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Uber is letting women avoid male drivers and riders in the US
- maest 8mo agoDoes this mean women drivers will command higher rates?
- SequoiaHope 8mo agoSince their passengers (women in this case) on average earn less, that customer base would be less likely to drive up the price. Also probably only a small percentage of the customers would choose this.
- jlawson 8mo agoIt'd be hilarious if women formed their own closed rideshare economy; they'd discover that they demand much higher prices from each other than they get from men.
- nicce 8mo agoHappened already in Finland. See Club WOWO Oy.
- brookst 8mo agoIt would be funny if the market showed women were willing to pay a premium to avoid being raped?
- general1465 8mo agoAfter figuring that they are paying more than males, they would be protesting against "rideshare gap"
- w0de0 8mo agoAnd they’d be right to, fella. It is unjust to need to pay more to achieve similar safety.
- mrits 8mo agodoes Uber Comfort not cover this already?
- mholm 8mo agoUnfortunately necessary. Essentially every girl I know has had at least one bad experience with a creepy uber driver. These are people that are entering their address and often their workplace into the app. It's a big reason why a lot of my friends are picking Waymos instead.
- deleted 8mo ago[deleted]
- SoftTalker 8mo ago[flagged]
- irl_zebra 8mo agoThis incident is creepy enough that I would also not agree to a give a random stranger a ride home, absent any additional context or mitigations. Maybe to avoid waking up in an ice bath with my liver gone. But, to not give a ride because of some perceived idea that they would claim you assaulted them or something is a bit "this person should go touch some grass" or whatever.
- EGreg 8mo agoInteresting One of you is afraid that YOU are going to get assaulted or worse. The other is afraid you’re going to get ACCUSED of it. What has this society become?
- baggy_trough 8mo agoA low-trust society.
- RajT88 8mo agoThe world we live in is one where women being assaulted is an order of magnitude larger problem than women falsely accusing someone of assault.
- mothballed 8mo ago[flagged]
- polski-g 8mo agoAs it is a membership-only club, yes they can: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boy_Scouts_of_America_v._Dale https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boy_Scouts_of_America_v._Dale
- hrimfaxi 8mo ago> In a 5–4 decision, the Supreme Court ruled that opposition to homosexuality is part of BSA's "expressive message" and that allowing homosexuals as adult leaders would interfere with that message. How does this discrimination factor into Uber's expressive message?
- _cenw 8mo agoThat's not even as close to as smart of a gotcha as you think it is.
- hrimfaxi 8mo agoCan you explain why? I am surprised this kind of discrimination is allowed, too. I know some discrimination is allowed like for hooters, etc but that is more on the hiring side not on the customer options side.
- metabagel 8mo agoBecause it's a legit safety concern not based on racism or bigotry.
- akramachamarei 8mo agoWhich are you referring to? /hj
- Der_Einzige 8mo ago
- hexyl_C_gut 8mo agoIf this form of discrimination is ok, can we get other filters?
- glouwbug 8mo agoWomen's only gyms and hours exist already. If there's a need, and they feel safer this way, let them have it
- GaryBluto 8mo ago> they feel safer this way, What if somebody started a Whites-only gym because it made them feel safer?
- sanswork 8mo agoAre there many assaults on uber passengers because they are white? Are there many assaults on uber passengers because they are women? There is your answer.
- ShowalkKama 8mo ago[flagged]
- sanswork 8mo agoI understand socioeconomic factors so I just ignore racist talking points.
- ShowalkKama 8mo agothe fact that skin color can be a proxy for socioeconomic factors does not change the statistics. Do you investigate why a rapist has raped someone and then ignore it if the reason is socioeconomic factors? If applying your logic on skin color leads to discrimination then maybe it's discrimination even when the discriminated party is males.
