21 ms·

Say hello to Google Allo: a smarter messaging app

440 points by mikeevans 10y ago

donw 10y ago
I wonder how many users will come to depend on it before they shut it down.
- gravypod 10y ago
  Google reader will always be missed.
- iagooar 10y ago
  I give it 2 years. Maybe only 18 months. I don't even know how many different (and confusing!) chat applications Google has launched already. Seems like their engineers, when they get bored, write a chat app.
  - flukus 10y ago
    Next time I see someone mention how great their monolithic repository is I'll ask how many chat applications you have to checkout before you can code at google.
    - justinlardinois 10y ago
      There was an article posted on here a few months ago about Google's version control system. One of the main features is that you don't actually checkout copies of every file in the repository; instead they're faulted in as you need them. My impression is that the monolithic repository only works because Google's built a bunch of custom tooling to support it. It doesn't mean any company can just roll all of their code into a single Git repository and call it a day.
      - kyrra 10y ago
        This maybe? http://m.cacm.acm.org/magazines/2016/7/204032-why-google-stores-billions-of-lines-of-code-in-a-single-repository/fulltext http://m.cacm.acm.org/magazines/2016/7/204032-why-google-sto... The key here is CITC. All the source code lives "in the cloud" and pulls to your machine as it's needed (using a FUSE file system).
        justinlardinois 10y ago
        Yes, that's it, and that's the key feature I was talking about.
- toomuchtodo 10y ago
  New Google Ecosystems: Not even once.
- 1_2__3 10y ago
  They should code name the next one "stillborn".
- dimino 10y ago
  This is overblown, the biggest thing they did this to was Reader, and that was hardly an "ecosystem" app without any way to use a stand-in replacement within minutes.
  - kuschku 10y ago
    You do realize reader had comment sections, likes, etc? It was a full-blown social network for a while.
piyush_soni 10y ago
Still says "Unregister" (or Pre-register if you hadn't registered) for me (I'm in India).
otto_ortega 10y ago
Yey! Just what the world was missing, yet another instant messaging app...
- r00fus 10y ago
  Google's bid for the slack/FB message space, which is now (even Apple's pushing) the new apps/bot platform. Google has no choice. I also don't expect them to fold up shop unless the 'bot market just fizzles.
sunnyps 10y ago
This has SMS fallback! https://support.google.com/allo/answer/6376011 https://support.google.com/allo/answer/6376011
- tdkl 10y ago
  Yeah, wonder how it looks like, if it's coming from the persons number, or some service. [edit] Not from personal number it seems : http://www.reddit.com/r/projectfi/comments/53rhk8/_/ http://www.reddit.com/r/projectfi/comments/53rhk8/_/
- rspeer 10y ago
  Does it work with MMS, like Hangouts usually doesn't?
  - tdkl 10y ago
    Nope. It's more or less glorified invite message over a service, that also receives replies from SMS. But since it doesn't show as sent from your mobile number, the receiver will have a separate thread in their SMS application. http://www.androidpolice.com/2016/09/20/allo-weird-sms-explained-other-answers/ http://www.androidpolice.com/2016/09/20/allo-weird-sms-expla...
    - rspeer 10y ago
      ...so if I used Google Allo, I would still need to also use Google Messenger for MMS conversations and Facebook Messenger for conversations with less-nerdy people. The only thing Allo seems to have going for it is that it's not another blue speech bubble icon labeled "Messenger".
      - tdkl 10y ago
        Basically, yeah. If we overlook everything, all that Allo offers is the Google Assistant and that's probably what they wanted - fresh set of data.
putlake 10y ago
I'm surprised Google Duo hasn't become more popular. It's a great cross-platform video chat app. I especially like the feature where you can see the other party before you answer their call. I have taken calls because of that feature that I otherwise wouldn't have. It's better than FaceTime because it works on Android. It's better than Skype and Google Hangouts because your cellphone number is your identity; you don't have to log in with any usernames or passwords. Extremely low friction.
- arihant 10y ago
  I was waiting for Duo and didn't even know it launched. Maybe more marketing is required.
- piyush_soni 10y ago
  I'll use everything Google, but Duo has been the most stupid video chat app I've ever used. That's because in countries where the common household internet is still not that fast, it 'aggressively' pauses (completely removes) the video for long intervals in every few minutes citing slow connection. That's a frustrating experience. I generally get around 10-12 Mbps speed (which is on the higher side in India), and my family in another city have a 4 Mbps connection - it still pauses the video regularly when we talk - and eventually we switch to skype because it at least shows something, even if pixelated. I'm as disappointed by this 'feature' as excited I was before trying Duo.
  - amaks 10y ago
    What's the latency of your connection? You can get 4 Mbps throughput (which is not a lot by itself, BTW), but the latency may be too high for a video chat.
    - AstralStorm 10y ago
      People can live with a few seconds of latency on GSM. Chat is mostly half-duplex. It is usually lack of bandwidth or major packet loss that cause trouble.
    - 10y ago
shmerl 10y ago
Google should open up their protocols, or use open ones. It's quite sad that Google of the past (which supported XMPP) is gone.
- aboonaboo 10y ago
  Xmpp is old and sucks for web
- kyrra 10y ago
  Google shut down XMPP support because none of the other large vendors were playing along. Because of how XMPP federation work, Microsoft could reach out to Google for presence and other information about friends, but didn't need to return the favor (they were doing one way federation). So it allowed for a "better" experience using other companies XMPP networks. Edit: Source for my beliefs on the above: http://www.ucstrategies.com/unified-communications-strategies-views/betting-on-xmpp.aspx http://www.ucstrategies.com/unified-communications-strategie... Edit 2: removed Facebook as an offender. It was just Microsoft that was not sharing.
  - kuschku 10y ago
    Facebook did provide XMPP service until the same time that Google ended it. So that’s definitely a wrong statement.
    - wutbrodo 10y ago
      Are you thinking of client-to-server federation? Google didn't cancel support for that (and supports it to this day: I still use pidgin here and there to connect to GChat). That's not what this conversation is about: Google's cancellation of server-to-server federation. Facebook definitely didn't support that at the time that Google cancelled it, and to my recollection, never did (though I may be wrong).
      - shmerl 10y ago
        As far as I know Google didn't cancel server to server federation, but they refused to support encryption for it, and it's as good as cancelled, because most servers made it mandatory at some point. That's what caused all my contacts who use Google to disappear. Very annoying, and it's completely Google's fault. Anyway, the reason they left it to rot is because they abandoned XMPP for "greener pa$tures".
Waterluvian 10y ago
Why isn't it always end to end encryption? I'm getting really paranoid and crochety in my old age of 29, as all I see is a tool to make me the product.
- sandermvanvliet 10y ago
  This was what popped out to me immediately in the bit where they write about TLS. I wonder whether this user driven approach is because of pressure from governments on encrypted chats or something else
- Guzba 10y ago
  The Google Assistant integration is arguably the killer feature of the app. End-to-end encryption would delete it, thus it is not the default.
  - tjl 10y ago
    But, they could have it encrypted except when you explicitly message the assistant. They can also get the full text of the conversation on-device and do the machine learning on it. After all, Apple is doing it for photos, so text should be easier.
    - kevinh 10y ago
      I think context-switching in terms of privacy in the middle of a conversation is more risky than doing so between different conversations (ideally with different visuals) or especially between applications. For me, having to remember that certain comments within conversations are not private (especially when said comments are looping in something that's designed to provide context to previous comments) is more problematic than having to remember that certain conversations are not private.
    - nzp 10y ago
      I wouldn't know, but from what one can hear from prominent Apple pundits and podcasters, Apple is not doing great at all in this regard, to put it mildly, compared to Google (and other data vacuumers). Examples: Google Photos is running circles around Photos, and Alexa around Siri. People who love and live Apple admit Apple is pathetic in this space. I doubt it's because Apple is incompetent. These problems require huge amounts of data and processing power. You can't do that locally on a mobile device (or even a PC class computer).
AceJohnny2 10y ago
So. Why make this a separate app? Why isn't this in Hangouts?
- prdonahue 10y ago
  Because Hangouts is a bloated POS? Everyone I know who works for Google states this (and I can concur from using it at work).
  - colemickens 10y ago
    How on earth is hangouts "bloated"? It's a friggin IM app with video calling built in. It's far more minimal than most other "alternative" IM clients.
    - tdfx 10y ago
      I don't know why it's "bloated", but after a few minutes of video chat it's got my computer sounding like a jetliner preparing for takeoff.
  - ProAm 10y ago
    So will this in a couple years, and then it will be dismantled and sunset like the rest...
  - urda 10y ago
    You do realize that's basically what's going to happen with this app yes? I'm pretty much done with Google IM products. I have a few contacts that will keep using hangouts, but for the rest I either have them on Facebook or iMessage.
- rtkwe 10y ago
  Easier to create a new code base and infrastructure than to bolt all the new features onto the old Hangouts code base. It also avoids the flip side argument/outcome to including it "I hate all these new features, it's ruined Hangouts."
- zamalek 10y ago
kai101 10y ago
wow, conversing with an AI. Skynet is near.
- bobsil1 10y ago
  I see. Why do you feel that way? -Eliza
tdkl 10y ago
If I'm bound to switch to something and bring friends to it, I'll rather do it with Wire[1], without any Google surveillance and data mining for "ad experience". It has a desktop client (electron based though) and isn't limited to 1 device. Not to mention E2E encryption ALL the time. [1] https://wire.com/ https://wire.com/
- MekaiGS 10y ago
  How does this company plan to make money from this? I tried to browse through all the pages and I am not seeing it.
  - tdkl 10y ago
    They're VC backed and plan a premium subscription sometime in the future. All of the current features will stay free. I think I've read it on their medium comment section or it's in the FAQ.
janvdberg 10y ago
Isn't the main feature of this (smart reply) something that can be easily implemented by other messaging apps? And the stickers/emojis and Google Assistant are already available in other apps. Granted, Google has the power to integrate things really well and make it a premium experience that can win users over. Also, how does this relate to Google Hangouts/Gmail Chat? Lots of questions so it will be interesting to see how this will turn out.
tiffanyh 10y ago
How did Google get Apple to approve this app for the App Store? It has fallback to SMS functionality[1], but SMS apps are rejected from the Apple App store [2]. [1] https://googleblog.blogspot.com/2016/09/google-allo-smarter-messaging-app.html https://googleblog.blogspot.com/2016/09/google-allo-smarter-... [2] https://developer.apple.com/app-store/review/guidelines/ https://developer.apple.com/app-store/review/guidelines/
- gelatocar 10y ago
  Are you referring to this bit? > Apps that enable anonymous or prank phone calls or SMS/MMS messaging will be rejected. I read that as anonymous or prank SMS/MMS, not just any SMS/MMS.
- itafroma 10y ago
  > It has fallback to SMS functionality, but SMS apps are rejected from the Apple App store. Which guideline are you thinking of? My search for "SMS" only found two unrelated guidelines: > 1.1.6 False information and features, including inaccurate device data or trick/joke functionality, such as fake location trackers. Stating that the app is “for entertainment purposes” won’t overcome this guideline. Apps that enable anonymous or prank phone calls or SMS/MMS messaging will be rejected. > 3.2.2 (iv) Collecting funds within the app for charities and fundraisers. Apps that seek to raise money for such causes must be free on the App Store and may only collect funds outside of the app, such as via Safari or SMS.
- lathiat 10y ago
  Sounds like Google are SMSing you from their own number, on behalf of Allo users -- at least for iPhone. If you click on the iPhone tab of that page, you see the following: Respond to a message without downloading Allo When you receive a message from an Allo user, you have a few options: Reply with a text message to continue chatting with the Allo user. To stop receiving messages from Allo users, text "STOP."
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spullara 10y ago
Looks like this is an attempt to do the same thing that iMessage has done for iPhone. If Apple released iMessage for Android it would probably lay waste to most other messaging services. People will pay to get upgraded to the blue bubble. https://twitter.com/search?q=green%20bubble%20text&src=typd https://twitter.com/search?q=green%20bubble%20text&src=typd
- urmish 10y ago
  Haha wow. I don't know what to make of this. Is being an apple user this important now a days?
flukus 10y ago
I've always wanted a messenger with bonzi buddy integrated...
