winning
• robinpie 26d ago
  Stuff like smart TVs always go in their own VLAN on my home network. Not because I don't trust the manufacturer, but I cannot be bothered to babysit some Android device on my LAN that I'll keep using years after end-of-support.
  • codfrantic 26d ago
    unless this VLAN doesn't allow internet access the issue persists. And if it doesn't, not connecting it would be the more logical choice.
• mitxela 26d ago
  Disconnecting it from the internet isn't enough, because it will store spying data forever until it gets a connection, and it will connect to any open WiFi. You have to disconnect it from the power, and then use a sledgehammer on the remains.
  • nosioptar 26d ago
    I'd rather open it up and remove/destroy just the network card. (I don't have to do so though because my tv is 20 years old.)
    • mitxela 26d ago
      What if the network isn't on a separate card?
      • nosioptar 26d ago
        That'd be the time to grab your hammer, baseball bat, or shotgun.
      • gedy 26d ago
        Then if you are lucky, the telescreen is in an unusual position. By sitting in the alcove, and keeping well back, you might be able to remain outside the range of the telescreen.
        • hoherd 25d ago
          It's comical how close to the telescreen this whole thing is. > The instrument (the telescreen, it was called) could be dimmed, but there was no way of shutting it off completely.
      • 15155 26d ago
        Remove the AC coupling capacitor connecting the antenna to the transceiver.
  • gruez 26d ago
• freediddy 26d ago
  How is this legal? Can't we sue them or get the FTC against them? This seems like a ridiculous amount of spying, even if their TOS says so. That seems like exploiting complexity of TOS to let them spy on everyone. I'm pretty sure that these TVs won't respect WIFI passwords and if you enter a wifi password in once, it will just remember it even when you clear it, and it will try to connect to the internet that way.
  • drfloyd51 26d ago
    FTC? They might be doing it FOR the FTC.
• lrvick 26d ago
  It is a screen. You plug an HDMI cable into your source device and another into the TV. Job done. Are there really that many people technical enough to know what an HDMI cable is without also knowing all TVs are subsidized by spyware with no security protections? Why would anyone connect a screen to the internet in the first place? Like, if suddenly computer monitors started asking for wifi credentials would everyone just compulsively punch them in just to see ads and give the manufacturers lots of data just because? I must be fundamentally disconnected from how consumers think about technology.
  • freediddy 26d ago
    All TVs offer extra functionality like connecting to Netflix, Disney+, HBO etc. It obviates the need for an extra device like Roku or Apple TV.
    • lrvick 26d ago
      So most consumers are willing to knowingly give up privacy, security, and freedom just to save 20 bucks on a hdmi streaming device? I have no words for how depressing that is. Then again most consumers use Bytedance, Meta, Google, and Apple products so I guess I should not be too surprised.
      • zapzupnz 26d ago
        > So most consumers are willing to knowingly "Knowingly". No, they don't know. You seem to think that because you know, then so must everybody else. I have no words for how depressing that way of thinking is.
        • lrvick 26d ago
          Why would anyone not take 5 minutes to research a major purchase? They have Internet access! I mean obviously I expect Grandma not to know, but anyone that knows enough to connect to the internet knows how to use a search engine. Corpos get away with blatant factory malware and security negligence because consumers are so predictably unwilling to research anything beyond what their social media algorithm of choice shows them as they scroll.
• svlasov 26d ago
  What about LG smart soundbars? I always kept the TV offline but the soundbar, if not connected to internet, exposes an unprotected hotspot that anyone can connect to and take control over the soundbar, forcing you to connect it to internet.
• adithyassekhar 26d ago
  > They also found where the microphone was software disabled via settings, it was STILL recording things but had the dB level so low that it looked like nothing but when amplified to +50dB later the conversations were actually still there.
  • bbor 26d ago
    Can someone confirm this part of it? I'm highly, highly dubious that these TVs are sending back random ambient conversation -- for one thing, it would be a truly monstrously-huge stream of data, no? I certainly believe that it sends back data when you use voice commands, ofc (both for advertising and product improvement). But this would be the first real case of something that's been a 100% false conspiracy theory for over a decade, which feels... unlikely. Kinda like someone finding a Sasquatch.
    • adithyassekhar 26d ago
      It is in the video at 36:40 https://youtu.be/6IFVTcM28KA?t=2199 https://youtu.be/6IFVTcM28KA?t=2199
      • bbor 26d ago
        [dead]
    • beart 25d ago
      I assumed from watching the video, the device is processing the audio locally and transmitting the results - text rather than audio.
• bschwindHN 26d ago
  Goddamnit, I have an LG TV. The panel panel itself is beautiful, but the software is complete shit and I only use an apple TV on it. The snakes in charge of this should be thrown in jail. They talk about "owning the glass and the living room" and you can just tell they've sold out their soul long ago.
• OrvalWintermute 26d ago
  People have always said the idea of the devices listening to conversations was all a conspiracy theory. Welp, looks like it is a fact.
• deleted 26d ago
  [deleted]
• anonymousiam 26d ago
  I've got a 65" LG C2 OLED TV (from 2022) that I hacked with https://rootmy.tv https://rootmy.tv shortly after I purchased it (and before LG updated the firmware to prevent the hack). It seems pretty safe. When it's on, I can ssh into it. When it's off, it doesn't reply to ICMP pings, and doesn't appear to be using much power. I guess the newer LG TVs have gone to shit.
