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I moved my digital stack to Europe
- galaSerge 5mo ago[flagged]
- grodes 5mo agoFrom Rome to Babylon.
- amai 4mo agoMore like from Rome to Athens.
- dorianmariecom 5mo agonot the domain name :)
- tmwoe 5mo agoA .com domain is not exclusive to the United States
- dijit 5mo agoUnfortunately, it is. Unless you're implying that Verisign isn't a US company, just because .com has become the conventional domain for businesses worldwide doesn't change the fact that it's US-based. Similarly, the EU's widespread adoption of Microsoft Office doesn't make it any less American. EDIT: That was unpopular. Why?
- catoc 5mo agoIt is not Source: own multiple, via EU registrar (Edit: Parent was edited after reply - parent statement is now correct)
- dijit 5mo agoRegistering a .com through a EU-based registrar doesn't change anything. Verisign, the organisation that actually controls the .com top-level domain, is a US company and operates under US jurisdiction. Where you purchase the domain from is irrelevant.
- catoc 5mo agoThat… is true - thanks for editing your comment to clarify The initial thread read like “.com domains are exclusive to US” which they of course aren’t
- dijit 5mo agoIt's a bit like .gov and .edu; technically exclusive to the US. The difference is that .com and .org were opened up for anyone to purchase. And it goes deeper than just intent: .com was literally administered under a US government contract for decades, with Verisign only ending up in control because they acquired the company that held that government contract. So while anyone can buy a .com today, the infrastructure and oversight have always been firmly American.
- peterspath 5mo agoyou do not really own a domain
- dangus 5mo ago> The OVHcloud control panel is a labyrinth: the lifecycle rule configuration is buried somewhere in the documentation, and it involves some work in the terminal. Use OpenTofu/Terraform! Much better than messing with cloud consoles, and then your infrastructure self-documents. I’d also put out one note to any people outside the EU looking to switch to Mistral or really any service: just because they’re a European company doesn’t mean they’ll follow the GDPR if you don’t live there. Mistral is an example: in their privacy policy, they state that they follow whatever privacy laws exist in your country.
- rob74 5mo ago> they state that they follow whatever privacy laws exist in your country Well, that's kinda obvious - if they want to do business in a country, they have to follow the laws of that country. That doesn't in and of itself mean that they will apply weaker privacy protections if the local laws are less strict than GDPR...
- dangus 5mo agoI don’t really feel like looking it up again but the verbiage sounded more to me like they were specifically trying to say that they weren’t setting the GDPR as a minimum standard. We also have to realize that any privacy policy that is allowing for something out of vagueness is something where you have to assume the worst.
- emj 5mo agoMatomo is nice on low traffic, but when we have a sustained rate of 5-25 logins per second and above things become real slow. Using regexps is really bad when you start having problems, but they are fine on low traffic sites. So If like it but it is a headache on high traffic sites. If anyone have an easy solution I would gladly accept it.
- sdoering 5mo agoI have worked with two clients. Both north of 8 million visits a month. Both on matomo. Both self hosted. If you architect the underlying infra right it still works like a charm. But I admit people need to know what they are doing. I was quite impressed with both infra teams. But as always, if you do not want tu use auto scaling US cloud based services, you need to enasure you have the right scaling and the necessary technical expertise at hand.
- emj 5mo agoI had no problems either, until we hit peaks. We hit our problems at about 7 million unique logins per month, we do not track visits in the same way. I am not that invested in Matomo and it just costs time for me. I am not sure how you scale Matomo we could not vertically scale anymore, we never did MySQL clusters because it just was not cost efficient for internal reasons.
- toredash 5mo agoManaged a fairly large matomo site in the past. Using queue plugin (https://plugins.matomo.org/QueuedTracking https://plugins.matomo.org/QueuedTracking) with Redis Cluster really improves the situation. We actually built a custom plugin with Nginx + Lua to avoid PHP altogether for the tracking part. Scaling ingestion then wasn't the problem, draining the queue was
- emj 5mo agoThe tracking was not the issue the problem was report generation with segments. Every segment makes you regenerate all the reports. Tracking part is a problem because you need to split the tracking and report part of you want to have something robust.
- YetAnotherNick 5mo ago> Digital sovereignty sounds like a buzzword until you think Sure now just think and give me the reason. All these moving to Europe post is getting tiring. Amazon follows the same EU rules, if not more, than Scaleway.
- bergheim 5mo agoSecond paragraph: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CLOUD_Act https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CLOUD_Act
- YetAnotherNick 5mo agoLater in the article: > The act is not limited to companies based in the United States.
- blitzar 5mo ago> if not more more mean the US rules that hoover up all the data for the government
- kaon_2 5mo agoMatt Lakeman writes in one of his blogs that wherever he goes, people tend to love the USA. Except in Europe where he faces a constant storm of criticism. And that was before February. Just like you cannot explain the taste of chocolate to someone, it is hardly possible to explain the mental shift that happened everywhere when the US threatened the EU with military invasion. Like a broken egg this is diplomatic damage that cannot be repaired. If you sell software and you tell your customers and prospects that everything runs in Europe, by European companies, this instills an enormous amount of trust. Risk averse sectors like manufacturing love this, and it will help you gain customers immediately. So no, these posts are not tiring to many of us. In fact, we are only at the beginning of the beginning because many of us will be making these migrations. I wish things had run a different course.
- YetAnotherNick 5mo ago> this instills an enormous amount of trust So you are saying the reason that it is just perceived better? Even that's quite debatable as I worked in few European companies and has never faced any backlash for choosing US vendor. Biggest European tech companies like Mistral and Klarna use many US vendors like AWS.
- deleted 5mo ago[deleted]
- iLoveOncall 5mo agoUsing OVH for backups is a crazy choice. They had a datacenter burn down (in large part because it was fully built using wood) and lost all customer data and did not take any action for 6 months after the incident. They're just not a serious company.
- sdoering 5mo agoAny source for this? Would love to read up on this.
- dijit 5mo agohttps://www.datacenterdynamics.com/en/opinions/ovhclouds-data-center-fire-one-year-on-what-do-we-know/ https://www.datacenterdynamics.com/en/opinions/ovhclouds-dat... Wooden floors contributed to the fire, they were fire resistant but that only lasts so long. Fire-doors are often the same type of wood.
- sdoering 5mo agoThanks a ton. Much appreciated. I am looking for German/EU options so this is highly relevant.
- deleted 5mo ago[deleted]
- riffraff 5mo agothis was 5 years ago. There were many threads on it on HN that may be of interest to you https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&query=ovh%20fire&sort=byPopularity&type=story https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&que...
- sdoering 5mo agoThanks a ton. Greatly appreciated. I am currently evaluation options. So this is relevant to me.
- __jonas 5mo agoThat lettermint service looks interesting! I was recently looking for something in that price range that covers both transactional and broadcast emails but couldn't find anything in Europe so I settled on Postmark which has been good, this looks almost identical in features and pricing though.
- sdoering 5mo agoSame here. I just discovered this and put it in my "check out tonight" folder. I am currently happy using resend. But this looks interesting, especially also for my freelance clients with a focus on EU tech.