ryan-allen 10y ago
I don't like canned replies. I made a tampermonkey [0] user script [1] to remove auto reply suggestions from Google Inbox, they drove me nuts. I found them utterly patronising! If only I could remove them from my phone, too. [0] https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/tampermonkey/dhdgffkkebhmkfjojejmpbldmpobfkfo?hl=en https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/tampermonkey/dhdgf... [1] https://gist.github.com/ryan-allen/fd45c6f7396fffe28b6b3b51797bb14f https://gist.github.com/ryan-allen/fd45c6f7396fffe28b6b3b517...
4684499 10y ago
From those gifs in the post, I assume it requires Google to scan every word I send. It will sense my tone to change the text style, and suggest how I should response. Well, why don't you just say it for me then? I'd love to see a bot representing me talks to my friends. And, a messaging app provides Incognito mode, lol, is there any other way to imply my conversation isn't private enough?
- chrisan 10y ago
  First you will need to train google to your own responses. Once it has your personality finger print then they can remove you from the equation :P
- bobsil1 10y ago
  Your friends will have their own bots. The bot-bot conversations will have ads sold against them. The ads will be bot-clickfrauded.
nickysielicki 10y ago
So the play store still shows this as coming soon for me. They did the same type of launch for Duo and I really don't understand what they have to gain from this. They're making a reentry into a very populated space. Facebook messenger, whatsapp, Skype, iMessage... why would you risk the scenario where someone finds this blog post in a newsfeed, looks at the app, finds it unavailable, and never returns? It just doesn't make any sense to me. Clearly they're going to launch sometime in the next 12 hours. So the infrastructure is all in place and the final builds are made. Why not wait on the press release until it's actually available?
dalbin 10y ago
In many countries, "allo" is the first word of a phone conversation. But Google Allo doesn't do any phone call, I think it will confuse users. https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/All%C3%B4 https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/All%C3%B4
- dx034 10y ago
  Especially because the two biggest competitors (FB messenger and Whatsapp) have phone calls in their chat apps. I think a lot of people will be disappointed finding out that you can't use voice in Allo.
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fma 10y ago
An app that writes my messages for me. Great, now I can be 1 step further removed from any contacts from my friends and family.
- prawn 10y ago
  Inbox does this too and in my brief experience so far, it's been accurate. I remember hearing about Amazon pre-emptively shipping goods to warehouses based on expected demand. If algorithms can anticipate our responses and our shopping, what will be left in the end?
  - dx034 10y ago
    I think it's a big difference to Amazon. They just forecast that in a given city x people will likely buy a certain product, so they already ship it there and only have to attach labels when it's ordered. Google tries to exactly forecast what you will want to respond to a picture, which sounds a lot harder.
    - prawn 10y ago
      Not commenting so much on the difficulty or differences as much as on the ability of software/analysis to anticipate us, gradually doing what makes us us. With my buying history, analysis could do a reasonable job of choosing and buying my future clothes. Spotify suggests decent music based on what I've previously liked. With relevant data, a service could feed me satisfying food I liked.
j_koreth 10y ago
This reminds me a lot of Telegram in incognito vs secret chat and the stickers. I wish Google good luck in such a competive field and especially one that is completely dependent on the network effect
colemickens 10y ago
Google's Duo/Allo strategy is the final straw after adopting Google Voice like 10 years and hoping that eventually Hangouts would not a pile of crap. Beside the limbo that this leaves Hangouts in, Allo and Duo have no web/desktop client, which is where I do 90% of my messaging. I've made too many excuses and put up with half-assed experiences for the past 5-10 years. Unfortunately, my options are probably Facebook messaging or raw SMS. Meanwhile Riot/Matrix have all of the functionality of Slack/Skype/Hangouts/etc, is open source, is federated, etc... and no one seems to care... (Not to mention that I still can't even download Allo if I try...)
helthanatos 10y ago
>We can’t wait for you to say hello to Google Allo! We’re beginning to roll out Google Allo for Android and iOS, and the app will be available worldwide in the next few days. I wonder if they are doing this because they expect issues or if they expect everyone to want the app. Personally, I just wish the stock Android messenger could communicate better with imessage group chats.
- yincrash 10y ago
  Without a valid macOS/iOS device key, it's not possible. The key allows your device to publish iMessage signing keys to the Apple directory service that recipient devices use to decrypt your iMessages. Without a device key, your device won't be able to do this.
  - jjcm 10y ago
    Is it possible to harvest one from an old iPhone? I'd certainly buy an old iPhone that's mildly damaged if it meant I could use imessage on android.
    - yincrash 10y ago
      Possibly, but it seems that the reverse engineering + the hassle of needing an Apple key has prevented any real compatible clones from being made.
supercoder 10y ago
they should have just made this an iMessage app
evincarofautumn 10y ago
Chat apps are like to-do apps. They’re easy to make (albeit hard to make well) and you rarely have a strong reason to choose one over another, so you’ll probably stick with whatever you (and your friends) are already using. Besides, if I take up Allo and fall in love with it, I’ll be sad when it disappears after Google stops supporting it in a few years. These features should be integrated into Hangouts, else they’re dividing their own market. Though, ironically, if everyone with this sentiment went against their gut reaction and adopted Allo anyway, then Google would be forced to support it, as they do Gmail.
- disillusioned 10y ago
  They'll just roll Assistant/other Allo features back into Hangouts, where all their users are. Unless they kick us all out by sunsetting Hangouts for non-Apps users.
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binoyxj 10y ago
Rolling out in India https://twitter.com/juberti/status/778453572035878912 https://twitter.com/juberti/status/778453572035878912 If you can't wait, here's the APK http://www.apkmirror.com/apk/google-inc/allo-by-google/allo-by-google-1-0-006_rc18-release/ http://www.apkmirror.com/apk/google-inc/allo-by-google/allo-...
jotux 10y ago
So now google has Voice, Messenger, Hangouts, Allo, and Duo all with overlapping functionality? I wish they would just focus on making Hangouts work really well.
- berfarah 10y ago
  I think the way they see it is: Voice is basically deprecated Hangouts is enterprise Allo and Duo compete with Whatsapp/iMessage and Facetime/Skype respectively
  - 77ko 10y ago
    Not quite: - Facebook Messenger combines all the functionality of Allo and Duo. - Whatsapp already has voice calling and is adding video soon (so I read on the internet) - iMessage and Facetime integrate in IOS much better than Google Duo does. In IOS, you go to a contact and press facetime. On Android, you go to a contact... then go back out to Duo and call them. WeChat, of course, does everything that all these apps will ever do - as of many years ago.
    - floopidydoopidy 10y ago
      I feel like ICQ 98 was the pinnacle of chat applications. Floating contacts and email style messages... brilliance.
      - wingerlang 10y ago
        > email style messages Care to elaborate? I'm having trouble picturing what you mean. Long form with styling?
      - the_other 10y ago
        The "find random chat partner" feature was so addictive!
      - ashark 10y ago
        Strongly agree. It's still unsurpassed. And it worked well on systems with 64mb of RAM (maybe even less) without stomping all over the rest of the programs you were running. Seems like no-one can even "Hello World" a desktop app these days without a 100mb download and requiring several hundred MB of memory all to itself.
nitins 10y ago
Installed it. Liking it so far.
timClicks 10y ago
This looks a lot like Wave wanted to be. Communication & smart agents helping things along.
chias 10y ago
I really wish they wouldn't overload terms that they themselves invented. In Chrome, "incognito" means we don't save your local history, but it does not add to the transport security. Here, "incognito" means you've got end-to-end encryption (and presumably also doesn't save local history). Why on earth would you re-use the same term when naming two things with similar (thus easily confused) consumer-visible attributes but completely different security guarantees?!
- Mizza 10y ago
  The worst was "Off the Record", which, for an XMPP service, didn't mean the "Off the Record" encryption protocol, it means "we don't log messages to your own email inbox." It's another dark pattern from an unscrupulous company.
  - Sargos 10y ago
    I doubt anyone has ever confused the two. "Off the record" is a well known phrase in our culture. The "off the record" protocol is not very well known.
- dovdov 10y ago
  End-to-end encryption from your phone to Google's server, where neural networks now analyze all your data, Super cute! Lovely Labrador!
  - jjcm 10y ago
    From their FAQ: "Your chats are end-to-end encrypted and can only be seen by you and the person you're chatting with. Google can't read any of your messages, so you won't see any Smart Reply or Google Assistant features." https://support.google.com/allo/answer/6383724?ref_topic=6376094&hl= https://support.google.com/allo/answer/6383724?ref_topic=637...
    - pjmlp 10y ago
      Who validates that that statement is indeed true, we in our naivety should just plain believe it?
0xmohit 10y ago
Open Whisper Systems partners with Google on end-to-end encryption for Allo. https://whispersystems.org/blog/allo/ https://whispersystems.org/blog/allo/
- headmelted 10y ago
  Dare I say that I'm actually a little disappointed by this? I get where Moxie is coming from, and that he doesn't have the PR machinery that Facebook and Google do to really push Signal to the mainstream, but these are advertising companies. When OWS takes this work on they're giving a tacit Moxie stamp of approval to the implementation, that could well change after OWS has moved on to other things. tldr; History tells me not to trust these companies motives in the long term, and I don't see why Moxie should either.
  - nzp 10y ago
    > When OWS takes this work on they're giving a tacit Moxie stamp of approval to the implementation Which is completely irrelevant for any mainstream messaging app OWS has collaborated with. No “normal” person on this planet that uses these apps knows or cares about who Moxie is. > tldr; History tells me not to trust these companies motives in the long term, and I don't see why Moxie should either. I doubt he does, but his goal with all this is to end passive mass surveillance, and he obviously thinks this is the best shot. I mean, Signal the app is certainly not going to become a significant player in this space, so we can debate if he's doing the right thing but I can totally see the how he can justify it even if he doesn't really trust them.
primitivesuave 10y ago
I'm quite sure the "smart reply" feature will eventually have a Google Gorilla scandal[1] of its own. 1. http://blogs.wsj.com/digits/2015/07/01/google-mistakenly-tags-black-people-as-gorillas-showing-limits-of-algorithms/ http://blogs.wsj.com/digits/2015/07/01/google-mistakenly-tag...
headmelted 10y ago
Boo. All the shiny bells-and-whistles in the world aren't going to cover the fact that this should be end-to-end by default. I suspect at least some of the folks working on it feel this way too, so I imagine it's really shitty for some of them to have it work this way. If WhatsApp is already end-to-end by default there's no reason at all that a new app trying to enter that already saturated space shouldn't be. Sincerely, I hope this fails quickly. My grumpy old ass will stay on Signal thanks very much.
- nanny 10y ago
  If it were end-to-end encrypted by default, how would Google Assistant work?
  - saint_fiasco 10y ago
    Maybe you could invite @google to the conversation just like you can invite a friend to a conversation in Hangouts.
  - headmelted 10y ago
    Oh it definitely wouldn't. I'd be fine with this though as, admittedly cynically, I suspect that Assistant's main reason for existing is to provide a justification for the lack of encryption.
20andup 10y ago
I don't know about you guys, but I am quite sick of these messaging apps that don't really provide any added-value over their competitors. Moreover, these message apps are not decentralize nor are these companies altruistic, so it quite easy to conclude that these companies wants your data.
notliketherest 10y ago
This is Googles big play into chat bots.
jcg8802 10y ago
Says it's available for iOS. Not available for iOS.
gcatalfamo 10y ago
Can't find it. Is it US only?
throw2016 10y ago
Google just keeps pushing boundaries trying to legitimise spying. This is really creepy, and its surprising that Google and folks who work there think its ok to do this. Might as well have an NSA drone tail you. It's as if Google's ad business is just a front for a global intelligence gathering operation. There is a real problem with Google here and a golden opportunity for less privacy invading businesses to take its place. I am sure as users becoming more aware they will increasingly gravitate to businesses that can operate less creepily.
enitihas 10y ago
Just installed the app and asked the google assistant - "Are you on Facebook?" The reply -> "I'm not on facebook, but I do like things a lot (y)"
scottmf 10y ago
