33 ms·
How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized
- iberator 1y agoReminder: Only right wing supporters of Iaraeli Likud party actually support genocide going on. Literally half of Israeli citizens hate Likud and Natanyahu. ps. Interesting trivia: Mahmoud Abbas (President of the Palestinian West Bank) and FATAH militia also are against Hamas. They always have been: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fatah%E2%80%93Hamas_conflict https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fatah%E2%80%93Hamas_conflict Nothing is black or white.
- kombine 1y agoThis is a popular idea in the Israeli propaganda. Israelis like to say that they hate Netanyahu, but in reality, majority of Israeli Jews fully align with his policies towards Palestinians, and multiple polls confirm this. https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2025-08-05/ty-article/.premium/large-majority-of-israeli-jews-untroubled-by-reports-of-famine-in-gaza-poll-finds/00000198-7ab3-d0ce-a5de-fbb374f30000 https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2025-08-05/ty-article/.p...
- boxed 1y ago"Fully align" is not supported by your reference. The massive demonstrations in the street seem to counter your narrative though.
- pydry 1y agoThe demonstrations are about his power grabs. They have 0 to do with the genocide. On that topic most Israelis are not against him. It is, in fact, what is keeping him in power and why he wants this war so badly. ~15% of Israelis believe that a terrorist who shot up a mosque (literally all he did) is a national hero. It shouldnt be that that hard to imagine that most of the rest are willing to look the other way in the event of a genocide against the same untermensch.
- tdeck 1y agoMore evidence of this in a poll from earlier this year. https://archive.is/nNzq4 https://archive.is/nNzq4 (It's an archive link because the original is paywalled). > Nearly half (47 percent) of respondents agreed that "when conquering an enemy city, the Israel Defense Forces should act as the Israelites did in Jericho under Joshua's command – killing all its inhabitants."
- boxed 1y ago[flagged]
- tsimionescu 1y agoIt is exactly from the article: > Religious interpretations play a key role in shaping these views. Nearly half (47 percent) of respondents agreed that "when conquering an enemy city, the Israel Defense Forces should act as the Israelites did in Jericho under Joshua's command – killing all its inhabitants." Sixty-five percent said they believed in the existence of a modern-day incarnation of Amalek, the Israelite biblical enemy whom God commanded to wipe out in Deuteronomy 25:19. Among those believers, 93 percent said the commandment to erase Amalek's memory remains relevant today.
- nashashmi 1y ago“Here's a challenge - find me just one article in the mainstream media that calls for the de-radicalization of Israeli society. I'll save you the effort - you can't!” https://youtu.be/lHuUJTPhN0A https://youtu.be/lHuUJTPhN0A
- jameshilliard 1y ago> Israelis like to say that they hate Netanyahu, but in reality, majority of Israeli Jews fully align with his policies towards Palestinians, and multiple polls confirm this. https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2025-08-05/ty-article/.premium/large-majority-of-israeli-jews-untroubled-by-reports-of-famine-in-gaza-poll-finds/00000198-7ab3-d0ce-a5de-fbb374f30000 https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2025-08-05/ty-article/.p... There tends to be a lot more nuance[0] when it comes to polling results like these, the reality is that opinions amongst Israelis vary quite a lot. There are also a lot of problems with organizations like the UN historically wildly misrepresenting the food situation[1] which are likely to make Israelis question the accuracy of many of these starvation reports, especially from organizations that have historically made many highly inaccurate claims. UN backed IPC reports like those cited in the CNN article likewise have serious credibility issues as well[2], additionally there are extremely biased individuals like Michael Fakhri(the UN’s special rapporteur on the right to food) cited in the CNN article that even publish comic books with some rather overt antisemitic tropes[3]. [0] https://www.haaretz.com/opinion/2025-06-04/ty-article-opinion/.premium/do-82-of-israelis-really-back-expulsion-of-gazans-the-data-tells-a-different-story/00000197-39da-da41-a9f7-3dde468d0000 https://www.haaretz.com/opinion/2025-06-04/ty-article-opinio... [1] https://www.pbs.org/newshour/world/how-one-un-leaders-mistaken-timeline-caused-confusion-about-gaza-childrens-starvation-risk https://www.pbs.org/newshour/world/how-one-un-leaders-mistak... [2] https://unwatch.org/hillel-neuer-on-sky-news-fabricated-u-n-backed-report-on-famine-in-gaza-is-a-complete-fraud/ https://unwatch.org/hillel-neuer-on-sky-news-fabricated-u-n-... [3] https://unwatch.org/legal-analysis-of-un-food-rapporteur-michael-fakhris-2024-report-to-un-general-assembly/ https://unwatch.org/legal-analysis-of-un-food-rapporteur-mic...
- tsimionescu 1y agoThis equivocation is absurd. Literally every international aid organization is saying the same thing - and even a few Israeli ones are now recognizing the genocide in Gaza. The fact that Israel, far from sending "large amounts of aid", has, in fact, systematically blocked aid to Gaza was recognized even by the US government. The US even resorted to building a pier to send their own aid in. Edit: looking at the claims more specifically, this one is particularly easy to debunk: > even publish comic books with some rather overt antisemitic trope The supposed "antisemitic trope" is an image of a person holding a cracked globe. The blog post implies that this is supposed to be an image representing the antisemitic "masters of the world" trope. In fact, the image represents the UN rapporteur himself looking at how the lack of international reaction to Israel's crimes has left a crack in the UN-led rules-based world order.
- NebulaChaser92 1y agoReminder: The US does support the genocide. Both the Republicans and the Democrats.
- impomura 1y agomajority of Israeli keep supporting IDF policies, shame on them
- lejalv 1y ago[flagged]
- tdeck 1y agoThis is nonsense, Israel's center right "opposition" won't even acknowledge the genocide, how can they be against it?
- fergie 1y agoModerate Israelis are the only people who have the power to peacefully defuse the situation.
- danielbenzvi1 1y agoModerates in Israel have shrunk because for decades, every attempt at compromise seemed to end in more violence rather than peace. From the Oslo years and the Second Intifada, to the Gaza withdrawal and repeated rocket wars, many Israelis came to believe that “giving ground” only brought terror closer to their homes. The sense is that moderation was tried, failed, and cost lives. On top of that, politics and demographics shifted rightward, and October 7th reinforced the belief that peace is not realistic in the near term. For many Israelis, moderation no longer feels like a safe or responsible option- it feels like a risk their families can’t afford.
- fergie 1y agoI appreciate the response, and I essentially agree with your assessment that this has become the prevailing feeling in Israel. With that being said: surely Israelis understand that the current direction of travel leads to a dark place, not least for Israel itself? I can't imagine a reality where the crisis in Gaza continues and Israel continues to be supported by the West. And then what happens? Surely at some point peace and reconciliation prevails?
- danielbenzvi1 1y agoI wish that was the natural path, that seeing the damage would turn people back toward reconciliation. But for now, most Israelis don’t see a viable partner on the other side to reconcile with. This is a very dire situation. We’ve come to realize there are millions, perhaps tens of millions, across the region whose worldview includes the elimination of the Jewish state, and they are very committed to it. We can’t and won’t wage war on whole populations as that is not in our blood. Nor can we realistically change their beliefs in the foreseeable future or find something to offer that would produce lasting peace. So today our choices feel grim and limited. That is why many Israelis believe we must: 1. Be excellent at predicting attacks and when necessary, strike first to disrupt them 2. Impose a very heavy cost on anyone who contemplates attacking us, so others think twice 3. Remain stronger and more capable than everyone around us It’s a terrible place to be, and it’s not the future anyone hoped for. But until there’s a credible, sustained shift in the region, a process that would likely take generations of committed leadership, many here see little alternative.
- dariosalvi78 1y agoI wish this were true, but it looks like that even if Natanyahu has little support (mostly because of corruption), the genocide is well accepted by israeli public https://www.genocidewatch.com/single-post/poll-show-most-jewish-israelis-support-expelling-gazans https://www.genocidewatch.com/single-post/poll-show-most-jew...
- DiogenesKynikos 1y agoOpposition to Netanyahu inside Israel is almost entirely about domestic issues (like judicial reform) and the fact that he refuses to accept any negotiated deal to get the hostages back. Relatively few Israelis care about what he's doing to the Palestinians. Israeli society is deeply complicit in the mass killing and starvation in Gaza. The IDF is a citizen army. There haven't been mass refusals or resistance. It's not just Netanyahu.
- alistairSH 1y agoDoes Israel have a government structure that allows for a counter-majoritarian government? In the US, we do... due to the structure of the Senate and Electoral College, low population states wield outsize influence on national politics. This goes as far as allowing the election of a president with <50% national support. Add in political gerrymandering (setting electrical districts to constrain the influence of certain demographics), and we have a national government that's opposed to policies that have wide support across the population in general.
- tt_dev 1y agoThats eye opening
- rubzah 1y agoThere is simply no excuse for blocking the entry of food into a region wholesale. For that alone they should, at the very least, be an outcast in the international community. But here we are.
- dfxm12 1y agoThat they have the backing and blessing of the US government is the counter-argument to this. The US can almost unilaterally end this war if they want to.
- JohnFen 1y agoHow is that a counter-argument?