- polack 5mo agoYes, Lettermint looks great if you need both transactional and marketing emails. But it's a bit weird that the OP selected Lettermint over Scaleway for just transactional emails when they use lots of other Scaleway services. https://www.scaleway.com/en/transactional-email-tem/ https://www.scaleway.com/en/transactional-email-tem/ [EDIT] Found the answer from the OP: > To be honest I implemented Lettermint before I migrated to Scaleway, so I didn't even look at TEM
- jdw64 5mo ago[dead]
- CodinM 5mo ago[dead]
- schnitzelstoat 5mo agoWhile I agree with him that the US is becoming more unpredictable, I don't think the EU is much better, especially with regards to digital things where they can be worse in some ways. For example, they are discussing restricting VPN access for 'child protection'[1] [1] https://www.europarl.europa.eu/thinktank/en/document/EPRS_ATA(2026)782618 https://www.europarl.europa.eu/thinktank/en/document/EPRS_AT...
- kaon_2 5mo agoOf course. But then again, it was the US that threatened the EU with military invasion, so if you want your service to continue uninterrupted, it helps being prepared.
- traceroute66 5mo ago> they are discussing restricting VPN access for 'child protection' Just like with encryption, there will always be an idiot politician somewhere discussing banning it. Mr Google tells me, for example, that lawmakers in Michigan (US) recently proposed " Anticorruption of Public Morals Act" which contained VPN banning clauses. Frankly, until such time as it actually NEARS, let alone BECOMES legislation, the only thing posts such as yours are doing is spreading FUD. The clue is in the URL you post "thinktank". It not even EU parliament, let alone been through the parliament debates, let alone passed to votes, let alone passed to being implemented by member states .... its just a random idea someone wrote down. And quite frankly, I would still much rather be in the EU's digital environment than that of the US.
- AlecSchueler 5mo agoNot only that but if you actually read the linked document it isn't calling for a VPN ban. It's a general report on what VPNs are and how they're perceived by various bodies. It does make reference to the UK Child Safety Commissioner's suggestion that they should be restricted to adult use only but it also talks about how essential they are for business etc. On the whole it's quite balanced and the existence of such a report seems very reasonable.
- aurareturn 5mo agoGoogle Analytics --> Matomo Matomo charges 22 euros for 50k hits/month.[0] Basically, it's unusable for anything other than a hobby site - especially with the number of crawlers nowadays. If you self host for free, you're missing basically all of the good parts of web analytics such as funnel analysis as they lock all of those features being paid subs. [0]https://matomo.org/pricing/ https://matomo.org/pricing/
- basisword 5mo agoi.e. you can't give stuff away for free if you aren't one of the 3 largest companies on the planet
- aurareturn 5mo agoWould you pay $20/month for Hacker News access? I think it's fair that GA is free and Google gets some benefits from using the data for their ad network.
- AlecSchueler 5mo ago"some benefits" is really underselling it though.
- shimman 5mo agoYeah just one of the core pillars that enables their unregulated monopoly that brings in billions of pure profit.
- basisword 5mo agoYeah but you're missing the point. Nobody else has the worlds biggest search engine and ad network to allow them to do the same. Others have to charge.
- tjoff 5mo agoAll the good parts of web analytics doesn't amount to much anyway. Especially if you desire to have a usable site, which includes no cookie popups.
- urvader 5mo agoGreat post! Today we just launched an European alternative to Claude Code - Berget Code- https://berget.ai/code https://berget.ai/code
- rvz 5mo agoSmall print: With exceptions Why are there exceptions for Anthropic, GitHub and GitLab? > Anthropic is a US company...But it satisfies something else, the sense that the organization building the thing has given serious thought to what it’s building and why. This reads like a weak excuse. Mistral and Mistral Vibe exists and even if you don't like them, there are many non-US harnesses (Qwen code) that are available. > GitHub stays in the picture for one specific purpose: public-facing NPM packages and issue tracking for open source software. First of all Codeberg exists. Secondly, at this stage relying on NPM and the Java/Typescript ecosystem is quite frankly waiting for a disaster to happen. This post isn't absolute on moving their digital stack to Europe as it has not one but three exceptions too many.
- TrackerFF 5mo agoFor the past days I've been participating(albeit over Teams) in a conference relevant to my industry (intel), basically startups and established companies showcasing their products to a closed audience of EU gov. officials. One thing I noticed right away, is that all companies were asked "Can we fully host this from within EU or our country" from the various people in audience. Every single one. Many of the startups had slides prepared for this. Definitely a change, because it is not something I can recall being important just a couple of years ago.
- deleted 5mo ago[deleted]
- unixhero 5mo agoThis is not a change. It has been asked since the advent of GDPR. So nearly 10 years.
- radicalbyte 5mo agoIn some cases but not enough. Some of us has been doing a lot to help educate companies and business here and with the current administration - and the fact that they are being explicitly backed/funded by the Silicon Valley tech companies long resisted government overreach - have helped to finally open ears in boardrooms to the dangers of the Cloud Act and other leverage.
- sisve 5mo agoIt started 10 years ago, but have def escalated the last year IMHO. Im sorry to say it, but i feel a lot of Europeans have lost a good deal of trust in the US.
- rf15 5mo agoWe have gained a lot of confidence that having control ourselves is actually enormously valuable.
- PaulKeeble 5mo ago
- data-ottawa 5mo agoJust a nitpick: 1Password is Canadian (still not European, but not us based, if that’s the issue). I do understand the choice to move all into proton though. Off topic: that’s a beautiful website
- james_pm 5mo ago1Password also lets you pick where your data lives - US, Canada or EU. https://support.1password.com/regions/ https://support.1password.com/regions/
- philipwhiuk 5mo agoSo do lots of providers. But the US law says if an American has access they can snoop as much as they like wherever the data physically is. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CLOUD_Act https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CLOUD_Act
- data-ottawa 5mo agoSince 1Password is Canadian, does that apply? It’s not if an American has access, it’s US based companies, no?
- philipwhiuk 4mo agoIt's probably if an American employee can be subpoenaed to do it. So whether they have a US office probably.
- guilhermesfc 5mo agoCanadian counts as reliable for me ;)
- emptybits 5mo agoCanadian here. It pains me to say that my country will not keep your data safe from prying eyes, nor safe from sharing and cooperating with USA authorities. Our legislative trajectory includes mandatory encryption back doors, warrantless access to data, and data retention even when you think you have deleted your data from a provider. Our federal government is only slightly behind the pace of the USA and is cooperating and sharing with them. https://ccla.org/privacy/coalition-to-mps-scrap-unprecedented-surveillance-measures/ https://ccla.org/privacy/coalition-to-mps-scrap-unprecedente... Recent HN thread on this. (There have been several.) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48111531 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48111531 If you're Canadian, write your MP. There are EFF and CCLA templates to help you do that.
- 999900000999 5mo agoCan’t read the article… But given how often GitHub and AWS East 1 go down, this is good. One bad day at Amazon shouldn’t stop Europeans from doing laundry. The cloud should have been localized from the start.