• qingcharles 26d ago
  There needs to be a crowdfunded jailbreak of all these TVs firmware so all of these dystopian features can be hard disabled. I'm guessing the mainboards of these things have zero protection from someone clamping on their flash ROMs or tapping the bus; these are hardly X-boxen or Playstations with uber-DRM. (Assuming you can't just force new unsigned modified firmware directly into them via USB)
• woodgala 26d ago
  I hate this. I hate having to be scared of every damn piece of technology spying on me. Of everything becoming a subscription. Of everything being sold to the highest bidder to be enshittified and gutted leaving a wake of low quality trash. This isn’t the future I worked for. This is a flea market for the Epstein class.
• jaimex2 26d ago
  Is there a site showing us where to drill?
• deleted 26d ago
  [deleted]
• andretti1977 26d ago
  This should be sufficient to let LG go bankrupt… We've all become numb to this kind of craziness
• adam_klein 26d ago
  This is Hacker News - any suggestions for physically removing the microphone and/or blocking LG servers with a firewall/pihole?
• blahblaher 26d ago
  I've just looked at the terms of service and privacy terms on an "old" C1 Oled, and it's "disgusting" the amount of spying they want to do. Turned everything off except for the minimum required to play Youtube on the tv. What a pos of a company. And yes I know (almost?) all of them are doing something similar
• huey77 26d ago
  This is awful. I own a LG OLED tv which I love for its quality, but god I want to chuck it knowing all the sensitive conversations I’ve had in front of it. Literally all my personal calls happen in the room that tv lives. I’m livid.
• Koshcheiushko 26d ago
  I've one question: I've used android phone (realme, which is chinese). And i remember that whenever we used to discuss somethings among our friends, i started used to get ads realated to that on my laptop, phone within atmost a hour. So, was realme transcribing all conversations and uploading it? Can someone answer?
• maxgashkov 26d ago
  PSA for the home automation enthusiasts who keep smart TVs connected to the network to turn them on or off remotely: a lot of other sources that are likely connected to HDMI ports (Apple TVs, gaming PCs etc.) could do the same via HDMI-CEC, so unless you're truly using the 'smart' features there is less and less reasons to keep the TV itself connected to any network.
  • emmaexe 25d ago
    Connect it to the network to let it talk to local devices but block it from connecting to the internet. That should still let you control the TV from your phone via the LAN, or if you have a HomeAssistant server, it will be able to control it.
    • maxgashkov 25d ago
      Yeah, I have been doing this with a naive firewall rule blocking its IP from egress, but how long until they'll wise up to it and start truly nefarious shit like using hidden MACs to acquire multiple addresses in the background? Then you could probably VLAN it off, but most people don't have managed gear on their networks.
• Netcob 26d ago
  Am I glad I blocked my CX from 2020 very early from accessing the internet! Looked into rooting - my old firmware would be ideal, but other than a native ambient lighting tap I don't really see anything worth my time. That model probably doesn't have a wide field mic yet to use for home automation.
• Havoc 25d ago
  Wow absolute dumpster fire of dishonesty & unethical behaviour from LG. Guess I'm not buying LG anything
• tsoukase 25d ago
  This might be a source of personal data for Facebook so the next day they present you the product you discussed with your wife last night.
• expedition32 25d ago
  Anything with a microphone in it can be used to spy on you. I always found that talking to computers is incredible stupid and only looks good in Star Trek. But I am apparently the minority in this because every car, phone and television has a voice activated interface. There was scandal with Siri that lasted for about 5 minutes.
• bawana 25d ago
  FYI, sony tvs do this as well plus because sony is based on google android, google gets the data too
• glaslong 25d ago
  We need a general LG jailbreak and aftermarket WebOS firmware scene Yesterday
• wiskinator 25d ago
  Anyone have an LG TV, access to ghidra and a desire to dig in and release open firmware? Because I have have everything but the TV
• permalac 25d ago
  What kind of people work on things like these?
• trinsic2 25d ago
  One of the things that bother me is that a lot of their language around the tracking technology is "We don't do x with it" But that doesnt rule out someone thats not affiliated with LG to use those features to perform various levels of surveillance. IMHO I think there is more to what LG is telling the public. There is no reason for the level of adversarial tech and dark patterns in the UI if you are not doing something shady with it.
  • abejfehr 24d ago
    How does someone unaffiliated with LG make use of this feature? If they don’t have an API for it then presumably you’re safe from third parties unless the TV is rooted, right?
    • trinsic2 24d ago
      How do you know LG isn't giving/allowing/lookingtheotherway a 3rd party access to there API?
• br0ceph 25d ago
  capability == intent treat ur lan like the public internet every internet enabled device with recording hardware, will use it against everything u do with and around a compromised device, can and will be used against u in every possible way within capability
• br0ceph 25d ago
  is this really news?! every smart device does this everyone should already know this by now smart ppl buy dumb crap smart crap sells dumb ppl
  • beardyw 24d ago
    This is the worst I've ever heard about.