12 ms·

My Steam Game Revenue Stats

258 points by donislawdev 5y ago

arnaudsm 5y ago
I fell bad for all the awesome indie devs out there now that the market is saturated. I remember the early days of Steam and Android when low quality asset flips would make $10k easily. New niches appear every year though, like the VR market that's desperate for content.
- donislawdev 5y ago
  Adapt or Die :-} That's how it works, I just accept it.
evo_9 5y ago
"In terms of cash, it was not worth it, if we count costs (without time) + taxes, then the “earnings” from those $632 will be lower than 0. I had lost the cash, the first month is mostly the “best” month of sales, so my next month’s sales will be worse and worse, maybe a few % of my first month. Someone might be curious why I’m still keeping early access, working on the game, to be honest, I don’t believe in some magic “boom” and millions of players, I’m just fixing bugs, adding new things because… People have paid for the game :-} I could drop it because Yerba Mate Tycoon generated cash loss (working more on it, generate bigger losses). But people paid for it, it got some players, so I will work on it :-} I know that some developers drop in that situations game, it’s a logical step from a business side, but it’s against my work ethic. I never promised huge things, but I have to finish what I started."
- jay_kyburz 5y ago
  You can't really make a super niche game and expect it to sell well. Nobody knows what Yerba Mate is. Nobody is searching for Yerba Mate. Also, the video is funny, but it really doesn't tell us anything about what you do. It doesn't show us the consequences of any of your decisions. Anyhow, I wish the developer all the best. I hope sales to pick up and that they enjoyed making the game.
  - vincentpants 5y ago
    I know what Yerba Mate is, I’m even drinking some now! I even managed to start a Yerba Mate scene at my old work. And considering how many dev stations have gourds among their vinyl toy collection makes me think there were a bunch of Canadian video game developers googling Yerba Mate at some point. I imagine this game can do well with a little bit of niche online community spelunking. We’re out there!
    - Krasnol 5y ago
      > Yerba Mate scene How did such a scene work? Did you have get togethers to talk about your Yerba Mate experiences? Are there Yearba Mate VIPs you worship together? Did you have Yerba Mate merchandise?
      - krustyburger 5y ago
        His scene seems to have attracted a sardonic detractor, so I’m inclined to believe it actually is real.
    - jay_kyburz 5y ago
      Perhaps the developer is just a but too ahead of the curve. In a few years time the game could huge. Also, I wonder how many people knew what spelunking was before Spelunky!
  - hn_throwaway_99 5y ago
    > Nobody knows what Yerba Mate is. I think it may depend on your region. Obviously it is very well known in South America (I first became acquainted with it about 25 years ago after being friends with someone from South America who drank tereré, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terer%C3%A9 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terer%C3%A9, all the time), but now I see these, https://guayaki.com/our-product-family/ https://guayaki.com/our-product-family/, all over Whole Foods in Texas, so somebody must be drinking them here.
  - ehnto 5y ago
    He mentions knowing about regional popularity of Yerba Mate, I think he was fully content with making a niche game for specific areas.
- bemmu 5y ago
  This type of niche game might actually be the exception where long-term sales are more than the initial sales. I would rather own this game than yet another clone of some overdone theme with similar sales up to this point. Some reasons: * If anyone were to search for such a game, this will be the top result by default, so there might be a trickle of sales over time that just doesn't stop. * This game may trend on some relevant subreddit/twitter clique/forum and get later sales boosts from that. * If you have a Yerba Mate blog or podcast, this is basically the only game you can even feature if you wanted to talk about something new. My next step would be to make a spreadsheet of anything Yerba Mate -related that could possibly feature the game and contact them all.
Tarsul 5y ago
As far as I know we users cannot see how many sales a game has from steam, so I very much appreciate the creator telling us. I often try to judge from the number of reviews if a game has made at least a few thousand bucks. This game here has 19 reviews with 420 sales, which means that 4,5% of all people have reviewed the game, which is more than I expected (I expected a ratio of about 1%). But this means that probably other games that have only a few dozen reviews have sold comparably (poorly). As an aside, me personally, I don't like early access games; I'd rather wait till the game is finished. I'm probably not the only one thinking like that. So I find it difficult to guess how different the sales projectory would be if it didn't have the "early access" status, but with any luck the creator will tell us once he has released V1.0 :)
- jonshariat 5y ago
  When I wrote my book, they did an early access thing at it was terrible. I was still understanding where to take my book and iterate and I was getting people telling me it sucked. Uh ya, its not finished at all yet, just v1! Not a fan. I mean I get Betas and access to things say a month or so before launch. But not during active development.
  - Hammershaft 5y ago
    I mean, a book is a predefined narrative that you experience once sequentially! Much less suited to open iterative development than a game.
    - Godel_unicode 5y ago
      There are other kinds of book than fiction.
  - bavell 5y ago
    Why did you agree to try early access with a book? It only really makes sense for games... and sometimes not even then...
    - 5y ago
flaque 5y ago
There's an interesting GDC talk about this for folks who are curious: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WycVOCbeKqQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WycVOCbeKqQ
- donislawdev 5y ago
  GDC talks are great, tons of interesting information.
cinntaile 5y ago
Why do you want to make an iOS/Android version when the game isn't very popular right now? You mention the competition will be a lot higher so why do you think it will be worth it?
- donislawdev 5y ago
  Just interested in it, I can gain this way experiences in releasing paid game on Android/IOS. From other side t's a lot harder (crowd market), for other there are not many paid tycoons, real tycoons games + a lot of players asked about mobile version.
hsbauauvhabzb 5y ago
Don’t downplay the value to you in fixing bugs, customer support etc. you’ll be better equipped when you release a title that is successful.
- imtringued 5y ago
  It's also easy to burn bridges by canceling early access games. The vast majority of people should stay away from early access games by default because of the risk that the game remains unfinished.
  - paulryanrogers 5y ago
    Perhaps there is a better name for what these projects are: "experimental" or "exploratory" access. Something that doesn't so strongly imply their will be a later or finished state.
  - shagie 5y ago
