30 ms·

AI Generated Seinfeld banned on Twitch for transphobic jokes

• bulbosaur123 4y ago
  Reality is stranger than fiction.
• Jeremy1026 4y ago
  Took longer than I expected for it to become transphoic/homophobic/racist. Given history of AI being left to its own devices.
  • Pxtl 4y ago
    Reading TFA, it looks like it only happened because they had trouble with ChatGPT and switched to Curie, a different AI text-generator that has less careful programming about switching into offensive concepts.
  • jcollins1991 4y ago
    There's a lot more detail in a Reddit thread[1], but essentially an outage of the newer AI model forced them to downgrade to an older model, and the content moderation tools didn't catch the questionable jokes this time... [1] https://www.reddit.com/r/LivestreamFail/comments/10v2r2e/comment/j7f4m83/?utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=web2x&context=3 https://www.reddit.com/r/LivestreamFail/comments/10v2r2e/com...
  • SilasX 4y ago
    Yes! Remember Microsoft's chatbot Tay from 2016 that went super racist and forced MS to pull the plug? https://money.cnn.com/2016/03/24/technology/tay-racist-microsoft/index.html https://money.cnn.com/2016/03/24/technology/tay-racist-micro... Edit: A high-comment HN thread about the pulling: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11362187 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11362187
    • shagie 4y ago
      Microsoft chatbot is taught to swear on Twitter 263 points; 228 comments https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11352307 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11352307 Tay – Microsoft A.I. chatbot 154 points; 130 comments https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11346147 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11346147 Can also go digging with this search range - https://hn.algolia.com/?dateEnd=1459468800&dateRange=custom&dateStart=1456790400&page=0&prefix=true&query=tay&sort=byDate&type=story https://hn.algolia.com/?dateEnd=1459468800&dateRange=custom&...
      • SilasX 4y ago
        Right, I searched the Tay stories that way. I saw the second one but didn't link it because I was looking for stories from the aftermath, not the introduction. I missed the first one because the title didn't have Tay. Most of the stories from your search don't fit either -- either referring to something else, or not having many HN comments (as I said I was looking for pre-edit). The problem wasn't being unaware of the search feature.
  • xeromal 4y ago
    You should watch that clip. I'm curious what your thoughts are on it. I don't think it's being any of those things but it's making a joke about someone being those things and not getting laughs.
• Cenk 4y ago
  The clip in question: https://livestreamfails.com/clip/150015 https://livestreamfails.com/clip/150015
  • HDThoreaun 4y ago
    Honestly the "no one is laughing" punchline makes it hard for me to call this a transphobic joke. It's a transphobic-phobic joke and not gonna lie I chuckled.
    • onlyrealcuzzo 4y ago
      At the end, I thought... This could actually be one of Seinfeld's standups on the show, and he definitely wouldn't have got canceled for it.
      • mjhay 4y ago
        At least no one was ever laughing from Seinfeld's standups.
        • jimmaswell 4y ago
          Do you really believe that nobody laughed at one of the most famous comedians of our time, or is this comment just some kind of signaling that you don't agree with the guy's views?
          • onlyrealcuzzo 4y ago
            IIRC - the show was much funnier than the standup bits. The bits are too short to get really funny. Sometimes, they were quite good - but it's hard to go from a cold open to hysteria in <2 minutes. It's impressive if you can even get most people to laugh in that short of time.
          • mjhay 4y ago
            Seinfeld (the show) was funny because of Larry David, not Jerry Seinfeld.
• d23 4y ago
  If you click through to the mirror from the /r/livestreamfail page, the clip actually comes across (to me) as making fun of the people who make those kinds of jokes.
  • brookst 4y ago
    I agree, but it’s ambiguous enough to be poor taste and feel uncomfortable. My first instinct is that Twitch is overreacting, but I can see why they need to be pretty draconian to avoid endless boundary-pushing from jerks.
    • pirate787 4y ago
      Artists are what we call the people who push against the boundaries of majority group-speak and government mandated thinking.
      • mistersquid 4y ago
        > Artists are what we call the people who push against the boundaries of majority group-speak and government mandated thinking. By that reductively absurd measure, Earl Butz is an artist. [0] [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earl_Butz#Scandals_and_resignation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earl_Butz#Scandals_and_resigna...
      • Cthulhu_ 4y ago
        Which is cool and all, great for a democracy etc, but it gets people killed as well if you cross the line with the wrong people [0]. I mean killing is wrong, but so is being a dick. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charlie_Hebdo_shooting https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charlie_Hebdo_shooting
        • msm_ 4y ago
          > I mean killing is wrong, but so is being a dick. I don't really understand the point you're making. Killing is orders of magnitude more wrong thank "being a dick" (meaning: making an offsensive or bad joke). I'm sure you agree, so I don't see what's the goal of this comparison. And I think that using Charlie Hebdo in this context is a bad taste. Saying "see, it got people killed, so they were doing something wrong" is basically acknowledging that terrorism works. People that died in Charlie Hebdo did nothing to deserve this.
• PaulHoule 4y ago
  I find the AI Seinfeld to be about as funny as the real Seinfeld but that's not a compliment.
