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Are such drastic action appropriate given the current state of the US? The US probably hasn't been this economically dominant since after WWII. Feels like Ches
by xnx 2y ago
Are such drastic action appropriate given the current state of the US? The US probably hasn't been this economically dominant since after WWII.
Feels like Chesterton fences are getting torn up left and right by people too young and incurious to possibly understand why those fences might be there.
- derangedHorse 2y agoBy what metric do you think the U.S. is as “economically dominant” as it was in the period after WWII?
- immibis 2y agoMost of the world's currency is backed by the currency they print? The USA has to spend a few cents to gain a hundred dollar bill, but any other country has to exchange a hundred dollars of actual goods and services (to the USA!). Losing this privilege would be devastating.
- curt15 2y agoThe economic power of the US is also largely due to its reputation for rule of law (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o5zaImTF92g https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o5zaImTF92g) when contrasted with other regimes like the CCP. Once that image goes out the window, it becomes no more attractive to foreign investment than any other banana republic run by thugs.
- mystified5016 2y agoSome people in the us government are very afraid of China. Whether that fear is justified is a totally different topic
- psunavy03 2y agoWhy yes, let's let a totalitarian state become a superpower and start dictating the international order. I'm sure Xi Jinping will prove to be just as cuddly as Winnie the Pooh; nothing to worry about here.
- jacobjjacob 2y agoShould we become a totalitarian state in order to compete with another? That feels like McCarthyism/Cold War/ “authoritarianism is fine as long as it isn’t communism” vibes.
- Cthulhu_ 2y agoI can see why one would think that; China is very successful in the world market (or, getting there) despite it not having a free market as such (although it has freed up a lot); despite, or is it because, it being a totalitarian state it is quickly catching up to the US, being the 2nd economy of the world; they still have like $10 trillion to go, but charts like https://www.statista.com/statistics/1070632/gross-domestic-product-gdp-china-us/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/1070632/gross-domestic-p... predict China will overtake the US by 2030 at the current rate. And there's nothing the US can do. Cutting government spending and starting trade wars with neighbours is not going to stop it. Building up a totalitarian state with deep government influence into businesses is not going to work and will be actively resisted, since Big Government is so against the principles of the current regime's voters - and China has been working on this for decades now. Free market won't work either, as it's already very free in the US itself - but the aggression of US companies in their sales practices, tax dodging, and privacy violations have caused their foreign customers like Europe to raise the defenses. TL;DR, while I can see how totalitarianism can in theory create a strong economy, it isn't going to fly / work in the US.
- LastTrain 2y agoSome people can't handle the idea that China has more people and are roughly as resource rich as the US, so if they work hard like we do they will naturally have the bigger economy.
- HotPotato787 2y agoI bet you're from the USA, so this may be hard for you to understand given your context, but as someone from LATAM, let me tell you: China can try really hard to be evil - they will have a LOT of work to be worse than the US.
- KerrAvon 2y agoNo, they are not. This is a bizarre and highly illegal coup by Musk simply because he can, and who's going to enforce the law? Trump's corrupt DOJ?
- electriclove 2y agoCan you explain what is illegal? Aren’t the people that Wired doxxed actually being paid by the government?
- jeffgreco 2y agoNo, they are not actually part of the government, authorized by any act of Congress, nor paid by it.
- derangedHorse 2y agoYes they are. If they are part of DOGE then they are part of the executive office of the President, which would be considered a part of government https://www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-actions/2025/01/establishing-and-implementing-the-presidents-department-of-government-efficiency/ https://www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-actions/2025/01/esta...
- ChicagoDave 2y agoThere is no such thing as DOGE. Any new “construct” and its directives need to be created and funded by Congress. Musk isn’t even legally an employee of the federal government. The President can hire him and Congress could direct him to do what he’s doing, but that step has been skipped. That’s why this is massively illegal
- gowld 2y agohttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_DOGE_Service https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_DOGE_Service https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Department_of_Government_Efficiency https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Department_of_Government_Effic... It's not a legal Department. Trump's team is claiming that anything computerized falls under USDS purview, hence the parasitic hijacking of the US Digital Service.
