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China unveils 600 kph maglev train
- egeozcan 5y agoAccording to the article, Germany is also looking to build one... Just assign the task to the Deutsche Bahn, what could possibly go wrong! Before corona times, there used to be stations closing because too many people are called in sick or at vacation. Trains stopping in the middle of nowhere and conductor announcing, "eerm, yeah, we are having technical difficulties" and you just sit there for at least an hour without any updates. Not sure how it is now but...
- ginko 5y agoI think they're referring to the Transrapid, which essentially got scrapped. The only non-test track ever built is in Shanghai.
- sudosysgen 5y agoNo, this is a completely new design. The ultimate goal is for rail transport to be faster than air transport and build it to connect Shanghai and Beijing. Transrapid was never going to be built on a large scale, it wasn't a domestic design and it wasn't fast enough to be a real alternative to air transport. Perhaps this iteration even won't be, but eventually there will almost certainly be such a line built - the need is too great.
- ginko 5y agoI was referring to the one Germany was working on. I know that the 600 kph train presented in this article isn't a Transrapid.
- sudosysgen 5y agoAh ok sorry, because the previous maglev train in China is also a Transrapid :P
- rob74 5y agoCompletely new? If you look at how Transrapid trains "hug" the rail from both above and below (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transrapid#/media/File:Transrapid_07_Muenchen_Airport_Center.jpg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transrapid#/media/File:Transra...), the train in the picture is doing exactly the same. So I would be a bit skeptical about such claims...
- sudosysgen 5y agoThat is indeed the basic design of a maglev train. If you look closely, you will see that almost every maglev train "hugs" the tracks from above and below. This is necessary to prevent the train from derailing and everyone on board from dying. Some use different means of not derailling but surrounding the rail is the simplest.
- rob74 5y agoNot any maglev train. According to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maglev https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maglev, there are three different types, and even the EMS type can have some variation ("single beam" or "double beam": https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:HSST-Double-Beam.png https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:HSST-Double-Beam.png). I'm not sure which type is more widespread though (since none of them can really be called "widespread").
- sudosysgen 5y agoEven dual beam EMS looks exactly the same : https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_Speed_Surface_Transport#/media/File%3AYES89-HSST.jpg https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_Speed_Surface_Transport... There aren't three different types of Maglev systems. There's EMS and EDS. Indutrack is a type of EDS.
- gruez 5y agoI thought German trains were supposed to be super punctual? Or is that Japan?
- Kelteseth 5y agoNo. Swiss trains are, but German trains are famous for being late. A little snow in the winter? Well, guess what: Schienenersatzverkehr! (Rail replacement bus service)
- rsynnott 5y agoI mean, it's all a question of perspective. The sort of train delay that's objectionable in Germany is so normal that no-one would even notice it in Ireland, say. Irish Rail defines punctuality as within 10 minutes of schedule for intercity and within 5 minutes of schedule for commuter and metro. Based on that rather generous definition, most lines manage 90-95% punctuality...
- bluGill 5y agoJust because some places are worse doesn't mean we should excuse Germany. Trains should be within 5 seconds every single time. With dedicated infrastructure and absolute priority this isn't hard. (I'll make an exception only if the wind is faster than 200km/h, or earthquakes - every other weather event should be normal and designed out - the exact wind speed can be debated of course). It goes without saying that collisions are not acceptable.
- JumpCrisscross 5y ago> sort of train delay that's objectionable in Germany is so normal that no-one would even notice it in Ireland New Yorker here. I noticed. Germany's trains were erratically delayed in a way that was frustrating, noticeable and opaque. Our LIRR and Metro North, on the other hand, run on time. As did Trenitalia when I was traveling from Roma to Napoli last week.