The technology behind the feature is great, don't get me wrong. But there's something so empty about the Labrador response. I want a discussion with a human. Not a human-curated conversation of algorithm-determined responses. Simple human conversation isn't as much of a problem-to-be-solved as they seem to think it is.
- dkarapetyan 10y ago
  This falls in an interesting uncanny valley. If you know the person on the other end is using allo who are you really talking to? The average google bot response powered by deepmind or the actual person on the other end?
  - em500 10y ago
    Reminds me of when Facebook got slammed about their auto-happy-birthday feature: https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/jul/29/facebook-happy-birthday-sms-notification https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/jul/29/facebook-...
    - scottmf 10y ago
      That's a good comparison and I'd expect similar user backlash here. I'm confused as to why they're choosing to lead with this feature.
- ygmelnikova 10y ago
  I see the Labrador type of responses would be very appealing to the ego of many. Why reply with "What kind of dog is she?" when you can reply "What a nice lab". And with the emoji prompt, you'll never find yourself on the wrong side of the status quo. What's the end game? An AI agent that handles 100% of your communication for you? Forget 'Skynet'.. we'll call it 'Mother'.
- gmarx 10y ago
  Will this evolve into a complete substitute for small talk? Will we some day have text algorithms exchanging pleasantries with our friends text algorithms each day? Hi John, how are you today? Wonderful! are you enjoying the 79 F sunny day? Why yes, Terry, I am! Once you automate (insincerity? phoniness?) does it go away?
vs2 10y ago
Not available in UK store ...
silverbln 10y ago
Why would someone use Allo - giving everyone the awkward feeling that my responses are computer-written?
zuxfer 10y ago
Am I too old school to miss Google Talk even today?
ephimetheus 10y ago
It's almost as if they want you to abandon their stuff even before they do...
Twisell 10y ago
TL;DR; "We had to react very quickly to Apple updated iMessage so instead of updating one of our existing clients we rolled out this new App which is a carbon copy of iMessage*" PS: Oh and yeah we have made this useless encryption as an opt-in per session variable instead of standard...
f4stjack 10y ago
All I want from this newest addition to google chat services is a decent overview of who is online and who is not. The rest is just icing on the cake.
VeejayRampay 10y ago
Really waiting for the day where Google will accidentally release a new messaging app called Google Hangouts or some other name that they already use, because there are just so many it's impossible to keep track.
andmarios 10y ago
> Google Allo makes it easier for you to respond quickly and keep the conversation going, even when you’re on the go. With Smart Reply, you can respond to messages with just a tap, so you can send a quick “yup” in response to a friend asking “Are you on your way?” Smart Reply will also suggest responses for photos. If your friend sends you a photo of their pet, you might see Smart Reply suggestions like “aww cute!” And whether you’re a “haha” or “” kind of person, Smart Reply will improve over time and adjust to your style. So for Google instead of snowflakes we are glorified chat bots? I like it. I hope one day it can imitate me so well I can delegate all my chats to it. It will be like a mini-me! > Have some fun. Ask your Assistant to share that funny YouTube video or play games with friends right in your group chat — for instance you can compete to guess a movie title based on a series of emojis. Oh great, now I have a tireless assistant to help me spam my friends and make them procrastinate!
- drake01 10y ago
  mini-me! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mini-Me https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mini-Me ?
  - andmarios 10y ago
    Exactly!
- em500 10y ago
  > I hope one day it can imitate me so well I can delegate all my chats to it. It will be like a mini-me! Next step is when both ends do this and cut out the human middle (wo)men.
  - andmarios 10y ago
    Yeap! And after work we can have a meta-chat about what our mini-mes chatted while we were working.
spacehunt 10y ago
Does anyone know how the app preview message notifications[1] are implemented? Is it open to us third party app developers? [1] When a message is sent to someone without Allo installed, they'll still receive a notification and can reply directly from it https://support.google.com/allo/answer/6385770 https://support.google.com/allo/answer/6385770
- kuschku 10y ago
  It doesn’t seem to be. A good occasion to send another complaint to http://ec.europa.eu/competition/contacts/electronic_documents_en.html http://ec.europa.eu/competition/contacts/electronic_document...
- piquadrat 10y ago
  Might be that it is based on Instant Apps[1] which was announced at this year's Google IO [1]: https://developer.android.com/topic/instant-apps/index.html https://developer.android.com/topic/instant-apps/index.html?
saynsedit 10y ago
Say hello to privacy invasion
Flip-per 10y ago
So if Allo, Whatsapp and Signal itself use the protocol and implementation of Signal, wouldn't it be possible to freely choose one of these clients which then can communicate with all other clients?
- Spakman 10y ago
  I'm afraid not. Federation isn't supported at all as far as I'm aware. It was on the Signal roadmap early on, but things have changed: https://whispersystems.org/blog/the-ecosystem-is-moving/ https://whispersystems.org/blog/the-ecosystem-is-moving/
newscracker 10y ago
Does Allo also require one to necessarily allow access to contacts on the device to use it? This was a must in Duo, and so I abandoned the app after denying it permission to access my contacts because it wouldn't work otherwise (like allowing me to enter a phone number manually). Regardless of what other people generally do, I wouldn't want to upload my complete contacts list to a service provider like Google (or Facebook). Also, the default being not end-to-end encrypted is not favorable to me. But I do like the option of having it available (like Telegram's secret chat).
- ccashell 10y ago
  I'm not sure I understand your complaint/concern. We're talking about text chat and video chat clients, and you're concerned with giving them access to your contacts? How are you going to contact your contacts with the apps if they don't know who your contacts are? All communication apps are going to require access to your contacts so that your contact information can be used to communicate with your contacts. Duo and Allo are tied to phone numbers. They use phone numbers to identify users, so without access to phone numbers (contacts), they can't function. This is the same as all text message (SMS) clients, and the same way that many other chat clients work (Signal, WhatsApp, etc.).
amelius 10y ago
Can't we just agree on one standard already? I hate having to use multiple messaging apps, that's the biggest UX failure right there, and it desperately needs fixing! Forget about all the other features!
- oddvar 10y ago
  agreed! This is what we're trying to do with Matrix (https://matrix.org https://matrix.org)
  - anentropic 10y ago
    I couldn't easily tell what it is from reading the homepage
    - Arathorn 10y ago
      we're about to rewrite the homepage to fix that :) (i work on matrix, obviously)
      - arbitrage 10y ago
        So ... what does it do?
- edhelas 10y ago
  XMPP http://xmpp.org/ http://xmpp.org/ ? Or maybe Matrix if you want a nice XKCD-927 project :)
psyc 10y ago
I faintly remember the early 'oughts, back when I used to be excited about the stuff Google did.
rajadigopula 10y ago
Great. Let's plan an experiment of using smart replies on both sides. It's like 2 bots chatting! Hope the smart reply adapts to individual's style with time, otherwise, it gets boring easily and the other party might know when a template response sent as 'sorry, no longer interested in you!'
kriro 10y ago
If they want an instant network effect there's a really simple play...integrate it with Pokemon Go. If it's the only official IM program that'll work with/is tightly coupled with Pokemon Go enough people will install it. Might sound silly but I think that would actually be a great play for Google.
davidgerard 10y ago
I'm sure Ello are delighted with Google's respect for trademarks.
wanda 10y ago
Lots of speculation about how long these apps will last. I personally suspect it's Hangouts that will be chopped. Google looked at Facebook Messenger and realised that the future was in personal assistants and the illusion of virtual/simulated AI, and realised also that Hangouts would become an unmanageable mess with more features added, so they are rolling out a Messenger competitor and a Hangouts video replacement with a transitional period to assess both feasibility, interest and to enable Hangouts customers to explore alternatives ahead of the shutdown, while attracting new business along the way. Personally, I like Duo because I can talk to my partner with video even though my partner is on Android and is a bit of a technophobe. The almost-too-simple UI is much easier for my partner to use than Hangouts, and Skype is a dog. I also do not use Facebook. Google, like Apple now, and like Microsoft before it, is playing catch-up to Facebook and arguably has been since Google+. It's like Hollywood: remakes are far from innovative and are loathed by many who liked the originals or who crave fresh material, but a remake is much easier to get through the boardroom and easier to make profitable. Google should be pushing the boundaries but it's afraid of tarnishing its credibility with potentially bad decisions. They also want to appear active I suppose, and to collect what data they can from people who are likely to be loyal to a Google competitor to Facebook. I think Google should be thinking doing more than buying up tech talent in acquihires and inflating an already bloated app ecosystem that threatens what business they already have, but I'm not a business person.
- lost_name 10y ago
  I believe they've previously discussed Hangouts becoming business focused. Allo, I think, has the potential to replace the default SMS app (similar to iMessage).
  - nameless912 10y ago
    Maybe, if they get rid of this boneheaded SMS relay bullshit. It's not 2008 anymore, iMessage got transparent SMS<->internet messaging right like 4 years ago.
- Angostura 10y ago
  I'm getting really confused. I work at a school where we wanted to do cheap and cheerful Webinars. Hangouts, with the ability to record to a Youtube channel looked ideal, but the repositioning of products is so rapid, I guess I may have to look at this all again.
Esau 10y ago
The Google surveillance machine has many faces. The only way to win is to not play the game.
TuringNYC 10y ago
Not sure how common this is, but everyone at both school and work these days shifts seamlessly from mobile to dekstop and back. This has been one of the main reasons we tend to use WhatsApp and Slack, even for corporate communications as silly as that sounds -- because you can type long messages on it on the keyboard/desktop but also have access to it on the go. What I don't understand is -- given Allo had a blank slate, why did they limit it to just mobile? They cover two major silos (Android + iOS), (one reason we dont use iMsg) but why not the third silo (non-mobile)?
- Bedon292 10y ago
  Definitely doesn't make sense. I use hangouts constantly. It is my default app for SMS and chatting with family. I like having one consistent thread between different desktop devices, as well as mobile. Yes Slack has replaced it for work, but that's no good for family, at least not mine. Until this has desktop support there is no reason for me to buy in. Why not have (one of) the most important feature of hangouts (and all of the other competitors) on these new apps?
  - scholia 10y ago
    Google wants to own the whole IT stack from servers and software services to devices. It supported the entrenched alternatives (Windows and Macs) when it had no alternative, but now it won't, unless it really has to. In Google's thinking, the whole IT stack is Google cloud-based, and in the long term, people having "different desktop devices" isn't the right way to go. Yes, this is overstatement for sarcastic effect, but the trend seems to be real....
  - MrPatan 10y ago
    For SMSs too? On my Android, the new(ish?) message app ("Messenger") now wanted control of SMSs back from hangouts. Another silly reversal, and another silly messaging app from Google. Fourth time lucky? On that topic, when is the inbox app replacing the gmail app? Maybe never and that's good, given that sometimes I cannot download attachments with the inbox app that I can happily download from the old gmail app right away.
meira 10y ago
This time is different, I'm sure.
jug 10y ago
So how do I get this going? Ask my friends to install a new messaging app just to talk with me? Unsure if I have that much of an influence even if I wanted people to switch. :P
mapletree 10y ago
Allo Taxi Lebanon is going to be pissed!
bane 10y ago
My response is the same as when Duo came out https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12297084 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12297084
betaby 10y ago
More messengers - less desire to use them. My anecdata show shift to jabber and IRC for older and more tech folks.
- comboy 10y ago
  That's what makes hangouts appealing, you can still you your XMPP client. Maybe allo will support it too.
  - ryukafalz 10y ago
    XMPP support is still around, but from what I've been able to gather it's their old Google Talk system bridged into Hangouts. I fully expect it to go away without warning at some point in the future, and I would be very surprised if Allo ever supports it.
abvdasker 10y ago
Another messaging app? Who gives a fuck?
oliv__ 10y ago
So this is what 2016 looks like in tech...
senc01a 10y ago
Goodbye Allo.
senc01a 10y ago
Hello and Goodbye Allo. Not interested in yet another messaging product.
tauchunfall 10y ago