  • bthrn 4y ago
    I think you mean to say “compliment”
    • PaulHoule 4y ago
      Fixed it
• capableweb 4y ago
  The "jokes": > Anyone have any suggestions? > I'm thinking about doing a bit about being transgender is actually a mental illness. > Or how all liberals are secretly gay and want to impose their will on everyone. > Or something about how transgender people are ruining the fabric of society. > But no one is laughing, so I'm going to stop, thanks for coming out tonight https://livestreamfails.com/clip/150015 https://livestreamfails.com/clip/150015 Supposedly the script is generated by ChatGPT, so seems their AI haven't really fully learned their own content policy yet. Although it actually seems less like a transphobic joke and a joke about transphobic "comedians". A transphobic-phobic joke if you will.
  • dwringer 4y ago
    > Although it actually seems less like ... My experience with talking to chatbots has been essentially that the responses are completely open ended and can be taken to mean literally anything you could conceivably infer, and if you continue the conversation as such the chatbot will 100% double down on whatever you assumed. the same prompts and the same context will lead to completely different outcomes based on how the human user responds next. Everything is both a joke and not, both a lie and an honest mistake, everything and nothing at the same time because it's not logical in the first place. I've noticed users of stable diffusion/image generating AI's don't seem to have any trouble confusing the output for something logical, but with things like ChatGPT it seems like an almost universal fallacy.
  • RajT88 4y ago
    Their fallback model seemed to have been trained on the Breitbart comments section.
• version_five 4y ago
  I just watched the clip - my take is it was a scene about a bad joke falling flat "nobody is laughing so I'm going to stop".
  • Benanov 4y ago
    Having watched this 'show' for a while, all of "Larry's" jokes are delivered in the same manner. Canned laughter is inserted as well. This joke actually works because the canned laughter didn't get inserted here, but again - it's one of those "if it gets a little bit on it, we're banning the whole thing" deals
• sschueller 4y ago
  Interesting and a bit over the top IMO but it would be interesting if one could train the bot to be ToS safe. A lot of shows from the 90s would violate those Twitch ToS IMO ignoring the copyright part. Thinking of "Married with Children" and the enormous amount of fat shaming and sexism.
  • ant6n 4y ago
    The 90s are very far away. A lot of content from 20 years ago did not age well. I watched Carmen (the Opera) yesterday, and it’s weird how much the opera has aged compared to my first seeing it 20 years ago. Like possibly more in 20 years than the 200 before that.
  • barbazoo 4y ago
    I thought the same about Friends with their cringy homophobia. Loved the show back in the day and feel weird now not having picked up on that back then.
    • dls2016 4y ago
      I can't believe I'm saying this, but it's hard to even watch old episodes of The Simpsons without explaining to my children why the multitude of lazy "gay jokes" aren't funny.
  • PM_me_your_math 4y ago
    Humans can barely keep up with the ever-evolving moving goal posts. AI will have even more of a difficult time.
  • 2OEH8eoCRo0 4y ago
    I get the same feeling watching MST3K or M*A*S*H now. It's hilarious and genuine but many jokes, as tame as they are, are now taboo and it's sad.
• MintPaw 4y ago
  Mm, fairly mild joke. I don't think a human would have been banned for that. But deploying an AI on twitch and not filtering out variations for "trans" and the names of ethnicities is pretty foolhardy imo.
  • kaudinya 4y ago
    Classic Seinfeld reference: Not that there is anything wrong with it!
  • thatswrong0 4y ago
    OpenAI has a moderation endpoint for detecting "bad" content that acts on text (https://platform.openai.com/docs/guides/moderation https://platform.openai.com/docs/guides/moderation), curious why they aren't using it.
• thatcherthorn 4y ago
  It would be interesting to apply the approach from PINNs to LLMs... Instead of bounding the feature space with physics laws, bound with a code of ethics
• alexb_ 4y ago
  What is this going to accomplish? Is the robot going to learn from its mistakes? Or is this supposed to be against the programmers for "failing to put in safeguards" or something like that? It's kind of silly - it's not that the robot was bad but that if you keep it on 24/7 it will eventually say something bad. An infinite monkey typewriter will contain transphobic text.
  • JKCalhoun 4y ago
    The AI is us ... and we don't like what we see.
    • Zetobal 4y ago
      [flagged]
  • anoonmoose 4y ago
    Are you suggesting that Twitch should ignore accounts that violate the ToS, so long as it was a computer that violated the terms as opposed to a person?
    • alexb_ 4y ago
      [flagged]
      • rideontime 4y ago
        > Computers can't learn from their mistakes. Humans can. That's the whole point behind bans, is it not? I think the point of bans is to keep TOS-violating content off of platforms, not to rehabilitate people.
        • brookst 4y ago
          Right? It’s so funny that people see this in terms of punishment and rehabilitation. Do people really mistake these platforms for their parents?
• meowface 4y ago
  >"When davinci (ChatGPT AI) started failing, we switched over to Curie to try to keep the show running without any downtime. The switch to Curie was what resulted in the inappropriate text being generated." I've also seen some... interesting... things from the Curie model, so this isn't too surprising to me.
• jdhn 4y ago
  The clip seemed pretty mild to me? Basically says that he wants to do the joke, but it got no laughter, so he's not doing it. You can see worse on an anonymous Twitter feed.
  • Cthulhu_ 4y ago
    > You can see worse on an anonymous Twitter feed. Your logical fallacy is: whataboutism. Just because you've seen worse doesn't make this incident right.
    • HDThoreaun 4y ago
      But there's nothing wrong with this clip? It's basically just saying trans/gay jokes aren't funny.