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- afavour 2y agoNever appropriate. The actions are entirely unconstitutional. If the US decided to disband USAID it would have to be an act of congress, unelected friends of the president don’t come close to being able to make that call.
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- aaomidi 2y agoDoesn’t matter if laws don’t matter and aren’t enforced.
- afavour 2y agoOP asked “is it appropriate”. Will they get away with it? Maybe. But that doesn’t mean it’s appropriate.
- mring33621 2y agowe keep having side debates about 'appropriate', 'ethical', 'traditional', 'conventional', 'legal', 'moral', whatever, but the fact remains that you can do whatever you want, until someone else stops you. No one is stopping the people at the top of the US Government from doing what they want. In fact, there is a whole apparatus in place, at this point, to protect their ability to continue to operate unchecked.
- jimmydddd 2y agoUS National Debt Adds $1 Trillion Every 100 Days.
- skywhopper 2y agoWhat is your point?
- snapcaster 2y agoTheir point (i assume because had same convo with my dad) is that the debt is such an emergency we should toss the rule of law
- intalentive 2y agoSometimes following rules leads to an unrecoverable state, and then you have no choice but to reboot. Compound interest leads to either stagnation and decline, or else to jubilee. It's an inherently unstable system that has felled many civilizations before ours. Debt grows exponentially while real economies saturate in an S-curve. Eventually something has to give.
- tsunamifury 2y agoThis is not that situation, you're been told so so you can give up what little power you have left out of stupidity.
- intalentive 2y agoInterest payments are the largest item of the federal budget. Give it time and they will consume the whole thing.
- mc32 2y agoStop unaudited government spending? Ukraine says it’s received only about half of what the Biden admin said it gave it. It's looking like this was at least larping as a 40+ billion dollar slush fund. There may have been some legitimate (useful) spending, and they will find out after auditing the system, but it also looks like there was lots of waste and once-removed (one degree of separation) self-dealing.
- wetpaws 2y ago[dead]
- nomel 2y ago> Are such drastic action appropriate given the current state of the US? With the debt ceiling ever increasing, approaching a trillion dollars in interest per year, nearing $6k/year per working individual, I would say the correct time to put any effort, whatsoever, into reducing spending, was 20 years ago. I think the fundamental problem is we lack adversarial systems within the government: it doesn't like to hurt itself. Trying to cut jobs/waste/find fraud is political/career suicide for anyone in government. Accountability requires a true adversary/"outsider". Should that be DOGE, or its current implementation? Probably not. Should the adversarial concept of DOGE exist? I would enjoy seeing arguments against the concept. It seems like it's severely needed.
- skywhopper 2y agoYou are way underreacting to what’s going on here. This is not about saving money, or trying to cut waste or fraud. Elon Musk has been posting wild conspiracies on X to justify what he’s doing. But the actual changes are reactionary and political. Accountability is long gone if someone like Elon is in direct charge of what bills get paid. Fraud and waste will skyrocket in these conditions.
- preters 2y agoI am not a fan of Elon, but his companies are run very capital efficient. So why would "fraud and waste" skyrocket under him?
- macintux 2y agoCorruption skyrockets when: - Safety checks are dismantled - Decisions are made at the whim of an executive - Executives surround themselves with sycophants
- throwitaway222 2y agoWe have a worldwide internet service now. We have electric vehicles (something that would not have happened without TSLA) On the other side, the corruption is obvious with billions spent on 8 EV chargers.
- watwut 2y agoIt does not matter. If republican party voters cared about appropriateness, they would not picked up Trump and Musk. They picked them because they wanted to see maximal harm and they see lack of ethics/morals as strength.
- jazz9k 2y agoNo. They want to stop the bleeding from the last 4 years. I blame the person that made the mess. Not the one cleaning it up and showing it to us.
- hsuduebc2 2y agoIf you are bleeding from the wound on your head it does not mean you need to cut off your legs. This is just weakening of state while covering it under this charade. Inflation was because of pandemic and wars. Rest is absolute nonsense.
- jazz9k 2y agoThe Biden administration just had to make things easier for businesses after covid. They had a very easy job and couldn't even get that right. Instead, The biggest oil pipeline in the US was shutdown on day one and increased regulations led to our current situation with inflation. The democrats are also war mongers and want to have perpetual wars to line their pockets. It's telling when there isn't one negative story about Biden/the democrats (especially when we found out they were colluding with big tech to suppress the speech of average citizens) in 4 years, and we immedialy get slop hit piece articles about Trump and Musk.