- krunger 5mo ago[dead]
- frevib 5mo agoScaleway has introduced Edge services recently: https://www.scaleway.com/en/edge-services/ https://www.scaleway.com/en/edge-services/ No ddos protection yet.
- wolvoleo 5mo agoI've been very happy with scaleway for many years yes. I can recommend them. Much more professional than OVH and Hetzner too.
- rc_kas 5mo agoI switched to Protonmail a month ago. It is patently inferior to gmail. Every day I get annoyed by some weakness in the UI that google had apparently just always solved without me ever having to think about it. For example, reading long email chains in the proton UI is horrific. I don't know what google did that made it natural to read and proton does so badly, but it is painful to read these long chains of emails. Another example is log emails from my servers are getting grouped together by Proton. Gmail had sepearated the logs into separate emails in a very natural way. These small annoyances add up and I'm not having a fun time right now with proton.
- d4mi3n 5mo agoThis is actually a pretty interesting observation as GMail, when it first came out, was just as clunky as all the other webmail clients. At the time, everyone was used to Yahoo!, MSN, etc. and Google was the odd one out with their webmail client. This changed when they were the first folks out there to get a dynamic interface in the browser (some of you may fondly or not so fondly remember the days of DHTML, XMLHTTPRequest, and the like). Fast forward 10 or 15 years and now GMail is the standard by which everything else is measured. I'm sure there are some things that are objectively better, but a surprising amount of preference comes from familiarity.
- jorisw 5mo agoI'll never understand why people insist on using web based email. Just install your favorite desktop + mobile mail apps and you're fine. If that can't be done with Protonmail, and you want to move your email out of the US, suggest FastMail, based in Australia.
- sisve 5mo agoA pragmatic article, always nice. I was surprised that gitlab and github was stillton the list. For me moving to self hosted forgejo was one of the easiest transition i had. But i did not have complex CI/CD needs
- swiftcoder 5mo agoWhile I do think the link highlights are pretty neat, this particular cursor hijack annoys me greatly. Would be nicer to float the link highlights next to the standard cursor.
- vovavili 5mo agoChoosing between two tech-unfriendly regimes doesn't intrinsically strike me as appealing.
- Markus9822 5mo ago[flagged]
- fleebee 5mo agoIf anyone else is wondering why no content is visible on the page, it's because it requires JavaScript and a WebGL context.
- classified 5mo agoAnd also this: You cannot access this site because the owner has reached their plan limits. Check back later once traffic has gone down. Cloudflare is no fun. How much coal does the steam engine need to serve this site?
- Johnathanb 5mo ago[dead]
- jorisw 5mo agoReader mode works
- anaisbetts 5mo agoProton Mail not supporting filters for message bodies is brutal, I understand why they don't do it but that really lowers its usability for me. Bummer.
- Havoc 5mo agoYeah trying to move more stuff out of the US too, while simultaneously trying to pick things that don’t follow the stupid unlimited scaling of how much money we can pull out of your wallet model. Two birds with one stone. There are definitely technical gaps though. eg bunny still uses one unified api key. CF I can lock to an IP and set granular permissions
- alaudet 5mo agoI am not running a company, just a household but this article speaks to me. I have given this topic plenty of thought in the past year as I have a growing unease with large American tech firms and how they use data. These are some of my setups (in the spirit of the article) I have also rid myself of Google Analytics for a personal website. Replaced with a local solution that parses logs and builds reports that give me quite a bit of information. Its a more ethical type of analytics leaving no cookies behind and no trackers at all. All info is from the web server logs, you can grok quite a bit of insight from this alone. Email is the biggest challenge, I have mapped out the entire migration steps for Google Workspace to Proton but have not yet pulled the trigger. The main thing is coordination with the rest of my family who use the domain for their email as well, they don't share my obsession with "digital sovereignty" so there is some negotiation around time tables :-) The Proton family plan will cut the bill in about half. Password management --> KeepassXC with db on local nas. For personal use I feel you can't beat self hosted for password management. Compute, Digital Ocean I continue to use and has servers in Toronto which works for me geographically. It's very low down my list of migration plans, they just work and they have treated me pretty good over the years. Storage all self hosted (ownCloud and Openmediavault). Are they the best options, maybe not but they just work. No cloud based storage at all (Google/Apple etc etc). If I ever throw something out there it is gpg encrypted). Offsite backups, two local copies to seperate drives (dejadup) on my NAS and offsite storage. There are still some other services I need to consider. I do have Claude Pro. I run local LLM's for a lot of stuff with OpenwebUI but its not a full replacement. CDN - Also use Cloudflare free tier. Have to give it more thought, it just works so well. DNS is fully self hosted using dns-crypt-proxy / dnssec to Quad9 and Mullvad DNS. Works great. I actually blackhole any hits to google dns at the router, media and iot devices love to ignore your dns settings. Github for code hosting. I know, Microsoft, but it works and is not a hill I am willing to die on just yet. Photos self hosted with Immich on Proxmox. It's been pretty solid. VPN, Wireguard to the home and have also integrated Tailscale for some things, which has been handy for extending connectivity and supporting my dad in a different city. Apparently they are based in Canada so that is a bonus. I use the free tier for now but am considering the paid version just to support them. Router and wireless access points all on the latest Openwrt with consumer grade equipment, some of which I picked up used for like 20 bucks. Allows me to have home, guest, media and iot vlans for proper network segregation. Is it overkill? 10 years ago maybe but today I would not run any other way. Thanks for attending my Ted Talk.
- fractalf 5mo agoDoing the same! The US is rapidly getting worse and worse
- codethief 5mo agoOff-topic: Oof, I like the Monokai theme very much but that cursor on the author's website… not so much. It is terribly laggy.
- dbvn 5mo agoMight want to move your site to a server you own.... site is down due to "rate limits"
- simon84 5mo agoRate limit from Cloudflare, so much for moving to EU Stack :/
- Mashimo 5mo ago[flagged]
- vanschelven 5mo agoThey say > Not everything moved. Cloudflare is a US company, I still use it, and I’m at peace with that. which you admittedly couldn't read when you complained about it.
- articsputnik 5mo ago> This website has been temporarily rate limited Did he move also the CDN stack? :)
- jwpapi 5mo agoI own the domain govern.eu I didn‘t yet have a good idea on how to utilize it, open to ideas.
- IAmFledge 5mo agoI started the process of this back in January and now, at least in terms of product hosting; fully migrated into European infrastructure (https://bannermedia.ltd https://bannermedia.ltd). It didn't come without a bit of pain, but glad I've done it - and to come with this I've ended up building a whole terraform setup for cross provider / cross region high availability within Europe. So far my key mappings included: - Cloudflare -> Bunny CDN (and honestly I am so impressed with Bunny so far) - AWS (or similar) -> Hetzner + OVH; I'm also looking at Civo.com for UK presence. - GitHub -> Forgejo. I do actually still operate in GitHub for development only work, however Forgejo is mirrored within my European private network, and thats where deployment workflows happen. - Google Analytics -> Self hosted Umami. I'll be doing a writeup fairly soon on the entire process.