- satvikpendem 8mo agoThis is not new, it seems, although the previous ones were just tests: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44659635 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44659635 Lyft already has such a feature, and personally I've been getting into Empower more, which also has the feature. This app pays more for drivers due to not actually acting as a taxi company but simply connecting the driver and rider marketplaces, something Uber tried to do as well but failed due to legal challenges as well as keeping margin for themselves. Empower just charged $50 per month to drivers as a subscription fee for the service and then lets them keep all the actual ride money. However, just as with a marketplace connector like TripAdvisor or TaskRabbit, your mileage may vary (literally) in terms of driver ratings and safety, due to Empower not doing as comprehensive background checks as Uber or Lyft, so it is up to your personal risk tolerance.
- xenospn 8mo agoThat might be tough - I remember having plenty of women drivers back in 2012 when uber and Lyft just got started. These days they’re extremely rare.
- cheezur 8mo agoWe are reinventing, from first principles, the discrimination we fought so hard against in the 20th century.
- jlawson 8mo ago[flagged]
- nathanaldensr 8mo agoIdealism meeting reality.
- usefulcat 8mo agoIf there wasn't a need for this then I might agree with you, but there is a need and that's the much bigger problem here.
- 1718627440 8mo agoThere was a need to be perceived as well for women not needing to live in hostile prisons and that ended with women effectively not being allowed their own bank accounts.
- traderj0e 8mo agoPeople in the 20th century saw a need to discriminate too
- ray023 8mo ago[flagged]
- bsenftner 8mo agoA population of class action attorneys just smiled. A paycheck is materializing.
- slowmovintarget 8mo agoThe real problem is that this is necessary. This same thing that keeps on happening when we try to reinvent things "without all that stuff that just adds friction." As with software, one should understand the underlying reasons for constraints in the old system before building the second one. Banking -> crypto and NFT "without all that stuff..." -> wash trading. Taxi service -> Uber "without all that employer stuff..." -> drivers with no background checks and no interview process I understand part of this is routing around the damage of monopoly maintenance (medallion system, for example), but let's fix that instead of taking away the protections in place. Sorry for the rant. I know this is like asking water to run uphill.
- nathanaldensr 8mo agoHardly a rant. You're just describing the "move fast and break things" ethic (or should I say unethic). Or said another way: "all of the convenience with none of the responsibility."
- moduspol 8mo agoCertainly that's an issue, but at least as bad is when things get over-regulated and nobody's willing to re-assess.
- kelvinjps10 8mo agoIt happens with taxi drivers too. I know women friends/family that don't like going in taxis because of the unnecessary flirting and harassment where with Uber it's easier to report and check by the driver's rating.
- traderj0e 8mo agoWere taxis any better in this respect?
- AdmiralAsshat 8mo agoUber is only getting this now? Wasn't this like a core offering of its longtime competitor, Lyft?
- nicce 8mo agoThis wasn’t even problem in EU before Uber lobbied regulation changes. Drivers had to meet strict criterias before the changes.
- deleted 8mo ago[deleted]
- nine_zeros 8mo ago[dead]
- brewcejener 8mo ago[dead]
- vaginaphobic 8mo ago[dead]
- urba_ 8mo ago[dead]
- kelseyfrog 8mo agoAbsolutely wild that none of the dissenting comments suggest a means of lowering or eliminating sexual harassment of women passengers. Why not start there? Get creative.
- brookst 8mo agoSo when you read Uber’s annual safety reports you didn’t see anything in this vein, either as actions taken or changes in statistics?
- kelseyfrog 8mo agoI'm talking about the comments here. Like yours that would rather shoot the messenger than actually make a positive change in the world. It sounds like you'd rather I shut up, then you know, actually do something.
- deleted 8mo ago[deleted]
- Dylan16807 8mo agoDo you have any compelling ideas on how to do that? I don't think it's 'wild' that people criticizing a company action aren't starting their comments with "here's how I'd fix society".
- kelseyfrog 8mo agoI'm fine with the fix. My point is to those who aren't. Suggest something better.