- rob74 5y agoWe have that in Germany too. Any delay between 0 and 4 minutes 59 seconds is "no delay". Any delay between 5:00 and 9:59 is "5 minutes". Any delay between 10:00 and 14:59 is "10 minutes", and so on... In Germany the whole fiasco started with the "privatisation" of the Federal Railways (Bundesbahn) in the mid-nineties. Since then, Deutsche Bahn behaves like a private company, but is still 100% owned by the federal government (who sometimes taps them for money), and is three things at once: train operator (in which role it competes with other operators), infrastructure owner (in which role it sells track usage rights to itself and other operators) and station owner (in which role it sells station usage rights to itself and other operators, plus makes a lot of money as landlord at bigger stations while neglecting smaller ones). Which leads to all kinds of conflicts of interest. Mainly, DB is "profit-oriented", i.e. it tends to dislike investing any of its own money in infrastructure expansion or maintenance - all such works must be requested and paid by either the federal government or the state (Bundesland) governments. And since these governments hate to be seen as "subsidizing" a "private company", most of the infrastructure (except for a few shiny new projects that make politicians look good) is just languishing in the state it was almost 30 years ago, with minimal maintenance.
- FabHK 5y agoFWIW, Germany did build a maglev that runs up to 500 km/h, the "Transrapid" [1]. Development was started in 1969, and a test route was built in 1987. However, it was only ever deployed in production once, in 2002 - guess where? In Shanghai, connecting the Pudong airport to downtown (Correction: Not downtown, but to an interchange station connecting to a few metro lines.) And hey presto, 20 years later China has a maglev. Honi soit qui mal y pense [2]. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transrapid https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transrapid [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honi_soit_qui_mal_y_pense https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honi_soit_qui_mal_y_pense
- larusso 5y agoYes I wanted to comment the same. And Germany is, as far as I know no longer looking into this anymore. Edit: I mean for the usage in Germany. It’s sadly a very political topic because lots of money went into this project.
- FabHK 5y agoYes, it is a pity. On the other hand, Germany is only around 1000 km north to south, and most distances can be done in a few hours with conventional high speed trains. And it doesn't look like there'll be export opportunities for a Transrapid anytime soon to, say, the US, or China...
- bluGill 5y agoIf you limit yourself to Germany you are correct. However the EU is a thing, and could be made a lot better if the countries started acting together more. Maglev from Italy to Finland with stops in Germany for example.
- giantrobot 5y agoThe Alps would have a word.
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- IceHegel 5y agoThat’s the way the cookie crumbles when you ride Deutsche Bahn.
- Brendinooo 5y agoNeat to see, wonder how realistic it is or if it's something that we should be skeptical of until it actually gets built. > By comparison, the journey would take 3 hours by plane Are they factoring in the security line? That flight should be two hours tops.
- yladiz 5y agoI think by journey they mean the travel time including security.
- sudosysgen 5y agoFor what it's worth, this has been in the works for a long time, the news is that a prototype finally rolled out of the factory. China is hell-bent on making trains that can compete with air travel. I don't think they will give up until it's actually done, there is a huge need for an alternative to air travel in China for many, many reasons.
- guywhocodes 5y agoThis makes it ironic that boarding a train in China has airplane level security
- mijamo 5y agoExcept if it has changed in the last 4 years I disagree, security is nowhere near what they make you go through for flying. It's not even at the level needed to take the Eurostar.
- guywhocodes 5y agoWe clearly did not take the same trains
- goodcanadian 5y agoIt does? I'll admit it has been a few years, but I don't recall any security of note when I visited.
- adrianN 5y agoI wonder what the CO2/(passenger*km) looks like for trains at those speeds, especially if you add in some amortized cost for all the infrastructure the train needs
- dalbasal 5y agoHow do you amortize CO2?
- GrantZvolsky 5y agoCO2/(passenger*km), not CO2.
- natpalmer1776 5y agoYou take out a loan from the CO2 bank with CO2 bring charged as interest, and then slowly pay it back over the course of a few decades. How much you pay back is something the atom counters figure out, I'm naught but a humble Oxygen farmer.
- adrianN 5y agoYou guesstimate how much CO2 was released during construction, and divide by the expected lifetime of the structure and add a guesstimate for the CO2 used for maintenance.
- xster 5y agoAlso, how do you amortize the alternatives? e.g. the airports, getting to the airports (which are further from city centers than train stations), etc?
- fvdessen 5y agoI remember some paper looking at this question, and if you took into account the train infrastructure, planes were not too far off. But train has other advantages such as reduced noise pollution, being able to bring you right to your destination, and not being hijackable into buildings.