- esistgut 5mo agoWaiting for your writeup, especially the Bunny part. We moved away from AWS but Cloudflare remains a point of failure, we are going to remove it as soon as we have some spare time to do the required research.
- IAmFledge 5mo agoHonestly my needs are not super complicated. There are a few edge rules I have in place to try and block things like the TikTok Bytespider which is hammering one of my sites. It's able to support round-robin multi-endpoint DNS, including weightings you can update which is super useful for what I'm doing. I've only really needed to speak to support twice so far; one was to get un-blocked because I migrated all my sites too quickly on a fresh account lol, so triggered their suspicious activity (so just be aware of that) - but both times they replied within an hour and resolved things.
- MartijnHols 5mo agoWhat are you looking for? I use Bunny CDN along with Bunny Shield, and together they're better than Cloudflare for me. It's $10/month, but I can afford it for the privacy of my users. Bunny's aggressive bot blocking without bothering the vast majority of users with regular challenge pages provides a much better UX.
- vipshek 5mo ago> This website has been temporarily rate limited Feels a bit ironic... though this website is hosted on Cloudflare Workers so using an American company anyway?
- Winblows11 5mo agoCloudflare = NSA creation to get around HTTPS
- chrisweekly 5mo agocitation?
- embedding-shape 5mo agoHave to wait for the next Snowden before you get any citations. NSA collaborator or not, the mere existence of something like Cloudflare, which also tries to nudge you into skipping internal http/tls and just use that at the front, makes it highly likely that NSA is already deep in their infrastructure, just like they've been in the past for literally any big technology company in the US. But yeah, zero citations, zero evidence, just based on history and what the goal of the organization is, it's pretty clear what's going on already.
- nozzlegear 5mo agoSo just conjecture and speculation, then.
- embedding-shape 5mo agoYes, just like expecting the sun to also rise tomorrow is mostly conjecture and speculation since we cannot see into the future, yet.
- cindyllm 5mo ago
- pbiggar 5mo agoDisagree on his characterization of Claude as being much better than OpenAI (a very low bar), esp from a sovereignty perspective. Here's what Anthropic's CEO had to say (from https://www.cbsnews.com/news/anthropic-ceo-dario-amodei-full-transcript/ https://www.cbsnews.com/news/anthropic-ceo-dario-amodei-full...): > We are patriotic Americans. We have done everything we have done for the sake of this country, for the sake of supporting U.S. national security... We believe in defeating our autocratic adversaries. We believe in defending America. and > So, you know, Anthropic actually has been the most lean forward of all the AI companies in working with the U.S. government and working with the U.S. military. We were the first company to, you know, put our models on the classified cloud. > We were the first company to make custom models for national security purposes. We're deployed across the intelligence community and military for applications like cyber, you know, combat support operations, various things like this. And, you know, the reason we've done this is, you know, I-- I believe that we have to defend our country. and > And so we have said to the Department of War that we are okay with all use cases, basically 98% or 99% of the use cases they want to do, except for two that we're concerned about.
- davedx 5mo agoTemporarily rate limited ... By CloudFlare?
- rc_mob 5mo agolol. true given the article contents, this is a fair criticism
- jorisw 5mo agoMirror: https://archive.is/LNYYU https://archive.is/LNYYU — Works for me after switching to reader mode
- Mashimo 5mo agoHeh, ironic that the link is now "temporarily rate limited" my cloudflare. I can't read the article, but it looks like he did not move everything to europe ;-)
- chakintosh 5mo agoProton Mail Helped FBI Unmask Anonymous ‘Stop Cop City’ Protester https://www.404media.co/proton-mail-helped-fbi-unmask-anonymous-stop-cop-city-protestor/ https://www.404media.co/proton-mail-helped-fbi-unmask-anonym...
- cipher-108 5mo agoSee also the Finnish alternative https://upcloud.com/ https://upcloud.com/ I also switched from DigitalOcean and have found UpCloud very good for my purposes.
- throwaway2037 5mo agoDid anyone else notice the leading image's caption? Chef's kiss. > 100% accurate European digital infrastructure, AI generated
- deleted 5mo ago[deleted]
- yiiii 5mo agoShowed Cloudflare error page "Please check back later - Error 1027" for me for a while, DNS still pointing there... So probably not so European after all!
- neonstatic 5mo agoThey acknowledge it in the article.
- maelito 5mo agoScaleway is great. Never had any problem. Has an open-source startup program. https://cartes.app https://cartes.app proudly runs on Scaleway.
- severino 5mo agoDo you know if it's possible to cap expenses on Scaleway so you don't end up with unexpected charges (due to bandwidth or whatever)? I mean, having your services stopped until the next cycle begins or you decide to pay more. I knew this wasn't possible for Hetzner, for example, but I'm not sure about this one.
- esher 5mo agoA sympathize, but my EU biz bets on US tech. We are in a tricky position now. So every 'Look ma I moved away from US big tech' post triggers me. Details: https://blog.fortrabbit.com/us-against-them https://blog.fortrabbit.com/us-against-them
- lenerdenator 5mo agoDid he drive home in a BYD EV after that?
- amelius 5mo agoChina has a lot more infrastructure than the EU. Why not move there?
- pjc50 5mo agoThey're unfree and not great at service offerings for foreigners?
- 9753268996433 5mo ago[flagged]
- ben_w 5mo agoThe EU isn't a regime, it's 27 sovereign nations in a free trade agreement that itself has marginally more democratic representation than free trade agreements normally get. All members nations of the EU are wildly more free than China is; the USA would be middling to low by EU standards: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_freedom_indices https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_freedom_indices
- vga1 5mo agoWhy not Russia or perhaps North Korea?
- euroderf 5mo agoStupid question... I guess SSG pages can be hosted for free from Github or Cloudflare. Any EU equivalents of these - with free or dirt-cheap hosting ?
- titanomachy 5mo agoNot a stupid question at all. Hetzner's cheapest cloud server is €4/month, which includes 20TB of egress. Certainly not free, but should be cheap enough for most.
- kenanfyi 5mo agoEvery now and then I see similar posts and people move to Proton from Gmail, because it is European. Well, it’s fine if that‘s the only reason you switch, but if you switch because US became weird and lost your trust, you might want to check their CEO‘s comments on political issues.
- Bengalilol 5mo agoWhile Andy Yen supports specific Trump-aligned initiatives for precise goals, such as breaking up Big Tech monopolies (which, btw, Trump won't), this does not mean he will replicate the erratic nature and global loss of trust associated with Trump and his administration. The Cloud Act is real and transcends any single company. This global erosion of trust highlights deeper concerns: specifically, that US practices have always been coercive. Now, the world is learning and taking action.
- mubaarakhassan 5mo ago[dead]
- TacticalCoder 5mo agoWhen AI is used to generate one picture, like in TFA, it's acceptable if the picture is nice enough. YMMV but although I'm usually not a fan of the AI-generated pics used to illustrate everything now, I dig the AI-generated picture in TFA.