- dfxm12 1y agoUS has a lot of both soft and hard power globally. If you don't treat their puppet state with deference (and do treat it as an outcast), you can face consequences. The current US admin is using this as a stick against its own citizens, even.
- mhb 1y ago[flagged]
- weregiraffe 1y ago[flagged]
- JohnFen 1y agoSure, and equally, stop the collective punishment/ethnic cleansing of innocent people.
- incrudible 1y agoWhat is a boycott, if not collective punishment?
- JohnFen 1y agoA boycott is people choosing where to spend their money (exercising their right of free association). That's not even in the same universe as punishing innocent people by murdering and starving them.
- incrudible 1y agoIsrael is doing neither, as far as I am concerned. Israel allowed in more than the required amount of food. Collateral damage within the context of war is not murder. Internal food distribution difficulties are not systematic starvation. If truly there was a famine, propagandists would not need to use photos of cancer patients (and similar) as false evidence for starvation. Fair enough, what are sanctions, if not collective punishment? There is a concentrated campaign to isolate the entire country and its citizens, from the same type of people that say Hamas does not represent Palestinians. Either there is a double standard here, or collective punishment is fair game. Choose one.
- _DeadFred_ 1y ago[flagged]
- DiogenesKynikos 1y ago
- waltercool 1y ago[dead]
- churchill 1y agoFor those out of the loop the actions of the Israeli gov. are not some fringe overreaction. This is what the people want. by their own admission, 48% of Israeli Jews want Palestinians to be ethnically cleansed which would constitute a genocidal act, while 79% believe they should get preferential treatment over Arabs. [0] Both Israeli Arabs & Palestinian Arabs. This is not some, 'oh no! it just happened.' Everyone who has actually spent time studying this conflict, the state of Israel has a policy of systematic rape, torture, mass incarceration, murder, and dehumanization of Palestinians at an industrial scale that's been in place for decades now. They're just going mask-off in a way Western audiences can't pretend not to know about it any longer. Israelis and their Western supporters try to make out their actions as that of fringe far-right loonies like Smotrich, etc. Nope. Systematic rape, torture, murder, of non-Jews has been their policy for decades now. You're just finally learning about it after so long. The ultra-orthodox don't make up a plurality of the population and used to not serve in the military until recently. So, if their abominable ideology is state policy, it's because Israelis are okay with it. [0]: https://www.timesofisrael.com/plurality-of-jewish-israelis-want-to-expel-arabs-study-shows/ https://www.timesofisrael.com/plurality-of-jewish-israelis-w...
- ProllyInfamous 1y agoTheir hubris will be their own downfall. >Israel has denied the allegations. [from linked CNN article] People are waking up.
- stefantalpalaru 1y ago[dead]
- boxed 1y ago[flagged]
- rowanseymour 1y ago"Both the definition and charge of ethnic cleansing is often disputed, with some researchers including and others excluding coercive assimilation or mass killings as a means of depopulating an area of a particular group, or calling it a euphemism for genocide or cultural genocide." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_cleansing https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_cleansing
- NoMoreNicksLeft 1y ago[flagged]
- NoMoreNicksLeft 1y ago[flagged]
- jstanley 1y agoI didn't downvote you but I have no idea what you're trying to say. It's a style of post common in twitter, where you obliquely refer to several things that you personally are familiar with and assume that the reader will understand because they should have basically entirely the same things on their mind that you do.
- potatototoo99 1y agoHe's alluding to some prophetic beliefs shared by some jews and some evangelical christians that the temple of Jerusalem needs to be rebuilt again (on the place of the current al-Aqsa mosque). This same mosque is important in Islam because it is in the place where the prophet ascended to heaven. If the temple is rebuilt (and some more things happen depending on the belief) some jews believe then that the messiah will come, and some evangelical christians believe instead that it starts the end of times, where good christians go to heaven.
- SilverElfin 1y ago> This same mosque is important in Islam because it is in the place where the prophet ascended to heaven. Is it actually important in Islam? Or is it just a way for fundamentalists to make a claim to land that was historically Jewish? Islam was not invented until the 7th century. The temple ruins that the Al Aqsa mosque is built on is much older - by over a thousand years. I’ve also seen some Muslim scholars claim that the “real” Al-Aqsa is actually not on this site but elsewhere, and potentially lost over time.
- ProllyInfamous 1y agoThere is massive narrative deception from Israel... wake up world: >“There is no famine in Gaza. Period,” the [Israeli] official said, adding that “Israel and the IDF are trying to strengthen the humanitarian situation in Gaza with partners.” If you want to see what Netanyaho looks like when he's covering things up [lying] just watch the 2024 documentary The Bibi Files — about his corruption charges (which features over an hour of Netanyaho lying to investigators about his accepting roses and leaves [wine and cigars]) — complete with his shit-eating-grins galore...
- tdeck 1y agoWorld leaders know this, they're pretending not to see it. For example, the Biden administration set specific aid targets for Israel to meet and even acknowledged that they weren't being met by the "deadline" but neglected to impose any consequences. https://www.propublica.org/article/biden-blinken-state-department-israel-gaza-human-rights-horrors https://www.propublica.org/article/biden-blinken-state-depar... Israelis (including those who use this platform to repeat the same warmed-over genocide denials for the umpteenth time) know it's happening too. That's why the argument is usually 50% "it's not happening" and 50% "but they deserve it".
- nostrebored 1y ago[flagged]
- tdeck 1y agoPerhaps you could spell out what you're talking about?
- wayeq 1y agoread the 1988 Hamas charter
- ProllyInfamous 1y ago
- jordanb 1y agoThe Trump peace plan calls for a resumption of aid contingent on the Palestinians accepting the deal. Please understand that this is a war crime. You can not use starvation of civilians as a weapon or as leverage against combatants.
- _DeadFred_ 1y ago[flagged]
- quantified 1y agoHow do you mean target? They don't seem to target the people. Seems like they make whatever calories hard to get.
- etchalon 1y agoYou're posting the same comment, each time linking to a source on WWII, but never linking to evidence of Israeli's policy or confirmation from any third-party attesting to it.
- ath3nd 1y ago[dead]
- _DeadFred_ 1y ago[flagged]
- etchalon 1y ago1500 calories per day is not, by any measure we now know of, an adequate number of calories. The fact that 80 years ago we thought it was does not have any moral value in discussions about Israel's actions today. A third-party source attesting to the validity of Israel's claims regarding the nearly the 4400-calories-per-person-per-day they're letting into Gaza would at least be something in a discussion of their actions. But yes, that source would obviously be viewed somewhat skeptically given the level of starvation we see in Gaza.
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- jalapenoe 1y ago[flagged]
- blueflow 1y agoFor reference: While the gas chambers were are the prominent way of death during the Holocaust, the majority of victims died of starvation. Starvation death looks like succumbing to a random sickness (the body is just too weak for a functional immune response), and thus saves the perpetrator from the usual psychological consequences of direct murder. This methodology was agreed on during the Wannsee conference in 1942. See also: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hunger_Plan https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hunger_Plan
- _DeadFred_ 1y ago[flagged]
- nashashmi 1y agoTwo years later after several ceasefires have been broken, only one chooses to continue the famine and the war.
- tguvot 1y agoyes. "Hamas military leader in Gaza objects to ceasefire plan, BBC understands" https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c708v2q5r09o https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c708v2q5r09o
- doodlebugging 1y agoSamantha Power wrote an excellent book: "A Problem From Hell" - America and the Age of Genocide [0], [1] She had seen war and genocide first-hand in Bosnia and that provided the impetus for her to study how America had responded to various genocides. I will repeat the last paragraph of her Preface for some context. >Before I began exploring America's relationship with genocide, I used to refer to U.S. policy towards Bosnia as a "failure." I have changed my mind. It is daunting to acknowledge, but this country's consistent policy of nonintervention in the face of genocide offers sad testimony not to a broken American political system but to one that is ruthlessly effective. The system, as it stands now, is working. No U.S. president has ever made genocide prevention a priority, and no U.S. president has ever suffered politically for his indifference to its occurrence. It is thus no coincidence that genocide rages on. [0] https://samanthapower.com/books/a-problem-from-hell-america-and-the-age-of-genocide/ https://samanthapower.com/books/a-problem-from-hell-america-... [1] https://www.amazon.com/Problem-Hell-America-Age-Genocide/dp/0465061516 https://www.amazon.com/Problem-Hell-America-Age-Genocide/dp/...
- iisan7 1y agoReaders should be dubious of her moral authority on this issue. When given influence, her advocacy of the war on Libya resulted in endemic violence and showed that she was as misguided as anyone else in American politics when it comes to intervention in world affairs.
- nradov 1y agoGenocide is a terrible thing. But that doesn't mean the USA has any obligation to directly intervene in foreign conflicts. Most of these aren't worth sacrificing the life of a single US soldier, and even when we do intervene it often makes the situation worse. Unless critical US national interests are involved, our actions should usually be limited to sanctions and diplomacy. (I am commenting on the general US policy and not making a statement about the current situation in Gaza.)
- Hikikomori 1y agoMost of the time US sells the weapons used to do the genocide. This time they're just giving them away, and that is what a lot of Americans have a problem with.