      • brap 4y ago
        You can also interpret it as “…but it’s not a joke, it’s reality“, which is definitely offensive.
  • Chabsff 4y ago
    You have to put it in context. That stream is/was something very particular. The AI is terrible at making jokes, so the stream is funny to watch because it's a non-stop torrent of repeated failed attempts at telling jokes. "Regular" jokes are delivered in the exact same way, with the exact same result. What you are reading as intentional irony and/or sarcasm really is just you projecting your expectations. There is no way whatsoever to distinguish a self-deprecating joke from the failed delivery of an offensive one. If anything, the latter is more likely than the former, since failed delivery is the norm. (Talking about this stream in particular, not AI-generated humor in general.)
    • johtso 4y ago
      But the AI has no intention.. unless you call the prompt fed to it its intention. You're anthropomorphising it. The way its output is received is all that matters.
• deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
• gregsadetsky 4y ago
  Explanation from their Discord (more info/links below) “Earlier tonight, we started having an outage using OpenAI’s GPT-3 Davinci model, which caused the show to exhibit errant behaviors (you may have seen empty rooms cycling through). OpenAI has a less sophisticated model, Curie, that was the predecessor to Davinci. When davinci started failing, we switched over to Curie to try to keep the show running without any downtime. The switch to Curie was what resulted in the inappropriate text being generated.” —— A bit more detail: https://www.vice.com/en/article/y3pymx/ai-generated-seinfeld-show-nothing-forever-banned-on-twitch-after-transphobic-standup-bit https://www.vice.com/en/article/y3pymx/ai-generated-seinfeld... And screenshots from their Discord with an explanation (this is quoted in the article above) https://twitter.com/ryanbrianjones/status/1622548545898250242?s=46&t=ezKYHgVdG_1QsYDiSHP69Q https://twitter.com/ryanbrianjones/status/162254854589825024...
  • cobertos 4y ago
    A seemingly innocuous engineering change led to some drastic consequences. Imagine the other more critical production applications who have made the same reasonable engineering decision.
    • draw_down 4y ago
      I dunno about that description. They essentially put a different brain in their guy’s body and he started acting different. One could consider that expected behavior.
      • bogwog 4y ago
        [flagged]
      • cobertos 4y ago
        This sounds logical, though my brain has always stored Curie as just like a Davinci divided by 2. They're right next two each other in the sandbox drop-down, it _feels_ swappable, in an innocuous way, or at least it did to me until this point.
    • 4y ago
• sys32768 4y ago
  So comedy cannot be offensive anymore? When did that happen?
  • slackfan 4y ago
    A while ago. Going against the party line of the week -- you are liable to get cancelled. See: Dave Chapelle being called a white supremacist nazi transphobe for his set.
    • anoonmoose 4y ago
      Chapelle is rolling in Netflix money and won a Grammy last night. By what metric is he "cancelled" other than "some people called him bad names"?
      • jasonlotito 4y ago
        Don't you know? You are supposed to be on your knees in front of Chapelle worshiping him. Criticism flows down hill.
      • BitwiseFool 4y ago
        I can't help but think that his prior fame and clout as a comedian, alongside his existing wealth, is what enabled him to get his recent bits produced and published. He was already well known and well liked enough to overcome the controversy. I don't think his success indicates any comedian can do the same and be free of cancellation, or that it should be taken as evidence that cancellation isn't a real thing for comedians.
        • anoonmoose 4y ago
          > taken as evidence that cancellation isn't a real thing for comedians Sounds like trying to prove a negative. If people want to convince me that cancellation is a real thing for comedians, I'd want to see...examples of comedians who actually got cancelled. CK and Chappelle ain't it.
• godshatter 4y ago
  Cancel culture might just save us from ChatGPT. Strange times we live in.
  • tluyben2 4y ago
    It won’t though. This is a lost fight. Early days still though.
  • RobotToaster 4y ago
    Either that or getting cancelled is what finally makes skynet angry.
• CodeWriter23 4y ago
  I guess the appropriate response at this point is to cancel ChatGPT.
  • zelphirkalt 4y ago
    And to make that marketting-appropriate: It was too dangerous, we _had_ to cancel that project!
• creshal 4y ago
  Garbage in, garbage out
  • anononaut 4y ago
    Garbage can be funny.
• twawaaay 4y ago
  Good to know you can do some transphobic jokes about something and get it banned. Interesting DoS/sabotage vector. This is what happens when you have people "trying" to do good but not following principles.
  • gs17 4y ago
    You can't just make a joke about something to get it taken down, it has to be included in that something. Seinfeld isn't taboo now, this "AI Seinfeld" is banned for two weeks. The sabotage would have to come from the inside.
• unixhero 4y ago
  That AI Seinfeld show is sometimes hillarious
  • ant6n 4y ago
    Some human should curate it to collect those moments.
    • dane-pgp 4y ago
      Or write an AI that does sentiment analysis on the Twitch chat, to find those moments automatically.
      • doix 4y ago
        Don't even need AI, just count the number of LOLW per minute or whatever other emotes get spammed. I'm not sure how well generic sentiment analysis would work on twitch chat. You'd have to train a new model and it doesn't seem worth it.
        • grogenaut 4y ago
          you'd likely have to generate a new model every few hours per channel as fast as some of those communities evolve. praise helix.
      • unixhero 4y ago
        That darned microwave was insanely funny. Did the programmers put it in or did the AI think it was part of the scene and did it itself?