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- EarthIsHome 5y agoIncredible. I would love to have a good high-speed intercity train network in the United States connecting the major cities in each State. I just looked up an Amtrak from Atlanta to Dallas: 3 legs around 64 hours. Cries in American. (there's no connection in New Orleans, so the trip planner routes to Chicago)
- Mordisquitos 5y agoA triangle linking Dallas -> Houston -> San Antonio -> Austin -> Dallas would be economically revolutionary for Texas, even with non-maglev high-speed rail.
- KoftaBob 5y agoThat’s currently being built! https://www.texascentral.com/ https://www.texascentral.com/
- mimixco 5y agoIt's coming! We will have the first true high speed rail in the US. It's Shinkansen hardware because the Japanese investors in the project insisted... and good for them and us that they did! It's also all new rail as Amtraks own the passenger rights to all existing rail in the US. It's also 100% grade separated (like TGV) so it doesn't cross traffic or people. (This is the #1 factor in making trains safer and faster than cars.) While I'm "not bullish on trains" in the US, as another poster put it, I do think it will work here. Houston is already America's 3rd largest city with 8M people and the route to Dallas (Hwy 45) is horrible, unsafe, and extremely busy, all the time.
- majormajor 5y agoHow would it be a revolution? I used to fly between some of those cities easily when necessary, and the drive is pretty doable too. A train would be an interesting alternative to flying, depending on route and total times and stop locations, but I just don't see it enabling much truly "new."
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- tw04 5y agohttps://archive.is/JirpL https://archive.is/JirpL
- blackcat201 5y agoFor reference, Boeing 747 average speed is 909 km/h (565 mph) with a top speed 986 km/h (613 mph). However maglev train saves time on landing and coordination makes it faster compare to air travel.
- gregoriol 5y agoNot sure it has a huge advantage if you take into account the infrastructure: the track is very difficult to build, you need land, you need to take into account every hill or mountain, build bridges and tunnels while a plane can go anywhere without any additional stuff. Also, a new station at the center of a major city requires a tremendous amount of investment and work, and some new stations may end up outside or far from the center so you'll need time to get to the place you go anyway.
- rsynnott 5y agoI would assume that ~all significant cities in China already have a train station or two...
- gregoriol 5y agoWith existing stations, you'll still need new tracks, and likely larger stations anyway as traffic will go up with new lines. Such projects are likely easier in China where the government has very effective power, not that easy to build in city centers in many other countries.
- BurningFrog 5y agoYeah, high speed rail uses up huge amounts of land. I think acquiring all that land and getting it through environmental review is pretty much impossible in the US.
- jbay808 5y agoAnd frequency/throughput. At peak hours, the Shinkansen can depart about every two minutes(!). I would regularly step into the train station five minutes before my departure. Or just buy a ticket at the station when I get there, with no reservation, since I know the trains come so often I won't have to wait long. How long do you have to wait if you miss your flight? How certain are you of an on-time arrival? How early do you arrive at the airport, to make sure you'll catch your plane?
- mytailorisrich 5y agoOne reason China invests heavily in trains is that they provide large capacity. China needs to transport literally hundreds of millions of people over a week once or twice a year (National holiday and Chinese New year) on top on regular transport between megalopolis. "All CRH trains are formed of eight or 16 cars with capacity ranging from 494 to 1299 seats. The busiest routes can be served by up to 101 services per direction per day, with up to eight trains per hour at peak times. Traffic density on such routes is estimated at about 30-40 million passengers" [1] [1] https://www.railjournal.com/in_depth/chinese-high-speed-an-evaluation-of-traffic https://www.railjournal.com/in_depth/chinese-high-speed-an-e...
- Clewza313 5y agoProps to China, but for time being Japan both holds the maglev speed record (603 kph) and is actually building the world's first long-distance maglev between Tokyo and Nagoya: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ch%C5%AB%C5%8D_Shinkansen https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ch%C5%AB%C5%8D_Shinkansen A shame it's a largely useless and incredibly expensive prestige prospect that's not even projected to become profitable until 2070, but that's another story.
- scrose 5y ago> not even projected to become profitable until 2070, but that's another story. I wish that’s how we looked at public transit in the US. Amtrak would be taking us coast to coast in a matter of hours at this point.
- opinion-is-bad 5y agoWell Japan has a little bit of a population density advantage over the US. This seems to be an important factor when looking at where rail has been most successful for commuters.