- Amir_A 1y agoWhat I find the most jarring about this on a day-to-day being in tech circles is how some of the smartest people I know are not only unwilling to call out what's happening, they're unwilling to acknowledge it to begin with, and some like the triangle man and Collison brothers even support it. The more time I spend in tech the more I realize there's a deep moral rot here covered up by noveau-rich wealth
- colpabar 1y agoWhere did the idea that being smart meant being moral come from? Why would anyone assume that people in tech are "good"? A lot of (I would say most) people go into tech to make money. All the people you expect to say something won't because doing so could jeopardize the amount of money they make. The same goes with celebrities, academics, politicians, etc. If you are someone who makes a lot of money, and you speak negatively about america's greatest ally, you will probably make less money as a direct result.
- graublau 1y agoBecause tech people spent probably 5 years signalling their moral goodness about a wide array of topics, indeed proclaiming these the most important political topics. IT was and still is insufferable.
- darod 1y agoIt’s called marketing and value signaling. Doesn’t mean they believe what they spew.
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- bodhi_mind 1y agoThe problem is we’re in an age of mass disinformation that makes any claim potentially propaganda. It comes down to trust and belief and those things are either easier than ever or harder than ever depending on media you consume and common sense.
- jalapenoe 1y ago[flagged]
- mef51 1y agoIsrael blocks the entry of Plumpy Nut into Gaza, a peanut-butter like paste meant for treating severe acute malnutrition. They say it is a luxury item Hamas might steal.[1] The amount of evidence Israel is committing genocide is embarrassing. [1] https://x.com/DropSiteNews/status/1971582137947295831 https://x.com/DropSiteNews/status/1971582137947295831
- s5300 1y ago[dead]
- dlubarov 1y ago[flagged]
- code_for_monkey 1y ago[flagged]
- tboyd47 1y agoYou're right, the number of babies Israel is starving is clearly higher than 14,000.
- dlubarov 1y agoHe took a credible claim by the IPC and changed several things (~12 months -> 48 hours, 6mo-5yr children -> babies, acute malnutrition -> death), making it patently false. There's no excuse for that kind of deliberate disinformation.
- JamesAdir 1y ago[flagged]
- RobertoG 1y agoDo you really believe that this have anything to do with the hostages? They want the land, that's it. It could be done little by little or it could be done like now, when they have an excuse. But the end goal is the same. Do you think that what they are doing in the west-bank have anything to do with the hostages or Hamas?
- KittenInABox 1y agoQuestion: There is a repeated claim that more calories have been provided to the Gaza people than several other human crisis scenarios, but that Hamas is currently stealing it all. But I have never seen rampant obesity in Hamas prisoners that the IDF have captured alive? Hamas can't be extorting the Gazan people for those calories, the Gazan people have no money at this point by and large due to the huge swath of destruction of property and infrastructure via bombing-- only Hamas has those underground tunnels or somesuch. So like... what is going on here
- justin66 1y agoCongratulations on discovering an easily identifyable lie.
- s5300 1y ago[dead]
- mef51 1y agoFrom the article: "An internal US government review found no evidence of widespread theft by Hamas of US-funded humanitarian aid in Gaza." Other reporting supports this. So what is going on is that the IDF are lying to justify their genocide. There is a massive propaganda machine at work to muddy the waters.
- m-s-y 1y agothe article also states that the US has looked into the reports of Hamas stealing the aid and found that none of the aid appears to have been stolen by anyone. given the current US administration and their hard-on for Israel, I can't imagine this is a faked report. if it were faked, it'd be to agree with Israel
- mupuff1234 1y agoKinda silly logic, access to calories doesn't mean someone has to be obese. Not saying that the claim is true, just that your logic is faulty.
- YZF 1y agoHave a look here: https://apnews.com/article/mideast-wars-photo-gallery-hostages-eeb1fd13f239c33f9d35b8d88d2a7034 https://apnews.com/article/mideast-wars-photo-gallery-hostag... Plenty of Hamas fighters looking in pretty great shape.
- alangibson 1y agoFixed headline: "How Israel caused famine in Gaza". There is an editorial voice reserved purely for blunting reporting on American and Israeli state crimes that drives me nuts.
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- starik36 1y ago* * *
- C6JEsQeQa5fCjE 1y agoBecause it doesn't move the situation any closer to liberation of their people and their homeland. They have been willing to constantly fight, and constantly keep getting killed by an enemy with overwhelming advantages, for their cause for two years now. Why would you assume that being able to escape with their lives is suddenly more important to them?
- Ray20 1y ago> doesn't move the situation any closer to liberation of their people and their homeland. From Hamas?
- chimineycricket 1y agoFrom the people killing them in places where Hamas has no control and building illegal settlements on their land.
- FridayoLeary 1y ago[flagged]
- lejalv 1y ago[flagged]
- RS-232 1y ago[flagged]
- abrenuntio 1y agoNo. The Bible says nothing about a European secular nationalist movement called Zionism. Certainly nothing positive.
- nakamoto_damacy 1y ago[flagged]
- Animats 1y ago“Israel has built the most efficient starvation machine you can imagine.” There's political opposition to this within Israel. Here's what happened to an elected member of the Knesset who spoke out against the cruelty in Gaza.[1] He was forcibly removed from the podium of the Knesset. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UzDxV7jnAos https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UzDxV7jnAos
- justin66 1y agoPeople sometimes forget how bitterly divided Israel was before October 7th, with hundreds of thousands of people protesting in the streets. The war put some of the infighting on hold for a while, but all the former problems still exist, and the stakes are higher.
- frank_nitti 1y agoEven Charlie Kirk, of all people, was talking about this (ignore the clickbait video title): https://youtu.be/3wUq3t9f6ug?si=nV_NukcsjHZgj0MT https://youtu.be/3wUq3t9f6ug?si=nV_NukcsjHZgj0MT
- TrnsltLife 1y agoOf all people?
- washadjeffmad 1y agoI just googled this: https://www.scribd.com/document/924955773/Kirk-Letter https://www.scribd.com/document/924955773/Kirk-Letter
- LightBug1 1y agoI don't know much about Charlie Kirk except what I've read recently. But he does/did seem to be part of a growing element of the right in the USA who stand against Israel and Netanyahu specifically. And while I support that, I don't think it's necessarily to support Palestinians, but more as an America First policy. In that context, "of all people" makes sense to me. I too have been surprised by the move, of some on the right, against Israel, considering their almost unanimous support previously.
- slowturtle 1y agoUK surgeon Nick Maynard, a volunteer at Nasser Hospital, tells Good Morning Britain that he and other doctors tried to bring baby formula into Gaza and the Israelis confiscated it from them with no justification. [0] [0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ipJEROtHOs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ipJEROtHOs
- mielioort 1y ago[flagged]
- FridayoLeary 1y ago[flagged]
- bjoli 1y agoThe reason for that is apparently that you can use baby formula to make rocket candy. Because apparently extracting the lactose from 40kg baby formula is all it takes to make a quassam rocket. If you can get your hand om 20kg of oxidiser that is. It is all more than ridiculous. Edit: and Nick Maynard is a national treasure.
- cma 1y agoThough different from the rocket fuel, I've read Israel has dumped so much ordinance on Gaza that the Hamas weapons primarily use material from unexploded ordinance as their warheads.
- mothballed 1y agoSame for water. I've heard they could electrolyze drinking water into hydrogen and oxygen. Then they could explode the hydrogen using the oxygen as an oxidizer. Only solution is to cut off all wells and water supplies.
- FridayoLeary 1y ago[flagged]
- glonq 1y ago"Israel accused the IPC of lowering the second threshold of acutely malnourished children for a famine declaration, which the IPC has denied." Damn, Israel is really arguing about how much child starvation they are allowed to inflict before it becomes egregious? That might be another one of those "are we the baddies?" moments right there.
- _DeadFred_ 1y ago[flagged]
- throwup238 1y ago> Yet Israel is the baddies and America/the Allies are sited as doing the correct thing even though they had equal or less food going in. If Israel institutes a Marshall Plan equivalent that rebuilds Gaza/West Bank to the NEMA equivalent of West Germany and Japan, then maybe decades from now their actions will receive the same deference that the historical actions of the Allies have now.
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- potatototoo99 1y agoIf we were to believe Israel, why did they ban foreign media from Gaza? I'm sure the "most moral" army in the world has nothing to hide?
- mk89 1y ago...if foreign media was banned from Gaza, how would you get your propaganda from Hamas now? How did Hamas get UK/Australia/Canada/France etc to recognise Palestine? Or do you think that Israel has control over every inch in Gaza...? The truth is that Israel from the media standpoint has lost this war already 2 years ago, on the 8th of October. The world was very sad for just 1 day. The moment Israel decided to go to war, that's when the machine started. They knew, Hamas knew it, they did it on purpose. And they are reaching their goal. So tell me, who is the winner? Everyone claiming Israel is the worst of the worst - just put yourselves in their shoes, and imagine for a moment that your friend/your husband/wife/baby/kids are still kept hostage by brutal people. Hostage. Not prisoner because they had done something. Hostage - grabbed in the night while sleeping or whatever.
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- lydiaharrison12 1y ago[dead]
- asadm 1y agoI think people blaming it on Hamas need to realize that Israel funds Hamas and uses it as a tool to further their goals. Hamas is their version of Talibans. It fully lines up.
