30 ms·

Ozempic drug supresses desire to smoke, drink and more?

288 points by explosion-s 3y ago

crakenzak 3y ago
Now if only it didn’t cost so damn much every month even under insurance =(
- BizarroLand 3y ago
  You can buy it as a "research chemical" and save money, but then the potential consequences of diy medicine and all that that entails are all on you. Hopefully the price will come down more as it becomes more prevalent or as generics become available.
  - rektide 3y ago
    I'm not that afraid of swallowing random chemicals but self injecting is a bit hardcore for me.
    - EthicalSimilar 3y ago
      FWIW, SubQ injections are pretty much completely unnoticeable in terms of pain / feeling at all. It’s more the mental barrier of doing it to yourself but once you’ve done it for the first time you soon realise it’s fine.
      - rektide 3y ago
        The actual doing it seems wild/absurd, but I don't think that would hold me back. This is ignorant/uniformed, but, taking research chemical by ingestion feels like I have some natural barriers still. Where-as I feel like there's a much more raw exposure to risk with injection. Also there's dumb risks like infection, if I don't attend well enough to injections. In spite of these protests, I think you are probably much closer to the truth here. Thanks for writing. These reactions I have are, I suspect, not really significant.
        idontwantthis 3y ago
        Counterpoint: Don’t inject yourself with stuff you found on the internet because people on the internet told you it’s ok.
    - opportune 3y ago
      Steroid users do it all the time and I haven’t heard of steroid users dealing with infections much.
      - pixl97 3y ago
        I'm sure its because most people aren't going to talk about illegal drug use and when it goes wrong.
        opportune 3y ago
        There are tons of online places where people openly discuss steroid use like r/steroids and many oldschool phpbb-style steroid forums
  - scheme271 3y ago
    GLP-1 agonists are a bit more tricky since they are temperature sensitive and need to be injected. You'll really need to be careful to keep it sterile and handle it properly. Whether the "research chemical" will receive the proper care until it gets into your hands is something that you're literally gambling your health on.
    - reaperman 3y ago
      You ship it as a dry/lypohilized powder, both semaglutide and tirzepatide survives long China->Europe shipping in the summer just fine, with customs delays. The testing I've seen showed 99.965% purity of semaglutide after 22 days in shipping from China to Poland during April. Tirzepatide shows 99.064% purity after 58 days of shipping in October-November. These didn't start out at 100.00% purity either, so they likely experienced absolutely minimal degradation in shipment. You reconstitute it with Bacteriostatic Water which is available without a prescription in the USA and contains 0.9% benzyl alcohol to inhibit bacterial growth. If you're particularly concerned you buy a 0.22 micrometer PVDF "syringe filter" and pump it through that to another, fresh/sealed sterile vial which you can get for like $2.00 from a medical supply company (the syringe, filter, and vials are gamma-irradiated to destroy any remnants of RNA/DNA). That size filtration will filter out any lifeforms (fungal, bacterial, viral) while allowing the peptide/drug itself to pass through. So you get a guaranteed sterile solution out of the filter.
      - quazar 3y ago
        Where do you buy it from to ship to Poland?
        reaperman 3y ago
        Anything specific would be inappropriate for this forum. But the broad answer is a chemicals distributor in China. I actually only utilize them for legal "nutritional" compounds, but others use them for pharmaceutical options, and those are independently tested frequently by a variety of stakeholders. Personally I really wish US citizens didn't feel forced to go outside of the quality protections of the FDA for their medical care.
- toomuchtodo 3y ago
  Going to be huge when it goes off patent off exclusivity. I'd also expect you'll be able to get it when it's made in jurisdictions that will ignore the patent. Up to you to get it from those places, either via mail or travel runs.
  - tboyd47 3y ago
    They will find some way to prevent people from acquiring it and promote some other in-patent drug.
    - toomuchtodo 3y ago
      Lots of ways around jurisdictional regs. Consider how many people live near a national border, or have access to the postal service. https://www.usnews.com/news/best-states/articles/2018-11-01/utah-insurance-company-is-paying-people-to-pick-up-their-prescriptions-in-mexico https://www.usnews.com/news/best-states/articles/2018-11-01/... https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7523158/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7523158/ https://www.cnn.com/2023/03/07/health/fda-drug-shipments-khn-partner/index.html https://www.cnn.com/2023/03/07/health/fda-drug-shipments-khn... https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/health/2022/12/14/states-challenge-biden-administration-drug-imports-canada/10890258002/ https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/health/2022/12/14/states... Also, I expect CRISPR or gene therapy to be the long game wrt this and updating the body's GLP-1 regulation, versus maintenance doses of a pharma product. This is a shim. https://benmay.uchicago.edu/crispr-gene-therapy https://benmay.uchicago.edu/crispr-gene-therapy https://www.creative-biogene.com/crispr-cas9/solution/glp1r-gene-editing.html https://www.creative-biogene.com/crispr-cas9/solution/glp1r-...
    - HDThoreaun 3y ago
      It is not possible to stop people from getting mail order pills from China. Especially with the abortion restrictions the market already is pretty large and it will be easy for them to throw these drugs in too.
      - trasz4 3y ago
- scheme271 3y ago
  It's not the only GLP-1 agonist out there. Victoza is another GLP-1 agonist and should be going generic in the US in a little over a year. It might already be available as a generic outside the US. There might be other GLP-1 agonists that are going generic soon as well.
- reaperman 3y ago
  You can get these wholesale from China from "reputable" gray-market wholesalers who get the chemicals made at contract manufacturing facilities. BYO QA/QC though, as with all non-FDA drugs. That's the huge catch, and it sucks for consumers. Testing just for active ingredient is >$100 and takes about a month. Testing for proper buffering agents, harmful contaminants, microbial contamination, etc is essentially unavailable at all. Semaglutide is very, very cheap in the gray market. It's somewhat less effective than Tirzepatide and has slightly more side effects if you ramp up the dosage too quickly. If an annual amount is purchased on the gray market, this brings the monthly cost down to: - Semaglutide: $10/month - Tirzepatide: $60/month - Liraglutide: $87/month - LY3437943: I have not yet seen this available, but it looks like distributors are notifying manufacturers of latent demand and are working to build up a supply chain. Note that in the USA, it is legal to import certain amounts of FDA-approved drugs if you have a prescription for them. However, just because something is the exact same chemical as an FDA-approved drug does not make it an FDA-approved drug. It must be manufactured in an FDA certified facility and be the same brand/manufacturer/packaging/labeling/etc as the approved drug. e.g. importing generic Sildenafil/Viagra is legal if you can find the Teva(tm) brand generic sildenafil in, say, Mexico or Canada for a better price. But it must be the pills manufactured by Teva in the appropriate facility with NDC #0093-5342-56[0]. If you import generic sildenafil "Cenforce" from the (very legitimate but not FDA-approved) Indian pharmaceutical manufacturer "Centurion Laboratories"... ...that would still be potentially criminal smuggling. Even if the pills you import show via laboratory test that they precisely match your medical prescription, they are not "FDA approved" and therefore not legal to import. A lot of people do though! 0: https://ndclist.com/ndc/0093-5342/package/0093-5342-56 https://ndclist.com/ndc/0093-5342/package/0093-5342-56
  - etchasketch 3y ago
    Interesting.
  - chriscappuccio 3y ago
    where is this grey market? apparently it's not as simple as just searching aliexpress :)
akiselev 3y ago
https://archive.ph/1waP9 https://archive.ph/1waP9
tboyd47 3y ago
[flagged]
- roywiggins 3y ago
  Wegovy- semaglutide- is approved for weight loss "in adults with obesity or overweight with at least one weight-related condition (such as high blood pressure, type 2 diabetes, or high cholesterol)": https://www.fda.gov/news-events/press-announcements/fda-approves-new-drug-treatment-chronic-weight-management-first-2014 https://www.fda.gov/news-events/press-announcements/fda-appr...
  - tboyd47 3y ago
    I appreciate the reply, really.
- trasz4 3y ago
  One works, the other doesn't.
  - hayst4ck 3y ago
    Ivermectin did feasibly improve covid outcomes, but only in places where worms were common, which is not the US. So it's true that people like the one you are responding to are ignorant and can't really understand nuance and that they are also wrong for their lack of trust in institutions, but institutions also failed to communicate to those ignorant people and that is a problem all of it's own. Very fun science read that I hope humbles you a little: https://astralcodexten.substack.com/p/ivermectin-much-more-than-you-wanted https://astralcodexten.substack.com/p/ivermectin-much-more-t...
    - deleted 3y ago
      [deleted]
mym1990 3y ago
A drug that promotes weight loss, lessens the desire to smoke, drink, etc...sounds too good to be true? From what I have heard, all of these issues come back as soon as someone comes off the drug. So either a person is committing to a lifetime of being dependent on this drug, or a person is committing to some period of time of ideal living, followed by a possible time of depression after reverting to the status quo.
- karaterobot 3y ago
  For a lot of people, it's kind of a choice of which substance you are going to be dependent on. It's all expensive and sad, but between Ozempic and cigarettes, alcohol, or overeating, Ozempic has got to be healthier, and quite possibly cheaper in the long run.
  - nancyhn 3y ago
    Is a drug or drug-like-food (ie, sugar) dependency really the only option?
    - oniony 3y ago
      No, there's also badmington.
    - deegles 3y ago
      What do you suggest otherwise? Clearly whatever we're doing now has led us to this point.
    - karaterobot 3y ago
      Versus, like, "just suck it up"? No, but empirically that strategy has had poor results across the wider population. It seems like it would work, but usually doesn't. At some point people look for more effective strategies.
    - yamtaddle 3y ago
      It's that, or dropping out of modern life, as far as I can tell. Everyone's on something and/or coping in unhealthy ways.
myshpa 3y ago
Psilocybin too.
rektide 3y ago