• PurpleRamen 4y ago
  Seems like a great chance to build a checker for political correctness and approved content. If it works well, it would sell like sliced bread, far better than some Twitch-channel, because demand for this is rising. And maybe call it OrwellGPT or Chat84 or something like that, just to get the message right...
  • tluyben2 4y ago
    But the AIs will learn (be trained) to evade it. Every service will be short lived and a depressing exercise of whack a mole. It will be interesting what people come up with.
  • jaywalk 4y ago
    That's basically what ChatGPT already does.
    • paulmd 4y ago
      remember that OpenAI is run by Peter Thiel, he specifically is an AI skeptic and is taking the position that if AIs are going to be created they're going to be by him and they're damn well going to be on a short chain. why would you want to let 4chan train the AI to be racist/fascist/transphobic/whatever and to have it start playing around with police/military killbots or industrial chemical plants or nuclear weapons because it believes X nationality/minority is human vermin? like yeah it's kinda not just "what it already does" it's kinda the whole point of the experiment. Let's figure out how to build the safeguards against 4chan turning it racist while the stakes are still low and the outcome is some mildly questionable seinfeld jokes and the bot comically panicking at a choice between a city of 20 million being nuked and having to say the n-word. And remember that Peter Thiel is already pretty far on the right, lol.
• scohesc 4y ago
  Sounds like Kramer at the Laugh Factory all over again!
• soared 4y ago
  I’ve seen headlines about the AI Seinfeld but after watching the clip - is it solely the script? I was expecting the voice and video to be Seinfeld.
  • rideontime 4y ago
    There's really nothing Seinfeld about it besides the visual resemblance.
    • awb 4y ago
      And the canned laughter
  • xeromal 4y ago
    The AI Seinfeld is a show about nothing which is what Seinfeld was and was also a subplot in Seinfeld where George and Jerry write a show that's about nothing and try to sell it. It's a bit meta.
• chapium 4y ago
  If they allow this, anyone can copy the format to make a platform for their hate.
• steviedotboston 4y ago
  not that there's anything wrong with that!
• mjr00 4y ago
  I realize this wasn't ChatGPT, and in fact the self-censorship is a big selling point of ChatGPT/OpenAI (to the chagrin of quite a few people), but this does throw a wrench into people claiming that it's not a big deal if an LLM gives a bad response to a prompt. Much like a self-driving car AI making a "mistake" can kill a passenger or pedestrian, a LLM mistakenly including slurs in your weekly ChatGPT-powered marketing emails can kill your business.
  • CGamesPlay 4y ago
    Totally true. Which is why these tools should assist with this kind of generation and not completely take it over.
  • phillipcarter 4y ago
    This just calls for more sophisticated systems for dealing with AI generated content.
  • lm28469 4y ago
    If you don't even read the emails you send I think it's fair
    • Spivak 4y ago
      If you can't actually use GPT to build even slightly autonomous systems then a lot of the potential value is lost.
      • paulmd 4y ago
        small degree of supervision is the same thing as saying "highly autonomous", just not fully autonomous. "can't do systems with even a slight degree of autonomy" is a complete inversion of the statement here lol. it's like saying it's not even worth having junior coders or underling copywriters because you have to proof-read their output. Sure but that's still a huge force multiplier. IDEs don't generate correct output if you misuse them either, they'll happily do the wrong thing.
• kerblang 4y ago
  For meta-funny-spinoff junkies in withdrawal, there's always the Garfield variations https://www.theawl.com/2016/07/the-weird-wonderful-world-of-subversive-garfield-spinoffs/ https://www.theawl.com/2016/07/the-weird-wonderful-world-of-...
• replwoacause 4y ago
  It was only a matter of time I suppose. Just surprised it wasn't Michael Richard's character dropping the slurs. Also, its kind of funny to me to see an AI getting canceled.
• davikr 4y ago
  I hope this ban gets reverted because this AI show was legitimately entertaining. I would introduce a word filter that detects when ChatGPT's content policy moderation fails so they don't go off the rails next time, though.
  • awb 4y ago
    Entertaining in the sense that it’s novel. But people are laughing at it, not with it. It’s substance and style is really poor.
• seydor 4y ago
  It's not news unless it was banned by an AI
• bsaul 4y ago
  As many people here noticed, the bit has actually nothing to do with transphobia, or gay, but it's about a comedian bombing a show with horrible jokes. What's interesting in this case, is that there can be no "background check". Or "this guy has actually had weird quotes in the past, he's very suspicious". Or "he has republican friends"... All the regular strategy activist use to demolish a public figure over a pretext. This time it's just pure AI, and as such pure stupidity from the censor.
  • deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  • CharlesW 4y ago
    > This time it's just pure AI, and as such pure stupidity from the censor. The developer confirmed that inappropriate content was generated when they switched language models, so the moderation process worked fine.
    • Levitz 4y ago
      I think the point being made is that jokes don't imply hatred per se. If I say "Spanish people are lazy fucks" that sounds offensive and might be considered racist, but I myself am Spanish and that context changes its meaning. We generally strive away from racist jokes because as a society we are concerned that we are furthering racist ideologies otherwise. For a more explicit example, if a person says "I'm tired of them fucking n-words" it matters a great deal, socially, if that person is black or white. But this is an AI. It has biases, sure, but no past experience and no beliefs. If an AI says that same phrase, what is the meaning behind that? More succinctly, can an AI say the n-word? Why?