- scrose 5y agoI wonder if access to better transportation options plays a role in their higher population density. I don’t know enough about Japan to really make any calls towards that though.
- iso1210 5y agoHigh speed rail isn't for commuters - certainly not daily ones. You need cities appropriate distance apart that can occupy the tracks at a decent rate (so 1000 passengers at 20tph). Commuter trains barely need to go much above 200, maybe 250kph. If you can supply say 20,000 passengers a hour for 15 hours a day - 300,000 passengers a day - then you just need the population centres. A 600kph maglev from New York to LA would take 7.5 hours. A flight takes 5.5 hours, so not much in it, especially if it were downtown to downtown. For New York to Chicago it would take about 2h10, same as a plane. Unlikely to provide 300k passengers, but if you added branches at each end and were routed Boston, NY, Washington branches meeting in western PA, then heading to Chicago (meeting a Toronto branch perhaps), Denver, Vegas then at the Western end splitting to LA, San Diego, Phoenix, San Francisco you might be able to occupy the bulk of the route tracks enough. Crucially you don't need to stop every train at every stop, as that adds big time penalties. Of course you're talking 6000km of maglev track minimum, and maglev means you can't just run it on traditional lines for the last 10 miles into the city.
- jl6 5y agoJust remember it’s much easier to pull off megaprojects like this when you can evict anyone whose home or business lies in its path.
- mm983 5y agoDon't forget about the unpaid "reeducation" workers who happen to be minorities or political opposition
- wiz21c 5y agoThere's an airport close to my home. The airport management committee, assisted by the town's representative have evicted many homes. And yes, I live in a perfectly fine democracy...
- rtpg 5y agoEminent domain is a commonly used tool in most nations in the world, you know.
- bitwize 5y agoIn the US the government is constitutionally bound to provide just compensation for anything they appropriate for public use. I doubt the Chinese government is likewise bound.
- sudosysgen 5y agoTher is a constitutional requirement to do so in China. The difference is that the vast majority of land isn't owned in China but leased by the Central government, so the compensation for the land itself may be very low. Structures built upon it are generally compensated properly, though there surely is sometimes corruption. Rural land is even less compensated, sometimes you may be assigned new land and compensated for the structure only.
- khqc 5y agoIn my experience, it's actually pretty common for folks to get massive compensation for land in China. There's even a term (拆二代) that describes a whole generation that suddenly became rich after their parents' land was appropriated by the government.
- jinto36 5y agoObligatory Japan Rail Maglev mention, the present plan for the Chuo shinkansen (bullet train) maglev is for 500 km/h in passenger service, though it's already been tested at speeds over 600 km/h. This train will eventually connect Tokyo to Osaka with service taking a little more than an hour, compared to the present 2.5 hours on the fastest traditional shinkansen service. The original goal was to have the maglev in service by 2027, but they're presently negotiating routing through an area in shizuoka that would need to go under a river that seems to be causing some contention. I don't doubt that China can get their project built faster due to differences in how such projects are executed there. The maglev project in Japan has been in planning for decades, and under construction for about a decade. Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ch%C5%A%C5%8D_Shinkansen https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ch%C5%A%C5%8D_Shinkansen Japan does have a commercial maglev service already, having built one for Expo 2005 in Nagoya. I've been on it, it's kind of neat, but it's quite slow and doesn't have the grand air of futurism a super-fast maglev does. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linimo https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linimo Here's hoping for some progress in room temp superconductors, so that these projects are more feasible!
- ChemSpider 5y agoGreat, I love the Chinese train network. But unfortunately, as of today, it is mainly coal-powered. And they are still building more and more coal-fired power plants: https://e360.yale.edu/features/despite-pledges-to-cut-emissions-china-goes-on-a-coal-spree https://e360.yale.edu/features/despite-pledges-to-cut-emissi...
- black_puppydog 5y agoWell at least with a train system there's an option to green it up medium term. Better than investments into air infrastructure, no? Of course, I'm blissfully unaware of China's air travel developments. I'd be surprised though if they were not also huge. :D
- iso1210 5y agoUnited just ordered 100+ electric short haul planes.