- mk89 1y agoWell, if that was the case, it's not really working out for Israel now, is it? Considering that more and more countries are recognising Palestine, etc. This comment is widespread on X or other social media as the n-th conspiracy theory that Israel has staged the attack etc. Crazy.
- lejalv 1y agoYou really need to google “Netanyahu. Hamas. Qatar”. Pick your favourite news source. You’re in for some surprises.
- brooke2k 1y agohttps://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli_support_for_Hamas https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli_support_for_Hamas
- mk89 1y agoDoesn't prove anything, and it definitely doesn't prove he gave Hamas weapons so they would be victims of a terror attack. Hell, we in the West have given Gaza (and indirectly, we knew it would go to Hamas) so much money. Did we support terrorism? How did we know that they would use our money to buy weapons to murder people in Israel instead of building good things? For me this is more showing an utter incompetence both from Nethanyau and our Western leaders who totally didn't see how they outsmarted us for years. Why do you think our leaders can control everything and know everything? They can make mistakes out of incompetence. I guess this strategy sometimes works in other countries, and sometimes they screw you :)
- logicchains 1y agoIsrael's territory is still expanding, and Palestine's is still shrinking, so it seems to be working out pretty fine. All those countries recognising Palestine don't have the balls to actually conduct any kind of military intervention against Israel.
- RS-232 1y ago[flagged]
- Gud 1y agoWhy is negotiating with Netanyahu acceptable? After all, he has more blood on his hands than Hamas combined. Of course the answer is that without negotiations there is only one path forward - hostile action.
- bccdee 1y agoI'll bite the bullet and respond to this. Those claims have been investigated and were found to be insubstantial. Given that the government of Israel is extraordinarily biased in this matter and would never, under any circumstances, admit to deliberately starving civilians, we can safely disregard whatever excuses they put forth in the absence of external corroboration. > Sam Rose, the acting director of affairs for the UN agency for Palestinian refugees (UNRWA) in Gaza, says Israel – which has near-total jurisdiction over what goods enter and exit Gaza – has controlled “to the calorie” the volume, type and overall flow of food into the enclave. “The system is designed not to function smoothly,” he said. > Last October, Israel’s government banned UNRWA from operating in areas under its control, a prohibition that went into effect in January, having accused the agency of failing to stop Hamas’ alleged theft of aid. An internal US government review found no evidence of widespread theft by Hamas of US-funded humanitarian aid in Gaza. Additionally: > since when did negotiating with terrorists like Hamas even become acceptable When people say they "don't negotiate with terrorists," what they mean is that they will not make concessions in response to terroristic threats. This idea has no relevance in this situation. > Why has the rest of the Arab world not volunteered to receive Palestinian refugees? You're describing forced displacement, which is a component of genocide. The reason why the Arab world has not collaborated with Israel's efforts to commit genocide in Gaza should be self-explanatory.
- RS-232 1y ago[flagged]
- 1y ago
- tguvot 1y ago> A senior COGAT official told a briefing in early September that 27% of the trucks entering Gaza are UN vehicles, claiming it was “a lie” that the UN had brought in 600 aid trucks a day before the war. un own statistics site https://www.ochaopt.org/data/crossings https://www.ochaopt.org/data/crossings food tracks fluctuate between 2000 and 3000 a month prior to oct 7th. a few more dozens of of tracks with "non-edible consumables" and "medical supplies". rest of tracks are construction materials "farm land" part, they forgot to mention that gaza was always totally dependent on imported food. farmland iirc provides only few percent of calories required in gaza. live stock is also sustained by imported feed
- ReptileMan 1y ago[flagged]
- derriz 1y agoYou can be the most efficient without being the one causing the most death. Maybe Israel is scoring well in terms of amount of starvation caused per hour of genocidal effort?
- ReptileMan 1y agoDoubtful, they have been spending tremendous efforts and the population of Gaza has barely bulged downwards. If this is genocide, they are shitty at it.
- SilverElfin 1y ago[flagged]
- bigyabai 1y ago> they could have leveled most of Gaza in the first week following the terrorism of October 7. How exactly would we know the difference from this hypothetical and reality? 92% of the livable housing in Gaza was demolished or damaged following October 7th: https://www.statista.com/statistics/1616491/gaza-war-infrastructure-damage-destruction/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/1616491/gaza-war-infrast...
- LAC-Tech 1y agoIt's amazing to see how support of Israel has started collapsing. Scores of US-aligned nations now recognise Palestine. Even inside their traditional support base in the US, it's on the decline; 50% of Republicans under 50 don't support Israel. At least one republican is calling it a "genocide". MAGA split over Iran. What's interesting is that I don't see the zionist talking points changing at all. They still hold out hope they can accuse everyone of "anti-semitism" and they'll all get back in line like it's 2020. I think they're holding out hope things can go back to normal, but it will be hard to put the toothpaste back in the tube.
- aristofun 1y ago[flagged]
- lejalv 1y ago[flagged]
- throwaway290 1y ago[flagged]
- magicalhippo 1y ago> So yes, maybe Israel started the war, not least by colonizing a territory and forcibly displacing its inhabitants (also called “stealing their land). As well as ensuring funding of Hamas[1][2], and willfully ignoring warnings the attack was imminent[3][4]. [1]: https://www.jpost.com/arab-israeli-conflict/netanyahu-money-to-hamas-part-of-strategy-to-keep-palestinians-divided-583082 https://www.jpost.com/arab-israeli-conflict/netanyahu-money-... [2]: https://www.thejc.com/news/israel/seized-documents-qatar-funded-hamas-disrupted-gaza-peace-n76tlkv8 https://www.thejc.com/news/israel/seized-documents-qatar-fun... [3]: https://www.jpost.com/israel-hamas-war/article-806634 https://www.jpost.com/israel-hamas-war/article-806634 [4]: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67082047 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67082047
- SilverElfin 1y ago[flagged]
- aristofun 1y agoName few exact cities, villages that were stolen? With trustworthy prooflinks about all the details of those specific places being stolen. Before that your comment with abstract yellow news posts is just a dumb propaganda.
- lejalv 1y agoAll of it. The entire place.
- crikeykangaroo 1y agoThis genocide reveals how much Israel truly controls the US government and other Western countries. I am beyond appalled this is allowed to happen. The last couple of months also showed that international rules and agreements don't mean anything - they are in fact only there to please the Western countries, until they throw it in the bin when it is convenient to them.
- bgnn 1y agoAnyone who isn't from the West, hell even Southern Europeans, are taking note. There is no rights and freedoms for us. All this for to support a bully of a fundamentalist state and a bunch of theocratic kingdoms/emirates.
- mindslight 1y agoI've got to wonder if Israel is one the pillars propping up Trump along with China and Russia. It would make perfect sense with its relation to the Epstein files (in which Trump is likely mentioned every other paragraph). I'm not saying the Democrats have done great by Gaza, but I feel like the point we're at - irrefutable genocide through starvation - there would at least be significant pressure to stop attacking humanitarian convoys. All I can really say about the current situation is that it would be a great time for the EU to step up, demonstrate some international leadership, and forcibly deliver aid under the guard of military force.
- arkensaw 1y agoThat simply will never happen. As outspoken as EU countries are, they are not inclined to act beyond the diplomatic equivalent of a strongly worded email. It's a fantasy to think that any single EU nation would risk a shooting war with Israel by trying to deliver aid without permission, and they absolutely could never reach a consensus on doing it as a unit.
- jijijijij 1y ago[flagged]
- JumpCrisscross 1y ago
- rdtsc 1y agoNot in a thousand years I would have expected CNN to start reporting on this. Hope they got some good lines responding to accusations on how every single one of them, including the janitors at the CNN Center in Atlanta are antisemitic. -"But we're not!" -"Aha, that's exactly what they always say, clearly a sign of guilt!" /s
- therobots927 1y agoToo little too late in order to save face now that the tide of public opinion has shifted
- axython 1y agoFor anyone commenting on this, I'll leave this: Official aid delivery reported by UN. I'd also assume this to be of the lower side, as there probably is more that doesn't get reported thorugh UN 27720 mechanism. I find the fact that this article does not use this or point to this data very questionable, but maybe I am wrong and I am imagining things. https://app.un2720.org/tracking https://app.un2720.org/tracking
- jijijijij 1y ago> Intercepted - Either peacefully by hungry people or forcefully by armed actors, during transit in Gaza I presume you meant to suggest Hamas is bathing in baby formula, but your link isn't evidence for that. It could be desperate people doing desperate things, you know, because they are starving.
- axython 1y agoNope. My main question is why journalists do not use official, readily available data, but instead talk about bullshit. How can you talk about aid, famine and not put this information in there is beyond me. The problem is not aid. the problem as proven by UN data is logistics and interceptions by someone(probably mostly Hamas, but even if it's some other peaceful side) How do we deal with that?
- WrongOnInternet 1y agoIn 1942, Jewish doctors conducted the Warsaw Ghetto Hunger Study used the man made famine to study the physiological and psychological effects of hunger. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warsaw_Ghetto_Hunger_Study https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warsaw_Ghetto_Hunger_Study Not all scientific studies need to be replicated.