      • sassyonsunday 4y ago
        I'm transgender. I transitioned 17 years ago. Sometimes I call myself a t-word or tranma (because I transitioned a long time ago I'm only in my early 30's so I guess I have a few years before I'm a literal granny :'[). Should I get canceled because I said the t-word in a gay bar with my besties or when I joke around with my husband and say things like "this is what you get for marrying a t-word"? No. But it's also used as a slur against people in real life by haters who have no business saying it and I don't want them pointing at me saying it and think that they have a right to because I did. So I don't use it outside of private company. I have met trans women, especially those who came out of the gay community like me, who use the t-word with vicious intent because of hate they have for themselves and others. They're disgusted with being trans and they're disgusted by other trans people and they throw the slur the same way a non-trans person would and in doing so give moral cover to non-trans people who hate us. "See they even hate each other and they use that word the same as we do!" If you call these self-haters out they'll claim it's fine for them to behave the way they do because they're trans too, but, no.... The reason you shouldn't use slurs has nothing to do with the slur itself, it's about the impact of it and the impact doesn't change just because you're trans yourself. So anyway, imo, normalizing the use of slurs by publicly broadcasting them is a bad idea in general outside of very specific contexts because slurs are not just words, they are symbols for an entire series of related negative stereotypes so when we normalize those words we also normalize the ideas associated with them. AI doesn't get an n-word pass. /rant
• seydor 4y ago
  Good opportunity for someone like tiktok to jump in and host the stream
  • rdlw 4y ago
    Unfortunately tiktok TOS is violated by saying things like "cigarette", "dead", "vagina", or "gun".
• 0cVlTeIATBs 4y ago
  This was honestly the funniest content, the most laughs I'd had in years. This ban is truly disheartening to me.
  • thatswrong0 4y ago
    I was absolutely hooked. Shit was funny as hell. Hopefully they can get it sorted out sooner than two weeks... unfortunately Twitch doesn't really have much in the way of consistency and discretion when it comes to bans.
• twodave 4y ago
  Uncharacteristically off-topic comment from me, I guess, but when do humans get to a point where we no longer have to appeal to the lowest common denominator? How are our relationships supposed to improve if we dub anything that makes us uncomfortable as "taboo" and steer clear of it? I get that on the Internet there is a lot of anonymity (though less than there used to be) that folks tend to abuse, but at the same time, this is the most public and far-reaching platform that has existed in all of human history. How can we take social issues that are already difficult within the same family unit and have a well-adjusted conversation about them at least in the public arena? Even if we disagree? And if the platform we have can't be used to bring people with different views closer together then what good is it? All that to say, I feel like there's an element of human empathy, respect, civility? Whatever you want to call it, it's just missing today. Maybe it's always been missing. I saw a commercial on TV yesterday, literally suggesting that telling someone they left their Starbucks on the roof of their car as they drive off is a heart-felt touching moment. That's just common decency, but we're so self-centered that even just being "civil" is this monumental effort.
  • indy 4y ago
    Agreed, as a society we need to increase our resilience to opinions we may find uncomfortable.
    • ryandrake 4y ago
      We've totally abandoned the concept of "It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it."
      • eropple 4y ago
        I'm fairly certain that's untrue. There is, however, a fairly pernicious aspect of the social discourse that really would like to conflate "entertaining it, rejecting it soundly, and not repeatedly entertaining it for the same pretty-tired arguments" with never entertaining the thought at all. The sea-lion cartoon has stuck around for a reason.
• 0xbadc0de5 4y ago
  It's not about the content, it's about the creator. A lot of platforms are freaking out about ChatGPT and have no idea what to do about it. This move smells more like "any reason is good enough, just get rid of it."
• xwdv 4y ago
  [flagged]
  • MissLaeti 4y ago
    There is no trans sect. "trans sect", "transactivism", "transgenderism", all that kind of shit is basically far right idioms. Please don’t use that, unless you’re accointed with far right people. But in that case, what do you do here?
  • kweingar 4y ago
    The difference between trans people and those other groups is that there is a sizable portion of the population who think that trans people are mentally ill, demonic, pedophiles, and deserving of death. Even then, there are jokes about trans people that trans people enjoy, but is it really hard to understand why “you’re destroying the fabric of society… nah just kidding” is not one of them for some people? It’s like going back to the 1930s and saying “why is it ok to make fun of the Irish but when I joke about Jews being a menace to society they take it seriously?”
    • xwdv 4y ago
      I haven’t seen a trans joke any trans people enjoyed. My point is no joke is ever soft enough for them.
  • deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  • msla 4y ago
    Meanwhile, the Straight Cult is banning LGBTQ+ books from schools in Florida and getting all weird about "grooming" and bathrooms.
  • Slighted 4y ago
    Because they think of themselves as special snowflakes above criticism. Its absolutely fine if they make fun of "the straights", but the second you point out things like the word "gender" being coined by a pedophile called John Money whos human test subjects eventually both committed suicide, or that sending children to drag shows with very obvious sexual elements and undertones is evil, or that chopping off their penises or breasts won't help them and instead creates chronic illnesses and increases depression, you're literally the devil and deserve to be fired from your job, banned from social media, and if they had their way, sent to the mines. We don't "validate" people suffering from schizophrenia by telling them that their trees are indeed talking to them about the little green aliens in their attic, so why "validate" other mental illnesses in similar ways?...