>but everyone at both school and work these days shifts seamlessly from mobile to dekstop and back Maybe the communication protocol is based on Hangout. Some people reverse-engineered the protocol and open-sourced it. It's called hangups. I'm not sure, but was WhatsApp mobile-only in the past and someone reverse-engineered the modified XMMP protocol? never used it.
mstade 10y ago
You know what I really need? A new messaging app, so people can complain more about me not using whatever messaging app they're using. I'm not saying that email and sms/mms don't have flaws, but at least I don't have to consider whether the recipient of my message has whatever random app is popular today. Have we seen the end of wide spread open protocols, because huge tech corporations are hell bent on controlling communications?
- kodt 10y ago
  I can see how these apps can take off with kids, who are in school and see each-other every day.. so there can be some coordination on what app to use. But for me, I don't see how I could use anything other than email/sms and expect someone else to use it.
  - CaptSpify 10y ago
    I think kids too, aren't tired: I've probably tried >50 messaging systems, from irc to aim to msn messenger to hangouts. After a while, you just get tired of trying rehashes of the same thing, and want one that communicates with everyone. We had things like Pigeon, but companies keep closing off their systems to force you to have one app/program per system. Eventually you get tired of trying new ones, and just go back to the reliable ones that work with everybody.
    - nameless912 10y ago
      > irc Man, why can't we just use IRC? It's as close to perfect as anything has ever gotten.
- chadlavi 10y ago
  This. I think my fiancée has decided she wants to use Allo for text messages now, and I am not excited to have to add some new number for her in my phone and deal with weird looking text messages from her all the time. Allo is just another also-ran solution trying to find a problem.
jorgecastillo 10y ago
Great, another App we'll get bundled in our Android devices. (>_<) I don't think so Google! https://telegram.org/ https://telegram.org/
koolba 10y ago
I can't be the only one thinking in (12 + x) months, where x is between 0 and 24, there will be a post on the same blog: "Say goodbye to Google Allo".
menacingly 10y ago
The useless predictive reply stuff makes it feel more like a tech demo than an actual product. Why on Earth would I want a machine actually expressing sentiment for me, even if it's really cool that it can?
- chriswarbo 10y ago
  > Why on Earth would I want a machine actually expressing sentiment for me, even if it's really cool that it can? My old 'phone came with a bunch of pre-prepared SMS messages to make replies quicker, like "OK", "Sorry, can't talk now", etc. One of them was "I love you too".
omouse 10y ago
Encrypted or not?
sickbeard 10y ago
I always wondered what word we would use after "smart" wore off. Apparently it's now "smarter"
givinguflac 10y ago
Google is a mess. Really sad to see they're doubling down even further on invading user privacy, never mind the encryption that isn't even enabled by default. Pathetic.
lost_name 10y ago
I wonder if the WhatsApp "problem" Brazil has been having somehow influenced the change of stance of encryption?
sorenjan 10y ago
I don't know of any other company that has discontinued as many products people actually used. Sorry Google, even if I didn't already have several chat apps and even if I didn't prefer to type on a real keyboard I still couldn't recommend your new products to friends and family. I just don't trust you anymore.
- degenerate 10y ago
  RIP Google Talk, February 16, 2015. This was the end for me.
dagaci 10y ago
I Have WhatsApp running on my iPhone, Windows PC, on my iMac and Laptop. I haven't tried Allo yet, but I'm not happy with any app like this taking off that isn't cross-platform.
- dethstar 10y ago
  Whatsapp wasn't on the web not too long ago. They also started with Chrome only which was annoying.
buro9 10y ago
Does not seem to work with Google Apps account. Which makes the list: * Allo * Google Fi * Google Play Music Family Plan * Google Play Store Family Sharing * Google Spaces * Google Trips * YouTube Red * YouTube Music It's a growing list. I'm always amused by the "One account. All of Google" header on the login pages. Google Apps accounts do not grant access to all of Google as the products do not work for it (it's not a permissions thing the domain admin can fix).
- nickspacek 10y ago
  I wonder if they do this to limit the potential of rolling breaking changes out to their enterprise Google Apps accounts and the like? The servers running the Google Apps accounts and applications probably have a different update policy. It's frustrating for sure, which is why I ended up making my Google Apps (old/free version) account just an alias for my Gmail address.
- MrMullen 10y ago
  Allo YouTube Red YouTube Music Spaces These all can use Google Apps accounts since I use all of these and I use a Google Apps account exclusively.
  - coda_ 10y ago
    But, within Allo, can you ask the assistant "What's on my schedule?" and get an answer? I know that's not what you were saying, just curious if that part works for you.
    - MrMullen 10y ago
      I did that it said it can't link to my account. I have not checked yet (My Admin password is locked up at home), but I think my account might not be configured to allow it.
      - MrMullen 10y ago
        Checked last night, can't link Allo assistant to my Google Apps calendar. Lame.
qntty 10y ago
This is what it looks like when you send someone an allo message and they don't have allo. I was surprised that it would send something like this without asking permission. I assumed it would fall back to SMS transparently. http://i.imgur.com/6aHNeMR.jpg http://i.imgur.com/6aHNeMR.jpg
overcast 10y ago
Express yourself with photos, emojis and stickers. This is where I decided I'm done reading, and this is not for me.
sorenjan 10y ago
According to reports Allo doesn't support quick reply on Android N, any kind of reply on Android Wear, or notifications on more than one device. If there was any chat app that should support all of those it should be Google's new and shiny, which begs the question: Have Google made these features hard to use on Android, or are Allo's developers just not good at writing Android apps?
johnhenry 10y ago
I just texted a friend and she replied "Good morning... why google allo". The message that she received from me included a message letting her know that I added her to Google Allo to chat along with a link to unsubscribe. I normally try to have more substance in my comments than just an anecdote, but this is simply highly un-nerving...
mark_l_watson 10y ago
I installed it and am comparing it to updates in macOS Sierra that I installed today. Even though Siri hooks into Wolfram Alpha so it does very well with 'calculation style' questions and general world questions, without Google's greater knowledge of what we are doing it can't compete. The question for people to answer individually is do they want give up more private information and have a great Google experience, or, they want more privacy, in which case Apple comes out the winner. With Allo, asking about my future airline reservations works, but asking for future shuttle reservations did not, which was surprising since Google Inbox highlights the upcoming shuttle reservation. EDIT: it turns out that you can't make Allo your SMS app on Android, it is separate. Allo looks cool, but I deregistered and uninstalled it: SMS, email, and separate Google Now works well for me.
- Yhippa 10y ago
  You know when you search Google for a question and sometimes it will highlight the answer in a card at the top of the page by itself? I'm really surprised it's not doing that in Allo.
  - vthallam 10y ago
    Basically part of the answer and a hyperlink to the full answer. Guess, they will add it soon enough.
willow9886 10y ago
Interesting that another trending story on HN contradicts google's post wrt the privacy features included in allo: http://www.theverge.com/2016/9/21/12994362/allo-privacy-message-logs-google http://www.theverge.com/2016/9/21/12994362/allo-privacy-mess... I had a feeling Google's representation of their respect for user privacy was too good to be true. Clearly they only have an interest in marketing privacy, as opposed to actually delivering effective privacy controlling tools and features.
whizzkid 10y ago
As long as they(Google) don't study why WhatsApp is the most popular messaging app, I don't think they will ever dominate this market. Here are the most important 2 things in my opinion that made whatsapp #1 messaging app. - WhatsApp tried to reach everyone from the beginning. Founders knew that not everyone in world has enough money to buy a shiny phone every year. - WhatsApp uses minimal bytes possible to send your messages to other side. This will be the only choice for people who have expensive data plans all over the world, and those who are travelling often and roaming enabled. I am not even sure if my 4 years old android phone will be able to install the app. So will this app have a great success? I don't think so.
- vocatus_gate 10y ago
  That's literally the reason I even heard of or installed WhatsApp a few years ago. I was spending time doing work with my church in el Salvador and a bunch of the locals there used WhatsApp because it avoided the insane SMS fees the telco charged. I installed it just to chat with them internationally. Now almost all my friends are on it and it's great. I love the cross-platform ease of use, E2E encryption, and easy web interface. I'm just scared of how Facebook will ruin it.
  - whizzkid 10y ago
    I think Google lately spending too much time in the Silicon Valley bubble and less time in the real world. Solutions they are coming up with have so little value outside the small bubble. WhatsApp solved a real world problem without being fancy or trying to do too much. It kept it simple, efficient and treated everyone equal in its ecosystem. I don't think Facebook will try to change WhatsApp. They are mostly interested in WhatsApp's user base. But even if they ruin it, success stories will not change. The next big thing will come from people that have similar mindsets like the ones created WhatsApp.
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
rer 10y ago
If both Allo users have responses recommended by the app, who's chatting with each other -- the users or the apps?
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
mmanfrin 10y ago
I just don't understand why. Encryption and stickers and gifs are things you could add to hangouts easily. 'Assistant' is just a wrapper for google now in a less convenient form. What is the point.
- gallerdude 10y ago
  After playing around with it for a bit, Google Assistant is the killer app. I wanted to show my friend Bill Wurtz's wonderful "History of Japan" video. So I just typed "@google bill wurtz japan". Google Assistant immediately added the video to our chat. So this seems super nice if you just thought of something you want to show a someone.
x2f10 10y ago
Google is the kid who accomplishes little despite having a genius IQ as he's unable to focus. Google needs to build a single messaging application (ala iMessage) into Android, Gmail, Google Docs, etc. Then, once that's done, support the messaging app on all mobile platforms. Most people outside the tech world do not even know what iMessage is, but they use it daily. That is how integrated it is into Apple products - perfect. Google can do this on a much larger scale, but chooses, instead, to focus on pet projects they'll lay out to pasture in 12 months. APPL and AMZN are going to eat Google's lunch.
api 10y ago
Imagine walking around and conversing with a friend and a salesman is hanging just behind you, listening to everything you say, and interjecting carefully crafted comments and "advice" designed to modify your buying behavior in response to what you're talking about. He's also recording your conversation and may or may not give it to the government or his advertising clients. That's this, basically. No thanks.
bstrong 10y ago
I find it interesting that people are complaining both about the lack of a web app and about Google keeping message history on their servers. I'm assuming they will eventually build a web app, but you can't build a useful one unless you have the message history on the server, encrypted in such a way that the web server can decrypt it and serve it to the browser. Unfortunately, you really do have to choose between privacy and having a web app. I'm not sure which I value more, TBH.
siddharthdeswal 10y ago
Just like omnichannel, chat apps need to be 'omnichat', i.e. be present on mobiles and desktop.
rajanikanthr 10y ago
useless for me until they introduce equivalent of web.whatsapp.com
BMorearty 10y ago
Just don't fat-finger the verification code. I did, and now I can't create an account.
xfactor973 10y ago
Yet another Google product that'll I'll like and they'll kill off in a year. I'm getting tired of this pattern from them
anon4711 10y ago
Google Allo: Why people such as Edward Snowden are advising against using the app http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/gadgets-and-tech/features/google-allo-should-i-download-it-privacy-issues-problems-fixes-snowden-a7321216.html http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/gadgets-and-tech/fea...
draw_down 10y ago
Why do they need another-nother-nother messaging app?!
huangc10 10y ago
Is it weird to anyone else that the first GIF they show is of an iPhone using Allo and not Android? What message is Google trying to send (excuse the pun)? To me, it really shows that they are prioritizing iPhone over Android...
nikolay 10y ago
I dislike it - there's no history between app installs. The least I need is another ephemeral messaging app!
github-cat 10y ago
So this is what I get when I use Google Assistant. http://www.pixelstech.net/fun/279-Am-I-talking-to-Google-Assistant-or-ET http://www.pixelstech.net/fun/279-Am-I-talking-to-Google-Ass...