    I've got a few "early access" games where the developer lost interest or disappeared. Most infamously Starbase DF-9, but I've got a handful of other games in my library. Now, I'll wishlist them rather than impulse buy them and then reconsider it when it comes out of early access.
- donislawdev 5y ago
  I got a respect to players cash :-} I know
thrdbndndn 5y ago
>the first month of Steam early access (15.06 to 15.07 June/July) This is very confusing
- yreg 5y ago
  How is it confusing? 15th of June to 15th of July.
  - Andrew_nenakhov 5y ago
    People in some countries are accustomed to using a very weird mm/dd date format, probably that's the case here?
    - Dylan16807 5y ago
      Month day is not weird. You should have mentioned something actually bad like month day year.
    - Quarrelsome 5y ago
      yyyy/mm/dd is the true format because its alphabetically sortable. dd/mm/yyyy is another sensible format because the units grow in size. mm/dd/yyyy is the insane one. Idk why the US persists with it tbh.
      - MattRix 5y ago
        It has flaws but it’s not “insane” or entirely illogical, it’s very clearly based on the way dates are spoken and written in English, ex. “Today is July 23rd, 2021”.
        speedgoose 5y ago
        It's not insane, but it's not very logical. As a non native speaker, I prefer to say "Today is the 23rd of July in 2021" which is perhaps not valid English.
techrat 5y ago
The game is far, far too much of a niche style game for it to even be all that popular, IMHO. I'm not quite sure what the Dev here expected to happen. It's also Early Access and it's fair to say that unless a game has broad appeal (which shop simulators don't) and hype (definitely not in this case), people tend to stay away from Early Access games from unknown developers with insubstantial catalogs. I know I do, been burned enough times. I'm not saying 'feel bad', here... more along the lines of 'lower your expectations'. Unless you have a big publishing house backing you, marketing money being spent, your first title isn't going to be profitable... and that's before you consider the type of game it is.
- robertlagrant 5y ago
  Annoyingly, the dev time travelled back and incorporated all that into their original article. I think they did it just to make your advice look pointless.
- ManBlanket 5y ago
  He could yet get another bump in sales from a 1.0 release, but you're right the stars are just not aligned to make Yerba Mate Tycoon an indie smash. This was not necessarily a story of loss though. Taking a project all the way to release is a feat, and his attitude toward finishing the game, not to mention supporting it after release is commendable. All this seems like it helps position the developer to solicit publishers for future projects, convince others to work with him, and even help sway potential buyers of future projects. Not to mention it's a critical learning experience, feedback like yours is very helpful. All things considered pretty successful for a first game. This dude definitely has the potential to turn a profit in the future.
  - tekromancr 5y ago
    Tenth game, according to the post
    - cmeacham98 5y ago
      I believe it is his 10th _attempt_ at a game but 1st finished/published game. The author at least has no other games published on steam.
bogwog 5y ago
> At launch, I was selling my game for $3.5 (10% discount), then the price went back to the full price of $4. Why would you launch with a discount?
- avereveard 5y ago
  It has become customary for early access titles to have an early bird discount
- jmd42 5y ago
  Drive day 1 sales, increasing your chance of getting featured as a "hot new release", increasing visibility and trying to ride the recommendation algorithm.
- WhiteNoiz3 5y ago
  Sadly Steam encourages everyone to do this - if you don't get high enough in the rankings at launch you basically won't make any money, plus everyone on Steam is super accustomed to getting everything at a discount.
- donislawdev 5y ago
  Special price for first EA (early access) customers. Steam recommend 10% discount.
pengaru 5y ago
The market is far too crowded to rely entirely on the steam store for your exposure. I'd like to know what the numbers are like for indie devs with their own twitch channel who constantly stream the development process, establishing a fan base throughout the year(s) of development before releasing on steam.
- pjmlp 5y ago
  The market has always been too crowded, unless we are talking about the early Atari 2600 days. Being a game dev is akin to music, acting, whatever arts related. It will cost blood, sweets and tears, full of ups and downs, and only an handful will manage to keep going at it their whole life. Just like other arts, it doesn't mean people just give up, rather be aware it isn't just because they like playing on their games console every single day, that they will make it on the industry.
- jmd42 5y ago
  Getting visibility within Steam itself is still probably the most effective way of increasing sales numbers - generally being featured/recommended within the platform is profoundly more effective than more organic marketing efforts (unless you really go viral on social media, for example). Discoverability and viewership numbers for game dev streamers on Twitch are really poor. Of course it can have value as a marketing initiative, but you can also grind that for months / years without seeing a significant effect on sales - the return on time investment is probably not great. Whereas getting onto the front page of Steam (as part of some seasonal event, for example) can do more for you in a single day than months/years of streaming or social media.
  - pengaru 5y ago
    I wasn't clear enough in my comment; it's to crowded to just toss your game on the Steam store and expect it to magically generate worthwhile sales. You're entirely correct about being featured/recommended, and there are ways to game the platform at your release to amplify these effects. But my basic point stands; you can't just toss a game on Steam and expect good results. Between the low barrier to entry on the store ($100) and engines like unity/gamemaker enabling basically anyone to have something to toss on the store, it's overflowing with shovelware. How many reskinned game engine tutorials alone are out there for sale as games? It's a complete mess.
willcipriano 5y ago
> Features: > New update = new bugs > Poor graphic and sounds I have to say the first two "features" aren't doing you any favors. https://store.steampowered.com/app/1404560/Yerba_Mate_Tycoon/ https://store.steampowered.com/app/1404560/Yerba_Mate_Tycoon...
- istorical 5y ago
  It's a joke. Not sure if that's immediately obvious to you (it's Hacker News).
  - throwuxiytayq 5y ago
    Still, as a potential customer, I don't find it very encouraging. You don't see jokes like these for products that don't have bugs or do have decent graphics. Not a very good idea to draw attention to your shortcomings, even if they're expected.
    - user5994461 5y ago
      +1 The joke is misplaced. It has nothing to do in the official description of the game, among the first lines read by customers. Personally I thought this was some sort of typo or weird expression, because the developer doesn't write English well.
- donislawdev 5y ago
  I'm honest person :-} Irony/Joke is a strong weapon in marketing.
- cdmoyer 5y ago
  Honestly, those make me want to buy it. Refreshing honest. I don't think the market here is people that'll be put off by that.
atum47 5y ago