- riskable 2y agoYou said it! How long before a lot of small countries start leaving treaties like the Berne Convention? Why would they bother protecting other big countries copyrights when they're no longer getting support through programs like USAID and there's no longer any guarantee that the US will protect them in any way. The first country to pull out has the chance to make like $100 billion by creating the next TikTok competitor that never takes down content for violating anyone's copyright. It'll be like Edison moving to Hollywood all over again! Let the gold rush begin!
- rapht 2y agoYou see the carrot vanishing... OK. But what about the stick? The whole point of Trump's policy is 'we forgot the stick, let's use it again'. I see this true for international policy but you could probably extend that to that infamous DOGE: Fed agencies must be 'productive' (whatever that means), or else.
- Dig1t 2y ago[flagged]
- allturtles 2y ago> The founding fathers were all younger than these guys. Haha what? https://www.archives.gov/founding-docs/signers-factsheet https://www.archives.gov/founding-docs/signers-factsheet.
- Dig1t 2y agoYou are correct and I was wrong about the founding fathers. I have updated my comment to say "some of America's greatest leaders". Which is correct.
- JohnnyMarcone 2y agoYou are still linking to a tweet with misinformation.
- tines 2y ago> The founding fathers were all younger than these guys. Who do you consider to be the founding fathers? Franklin was 70 in 1776. Washington was 44. Adams was 40. Jefferson was 36.
- Dig1t 2y agoYou are correct and I was wrong about the founding fathers. I have updated my comment to say "some of America's greatest leaders". Which is correct.
- ambicapter 2y agoYes, you can always make your statement more vague to make it more "correct".
- evanelias 2y ago
- huijzer 2y ago> The US probably hasn't been this economically dominant since after WWII. Where do you base that on? China’s GDP is huge. It overtook the whole EU’s GDP.
- nine_k 2y agoI don't think these fences are being torn down by inexperienced engineers by their own initiative. They have a mandate (or so they think), a direction, and maybe specific orders from much more experienced folks, AFAICT.
- tehjoker 2y agoWhat are you talking about? The whole reason this is happening is because US economic dominance is being eclipsed and dedollarization is occurring at a rapid pace. This is a freak out and reorganization of foreign policy and the economy to cope with that situation.
- TOMDM 2y agoIs there any data you can share that backs that up?
- tehjoker 2y agoUS GDP growth is slow, China's is high and BRICS is coalescing. In not too long, China's GDP will eclipse ours and their cooperative foreign policy as opposed to our full spectrum dominance policy will yield major benefits. Dedollarization is proceeding apace, and it accelerates with each sanction and aggressive and arbitrary move by the US. Other countries used to have no choice, but now choices are opening up. The end of dollar dominance ends the most powerful tool of U.S. hegemony and turns us into a mere great power, not the lord of the world. https://www.jpmorgan.com/insights/global-research/currencies/de-dollarization https://www.jpmorgan.com/insights/global-research/currencies... Trump's policy is about corruption yes, but also likely about wringing more efficiency out of American industry by reducing worker protections and reducing middle management positions. They are trying different methods to juice growth. I don't think it will work for very long.
- iszomer 2y agoSmall twist: Panama "pledged" to exit China's BRI. - https://freebeacon.com/national-security/panama-wont-renew-belt-and-road-agreement-with-china-making-it-first-latin-american-nation-to-leave-initiative/ https://freebeacon.com/national-security/panama-wont-renew-b... - https://ground.news/article/panama-pledges-to-exit-chinas-belt-and-road-initiative-work-with-us-after-rubios-visit_d56e49 https://ground.news/article/panama-pledges-to-exit-chinas-be...
- woopwoop 2y ago
- PeterStuer 2y agoThe US is tethering on the brink of hyperinflation due to not just the last 4 but the last 40 years. Interest on the debt is insurmountable. You can argue whether the chosen approach is right, but no matter what, a drastically different course is needed as 'business as usual' is a sure way to disaster. I for one hope the US get their act together at home rather than dragging the world into WWIII.