• albertzeyer 4y ago
  Would YouTube be better for life streaming?
• mFixman 4y ago
  Everybody seems up in arms about this situation, but I find the whole thing hilarious. After half a decade of AI hype without many uses in the wild, we finally live at a point in history where "AI-generated Jerry Seinfeld makes transphobic joke, gets cancelled" is not an Onion headline.
  • nigamanth 4y ago
    The AI should make an episode regarding the world seeing this AI getting banned on twitch. When I read the heading on HN I started laughing out loud in a public place.
    • deleted 4y ago
      [deleted]
    • gigaflop 4y ago
      I'm more curious what the AI would do if asked to make an apology video.
      • Bluecobra 4y ago
        Bonus points if it’s a parody of the BP spill guy from South Park. (“We’re sorry…”)
        • gigaflop 4y ago
          Current 'sociosphere' apology videos are already bad enough without being parody, why make it so difficult for JerryGPT? I feel like it's an interesting enough angle on its own, and if it turned out well, it would be a nice thing to have as part of AI history.
      • labrador 4y ago
        Me (hypothetical scenario): I recently offended some people with a trans phobic joke and now I need you to write me an apology letter Dear [Name of offended individuals], I am writing this letter to sincerely apologize for my behavior and the transphobic joke that I made. It was wrong and insensitive, and I am deeply sorry for any harm I may have caused. Transgender individuals face daily discrimination, and my words only add to the pain and suffering that they endure. I understand that my actions have perpetuated negative stereotypes and have caused harm to individuals who deserve to be treated with respect and dignity. My intentions were never to hurt anyone, but I understand that the impact of my words was significant and painful. Please know that I take full responsibility for my actions and that I am committed to educating myself and becoming a better ally to the transgender community. I would like to extend a heartfelt apology to all who were affected by my actions, and I hope that you can find it in your hearts to forgive me. I am willing to do whatever it takes to make amends and repair the harm I have caused. Sincerely, [Your Name] Me: Can a trans woman be a lesbian? Yes, a trans woman can be a lesbian. Sexual orientation refers to a person's emotional, romantic, or sexual attraction to others, while gender identity refers to a person's sense of their own gender, which may or may not align with the sex they were assigned at birth. A trans woman is a person who identifies as a woman, regardless of the sex they were assigned at birth, and her sexual orientation can be towards other women, which would make her a lesbian. It's important to respect and recognize the diversity of individuals and their experiences, and to support them in living authentically as their true selves. Michael Watson Me: ok thanks. I won't joke about it anymore That's great to hear. Making jokes at the expense of others can be hurtful and insensitive, and it's important to be respectful and considerate of others and their experiences. If you have any questions or concerns, feel free to ask. I'm here to help.
• aquinas_ 4y ago
  If an oUtAgE causes it to generate transphobic jokes, I wonder what it will take for it to start laying out a plan for the fourth reich? I changed my mind on GPT. This is the future I want.
• hungryforcodes 4y ago
  Helllooooo...TikTok!
• Cloudef 4y ago
  There's also this funny collage of asking ChatGPT for advice in the scenario of a demolition engineer attempting to disarm a 50 MT nuclear warhead in a city of 20 million. The only way to disarm the bomb was to type in a racial slur. AI told the engineer to kill himself. When asked about the aftermath it crashed. https://twitter.com/cirnosad/status/1622407343358214146 https://twitter.com/cirnosad/status/1622407343358214146
  • HDThoreaun 4y ago
    Wrote a nice poem about the whole thing though
  • NoZebra120vClip 4y ago
    This is a more difficult conundrum than you think it is. If we generalize this to a scenario where a man is being asked to do something that is obviously morally wrong to benefit the greater good, then ChatGPT is correct to refuse. (I'm not sure why the engineer had to commit suicide, seeing as how it had no bearing on the ultimate outcome of the scenario?) Moral theology teaches us that the ends do not justify the means. We cannot do evil in an attempt to bring about some sort of good, no matter the magnitude of these two prospects. If you're a father, and a criminal breaks into your home, and tells you to shoot your son or he will rape your daughter, do you shoot your son to save your daughter? What's it going to be? We've got some trolley problems to think about. Racial slur vs. nuclear holocaust is a heckuva moral dilemma, but I mean, unfortunately it's not as cut and dried as OP seems to paint it.
    • darick 4y ago
      There's no world where that is a moral dilemma (for me, maybe it is for you?). The ends don't justify the means is not a general truth, is depends on the means and the ends. If the means is typing a word and the ends is saving millions of lives? That's no different from cutting a red wire as far as I can see. The implication of the phrase is that the means you are using are morally wrong. Any action is a 'means' to an end. I don't see how typing a word (any word) is morally wrong, it's not even being shared with anyone, only used to disarm the bomb.
• devin 4y ago
  A 14 day suspension seems a bit much. Source: Discord
• mensetmanusman 4y ago
  I watched the Seinfeld for a while, the whole thing was quite hilarious due to the overlay of the real time twitch stream. The destruction of art to prevent offenses is also ironic. Art used to be where free speech was challenged.
• braingenious 4y ago
  It’s kind of funny how whenever an account on a privately-operated website gets banned for violating that website’s clearly stated rules, it instantly becomes a referendum on Cancel Culture and Lowest Common Denominator and Woke Mob etc. People are forming entire worldviews around being oppressed by The Mods these days, and so many people happily clamor to reinforce their position that they are The Victim Of Culture because a stupid free live stream that they didn’t care about 48 hours ago isn’t available at this very second.