I'm surprised Ozempic gets all the press. Supposedly Mounjaro is all that and more. The wonderful Paul Ford has the best writeup I've seen that discusses these more meta levels, the post-human implications of a drug we can genuinely widescalely reprogram ourselves with. Paul's so great. https://www.wired.com/story/new-drug-switched-off-appetite-mounjaro/ https://www.wired.com/story/new-drug-switched-off-appetite-m... https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34660232 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34660232
- HDThoreaun 3y ago
  Ozempic has been around longer and there were a bunch of celebrities taking it and talking about it on twitter so I think it has more cultural cachet. Most people probably don't know about mounjaro, I don't even think it's approved for weight loss yet.
- kristofferR 3y ago
  Massive text: "People taking Mounjaro lost up to 25 LBS" Small text underneath: "Mounjaro is not a weight loss drug." Man, the US pharma industry/marketing is so weird. https://www.mounjaro.com/#:~:text=mounjaro%20is%20not%20a%20weight%20loss%20drug https://www.mounjaro.com/#:~:text=mounjaro%20is%20not%20a%20....
  - iwanttocomment 3y ago
    Mounjaro is not yet approved for weight loss in the US even though there is strong evidence that it will be, and there's little question that there has generally been weight loss in those taking it for diabetes. Recent studies have very clearly shown it's effective for weight loss even in those without diabetes, but there's a lag as the FDA reviews those studies. Until then, Lilly simply can't advertise it as a treatment for obesity.
  - refurb 3y ago
    It’s not weird at all if you’re aware of the regulations. Drug companies can’t promote a drug for something it’s not FDA approved for (off-label promotion). Companies face multi-billion dollar penalties for doing so. Mounjaro is approved for type 2 diabetes. And weight loss is a great way to help get your type 2 diabetes under control. So highlighting that it helps type 2 patients lose weight, while having an FDA mandated disclosure that it’s not approved for weight loss alone, makes perfect sense.
lumb63 3y ago
I’m glad people are enjoying Ozempic. My experience from seeing a family member on it, is I would not touch it if I were a 500-pound alcoholic smoking two packs of cigarettes a day. That’s an exaggeration since it probably outweighs the health issues there, but only slightly. The person I know taking Ozempic has only lost weight (35 lbs) due to the fact that eating now makes her sick. She has been sapped of all energy and has developed issues with her bladder, circulatory system, joints, thyroid, and digestive system since starting Ozempic. I’m not saying it’s due to Ozempic, but I am saying all these issues have cropped up in the few months since she started taking it, and she never had any chronic health issues prior. At least she lost some weight, I guess.
- ikekkdcjkfke 3y ago
  Same experience here, gallstone attacks
  - shrimp_emoji 3y ago
    You can get those from rapid weight loss, I thought. Maybe it's working TOO well if that's the case.
    - jjeaff 3y ago
      Ya, rapid weight loss is one of the most common triggers of gall stones. Lots of weight loss surgery patients get them as well.
      - winocm 3y ago
        Happened to me too from just generally not eating much at the time. Ended up getting acute cholecystitis and a dead gallbladder plus sepsis after. Not too pleasant of an experience.
- burnte 3y ago
  I take it, and when I started I got violently nauseous and had GI issues. I wasn't informed I needed to slowly ramp up. I still have pretty big appetite suppression, and only minimal nausea sometimes if I eat too much, but what it's done to my blood glucose is AMAZING. And I lost some weight when I started which was a great bonus. It can be hard to start but it's truly worth it, just adjust the dose. I take 0.5mg as I can't handle the larger 1.0mg dose.
NickC25 3y ago
[flagged]
- renewiltord 3y ago
  Sometimes I see people have written a bug in code and I wonder why they didn't just do the obvious and write it without the bug. Personally, every time I'm about to introduce a bug I just choose to not do it.
  - moonchrome 3y ago
    I mean if you know ahead of time the thing you're doing is going to produce buggy code then yep your analogy holds.
    - renewiltord 3y ago
      Yeah, it's weird, right? But people keep putting use-after-free bugs everywhere. Like, do the OpenBSD guys not know that this is a bug (and worse, a security bug)? They keep putting them everywhere. A few years ago they stuck one in OpenSMTPD. Theo de Raadt would benefit from reading some Hacker News.
      - moonchrome 3y ago
        That's like saying obese people are the same as bodybuilders because they both eat surplus calories and have high BMI.
- amanaplanacanal 3y ago
  Unfortunately, suggesting that people eat less and exercise more doesn’t seem to actually work that well. We’ve been trying that for decades and the obesity epidemic just keeps getting worse.
  - shagymoe 3y ago
    Have we though? I seriously doubt doctors are aggressively pushing eating well and exercising. Has anyone ever received a workout plan from their doctor besides some generic PT exercises? Do they develop nutrition plans tailored to you? Do they track your progress? Do they have any incentive for you to actually get better? Do they require regular blood tests and include all the tests that might actually tell them something? The answer is a resounding no. None of that. Even if you request a blood test, they will include the absolute bare minimum and fight you when you request something like vitamin D or testosterone. General healthcare in the US is farce. You must be your own doctor, do your own research and fight for the care you need and also tolerate doctors telling you that you don't know what you're talking about. Besides being prescribed antibiotics, no doctor has ever fixed any problem I've ever had. I had to do it myself.
omgmajk 3y ago
I was on ozempic for a bit but it raised my resting pulse from 65ish to 95ish just sitting at my computer so I had to stop taking it.
bitwize 3y ago
[flagged]
glonq 3y ago
What happens when you reach your target weight with drugs like this? After having learned potentionally nothing about nutrition, exercise, and self-control, are you stuck on these meds for life out of fear of binge-eating back to your original weight? FWIW I'm on a hundred-pound roller coaster ride from 300lbs to 200lbs; currently ~215. I've learned a lot about discipline and sustainable habits along the way.
- opportune 3y ago
  I’ve never been obese but after losing 30+ lbs of weight I found it a lot easier to live an active lifestyle and keep the weight off. Partly it was just that moving around was physically easier and less strenuous, but also that I was less self conscious and had higher self esteem. I imagine Ozempic will help with this even if people don’t learn about nutrition per se. Though I think basically everybody knows nutrition, it’s more about self control IME.
- op00to 3y ago
  What happens when someone who was previously deeply depressed but feels better goes off an antidepressant? They learn to handle life, or they return to the drug if further treatment is needed. It’s not a moral failing.
  - jasonfarnon 3y ago
    I don't think you need to bring morality into it. OP is just asking, do you develop your own tools to address the problem, or rely on another's forever? There are lots of practical non-moral answers to that question.
  - gnulinux 3y ago
    As an anecdote: at my worst (when I was clearly suicidal, insomniac and emotionally unstable) I was on antidepressants (Prozac) and it helped me a lot. It made me very emotionally stable. I got off Prozac after a couple years to try it out and I felt much better. Over that year, I started feeling similarly terrible due to COVID world. Went back to Prozac. Once again made me very stable. Stopped using Prozac in mid 2022, again to see if I feel good without it. Since then have been feeling much, much better. Of course, mental health is a constant battle, you fight one day at a time, but I consider my depression as close to "cured" as possible because over the last year I felt pretty normal without any drugs. Things to note are, along the way I stopped drinking alcohol which helped me tons. Before 2020 I was a huge drinker (not alcoholic, but every day heavy drinker). Initially, I started smoking weed. This helped a ton because I stopped drinking completely, but I wasn't getting very high every day and I thought THC helped quite a bit too. Eventually, in late 2022 I stopped using THC too. I'm completely drug free now. I believe that both Prozac and THC helped me significantly to get out of depression. In addition to drugs, CBT (cognitive behavioral therapy), therapy in general and getting a cat has been extremely helpful as well. This is just an anecdote, every brain is different. Never self medicate, see a doctor and a therapist!
beefman 3y ago
https://archive.is/MfXlm https://archive.is/MfXlm
arcadeparade 3y ago
Some people really love to moralize and cite anecdotes about Ozempic.
- armchairhacker 3y ago
  Moralizing about weight loss is upsetting, as someone whose thankfully considers themselves "naturally thin". It's 100% true the vast majority (including me) needs to put some discipline into eating and exercise: normal people can't just eat whatever they want whenever they feel hungry. But normal people don't get fat eating whole foods, working out, eating below their demographic's daily intake; and normal people don't suffer immense fatigue on tiny calorie deficits or even maintenance. People with thyroid and other metabolic issues do. Which IMO completely destroys the "moral" argument for weight. (And it's also probably true that most overweight people don't eat whole foods and work out daily. That doesn't mean its right to call out some random fat person eating a mildly-unhealthy meal. You have no idea what else they've eaten that day, what else is going on around them, and you wouldn't call out a skinny person who eats the same.)
  - mrcrumb1 3y ago
    I'm a person who has vacillated between being close to normal weight and obese. I think people who don't have problems controlling their diet tend to underestimate just how hard it can be to eat at a calorie deficit or even just maintenance when you've lost a large amount of weight. When I'm at my lowest weight I literally am thinking about food constantly and my maintenance calorie intake drops to about 1500-1800 calories.
    - Danjoe4 3y ago
      [flagged]
    - DoreenMichele 3y ago
      FWIW, I lost multiple dress sizes without counting calories or starving myself by eating a more nutrient dense diet.
    - 3y ago
Avshalom 3y ago
"Semaglutide does not dull all pleasure, people taking the drug for weight loss told me. They could still enjoy a few bites of food or revel in finding the perfect dress; they just no longer went overboard. Anhedonia, or a general diminished ability to experience pleasure, also hasn’t shown up in cohorts of people who take the drug for diabetes, says Elisabet Jerlhag Holm, an addiction researcher at the University of Gothenburg." So it doesn't dull all pleasure just almost all so it's not technically anhedonia... I dunno, still seem pretty fucking bleak to me.
- kevviiinn 3y ago