- mimixco 5y agoChina doesn't have the national road network like the US, so they built out a train system. As far as air travel, their Comac airplane has been accused of being a copy of an Airbus. It has about 300 orders from Chinese companies and no deliveries, as far as I can tell: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comac_C919 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comac_C919
- DiogenesKynikos 5y agoChina has also been rapidly expanding its national highway system. It's now larger than the US Interstate System. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Expressways_of_China https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Expressways_of_China
- mimixco 5y agoI was not aware that it had gotten so large. That's cool. But it still doesn't run end-to-end, like ours did from the beginning. That feature lead to the development of both sides of the country.
- fatjokes 5y agoInvesting in large infrastructure projects is a political deadend in American democracy with term limits. A politician needs to expend their political and financial capital on a project that won't complete until well after their term is done, at which point the fickle electorate will associate the success with whoever is in power at the time. I'm just bitter about the tunnels into NY Penn Station.
- ramesh31 5y ago>Investing in large infrastructure projects is a political deadend in American democracy with term limits. Nonsense. We built the transcontinental railroad, the interstate system, and the biggest dams and bridges in the world with term limits. The problem comes down to vested interests. Those things were done when the US still had free land. But in a democracy that respects individual rights and private property, you now end up with an inability to do things for the greater good like an autocratic China can still do on a whim.
- alpha_squared 5y agoPublic works projects now take much longer and are much costlier than they used to be in the US. None of those projects you've listed could be completed today for both of those reasons.
- clairity 5y agowhile overly cynical, yes, term limits do have such adverse effects. perhaps we could rather have yearly (electronic) reconfirmation votes (negative result triggers a full election), fixed publicly-funded campaign budgets (with temp staff completely separate from governance staff), and a rejection of corporate influence (i.e., citizens united) in elections. that would still hold politicians accountable to the people (not corps), but not impose hard and somewhat arbitrary limits.
- bluGill 5y agoThat all sounds good, but when you look at the details you discover it is worse than what we have.
- JoeAltmaier 5y agoWhere does it go? Is it real? Or a demo?
- throwaway4good 5y agoFrom another source, on the economics of Maglev trains: https://www.globaltimes.cn/page/202107/1229097.shtml https://www.globaltimes.cn/page/202107/1229097.shtml China's speediest 600 km/h maglev rolls off assembly line in Qingdao city ... But Zhao Jian, a professor with Beijing Jiaotong University, said that it is unlikely to export China's maglev train and relevant technologies in the near future, as other countries lack the scale to make the maglev lines profitable. "The maglev lines can earn money only when a network of high-speed transportation is formed, with huge passenger flows," Zhao told the Global Times on Tuesday.
- throwaway4good 5y agoI think only where the population density is very high, maglev trains make economic sense: China, Japan, maybe Germany.
- iso1210 5y agoMaglev or other high speed rail (by highspeed I mean 300km-400km/h, not this 1960s stuff California is talking about) is fine for dense cities between 200 and 1000km apart where there's enough traffic to justify the line (i.e. 200,000 passengers a day in each direction over the bulk of the line -- 1000 seats at 20 trains per hour in each direction) For much under 200km there's starts to be little benefit to high speed (10 minutes - station design and frequency far more important) For more than 1000km then you'll struggle to compete with planes -- although a 600kph maglev probably works at most scales -- certainly upto 3000km.
- thehappypm 5y agoI don't think HSR is the future, personally. It's too centralized and inflexible, compared to flying. Any metro can plop an airport down and get some cheap routes out, and as planes get cheaper and maybe electrify, you can scale up and down routes and capacity by deploying more planes. Even laying a single HSR line is a multi billion dollar endeavor, and still doesn't solve the vast majority of actual routes. Just look at the airport departure board at any airport -- even small ones -- direct to a dozen cities hundreds or even thousands of miles away. That's never going to be achievable with rail without laying down tens of thousands of miles of rail.
- Anechoic 5y ago> Any metro can plop an airport down Development of a new runway at an existing (US) is a $billion* endeavor and can take decades.
- thehappypm 5y agoAs a counterpoint to this, it is possible to scale existing airports up to meet consumer demand as-needed. There are thousands and thousands of airports in the US, but most don't have passenger service. Example: Paine Field in Everett (north of Seattle) became a commercial airport in 2019 to service an exploding Seattle metro. While it takes some time for regulations, it's straightforward compared to the billions needed to connect new cities with HSR.