Congratulations on commercializing the game. Are you a one person operation? I know how hard can it be to develop, publish, deal with game stores... This is a great deal that you were able to launch and sell. Kudos
- donislawdev 5y ago
  22-year-old solo developer from Poland :-} One-man team.
dzonga 5y ago
one thing, to applaud the author is they have the right attitude. when launching internet products, don't expect them to make money. that liberates you from all sort of problems and stress.
gcampos 5y ago
I don’t think the problem is that the game is a niche game, there are ways to break even with niche games and just copying what everyone else is doing is not exactly a receipt for success. In my opinion these is what OP could have done differently: - The game lacks (an obvious) unique hook. Just replacing coffee with mate is not enough of a hook for me, and I was raised in a family that drinks Chimarrão. - $5 is too cheap for a niche game. I think would help a lot if you check the Jeff Vogel advices on creating and marketing niche games. He has a lot insight on creating games that only a tiny amount of people want
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
fouc 5y ago
Incredible progress he's making. Ten "failures" that he's learned tons from. He's going to be hugely successful if he keeps this up!
- AussieWog93 5y ago
  Sarcasm?
  - adenozine 5y ago
    Can't speak for parent commenter, but there is a nugget of supreme wisdom in the remark nonetheless. Gamedev is notoriously punishing and mentally grueling. Pushing through these roadblock moments CAN lead to huge runaway successes if the market timing is right. I'm in a field in no way orthogonal to gaming, but I can attest myself that pushing though the moments I -wanted- to quit the most, were the moments that yielded the most amount of advantage to me. I knew I could go further, work harder, learn to be smarter, because I knew that I had persevered where most others would've called it quits. Hopefully that's what they mean.
    - AussieWog93 5y ago
      I've heard this before, mainly from "hustle culture" folks, but have never witnessed it in real life. I've followed quite a few people, both online and IRL, who have persevered through repeated failure, motivated by "passion" and convinced that success was around the corner. Almost none of them achieved success. Instead, they ended up burned, jaded and in a few cases even genuinely suicidal. As someone else mentioned in the thread, the kid is clearly talented. He has released 10 games on five different platforms at age 22 with no assistance whatsoever. That is genuinely exceptional, and he is without doubt in the top 10% of game dev grads. I'm not arguing that you should quit after one attempt either (even successful designers fail maybe 50% of the time) but it seems irresponsible to suggest 10 failures in a row are a sign of success to come and he just needs to eat shit for the next 5 years. Far more likely than not, the repeated failures suggest that his talents would be better applied elsewhere.
z3t4 5y ago
In this day and age having over 400 actually paying customers is a lot! Even having 400 free users would be a lot. Now the question is - do they play the game ? Any number above 1% is good, so if there are 4 players spending a lot of time - it's a good sign. If possible ask them what they think is good about it, then update the marketing material to showcase what is good about the game.
- georgeecollins 5y ago
  I agree. And actually shipping a game that anyone will pay for puts you in very rare territory. The world is full of game designer wannabes.
  - Karsteski 5y ago
    Why are they wannabes? I don't understand why you would insult people who are trying to put out a product but failing.
    - judge2020 5y ago
      There's a lot of low-quality Unity games on Steam, largely because they automated the new game system so that all it takes to publish a game is paying $100. There are some legitimate game designers putting in effort, but some 'publishers' have hundreds of these games and are often just copies of each other but with different assets.
      - squeaky-clean 5y ago
        For anyone doubting how simple this is, you can buy entirely pre-made games and template games in the Unity Asset Store for anywhere from $25-$500 depending on how polished the asset is.
        moepstar 5y ago
        ...and then, something like this [0] happens: 1) create overpromising marketing campaign/kickstarter for a MMO 2) slap together some random assets 3) ??? 4) receive VC 5) profit.. [0] https://www.pcgamer.com/dreamworld-infinite-world-mmo-kickstarter-fiasco/ https://www.pcgamer.com/dreamworld-infinite-world-mmo-kickst...
bschwindHN 5y ago
400 sales is quite a lot actually! Going in with low expectations and achieving that number, honestly I would be proud.
WhompingWindows 5y ago
You might be able to go to those users who do like it, add features they want in DLCs and such. Could be a fun endeavor for a side-gig over time.
10x-dev 5y ago
My sincere congratulations to you on actually publishing your game and having players.
- donislawdev 5y ago
  Thank you a lot :-}
nazrulmum10 5y ago
You can buy Yerba Mate Tycoon
sillysaurusx 5y ago
I threw $5 your way because I wanted to support you. That said, some feedback: 1. The price is too high. I'm sorry, I know this sounds cheap at $5. But you're competing with the entire world of iOS games. For free, I can get endless kinds of games like this, but with in game purchases. Some of those, like Cardinal Quest 2, are actually amazing and the ingame purchases don't get in the way at all. I think if you priced it at $2 you might get more revenue in the long run. 2. I don't know what the hell a Yerba Mate is. It does say in the description that it's some kind of coffee, but I honestly had to force myself to buy this. I'd rather buy a coffee than a game about coffee. I feel guilty saying these things, because I don't know if my feelings here are representative or not. Maybe a lot of people feel that $5 is the right price point and that a game about coffee management is compelling. Either way, I want to support gamedevs, so I might try playing this just for kicks.
- Strom 5y ago
  > But you're competing with the entire world of iOS games. I am not convinced these are overlapping markets. The Venn diagram probably looks pretty close to two independent circles. I play games on Steam and also own an iPhone. I never play anything on my phone, because it's a completely different experience. I think PC games and iOS games are both games in the same way as PC games and hide&seek are both games. That is to say we use the same term for them, but they're not at all the same in regards to what I'm looking for. It's not just me either. This line of separation exists in my whole social circle as far as I can tell. None of my PC gaming buddies play mobile games and everyone I know that plays mobile games don't play PC games.
  - oefrha 5y ago
    As someone who has made a fair bit more in donations than OP just from building community tools for a reasonably popular mobile game (still peanuts compared to the time poured in though), I probably have a bit more anecdata to draw from. In my experience, a not insignificant percentage of avid players of said mobile game active on Discord are also players of PC/console titles. These players may not represent the mobile game market at large, but they are overwhelmingly moderate to big spenders compared to the F2P crowd out there, so I’d say they are a good representation of a slice of the more valuable market segment. So, yes, there’s an overlap, and I imagine “Yerba Mate Tycoon”’s addressable PC market would be even more likely to play a comparable mobile game than the average AAA action/shooter/etc. market.