- czzr 2y agoYour model for the economy is just utterly wrong. The US is in zero danger of hyperinflation, and probably has the smallest debt issues of any country (certainly of any major country). Now, the problem is - what to do about how badly informed you and millions of Americans are. That you cheer for the destruction of valuable and painfully built state capacity for completely spurious reasons. It’s almost funny, except for all the innocent people who get hurt along the way.
- PeterStuer 2y agoPlease substantiate your claims. I am not 'cheering'. I am 100% prepared to be converted. As I see it that debt counter is compounding fast, and with BRICS gaining steam your abilities to keep shoving it onto the rest of the planet are diminishing.
- czzr 2y agoThe US has debt denominated in its own currency, a large and growing economy, vast natural and human resources, no prospect of a foreign invasion and debt declining relative to GDP the last few years (this last point is not even that important but just for the record). I can’t even begin to tell you how far the US is from hyperinflation or any major debt issues - the only real risk the US faces is internal stupidity (I don’t only mean the current situation, idiocies like the ongoing debt ceiling nonsense apply too). Look, prudence is not a bad thing, and it’s worthwhile to have sensible management. But talk of hyperinflation is either severe mis-calibration of risks, deep misunderstanding of how economies work, or intentional propaganda.
- jjallen 2y agoIs economic dominance the right metric to be looking at? Yes, the US is the biggest economy. This doesn’t mean its ability to pay liabilities is infinite. Every amount of income has a particular amount of debt and interest that it is able to pay. Take the largest company. It would not be able to service infinite debt. Apple could not service $5 trillion in debt, just like the US could not service 300 trillion. I get why some people are concerned about the US’s liabilities and its global police status. Also stopping giving many other countries billions of dollars a year after might be drastic. But I see why some people may not like this. Individuals can give to charities instead if this is really such a problem for them. Now cutting research and other things is really dumb. Glad they reversed that quickly. Also needlessly licking fights with our neighbors is also really dumb. Now only if we can reduce our military spending as well.
- starspangled 2y ago> Are such drastic action appropriate given the current state of the US? The US probably hasn't been this economically dominant since after WWII. Why is USAID needed most in times when the US is very "economically dominant"?
- vkou 2y agoBecause it takes decades of investment and work to build up international trust and soft power, but as it turns out, it takes all of two weeks for a fool to destroy it. Look at how that turned out for Bismark's Germany after he was gone. His successors were high on their own supply, and in pursuit of short-term wins, destroyed the careful network of relationships and alliances that he curated. Beijing is, no doubt, finding this entire folly amusing.
- ahmeneeroe-v2 2y agoUS dominance was built on hard power (war machine). Ditto for Bismarck. Nothing works without the hard power part.
- kazen44 2y agoif you are talking about the formation of germany, That was also a lot of soft power and politics to keep socialists from gaining any real political power and a lot of soft power to get all other german states to form into germany. there where two major wars during that time which mattered for the formation of germany, (the franco prussian war and the austro-prussian war, which was an extent of the politicals about who should form the german state).
- intended 2y agoSo should the world read your comment as a ditching of soft power to use hard power? Is america going to war? Is that why you made that statement in the context of everything that was built on that hard power being demolished?
- 2y ago
- ahmeneeroe-v2 2y ago[flagged]
- doctorpangloss 2y ago> fences are getting torn up left and right by people too young and incurious to possibly understand why those fences might be there. So you're saying they hired a bunch of undistinguished Berkeley drop-outs just because they're libertarians? A sort of affirmative action for libertarians? It's always projection with these guys.
- ahmeneeroe-v2 2y agoIs this really a drastic action? As others in this thread have pointed out, these programs are a single-digit percentage of the Federal budget. We could delete these completely and still have a budget that is 90% the same as last year.
- intended 2y agoWow. That’s a refreshing take on the reducing the corruption angle. If these programs are so small, why aren’t they going after the real grift? It’s too hard? Why the small, more relevant to citizens programs get cut first? Because its easy to avoid the military spending and the black box that represents.