  Our experience exists on a series of spectrums, some people experience pleasure way too intensely and it actually causes problems which is why this might be a good thing Obviously there are people who like the pleasure given to them by food a bit too much and they consistently overindulge, it can be that way for many things as well. I'm not saying that the cause is always related but for many it may be
- Taywee 3y ago
  Addiction is often extremely distressing. Dulled pleasure can be far better than drinking yourself into a stupor every single night.
- contravariant 3y ago
  I'm not sure it is pleasure driving people to go overboard. I'm pretty sure it is dissatisfaction that is driving excess. In which case a drug that means you're more easily satisfied is far from bleak. If anything the opposite is far more bleak. Imagine if there was a drug that meant you're less easily satisfied, who on earth would want that?
  - tetrep 3y ago
    > If anything the opposite is far more bleak. Imagine if there was a drug that meant you're less easily satisfied, who on earth would want that? That sounds like stimulants. You wouldn't be motivated to do things if you were satisfied, so any drugs that motivate people would seem to need to have to have such an effect.
throwaway5959 3y ago
Wasn’t this the plot of the Firefly movie? It didn’t work out well for them.
- pixl97 3y ago
  I mean the opposite where we're fattening up ourselves like lambs for the slaughter isn't working out great either. We've had recent downward trend in longevity.
caycep 3y ago
it's funny in that a few years ago we were (and still are) excited by the potential cellular protective properties of GLP1 agonists, not just in the pancreas but in brain glial cells or whatnot. So much so that it seems to be the most neuroprotective of recent candidates for Parkinson's disease disease-modifying-therapies (DMTs). to whit, (like botox), all the initial promises of the stuff have been waaaay overshadowed by...cosmetic value. (I'm oversimplifying a bit...for those who are morbidly obese, yes, the weight loss really helps, but then they also have diabetes most likely which is the primary indication of the drug)
SamoyedFurFluff 3y ago
How long is the research info ozempic and other hormonal weight loss drugs? Remember the last miracle drug that went to the market for weight loss had to be retracted for killing people or damaging their hearts to the tune of over 10 billion dollars in damages paid out.
- ESTheComposer 3y ago
  These types of medications have been around since the 2000s, semaglutide (ozempic) specifically since 2012.
- dillydogg 3y ago
  At least in this case GLP-1 antagonists have been in clinical use for diabetes since around 2010
- jjeaff 3y ago
  While I am not saying that this drug is definitely safe, I think the fact that Fen-phen turned out to be more dangerous doesn't really implicate these new drugs because while the desired outcome is the same, the class and type of drugs seem to be entirely different. My understanding is that fen-phen is a stimulant and increased blood pressure and heart rate. It also includes some other drugs that affect serotonin levels. These new drugs are peptide analogs that affect your body's digestion and how it deals with sugar and fat production and insulin.
- reaperman 3y ago
  Drugs acting on GLP-1 (ozempic), GIP, and glucagon receptors are largely shown to help hearts and cardiovascular health specifically (and independently of weight loss). They also improve lipid profiles (HDL/LDL), and have a multitude of other benefits. Whether they, for example, increase the rate of glial brain cancer ... they really haven't been out long enough to know.
jmpman 3y ago
I’ve been on Mounjaro since August. Down almost 60lbs, and it’s been a life changer. Have I had some gastrointestinal issues, sure, but expected. I feel great and my brain seems to be functioning as well as when I was in my 20’s. Now, when I go to the bar with friends, I end up having maybe 2 beers and although enjoyable, I don’t feel that light switch turning on which encourages me to drink more. Can I force myself to keep drinking, say if my good friends are in town and we’re going out all night? Sure, but there’s some reward center that’s no longer lighting up. I just get drunker, but it’s not more pleasurable. I was never a big drinker at home by myself. Maybe a glass of wine or two with dinner if my in-laws are coming over. Now I’ve literally had zero drinks at home by myself. Seems to have started changing about 3 month in. Work also seems more interesting, but my untreated ADHD seems to be getting worse.
- raincom 3y ago
  I heard Mounjaro is even more effective than Semaglutide.
- yieldcrv 3y ago
  the most surprising thing to me is how you’re describing normal behavior that I can relate to all my life, but the community of strugglers is so big that this is a whole testimonial people feel comfortable and exalted to share like thats not something I’m deriding its just news to me makes me wonder what this drug actually does, flush gut bacteria? just the right ones?
  - andbberger 3y ago
    it's a GLP-1 agonist
    - 015UUZn8aEvW 3y ago
      Ozempic/Wegovy is a GLP-1 receptor agonist, but Mounjaro is a GLP-1 and GIP receptor agonist
  - ramraj07 3y ago
LazyMans 3y ago
Yes. On a compounded semaglutide. I can finally control my hunger and a nice unexpected effect has been losing a desire to drink large quantities of alcohol. I don’t drink during the week anyway, but it seems to be the volume that turns me off to drinking. Thus a few cocktails are all I can tolerate. For context, Im 30, male, would be defined as a binge drinker on weekends. Oh, and I’ve given up nicotine entirely. I can’t tell if the drug is helping or it was just a point in my life that I finally decided I accept it makes me feel ill most of the time.
- AtlasBarfed 3y ago
  I'd hazard a guess that nicotine is one of the two or three most addictive substances known to humanity. Opiates/heroin is probably worse, world of warcraft is probably third :-) The drug probably helped.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
  - Waterluvian 3y ago
    Don’t forget caffeine!
    - LazyMans 3y ago
      I like caffeine, unfortunately even small amounts tend to make me irritable and sick at the end of the day. Wasn’t always like that
      - runsWphotons 3y ago
        What changed and when?
        LazyMans 3y ago
        I’m not sure what, but a few years ago caffeine started to give me anxiety sometimes, or sick. I guess I just got older.
monkeycantype 3y ago
the genetics of obesity are amazing. we all have a unique combination of genes, and epigenic features that influece the endocrine and neuronal pathways that drive the desire to eat, these different genotypes affect our behaviour. Ozempic is putting a thumb on the scales of this pathway, but this pathway is balanced differently in all of us. Think of the most hungry you have ever been, in some people this never stops, in others it's dialed up or down. there are some great papers on fat labradors that hint at how these different genotypes are linked to our desire to eat and how that shifts our behaiour. Guide dogs are highly selected for trainability, and positive reinforcement with food reward plays an important role in their training. I think it was Yeo, found 22% of pet Labradors and 80% of Labrador guide dogs sampled carried a 14 BP deletion in the POMC gene, which forms part of this pathway. https://doi.org/10.1007/s00125-016-4187-x https://doi.org/10.1007/s00125-016-4187-x https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4873617/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4873617/
Jun8 3y ago
So, instead is suppressing the desire to eat, how about inventing a drug that blocks the absorption or breakdown of carbohydrates in the gut? Or maybe control the gut biome so that growth of bacteria that breaks down high calorie food is minimized. Is this faster-than-light-like impossible daydream or is there any plausible path to it?
- paulpauper 3y ago
  this is what gastric bypass tries to do. it bypasses part of the digestive process
- coke12 3y ago
  Consider Alli, the drug that blocks fat absorption in the body. It already exists and works reasonably well for weight loss. The side effects can be gross and unpleasant though.
- Auracle 3y ago
  I don’t know if I want a drug to exist that allows people to be gluttons without consequence. It’s like a modern (and real) vomitorium.
  - cromulent 3y ago
    Some people will tell you though that they can eat anything and not put on weight - this is simply allowing others to do the same, right. A vomitorium is simply the large exit pathway in stadia for rapid egress of many people. The idea that ancient Romans had facilities dedicated to vomiting has been debunked.
    - Auracle 3y ago
      That's why I said (real), I know they didn't exist - though I'm guessing somewhere, sometime in history it has. Those people that tell you they can eat anything and not put on weight have a very different idea of what "anything" is than fat people, with probably an actual exception here and there (along with teenagers).
therein 3y ago
[flagged]
tomcam 3y ago
Ozempic did nothing for me
PostOnce 3y ago
Exercise is free and the side effects are you get stronger, more energetic, and better looking. Ozempic costs money and its side effects include cancer, kidney failure, and ruining your eyes. https://www.ozempic.com/faqs.html https://www.ozempic.com/faqs.html edit: many point out calorie intake is the real problem, it's true: buy a kitchen scale, weigh your food, count your calories, and you will lose weight. Exercise is optional compared to that. Still, both are free and have more benefits.
- caymanjim 3y ago
  Exercise does nothing for weight loss if you're eating too much. Exercise has health benefits, but weight loss is not one of them for the vast majority of people. People wildly overestimate how many calories they're burning.
  - dmix 3y ago
    s/calories/carbs Calories can still be a useful metric as a proxy but low calorie (“diet”) foods tend to compensate with more carbs. At least the ones I see regularly at my grocery store. As a side note: It’s actually difficult to find pre-packaged low carb food at regular grocery stores sadly. It requires effort to make yourself, just like going to the gym. Like most good things in life.
    - uranium 3y ago
      Lots of grocers will have hard sausages, cheeses, olives, and nuts. It's not as easy as chips and food bars, I'll grant you, but it's doable.
    - tuatoru 3y ago
      Low glycemic index carbs are available. I find I eat smaller portions and feel full for longer with low GI rice vs ordinary rice, for example.
  - justsomehnguy 3y ago
    > People wildly overestimate how many calories they're burning. And people wildly underestimate how many calories they need. Just by limiting the one portion to 50g of pasta, instead of my preferred 150+g, I can go under 100kg in less than a week. My 'how much should I cook' habits formed when I was young and spent at least a couple of hours commuting, but nowadays I'm quite literally just sit on my ass all day. It's bothersome and isn't fulfilling to use scales cut down on the food (especially if it's tasty) but...