440 points by mikeevans 10y ago

donw 10y ago

I wonder how many users will come to depend on it before they shut it down.

gravypod 10y ago
Google reader will always be missed.
iagooar 10y ago
I give it 2 years. Maybe only 18 months. I don't even know how many different (and confusing!) chat applications Google has launched already. Seems like their engineers, when they get bored, write a chat app.
- flukus 10y ago
  Next time I see someone mention how great their monolithic repository is I'll ask how many chat applications you have to checkout before you can code at google.
  - justinlardinois 10y ago
    There was an article posted on here a few months ago about Google's version control system. One of the main features is that you don't actually checkout copies of every file in the repository; instead they're faulted in as you need them. My impression is that the monolithic repository only works because Google's built a bunch of custom tooling to support it. It doesn't mean any company can just roll all of their code into a single Git repository and call it a day.
    - kyrra 10y ago
      This maybe? http://m.cacm.acm.org/magazines/2016/7/204032-why-google-stores-billions-of-lines-of-code-in-a-single-repository/fulltext http://m.cacm.acm.org/magazines/2016/7/204032-why-google-sto... The key here is CITC. All the source code lives "in the cloud" and pulls to your machine as it's needed (using a FUSE file system).
      - justinlardinois 10y ago
        Yes, that's it, and that's the key feature I was talking about.
toomuchtodo 10y ago
New Google Ecosystems: Not even once.
1_2__3 10y ago
They should code name the next one "stillborn".
dimino 10y ago
This is overblown, the biggest thing they did this to was Reader, and that was hardly an "ecosystem" app without any way to use a stand-in replacement within minutes.
- kuschku 10y ago
  You do realize reader had comment sections, likes, etc? It was a full-blown social network for a while.

piyush_soni 10y ago

Still says "Unregister" (or Pre-register if you hadn't registered) for me (I'm in India).

otto_ortega 10y ago

Yey! Just what the world was missing, yet another instant messaging app...

r00fus 10y ago
Google's bid for the slack/FB message space, which is now (even Apple's pushing) the new apps/bot platform. Google has no choice. I also don't expect them to fold up shop unless the 'bot market just fizzles.

sunnyps 10y ago

This has SMS fallback! https://support.google.com/allo/answer/6376011 https://support.google.com/allo/answer/6376011

tdkl 10y ago
Yeah, wonder how it looks like, if it's coming from the persons number, or some service. [edit] Not from personal number it seems : http://www.reddit.com/r/projectfi/comments/53rhk8/_/ http://www.reddit.com/r/projectfi/comments/53rhk8/_/
rspeer 10y ago
Does it work with MMS, like Hangouts usually doesn't?
- tdkl 10y ago
  Nope. It's more or less glorified invite message over a service, that also receives replies from SMS. But since it doesn't show as sent from your mobile number, the receiver will have a separate thread in their SMS application. http://www.androidpolice.com/2016/09/20/allo-weird-sms-explained-other-answers/ http://www.androidpolice.com/2016/09/20/allo-weird-sms-expla...
  - rspeer 10y ago
    ...so if I used Google Allo, I would still need to also use Google Messenger for MMS conversations and Facebook Messenger for conversations with less-nerdy people. The only thing Allo seems to have going for it is that it's not another blue speech bubble icon labeled "Messenger".
    - tdkl 10y ago
      Basically, yeah. If we overlook everything, all that Allo offers is the Google Assistant and that's probably what they wanted - fresh set of data.

putlake 10y ago

I'm surprised Google Duo hasn't become more popular. It's a great cross-platform video chat app. I especially like the feature where you can see the other party before you answer their call. I have taken calls because of that feature that I otherwise wouldn't have. It's better than FaceTime because it works on Android. It's better than Skype and Google Hangouts because your cellphone number is your identity; you don't have to log in with any usernames or passwords. Extremely low friction.

arihant 10y ago
I was waiting for Duo and didn't even know it launched. Maybe more marketing is required.
piyush_soni 10y ago
I'll use everything Google, but Duo has been the most stupid video chat app I've ever used. That's because in countries where the common household internet is still not that fast, it 'aggressively' pauses (completely removes) the video for long intervals in every few minutes citing slow connection. That's a frustrating experience. I generally get around 10-12 Mbps speed (which is on the higher side in India), and my family in another city have a 4 Mbps connection - it still pauses the video regularly when we talk - and eventually we switch to skype because it at least shows something, even if pixelated. I'm as disappointed by this 'feature' as excited I was before trying Duo.
- amaks 10y ago
  What's the latency of your connection? You can get 4 Mbps throughput (which is not a lot by itself, BTW), but the latency may be too high for a video chat.
  - AstralStorm 10y ago
    People can live with a few seconds of latency on GSM. Chat is mostly half-duplex. It is usually lack of bandwidth or major packet loss that cause trouble.
  - 10y ago

shmerl 10y ago

Google should open up their protocols, or use open ones. It's quite sad that Google of the past (which supported XMPP) is gone.

aboonaboo 10y ago
Xmpp is old and sucks for web
kyrra 10y ago
Google shut down XMPP support because none of the other large vendors were playing along. Because of how XMPP federation work, Microsoft could reach out to Google for presence and other information about friends, but didn't need to return the favor (they were doing one way federation). So it allowed for a "better" experience using other companies XMPP networks. Edit: Source for my beliefs on the above: http://www.ucstrategies.com/unified-communications-strategies-views/betting-on-xmpp.aspx http://www.ucstrategies.com/unified-communications-strategie... Edit 2: removed Facebook as an offender. It was just Microsoft that was not sharing.
- kuschku 10y ago
  Facebook did provide XMPP service until the same time that Google ended it. So that’s definitely a wrong statement.
  - wutbrodo 10y ago
    Are you thinking of client-to-server federation? Google didn't cancel support for that (and supports it to this day: I still use pidgin here and there to connect to GChat). That's not what this conversation is about: Google's cancellation of server-to-server federation. Facebook definitely didn't support that at the time that Google cancelled it, and to my recollection, never did (though I may be wrong).
    - shmerl 10y ago
      As far as I know Google didn't cancel server to server federation, but they refused to support encryption for it, and it's as good as cancelled, because most servers made it mandatory at some point. That's what caused all my contacts who use Google to disappear. Very annoying, and it's completely Google's fault. Anyway, the reason they left it to rot is because they abandoned XMPP for "greener pa$tures".

Waterluvian 10y ago

Why isn't it always end to end encryption? I'm getting really paranoid and crochety in my old age of 29, as all I see is a tool to make me the product.

sandermvanvliet 10y ago
This was what popped out to me immediately in the bit where they write about TLS. I wonder whether this user driven approach is because of pressure from governments on encrypted chats or something else
Guzba 10y ago
The Google Assistant integration is arguably the killer feature of the app. End-to-end encryption would delete it, thus it is not the default.
- tjl 10y ago
  But, they could have it encrypted except when you explicitly message the assistant. They can also get the full text of the conversation on-device and do the machine learning on it. After all, Apple is doing it for photos, so text should be easier.
  - kevinh 10y ago
    I think context-switching in terms of privacy in the middle of a conversation is more risky than doing so between different conversations (ideally with different visuals) or especially between applications. For me, having to remember that certain comments within conversations are not private (especially when said comments are looping in something that's designed to provide context to previous comments) is more problematic than having to remember that certain conversations are not private.
  - nzp 10y ago
    I wouldn't know, but from what one can hear from prominent Apple pundits and podcasters, Apple is not doing great at all in this regard, to put it mildly, compared to Google (and other data vacuumers). Examples: Google Photos is running circles around Photos, and Alexa around Siri. People who love and live Apple admit Apple is pathetic in this space. I doubt it's because Apple is incompetent. These problems require huge amounts of data and processing power. You can't do that locally on a mobile device (or even a PC class computer).

AceJohnny2 10y ago

So. Why make this a separate app? Why isn't this in Hangouts?

prdonahue 10y ago
Because Hangouts is a bloated POS? Everyone I know who works for Google states this (and I can concur from using it at work).
- colemickens 10y ago
  How on earth is hangouts "bloated"? It's a friggin IM app with video calling built in. It's far more minimal than most other "alternative" IM clients.
  - tdfx 10y ago
    I don't know why it's "bloated", but after a few minutes of video chat it's got my computer sounding like a jetliner preparing for takeoff.
- ProAm 10y ago
  So will this in a couple years, and then it will be dismantled and sunset like the rest...
- urda 10y ago
  You do realize that's basically what's going to happen with this app yes? I'm pretty much done with Google IM products. I have a few contacts that will keep using hangouts, but for the rest I either have them on Facebook or iMessage.
rtkwe 10y ago
Easier to create a new code base and infrastructure than to bolt all the new features onto the old Hangouts code base. It also avoids the flip side argument/outcome to including it "I hate all these new features, it's ruined Hangouts."
zamalek 10y ago

kai101 10y ago

wow, conversing with an AI. Skynet is near.

bobsil1 10y ago
I see. Why do you feel that way? -Eliza

tdkl 10y ago

If I'm bound to switch to something and bring friends to it, I'll rather do it with Wire[1], without any Google surveillance and data mining for "ad experience". It has a desktop client (electron based though) and isn't limited to 1 device. Not to mention E2E encryption ALL the time. [1] https://wire.com/ https://wire.com/

MekaiGS 10y ago
How does this company plan to make money from this? I tried to browse through all the pages and I am not seeing it.
- tdkl 10y ago
  They're VC backed and plan a premium subscription sometime in the future. All of the current features will stay free. I think I've read it on their medium comment section or it's in the FAQ.

janvdberg 10y ago

Isn't the main feature of this (smart reply) something that can be easily implemented by other messaging apps? And the stickers/emojis and Google Assistant are already available in other apps. Granted, Google has the power to integrate things really well and make it a premium experience that can win users over. Also, how does this relate to Google Hangouts/Gmail Chat? Lots of questions so it will be interesting to see how this will turn out.

tiffanyh 10y ago

How did Google get Apple to approve this app for the App Store? It has fallback to SMS functionality[1], but SMS apps are rejected from the Apple App store [2]. [1] https://googleblog.blogspot.com/2016/09/google-allo-smarter-messaging-app.html https://googleblog.blogspot.com/2016/09/google-allo-smarter-... [2] https://developer.apple.com/app-store/review/guidelines/ https://developer.apple.com/app-store/review/guidelines/

gelatocar 10y ago
Are you referring to this bit? > Apps that enable anonymous or prank phone calls or SMS/MMS messaging will be rejected. I read that as anonymous or prank SMS/MMS, not just any SMS/MMS.
itafroma 10y ago
> It has fallback to SMS functionality, but SMS apps are rejected from the Apple App store. Which guideline are you thinking of? My search for "SMS" only found two unrelated guidelines: > 1.1.6 False information and features, including inaccurate device data or trick/joke functionality, such as fake location trackers. Stating that the app is “for entertainment purposes” won’t overcome this guideline. Apps that enable anonymous or prank phone calls or SMS/MMS messaging will be rejected. > 3.2.2 (iv) Collecting funds within the app for charities and fundraisers. Apps that seek to raise money for such causes must be free on the App Store and may only collect funds outside of the app, such as via Safari or SMS.
lathiat 10y ago
Sounds like Google are SMSing you from their own number, on behalf of Allo users -- at least for iPhone. If you click on the iPhone tab of that page, you see the following: Respond to a message without downloading Allo When you receive a message from an Allo user, you have a few options: Reply with a text message to continue chatting with the Allo user. To stop receiving messages from Allo users, text "STOP."

deleted 10y ago

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spullara 10y ago

Looks like this is an attempt to do the same thing that iMessage has done for iPhone. If Apple released iMessage for Android it would probably lay waste to most other messaging services. People will pay to get upgraded to the blue bubble. https://twitter.com/search?q=green%20bubble%20text&src=typd https://twitter.com/search?q=green%20bubble%20text&src=typd

urmish 10y ago
Haha wow. I don't know what to make of this. Is being an apple user this important now a days?

flukus 10y ago

I've always wanted a messenger with bonzi buddy integrated...

ryan-allen 10y ago

I don't like canned replies. I made a tampermonkey [0] user script [1] to remove auto reply suggestions from Google Inbox, they drove me nuts. I found them utterly patronising! If only I could remove them from my phone, too. [0] https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/tampermonkey/dhdgffkkebhmkfjojejmpbldmpobfkfo?hl=en https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/tampermonkey/dhdgf... [1] https://gist.github.com/ryan-allen/fd45c6f7396fffe28b6b3b51797bb14f https://gist.github.com/ryan-allen/fd45c6f7396fffe28b6b3b517...