- codingjoe 5mo agoIf you're looking for a Twillio and Elevenlabs replacement, I am working on that too: https://github.com/codingjoe/VoIP https://github.com/codingjoe/VoIP
- rob74 5mo agoFirst time I heard about Mistral, so I went to the site. I first thought their logo is a pixel-art letter M. Then I read that their chatbot/agent is called "Le Chat"... wait a minute, that means something different in French? And then I noticed that the logo can also be seen as a cat head (from the whiskers up). Then I scrolled to the end of the page and saw my suspicion confirmed: https://cms.mistral.ai/assets/920e56ee-25c5-439d-bd31-fbdf5c92c87f https://cms.mistral.ai/assets/920e56ee-25c5-439d-bd31-fbdf5c... . Kudos to the designer(s)!
- lefra 5mo agoA french with low exposure to english would pronounce "ChatGPT" with the first "t" silent, and it sounds exactly like "Cat, I farted" in french.
- finegrainlabs 5mo agoOne of my friends made fremforge.com (an EU-sovereign CI/CD with Git included). It's currently in closed beta but goes live next week (tm). It is built upon Forgejo and EU-based services using T-Cloud as the underlying hyperscaler. Have a look! I don't make any money from it, by the way. And yes, it will cost a little bit, but rest assured: because you are paying for it, you will not be the product.
- FpUser 5mo agoDepending on who is my software for I host either on my own premises or Hetzner / OVH. Do it for many years already and no cloudy headaches
- w4der 5mo agoIf anyone was annoyed by the site hijacking the mouse pointer, this rule works: "##:style(cursor: auto !important;)"
- 1234letshaveatw 5mo agothank you. What an annoying site
- whalesalad 5mo agothere is a button in the footer to turn it off.
- marcelox86 5mo agothere is also some janky, cheap feeling lenis-type of scrolling hijacking in place that gets disabled when the viewport is about the size of a phone. tried to disable it by turning off javascript and the page no longer loads - thus i am completely uninterested in reading this article
- mosburger 5mo agoI wonder if the author considered moving payment processing to Adyen from Stripe? They're also EU-based and a bit more... well known? I liked integrating with them in the past.
- monokai_nl 5mo agoI'm considering Adyen and Mollie, but presently lacking the time to properly investigate and redo my payment flows. It will happen at some point.
- mosburger 5mo agoCheckout.com (UK) might be another worth checking. :) [I'm a "payments guy" for my day job].
- bilekas 5mo agoThis is really cool, just for curiosity though is Stripe not considered EU anymore? I know it was created in Ireland and didn't hear anything about it changing ?
- s_dev 5mo agoIrish here, it was never EU or Irish. The Collisons are Irish but Stripe is an American company. The profits are ultimately repatriated to the United States.
- flanked-evergl 5mo agoNever before in history has a vassal that is this dependent on its patron hated its patron so much. God help us when the US finally decides that the vast amounts of money it pours down the drain to keep us as its vassal is not worth the squeeze. China and Russia will not be nearly as patient and kind. America sends a VP to give a speech, which even though it made some politicians cry, was still just words. China will just use us for spare body parts and Russia will drop our people from planes. America says it really would like Greenland, which it could take with literally zero contest if it wanted, and which it gave back to Europe after Europe had another one if it's many internal meat grinder wars. China and Russia just takes what it wants, they don't ask. It's really going to suck balls being the punching bag of Russia and China. Europe is by actual fact completely dysfunctional, constantly getting itself into shit left and right, constantly needing bailouts from America to keep it afloat, and Europeans pretend they are better than Americans. Totally absurd.
- jorisw 5mo agoThe art on this website is awesome. The Draad series especially
- huqedato 5mo agoI have several small SaaS apps running on Rended and Railway. I would like to host them in EU. Wondering if there are similar "managed" PaaS options here. I found none.
- recroad 5mo agoAll my customers are in US and Canada, so switching to EU will automatically add latency to everything. That's a deal breaker for me, so I end up hosting on DO TOR cloud. At least it's not hosted in US but it is by a US company.
- pjmlp 5mo agoThe biggest issue, is that the whole stack keeps being dependent on external nations, as per the companies that actually contribute to FOSS with big money. https://insights.linuxfoundation.org/project/korg/contributors?timeRange=past365days&start=2025-05-13&end=2026-05-13&widget=organizations-leaderboard https://insights.linuxfoundation.org/project/korg/contributo... Then it is Go (Google), Java (Oracle, IBM, Red-Hat), .NET (Microsoft), Rust (Amazon, Microsoft, Google), Typescript (Microsoft), C and C++ (Red-Hat, IBM, Microsoft, Apple Google, ...), and so on.
- kreco 5mo agoUsing a programming language is not the same as using a service. I can't seen any reason for this to be "the biggest issue".
- pjmlp 5mo agoAttack vectors and supply chain, every piece of the puzzle matters. There is no accident that folks like Oxide go through the trouble to control the whole stack, hardware, software, programming language toolchains they are using, only working with vendors that provide them every single documentation and customisation points they need. Unfortunely we lack an European Oxide.
- jeffrallen 5mo agoThey use Go and Rust. If Oxide thinks they can keep the supply chain risks of their langiage ecosystems under control, I think the rest of us can too.
- pjmlp 5mo agoYes, and are in the position of maintaining their own forks if needed, or doing reviews when updating them. Is everyone else?
- pear01 5mo agoIt is good to diversify but people should really not make Europe out to be some sanctuary. European governments (and thus companies) are still going to cooperate with America. When the day comes when they do not, America's reach will still be long. Never mind the fact that incentives in Europe are not so different from the USA. It may look that way now, but often moving across the globe just means trading one villain for another. Still a good idea, just a word of caution. If people make a move such as this based on some assumption about the stability of the European regulatory scheme you may want to examine that assumption with a little more rigor.
- andix 5mo agoCurrently Europe is one of the last larger sanctuaries for democracy and freedom. Sad but true.
- bradley13 5mo agoThis. The privacy threats are somewhat different, but they still stem from government. The EU has tried to attack end-to-end encryption more than once, and they will try again. They are now requiring logging of IP addresses, and ever more tracking of use activities. The legislation requiring age verification is the camel's nose in the tent - expect them to require full ID soon. Etc. All Western governments have clearly decided to restrict individual rights to privacy, political advocacy, and free speech in general. The way this is happening simultaneously in so many countries seems a clear indication of a coordinated effort.
- shimman 5mo agoEuropean sanctuary is good for Europeans. The USA is not a reliable partner and has uncaused a massive amount of global instability that impacts European lives. I also heavily disagree that incentives in EU are not different from the USA. The USA is an oligarchic government with pro-corporate politic parties. This is not the case in the EU. Not too mention workers in the EU often live better lives than workers in the USA. Hard to not see how the incentives are completely unaligned. I mean FFS the USA made a very credible threat to invade Greenland, so credible that they were preparing for an invasion. An invasion started by your "ally."
- dethos 5mo agoNice and succinct article, and the choices seem reasonable and well thought out. My only question is, what are the selling points that made you choose Lettermint over Scaleway TEM? Using TEM seemed obvious at first sight, given the fact that you already use Scaleway for object storage and compute.