minimize 5y ago
Not sure if it has been mentioned yet, but I think the main reason why this title failed is the title. Most people probably never heard of "yerba mate", so to them, the title sounds like some kind of weird mating simulator. You can verify this by comparing the sales by country to the number of searches for the term "yerba mate" by country: https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?q=yerba%20mate https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?q=yerba%20mate The distributions are very similar.
- donislawdev 5y ago
  Niche genre :-} I know that the game will fail (before release), it's not problem for me :-}
DaveSapien 5y ago
These numbers are actually promising. 400 sales in early access for a 'niche' game would open the door for a few publishers out there. And as it stands this game has momentum behind it, NOT an easy thing to accomplish. And further more, the steam page has quite a few problems that are easily fixed and would drives sales in a positive direction. Add some streamer outreach to the mix and this could do well enough to fund their next game. Just perhaps not well enough to satisfy the developers ambitions. Yet. I would love to have this momentum on my own (very) niche game. Its is also on early access, interesting premise, zero marketing budget, and so on. Its numbers are nowhere near as promising as Yerba Mate Tycoon. Its a rare thing to click with an audience and YMT has done so. To the Developer, keep going. Keep that mindset of honouring your customers its rare in games and of value to the gamers. Spend more time on you store page and promoting, and release it. It will be worth it.
- zone411 5y ago
  Use the opportunity and link us to your game. I don't think anybody will mind.
  - DaveSapien 5y ago
    Thanks, I don't want to seem like I'm shilling with any of my comments. This is Kanso, a relaxing game that invites the player to slowdown and find a moment of Zen: https://store.steampowered.com/app/1454650/Kanso/ https://store.steampowered.com/app/1454650/Kanso/
    - hendi_ 5y ago
      This looks great, will buy once I'm back at my PC :-)
      - DaveSapien 5y ago
        Oh wow, thank you very much. If you have any feedback, I'd very much like to hear it.
    - 5y ago
nix23 5y ago
It's an early access game, like many...i never buy a EA game, too many disappointment's.
- donislawdev 5y ago
  Yep, agree
hnarn 5y ago
I believe pricing is one of the most important decisions any business can make, and $5 does not make any sense to me. You're probably betting that this is a niche game that likely will take you more time than its worth in sales: in that case, you need to increase the price as much as you can without it looking absurd in comparison to triple A titles, so maybe $30 or so. If not much happens, you accept that there is no way any meaningful number of people will be interested in this game for the price of a steak dinner, so you go for the "penny crowd" instead: sell the game for $1 during a steam sale and get free attention from a >95% discount. Ideally you can spend this in-between time fixing some bugs and just keeping the game "alive" so it doesn't look like a complete cash grab, but on the other hand you should never feel obligated to put your time into something that isn't, and likely never will, be paying you back.
- user5994461 5y ago
  If the game can reach something like the other simple Tycoon games, it can probably sell for around $20. But definitely not in early access and definitely not until it reaches similar quality/content. If one tries to make a money grab as you suggest, gamers will obliterate the game with bad reviews. A few bad reviews and the game is doomed forever.
Ostrogodsky 5y ago
Congrats! You are doing fantastic. Thousands of debbie downers here, pay absolutely no attention to them. Keep doing what you like, strengthen yourself physically and mentally and if you need to have a second job while you get your first break-away success so be it. Just a small correction, "Yerba mate" is not the "coffee of south-america" Coffee is the coffee of south america,i.e. by far is a more popular drink. Mate is huge in Argentina/Uruguay and perhaps Paraguay , only regionally in Brazil and very niche everywhere else in the region. Coffee is as popular as it can be everywhere else in the world where the drink is liked.
- raverbashing 5y ago
  Your advice is on point Yerba matte is also popular in Germany (as in, "Club-Mate") so maybe OP can try some advertising there ;)
WastingMyTime89 5y ago
The game sounds interesting and you seem to have great work ethics. You seem to have a marketing issue however. For a game, marketing is really important. I'm not extremely knowledgeable in the indie game business but as you seem to have a positive track record, getting a publisher might help you.
flak48 5y ago
The synthesized speech in the video seems pretty realistic - does anyone know which software was used?
- donislawdev 5y ago
  It's human speech, not software :-}
kimopertonau 5y ago
Coincidentally, just three months ago I began drinking yerba mate[0] which is the tea or infusion in this game Yerba Mate Tycoon. I found it better than coffee in the afternoon, since it provides a slower onset and more sustained energizing effect with essentially no crash. I believe it’s due to it containing other compounds such as L-theanine apart from caffeine. Popular brands are Taragüi[1] and Canarias, and can be prepared in a standard French press almost like tea. Some even drink it in teabags[2]. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mate_(drink) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mate_(drink) [1] https://pampadirect.com/taragui-yerba-mate-classic-flavor-con-palo-with-stems-from-las-marias-500-g-1-1-lb/ https://pampadirect.com/taragui-yerba-mate-classic-flavor-co... [2] https://pampadirect.com/taragui-mate-cocido-ready-to-brew-yerba-mate-bags-box-of-25-bags/ https://pampadirect.com/taragui-mate-cocido-ready-to-brew-ye...
DeathMetal3000 5y ago
Having a Polish developer create a game around a South American drink really shows the power of cross-cultural spread of the internet. Love it!
JoeDaDude 5y ago
Dumb but honest question: If most sales were expected to be in Latin America, why wasn't the game localized in the Spanish language?
- donislawdev 5y ago
  Good question, no budget for it, for localization I would pay $2000-$5000+ or even more. There are tons of words. If on launch I was selling the game (Argentina) for $0.5, like 30% of that goes to me, so $0.15. Then for the pay of localization I would need to sell 13k-60k copies in Argentina. No chances. 13k copies just for paying for localization or even more copies. Even big indie games don't pay for localizations, it's not worth it, selling 13-60k copies in xx country is hard. Right now, the game is translated in 70% to Spanish by community. I know indie games that earned millions of cash, but still, they rely on the community translations.
  - JoeDaDude 5y ago
    I'd like to continue this discussion. Can you please e-mail me at the address in my profile? Thanks!