4684499 10y ago

From those gifs in the post, I assume it requires Google to scan every word I send. It will sense my tone to change the text style, and suggest how I should response. Well, why don't you just say it for me then? I'd love to see a bot representing me talks to my friends. And, a messaging app provides Incognito mode, lol, is there any other way to imply my conversation isn't private enough?

chrisan 10y ago
First you will need to train google to your own responses. Once it has your personality finger print then they can remove you from the equation :P
bobsil1 10y ago
Your friends will have their own bots. The bot-bot conversations will have ads sold against them. The ads will be bot-clickfrauded.

nickysielicki 10y ago

So the play store still shows this as coming soon for me. They did the same type of launch for Duo and I really don't understand what they have to gain from this. They're making a reentry into a very populated space. Facebook messenger, whatsapp, Skype, iMessage... why would you risk the scenario where someone finds this blog post in a newsfeed, looks at the app, finds it unavailable, and never returns? It just doesn't make any sense to me. Clearly they're going to launch sometime in the next 12 hours. So the infrastructure is all in place and the final builds are made. Why not wait on the press release until it's actually available?

dalbin 10y ago

In many countries, "allo" is the first word of a phone conversation. But Google Allo doesn't do any phone call, I think it will confuse users. https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/All%C3%B4 https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/All%C3%B4

dx034 10y ago
Especially because the two biggest competitors (FB messenger and Whatsapp) have phone calls in their chat apps. I think a lot of people will be disappointed finding out that you can't use voice in Allo.

deleted 10y ago

[deleted]

fma 10y ago

An app that writes my messages for me. Great, now I can be 1 step further removed from any contacts from my friends and family.

prawn 10y ago
Inbox does this too and in my brief experience so far, it's been accurate. I remember hearing about Amazon pre-emptively shipping goods to warehouses based on expected demand. If algorithms can anticipate our responses and our shopping, what will be left in the end?
- dx034 10y ago
  I think it's a big difference to Amazon. They just forecast that in a given city x people will likely buy a certain product, so they already ship it there and only have to attach labels when it's ordered. Google tries to exactly forecast what you will want to respond to a picture, which sounds a lot harder.
  - prawn 10y ago
    Not commenting so much on the difficulty or differences as much as on the ability of software/analysis to anticipate us, gradually doing what makes us us. With my buying history, analysis could do a reasonable job of choosing and buying my future clothes. Spotify suggests decent music based on what I've previously liked. With relevant data, a service could feed me satisfying food I liked.

j_koreth 10y ago

This reminds me a lot of Telegram in incognito vs secret chat and the stickers. I wish Google good luck in such a competive field and especially one that is completely dependent on the network effect

colemickens 10y ago

Google's Duo/Allo strategy is the final straw after adopting Google Voice like 10 years and hoping that eventually Hangouts would not a pile of crap. Beside the limbo that this leaves Hangouts in, Allo and Duo have no web/desktop client, which is where I do 90% of my messaging. I've made too many excuses and put up with half-assed experiences for the past 5-10 years. Unfortunately, my options are probably Facebook messaging or raw SMS. Meanwhile Riot/Matrix have all of the functionality of Slack/Skype/Hangouts/etc, is open source, is federated, etc... and no one seems to care... (Not to mention that I still can't even download Allo if I try...)

helthanatos 10y ago

>We can’t wait for you to say hello to Google Allo! We’re beginning to roll out Google Allo for Android and iOS, and the app will be available worldwide in the next few days. I wonder if they are doing this because they expect issues or if they expect everyone to want the app. Personally, I just wish the stock Android messenger could communicate better with imessage group chats.

yincrash 10y ago
Without a valid macOS/iOS device key, it's not possible. The key allows your device to publish iMessage signing keys to the Apple directory service that recipient devices use to decrypt your iMessages. Without a device key, your device won't be able to do this.
- jjcm 10y ago
  Is it possible to harvest one from an old iPhone? I'd certainly buy an old iPhone that's mildly damaged if it meant I could use imessage on android.
  - yincrash 10y ago
    Possibly, but it seems that the reverse engineering + the hassle of needing an Apple key has prevented any real compatible clones from being made.

supercoder 10y ago

they should have just made this an iMessage app

evincarofautumn 10y ago

Chat apps are like to-do apps. They’re easy to make (albeit hard to make well) and you rarely have a strong reason to choose one over another, so you’ll probably stick with whatever you (and your friends) are already using. Besides, if I take up Allo and fall in love with it, I’ll be sad when it disappears after Google stops supporting it in a few years. These features should be integrated into Hangouts, else they’re dividing their own market. Though, ironically, if everyone with this sentiment went against their gut reaction and adopted Allo anyway, then Google would be forced to support it, as they do Gmail.

disillusioned 10y ago
They'll just roll Assistant/other Allo features back into Hangouts, where all their users are. Unless they kick us all out by sunsetting Hangouts for non-Apps users.

deleted 10y ago

[deleted]

binoyxj 10y ago

Rolling out in India https://twitter.com/juberti/status/778453572035878912 https://twitter.com/juberti/status/778453572035878912 If you can't wait, here's the APK http://www.apkmirror.com/apk/google-inc/allo-by-google/allo-by-google-1-0-006_rc18-release/ http://www.apkmirror.com/apk/google-inc/allo-by-google/allo-...

jotux 10y ago

So now google has Voice, Messenger, Hangouts, Allo, and Duo all with overlapping functionality? I wish they would just focus on making Hangouts work really well.

berfarah 10y ago
I think the way they see it is: Voice is basically deprecated Hangouts is enterprise Allo and Duo compete with Whatsapp/iMessage and Facetime/Skype respectively
- 77ko 10y ago
  Not quite: - Facebook Messenger combines all the functionality of Allo and Duo. - Whatsapp already has voice calling and is adding video soon (so I read on the internet) - iMessage and Facetime integrate in IOS much better than Google Duo does. In IOS, you go to a contact and press facetime. On Android, you go to a contact... then go back out to Duo and call them. WeChat, of course, does everything that all these apps will ever do - as of many years ago.
  - floopidydoopidy 10y ago
    I feel like ICQ 98 was the pinnacle of chat applications. Floating contacts and email style messages... brilliance.
    - wingerlang 10y ago
      > email style messages Care to elaborate? I'm having trouble picturing what you mean. Long form with styling?
    - the_other 10y ago
      The "find random chat partner" feature was so addictive!
    - ashark 10y ago
      Strongly agree. It's still unsurpassed. And it worked well on systems with 64mb of RAM (maybe even less) without stomping all over the rest of the programs you were running. Seems like no-one can even "Hello World" a desktop app these days without a 100mb download and requiring several hundred MB of memory all to itself.

nitins 10y ago

Installed it. Liking it so far.

timClicks 10y ago

This looks a lot like Wave wanted to be. Communication & smart agents helping things along.

chias 10y ago

I really wish they wouldn't overload terms that they themselves invented. In Chrome, "incognito" means we don't save your local history, but it does not add to the transport security. Here, "incognito" means you've got end-to-end encryption (and presumably also doesn't save local history). Why on earth would you re-use the same term when naming two things with similar (thus easily confused) consumer-visible attributes but completely different security guarantees?!

Mizza 10y ago
The worst was "Off the Record", which, for an XMPP service, didn't mean the "Off the Record" encryption protocol, it means "we don't log messages to your own email inbox." It's another dark pattern from an unscrupulous company.
- Sargos 10y ago
  I doubt anyone has ever confused the two. "Off the record" is a well known phrase in our culture. The "off the record" protocol is not very well known.
dovdov 10y ago
End-to-end encryption from your phone to Google's server, where neural networks now analyze all your data, Super cute! Lovely Labrador!
- jjcm 10y ago
  From their FAQ: "Your chats are end-to-end encrypted and can only be seen by you and the person you're chatting with. Google can't read any of your messages, so you won't see any Smart Reply or Google Assistant features." https://support.google.com/allo/answer/6383724?ref_topic=6376094&hl= https://support.google.com/allo/answer/6383724?ref_topic=637...
  - pjmlp 10y ago
    Who validates that that statement is indeed true, we in our naivety should just plain believe it?

0xmohit 10y ago

Open Whisper Systems partners with Google on end-to-end encryption for Allo. https://whispersystems.org/blog/allo/ https://whispersystems.org/blog/allo/

headmelted 10y ago
Dare I say that I'm actually a little disappointed by this? I get where Moxie is coming from, and that he doesn't have the PR machinery that Facebook and Google do to really push Signal to the mainstream, but these are advertising companies. When OWS takes this work on they're giving a tacit Moxie stamp of approval to the implementation, that could well change after OWS has moved on to other things. tldr; History tells me not to trust these companies motives in the long term, and I don't see why Moxie should either.
- nzp 10y ago
  > When OWS takes this work on they're giving a tacit Moxie stamp of approval to the implementation Which is completely irrelevant for any mainstream messaging app OWS has collaborated with. No “normal” person on this planet that uses these apps knows or cares about who Moxie is. > tldr; History tells me not to trust these companies motives in the long term, and I don't see why Moxie should either. I doubt he does, but his goal with all this is to end passive mass surveillance, and he obviously thinks this is the best shot. I mean, Signal the app is certainly not going to become a significant player in this space, so we can debate if he's doing the right thing but I can totally see the how he can justify it even if he doesn't really trust them.

primitivesuave 10y ago

I'm quite sure the "smart reply" feature will eventually have a Google Gorilla scandal[1] of its own. 1. http://blogs.wsj.com/digits/2015/07/01/google-mistakenly-tags-black-people-as-gorillas-showing-limits-of-algorithms/ http://blogs.wsj.com/digits/2015/07/01/google-mistakenly-tag...

headmelted 10y ago

Boo. All the shiny bells-and-whistles in the world aren't going to cover the fact that this should be end-to-end by default. I suspect at least some of the folks working on it feel this way too, so I imagine it's really shitty for some of them to have it work this way. If WhatsApp is already end-to-end by default there's no reason at all that a new app trying to enter that already saturated space shouldn't be. Sincerely, I hope this fails quickly. My grumpy old ass will stay on Signal thanks very much.

nanny 10y ago
If it were end-to-end encrypted by default, how would Google Assistant work?
- saint_fiasco 10y ago
  Maybe you could invite @google to the conversation just like you can invite a friend to a conversation in Hangouts.
- headmelted 10y ago
  Oh it definitely wouldn't. I'd be fine with this though as, admittedly cynically, I suspect that Assistant's main reason for existing is to provide a justification for the lack of encryption.