ingenika 3y ago
maybe useful to treat drug addiction ?
clementmas 3y ago
Is this mostly a US drug? I never heard about it in France. I can't believe people love it so much without thinking about the actual source of their problem.
- throwawayadvsec 3y ago
  The source of the problem is that animals are wired to eat as much food as possible as quickly as possible. You can't blame half of the population for something that is deeply wired into our brain and bodies.
  - prawn 3y ago
    I think you can ultimately blame them, but you can also accept that for many it's a very difficult problem to overcome and that finding other ways to tackle it has value to the individual and community.
- benrapscallion 3y ago
  No, it is approved by EMA. https://www.has-sante.fr/jcms/c_2906429/fr/ozempic-semaglutide https://www.has-sante.fr/jcms/c_2906429/fr/ozempic-semagluti...
tremere 3y ago
[flagged]
- jacobrussell 3y ago
  Congrats -- many people cannot do that, and would like to be able to.
- mattpallissard 3y ago
  I'm a former alcoholic. I quit cold turkey years ago. Had a drug problem before that. Cold turkey as well. While I agree with you somewhat, I too don't like the narrative, I also realize that some people actually can't do that. Some people are faster, some smarter, some stronger, and some of us are better at sticking to a resolution. Everyone has things they're good at and things they struggle at despite the effort. Gotta find what works for you personally.
  - tremere 3y ago
    I'm happy you've quit your former habits and I celebrate you. Just so you know, the point of my post isn't to rip on people with low willpower or to brag about mine (which would be false valor anyway--there are reasons I had issues with alcohol and drugs to begin with). The thesis of my post is that the narrative is that you need a drug to get better. Ozempic is supposed to be a treatment applied to people who are not yet overweight enough for bariatric surgery, yet it is being used ubiquitously. What does that tell you about the mind share differences between "you need a drug to get better" versus "you can just stop"? The idea that another drug is your only way out is but a shadow on the wall of a cave, puppeteered by Big Pharma, people need to free themselves, escape outside and see the sun. Additionally, my post was "flagged" which is a bit hilarious. I wonder what part of my post was hateful or otherwise below the standards of this forum. Unless you define hate as being critical of big pharma.
    - mattpallissard 3y ago
      I think we're more or less on the same page. And honestly, flagging a comment based on disagreement is a pretty shitty move. I've noticed that happening more often here.
TeeMassive 3y ago
I am taking Contrave to lose weight. Lost 30 lbs in 4 months. It is a drug that's composed of an anti-depressant and an opioid antagonist. Together they have a synergistic effect that represses binging envy and cuts appetite. It also has a repressive effect on drinking and smoke, to my great surprise. And it also has had an effect on my addiction to video games. Drugs companies get a lot of slack (most of the time deserving) but sometimes they create miracles pills.
aaron695 3y ago
[dead]
olegious 3y ago
Just a heads up “weight loss” is a poor metric if it comes at the cost of lean muscle mass. It seems that 39% of weight loss associated with Ozempic comes from lean muscle mass which isn’t great. https://peterattiamd.com/the-downside-of-glp-1-receptor-agonists/ https://peterattiamd.com/the-downside-of-glp-1-receptor-agon...
- WheelsAtLarge 3y ago
  When you diet to lose weight you lose lean muscle too unless you exercise to minimize it. What's the lean muscle mass loss from just dieting? I would guess that it's a relatively large number too.
- paulpauper 3y ago
  Though a certain amount of lean loss is inevitable with significant weight reduction (usually about 25% of total weight loss), the goal is to increase the body’s overall proportion of lean mass – in other words, to improve body composition. lean loss does not mean muscle loss
- hombre_fatal 3y ago
  There's no shortage of people debunking that charlatan. https://twitter.com/MichaelAlbertMD/status/1647036417250304000 https://twitter.com/MichaelAlbertMD/status/16470364172503040...
  - ddlutz 3y ago
    Why do you think Peter Attia is a charlatan? Out of all these longevity & health influencers he seems most realistic & knowledgeable.
  - benrapscallion 3y ago
    In 2020, Diabetologia published a body composition analysis of 88 volunteers with type 2 diabetes who used semaglutide for one year. These participants lost an average of 12.5 pounds. Of that weight loss, there was a 7.5-pound reduction in fat mass and a 5-pound reduction in lean mass. In 2021, a major trial of semaglutide’s weight loss potency examined the body composition of a minority of participants. These patients did not have diabetes, and they took a much larger dose of the drug. The 95 participants to undergo a body scan lost an average of 18 pounds of fat — and 12 pounds of lean mass. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6997246/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6997246/
xvilka 3y ago
I tried Ozempic for two months but wasn't able to continue - the gastrointestinal side effects are unbearable. I can confirm lack of desire to eat and drink alcohol. The hunger didn't go away but after a few bites of anything it quickly evaporated. After dropping the drug the hunger steeply increased, even higher than before, that was hard to contain.
breezingfast 3y ago
[dead]
EdwardDiego 3y ago
From my experience of addiction, suppressing the sensation of pleasure derived, is only the start. People who are addicted will repeat the behaviour even without the neurochemical response. Consider the ritual of the addiction as a form of self-soothing. You have to treat the patterns we've trod in our own minds, as well as removing that biological reinforcement.
jamesfisher 3y ago
https://archive.is/BUo29 https://archive.is/BUo29
MagicMoonlight 3y ago
I was always of the opinion that being fat was a moral failing. Trying the drug really changed that. Normies have it so easy. They take one bite and feel full. My brain would scream at me continuously to try and make me eat and would never be satisfied.
- sourcecodeplz 3y ago
  It's the same for me. I resorted to just eating yogurt, vegetables and fruits in between meals. Give it a try.
  - MagicMoonlight 3y ago
    I'd rather take the medication that stops the addiction. You can't eat your way out of an eating disorder
- thegreenswede 3y ago
  "they take one bite and feel full"- I strongly disagree with this as the reason some people are just lean. As someone who's bounced around weight a lot and also had long periods where I had to basically control it (wrestling in college), the main difference I've seen with people who are in shape and people are overeat is that the former group understands that it's 'ok' to not feel full all the time. As in like learning the TRUE difference between appetite and hunger. I've had periods where I gained 50lb in like 4 months (start of pandemic) and all I had to do to basically get back to baseline is remind myself that I'm not going to die just bc I'm not constantly full. But i definitely don't get 'full' after a few bites. I can keep eating and eating for sure. It's more that being what we call traditionally "full" is actually just wayyyyy overeating.
  - gerbilly 3y ago
    When I'm on vacation my stress is reduced to the point where my 'appetite' drops, and this is despite the fact that I'm increasing my exercise load enormously (surfing, hiking, etc...) I've noticed that stress causes me mild stomach pain, which can register as hunger. It also causes dry mouth which registers as thirst. If you're satisfying that thirst with sugary drinks long term, then you're going to be in trouble. There is also so much novelty and more interesting stuff going on while on vacation that I don't find myself poking through the fridge out of boredom.
Eumenes 3y ago
Congrats, you're now a lifetime subscriber to big pharma
fintechie 3y ago
I was about to get on semaglutide and after extensive research I thought "wait, the results won't be much better than the periods of IF I've had in the past, and the reported benefits are similar", and without side effects. Dropping 30 pounds in 3 months? easy to achieve with the Warrior Diet or OMAD versions of IF. The results are exactly the same... you fill full eating less quantity, cravings disappear after 1-2 weeks, increased focus and enhanced mental state. But yeah, you need some self-discipline, tons of coffee/matcha and water. I've concluded that semaglutide is not for me. Just like self-discipline in pills, with potential side effects. So better to give IF another go... I'm in the 4th week and dropped 10lbs already.
jshaqaw 3y ago
It’s interesting to me how much of the hostility to this drug has a moral dimension. I am quite fit for my middle age. It’s a relative superpower which confers a degree of status in this world. It’s not why I originally became fit 5 or so years ago but it’s something I increasingly notice or to be clear others notice and comment on. I think the “fit” of the world get inherently uncomfortable that our relative social currency is being “devalued” if everyone can be like us with an “unearned” pill. And it comes out as hostility and skepticism. I admit haven’t done much research on this particular topic. History should caution us that serious medication like this often has serious side effects which are not apparent early on. I get that. But unlike many others I don’t “hope” that happens like some kind of moral balancing. I get that reaction. In my gut I have that “I did it with willpower and lifestyle and sweat and these people shouldn’t just get it at CVS.” But that’s just the primate status brain talking. Not that it impacts the outcome but I sincerely hope these drugs can improve people’s lives without significant negative problems. I can find my relative status elsewhere or better yet try to grow up past such impulses.
- joedevon 3y ago
  Well said. I believe you are right. That and ignorance of how Leptin works, setpoint or lipostat theory of bodyweight regulation...once you've gotten fat, your setpoint goes up and the hunger signals are far greater than folks who have never gotten fat. You can have 2 athletes with identical weight height and BF%, but if one had been fat once, their hunger signals from the brain will be far greater than the athlete who was always slim.
- briHass 3y ago
  Those of us that work out, however, have been dealing with 'cheating with drugs' for a while: steroids. When you get close with enough gym rats, it's utterly shocking how many people with a muscular build use steroids. It's to the point where I essentially don't believe anyone claiming 'natty' (natural) status if they have more than a 1 sigma increase in musculature. It's also downright laughable how the media/Youtube influencers/etc. treat everyone like idiots. Men's Health will run an article on Mr. Moviestar who was 5'11' and 150 pounds before his role as Superhero Character got to 200 pounds and veiny biceps in 6 months by eating eggs, oatmeal, and chicken breast and doing some situps.