- monokai_nl 5mo agoTo be honest I implemented Lettermint before I migrated to Scaleway, so I didn't even look at TEM. At that point I was more than happy though. And I like to support my fellow Dutch startups too.
- mark_l_watson 5mo agoI am in the US but my daily chat AI is Proton's Lumo+. Adequate, good features, not too expensive. I am near the end of a 1 month experiment using Google's $250/month Ultra AI plan and I wanted to try something different when the Ultra plan ends. I have tried Mistral's Vibe command line coding agent and considered it, but decided on a one month OpenCode + Deepseek v4 experiment. I understand why Europeans might want to go all in on their own tech stacks, but it might be more strategic to just not get locked in to specific providers. Maybe a mix of European, US, and Asian tech - with a good plan for easy migration.
- tedshark 5mo agoThat feeling having total control of your data
- sliqqq 5mo agoMeanwhile, we here in Europe move our stacks over to other continents or at least ourside of the EU to workaround the crazy EU regulation nonsense ;) We live in crazy times my friends...
- Aldipower 5mo agoTrainingPeaks -> Tredict I do not miss anything. Opposite is the case.
- yanis_t 5mo agoSorry to bring it to you folks, but this is not how you build a competitive industry. You put properly though-through legislation in place if you want EU to be competitive with US and China. Not regulations, for f sake.
- xandrius 5mo agoHonestly not everyone wants and needs a EU that can go head to head with the US and China. The markets there follow different philosophies: one is the wild west of free markets to the extreme and the other fully centralised. I personally want a sane, stable and consumer-friendly market, no unicorns but strong consumer laws and enforcement against mispractice of businesses towards people and the environment. We are far from it but I think the EU is the closest to an entity acting like that and being predictable. The US chases the dollars at all costs and China similar but depending on the party lines of the decade.
- yanis_t 5mo agoThis is totally fine. Just don't expect that it will help the industry in EU. If we want to help, we need to push the politians.
- lukewarm707 5mo agochina-based cloud providers would be perfect for me, many offer private sla, no data retention, and they have everything you could want. sounds basic but the problem for me is that the internet law in china is very restrictive. on top of that, in the uk and in china, the government will lock you in a cage unless you give them the encryption keys. so if i was using alibaba cloud, i would have to play hopscotch trying not to tread on various legal landmines and it's not so attractive for me.
- tinco 5mo agoSeems like not being compatible with Sentry's agent is a missed opportunity for Appsignal, which I think is the premier EU based (Amsterdam) APM suite at the moment. It sounds like Bugsink is rather barebones in comparison and I bet a quick agentic coding session would make short work of a migration to AppSignal.
- po1nt 5mo agoI do use a lot of EU services. But help me understand what is the hype about moving to EU cloud services? Is it any different? Wasn't internet supposed to break the international borders and bring us together?
- lucalouren 5mo ago[dead]
- BaudouinVH 5mo agoEuropean-based alternative to github : https://codeberg.org/ https://codeberg.org/ The hub for european alternatives : https://european-alternatives.eu/ https://european-alternatives.eu/
- gib444 5mo agoI'll preface this with a statement that as a European I want European alternatives to succeed, and MS-owned GitHub to shrivel and disappear. But in case anyone from Codeberg reads this, IMO landing and signup pages need a lot of improvements: > Codeberg is a non-profit, community-led effort that provides services to free and open-source projects, such as Git hosting (using Forgejo) OK, so do I register for Codeberg or Forgejo? Do I need to click through to Forgejo (it's a hyperlink)? Do I care it's Forgejo? "Software development, but free!" Free is the biggest selling point? Well GitHub is free too. WHY should I sign up? Why is there no signup email address on the homepage like GitHub? Why is the Register CTA off to the side, looking like a header instead of a button? Why no screenshots of the Codeberg (Forgejo?) UI / wowing me with features? (None on the Forgejo homepage either) Why is the signup behind that Anubis anime girl AND I need to enter a CAPTCHA after passing that? > Confirm Password That's extra friction and AIUI an outdated UI practice. > We are planning to drop the captcha by improving moderation and spam detection. (state: March 2025). OK...it's been over a year. > Using Codeberg to spread SEO spam, malware, links to IPTV services ("tvbox") or pirated content will result in an immediate ban with no prior warning. Too many words, pushing the "Register" button even further down. Just put it in the Terms of Service Just copy these things from GitHub, it's not that hard. Right now it looks like a conference registration landing page or something
- shimman 5mo agoThis is a lot of whining over nothing... not everyone wants to copy big tech.
- gib444 5mo agoIt was not meant as whining. Did you fail to realise my points were aimed at gaining a bigger audience and increasing sign ups? An attempt at constructive criticism > not everyone wants to copy big tech. Yeah sure increasing signups is the same as copying the entire big tech industry. Please. What a ridiculous leap
- jmbwell 5mo agoI’ve also moved all mine to Europe. There are ample alternatives to us-based commercial cloud. The regulatory environment is different, so it’s worth understanding the ramifications as far as what’s expected of you if you’re operating in a different jurisdiction. It’s nothing that can’t be handled, but some may find they have to care about things they haven’t before It’s a great exercise for shoring up independence from extractive providers Maybe I should have AI write up an article too. Honestly, it’s not just rare, it quietly matters
- Damianf19 5mo ago[dead]
- Prilog 5mo ago[flagged]
- Brendinooo 5mo ago> Bugsink Huh! Interesting to see another one of these. I helped get GlitchTip off the ground awhile back. Might be worth evaluating as another self-hosted, drop-in Sentry replacement.
- ekjhgkejhgk 5mo agoUgh gitlab instead of forgejo - no credibility. Also... yeah put all your passwords on the cloud. Sounds like a good idea.
- xyzelement 5mo agoWant to state up-front, I am a dual citizen: an EU member and the US, and I live in the US. So I hope this gives my view some credibility as being grounded in the dual perspective. The sentiment we're seeing in this story/comments and thematically is EU's desire to distance from the US - sure in infrastructure - but more so in identity. Which on the high-level I think is a great goal (ie, Europe should have European identity) but is incredibly risky and I am not sure is well thought out, though I could be wrong. We can say that since 1950s the US and Europe had a familial relationship with the US being a bit of the parent despite being younger. That manifested in everything from protection (US bases in Europe, NATO), money flow, and culture flow. Since the 1950s, America did not become more European but Europe became more American. Today we're in the adolescent stage of this familial relationship - Europe wants to move out of the house and perhaps even pay for its own cell-phone plan and that could be wonderful because if that leads to a legitimately stronger and more robust Europe, that's great. But there's risk. Sometimes when the adolescent moves out of the house, they blossom into the fully manifested version of themselves. Other times they fall in with a bad crowd or fail to deal with their internal problems - and whither. It's easy to tell daddy-US to fuck off, it's much harder to not slide into the clutches of Russia and China in the next decade or two, or to deal with the internal demographic crisis. What worries me for Europe is that it is trying to "distance" more than its trying to "grow." I don't hear people talk about a Europe that's strong, that leads, that innovates - in other words, the motivation is still about the US (just in a negative sense) not about Europe itself and that's not a good sign. I still don't sense a true vibe of resurgence coming out of my native continent. Difficult problems you've always had tend to come to a head once you actually move out of your parents house. And while it's great (or at least cute) that you can switch to a European e-mail provider that's very far from what it actually takes to survive and thrive as a country in the long run. Hope it pans out.