- yibg 1y agoIt's wild to me how many people here use the "it's war, bad things happen" to justify the situation. Weird that it needs to be said, but this is why war crimes are a thing. Just because it's an armed conflict, doesn't mean anything goes.
- JamesAdir 1y ago[flagged]
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- JumpCrisscross 1y ago> It's war initiated by Hamas Takes two to tango. Hamas started the war. Israel has continued it way past where it made sense. (No later than after Sinwar was killed.)
- istjohn 1y agoGaza has been under blockade since 2007, and the roots of the conflict date back to the founding of the Zionist Organization by Theodor Herzl in 1897 with the purpose to facilitate the escape of Jews from persecution in Eastern Europe by establishing a colony in Palestine. Israel has persecuted the indigenous people of Palestine ever since.
- JumpCrisscross 1y ago> the roots of the conflict date back to the founding of the Zionist Organization by Theodor Herzl in 1897 with the purpose to facilitate the escape of Jews from persecution in Eastern Europe by establishing a colony in Palestine Please, the roots of this conflict go back millenia. Nothing done in the last hundred years have helped it. And the Palestinian people keep getting fucked by outside powers using them for their own ends, whether it be the Arab countries invading Israel or Iran having their sock puppets invite bombs. But it's a bit silly to imagine that if we poofed Israel and turned Israel & Palestine into a democracy that we wouldn't, within like two minutes, start seeing missiles flying.
- ge96 1y agoI've seen air dropping videos, if random countries were to try that would they be at risk of being shot down, probably right for violating air space (cough cough).
- csb6 1y agoYes, airdrops are only done with permission from Israel since they control Gaza airspace (they have for decades). But airdrops are not an efficient way to feed millions of people (and the pallets have killed multiple people by landing on them). Shipping by truck allows a much larger volume much faster, and the UN has experience doing so, but they have been largely blocked from doing so for months by Israel, which runs its own much less efficient aid operation with many fewer distribution points guarded by mercenaries who regularly kill aid seekers who often have to travel long distances through dangerous areas.
- wonderwonder 1y ago[flagged]
- cletusw 1y agoThat's the entire point of "war crimes" and "crimes against humanity" definitions like intentional starvation. It doesn't matter what the justification is, they're not allowed by the international law and need to be punished as such in all cases unconditionally.
- wonderwonder 1y agoInternational law is not really a real thing. There is what America will allow and what it wont.
- RobertoG 1y agoNonsense, this is about the land. Israel wants Gaza and the West Bank, and who knows what more, and if they have to go genocidal to getting it, they will. So simple like that. Any other explanation is just obfuscation of this obvious fact.
- wonderwonder 1y agoJust so we are clear, Japan attacked us at Pearl Harbor and we eventually nuked them killing 250k. Was that an international war crime? Al Qaeda attacked us and killed 3000 Americans and in response we killed about 200k Afghanis. Was that a war crime? Israel has simply responded as any other country would to the attack.
- JamesAdir 1y ago[flagged]
- thinkindie 1y agoIt's incredible how two years of continuing pounding a small strip of land still leaves ample space for Hamas to operate. To the point that Israel international reputation is damaged because, check notes, they don't allow baby formula for babies that might otherwise die under those aforementioned bombs. Or being amputated. Same with the latest "because Hamas": apparently Hamas, while being under the bombs with Israeli soldiers everywhere, was able to organise, finance and operate a flotilla of several boats to bring food that is otherwise blocked by Israel. Either the IDF has been bombing randomly in the last two years (to inflict the highest pain to civilian) or they are lying. Or both.
- oytis 1y agoDo you think Israel is able to destroy Hamas' power in Gaza, but prefers to starve babies instead?
- thinkindie 1y agoJohn Oliver has a very valid point https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0_Bwix9IjOE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0_Bwix9IjOE but this was already known: Netanyahu must cling to power, otherwise he will be screwed on so many levels, that's why he is sabotaging any agreement (and this has always been his modus operandi, see what he did back in the 90s).
- zhynn 1y agoIt appears that Hamas struck a deeper blow on October 7th than we realized. Perhaps Israel's humanity was the primary target. It's like watching a family member destroy everything in a fit of grief and rage. Surely there is a wiser path.
- mrbonner 1y agoThe horror that starvation inflicts on the human mind is beyond comparison. My grandfather experienced this firsthand when he fled from the Japanese invasion, an occupation that stripped civilians of their food supply. He helplessly watched as his parents, relatives, and even his older brother succumbed one by one to hunger. Barely escaping the same fate, he fled the country just before starvation could claim his own life. When I was eight years old, I asked him why he always kept a room filled with dried cassava root. His reply was simple but unforgettable: dying from starvation is the most terrifying experience imaginable, and he was determined never to endure it again.
- jijijijij 1y agoStarvation may also cause epigenetic and metabolic changes, which persist and are even passed to next generations. In children tissue dystrophy is particular damaging, since their bodies are still developing. Starvation is a really fucking bad thing.
- dbancajas 1y agoIt's nature's way of communicating to the next generation. That is crazy and beautiful.
- jijijijij 1y agoPretty cynical and tone-deaf comment in this context, in my opinion. Molecular evidence was notably described in nematodes, so epigenetic inheritance is a very old mechanism. I don't think you could describe molecular transgenerational trauma as beautiful, or useful adaptation regarding human life. Especially considering the artificial nature of every famine in today's world, where we are producing enough food to feed all humans on earth three times over.
- mrbonner 1y agoIn many ways, the fear of hunger is deeply ingrained within us as human beings. Our instincts continually drive us to optimize for consumption and survival. Yet, how often do we pause to reflect on how much of our daily lives revolve around thoughts of food or the pursuit of security?
- kneelesh48 1y ago[flagged]
- khazhoux 1y agoWhere do you see antisemitism?
- just-the-wrk 1y agoI think the most amazing part of the comments is how much the sentiment has changed over the last 2 years. Is anybody else noticing this?
- notnaut 1y agoPlausible deniability dried up as the blatantly skewed results of this “conflict” became impossible to ignore.
- Braxton1980 1y agoAnd Israel will still get away with it. There will be delays, complaints, but 10 years from now Israel will have Gaza and at best the Palestinians, reduced in number, will live in a small ghettos. At worst somewhere else or dead
- falconroar 1y agoThey will get away with it if we believe we are powerless to change it. Russia has been proven to be pushing defeatist propaganda similar to your sentiment, and I'm sure Israel has been as well.
- cropcirclbureau 1y agowhat are you talking about? The sheer number of 10+ year old hn accounts tirading to defend, downplay and whitewash the actions of Israel in the comments in this exact thread is simply horrifying. .
- just-the-wrk 1y agoI'm saying the percentage of this appears different to me
- insane_dreamer 1y agoWhat shocks me is that there are still people trying to whitewash and/or defend the genocide.
- chakintosh 1y ago> How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza Way to whitewash a genocide. The title make it sound like the famine is accidental or an unintended consequence of Israel's "actions". While in reality, it's the sole purpose of what Israel is doing in Gaza for years, they are conducting a genocide, plain and simple.
- stronglikedan 1y agoIs there any difference between carrying it out and intending to carry it out if given the chance? From the river to the sea?
- JumpCrisscross 1y ago> Way to whitewash a genocide I honestly think invoking the g- word is harmful to the Palestinian cause at this point. It's a war. There are war crimes. Maybe there's genocidal intent. But that seems like a distraction compared to actual harm on the ground.
- phgn 1y agoThe UN calls it a genocide now. What evidence more do you need?
- JumpCrisscross 1y ago> UN calls it a genocide now One, really important to specify that the Independent International Commission of Inquiry on the Occupied Palestinian Territory, including East Jerusalem, and Israel said this, not the UN as a whole. "The UN" is generally held to be the General Assembly. Two, I'm not disputing that it probably is a genocide. I'm just saying that people have been calling it a genocide well before we had evidence it was one. As a result, the term has lost moral weight. Put another way, I don't think support for Palestine increases by calling it a genocide again. I do think it increases by showing, specifically, what the famine means for the kids on the ground can change hearts and minds. (Nobody, at this point, is probably going to be swung on a fundamental opinion. People may, however, re-prioritise this politically.)
- phgn 1y agoTwo numbers on the effectiveness of that strategy: 680.000 and 380.000. The total number of Palestinians murdered, and the number of those who were kids under 5 years old. source: https://arena.org.au/politics-of-counting-gazas-dead/ https://arena.org.au/politics-of-counting-gazas-dead/
- m101 1y agoThese numbers are just false. Even the Hamas numbers are 10x less than this!
- sharkjacobs 1y agoWhat are the numbers then?
- m101 1y ago[flagged]
- phgn 1y agoI was referencing numbers from the article which I linked, which clearly states the reasons for why those researchers don't believe official numbers. The page you linked seems to only include deaths where the name of the person is known. Who is left in Gaza to count or report the dead?
- ngruhn 1y ago440+ according to Wikipedia. Only a lower bound I guess. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaza_Strip_famine https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaza_Strip_famine EDIT: only due to starvation
- phgn 1y agoWho is left in Gaza to count or report all the dead? The people who die of famine? Official numbers have increased by less than 20.000 in the last year of genocide. Isn't that curious?
- m101 1y ago[flagged]
- phgn 1y agoMhh, what if we let enough food into Gaza so that everyone can survive? Why would Hamas have any reason to steal food then?