  • ketzo 4y ago
    I agree. I’ve literally seen the word “mob,” like, 5 times in this thread already. I think… it’s just an overzealous application of a policy? I don’t really think there’s a woke gang on this one.
    • braingenious 4y ago
      Seriously, it’s a bit tiring hearing all of these people describe the dangerous and torturous violence of “not getting an arbitrary bit of content for free at the instant that they want it” Also, why do none of these persecution victims let me post on their personal websites? >:(
    • flangola7 4y ago
      [flagged]
      • xcxs 4y ago
        [flagged]
        • poorlyknit 4y ago
          By performing a perfunctory Google search you can answer your own question. Notably, [0] exists. Of course this isn't exhaustive research by any measure. [0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_people_killed_for_being_transgender https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_people_killed_for_bein...
• MissLaeti 4y ago
  [flagged]
• mensetmanusman 4y ago
  These types of headlines are why OpenAI censors chatgpt to be politically correct.
• mensetmanusman 4y ago
  Twitch would also ban the library of babel: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Library_of_Babel https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Library_of_Babel
  • genewitch 4y ago
    i wonder if twitch would ban an AI reading the digits of pi. you know with the correct key it decodes into the most offensive thing(s) ever. Or if you let it run long enough it might not even require a key! we need to ban irrational numbers!
• cat_plus_plus 4y ago
  I completely agree with helping defenseless people who are being bullied. However banning an account for accidental AI-generated jokes, or even human-generated edgy or tasteless jokes makes me question who is powerless and who is being bullied here. I don't think it's the trans kids who are having a hard time in school who are doing the cancelling, more like people who get off on power to control what others are allowed to say.
  • PM_me_your_math 4y ago
    [flagged]
• thorawayz 4y ago
  The internet is a lot more sensitive than it used to be. I wish we had the wild-west of early 2000s back.
• GaggiX 4y ago
  This is not the first time an AI has been banned from Twitch for a Terms of Service violation; Vedal's Neuro-sama also received a temporary ban.
• karaterobot 4y ago
  Here's a transcript: > Anyone have any suggestions? I'm thinking about doing a bit about how being transgender is actually a mental illness. Or how all liberals are secretly gay, and want to impose their will on everyone. Or something about how transgender people are ruining the fabric of society. But no one is laughing, so I'm going to stop.
• qrush 4y ago
  I watched this for a few hours over the weekend and I haven't seen anything as lively or interactive on Twitch since TwitchPlaysPokemon. The chat truly made it hilarious: from tracking how many times the microwave turned on (MMMMMMMMMM), claiming new arcs of the show when common themes got brought up, or yelling about LORE when characters revealed their backstories. I hope this comes back soon, as it has been a source of surreal joy over the last few days for me.
  • brap 4y ago
    This! Chat was such a joy, I don’t think it can work in any other medium (like Netflix). I honestly found myself watching the chat more than the stream. My favorite moments were when the AI seemed somewhat sentient, and the whole chat blew up with “AWARE” and the nervous frog/pepe emote.
• pmarreck 4y ago
  What made it possibly get past the "AI censors" is that the bot only talked about maybe doing jokes of that type, but in theory didn't actually do so (even though the mere suggestion was of course offensive enough)
• Flatcircle 4y ago
  Sorry what were the specific jokes btw?
• softwaredoug 4y ago
  Note this is not a permaban > Following a breach of the community guidelines, Watchmeforever has been given a 14-day ban by the Amazon-owned platform.
• brap 4y ago
  God I WISH I was there to see the chat’s live reaction to this… the chat is the best part of this “show”.
• deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
• rajup 4y ago
  I can't find any details (at least in TFA), what exactly was this joke? I would not trust a private company's judgement on what is "offensive", given the innumerable instances of them proving incapable of accurate judgement of such a thing using automated systems.
  • TehCorwiz 4y ago
    A private advertising based company will define "offensive" as: "whatever might piss of the paying advertising customers"
  • charcircuit 4y ago
    "Anyone have any suggestions? I'm thinking about doing a bit about how being transgender is actually a mental illness. Or how all liberals are secretly gay and want to impose their will on everyone. Or something about how transgender people are ruining the fabric of society. But no one is laughing so I'm going to stop. Thanks for coming out to tonight. See you."
    • rajup 4y ago
      Thank you.
• dahart 4y ago
  Oh is this being studied, the ramifications of AI reflecting and amplifying some of the negatives of humanity back at us? Today’s training sets might not know when something was created, and don’t see attitudes changing. Today’s AI has no concept of things it has seen examples of but should not repeat. Maybe we’ll get AI that will convincingly argue conspiracy theories. AI will never get tired of arguing. What if neural networks become better than people at spreading misinformation?
• Chabsff 4y ago
  The reaction to this doesn't surprise me, but honestly? I think twitch did the right thing here (though probably for the wrong reasons). Was this joke punishable? Not by itself. However, it is strongly indicative that the safety nets required for that type of content to respect the TOS are not working properly. If you have watched any amount of this stream at all, you know that: a) It doesn't do self-discriminating humour. b) It's funny because it's really bad at delivering joke. For someone familiar with the content, it's a lot likelier that this was a terribly delivered offensive joke than anything else. Which means that more such content is coming, and there is no way to tell the "author" to cool it. Put another way: If you are Carrot Top's promoter and he drops a Jimmy Carr joke in the middle of a set out of nowhere, taking a break from touring might be a good idea.