- quentindanjou 5mo agoComparing Europe to a teenager wanting to move out of their parents' (US) house is incredibly condescending. Especially considering that the US is the actual young country being swinged in instability.
- kfk 5mo ago
- pelagicAustral 5mo agoGot a similar stack for my personal stuff, but would probably do the same if I was freelancing and whatnot. Bunny, UpCloud/Scaleway, Proton, Mistral, self-hosted Gitlab, self-hosted Plausible, had no idea about BugSink so amazing, now I know... and I deploy everything via some form of self-hosted Heroku
- OhMeadhbh 5mo agoI tried scaleway about 7 or 8 years ago and it was still pretty rough. And setting up with them required multiple trips to government portals to get id documents they would accept. Being European, they don't know how to scan the bar code on the back of US driver's licenses. It was a major PITA getting them to understand that people will sometimes change their names after they get married (my passport and birth certificate have different names and I had to dhl them a notarized copy of my name change order.) So... Digital sovereignty is cool and all, but Scaleway is taking "Know Your Customer" seriously.
- achayala 5mo agoNice post. I really was expecting you replace Github/Gitlab with Codeberg.
- mwban 5mo agoVery nice to see this more and more. Recently the German province of Schleswig-Holstei also moved almost their complete stack to European alternatives. One note: for European payment coverage there is Rootline available. But I have to put up the disclaimer that I work at Rootline.
- chinathrow 5mo ago> dig ns https://monokai.com https://monokai.com [..] > ;; AUTHORITY SECTION: com. 586 IN SOA a.gtld-servers.net. nstld.verisign-grs.com. 1778686176 1800 900 604800 900 [..] Edit for those who don't get it: .com domains are fully dependent on the US.
- rconti 5mo agoSide rant: "GMail lets you write filters against virtually anything" GMail inexplicably doesn't let you filter against almost anything in the headers, except the few fields they hand-pick. Which is unfortunate because virtually every piece of political junk spam from one major US party has the same thing in its headers, and I can't filter on it. Presumably the other major US party has similar large vendors but I don't happen to get spam from them at this time.
- neilv 5mo agoNice and helpful article. Cloudflare is a kinda funny choice to pick to trust, and maybe they'll re-evaluate that soon. GitLab is overall nice, and I recommended their on-prem product a few years ago, at an AI hardware tech startup with unusual security requirements. Today, I'd still consider GitLab, but I'd first evaluate how Forgejo fits requirements.
- maryamshafaqat 5mo agoThis was a good read. Did not feel like theory more like someone actually shipping the change.
- ge96 5mo agomonokai as in monokai pro spectrum vs code theme? that's my goto
- monokai_nl 5mo agoYeah I named the color palette after my own alias 20 years ago, that was not the smartest move perhaps, but hey here we are.
- io84 5mo agoThe very same - he writes about that elsewhere on the site.
- levmiseri 5mo agoThis might be too naively non-feature-parity, but in case someone is looking for a European alternative to Notion/Google Docs, we made https://kraa.io/about https://kraa.io/about
- rfmoz 5mo ago[dead]
- rixed 5mo agoMeanwhile, all european companies, tech or not, big and small, are preparing to make all their business depends on Anthropic or OpenAI...
- jeffrallen 5mo agoEuropean companies might prefer hosting open models on Exoscale's dedicated inference platform. (I work on ops for that product.)
- throw154 5mo agoI try to avoid Chinese, Russian and American corporations as much as i could
- raffael_de 5mo agoIs this trend going to boost adoption of K8s on IaaS as a standard for deploying compute over equivalent PaaS solutions?
- 6510 5mo agoWhen reading the docs of quite a few payment processors (for a simple cart check out) Mollie was quite hilarious. I kept thinking "this is it? This is all I need to do??" Then the masochist api's are also available. And a serious lack of "dear customer, we are keeping all of your money for reasons we wont get into, screw you and your customers, you have no further questions." Which I consider a killer feature.
- paol_taja 5mo agoI like the idea, but I always struggle with the practical side of this. As a business owner, I don't really care where the company is based on paper if the product is worse, the support is worse, or the ecosystem around it is tiny. I want better European alternatives, but they need to win on product too. "Not American" is a decent reason to try something. It is not enough of a reason to keep using it for years.
- holistio 5mo agoAs a fellow European who's also working on a similar move, I would just like to note that it is absolutely surreal that we have to consider this. I wish it was motivated by pure patriotism (give our money to relatively local businesses), but it's motivated by uncertainty, something I wouldn't have expected from the USA in my younger years.
- monokai_nl 5mo agoHey, thanks for reading and it's great to read your interesting discussions. Couple of things. The main reason to move my data to the EU is that I live in the EU and I don't want a few non-EU companies in an unstable political climate have control over it. It's too unpredictable and I rather support companies closer to my jurisdiction. I know the EU isn't perfect. And my stack is not 100% EU at the moment. I'm a pragmatist and just got down and transitioned the bulk of my services. Always room for improvement. Some good points: my domain is owned by the US. That's true, but no way around it I guess (I do own the .nl too though). I should dive deeper into using something else than GitHub / GitLab. Indeed maybe Codeberg / Forgejo. And Cloudflare proved not to be ideal today (thanks for the hug of death). I still think using Cloudflare is a problem data-wise, because it only handles public data, but I might look at BunnyCDN again to see if they have better limits.
- tamimio 5mo agoSince you are already in the migration process, should’ve migrated to self hosting instead, full independence and control, Europe isn’t that different from US, they just have few extra steps on how to handle your data. Self hosting is literally a weekend project once you have bought the equipment (or just use an old pc with hdds), and they are not expensive either, and you can even host stuff for your friends and family too. Maintenance is minimal as well, you can automate few cron jobs in proxmox and enable backups (plus 3 2 1 rule). Your data is in front of you, all yours, you don’t need permission to delete or access that, you don’t need to become a lawyer and read terms and laws, you don’t to call support for whatever either.
- Worf 5mo agoWhile the EU currently offers more privacy than the US, the best solution would be to use services which no one could have any meaningful control over, as much as possible, except the user. Self-hosting (including object storage, backups, CDNs) is hard, but doable for some companies. For others it's life-and-death due to costs. Analytics should be kept at a minimum and should always be self-hosted. Email should die and be replaced with some E2EE solution. Matrix is far from perfect but if I were to make a website now, I would offer the choice of a Matrix address for account creation and comms. It's still federated and, while not offering 100% privacy, is much better than email, which offers none. Using a service for transactional email is something that shouldn't be required in an ideal world. That it is only shows how email is captured by a few big players who simply won't deliver your message even if you follow the best practices when setting up your server. Payment services shouldn't be required in an ideal world, either. They're needed because of a bunch of regulations and unnecessary complexities that could've been avoided and aren't needed from a technical POV. AI use is troublesome when a company is not using their self-hosted models. As a customer, I wouldn't want my data being shared to a US company or an EU one, although if I had to choose, I'd say EU would be the lesser evil.