- m101 1y agoDid you know that the population of Gaza has actually increased since the start of the conflict?
- buyucu 1y agoThe lows Israel is capable of is beyond normal comprehension. Fixed that for you.
- pat64 1y agoI generally use conversations on this topic as a litmus test for a group or community. I’m pretty disappointed by all the whatabout-ism and false equivalence. I expected better from HN. We can study why this happened later. The genocide needs to stop now.
- sys32768 1y ago[flagged]
- ipaddr 1y agoBenjamin Netanyahu funded Hamas in the 90s. So this is where we are. If they allowed the PLO to manage we would have two states already.
- danielbenzvi1 1y agoThe idea that simply empowering the PLO would have produced peace ignores the reality of what happened when they were empowered. After Oslo, Israel handed over cities in the West Bank and gave the Palestinian Authority control in Gaza. Instead of building the foundations of a peaceful state, the PLO leadership became riddled with corruption, failed to create functioning institutions, and tolerated or even encouraged waves of violence. The Second Intifada, launched under the PLO’s watch, was one of the bloodiest chapters in the conflict and shattered Israeli trust in their willingness or ability to deliver peace.
- ipaddr 1y agoIt’s true that the post-Oslo period exposed serious failures in Palestinian leadership, but the picture isn’t one-sided. The Palestinian Authority was granted limited autonomy under Oslo, not true sovereignty. Israel retained control over borders, resources, movement, and security, meaning the PLO never had the conditions to fully build a state. Corruption and mismanagement within the PA certainly damaged trust, but so did ongoing settlement expansion, restrictions on movement, and the lack of progress toward final status negotiations. The Second Intifada was indeed devastating and eroded faith on both sides, but framing it only as a PLO decision ignores the buildup of frustration from years of unfulfilled promises and worsening conditions on the ground. Empowering the PLO in a genuine way, with real authority, accountability mechanisms, and mutual commitment to peace, might have led to a different outcome. In other words, both leadership failures and structural limitations played roles. Reducing it to "the PLO blew it" risks oversimplifying a very complex situation.
- softwaredoug 1y agoI've heard it said by eliminating all other avenues of Palestinian political expression, Netanyahu created modern Hamas. He undermined the two-state solution and Palestinian Authority. When you do this, you back people into a corner. There's no path to peacefully making progress on anything you care about. It also conveniently gives Netanyahu a boogeyman for his own political ends. You might argue the PA was corrupt, etc. But that status quo was far better than what exists now.
- glenngillen 1y agoThe most recent episode of John Oliver goes further and says he actively funded Hamas to destabilise the area and cause problems for the PA.
- LightBug1 1y agoYep, Netanyahu used Hamas' existence as a political tool to divide Palestinians, weaken peace efforts, and maintain Israeli control. He let Qatari cash find its way to Hamas.
- magicalhippo 1y agoNetanyahu himself has said that: Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu defended Israel’s regular allowing of Qatari funds to be transferred into Gaza, saying it is part of a broader strategy to keep Hamas and the Palestinian Authority separate, a source in Monday’s Likud faction meeting said. The prime minister also said that, “whoever is against a Palestinian state should be for” transferring the funds to Gaza, because maintaining a separation between the PA in the West Bank and Hamas in Gaza helps prevent the establishment of a Palestinian state. https://www.jpost.com/arab-israeli-conflict/netanyahu-money-to-hamas-part-of-strategy-to-keep-palestinians-divided-583082 https://www.jpost.com/arab-israeli-conflict/netanyahu-money-...
- dotancohen 1y ago[flagged]
- 1y ago
- Humorist2290 1y agoSo focusing on the details of the situation in Gaza is quite awful. The general tone of the comments in this thread, along with basically any public forum I think speaks for the reverberation of human suffering throughout this -- civilians are being made into casualties, Israeli and Palestinian, and it's terrible. Taking a broader perspective, large parts of the human race have come to realize famine is a relic of the past. Modern agriculture, synthetic fertilizer, and the technology of the last 100+ years has made famine optional. There is without a doubt the technological capacity to supply every person on earth with food and clean water. Nobody needs to go hungry to feed every person in Gaza. The same could be said of Sudan, or Bangladesh, or Haiti. 200 years ago, famine was usually a natural disaster; now it is almost exclusively a political choice.
- jmyeet 1y agoFamine is political, always. The world produces a significant excess of food. The only reason famine exists is because one group of people is perfectly happy to starve another group of people. Gaza is not unique here although Gaza is a aprticularly egregious example of industrial mass starvation and death at the hands of a highly-developed military and state actor.
- Humorist2290 1y agoI can't disagree. Modern famine is a tool used to cause harm indiscriminately. It is a testament to the human capacity for cognitive dissonance that so many people can be against the starvation of children yet support politicians responsible for mass starvation. Though my point was more about considering the historical context. Famines used to happen all the time but largely because of crop failures. That famine is _caused_ has become common knowledge is, I think, at least an improvement. ~All~ Most of the famines that could've happened for the old reasons haven't. Admittedly, I'm grasping at straws to avoid dwelling on the horrid situation at hand.
- insane_dreamer 1y agoYou make a good point, and it extends to other disasters besides famine. As humans we have evolved to the point where there are certain problems that we can eliminate -- starvation being one of them as you pointed out -- thanks to technological solutions. And yet, we deliberately choose not to. There are millions of people who die each year whose deaths are wholly preventable -- we have the technology and the resources to prevent them (without harming anyone else) -- but we choose not to, mostly so that some relatively small group of people can amass more wealth than they need. Humans have always been that way, I suppose, but never have these solutions been more within our grasp and yet, we choose not to use them. It's a terrible indictment against the human race.
- onetimeusename 1y agoThere are articles about Israel planning for Gazans to emigrate for months. The idea is they would 'voluntarily' emigrate to several African countries Israel made deals with. So I think that is more proof the starvation is deliberate. They can claim they aren't forcing anyone to migrate but if you stay you die. Not only is that evil but they are forcing some other country to deal with the problem.
- asdefghyk 1y ago[flagged]
- bigyabai 1y ago> And why is there never any posted articles with criticism of Hamas? There definitely is; discussion of the Yemen conflict has been constant on HN. The Israeli criticism of Hamas gets much less coverage because it's less globally important. The consequence of one side or the other "losing" has very little bearing on global affairs. Many of the Israeli articles criticizing Hamas lack impartial corroboration, largely as a consequence of the urban warfare campaign: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_journalists_killed_in_the_Gaza_war https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_journalists_killed_in_...
- asdefghyk 1y agoI mean "bad things" Hamas has done to their own? people ( Gaza people). Example - Hamas has killed people who criticise it ( or I should say thats whats been reported )
- bigyabai 1y agoI don't think you read my last comment. Hundreds of embedded reporters living in Gaza have died, the only remaining perspective is the famously biased hasbara news, subject to the Israeli Military Censor unit: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli_Military_Censor https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli_Military_Censor We can't take Israel's word for it, since the IDF controls their media. We don't have much independent reporting since Israel suppresses it. You can pretty easily read between the lines to figure out who's hiding what.
- asdefghyk 1y agoHamas controls the reporters in Gaza too.... Its reported, Some have been killed by Hamas for not reporting as directed by Hamas. Any reporters previously associated in any way with Hamas would be a extremely dangerous position. Israel while having release some information on such journalists would NOT be releasing sensitive information that would give clues how information is collected and associated surveillance techniques. No doubt they and lots other militaries would have amazing tracking and interception capabilities. Israel would also be receiving information contributed by associated powers from other countries. Also maybe Israel have recruited some Gaza people as spys?
- jmyeet 1y ago[flagged]
- ziobot 1y ago[dead]
- grumple 1y agoThe IPC standard says for famine to be declared: > at least two in every 10,000 people die each day from starvation, or from malnutrition and disease. Gaza population is 2 million * 2/10000 = 400 people dying per day in order for it to be a famine. > After more than 700 days of war, 455 Palestinians have died of malnutrition or starvation, including 151 children, the health ministry in Gaza reported on October 1. One hundred and seventy-seven of the total number have died of malnutrition or starvation since the IPC confirmed famine on August 15, it said. Is 455 in 700 days more than 400 per day? I don’t know, I’m having trouble doing math. Perhaps the people of HN can tell me the IPC standard is being met as the CNN article states? Media and general literacy is apparently impossible even for journalists.
- JumpCrisscross 1y ago> Gaza population is 2 million In August, the IPC found about 514,000 Gazans are Phase 5 (famine / humanitarian catastrophe) [1][2]. It projected by September that was around 641,000. So the threshold you're looking for is a crude death rate (CDR) between 100 and 120 per day. CRD "needs to be directly attributable to outright starvation or to the interaction of food consumption deficits and disease" and does not include trauma [3]. So it will be more than just confirmed deaths from malnutrition or starvation (which is, in practice, impossible to procure for anywhere on even the brink of famine). [1] https://www.ipcinfo.org/ipc-country-analysis/details-map/en/c/1159696/?iso3=PSE https://www.ipcinfo.org/ipc-country-analysis/details-map/en/... [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Integrated_Food_Security_Phase_Classification https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Integrated_Food_Security_Phase... [3] https://www.ipcinfo.org/fileadmin/user_upload/ipcinfo/docs/IPC_Famine_Guidelines_Nov16.pdf https://www.ipcinfo.org/fileadmin/user_upload/ipcinfo/docs/I...