288 points by explosion-s 3y ago

crakenzak 3y ago

Now if only it didn’t cost so damn much every month even under insurance =(

BizarroLand 3y ago
You can buy it as a "research chemical" and save money, but then the potential consequences of diy medicine and all that that entails are all on you. Hopefully the price will come down more as it becomes more prevalent or as generics become available.
- rektide 3y ago
  I'm not that afraid of swallowing random chemicals but self injecting is a bit hardcore for me.
  - EthicalSimilar 3y ago
    FWIW, SubQ injections are pretty much completely unnoticeable in terms of pain / feeling at all. It’s more the mental barrier of doing it to yourself but once you’ve done it for the first time you soon realise it’s fine.
    - rektide 3y ago
      The actual doing it seems wild/absurd, but I don't think that would hold me back. This is ignorant/uniformed, but, taking research chemical by ingestion feels like I have some natural barriers still. Where-as I feel like there's a much more raw exposure to risk with injection. Also there's dumb risks like infection, if I don't attend well enough to injections. In spite of these protests, I think you are probably much closer to the truth here. Thanks for writing. These reactions I have are, I suspect, not really significant.
      - idontwantthis 3y ago
        Counterpoint: Don’t inject yourself with stuff you found on the internet because people on the internet told you it’s ok.
  - opportune 3y ago
    Steroid users do it all the time and I haven’t heard of steroid users dealing with infections much.
    - pixl97 3y ago
      I'm sure its because most people aren't going to talk about illegal drug use and when it goes wrong.
      - opportune 3y ago
        There are tons of online places where people openly discuss steroid use like r/steroids and many oldschool phpbb-style steroid forums
- scheme271 3y ago
  GLP-1 agonists are a bit more tricky since they are temperature sensitive and need to be injected. You'll really need to be careful to keep it sterile and handle it properly. Whether the "research chemical" will receive the proper care until it gets into your hands is something that you're literally gambling your health on.
  - reaperman 3y ago
    You ship it as a dry/lypohilized powder, both semaglutide and tirzepatide survives long China->Europe shipping in the summer just fine, with customs delays. The testing I've seen showed 99.965% purity of semaglutide after 22 days in shipping from China to Poland during April. Tirzepatide shows 99.064% purity after 58 days of shipping in October-November. These didn't start out at 100.00% purity either, so they likely experienced absolutely minimal degradation in shipment. You reconstitute it with Bacteriostatic Water which is available without a prescription in the USA and contains 0.9% benzyl alcohol to inhibit bacterial growth. If you're particularly concerned you buy a 0.22 micrometer PVDF "syringe filter" and pump it through that to another, fresh/sealed sterile vial which you can get for like $2.00 from a medical supply company (the syringe, filter, and vials are gamma-irradiated to destroy any remnants of RNA/DNA). That size filtration will filter out any lifeforms (fungal, bacterial, viral) while allowing the peptide/drug itself to pass through. So you get a guaranteed sterile solution out of the filter.
    - quazar 3y ago
      Where do you buy it from to ship to Poland?
      - reaperman 3y ago
        Anything specific would be inappropriate for this forum. But the broad answer is a chemicals distributor in China. I actually only utilize them for legal "nutritional" compounds, but others use them for pharmaceutical options, and those are independently tested frequently by a variety of stakeholders. Personally I really wish US citizens didn't feel forced to go outside of the quality protections of the FDA for their medical care.
toomuchtodo 3y ago
Going to be huge when it goes off patent off exclusivity. I'd also expect you'll be able to get it when it's made in jurisdictions that will ignore the patent. Up to you to get it from those places, either via mail or travel runs.
- tboyd47 3y ago
  They will find some way to prevent people from acquiring it and promote some other in-patent drug.
  - toomuchtodo 3y ago
    Lots of ways around jurisdictional regs. Consider how many people live near a national border, or have access to the postal service. https://www.usnews.com/news/best-states/articles/2018-11-01/utah-insurance-company-is-paying-people-to-pick-up-their-prescriptions-in-mexico https://www.usnews.com/news/best-states/articles/2018-11-01/... https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7523158/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7523158/ https://www.cnn.com/2023/03/07/health/fda-drug-shipments-khn-partner/index.html https://www.cnn.com/2023/03/07/health/fda-drug-shipments-khn... https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/health/2022/12/14/states-challenge-biden-administration-drug-imports-canada/10890258002/ https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/health/2022/12/14/states... Also, I expect CRISPR or gene therapy to be the long game wrt this and updating the body's GLP-1 regulation, versus maintenance doses of a pharma product. This is a shim. https://benmay.uchicago.edu/crispr-gene-therapy https://benmay.uchicago.edu/crispr-gene-therapy https://www.creative-biogene.com/crispr-cas9/solution/glp1r-gene-editing.html https://www.creative-biogene.com/crispr-cas9/solution/glp1r-...
  - HDThoreaun 3y ago
    It is not possible to stop people from getting mail order pills from China. Especially with the abortion restrictions the market already is pretty large and it will be easy for them to throw these drugs in too.
    - trasz4 3y ago
scheme271 3y ago
It's not the only GLP-1 agonist out there. Victoza is another GLP-1 agonist and should be going generic in the US in a little over a year. It might already be available as a generic outside the US. There might be other GLP-1 agonists that are going generic soon as well.
reaperman 3y ago
You can get these wholesale from China from "reputable" gray-market wholesalers who get the chemicals made at contract manufacturing facilities. BYO QA/QC though, as with all non-FDA drugs. That's the huge catch, and it sucks for consumers. Testing just for active ingredient is >$100 and takes about a month. Testing for proper buffering agents, harmful contaminants, microbial contamination, etc is essentially unavailable at all. Semaglutide is very, very cheap in the gray market. It's somewhat less effective than Tirzepatide and has slightly more side effects if you ramp up the dosage too quickly. If an annual amount is purchased on the gray market, this brings the monthly cost down to: - Semaglutide: $10/month - Tirzepatide: $60/month - Liraglutide: $87/month - LY3437943: I have not yet seen this available, but it looks like distributors are notifying manufacturers of latent demand and are working to build up a supply chain. Note that in the USA, it is legal to import certain amounts of FDA-approved drugs if you have a prescription for them. However, just because something is the exact same chemical as an FDA-approved drug does not make it an FDA-approved drug. It must be manufactured in an FDA certified facility and be the same brand/manufacturer/packaging/labeling/etc as the approved drug. e.g. importing generic Sildenafil/Viagra is legal if you can find the Teva(tm) brand generic sildenafil in, say, Mexico or Canada for a better price. But it must be the pills manufactured by Teva in the appropriate facility with NDC #0093-5342-56[0]. If you import generic sildenafil "Cenforce" from the (very legitimate but not FDA-approved) Indian pharmaceutical manufacturer "Centurion Laboratories"... ...that would still be potentially criminal smuggling. Even if the pills you import show via laboratory test that they precisely match your medical prescription, they are not "FDA approved" and therefore not legal to import. A lot of people do though! 0: https://ndclist.com/ndc/0093-5342/package/0093-5342-56 https://ndclist.com/ndc/0093-5342/package/0093-5342-56
- etchasketch 3y ago
  Interesting.
- chriscappuccio 3y ago
  where is this grey market? apparently it's not as simple as just searching aliexpress :)

akiselev 3y ago

https://archive.ph/1waP9 https://archive.ph/1waP9

tboyd47 3y ago

[flagged]

roywiggins 3y ago
Wegovy- semaglutide- is approved for weight loss "in adults with obesity or overweight with at least one weight-related condition (such as high blood pressure, type 2 diabetes, or high cholesterol)": https://www.fda.gov/news-events/press-announcements/fda-approves-new-drug-treatment-chronic-weight-management-first-2014 https://www.fda.gov/news-events/press-announcements/fda-appr...
- tboyd47 3y ago
  I appreciate the reply, really.
trasz4 3y ago
One works, the other doesn't.
- hayst4ck 3y ago
  Ivermectin did feasibly improve covid outcomes, but only in places where worms were common, which is not the US. So it's true that people like the one you are responding to are ignorant and can't really understand nuance and that they are also wrong for their lack of trust in institutions, but institutions also failed to communicate to those ignorant people and that is a problem all of it's own. Very fun science read that I hope humbles you a little: https://astralcodexten.substack.com/p/ivermectin-much-more-than-you-wanted https://astralcodexten.substack.com/p/ivermectin-much-more-t...
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]

mym1990 3y ago

A drug that promotes weight loss, lessens the desire to smoke, drink, etc...sounds too good to be true? From what I have heard, all of these issues come back as soon as someone comes off the drug. So either a person is committing to a lifetime of being dependent on this drug, or a person is committing to some period of time of ideal living, followed by a possible time of depression after reverting to the status quo.

karaterobot 3y ago
For a lot of people, it's kind of a choice of which substance you are going to be dependent on. It's all expensive and sad, but between Ozempic and cigarettes, alcohol, or overeating, Ozempic has got to be healthier, and quite possibly cheaper in the long run.
- nancyhn 3y ago
  Is a drug or drug-like-food (ie, sugar) dependency really the only option?
  - oniony 3y ago
    No, there's also badmington.
  - deegles 3y ago
    What do you suggest otherwise? Clearly whatever we're doing now has led us to this point.
  - karaterobot 3y ago
    Versus, like, "just suck it up"? No, but empirically that strategy has had poor results across the wider population. It seems like it would work, but usually doesn't. At some point people look for more effective strategies.
  - yamtaddle 3y ago
    It's that, or dropping out of modern life, as far as I can tell. Everyone's on something and/or coping in unhealthy ways.