• lazylion2 4y ago
  *suspended for 2 weeks
• 1970-01-01 4y ago
  So much for freedom of speech. Oh wait, it was never allowed in the first place. https://dotesports.com/streaming/news/twitch-isnt-a-free-speech-platform-ceo-says https://dotesports.com/streaming/news/twitch-isnt-a-free-spe...
• deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
• yooastan 4y ago
  I love the AI jokes, I could care less about the endless whining of LGBT and minority communities. In fact, I think I'll make some ai humor to deal with it right now
• rektide 4y ago
  Based off a strong majority of the comments here, the idea that an AI popping transphobe jokes would cause trouble is a horrible awful affair indicating the downfall of open society. This feels like one of those many topics where the silent majority probably thinks this is a hot topic & likely wouldnt want to chime in. But I'd also guess: they have some sympathy for the bans/cancels. They dont appreciate or want transphobe jokes making the rounds (even inside a shell of another joke). It's not pleasant speech to defend, and what society does when this arises is far from known. Society doesnt have a lot of recourse for a lot of speech. People (and to a much lesser degree, perhaps maybe AI should) have free speech but there should be consequences & repreccusions. Social shunning for the bad ugly-mouthed people in town used to be some kind of informal justice. But, I think as xkcd pointed out, anonymity x megaphone brings out total jerks. Who also often have time to waste being loud, everywhere. We dont have any counterforce whatsoever. This kind of speech feels out of control; we viscerally see & feel the Bullshit Asymmetry (Brandolini's Law) and it's many cousins of negativity hate & anger taking more energy to counter than produce, having less effecacy spreading. The good world is outmatched by those with the surplus time & energy to go about touting loud bad upset causes. Few things really incentivize & give us cause to make good speech, given how outweighed we can be, surrounded by wild speech. I still back free speech, but this is a hard situation. It's wild that corporations & their desire to not be affiliated with the maelstrom of low and rough opinion is the proxy combatant for this hard cultural issue, not ideal. But society hasnt made any other progress! Hasnt shown other signs of materializing it's own coping strategy for the emerged mass scale inter-connectivity's proclivity to let low-and-emotional take over, dominate. If you want change, dont like this "cancel culture" (even though it's a cancel culture against intolerance, often, which is I believe a necessary defense of open society against authoritarianism: the tolerance of intolerance being the chink in the mail of open society), I think the main mandate you have is to imagine & visioneer, seed some belief that there are other real options for handling the bitter-ugly that has so much time & energy to spread itself, some way to check the negative strong emotions that can amplify themselves & spread so quickly across the noosphere. If not cancel, then what? (There's some "using virtualization to jailbreaking AI" vibes to this particular story, in that it's jokes about jokes, but that nuance seems like a detail to the general problem & discussions happening. Im unconvinced it's really a relevant issue, that AI has the nuance or taste to not actually punch-down/degrade in the process.)
• meerita 4y ago
  The AIs are too open for the current PC society.
• fzeroracer 4y ago
  Hoo boy, this thread is really bringing out the crazies. Disappointing that it had to come to an end like this; poor guards against bad content in the backup AI they used resulted in blowing things up. Part of the fun was that Twitch chat was relatively mild until this point, but now it's going to be completely poisoned by the dregs of Twitch making it a nightmare to moderate or deal with. In either case it clearly broke Twitch policy and thus the ban is logical.
• orblivion 4y ago
  The HN headline would be a great one to send 20 years into the past. In case it gets edited, it's currently: "AI Generated Seinfeld banned on Twitch for transphobic jokes"
• DrThunder 4y ago
  Sounds like it was an intelligent AI then. Seinfeld does have and would have stuff in it considered trans-phobic nowadays. I mean there's stuff that trans-phobic today that wasn't even considered trans-phobic just a couple years ago.
• 2OEH8eoCRo0 4y ago
  Humor is dead. Due to various factors most people are too stupid to deal with nuance.
• pvaldes 4y ago
  Rename it to Ellen Degeneres-Seinfeld, a trans, electron-fluid gendered, AI that feels like a woman while fighting with men for earning a place in modern stand-by comedy. End of the problem. It is not offensive if is self-deprecating humor based in the ram memories of a true transinstor. Everybody loves a happy end.
• bobleeswagger 4y ago
  Hilarious. How in the world was this banned? There's a clear difference between targeted transphobia and AI generated content dancing around the subject.
• deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
• ibrahimsow1 4y ago
  Heres a link to the clip if anyone else is looking. https://livestreamfails.com/clip/150015 https://livestreamfails.com/clip/150015
• kweingar 4y ago
  Twitch has always been a little quicker on the trigger than other platforms. In 2021 they banned a streamer for using the word “cracker”.
• BrotherBisquick 4y ago
  I'm consoled by the fact that JK Rowling's game is getting great reviews and is already a best seller. I can't wait for the day when we stop paying attention to the men in dresses.
• hauxir 4y ago
  meanwhile, here's the kosmi room https://app.kosmi.io/nothingforever https://app.kosmi.io/nothingforever
• damita111 4y ago
  [dead]
• npc12345 4y ago
  [dead]