- grumple 1y agoThe mortality exceeding the rate I mentioned is a prerequisite for declaring stage 5. It has not been met. You don’t declare stage 5 until it has according to their own standards. The rate of death in Gaza from those causes is nowhere near that CDR. The total death rate from all causes is substantially below that number (by a factor of 4).
- A_D_E_P_T 1y agoIsrael's response to Oct 7th has been a major blackpill. Their strategy was, I think, as bad as it could possibly be. In fact, it really seemed, and still seems, like no strategy at all -- they lashed out wildly and extremely destructively, without a clear picture of what the post-war Gaza Strip will look like. Hamas successfully baited Israel into a disproportionate response that killed tens of thousands, if not hundreds of thousands, which played directly into the dynamics of guerrilla warfare where a strong state's extreme actions against a weak opponent undermine its legitimacy. Walking into such a trap tends to be a real world-historical blunder for any nation. Yet, rather than adapting, Israel's network doubled down with censorship campaigns, crackdowns on protests, and weaponizing "anti-semitism" accusations to silence critics -- actions that have all backfired. Now international support is collapsing, the EU is pushing sanctions, and the US is slowly distancing itself. Israel's best option right now is to end the war as quickly as possible, and devote all of its efforts to repairing damaged relationships and mitigating the war's effects, before isolation accelerates to the level of sanctions similar to those imposed on South Africa. I'll also note that it's interesting how all sides seem to have lost. Hamas lost the shooting war, the people of Gaza have lost lives and livelihoods which may take more than a decade to rebuild, and Israel lost the information/media war so damn badly that it may genuinely not recover from this.
- flyinglizard 1y agoWe can talk endlessly about strategy and long term implications (for example, the destruction of the Iranian "ring of fire" network of proxies, the permanent changes in Syria and Lebanon, etc), but consider something much more basic: Israelis around Gaza can finally live securely. There are no rockets coming from Gaza, no mortars, no chance of another October 7th or smaller incursions as long as the Israeli military is there. Israelis have peace. No Gazan rocket can disturb the life in Tel Aviv or Ashdod. This couldn't and shouldn't have been a re-run of the countless previous clashes with Hamas. Israel needed to go all out to change the security situation, permanently.
- jayveeone 1y ago[flagged]
- orochimaaru 1y ago[flagged]
- AzzieElbab 1y agoHow many people died of famine in Gaza?
- nikodotio 1y agoRead the article
- AzzieElbab 1y agoI did. 450, according to CNN, no sources cited, and no reference to how many died of hunger before the war. One thing I did not expect on this board is innumeracy.
- nitwit005 1y agoThat's presumably the Palestinian Ministry of Health. But, obviously, there's no reliable source in a war zone, and starving people often don't die directly from hunger, but from disease after being weakened. Most statistics about deaths from famines are estimates after the fact.
- yieldcrv 1y agoExecutive Order 14046 https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2021/09/21/2021-20508/imposing-sanctions-on-certain-persons-with-respect-to-the-humanitarian-and-human-rights-crisis-in https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2021/09/21/2021-20... this financial blacklisting was done on the mere allegation of famine and no court tribunal was involved at all and nobody split hairs on the definition find and replace Ethiopia with Israel, Eritrea with Gaza, and that's all we need to do happy Yom Kippur! there's a lot to atone for, as some say, and an easy way for the US Government to ensure it
- blini-kot 1y agoI wonder if israeli citizens are blocked to enter other countries, or maybe Israel itself is disconnected from visa and mastercard not that it is a proper response, but you know, at least it would be a principled one
- avaika 1y agoNot sure how much sarcasm did you put in this comment, but banning from entering other countries and disconnecting from visa / mc only hurts. Here's why. I am originally from Russia and I do not support the war my country has started. I moved to another country because of that. And I face all the fun consequences from two nice restrictions above. Some of my former neighbors or acquaintances who decided to stay in the country or even support the invasion face no issues. They don't visit other countries and don't need international cards. Which means both these things primary target people who most likely do not support the shit which is happening. Is that the goal?
- blini-kot 1y agothat's exactly what I am on about, and facing those restrictions as well as such, sarcasm here is beyond measurement - obviously those measures were just a distraction for own voters, but presented as a matter of principle yada yada yada an absolutely identical situation gets a 100% hush hush reverse treatment, hence my comment on being a matter of principle - even though I don't agree with such measures, seeing them implemented against Israelis would at least be an honest thing to do instead of the current hypocrisy
- hereme888 1y ago[flagged]
- smallnix 1y ago> ripped fetuses out of pregnant women This is insane brutality. A cursory search, I don't want to do more than that, tells me it's a misattribution of an older Mexican cartel murder.
- hereme888 1y agoHuh, interesting. Search with Grok seems to concur. While they did commit many atrocities against women and children, the ripping from belly events failed journalistic verification.
- nikodotio 1y agoInsane brutality has happened on both sides. However the statistical numbers are different, before oct 7 and after, one side has been much more successful in its brutalization of the other.
- Stevvo 1y agoEven if Israel actually were trying to recover the hostages, this wouldn't make sense. Over 20,000 dead Palestinian children and blocking aid does not recover any hostages. On the contrary, it only fuels the terror ideology ensuring Hamas is never eradicated. Israel is responsible for its own actions. It is not Hamas who is using starvation as a weapon of war, it is Israel.
- falconroar 1y ago[flagged]
- nikodotio 1y agoYou should look into the accounts of doctors who are not allowed to take in baby food. Israeli mobs destroying aid trucks. Israeli soldiers gloating about killing children. While Hamas has done atrocities, this does not allow atrocities to be committed in response. Especially by an occupying power that controls every variable in the environment.
- Tehnix 1y agoNothing has opened my eyes more to how much mainstream media is distorting reality to fit their narrative, than the genocide Israel is committing in Gaza. You can sit with literal video of an incident, and then see media headlines tell a completely different story than what actually happened. Social media in our generation has been a weird amplifier of both misinformation as well as truth from the ground that contradicts misinformation in the media. My selection of topics I trust media to report on has greatly narrowed down to ones that are completely apolitical, which is sad (they’ve always been biased, but at least I felt you could tell that they were biased and read through it).
- aristofun 1y ago[flagged]
- more_corn 1y agoBold of CNN to so openly report facts that the current administration will take offense at. I wonder what retaliation they will face.
- aristofun 1y ago[flagged]
- nsoonhui 1y agoThe first question that should be asked is this: if there is indeed so much suffering in Gaza, why is no one pressuring Hamas to end the war by accepting Donald Trump’s peace plan? The war could have been over by now if Hamas had surrendered, yet this point is rarely mentioned. Why is that? Instead, many—including major Western media outlets—repeat Hamas’ narrative: that Israel is responsible for the killing (while Hamas has been accused of using human shields [0]) and that Israel prevents the UN from distributing aid (even though the UN is said to be heavily infiltrated by Hamas [1], and the GHF was established to restrict Hamas’ access to food supplies and prevent profiteering through resale [2]). Furthermore, if starvation in Gaza is a pressing reality, why does the UN refuse to distribute food directly [4]? In fact, the claim that there is a famine going on just doesn't match the numbers [5], and UN-linked IPC finds no mortality data to prove famine is present, despite their very intention of proving so [6], and media was found to misrepresent the situation on the ground [7] Finally, little attention is given to Egypt’s role in maintaining the blockade of Gaza, which also contributes to "famine". Egypt does not allow Gazans—who are described by some as facing genocide—to cross its border to escape [3]. It often seems as though those who argue that starvation is being deliberately inflicted prefer to keep the situation unchanged, only to place the blame on Israel. 0: https://www.fdd.org/analysis/2023/11/01/hamas-officials-admit-its-strategy-is-to-use-palestinian-civilians-as-human-shields/ https://www.fdd.org/analysis/2023/11/01/hamas-officials-admi... 1: https://govextra.gov.il/unrwa/unrwa/ https://govextra.gov.il/unrwa/unrwa/ 2: https://www.aipac.org/resources/gaza-aid https://www.aipac.org/resources/gaza-aid 3: https://theconversation.com/why-egypt-refuses-to-open-its-border-to-palestinians-forcibly-displaced-from-gaza-223735 https://theconversation.com/why-egypt-refuses-to-open-its-bo... 4: https://www.fdd.org/analysis/2025/07/24/un-refuses-to-cooperatively-distribute-aid-as-reported-hunger-grows-in-gaza/ https://www.fdd.org/analysis/2025/07/24/un-refuses-to-cooper... 5: https://x.com/Aizenberg55/status/1966495888051761582 https://x.com/Aizenberg55/status/1966495888051761582 6: https://www.timesofisrael.com/key-food-security-org-finds-no-famine-in-gaza-says-previous-assumptions-wrong/ https://www.timesofisrael.com/key-food-security-org-finds-no... 7: https://honestreporting.com/famine-standard-was-lowered-for-gaza-media-turned-a-blind-eye/ https://honestreporting.com/famine-standard-was-lowered-for-...