- Dylan16807 8mo agoThis isn't a fix, this is a workaround. It would be cool if people have better ideas, but someone criticizing this workaround doesn't need to suggest something better, and it's not weird for them to lack better ideas but still post. It's a hard problem. And "better than nothing" might get an idea approved but doesn't let it escape criticism.
- paxys 8mo agoSo Uber is finally dropping the pretense of "vetted drivers" and "strict background checks" and whatever else they claim in their advertising. It's good that women get this service, but I'd be pretty concerned as a man as well. At this point whenever I call an Uber it's a 50/50 whether the person and car listed in the app will be the one picking me up. A lot of times I wonder if the driver has a license or insurance at all. They've been churning through drivers so quickly over the last decade that it's now impossible to get new ones on the service without massively lowering standards and looking the other way when something comes up as irregular.
- no_wizard 8mo agoThey're going to spin it as a concession of the lawsuits they're facing, and they're face plenty, regarding the sexual assault of women from drivers. This isn't being done because they want to, users have been asking for this since pretty early in ridesharing history. They're pre-empting the lawsuits and their consequences
- paxys 8mo agoDoes anyone have experience using this feature? I can't imagine it'll be easy to get matched with a female driver. From my own experience Uber/Lyft/taxi drivers are seemingly 99%+ men.
- oceansky 8mo agoIt's 80%. https://www.uber.com/us/en/newsroom/gamechangers/ https://www.uber.com/us/en/newsroom/gamechangers/
- stackedinserter 8mo ago[flagged]
- recursivedoubts 8mo ago"As I pass through my incarnations in every age and race, I make my proper prostrations to the Gods of the Market Place. Peering through reverent fingers I watch them flourish and fall, And the Gods of the Copybook Headings, I notice, outlast them all." https://www.kiplingsociety.co.uk/poem/poems_copybook.htm https://www.kiplingsociety.co.uk/poem/poems_copybook.htm
- avidiax 8mo agoUber is already being sued by male drivers in California: https://onlabor.org/january-25-2026 https://onlabor.org/january-25-2026 I think the lawsuits probably make sense. While you can claim that there is a statistical danger, you can make that same claim about a number of other protected characteristics. Would we allow riders to request only female, heterosexual, over 45, wealthy Quaker drivers, if that happens to be the statistically safest driver characteristic?
- bluedays 8mo agoThe wealthy Quaker drivers thing threw me. I know it's an exaggeration but is there a large enough wealthy Quaker driver population drivers ubers for this to be a concern?
- avidiax 8mo agoI highly doubt that there is. I'm just saying that if you can discriminate on drivers based on protected characteristic Y and data suggesting that characteristic Y is more/less dangerous, then you should be able to discriminate on protected characteristic X based on similar data, or both characteristics X and Y, or characteristics X, Y, Z, U and W. If characteristic X was race, religion or sexuality, I think people would be extremely opposed to this, and not even entertain the idea that this would be acceptable.
- scoofy 8mo agoYou don't have to dance around it. That's exactly what's happening. The people here who are saying it's okay to discriminate against men because "they" commit sexual assaults at a higher rate, those same people would (rightly) lose their minds if anyone suggest that we should discriminate against African Americans if they were to commit some violent crime at a higher rate. We need to call a spade a spade here. This is blindly terrible logic. It's crass sex discrimination, and it's affect people's ability to find employment, and it's almost certainly against the law. Deciding we can just start discriminating against an entire class of people in employment or housing, just because their is a subset of that class committing crimes is a civil rights violation. People need to stop treating this like it's somehow okay because it's men.
- buynlarge 8mo agoCar share apps could have a camera and audio on mode. - The inside of the car is surveilled and made available for both parties after the ride. - The intent is made clear, that this is to capture a trace of any harassment or misconduct. Hopefully making this statement puts all parties on their best behaviour. - Any failure to comply by the driver, camera blocked or audio muffled, then driver gets penalised.