myshpa 3y ago

Psilocybin too.

rektide 3y ago

I'm surprised Ozempic gets all the press. Supposedly Mounjaro is all that and more. The wonderful Paul Ford has the best writeup I've seen that discusses these more meta levels, the post-human implications of a drug we can genuinely widescalely reprogram ourselves with. Paul's so great. https://www.wired.com/story/new-drug-switched-off-appetite-mounjaro/ https://www.wired.com/story/new-drug-switched-off-appetite-m... https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34660232 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34660232

HDThoreaun 3y ago
Ozempic has been around longer and there were a bunch of celebrities taking it and talking about it on twitter so I think it has more cultural cachet. Most people probably don't know about mounjaro, I don't even think it's approved for weight loss yet.
kristofferR 3y ago
Massive text: "People taking Mounjaro lost up to 25 LBS" Small text underneath: "Mounjaro is not a weight loss drug." Man, the US pharma industry/marketing is so weird. https://www.mounjaro.com/#:~:text=mounjaro%20is%20not%20a%20weight%20loss%20drug https://www.mounjaro.com/#:~:text=mounjaro%20is%20not%20a%20....
- iwanttocomment 3y ago
  Mounjaro is not yet approved for weight loss in the US even though there is strong evidence that it will be, and there's little question that there has generally been weight loss in those taking it for diabetes. Recent studies have very clearly shown it's effective for weight loss even in those without diabetes, but there's a lag as the FDA reviews those studies. Until then, Lilly simply can't advertise it as a treatment for obesity.
- refurb 3y ago
  It’s not weird at all if you’re aware of the regulations. Drug companies can’t promote a drug for something it’s not FDA approved for (off-label promotion). Companies face multi-billion dollar penalties for doing so. Mounjaro is approved for type 2 diabetes. And weight loss is a great way to help get your type 2 diabetes under control. So highlighting that it helps type 2 patients lose weight, while having an FDA mandated disclosure that it’s not approved for weight loss alone, makes perfect sense.

lumb63 3y ago

I’m glad people are enjoying Ozempic. My experience from seeing a family member on it, is I would not touch it if I were a 500-pound alcoholic smoking two packs of cigarettes a day. That’s an exaggeration since it probably outweighs the health issues there, but only slightly. The person I know taking Ozempic has only lost weight (35 lbs) due to the fact that eating now makes her sick. She has been sapped of all energy and has developed issues with her bladder, circulatory system, joints, thyroid, and digestive system since starting Ozempic. I’m not saying it’s due to Ozempic, but I am saying all these issues have cropped up in the few months since she started taking it, and she never had any chronic health issues prior. At least she lost some weight, I guess.

ikekkdcjkfke 3y ago
Same experience here, gallstone attacks
- shrimp_emoji 3y ago
  You can get those from rapid weight loss, I thought. Maybe it's working TOO well if that's the case.
  - jjeaff 3y ago
    Ya, rapid weight loss is one of the most common triggers of gall stones. Lots of weight loss surgery patients get them as well.
    - winocm 3y ago
      Happened to me too from just generally not eating much at the time. Ended up getting acute cholecystitis and a dead gallbladder plus sepsis after. Not too pleasant of an experience.
burnte 3y ago
I take it, and when I started I got violently nauseous and had GI issues. I wasn't informed I needed to slowly ramp up. I still have pretty big appetite suppression, and only minimal nausea sometimes if I eat too much, but what it's done to my blood glucose is AMAZING. And I lost some weight when I started which was a great bonus. It can be hard to start but it's truly worth it, just adjust the dose. I take 0.5mg as I can't handle the larger 1.0mg dose.

NickC25 3y ago

[flagged]

renewiltord 3y ago
Sometimes I see people have written a bug in code and I wonder why they didn't just do the obvious and write it without the bug. Personally, every time I'm about to introduce a bug I just choose to not do it.
- moonchrome 3y ago
  I mean if you know ahead of time the thing you're doing is going to produce buggy code then yep your analogy holds.
  - renewiltord 3y ago
    Yeah, it's weird, right? But people keep putting use-after-free bugs everywhere. Like, do the OpenBSD guys not know that this is a bug (and worse, a security bug)? They keep putting them everywhere. A few years ago they stuck one in OpenSMTPD. Theo de Raadt would benefit from reading some Hacker News.
    - moonchrome 3y ago
      That's like saying obese people are the same as bodybuilders because they both eat surplus calories and have high BMI.
amanaplanacanal 3y ago
Unfortunately, suggesting that people eat less and exercise more doesn’t seem to actually work that well. We’ve been trying that for decades and the obesity epidemic just keeps getting worse.
- shagymoe 3y ago
  Have we though? I seriously doubt doctors are aggressively pushing eating well and exercising. Has anyone ever received a workout plan from their doctor besides some generic PT exercises? Do they develop nutrition plans tailored to you? Do they track your progress? Do they have any incentive for you to actually get better? Do they require regular blood tests and include all the tests that might actually tell them something? The answer is a resounding no. None of that. Even if you request a blood test, they will include the absolute bare minimum and fight you when you request something like vitamin D or testosterone. General healthcare in the US is farce. You must be your own doctor, do your own research and fight for the care you need and also tolerate doctors telling you that you don't know what you're talking about. Besides being prescribed antibiotics, no doctor has ever fixed any problem I've ever had. I had to do it myself.

omgmajk 3y ago

I was on ozempic for a bit but it raised my resting pulse from 65ish to 95ish just sitting at my computer so I had to stop taking it.

bitwize 3y ago

[flagged]

glonq 3y ago

What happens when you reach your target weight with drugs like this? After having learned potentionally nothing about nutrition, exercise, and self-control, are you stuck on these meds for life out of fear of binge-eating back to your original weight? FWIW I'm on a hundred-pound roller coaster ride from 300lbs to 200lbs; currently ~215. I've learned a lot about discipline and sustainable habits along the way.

opportune 3y ago
I’ve never been obese but after losing 30+ lbs of weight I found it a lot easier to live an active lifestyle and keep the weight off. Partly it was just that moving around was physically easier and less strenuous, but also that I was less self conscious and had higher self esteem. I imagine Ozempic will help with this even if people don’t learn about nutrition per se. Though I think basically everybody knows nutrition, it’s more about self control IME.
op00to 3y ago
What happens when someone who was previously deeply depressed but feels better goes off an antidepressant? They learn to handle life, or they return to the drug if further treatment is needed. It’s not a moral failing.
- jasonfarnon 3y ago
  I don't think you need to bring morality into it. OP is just asking, do you develop your own tools to address the problem, or rely on another's forever? There are lots of practical non-moral answers to that question.
- gnulinux 3y ago
  As an anecdote: at my worst (when I was clearly suicidal, insomniac and emotionally unstable) I was on antidepressants (Prozac) and it helped me a lot. It made me very emotionally stable. I got off Prozac after a couple years to try it out and I felt much better. Over that year, I started feeling similarly terrible due to COVID world. Went back to Prozac. Once again made me very stable. Stopped using Prozac in mid 2022, again to see if I feel good without it. Since then have been feeling much, much better. Of course, mental health is a constant battle, you fight one day at a time, but I consider my depression as close to "cured" as possible because over the last year I felt pretty normal without any drugs. Things to note are, along the way I stopped drinking alcohol which helped me tons. Before 2020 I was a huge drinker (not alcoholic, but every day heavy drinker). Initially, I started smoking weed. This helped a ton because I stopped drinking completely, but I wasn't getting very high every day and I thought THC helped quite a bit too. Eventually, in late 2022 I stopped using THC too. I'm completely drug free now. I believe that both Prozac and THC helped me significantly to get out of depression. In addition to drugs, CBT (cognitive behavioral therapy), therapy in general and getting a cat has been extremely helpful as well. This is just an anecdote, every brain is different. Never self medicate, see a doctor and a therapist!

beefman 3y ago

https://archive.is/MfXlm https://archive.is/MfXlm

arcadeparade 3y ago

Some people really love to moralize and cite anecdotes about Ozempic.

armchairhacker 3y ago
Moralizing about weight loss is upsetting, as someone whose thankfully considers themselves "naturally thin". It's 100% true the vast majority (including me) needs to put some discipline into eating and exercise: normal people can't just eat whatever they want whenever they feel hungry. But normal people don't get fat eating whole foods, working out, eating below their demographic's daily intake; and normal people don't suffer immense fatigue on tiny calorie deficits or even maintenance. People with thyroid and other metabolic issues do. Which IMO completely destroys the "moral" argument for weight. (And it's also probably true that most overweight people don't eat whole foods and work out daily. That doesn't mean its right to call out some random fat person eating a mildly-unhealthy meal. You have no idea what else they've eaten that day, what else is going on around them, and you wouldn't call out a skinny person who eats the same.)
- mrcrumb1 3y ago
  I'm a person who has vacillated between being close to normal weight and obese. I think people who don't have problems controlling their diet tend to underestimate just how hard it can be to eat at a calorie deficit or even just maintenance when you've lost a large amount of weight. When I'm at my lowest weight I literally am thinking about food constantly and my maintenance calorie intake drops to about 1500-1800 calories.
  - Danjoe4 3y ago
    [flagged]
  - DoreenMichele 3y ago
    FWIW, I lost multiple dress sizes without counting calories or starving myself by eating a more nutrient dense diet.
  - 3y ago

Avshalom 3y ago

"Semaglutide does not dull all pleasure, people taking the drug for weight loss told me. They could still enjoy a few bites of food or revel in finding the perfect dress; they just no longer went overboard. Anhedonia, or a general diminished ability to experience pleasure, also hasn’t shown up in cohorts of people who take the drug for diabetes, says Elisabet Jerlhag Holm, an addiction researcher at the University of Gothenburg." So it doesn't dull all pleasure just almost all so it's not technically anhedonia... I dunno, still seem pretty fucking bleak to me.