- jlundberg 5mo agoI am so happy email is not dead. We need more playing fields and protocols new players can enter with being blocked by a gatekeeper. One could argue Google and Microsoft are gatekeepes for email and in some sense they are. But at least it’s possible to challenge their power both technically and policy wise. Eventually it will fade.
- sajithdilshan 5mo agoI'm pretty sure I'm gonna get a loads of downvotes for this comments, but what is the whole point of this? Let's say in next general election in Germany, AfD would come into power, form a government and Germany decided to break away from EU, and when that destabilizes EU, are you going to move all your stuff back to US?
- capibara13 5mo ago[dead]
- jlundberg 5mo agoWe see a lot of new users coming from Twilio. For some reason the LLMs have started recommending us for people looking for a European or Swedish alternative.
- Rover222 5mo agoSo you love having to accept cookies. This is what the EU did to us. Unforgivable.
- CamelCaseCondo 5mo agoIf all the juicy content moves to the EU, the US will force the EU to open its platform for external access. See what happened to the Swiss banking.
- crossroadsguy 5mo agoI had taken my email to mailbox.org many years ago and I have been paying the price (not the fee/cost) ever since. The service doesn't have zero support, it has negative support. If you ever face any issue the responses are such that knee-jerk reactions by toddlers would be no match. Sadly I've used their domain email at so many places that even winding it all down seems so tough and it will take long. I am going to do it anyway. Downgrade to single euro plan until I complete my @mailbox.org email change/migration while in parallel moving domains to another provider. I don't want quick email service support, but I don't want an "not our fault" after two weeks and then radio silence. Complete ghosting. I have used many paid services from Europe and around but mailbox.org, imho, is one of the most user hostile. I'd appreciate some suggestions. (FastMail is overkill for my usage. Otherwise it's fantastic, I've used its trial).
- sexylinux 5mo agoI made the very opposite experience with mailbox.org! Very competent people, very friendly, reliable. Absolutely no problems.
- Steinmark 5mo ago[flagged]
- storus 5mo agoAnd in other news some European Google Mail accounts got a notification that due to their usage patterns, they are migrating their accounts to Texas (for people who might have traveled through Texas at some point in the past).
- Beijinger 5mo ago"Not everything moved. Cloudflare is a US company, I still use it, and I’m at peace with that." I am not. THe cancer of the Internet. Sometimes Cloudflare does not work abroad. It is annoying. "Here’s the reasoning: Cloudflare sits in front of my public-facing websites. Its job is to cache, protect against DDoS attacks," If your host has no protection against DDoS then find a better host. You can find very cheap CDN, if you really need them. Likely you dont. As a word of caution, Cloudflare can have a devastating effect on SEO if you are not a paying customer and serve your stuff from your own URL. Cloudflare allows this only for paid accounts.
- wackget 5mo agoThat's cool but your text-based web page won't even display in my browser which doesn't support webgl.
- parijatmohor 5mo ago[flagged]
- Fedot982 5mo agobig job
- bcye 5mo ago[dead]
- momo26 5mo agoWill the environment is EU be particularly better than US?
- retinaros 5mo agothere is no digital sovereignty in european cloud. first they would bow down to any bigger instance of power that ask for their data and being smaller companies than azure aws gcp they wouldnt have the firepower to fight back against governments. Like this one : https://www.theregister.com/off-prem/2025/11/27/canadian-data-order-risks-blowing-a-hole-in-eu-sovereignty/2615140 https://www.theregister.com/off-prem/2025/11/27/canadian-dat... second, europe has the most digitally agressive roadmap in the democratic world right now. they plan to ban vpn, enforce agressive data laws that give full power to authorities and gov to extract legally your data from your "sovereign cloud", remove anonymity from the web, enforce a cashless distopia where they can track everything and block you from using your own cash, punish you with laws against hate speech where governements decide what they define as hate speech depending on who is in power. finally for his choices. Mistral while riding the european sovereignity wave is in fact an american owned company with european founders and the french gov trying to kill anything that they dont like touching Mistral. OVH while a good company is definitly not providing US cloud-level data resiliency and recent events are pretty worrisome from data loss fire and hacks on customer data Proton, maybe the only company that ever looked for sovereignity is thinking about leaving switzerland due to these opressive laws.https://www.techradar.com/vpn/vpn-privacy-security/we-would-be-less-confidential-than-google-proton-threatens-to-quit-switzerland-over-new-surveillance-law https://www.techradar.com/vpn/vpn-privacy-security/we-would-... also he kept the only company that is vibecoding in prod (cloudflare) and proud of it while laying off people based on the ai-religion. It is like he made all the wrong choice if his goal was like he says to own his data and know "where is the data"
- ____mr____ 5mo agoIts so silly to see people actually believe the EU is a real sovereign body. The only thing unifying various nationalists within the EU is Americas dominance in the global market and their opposition to it. An EU freed from American (and Chinese) political and market pressures will eventually lead to their various nationalists turning their anger towards whoever gets to sit on top of the EU (probably germany) and fracturing the union. The only other thing uniting "us" all is racism towards black and arab people.
- mrklol 5mo agoI think I would move everything too for my hobby projects, if it wouldn’t be that crazy cheap at Cloudflare. I still use external servers in the EU for backend stuff, but CDN, static pages, frontend projects run at Cloudflare for free or the $5 tier. I legit can’t get cheaper than this, till they adjust their pricing. Their free tier seems way too generous and I suppose this has to be adjusted at some point.
- egorfine 5mo ago> Mollie is a Dutch payment processor with full EU incorporation, strong GDPR compliance by design, and a product that has matured considerably in recent years. So, fully KYC'ed with PoA no older than 6 months, strong residency requirement for at least two generations, half of the payments are rejected based on travel rule, SARs are generated automatically on every transactions and only EC card accepted? As much as I'd love to move to EU services, a billing system being fully compliant to EU financial regulations should make it almost impossible to actually move money.
- HackerThemAll 5mo agoI am heavily reliant on the Office suite, and aware of many business that also are. I tried to switch to LibreOffice numerous times, with no success. For example, a simple thing - the CSV import wizard is so inefficient and buggy in LibreOffice that I spent literally hours to make it work. I then proposed concrete improvements for the LibreOffice team, but they got downplayed and dismissed. "Everything's normal, just got used to it". The productivity with LibreOffice is ruined at the very moment you have to do anything but typing a text or spreadsheet cell content. Paying the MS subscription returns in a few hours saved by it compared to LibreOffice and clones.
- spelufo 5mo agoPedantic note on notation: "A > B" reads as "A greater than B" "A -> B" reads as "A to B"
- amai 4mo agoInstead of gitlab I can recommend https://codeberg.org/ https://codeberg.org/.
- amai 4mo agoSee also https://www.reddit.com/r/BuyFromEU/ https://www.reddit.com/r/BuyFromEU/.
- terekhindc 4mo ago[flagged]