- lordfrito 8mo agoSex is a protected class under Title VII of the civil rights act. And the supreme court recently said that even majority classes (men) are protected by this. Since Uber involved in the decision to send more business to female drivers than male drivers, this would seem to me to run afoul of employment discrimination (sorry we don't need as many men workers today, too many of you competing so market forces mean we're going to pay you less, etc). Can someone explain to me how this is (or isn't) legal under Title VII? It seems if this is fully legal because it's the customer making the decision, then pretty much any form of "in app" discrimination is legal as long as it's the customer doing the discrimination. How long till "I don't want a black/white/gay/etc driver" options show up? "All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than others." — George Orwell, Animal Farm
- paxys 8mo agoIs it illegal to set a filter for a female gynecologist over a male one? Or a male gym trainer over a female one? Or a massage service, hostel, sports team? Is it illegal to set a gender preference on a dating app? Is it illegal to issue a casting call for a female actor or model? This kind of "discrimination" is a part of society, and has been tested in courts plenty of times.
- akramachamarei 8mo agoI don't think you need scare quotes, this is discrimination. Discrimination isn't always bad. IANAL but it seems like these are cases where we just kinda ignore some laws, and society usually goes okay despite and in spite of it. Just my uneducated impression. Could you link to some cases where this kind of thing has been tested? I have an amateur interest in law and this issue is puzzling to me. It's not at all clear to me why it's okay to discriminate against Uber drivers based on the genitals they are born with, but not e.g. their skin color or religion.
- robhlt 8mo agoThe legal standard that must be met for this kind of discrimination is called "Bona fide occupational qualification" [1] Generally customer demand is not enough use this defense. Airlines tried using it to defend hiring only female flight attendants and lost. 1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bona_fide_occupational_qualification https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bona_fide_occupational_qualifi...
- haunter 8mo agoBolt have that too in Europe https://i.imgur.com/qAkPtbt.jpeg https://i.imgur.com/qAkPtbt.jpeg
- deleted 8mo ago[deleted]
- zoezoezoezoe 8mo agoThis is a great change!
- Simulacra 8mo agoI think this is blatant sexual discrimination. I appreciate the sentiment behind it, but it's discriminatory. Maybe if someone can request a male driver instead of female it MIGHT eventually balance out, but I don't see this surviving judicial scrutiny.
- Humbly8967 8mo agoOnly women can request women drivers? Ok. Will trans women and intersex people be allowed to request women drivers? They are an especially vulnerable group. What about women drivers? How will the boundaries of these classifications be determined, and what happens when someone tests these boundaries?
- nyczomg 8mo ago“What about women drivers?” The headline is… “Uber is letting women avoid male drivers and riders in the US”
- Humbly8967 8mo agoWhat I was trying to get at is that the class boundaries get fuzzy for both the riders and drivers. And where you draw the line will have consequences for both riders and drivers.
- mvdtnz 8mo ago"If we can't make it perfect we shouldn't make it better".
- scoofy 8mo agoWe either care about sex discrimination everywhere, or we don't actually care about it at all. "I like discrimination when it's good for me" is not a serious position.
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- baubino 8mo agoWhile I‘m glad that there’s an immediate safe option for women riders, in the longer term this lets Uber off the hook when they should be taking responsibility for their drivers who are functionally employees despite Uber insisting otherwise. It’s worth noting that the old school taxi companies did not have this problem of rampant sexual assault committed by their drivers. Why? Because they performed background checks before hire. I know that at least in Chicago it was very difficult to get licensed as a taxi driver. The problem with Uber is that they make it very very easy for shady individuals to be drivers, then act like they have no control over who’s driving.