- ahmeneeroe-v2 2y agoMy guess is a few things. First, these are symbolic, it is very hard to concretely argue that these programs are good for Americans, since even proponents of these programs say it's about "soft power". Corollary to this is that cutting something like social security is seen as cutting benefits to Americans (ditto with Defense) Second, these programs are seen as funding "professional democrats" in a way that social security or defense are not. So this is also about cutting out their opponents support structures. If these programs are so small, why do you care so much?
- magicalist 2y ago> If these programs are so small, why do you care so much? Because they help starving children? > First, these are symbolic Are we talking about how USAID worked against apartheid in South Africa now?
- ahmeneeroe-v2 2y ago>starving children The people who put Trump in office want the US Gov to focus on American children
- screye 2y agoUSD as reserve currency is a hen that lays golden eggs. The US maintains monopoly on this free money cheat through goodwill driven manufactured consent, diplomacy, financial bullying and military might. Each subsequent tool being more heavy handed & less preferred than the last. Heavy handed tools while effective, break more than they fix. This prudence sustains Pax Americana. In 2025 America, good will is at an all-time-low. Mechanisms for classical diplomacy are being actively dismantled by Elon-Trump. Financial bullying is now the cudgel of choice. Pax Americana is under threat. Post-WW2 peace is among mankind's most remarkable civilizational achievements. It isn't self-evident and it definitely isn't the historic norm. How long until nations start questioning the deal ? How many decades of work is being dismantled within days ? May be hyperbole, but the locks on Chesterton-Pandora's box are being opened. It might work out, but Elon's aggressiveness seems so unnecessary at a time when the American economy is doing exceedingly well.
- diob 2y agoI'm honestly terrified that they'll turn my savings to some sort of nothing by fucking over our currency. I don't know how anyone isn't.
- akkad33 2y agoThat sounds improbable. If US currency falls every western economy falls with it
- ugexe 2y agoHow does that make it improbable?
- PaulRobinson 2y agoNot true. EUR and GBP will thrive.
- akkad33 2y agoHow? When 2008 crisis happened the whole of west went down with the US
- insane_dreamer 2y agoClosing USAID is idiotic from a foreign policy perspective. Gives China a huge opportunity to fill the void in countries and grow its global influence. It’s already done so in Africa due to US being so preoccupied with the “war on terror”. Not to mention that aiding developing countries - reduces chances of instability/conflicts/etc which otherwise end up costing much more. Plus it’s about access to raw materials (why do you think China cares about Africa?). Idiotic no matter how you look at it.
- nxm 2y agoA lot of what USAID was spending money on would shock people. Meanwhile, no money left to rebuild parts of the US
- insane_dreamer 2y agoOh please enough with the hand wavy bs. Give some examples of how much we are “saving” and what is being cut, and what it will be spent on to “rebuild” America (whatever tf that means). Then we can be the judges of how shocking or not it is.
- hirsin 2y agoHUD and FEMA alone are 2.5x larger than USAID's budget, so while I can't argue with the unsourced bit that it would be shocking, it's clear there is and was even more money being spent on Americans too.
- LastTrain 2y agoFirst, give some examples of what you are talking about. Second, we spend all kinds of money on things I don't agree with, which is how it works.
- refurb 2y agoYou realize USAID has been a conduit for CIA activities pretty much since its establishment? I mean the hint is the fact its head sits on the National Security Council. Why does a friendly aid organization need a seat at that table? USAID played a huge role in the Vietnam War by supporting things like “civil defense forces” arming villages against Viet Cong, land reform and “open arms” program to get defectors from the North. https://www.archives.gov/research/foreign-policy/assistance/vietnam https://www.archives.gov/research/foreign-policy/assistance/... It had little to do with no strings attached foreign aid. It’s mostly been an arm of US covert activities in other countries (providing cover) and a massive, massive slush fund for the CIA (hence the billions going to “undisclosed recipients”).
- TacticalCoder 2y ago[dead]
- bitsage 2y agoThat’s an interesting thought because I saw Trump, and many other elections, as a conservative reaction. A main complaint I see is people thinking the country is going backwards, rather than into uncharted territory.
- naravara 2y agoThe young and incurious have been targeted, recruited, and brainwashed into this by tech moguls for just this reason. A steady diet of calcified resentments against vague, post-modernist buzzword nonsense like “woke” and “DEI” has created a whole political movement around getting unreasonably angry over feeling slighted about symbolic representation in pop culture to the point where they’re going to bring the whole country down it’s insane. But of course, that’s exactly what would be oligarchs want.