258 points by donislawdev 5y ago

I fell bad for all the awesome indie devs out there now that the market is saturated. I remember the early days of Steam and Android when low quality asset flips would make $10k easily. New niches appear every year though, like the VR market that's desperate for content.

donislawdev 5y ago
Adapt or Die :-} That's how it works, I just accept it.

evo_9 5y ago

"In terms of cash, it was not worth it, if we count costs (without time) + taxes, then the “earnings” from those $632 will be lower than 0. I had lost the cash, the first month is mostly the “best” month of sales, so my next month’s sales will be worse and worse, maybe a few % of my first month. Someone might be curious why I’m still keeping early access, working on the game, to be honest, I don’t believe in some magic “boom” and millions of players, I’m just fixing bugs, adding new things because… People have paid for the game :-} I could drop it because Yerba Mate Tycoon generated cash loss (working more on it, generate bigger losses). But people paid for it, it got some players, so I will work on it :-} I know that some developers drop in that situations game, it’s a logical step from a business side, but it’s against my work ethic. I never promised huge things, but I have to finish what I started."

jay_kyburz 5y ago
You can't really make a super niche game and expect it to sell well. Nobody knows what Yerba Mate is. Nobody is searching for Yerba Mate. Also, the video is funny, but it really doesn't tell us anything about what you do. It doesn't show us the consequences of any of your decisions. Anyhow, I wish the developer all the best. I hope sales to pick up and that they enjoyed making the game.
- vincentpants 5y ago
  I know what Yerba Mate is, I’m even drinking some now! I even managed to start a Yerba Mate scene at my old work. And considering how many dev stations have gourds among their vinyl toy collection makes me think there were a bunch of Canadian video game developers googling Yerba Mate at some point. I imagine this game can do well with a little bit of niche online community spelunking. We’re out there!
  - Krasnol 5y ago
    > Yerba Mate scene How did such a scene work? Did you have get togethers to talk about your Yerba Mate experiences? Are there Yearba Mate VIPs you worship together? Did you have Yerba Mate merchandise?
    - krustyburger 5y ago
      His scene seems to have attracted a sardonic detractor, so I’m inclined to believe it actually is real.
  - jay_kyburz 5y ago
    Perhaps the developer is just a but too ahead of the curve. In a few years time the game could huge. Also, I wonder how many people knew what spelunking was before Spelunky!
- hn_throwaway_99 5y ago
  > Nobody knows what Yerba Mate is. I think it may depend on your region. Obviously it is very well known in South America (I first became acquainted with it about 25 years ago after being friends with someone from South America who drank tereré, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terer%C3%A9 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terer%C3%A9, all the time), but now I see these, https://guayaki.com/our-product-family/ https://guayaki.com/our-product-family/, all over Whole Foods in Texas, so somebody must be drinking them here.
- ehnto 5y ago
  He mentions knowing about regional popularity of Yerba Mate, I think he was fully content with making a niche game for specific areas.
bemmu 5y ago
This type of niche game might actually be the exception where long-term sales are more than the initial sales. I would rather own this game than yet another clone of some overdone theme with similar sales up to this point. Some reasons: * If anyone were to search for such a game, this will be the top result by default, so there might be a trickle of sales over time that just doesn't stop. * This game may trend on some relevant subreddit/twitter clique/forum and get later sales boosts from that. * If you have a Yerba Mate blog or podcast, this is basically the only game you can even feature if you wanted to talk about something new. My next step would be to make a spreadsheet of anything Yerba Mate -related that could possibly feature the game and contact them all.

Tarsul 5y ago

As far as I know we users cannot see how many sales a game has from steam, so I very much appreciate the creator telling us. I often try to judge from the number of reviews if a game has made at least a few thousand bucks. This game here has 19 reviews with 420 sales, which means that 4,5% of all people have reviewed the game, which is more than I expected (I expected a ratio of about 1%). But this means that probably other games that have only a few dozen reviews have sold comparably (poorly). As an aside, me personally, I don't like early access games; I'd rather wait till the game is finished. I'm probably not the only one thinking like that. So I find it difficult to guess how different the sales projectory would be if it didn't have the "early access" status, but with any luck the creator will tell us once he has released V1.0 :)

jonshariat 5y ago
When I wrote my book, they did an early access thing at it was terrible. I was still understanding where to take my book and iterate and I was getting people telling me it sucked. Uh ya, its not finished at all yet, just v1! Not a fan. I mean I get Betas and access to things say a month or so before launch. But not during active development.
- Hammershaft 5y ago
  I mean, a book is a predefined narrative that you experience once sequentially! Much less suited to open iterative development than a game.
  - Godel_unicode 5y ago
    There are other kinds of book than fiction.
- bavell 5y ago
  Why did you agree to try early access with a book? It only really makes sense for games... and sometimes not even then...
  - 5y ago

flaque 5y ago

There's an interesting GDC talk about this for folks who are curious: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WycVOCbeKqQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WycVOCbeKqQ

donislawdev 5y ago
GDC talks are great, tons of interesting information.

cinntaile 5y ago

Why do you want to make an iOS/Android version when the game isn't very popular right now? You mention the competition will be a lot higher so why do you think it will be worth it?

donislawdev 5y ago
Just interested in it, I can gain this way experiences in releasing paid game on Android/IOS. From other side t's a lot harder (crowd market), for other there are not many paid tycoons, real tycoons games + a lot of players asked about mobile version.

hsbauauvhabzb 5y ago

Don’t downplay the value to you in fixing bugs, customer support etc. you’ll be better equipped when you release a title that is successful.