- seanmcdirmid 8mo agoLong term it will be Waymo, and there won't need to be issues anymore because no human drivers. > It’s worth noting that the old school taxi companies did not have this problem of rampant sexual assault committed by their drivers. Wait what? Did you not read a newspaper in the 80s and 90s? If you do a google search today for "taxi driver" and "sexual assault" you will not come up with nothing. > Why? Because they performed background checks before hire. 99.9% of the taxi drivers in the US have and have always been independent contractors. Uber does background checks on all drivers in the US. A family member applied and was rejected because of a marijuana possession conviction when she was much younger in a state far far away from where she lives now. https://www.uber.com/us/en/ride/safety/driver-screening/ https://www.uber.com/us/en/ride/safety/driver-screening/ (this is much more screening that I've seen elsewhere, but maybe you think they are cutting corners?)
- baubino 8mo agoI only have experience in one city but I know that getting to drive for Uber is much much easier than getting a taxi driving job in the 90s. Taxi companies performed extensive background checks and while Uber claims to do so now, it’s not clear to me that they have really taken seriously the safety problem and that any random person shouldn’t be allowed as a driver. Their incentive is to get as many people driving as possible. I never said there were no instances of sexual assault by taxi drivers; just pointing out that there’s a real crisis of rampant assault with Uber for which there are solutions that they’ve essentially refused to entertain because they don’t want to take responsibility for their drivers. I’m saying that these companies need to be held responsible for their role in this problem.
- zombot 8mo agoWell, if you can't stop the Johns from being animals, that's the only thing left to do.
- Markoff 8mo agoGreat solution, next do special women subway coaches, separate public buses to mixed vs women areas and separate girls and boys in school, down to road we can introduce burqa just to make sure nobody has reason to attack women.
- thrance 8mo agoSlippery slope fallacy. It's unfortunate that gender seggragation is the only way to stop women from being raped by their Uber drivers, but in a country led by a raging misogynist and pedophile, it's hardly surprising that we would need to go that far. I'm all for building a safer society for everyone, but in the meantime this crutch appears necessary.
- Alan_Writer 8mo agoDoes this even matter right now? The number of female drivers is quite small. Maybe later on, there'll be another controversy whether to take a male or female drive, just like it happened with taxis taking over Uberists in the beginning. Time and good security frameworks will place this into "something else" that happened at some time.
- avanticc 8mo agoThe shift toward Waymo mentioned in the comments is a perfect example of how 'low-trust' environments drive automation. People aren't just choosing autonomous vehicles for the tech; they’re choosing them to remove the human variable entirely. If a platform like Uber can't guarantee safety through its vetting process, the market will naturally move toward solutions that eliminate the need for trust in the first place. It’s a sad commentary on the state of the gig economy when the 'killer feature' is just the absence of another person.
- thrance 8mo agoAnd then this automation contributes in turn to this "low-trust environment", removing one more human interaction from your day and further erroding the social fabric. Taken to the extreme, this only ends with everyone completely isolated and talking to AIs all day, like in Asimov's The Naked Sun. Not really my preferred vision of the future, tbh.
- lucyjojo 8mo agomeanwhile japan has special train cars for women only. you gotta stop thinking "low/high-trust" everywhere you put your eyes on.
- customguy 8mo agoThey're also doing it in Berlin, Frankfurt and München. Bolt is offering it in Berlin. I dislike Uber, I'd rather walk than take one, but if it has to exist, I think it's awesome they're doing this. There is also a women-exclusive company in Berlin now: https://g-cars.co/ https://g-cars.co/
- eudamoniac 8mo agoI think there is nothing wrong with this change. Customers should be able to patronize, with great granularity, the sort of businesses, employees, and people that they wish to. The push to advertise "black owned" or "women owned" businesses is similar to this. Letting people choose who to patronize is generally good. It would be better to have more filtering options for everyone, though. One might prefer a male driver, for example, or a black driver, and if one wishes to wait longer for the driver to arrive because of their narrow preferences, that should be their right.
- josefritzishere 8mo agoBetter late than never?