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- gauravphoenix 2y ago>The US probably hasn't been this economically dominant since after WWII. now look at the deficits.
- ceejayoz 2y agoWhich are roughly like me having a mortgage that’s the same as my annual salary. Which is quite commonplace. It’d be a problem if we had to pay it all off tomorrow, but we don’t.
- gauravphoenix 2y agodepends on the mortgage if it is fixed or variable. have a look at this: https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/interest-payments-percent-of-revenue-wb-data.html https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/interest-payments... it is like borrowing at higher rate than the rate at which are are growing our income.
- ceejayoz 2y agoCurrent value for that metric is the same as 1985, if you expand the chart.
- gauravphoenix 2y agoabsolutely. and now look at the inflation and fed rate of late 70s and 80s. we have not yet won the inflation war and fed has already paused the rate lowering cycle. so if we need to increase the rate higher to bring inflation down to 2%, imagine the % of debt payment as part of revenue; in 70s/early 80s, the fed rate was as high as 15% compared to 4-5% now. To understand the scale at which we have printed money, analyze the fed balance sheet https://www.federalreserve.gov/monetarypolicy/bst_recenttrends.htm https://www.federalreserve.gov/monetarypolicy/bst_recenttren...
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- ggddv 2y agoChesterton fence == I don’t have an argument but I do have a fence and you don’t, so I guess somebody should have learnt their lesson!
- elzbardico 2y ago>> The US probably hasn't been this economically dominant since after WWII. In which parallel reality do you live? Some metrics: - U.S. share of global GDP (nominal). 40% in 1960 to around 24% nowadays. - Share of global exports from the peak of 17% in 1963, to around 8.5% today (China is 14%). - Global R&D expending from the 1960 peak of 69% to 30% today with China closing the gap currently at 23%. - Reserve currency status of the Dollar dropped from 71% to 59%. - Share of outward Foreign Direct Investment (FDI) 47% in 1960 vs 22% in 2022. Even the strongest selling point of the american economy of being the largest consumer economy is strongly dependent on high levels of consumer debt as well as the ability to sustain gigantic trade deficits based on the global appetite for the dollar and US bonds. And then we have some other points of concern: In 1950, manufacturing represented 28% of GDP, while FIRE was 10%. Today, manufacturing is 10%, and FIRE is 20%. FIRE’s dominance reflects financialization — prioritizing short-term profit through financial engineering over productive, long-term investment. It encourages Rent-Seeking vs Productive Activity, for example, in Finance, much of the sector’s growth comes from fees, interest, and speculative trading (e.g., derivatives, high-frequency trading) rather than financing innovation or infrastructure. In Real Estate Rising prices often reflect speculation rather than new construction or improved living standards. This leads to inequality amplification, FIRE disproportionately benefits high-income earners (e.g., Wall Street, landlords). The top 1% owns 53% of stocks and 40% of real estate wealth (Fed data), which exacerbates wealth gaps without broadly improving household economic security. Real Estate alone now accounts for ~60% of corporate profits, something that create obvious systemic risks. The US is still the richest and most powerful country in the world, but it is far from being as economically dominant as it was in the past, exactly the contrary of what you said. I understand that after the gains we all had in the stock market in recent times, we might be tempted to consider this as a measure of the health of American Economy and considering market capitalizations, its global dominance. But that is a mistake. Stock Prices reflect investor sentiment, not fundamentals, they are driven by factors like speculation, liquidity and future expectations, not direct economic performance. Also, a handful of mega-cap companies dominate indexes, which introduces a lag that could mask broader economic issues. For example, the "Magnificent Seven" drove around 75% of the S&P 2023 gains, while small-cap stocks lagged. Also, tech and finance dominate markets, but they are not labor intensive, and thus they can't contribute as much to employment. Also, as the top 10% of the households own almost 90% of stocks, rising markets enrich the wealthy but don't reflect wage growth or living standards. Also, a lot of the stock market exhuberance has been driven by things like stock buybacks, inflating share prices at the expense of investment and wages.