imtringued 5y ago
It's also easy to burn bridges by canceling early access games. The vast majority of people should stay away from early access games by default because of the risk that the game remains unfinished.
- paulryanrogers 5y ago
  Perhaps there is a better name for what these projects are: "experimental" or "exploratory" access. Something that doesn't so strongly imply their will be a later or finished state.
- shagie 5y ago
  I've got a few "early access" games where the developer lost interest or disappeared. Most infamously Starbase DF-9, but I've got a handful of other games in my library. Now, I'll wishlist them rather than impulse buy them and then reconsider it when it comes out of early access.
donislawdev 5y ago
I got a respect to players cash :-} I know

thrdbndndn 5y ago

>the first month of Steam early access (15.06 to 15.07 June/July) This is very confusing

yreg 5y ago
How is it confusing? 15th of June to 15th of July.
- Andrew_nenakhov 5y ago
  People in some countries are accustomed to using a very weird mm/dd date format, probably that's the case here?
  - Dylan16807 5y ago
    Month day is not weird. You should have mentioned something actually bad like month day year.
  - Quarrelsome 5y ago
    yyyy/mm/dd is the true format because its alphabetically sortable. dd/mm/yyyy is another sensible format because the units grow in size. mm/dd/yyyy is the insane one. Idk why the US persists with it tbh.
    - MattRix 5y ago
      It has flaws but it’s not “insane” or entirely illogical, it’s very clearly based on the way dates are spoken and written in English, ex. “Today is July 23rd, 2021”.
      - speedgoose 5y ago
        It's not insane, but it's not very logical. As a non native speaker, I prefer to say "Today is the 23rd of July in 2021" which is perhaps not valid English.

techrat 5y ago

The game is far, far too much of a niche style game for it to even be all that popular, IMHO. I'm not quite sure what the Dev here expected to happen. It's also Early Access and it's fair to say that unless a game has broad appeal (which shop simulators don't) and hype (definitely not in this case), people tend to stay away from Early Access games from unknown developers with insubstantial catalogs. I know I do, been burned enough times. I'm not saying 'feel bad', here... more along the lines of 'lower your expectations'. Unless you have a big publishing house backing you, marketing money being spent, your first title isn't going to be profitable... and that's before you consider the type of game it is.

robertlagrant 5y ago
Annoyingly, the dev time travelled back and incorporated all that into their original article. I think they did it just to make your advice look pointless.
ManBlanket 5y ago
He could yet get another bump in sales from a 1.0 release, but you're right the stars are just not aligned to make Yerba Mate Tycoon an indie smash. This was not necessarily a story of loss though. Taking a project all the way to release is a feat, and his attitude toward finishing the game, not to mention supporting it after release is commendable. All this seems like it helps position the developer to solicit publishers for future projects, convince others to work with him, and even help sway potential buyers of future projects. Not to mention it's a critical learning experience, feedback like yours is very helpful. All things considered pretty successful for a first game. This dude definitely has the potential to turn a profit in the future.
- tekromancr 5y ago
  Tenth game, according to the post
  - cmeacham98 5y ago
    I believe it is his 10th _attempt_ at a game but 1st finished/published game. The author at least has no other games published on steam.

bogwog 5y ago

> At launch, I was selling my game for $3.5 (10% discount), then the price went back to the full price of $4. Why would you launch with a discount?

avereveard 5y ago
It has become customary for early access titles to have an early bird discount
jmd42 5y ago
Drive day 1 sales, increasing your chance of getting featured as a "hot new release", increasing visibility and trying to ride the recommendation algorithm.
WhiteNoiz3 5y ago
Sadly Steam encourages everyone to do this - if you don't get high enough in the rankings at launch you basically won't make any money, plus everyone on Steam is super accustomed to getting everything at a discount.
donislawdev 5y ago
Special price for first EA (early access) customers. Steam recommend 10% discount.

pengaru 5y ago

The market is far too crowded to rely entirely on the steam store for your exposure. I'd like to know what the numbers are like for indie devs with their own twitch channel who constantly stream the development process, establishing a fan base throughout the year(s) of development before releasing on steam.

pjmlp 5y ago
The market has always been too crowded, unless we are talking about the early Atari 2600 days. Being a game dev is akin to music, acting, whatever arts related. It will cost blood, sweets and tears, full of ups and downs, and only an handful will manage to keep going at it their whole life. Just like other arts, it doesn't mean people just give up, rather be aware it isn't just because they like playing on their games console every single day, that they will make it on the industry.
jmd42 5y ago
Getting visibility within Steam itself is still probably the most effective way of increasing sales numbers - generally being featured/recommended within the platform is profoundly more effective than more organic marketing efforts (unless you really go viral on social media, for example). Discoverability and viewership numbers for game dev streamers on Twitch are really poor. Of course it can have value as a marketing initiative, but you can also grind that for months / years without seeing a significant effect on sales - the return on time investment is probably not great. Whereas getting onto the front page of Steam (as part of some seasonal event, for example) can do more for you in a single day than months/years of streaming or social media.
- pengaru 5y ago
  I wasn't clear enough in my comment; it's to crowded to just toss your game on the Steam store and expect it to magically generate worthwhile sales. You're entirely correct about being featured/recommended, and there are ways to game the platform at your release to amplify these effects. But my basic point stands; you can't just toss a game on Steam and expect good results. Between the low barrier to entry on the store ($100) and engines like unity/gamemaker enabling basically anyone to have something to toss on the store, it's overflowing with shovelware. How many reskinned game engine tutorials alone are out there for sale as games? It's a complete mess.

willcipriano 5y ago

> Features: > New update = new bugs > Poor graphic and sounds I have to say the first two "features" aren't doing you any favors. https://store.steampowered.com/app/1404560/Yerba_Mate_Tycoon/ https://store.steampowered.com/app/1404560/Yerba_Mate_Tycoon...

istorical 5y ago
It's a joke. Not sure if that's immediately obvious to you (it's Hacker News).
- throwuxiytayq 5y ago
  Still, as a potential customer, I don't find it very encouraging. You don't see jokes like these for products that don't have bugs or do have decent graphics. Not a very good idea to draw attention to your shortcomings, even if they're expected.
  - user5994461 5y ago
    +1 The joke is misplaced. It has nothing to do in the official description of the game, among the first lines read by customers. Personally I thought this was some sort of typo or weird expression, because the developer doesn't write English well.
donislawdev 5y ago
I'm honest person :-} Irony/Joke is a strong weapon in marketing.
cdmoyer 5y ago
Honestly, those make me want to buy it. Refreshing honest. I don't think the market here is people that'll be put off by that.