kevviiinn 3y ago
Our experience exists on a series of spectrums, some people experience pleasure way too intensely and it actually causes problems which is why this might be a good thing Obviously there are people who like the pleasure given to them by food a bit too much and they consistently overindulge, it can be that way for many things as well. I'm not saying that the cause is always related but for many it may be
Taywee 3y ago
Addiction is often extremely distressing. Dulled pleasure can be far better than drinking yourself into a stupor every single night.
contravariant 3y ago
I'm not sure it is pleasure driving people to go overboard. I'm pretty sure it is dissatisfaction that is driving excess. In which case a drug that means you're more easily satisfied is far from bleak. If anything the opposite is far more bleak. Imagine if there was a drug that meant you're less easily satisfied, who on earth would want that?
- tetrep 3y ago
  > If anything the opposite is far more bleak. Imagine if there was a drug that meant you're less easily satisfied, who on earth would want that? That sounds like stimulants. You wouldn't be motivated to do things if you were satisfied, so any drugs that motivate people would seem to need to have to have such an effect.

throwaway5959 3y ago

Wasn’t this the plot of the Firefly movie? It didn’t work out well for them.

pixl97 3y ago
I mean the opposite where we're fattening up ourselves like lambs for the slaughter isn't working out great either. We've had recent downward trend in longevity.

caycep 3y ago

it's funny in that a few years ago we were (and still are) excited by the potential cellular protective properties of GLP1 agonists, not just in the pancreas but in brain glial cells or whatnot. So much so that it seems to be the most neuroprotective of recent candidates for Parkinson's disease disease-modifying-therapies (DMTs). to whit, (like botox), all the initial promises of the stuff have been waaaay overshadowed by...cosmetic value. (I'm oversimplifying a bit...for those who are morbidly obese, yes, the weight loss really helps, but then they also have diabetes most likely which is the primary indication of the drug)

SamoyedFurFluff 3y ago

How long is the research info ozempic and other hormonal weight loss drugs? Remember the last miracle drug that went to the market for weight loss had to be retracted for killing people or damaging their hearts to the tune of over 10 billion dollars in damages paid out.

ESTheComposer 3y ago
These types of medications have been around since the 2000s, semaglutide (ozempic) specifically since 2012.
dillydogg 3y ago
At least in this case GLP-1 antagonists have been in clinical use for diabetes since around 2010
jjeaff 3y ago
While I am not saying that this drug is definitely safe, I think the fact that Fen-phen turned out to be more dangerous doesn't really implicate these new drugs because while the desired outcome is the same, the class and type of drugs seem to be entirely different. My understanding is that fen-phen is a stimulant and increased blood pressure and heart rate. It also includes some other drugs that affect serotonin levels. These new drugs are peptide analogs that affect your body's digestion and how it deals with sugar and fat production and insulin.
reaperman 3y ago
Drugs acting on GLP-1 (ozempic), GIP, and glucagon receptors are largely shown to help hearts and cardiovascular health specifically (and independently of weight loss). They also improve lipid profiles (HDL/LDL), and have a multitude of other benefits. Whether they, for example, increase the rate of glial brain cancer ... they really haven't been out long enough to know.

jmpman 3y ago

I’ve been on Mounjaro since August. Down almost 60lbs, and it’s been a life changer. Have I had some gastrointestinal issues, sure, but expected. I feel great and my brain seems to be functioning as well as when I was in my 20’s. Now, when I go to the bar with friends, I end up having maybe 2 beers and although enjoyable, I don’t feel that light switch turning on which encourages me to drink more. Can I force myself to keep drinking, say if my good friends are in town and we’re going out all night? Sure, but there’s some reward center that’s no longer lighting up. I just get drunker, but it’s not more pleasurable. I was never a big drinker at home by myself. Maybe a glass of wine or two with dinner if my in-laws are coming over. Now I’ve literally had zero drinks at home by myself. Seems to have started changing about 3 month in. Work also seems more interesting, but my untreated ADHD seems to be getting worse.

raincom 3y ago
I heard Mounjaro is even more effective than Semaglutide.
yieldcrv 3y ago
the most surprising thing to me is how you’re describing normal behavior that I can relate to all my life, but the community of strugglers is so big that this is a whole testimonial people feel comfortable and exalted to share like thats not something I’m deriding its just news to me makes me wonder what this drug actually does, flush gut bacteria? just the right ones?
- andbberger 3y ago
  it's a GLP-1 agonist
  - 015UUZn8aEvW 3y ago
    Ozempic/Wegovy is a GLP-1 receptor agonist, but Mounjaro is a GLP-1 and GIP receptor agonist
- ramraj07 3y ago

LazyMans 3y ago

Yes. On a compounded semaglutide. I can finally control my hunger and a nice unexpected effect has been losing a desire to drink large quantities of alcohol. I don’t drink during the week anyway, but it seems to be the volume that turns me off to drinking. Thus a few cocktails are all I can tolerate. For context, Im 30, male, would be defined as a binge drinker on weekends. Oh, and I’ve given up nicotine entirely. I can’t tell if the drug is helping or it was just a point in my life that I finally decided I accept it makes me feel ill most of the time.

AtlasBarfed 3y ago
I'd hazard a guess that nicotine is one of the two or three most addictive substances known to humanity. Opiates/heroin is probably worse, world of warcraft is probably third :-) The drug probably helped.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
- Waterluvian 3y ago
  Don’t forget caffeine!
  - LazyMans 3y ago
    I like caffeine, unfortunately even small amounts tend to make me irritable and sick at the end of the day. Wasn’t always like that
    - runsWphotons 3y ago
      What changed and when?
      - LazyMans 3y ago
        I’m not sure what, but a few years ago caffeine started to give me anxiety sometimes, or sick. I guess I just got older.

monkeycantype 3y ago

the genetics of obesity are amazing. we all have a unique combination of genes, and epigenic features that influece the endocrine and neuronal pathways that drive the desire to eat, these different genotypes affect our behaviour. Ozempic is putting a thumb on the scales of this pathway, but this pathway is balanced differently in all of us. Think of the most hungry you have ever been, in some people this never stops, in others it's dialed up or down. there are some great papers on fat labradors that hint at how these different genotypes are linked to our desire to eat and how that shifts our behaiour. Guide dogs are highly selected for trainability, and positive reinforcement with food reward plays an important role in their training. I think it was Yeo, found 22% of pet Labradors and 80% of Labrador guide dogs sampled carried a 14 BP deletion in the POMC gene, which forms part of this pathway. https://doi.org/10.1007/s00125-016-4187-x https://doi.org/10.1007/s00125-016-4187-x https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4873617/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4873617/

Jun8 3y ago

So, instead is suppressing the desire to eat, how about inventing a drug that blocks the absorption or breakdown of carbohydrates in the gut? Or maybe control the gut biome so that growth of bacteria that breaks down high calorie food is minimized. Is this faster-than-light-like impossible daydream or is there any plausible path to it?

paulpauper 3y ago
this is what gastric bypass tries to do. it bypasses part of the digestive process
coke12 3y ago
Consider Alli, the drug that blocks fat absorption in the body. It already exists and works reasonably well for weight loss. The side effects can be gross and unpleasant though.
Auracle 3y ago
I don’t know if I want a drug to exist that allows people to be gluttons without consequence. It’s like a modern (and real) vomitorium.
- cromulent 3y ago
  Some people will tell you though that they can eat anything and not put on weight - this is simply allowing others to do the same, right. A vomitorium is simply the large exit pathway in stadia for rapid egress of many people. The idea that ancient Romans had facilities dedicated to vomiting has been debunked.
  - Auracle 3y ago
    That's why I said (real), I know they didn't exist - though I'm guessing somewhere, sometime in history it has. Those people that tell you they can eat anything and not put on weight have a very different idea of what "anything" is than fat people, with probably an actual exception here and there (along with teenagers).

therein 3y ago

[flagged]

tomcam 3y ago

Ozempic did nothing for me

PostOnce 3y ago

Exercise is free and the side effects are you get stronger, more energetic, and better looking. Ozempic costs money and its side effects include cancer, kidney failure, and ruining your eyes. https://www.ozempic.com/faqs.html https://www.ozempic.com/faqs.html edit: many point out calorie intake is the real problem, it's true: buy a kitchen scale, weigh your food, count your calories, and you will lose weight. Exercise is optional compared to that. Still, both are free and have more benefits.

caymanjim 3y ago
Exercise does nothing for weight loss if you're eating too much. Exercise has health benefits, but weight loss is not one of them for the vast majority of people. People wildly overestimate how many calories they're burning.
- dmix 3y ago
  s/calories/carbs Calories can still be a useful metric as a proxy but low calorie (“diet”) foods tend to compensate with more carbs. At least the ones I see regularly at my grocery store. As a side note: It’s actually difficult to find pre-packaged low carb food at regular grocery stores sadly. It requires effort to make yourself, just like going to the gym. Like most good things in life.
  - uranium 3y ago
    Lots of grocers will have hard sausages, cheeses, olives, and nuts. It's not as easy as chips and food bars, I'll grant you, but it's doable.
  - tuatoru 3y ago
    Low glycemic index carbs are available. I find I eat smaller portions and feel full for longer with low GI rice vs ordinary rice, for example.
- justsomehnguy 3y ago
  > People wildly overestimate how many calories they're burning. And people wildly underestimate how many calories they need. Just by limiting the one portion to 50g of pasta, instead of my preferred 150+g, I can go under 100kg in less than a week. My 'how much should I cook' habits formed when I was young and spent at least a couple of hours commuting, but nowadays I'm quite literally just sit on my ass all day. It's bothersome and isn't fulfilling to use scales cut down on the food (especially if it's tasty) but...