- jmyeet 2y agoI'm not sure why people are focusing on the engineers here. The fish rots from the head. Elon is the definition of Dunning-Kruger. He seems smart (maybe) when he's talking about something you know nothing about but as soon as he talks about something you do know about, the illusion quickly shatters. Many here learned this after the Twitter takeover when he started talking about software and technical infrastructure. The only thing going on here is some performative cuts to mollify the base and make some headlines. The real goal here is looting the public purse for the (further) benefit of the ultra-wealthy. Welcome to the kleptocracy.
- nxobject 2y agoIt’s the definition of failing up: you sin bullshit for long enough, and make big enough changes, that you get your next job before you’re accountable for the consequences.
- coldtea 2y agoIf it's at some economic dominance peak is at the point at the top of an upward curve, when the acceleration has ended and the object reaches 0 velocity before coming back. It's a downward trajectory: public debt, failing infrastructure, failing manufacturing capabilities, failing leadership, failing rule of law, increased irrelevance on the world stage, and let's not get started with the culture. If the dollar falls further from being the global reserve currency (something which both administrations did their best to ensure it will happen) that will be an even worse blow. That there are people in bubbles believing it's all fine, or they never been better, is also a contributing factor to all this.
- karuselli 2y agoAgreed - it’s arguably as much a risk-on behavior as the excessive spending they’re warning about. They are using a similar cut-first mentality to what has been done in the private sector, but in the govt there are more considerations than the direct economic impacts of the actions. In an ideal world the better route is likely to spend more time on analysis before making cuts and to try and reduce variance, but it’s fair to say that might impede the initiative entirely plus they are trying to act quickly before the opposition wakes up.
- nxobject 2y agoOr, for that matter, before the judiciary can act as a balance. Establishing “facts on the ground”.
- almostdeadguy 2y agoYoung, inexperienced people have a hard time saying “no”. It’s even harder when working 120 hour weeks where you have less than 7 hours a day outside work (not even enough to get a full nights rest): https://www.businessinsider.com/elon-musk-doge-work-silicon-vallery-grind-culture-2025-2 https://www.businessinsider.com/elon-musk-doge-work-silicon-... Sleep deprivation, stress and overwork, controlling the lives of participants, targeting at risk populations, etc. are cult programming techniques.
- UltraSane 2y agoThis is actually curtis yarvin's RAGE (retire all government employees) concept. Curtis Yarvin, an extreme right-wing tech person out of Silicon Valley and the person who JD Vance is a disciple of. Their belief is that the U.S. government itself “must be deleted” and that what the country needs is not a president but a dictator, which is what a CEO of any successful corporation actually is. Yarvin said that the American people “must get over their ‘dictator phobia’” while Vance says we have to do things that make even conservatives “uncomfortable.”
- hsuduebc2 2y agoIt's just big tech weakening the power of state. The economics incentive is just a cover up for masses and politicians.
- templeOSdotcom 2y agoThe U.S. national debt has been increasing at a rate of approximately $1 trillion every 100 days, which equates to about 10 days to add $100 billion. When do we hit the panic button?
- lostdog 2y agoTrump's first term is responsible for a large portion of the debt. He should take accountability and step down.
- elif 2y agoI think assuming that their intentions are a well functioning economy have been disproven by the rapid pace of kicking pillars out from under it. Occams razor would instead suggest that either a recession or some other form of social instability is not an externality but an objective. It makes me scared for what the ultimate aim is, but I think at this point it's beyond giving him the benefit of the doubt.
- jasondigitized 2y agoI was literally going to quote Chesterson's fence. How are people this smart and also this dumb?
- paganel 2y ago> The US probably hasn't been this economically dominant since after WWII. That may be true if you look at the US in isolation, they're much richer now compared to 1950, but they've never had a strong a contender as China is right now. The Soviets were matching them militarily back in the Cold War years but they were never close to surpass them economically, like China is now in the process of doing.
- sanktanglia 2y agoThe US weathered the recession better than nearly any developed nation so the idea that we aren't economically dominant is hilarious
- Gothmog69 2y agoThe guy who deciphered an ancient scroll destroyed by a volcano is too incurious to possibly understand things unlike the amazing geniuses who fund DEi operas in Peru