atum47 5y ago

Congratulations on commercializing the game. Are you a one person operation? I know how hard can it be to develop, publish, deal with game stores... This is a great deal that you were able to launch and sell. Kudos

donislawdev 5y ago
22-year-old solo developer from Poland :-} One-man team.

dzonga 5y ago

one thing, to applaud the author is they have the right attitude. when launching internet products, don't expect them to make money. that liberates you from all sort of problems and stress.

gcampos 5y ago

I don’t think the problem is that the game is a niche game, there are ways to break even with niche games and just copying what everyone else is doing is not exactly a receipt for success. In my opinion these is what OP could have done differently: - The game lacks (an obvious) unique hook. Just replacing coffee with mate is not enough of a hook for me, and I was raised in a family that drinks Chimarrão. - $5 is too cheap for a niche game. I think would help a lot if you check the Jeff Vogel advices on creating and marketing niche games. He has a lot insight on creating games that only a tiny amount of people want

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

fouc 5y ago

Incredible progress he's making. Ten "failures" that he's learned tons from. He's going to be hugely successful if he keeps this up!

AussieWog93 5y ago
Sarcasm?
- adenozine 5y ago
  Can't speak for parent commenter, but there is a nugget of supreme wisdom in the remark nonetheless. Gamedev is notoriously punishing and mentally grueling. Pushing through these roadblock moments CAN lead to huge runaway successes if the market timing is right. I'm in a field in no way orthogonal to gaming, but I can attest myself that pushing though the moments I -wanted- to quit the most, were the moments that yielded the most amount of advantage to me. I knew I could go further, work harder, learn to be smarter, because I knew that I had persevered where most others would've called it quits. Hopefully that's what they mean.
  - AussieWog93 5y ago
    I've heard this before, mainly from "hustle culture" folks, but have never witnessed it in real life. I've followed quite a few people, both online and IRL, who have persevered through repeated failure, motivated by "passion" and convinced that success was around the corner. Almost none of them achieved success. Instead, they ended up burned, jaded and in a few cases even genuinely suicidal. As someone else mentioned in the thread, the kid is clearly talented. He has released 10 games on five different platforms at age 22 with no assistance whatsoever. That is genuinely exceptional, and he is without doubt in the top 10% of game dev grads. I'm not arguing that you should quit after one attempt either (even successful designers fail maybe 50% of the time) but it seems irresponsible to suggest 10 failures in a row are a sign of success to come and he just needs to eat shit for the next 5 years. Far more likely than not, the repeated failures suggest that his talents would be better applied elsewhere.

z3t4 5y ago

In this day and age having over 400 actually paying customers is a lot! Even having 400 free users would be a lot. Now the question is - do they play the game ? Any number above 1% is good, so if there are 4 players spending a lot of time - it's a good sign. If possible ask them what they think is good about it, then update the marketing material to showcase what is good about the game.

georgeecollins 5y ago
I agree. And actually shipping a game that anyone will pay for puts you in very rare territory. The world is full of game designer wannabes.
- Karsteski 5y ago
  Why are they wannabes? I don't understand why you would insult people who are trying to put out a product but failing.
  - judge2020 5y ago
    There's a lot of low-quality Unity games on Steam, largely because they automated the new game system so that all it takes to publish a game is paying $100. There are some legitimate game designers putting in effort, but some 'publishers' have hundreds of these games and are often just copies of each other but with different assets.
    - squeaky-clean 5y ago
      For anyone doubting how simple this is, you can buy entirely pre-made games and template games in the Unity Asset Store for anywhere from $25-$500 depending on how polished the asset is.
      - moepstar 5y ago
        ...and then, something like this [0] happens: 1) create overpromising marketing campaign/kickstarter for a MMO 2) slap together some random assets 3) ??? 4) receive VC 5) profit.. [0] https://www.pcgamer.com/dreamworld-infinite-world-mmo-kickstarter-fiasco/ https://www.pcgamer.com/dreamworld-infinite-world-mmo-kickst...

bschwindHN 5y ago

400 sales is quite a lot actually! Going in with low expectations and achieving that number, honestly I would be proud.

WhompingWindows 5y ago

You might be able to go to those users who do like it, add features they want in DLCs and such. Could be a fun endeavor for a side-gig over time.

10x-dev 5y ago

My sincere congratulations to you on actually publishing your game and having players.

donislawdev 5y ago
Thank you a lot :-}

nazrulmum10 5y ago

You can buy Yerba Mate Tycoon

sillysaurusx 5y ago

I threw $5 your way because I wanted to support you. That said, some feedback: 1. The price is too high. I'm sorry, I know this sounds cheap at $5. But you're competing with the entire world of iOS games. For free, I can get endless kinds of games like this, but with in game purchases. Some of those, like Cardinal Quest 2, are actually amazing and the ingame purchases don't get in the way at all. I think if you priced it at $2 you might get more revenue in the long run. 2. I don't know what the hell a Yerba Mate is. It does say in the description that it's some kind of coffee, but I honestly had to force myself to buy this. I'd rather buy a coffee than a game about coffee. I feel guilty saying these things, because I don't know if my feelings here are representative or not. Maybe a lot of people feel that $5 is the right price point and that a game about coffee management is compelling. Either way, I want to support gamedevs, so I might try playing this just for kicks.

Strom 5y ago
> But you're competing with the entire world of iOS games. I am not convinced these are overlapping markets. The Venn diagram probably looks pretty close to two independent circles. I play games on Steam and also own an iPhone. I never play anything on my phone, because it's a completely different experience. I think PC games and iOS games are both games in the same way as PC games and hide&seek are both games. That is to say we use the same term for them, but they're not at all the same in regards to what I'm looking for. It's not just me either. This line of separation exists in my whole social circle as far as I can tell. None of my PC gaming buddies play mobile games and everyone I know that plays mobile games don't play PC games.
- oefrha 5y ago
  As someone who has made a fair bit more in donations than OP just from building community tools for a reasonably popular mobile game (still peanuts compared to the time poured in though), I probably have a bit more anecdata to draw from. In my experience, a not insignificant percentage of avid players of said mobile game active on Discord are also players of PC/console titles. These players may not represent the mobile game market at large, but they are overwhelmingly moderate to big spenders compared to the F2P crowd out there, so I’d say they are a good representation of a slice of the more valuable market segment. So, yes, there’s an overlap, and I imagine “Yerba Mate Tycoon”’s addressable PC market would be even more likely to play a comparable mobile game than the average AAA action/shooter/etc. market.