20andup 10y ago

I don't know about you guys, but I am quite sick of these messaging apps that don't really provide any added-value over their competitors. Moreover, these message apps are not decentralize nor are these companies altruistic, so it quite easy to conclude that these companies wants your data.

notliketherest 10y ago

This is Googles big play into chat bots.

jcg8802 10y ago

Says it's available for iOS. Not available for iOS.

gcatalfamo 10y ago

Can't find it. Is it US only?

throw2016 10y ago

Google just keeps pushing boundaries trying to legitimise spying. This is really creepy, and its surprising that Google and folks who work there think its ok to do this. Might as well have an NSA drone tail you. It's as if Google's ad business is just a front for a global intelligence gathering operation. There is a real problem with Google here and a golden opportunity for less privacy invading businesses to take its place. I am sure as users becoming more aware they will increasingly gravitate to businesses that can operate less creepily.

enitihas 10y ago

Just installed the app and asked the google assistant - "Are you on Facebook?" The reply -> "I'm not on facebook, but I do like things a lot (y)"

scottmf 10y ago

The technology behind the feature is great, don't get me wrong. But there's something so empty about the Labrador response. I want a discussion with a human. Not a human-curated conversation of algorithm-determined responses. Simple human conversation isn't as much of a problem-to-be-solved as they seem to think it is.

dkarapetyan 10y ago
This falls in an interesting uncanny valley. If you know the person on the other end is using allo who are you really talking to? The average google bot response powered by deepmind or the actual person on the other end?
- em500 10y ago
  Reminds me of when Facebook got slammed about their auto-happy-birthday feature: https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/jul/29/facebook-happy-birthday-sms-notification https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/jul/29/facebook-...
  - scottmf 10y ago
    That's a good comparison and I'd expect similar user backlash here. I'm confused as to why they're choosing to lead with this feature.
ygmelnikova 10y ago
I see the Labrador type of responses would be very appealing to the ego of many. Why reply with "What kind of dog is she?" when you can reply "What a nice lab". And with the emoji prompt, you'll never find yourself on the wrong side of the status quo. What's the end game? An AI agent that handles 100% of your communication for you? Forget 'Skynet'.. we'll call it 'Mother'.
gmarx 10y ago
Will this evolve into a complete substitute for small talk? Will we some day have text algorithms exchanging pleasantries with our friends text algorithms each day? Hi John, how are you today? Wonderful! are you enjoying the 79 F sunny day? Why yes, Terry, I am! Once you automate (insincerity? phoniness?) does it go away?

vs2 10y ago

Not available in UK store ...

silverbln 10y ago

Why would someone use Allo - giving everyone the awkward feeling that my responses are computer-written?

zuxfer 10y ago

Am I too old school to miss Google Talk even today?

ephimetheus 10y ago

It's almost as if they want you to abandon their stuff even before they do...

Twisell 10y ago

TL;DR; "We had to react very quickly to Apple updated iMessage so instead of updating one of our existing clients we rolled out this new App which is a carbon copy of iMessage*" PS: Oh and yeah we have made this useless encryption as an opt-in per session variable instead of standard...

f4stjack 10y ago

All I want from this newest addition to google chat services is a decent overview of who is online and who is not. The rest is just icing on the cake.

VeejayRampay 10y ago

Really waiting for the day where Google will accidentally release a new messaging app called Google Hangouts or some other name that they already use, because there are just so many it's impossible to keep track.

andmarios 10y ago

> Google Allo makes it easier for you to respond quickly and keep the conversation going, even when you’re on the go. With Smart Reply, you can respond to messages with just a tap, so you can send a quick “yup” in response to a friend asking “Are you on your way?” Smart Reply will also suggest responses for photos. If your friend sends you a photo of their pet, you might see Smart Reply suggestions like “aww cute!” And whether you’re a “haha” or “” kind of person, Smart Reply will improve over time and adjust to your style. So for Google instead of snowflakes we are glorified chat bots? I like it. I hope one day it can imitate me so well I can delegate all my chats to it. It will be like a mini-me! > Have some fun. Ask your Assistant to share that funny YouTube video or play games with friends right in your group chat — for instance you can compete to guess a movie title based on a series of emojis. Oh great, now I have a tireless assistant to help me spam my friends and make them procrastinate!

drake01 10y ago
mini-me! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mini-Me https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mini-Me ?
- andmarios 10y ago
  Exactly!
em500 10y ago
> I hope one day it can imitate me so well I can delegate all my chats to it. It will be like a mini-me! Next step is when both ends do this and cut out the human middle (wo)men.
- andmarios 10y ago
  Yeap! And after work we can have a meta-chat about what our mini-mes chatted while we were working.

spacehunt 10y ago

Does anyone know how the app preview message notifications[1] are implemented? Is it open to us third party app developers? [1] When a message is sent to someone without Allo installed, they'll still receive a notification and can reply directly from it https://support.google.com/allo/answer/6385770 https://support.google.com/allo/answer/6385770

kuschku 10y ago
It doesn’t seem to be. A good occasion to send another complaint to http://ec.europa.eu/competition/contacts/electronic_documents_en.html http://ec.europa.eu/competition/contacts/electronic_document...
piquadrat 10y ago
Might be that it is based on Instant Apps[1] which was announced at this year's Google IO [1]: https://developer.android.com/topic/instant-apps/index.html https://developer.android.com/topic/instant-apps/index.html?

saynsedit 10y ago

Say hello to privacy invasion

Flip-per 10y ago

So if Allo, Whatsapp and Signal itself use the protocol and implementation of Signal, wouldn't it be possible to freely choose one of these clients which then can communicate with all other clients?

Spakman 10y ago
I'm afraid not. Federation isn't supported at all as far as I'm aware. It was on the Signal roadmap early on, but things have changed: https://whispersystems.org/blog/the-ecosystem-is-moving/ https://whispersystems.org/blog/the-ecosystem-is-moving/

newscracker 10y ago

Does Allo also require one to necessarily allow access to contacts on the device to use it? This was a must in Duo, and so I abandoned the app after denying it permission to access my contacts because it wouldn't work otherwise (like allowing me to enter a phone number manually). Regardless of what other people generally do, I wouldn't want to upload my complete contacts list to a service provider like Google (or Facebook). Also, the default being not end-to-end encrypted is not favorable to me. But I do like the option of having it available (like Telegram's secret chat).

ccashell 10y ago
I'm not sure I understand your complaint/concern. We're talking about text chat and video chat clients, and you're concerned with giving them access to your contacts? How are you going to contact your contacts with the apps if they don't know who your contacts are? All communication apps are going to require access to your contacts so that your contact information can be used to communicate with your contacts. Duo and Allo are tied to phone numbers. They use phone numbers to identify users, so without access to phone numbers (contacts), they can't function. This is the same as all text message (SMS) clients, and the same way that many other chat clients work (Signal, WhatsApp, etc.).

amelius 10y ago

Can't we just agree on one standard already? I hate having to use multiple messaging apps, that's the biggest UX failure right there, and it desperately needs fixing! Forget about all the other features!

oddvar 10y ago
agreed! This is what we're trying to do with Matrix (https://matrix.org https://matrix.org)
- anentropic 10y ago
  I couldn't easily tell what it is from reading the homepage
  - Arathorn 10y ago
    we're about to rewrite the homepage to fix that :) (i work on matrix, obviously)
    - arbitrage 10y ago
      So ... what does it do?
edhelas 10y ago
XMPP http://xmpp.org/ http://xmpp.org/ ? Or maybe Matrix if you want a nice XKCD-927 project :)

psyc 10y ago

I faintly remember the early 'oughts, back when I used to be excited about the stuff Google did.

rajadigopula 10y ago

Great. Let's plan an experiment of using smart replies on both sides. It's like 2 bots chatting! Hope the smart reply adapts to individual's style with time, otherwise, it gets boring easily and the other party might know when a template response sent as 'sorry, no longer interested in you!'

kriro 10y ago

If they want an instant network effect there's a really simple play...integrate it with Pokemon Go. If it's the only official IM program that'll work with/is tightly coupled with Pokemon Go enough people will install it. Might sound silly but I think that would actually be a great play for Google.

davidgerard 10y ago

I'm sure Ello are delighted with Google's respect for trademarks.

wanda 10y ago

Lots of speculation about how long these apps will last. I personally suspect it's Hangouts that will be chopped. Google looked at Facebook Messenger and realised that the future was in personal assistants and the illusion of virtual/simulated AI, and realised also that Hangouts would become an unmanageable mess with more features added, so they are rolling out a Messenger competitor and a Hangouts video replacement with a transitional period to assess both feasibility, interest and to enable Hangouts customers to explore alternatives ahead of the shutdown, while attracting new business along the way. Personally, I like Duo because I can talk to my partner with video even though my partner is on Android and is a bit of a technophobe. The almost-too-simple UI is much easier for my partner to use than Hangouts, and Skype is a dog. I also do not use Facebook. Google, like Apple now, and like Microsoft before it, is playing catch-up to Facebook and arguably has been since Google+. It's like Hollywood: remakes are far from innovative and are loathed by many who liked the originals or who crave fresh material, but a remake is much easier to get through the boardroom and easier to make profitable. Google should be pushing the boundaries but it's afraid of tarnishing its credibility with potentially bad decisions. They also want to appear active I suppose, and to collect what data they can from people who are likely to be loyal to a Google competitor to Facebook. I think Google should be thinking doing more than buying up tech talent in acquihires and inflating an already bloated app ecosystem that threatens what business they already have, but I'm not a business person.

lost_name 10y ago
I believe they've previously discussed Hangouts becoming business focused. Allo, I think, has the potential to replace the default SMS app (similar to iMessage).
- nameless912 10y ago
  Maybe, if they get rid of this boneheaded SMS relay bullshit. It's not 2008 anymore, iMessage got transparent SMS<->internet messaging right like 4 years ago.
Angostura 10y ago
I'm getting really confused. I work at a school where we wanted to do cheap and cheerful Webinars. Hangouts, with the ability to record to a Youtube channel looked ideal, but the repositioning of products is so rapid, I guess I may have to look at this all again.

Esau 10y ago

The Google surveillance machine has many faces. The only way to win is to not play the game.

TuringNYC 10y ago

Not sure how common this is, but everyone at both school and work these days shifts seamlessly from mobile to dekstop and back. This has been one of the main reasons we tend to use WhatsApp and Slack, even for corporate communications as silly as that sounds -- because you can type long messages on it on the keyboard/desktop but also have access to it on the go. What I don't understand is -- given Allo had a blank slate, why did they limit it to just mobile? They cover two major silos (Android + iOS), (one reason we dont use iMsg) but why not the third silo (non-mobile)?

Bedon292 10y ago
Definitely doesn't make sense. I use hangouts constantly. It is my default app for SMS and chatting with family. I like having one consistent thread between different desktop devices, as well as mobile. Yes Slack has replaced it for work, but that's no good for family, at least not mine. Until this has desktop support there is no reason for me to buy in. Why not have (one of) the most important feature of hangouts (and all of the other competitors) on these new apps?
- scholia 10y ago
  Google wants to own the whole IT stack from servers and software services to devices. It supported the entrenched alternatives (Windows and Macs) when it had no alternative, but now it won't, unless it really has to. In Google's thinking, the whole IT stack is Google cloud-based, and in the long term, people having "different desktop devices" isn't the right way to go. Yes, this is overstatement for sarcastic effect, but the trend seems to be real....
- MrPatan 10y ago
  For SMSs too? On my Android, the new(ish?) message app ("Messenger") now wanted control of SMSs back from hangouts. Another silly reversal, and another silly messaging app from Google. Fourth time lucky? On that topic, when is the inbox app replacing the gmail app? Maybe never and that's good, given that sometimes I cannot download attachments with the inbox app that I can happily download from the old gmail app right away.

meira 10y ago

This time is different, I'm sure.

jug 10y ago

So how do I get this going? Ask my friends to install a new messaging app just to talk with me? Unsure if I have that much of an influence even if I wanted people to switch. :P

mapletree 10y ago

Allo Taxi Lebanon is going to be pissed!

bane 10y ago

My response is the same as when Duo came out https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12297084 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12297084

betaby 10y ago

More messengers - less desire to use them. My anecdata show shift to jabber and IRC for older and more tech folks.

comboy 10y ago
That's what makes hangouts appealing, you can still you your XMPP client. Maybe allo will support it too.
- ryukafalz 10y ago
  XMPP support is still around, but from what I've been able to gather it's their old Google Talk system bridged into Hangouts. I fully expect it to go away without warning at some point in the future, and I would be very surprised if Allo ever supports it.

abvdasker 10y ago

Another messaging app? Who gives a fuck?