- neoromantique 1y agoHamas is dire, hencw the increased media attention lately, hopefully it'll all end soon, regular people have suffered enough
- ropable 1y agoThe situation in Gaza is horrifying and despair-inducing. While acknowledging the incredibly complex historical context of the region and the security bind that Israel is in, IMO they have surrendered all moral authority by their actions there. The military campaign and blockade of aid into Gaza is wildly disproportionate and monstrous.
- zawaideh 1y agoDenying Palestinians their basic human rights to create an apartheid ethno state is not complex. The narrative that “it is complex therefore there is nothing to be done” is meant to paralyze people from standing up for what’s right. The solution has always been a single democratic secular state from the river to the sea. For all inhabitants of the land. Including those expelled previously.
- Gud 1y agoHow do you propose that should happen? Seems impossible to me.
- insane_dreamer 1y agoA two-state solution is still possible, but becoming vanishingly small: On the Palestinian side, it doesn't give them the "right of return" (to the land they were expelled from in 1948) that they frankly deserve, which is a tough pill to swallow for them. But besides some hardliners they've pretty much resigned themselves to the fact they'll never get their stolen land back (much like the Native Americans). On the Israeli side, it's much more problematic as it would mean dismantling many or all of the settlements on the WB. This is anathema to Israel and would be heavily resisted (perhaps violently) by the settlers who were put there in the first place expressly to prevent a two-state solution. Israel deliberately violated all the agreements about settlements reached over the years in order to create a situation where it could say "we can't expect those settlers to move out". It's no coincidence that the settlers who were given the stolen land are generally the most militant of the Israelis, and many are heavily armed, by the way.
- boxerab 1y ago[flagged]
- archdang 1y agoWe see here an example of a useless idiot. Point 1, nonsense: Allies fed Germans during WW2, the US fed Iraqis and Afghans during their wars and occupations. Point 2, nonsense: The Rafah crossing has been intermittently open, and Egypt has allowed aid in coordination with the UN. Israel has bombed the Rafah crossing multiple times since October 7th. Point 3, whataboutism. Sudan and Yemen are in the news in my circles weekly and there's care for all these horrible events.
- boxerab 1y agoMy whole point is that there is a double standard applied to the only Jewish state vs all other countries, and I'm afraid you have given pretty weak rebuttal. Point 1: nope, the Allies provided minimal food to the Germans during the conflict. They were too busy bombing the crap out of German cities, and they didn't bother on warning the civilians first, as Israel does in Gaza. The aid came AFTER the Nazis had unconditionally surrendered. Point 2: nope again - there has been some food coming from Egypt, but they are not at war and nobody is marching in the streets demanding that they give more. And yes, Rafah was bombed, because there is a war taking place, with Hamas smuggling arms and food through the crossing. Point 3: nope, the famines in Sudan and Yemen are real vs the fake famine in Gaza, and yet I see no street marches or HN posts on these tragedies. Maybe it's because it is Muslims killing and starving other Muslims. No Jews, No News. If you actually cared about Gazans you would demand that Hamas release hostages and surrender - conflict ends immediately.
- archdang 1y agoYou move goalposts and mire yourself in falsehood. Point 1 empirically wrong. Of course more food was provided after guns went silent. Point 2 you sound like you agree with me and disagree with your original post. Point 3. Reveals you as a propagandist.I've demanded that Hamas releases the hostage. From your rather uninformed framing it's clear you think there's a war on all of Gaza and not just Hamas. You just read an article on how Israel engineered a famine, correct? This reveals quite a lot about your relationship to truth and human suffering.
- sirmike_ 1y agouh-huh. IF there is; Hamas carries the weight. Not Israel. Take a momma bear's cub away and see the momma bear's claws. Duh.
- FilosofumRex 1y ago[flagged]
- tomhow 1y agoCould you please stop posting ideological flamebait? Looking at your history, most of your comments seem related to politics/ideology, including multiple comments referencing stereotypes, like this one [1]. It's not what this site is for, and destroys what it is for. We have to ban accounts that continue to do this after being warned. If you wouldn't mind reviewing https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and taking the intended spirit of the site more to heart, we'd be grateful. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45230809 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45230809
- kangaroozach 1y ago[flagged]
- regularization 1y ago> not a single Jew has been allowed to live in Gaza for 20 years, per Hamas Israeli law in the past 20 years says Israelis can not live in Gaza. Something you neglected to mention.
- neoromantique 1y agoBecause it took releasing thousands of terrorists to return one jew from Gaza. If he were to survive long enough for something to be released that is.
- nick_ 1y ago"One day, everyone will have always been against this"
- xyzal 1y agoYou can donate to help break the cycle of IDF impunity. https://www.hindrajabfoundation.org/ https://www.hindrajabfoundation.org/
- ukblewis 1y agoHow CNN, a supposedly reputable news source can quote Hamas-run (a recognised terror group in the US) Health Ministry’s number without even noting who runs the ministry or raising any doubt is ridiculous? More ridiculous, noting the prices of different goods in Gaza when the vast majority of those goods enter Gaza as free aid. So who is stealing it and extorting others? Hamas and other terror groups are ghosts in this article. It is time that the UN focus on delivering aid rather than blaming Israel. Gazans die when they both refuse IDF convoys to keep them safe and blame the IDF for not keeping them safe as the “occupying” power. If only the IDF had already won, then Gazans would eat like normal already
- DobarDabar 1y ago[flagged]
- MichaelMoser123 1y agoCNN is quoting data from the Gaza health ministry, an organization run by genocidal Islamist Hamas, without mentioning its affiliation and without questioning the data. So much for objectivity on CNN and "Hacker News". There is also no mention on the food convoys that get plundered by Hamas. Just to mention: Hamas is designated as a terrorist organization in the US, since 1997 - just adding some missing background information.
- buyucu 1y agoThere is a genocidal group of religious crazies here, and it is the Israeli government.
- insane_dreamer 1y agoIf any other country in the world was doing what Israel is doing, there would be international sanctions against them and talk of military intervention (if they had oil or natural resources to grab). The fact that Israel can get away with this is almost entirely due to the US' "unwavering" support for political (a strategic military ally in the Middle East) and religious (Evangelicals and the "Promised Land") reasons. As an American, I'm disgusted that my tax dollars are actively supporting genocide. And let's not fall into the trap of telling ourselves that this only started in response to Oct 7. The Palestinians have been severely oppressed for _decades_ -- which is why it's almost impossible to root out something like Hamas, because the next generation of boys will be more than willing to sacrifice themselves to break and/or avenge the oppression of their families when they get old enough to carry a gun.
- enumer8 1y ago" We will clean Gaza of every potential murderer, and everyone there is a potential murderer." - Michal Woldiger, member of the Israeli Knesset "Tulkarm and Jenin will look like Jabalia and Shujaiya. Nablus and Ramallah will look like Rafah and Khan Younis. They too will be uninhabitable ruins, their residents will be forced to migrate and seek a new life in other countries." - Bezalel Smotrich, Finance Minister of Israel "It's a simple matter, existential and survival, of wiping these crazy Amalekites off the face of the Earth. Like the Nazis, so with Hamas: we will fight them and hunt them forever. Until not one of them is left. This is a Jewish commandment. This is an Israeli commandment. This is a historic commandment. And today's pictures are just another reminder of what we must not forget for a single moment: the nature of this deranged enemy. And why they must be wiped off the face of the earth." - Shai Golden, Channel 14 News "Gazans will be concentrated in a very defined area and live as refugees their whole lives without water or electricity until they decide, of their own accord, to emigrate." - Eyal Shalit Snir, Lt. Col. in the Israeli military "Anyone who stays there [in north Gaza] will be judged by law as a terrorist and will go through either a process of starvation or a process of extermination." - Uzy Raby, Professor of Middle Eastern History, Tel Aviv University [Quotes taken from zionism dot observer, a website that aggregates statements from Israeli sources] I think there's a sort of naivete amongst people who don't pay close attention to the realities of Israel's social and political climate, and simply ascribing a sort of ghoulish evil to the vague bloc of 'nationalist' or 'religious' right-wing is simply not true. Genocidal intent permeates every level of Israeli society, from citizenry to the highest decision-making levels of the government, to all strata of the military. Israel is a fascist society and it's plain to see. This is a Pandora's Box that cannot be shut anymore, and people won't magically unsee or forget the horrors that are broadcast on a daily basis on social media. The ghastly accusations of 'Pallywood' don't cut it anymore, either. The sheer speed of information dissemination has ensured that whatever horrors the Palestinians are experiencing the rest of the world sees in real time, as opposed to being memoryholed for 5-10 years, then uncovered in a viral tweet. Now, every airstrike is actually recorded as it happens, alongside its outcome.
- nailer 1y ago[flagged]
- bigyabai 1y ago> why the flagging that probably happened on this post was undone. Likely due to the famine in Gaza.
- Shindi 1y agoRemember that Gaza has the most amputated children per capita in the world. Next time you see a child, you should remember this fact. because Palestinian children aren't this abstract concept, but real people just like the children in our own neighborhoods
- EchoReflection 1y ago[flagged]
- comprev 1y agoGermans would often say _their_ grandparents were never Nazis. Ironically, the same thing will happen in future Israeli generations when they look back at the current genocide - "No, my grandfather wasn't involved in the Gaza war"