minimize 5y ago

Not sure if it has been mentioned yet, but I think the main reason why this title failed is the title. Most people probably never heard of "yerba mate", so to them, the title sounds like some kind of weird mating simulator. You can verify this by comparing the sales by country to the number of searches for the term "yerba mate" by country: https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?q=yerba%20mate https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?q=yerba%20mate The distributions are very similar.

donislawdev 5y ago
Niche genre :-} I know that the game will fail (before release), it's not problem for me :-}

DaveSapien 5y ago

These numbers are actually promising. 400 sales in early access for a 'niche' game would open the door for a few publishers out there. And as it stands this game has momentum behind it, NOT an easy thing to accomplish. And further more, the steam page has quite a few problems that are easily fixed and would drives sales in a positive direction. Add some streamer outreach to the mix and this could do well enough to fund their next game. Just perhaps not well enough to satisfy the developers ambitions. Yet. I would love to have this momentum on my own (very) niche game. Its is also on early access, interesting premise, zero marketing budget, and so on. Its numbers are nowhere near as promising as Yerba Mate Tycoon. Its a rare thing to click with an audience and YMT has done so. To the Developer, keep going. Keep that mindset of honouring your customers its rare in games and of value to the gamers. Spend more time on you store page and promoting, and release it. It will be worth it.

zone411 5y ago
Use the opportunity and link us to your game. I don't think anybody will mind.
- DaveSapien 5y ago
  Thanks, I don't want to seem like I'm shilling with any of my comments. This is Kanso, a relaxing game that invites the player to slowdown and find a moment of Zen: https://store.steampowered.com/app/1454650/Kanso/ https://store.steampowered.com/app/1454650/Kanso/
  - hendi_ 5y ago
    This looks great, will buy once I'm back at my PC :-)
    - DaveSapien 5y ago
      Oh wow, thank you very much. If you have any feedback, I'd very much like to hear it.
  - 5y ago

nix23 5y ago

It's an early access game, like many...i never buy a EA game, too many disappointment's.

donislawdev 5y ago
Yep, agree

hnarn 5y ago

I believe pricing is one of the most important decisions any business can make, and $5 does not make any sense to me. You're probably betting that this is a niche game that likely will take you more time than its worth in sales: in that case, you need to increase the price as much as you can without it looking absurd in comparison to triple A titles, so maybe $30 or so. If not much happens, you accept that there is no way any meaningful number of people will be interested in this game for the price of a steak dinner, so you go for the "penny crowd" instead: sell the game for $1 during a steam sale and get free attention from a >95% discount. Ideally you can spend this in-between time fixing some bugs and just keeping the game "alive" so it doesn't look like a complete cash grab, but on the other hand you should never feel obligated to put your time into something that isn't, and likely never will, be paying you back.

user5994461 5y ago
If the game can reach something like the other simple Tycoon games, it can probably sell for around $20. But definitely not in early access and definitely not until it reaches similar quality/content. If one tries to make a money grab as you suggest, gamers will obliterate the game with bad reviews. A few bad reviews and the game is doomed forever.

Ostrogodsky 5y ago

Congrats! You are doing fantastic. Thousands of debbie downers here, pay absolutely no attention to them. Keep doing what you like, strengthen yourself physically and mentally and if you need to have a second job while you get your first break-away success so be it. Just a small correction, "Yerba mate" is not the "coffee of south-america" Coffee is the coffee of south america,i.e. by far is a more popular drink. Mate is huge in Argentina/Uruguay and perhaps Paraguay , only regionally in Brazil and very niche everywhere else in the region. Coffee is as popular as it can be everywhere else in the world where the drink is liked.

raverbashing 5y ago
Your advice is on point Yerba matte is also popular in Germany (as in, "Club-Mate") so maybe OP can try some advertising there ;)

WastingMyTime89 5y ago

The game sounds interesting and you seem to have great work ethics. You seem to have a marketing issue however. For a game, marketing is really important. I'm not extremely knowledgeable in the indie game business but as you seem to have a positive track record, getting a publisher might help you.

flak48 5y ago

The synthesized speech in the video seems pretty realistic - does anyone know which software was used?

donislawdev 5y ago
It's human speech, not software :-}

kimopertonau 5y ago

Coincidentally, just three months ago I began drinking yerba mate[0] which is the tea or infusion in this game Yerba Mate Tycoon. I found it better than coffee in the afternoon, since it provides a slower onset and more sustained energizing effect with essentially no crash. I believe it’s due to it containing other compounds such as L-theanine apart from caffeine. Popular brands are Taragüi[1] and Canarias, and can be prepared in a standard French press almost like tea. Some even drink it in teabags[2]. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mate_(drink) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mate_(drink) [1] https://pampadirect.com/taragui-yerba-mate-classic-flavor-con-palo-with-stems-from-las-marias-500-g-1-1-lb/ https://pampadirect.com/taragui-yerba-mate-classic-flavor-co... [2] https://pampadirect.com/taragui-mate-cocido-ready-to-brew-yerba-mate-bags-box-of-25-bags/ https://pampadirect.com/taragui-mate-cocido-ready-to-brew-ye...

DeathMetal3000 5y ago

Having a Polish developer create a game around a South American drink really shows the power of cross-cultural spread of the internet. Love it!

JoeDaDude 5y ago

Dumb but honest question: If most sales were expected to be in Latin America, why wasn't the game localized in the Spanish language?

donislawdev 5y ago
Good question, no budget for it, for localization I would pay $2000-$5000+ or even more. There are tons of words. If on launch I was selling the game (Argentina) for $0.5, like 30% of that goes to me, so $0.15. Then for the pay of localization I would need to sell 13k-60k copies in Argentina. No chances. 13k copies just for paying for localization or even more copies. Even big indie games don't pay for localizations, it's not worth it, selling 13-60k copies in xx country is hard. Right now, the game is translated in 70% to Spanish by community. I know indie games that earned millions of cash, but still, they rely on the community translations.
- JoeDaDude 5y ago
  I'd like to continue this discussion. Can you please e-mail me at the address in my profile? Thanks!