oliv__ 10y ago

So this is what 2016 looks like in tech...

senc01a 10y ago

Goodbye Allo.

senc01a 10y ago

Hello and Goodbye Allo. Not interested in yet another messaging product.

tauchunfall 10y ago

>but everyone at both school and work these days shifts seamlessly from mobile to dekstop and back Maybe the communication protocol is based on Hangout. Some people reverse-engineered the protocol and open-sourced it. It's called hangups. I'm not sure, but was WhatsApp mobile-only in the past and someone reverse-engineered the modified XMMP protocol? never used it.

mstade 10y ago

You know what I really need? A new messaging app, so people can complain more about me not using whatever messaging app they're using. I'm not saying that email and sms/mms don't have flaws, but at least I don't have to consider whether the recipient of my message has whatever random app is popular today. Have we seen the end of wide spread open protocols, because huge tech corporations are hell bent on controlling communications?

kodt 10y ago
I can see how these apps can take off with kids, who are in school and see each-other every day.. so there can be some coordination on what app to use. But for me, I don't see how I could use anything other than email/sms and expect someone else to use it.
- CaptSpify 10y ago
  I think kids too, aren't tired: I've probably tried >50 messaging systems, from irc to aim to msn messenger to hangouts. After a while, you just get tired of trying rehashes of the same thing, and want one that communicates with everyone. We had things like Pigeon, but companies keep closing off their systems to force you to have one app/program per system. Eventually you get tired of trying new ones, and just go back to the reliable ones that work with everybody.
  - nameless912 10y ago
    > irc Man, why can't we just use IRC? It's as close to perfect as anything has ever gotten.
chadlavi 10y ago
This. I think my fiancée has decided she wants to use Allo for text messages now, and I am not excited to have to add some new number for her in my phone and deal with weird looking text messages from her all the time. Allo is just another also-ran solution trying to find a problem.

jorgecastillo 10y ago

Great, another App we'll get bundled in our Android devices. (>_<) I don't think so Google! https://telegram.org/ https://telegram.org/

koolba 10y ago

I can't be the only one thinking in (12 + x) months, where x is between 0 and 24, there will be a post on the same blog: "Say goodbye to Google Allo".

menacingly 10y ago

The useless predictive reply stuff makes it feel more like a tech demo than an actual product. Why on Earth would I want a machine actually expressing sentiment for me, even if it's really cool that it can?

chriswarbo 10y ago
> Why on Earth would I want a machine actually expressing sentiment for me, even if it's really cool that it can? My old 'phone came with a bunch of pre-prepared SMS messages to make replies quicker, like "OK", "Sorry, can't talk now", etc. One of them was "I love you too".

omouse 10y ago

Encrypted or not?

sickbeard 10y ago

I always wondered what word we would use after "smart" wore off. Apparently it's now "smarter"

givinguflac 10y ago

Google is a mess. Really sad to see they're doubling down even further on invading user privacy, never mind the encryption that isn't even enabled by default. Pathetic.

lost_name 10y ago

I wonder if the WhatsApp "problem" Brazil has been having somehow influenced the change of stance of encryption?

sorenjan 10y ago

I don't know of any other company that has discontinued as many products people actually used. Sorry Google, even if I didn't already have several chat apps and even if I didn't prefer to type on a real keyboard I still couldn't recommend your new products to friends and family. I just don't trust you anymore.

degenerate 10y ago
RIP Google Talk, February 16, 2015. This was the end for me.

dagaci 10y ago

I Have WhatsApp running on my iPhone, Windows PC, on my iMac and Laptop. I haven't tried Allo yet, but I'm not happy with any app like this taking off that isn't cross-platform.

dethstar 10y ago
Whatsapp wasn't on the web not too long ago. They also started with Chrome only which was annoying.

buro9 10y ago

Does not seem to work with Google Apps account. Which makes the list: * Allo * Google Fi * Google Play Music Family Plan * Google Play Store Family Sharing * Google Spaces * Google Trips * YouTube Red * YouTube Music It's a growing list. I'm always amused by the "One account. All of Google" header on the login pages. Google Apps accounts do not grant access to all of Google as the products do not work for it (it's not a permissions thing the domain admin can fix).

nickspacek 10y ago
I wonder if they do this to limit the potential of rolling breaking changes out to their enterprise Google Apps accounts and the like? The servers running the Google Apps accounts and applications probably have a different update policy. It's frustrating for sure, which is why I ended up making my Google Apps (old/free version) account just an alias for my Gmail address.
MrMullen 10y ago
Allo YouTube Red YouTube Music Spaces These all can use Google Apps accounts since I use all of these and I use a Google Apps account exclusively.
- coda_ 10y ago
  But, within Allo, can you ask the assistant "What's on my schedule?" and get an answer? I know that's not what you were saying, just curious if that part works for you.
  - MrMullen 10y ago
    I did that it said it can't link to my account. I have not checked yet (My Admin password is locked up at home), but I think my account might not be configured to allow it.
    - MrMullen 10y ago
      Checked last night, can't link Allo assistant to my Google Apps calendar. Lame.

qntty 10y ago

This is what it looks like when you send someone an allo message and they don't have allo. I was surprised that it would send something like this without asking permission. I assumed it would fall back to SMS transparently. http://i.imgur.com/6aHNeMR.jpg http://i.imgur.com/6aHNeMR.jpg

overcast 10y ago

Express yourself with photos, emojis and stickers. This is where I decided I'm done reading, and this is not for me.

sorenjan 10y ago

According to reports Allo doesn't support quick reply on Android N, any kind of reply on Android Wear, or notifications on more than one device. If there was any chat app that should support all of those it should be Google's new and shiny, which begs the question: Have Google made these features hard to use on Android, or are Allo's developers just not good at writing Android apps?

johnhenry 10y ago

I just texted a friend and she replied "Good morning... why google allo". The message that she received from me included a message letting her know that I added her to Google Allo to chat along with a link to unsubscribe. I normally try to have more substance in my comments than just an anecdote, but this is simply highly un-nerving...

mark_l_watson 10y ago

I installed it and am comparing it to updates in macOS Sierra that I installed today. Even though Siri hooks into Wolfram Alpha so it does very well with 'calculation style' questions and general world questions, without Google's greater knowledge of what we are doing it can't compete. The question for people to answer individually is do they want give up more private information and have a great Google experience, or, they want more privacy, in which case Apple comes out the winner. With Allo, asking about my future airline reservations works, but asking for future shuttle reservations did not, which was surprising since Google Inbox highlights the upcoming shuttle reservation. EDIT: it turns out that you can't make Allo your SMS app on Android, it is separate. Allo looks cool, but I deregistered and uninstalled it: SMS, email, and separate Google Now works well for me.

Yhippa 10y ago
You know when you search Google for a question and sometimes it will highlight the answer in a card at the top of the page by itself? I'm really surprised it's not doing that in Allo.
- vthallam 10y ago
  Basically part of the answer and a hyperlink to the full answer. Guess, they will add it soon enough.

willow9886 10y ago

Interesting that another trending story on HN contradicts google's post wrt the privacy features included in allo: http://www.theverge.com/2016/9/21/12994362/allo-privacy-message-logs-google http://www.theverge.com/2016/9/21/12994362/allo-privacy-mess... I had a feeling Google's representation of their respect for user privacy was too good to be true. Clearly they only have an interest in marketing privacy, as opposed to actually delivering effective privacy controlling tools and features.

whizzkid 10y ago

As long as they(Google) don't study why WhatsApp is the most popular messaging app, I don't think they will ever dominate this market. Here are the most important 2 things in my opinion that made whatsapp #1 messaging app. - WhatsApp tried to reach everyone from the beginning. Founders knew that not everyone in world has enough money to buy a shiny phone every year. - WhatsApp uses minimal bytes possible to send your messages to other side. This will be the only choice for people who have expensive data plans all over the world, and those who are travelling often and roaming enabled. I am not even sure if my 4 years old android phone will be able to install the app. So will this app have a great success? I don't think so.

vocatus_gate 10y ago
That's literally the reason I even heard of or installed WhatsApp a few years ago. I was spending time doing work with my church in el Salvador and a bunch of the locals there used WhatsApp because it avoided the insane SMS fees the telco charged. I installed it just to chat with them internationally. Now almost all my friends are on it and it's great. I love the cross-platform ease of use, E2E encryption, and easy web interface. I'm just scared of how Facebook will ruin it.
- whizzkid 10y ago
  I think Google lately spending too much time in the Silicon Valley bubble and less time in the real world. Solutions they are coming up with have so little value outside the small bubble. WhatsApp solved a real world problem without being fancy or trying to do too much. It kept it simple, efficient and treated everyone equal in its ecosystem. I don't think Facebook will try to change WhatsApp. They are mostly interested in WhatsApp's user base. But even if they ruin it, success stories will not change. The next big thing will come from people that have similar mindsets like the ones created WhatsApp.

deleted 10y ago

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rer 10y ago

If both Allo users have responses recommended by the app, who's chatting with each other -- the users or the apps?

deleted 10y ago

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mmanfrin 10y ago

I just don't understand why. Encryption and stickers and gifs are things you could add to hangouts easily. 'Assistant' is just a wrapper for google now in a less convenient form. What is the point.

gallerdude 10y ago
After playing around with it for a bit, Google Assistant is the killer app. I wanted to show my friend Bill Wurtz's wonderful "History of Japan" video. So I just typed "@google bill wurtz japan". Google Assistant immediately added the video to our chat. So this seems super nice if you just thought of something you want to show a someone.

x2f10 10y ago

Google is the kid who accomplishes little despite having a genius IQ as he's unable to focus. Google needs to build a single messaging application (ala iMessage) into Android, Gmail, Google Docs, etc. Then, once that's done, support the messaging app on all mobile platforms. Most people outside the tech world do not even know what iMessage is, but they use it daily. That is how integrated it is into Apple products - perfect. Google can do this on a much larger scale, but chooses, instead, to focus on pet projects they'll lay out to pasture in 12 months. APPL and AMZN are going to eat Google's lunch.

api 10y ago

Imagine walking around and conversing with a friend and a salesman is hanging just behind you, listening to everything you say, and interjecting carefully crafted comments and "advice" designed to modify your buying behavior in response to what you're talking about. He's also recording your conversation and may or may not give it to the government or his advertising clients. That's this, basically. No thanks.

bstrong 10y ago

I find it interesting that people are complaining both about the lack of a web app and about Google keeping message history on their servers. I'm assuming they will eventually build a web app, but you can't build a useful one unless you have the message history on the server, encrypted in such a way that the web server can decrypt it and serve it to the browser. Unfortunately, you really do have to choose between privacy and having a web app. I'm not sure which I value more, TBH.

siddharthdeswal 10y ago

Just like omnichannel, chat apps need to be 'omnichat', i.e. be present on mobiles and desktop.

rajanikanthr 10y ago

useless for me until they introduce equivalent of web.whatsapp.com

BMorearty 10y ago

Just don't fat-finger the verification code. I did, and now I can't create an account.

xfactor973 10y ago

Yet another Google product that'll I'll like and they'll kill off in a year. I'm getting tired of this pattern from them

anon4711 10y ago

Google Allo: Why people such as Edward Snowden are advising against using the app http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/gadgets-and-tech/features/google-allo-should-i-download-it-privacy-issues-problems-fixes-snowden-a7321216.html http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/gadgets-and-tech/fea...

draw_down 10y ago

Why do they need another-nother-nother messaging app?!

huangc10 10y ago

Is it weird to anyone else that the first GIF they show is of an iPhone using Allo and not Android? What message is Google trying to send (excuse the pun)? To me, it really shows that they are prioritizing iPhone over Android...

nikolay 10y ago

I dislike it - there's no history between app installs. The least I need is another ephemeral messaging app!

github-cat 10y ago

So this is what I get when I use Google Assistant. http://www.pixelstech.net/fun/279-Am-I-talking-to-Google-Assistant-or-ET http://www.pixelstech.net/fun/279-Am-I-talking-to-Google-Ass...