ingenika 3y ago

maybe useful to treat drug addiction ?

clementmas 3y ago

Is this mostly a US drug? I never heard about it in France. I can't believe people love it so much without thinking about the actual source of their problem.

throwawayadvsec 3y ago
The source of the problem is that animals are wired to eat as much food as possible as quickly as possible. You can't blame half of the population for something that is deeply wired into our brain and bodies.
- prawn 3y ago
  I think you can ultimately blame them, but you can also accept that for many it's a very difficult problem to overcome and that finding other ways to tackle it has value to the individual and community.
benrapscallion 3y ago
No, it is approved by EMA. https://www.has-sante.fr/jcms/c_2906429/fr/ozempic-semaglutide https://www.has-sante.fr/jcms/c_2906429/fr/ozempic-semagluti...

tremere 3y ago

[flagged]

jacobrussell 3y ago
Congrats -- many people cannot do that, and would like to be able to.
mattpallissard 3y ago
I'm a former alcoholic. I quit cold turkey years ago. Had a drug problem before that. Cold turkey as well. While I agree with you somewhat, I too don't like the narrative, I also realize that some people actually can't do that. Some people are faster, some smarter, some stronger, and some of us are better at sticking to a resolution. Everyone has things they're good at and things they struggle at despite the effort. Gotta find what works for you personally.
- tremere 3y ago
  I'm happy you've quit your former habits and I celebrate you. Just so you know, the point of my post isn't to rip on people with low willpower or to brag about mine (which would be false valor anyway--there are reasons I had issues with alcohol and drugs to begin with). The thesis of my post is that the narrative is that you need a drug to get better. Ozempic is supposed to be a treatment applied to people who are not yet overweight enough for bariatric surgery, yet it is being used ubiquitously. What does that tell you about the mind share differences between "you need a drug to get better" versus "you can just stop"? The idea that another drug is your only way out is but a shadow on the wall of a cave, puppeteered by Big Pharma, people need to free themselves, escape outside and see the sun. Additionally, my post was "flagged" which is a bit hilarious. I wonder what part of my post was hateful or otherwise below the standards of this forum. Unless you define hate as being critical of big pharma.
  - mattpallissard 3y ago
    I think we're more or less on the same page. And honestly, flagging a comment based on disagreement is a pretty shitty move. I've noticed that happening more often here.

TeeMassive 3y ago

I am taking Contrave to lose weight. Lost 30 lbs in 4 months. It is a drug that's composed of an anti-depressant and an opioid antagonist. Together they have a synergistic effect that represses binging envy and cuts appetite. It also has a repressive effect on drinking and smoke, to my great surprise. And it also has had an effect on my addiction to video games. Drugs companies get a lot of slack (most of the time deserving) but sometimes they create miracles pills.

aaron695 3y ago

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olegious 3y ago

Just a heads up “weight loss” is a poor metric if it comes at the cost of lean muscle mass. It seems that 39% of weight loss associated with Ozempic comes from lean muscle mass which isn’t great. https://peterattiamd.com/the-downside-of-glp-1-receptor-agonists/ https://peterattiamd.com/the-downside-of-glp-1-receptor-agon...

WheelsAtLarge 3y ago
When you diet to lose weight you lose lean muscle too unless you exercise to minimize it. What's the lean muscle mass loss from just dieting? I would guess that it's a relatively large number too.
paulpauper 3y ago
Though a certain amount of lean loss is inevitable with significant weight reduction (usually about 25% of total weight loss), the goal is to increase the body’s overall proportion of lean mass – in other words, to improve body composition. lean loss does not mean muscle loss
hombre_fatal 3y ago
There's no shortage of people debunking that charlatan. https://twitter.com/MichaelAlbertMD/status/1647036417250304000 https://twitter.com/MichaelAlbertMD/status/16470364172503040...
- ddlutz 3y ago
  Why do you think Peter Attia is a charlatan? Out of all these longevity & health influencers he seems most realistic & knowledgeable.
- benrapscallion 3y ago
  In 2020, Diabetologia published a body composition analysis of 88 volunteers with type 2 diabetes who used semaglutide for one year. These participants lost an average of 12.5 pounds. Of that weight loss, there was a 7.5-pound reduction in fat mass and a 5-pound reduction in lean mass. In 2021, a major trial of semaglutide’s weight loss potency examined the body composition of a minority of participants. These patients did not have diabetes, and they took a much larger dose of the drug. The 95 participants to undergo a body scan lost an average of 18 pounds of fat — and 12 pounds of lean mass. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6997246/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6997246/

xvilka 3y ago

I tried Ozempic for two months but wasn't able to continue - the gastrointestinal side effects are unbearable. I can confirm lack of desire to eat and drink alcohol. The hunger didn't go away but after a few bites of anything it quickly evaporated. After dropping the drug the hunger steeply increased, even higher than before, that was hard to contain.

breezingfast 3y ago

[dead]

EdwardDiego 3y ago

From my experience of addiction, suppressing the sensation of pleasure derived, is only the start. People who are addicted will repeat the behaviour even without the neurochemical response. Consider the ritual of the addiction as a form of self-soothing. You have to treat the patterns we've trod in our own minds, as well as removing that biological reinforcement.

jamesfisher 3y ago

https://archive.is/BUo29 https://archive.is/BUo29

MagicMoonlight 3y ago

I was always of the opinion that being fat was a moral failing. Trying the drug really changed that. Normies have it so easy. They take one bite and feel full. My brain would scream at me continuously to try and make me eat and would never be satisfied.

sourcecodeplz 3y ago
It's the same for me. I resorted to just eating yogurt, vegetables and fruits in between meals. Give it a try.
- MagicMoonlight 3y ago
  I'd rather take the medication that stops the addiction. You can't eat your way out of an eating disorder
thegreenswede 3y ago
"they take one bite and feel full"- I strongly disagree with this as the reason some people are just lean. As someone who's bounced around weight a lot and also had long periods where I had to basically control it (wrestling in college), the main difference I've seen with people who are in shape and people are overeat is that the former group understands that it's 'ok' to not feel full all the time. As in like learning the TRUE difference between appetite and hunger. I've had periods where I gained 50lb in like 4 months (start of pandemic) and all I had to do to basically get back to baseline is remind myself that I'm not going to die just bc I'm not constantly full. But i definitely don't get 'full' after a few bites. I can keep eating and eating for sure. It's more that being what we call traditionally "full" is actually just wayyyyy overeating.
- gerbilly 3y ago
  When I'm on vacation my stress is reduced to the point where my 'appetite' drops, and this is despite the fact that I'm increasing my exercise load enormously (surfing, hiking, etc...) I've noticed that stress causes me mild stomach pain, which can register as hunger. It also causes dry mouth which registers as thirst. If you're satisfying that thirst with sugary drinks long term, then you're going to be in trouble. There is also so much novelty and more interesting stuff going on while on vacation that I don't find myself poking through the fridge out of boredom.

Eumenes 3y ago

Congrats, you're now a lifetime subscriber to big pharma

fintechie 3y ago

I was about to get on semaglutide and after extensive research I thought "wait, the results won't be much better than the periods of IF I've had in the past, and the reported benefits are similar", and without side effects. Dropping 30 pounds in 3 months? easy to achieve with the Warrior Diet or OMAD versions of IF. The results are exactly the same... you fill full eating less quantity, cravings disappear after 1-2 weeks, increased focus and enhanced mental state. But yeah, you need some self-discipline, tons of coffee/matcha and water. I've concluded that semaglutide is not for me. Just like self-discipline in pills, with potential side effects. So better to give IF another go... I'm in the 4th week and dropped 10lbs already.

jshaqaw 3y ago

It’s interesting to me how much of the hostility to this drug has a moral dimension. I am quite fit for my middle age. It’s a relative superpower which confers a degree of status in this world. It’s not why I originally became fit 5 or so years ago but it’s something I increasingly notice or to be clear others notice and comment on. I think the “fit” of the world get inherently uncomfortable that our relative social currency is being “devalued” if everyone can be like us with an “unearned” pill. And it comes out as hostility and skepticism. I admit haven’t done much research on this particular topic. History should caution us that serious medication like this often has serious side effects which are not apparent early on. I get that. But unlike many others I don’t “hope” that happens like some kind of moral balancing. I get that reaction. In my gut I have that “I did it with willpower and lifestyle and sweat and these people shouldn’t just get it at CVS.” But that’s just the primate status brain talking. Not that it impacts the outcome but I sincerely hope these drugs can improve people’s lives without significant negative problems. I can find my relative status elsewhere or better yet try to grow up past such impulses.

joedevon 3y ago
Well said. I believe you are right. That and ignorance of how Leptin works, setpoint or lipostat theory of bodyweight regulation...once you've gotten fat, your setpoint goes up and the hunger signals are far greater than folks who have never gotten fat. You can have 2 athletes with identical weight height and BF%, but if one had been fat once, their hunger signals from the brain will be far greater than the athlete who was always slim.
briHass 3y ago
Those of us that work out, however, have been dealing with 'cheating with drugs' for a while: steroids. When you get close with enough gym rats, it's utterly shocking how many people with a muscular build use steroids. It's to the point where I essentially don't believe anyone claiming 'natty' (natural) status if they have more than a 1 sigma increase in musculature. It's also downright laughable how the media/Youtube influencers/etc. treat everyone like idiots. Men's Health will run an article on Mr. Moviestar who was 5'11' and 150 pounds before his role as Superhero Character got to 200 pounds and veiny biceps in 6 months by eating eggs, oatmeal, and chicken breast and doing some situps.