- psadri 5y agoI wonder what’s the optimal max speed considering the increasing cost of building it vs the utility of time saved. It seems higher speeds have higher utility for longer distances as the travel time dominates over boarding/disembarkation times.
- dpix 5y agoI wonder how fault tolerant maglev systems are. The tracks must have to be incredible straight and precise to have a train hovering over it at 600km/hr over those kinds of distances. With traditional rail it's relatively simple to fix up parts of a track or have areas where trains need to slow down to accommodate tricky sections of track. Must be a lot more difficult to repair a maglev track section?
- bfung 5y agoThis article sounds like pure fluff - the new train is “unveiled”, but has it taken anyone from one side of Qingdao to the other yet? Will it really go as fast as it claims in production environment? I’m sure everyone’s code is bug free and high performing before being deployed in production as well ;) http://paulgraham.com/submarine.html http://paulgraham.com/submarine.html
- andrewzah 5y agoThe safety record of the Shinkansen lines in Japan is impeccable [0]. The design and maintenance of train lines is not really comparable to typical software design. [0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shinkansen#Safety_record https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shinkansen#Safety_record
- Darmody 5y agoBy the way. If you like high speed trains, you should check Swisspod[1]. They are developing a viable hyperloop. I know that word might sound like space travel to some of you because we've been hearing it over and over in the last years but it's far from that. It's also relatively cheap, eco friendly (batteries or hydrogen, you choose) and it has some nice tech behind. [1]https://swisspod.ch/ https://swisspod.ch/
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- ghufran_syed 5y ago“capable of reaching 600 kph” So I take that to mean it has never actually done it, but it “could”? Before getting excited about this, maybe we should wait until the system, including the track, is actually built? Or at least a test track with curves etc. I am not shocked this came from chinese state media originally, it comes across as a press release.
- troyvit 5y agoMan. Remember when "Unveil" meant that they were actually taking a sheet off of a real product?
- hintymad 5y agoIt's so refreshing to see 600 kph instead of those crappy mph. I'd rather the US replace imperial metrics with the metric system before seeing a high-speed rail. I mean, how many people suffered in their STEM class for not having intuition on metric units?
- SkyMarshal 5y agoIt's certainly annoying. I wonder how many anti-metric-system types would change their minds if they realized how much easier the metric system is to learn and work with - everything is just a power 10. So much easier for grade school children to learn.
- Caprinicus 5y agoThis is exactly why I anticipate every grade school teaching kids Esperanto any day now As someone who uses both but mostly metric, neither one is difficult to use. Metric relationships between volume and energy and heat are cool - but they are linked to the present day earth at sea level, which in the future might be just as archaic as Fahrenheit being linked to an erroneous human body temperature measurement
- SkyMarshal 5y agoAre you saying we shouldn't continuously improve our scientific systems just because one day we might need to rebase it on Martian or some other physical constants? There are two aspects to the metric system - the physical constants that the base measurements are derived from, and the mathematical relationships between different measurement scales, from microscopic to macroscopic. The latter aspect will remain useful and sensible even if we need to rebase the former on something more appropriate one day. But that day is a long way off, realistically a century or more. Not a great reason.
- guenthert 5y ago"While there are no inter-city or inter-province maglev lines yet in China that could make good use of the higher speeds, some cities including Shanghai and Chengdu have started to conduct research." So, what exactly has been unveiled? The vehicle itself? Yet another test ground (there has been such in Germany since the eighties)? It might be news-worthy that the new train can reach 600km/h, instead of the 450km/h earlier trains could, but ... just barely.
- russli1993 5y agoI think this is going to take a long time to be actually be deployed for public use. China's top transportation plans is signaling its taking a more conservative approach to hard infrastructure development in the next 10 years. It is balancing debt and cost. It calls for more local transportation between cities and their satellite cities/towns. These are slower and cheaper to build. It calls for more stringent review of 350km/h HSR lines. In the past, local governments have been rampant in building 350km/h HSR lines, even if the projected ridership is low. These lines cost a lot more to build and operate than lower speed HSR or regular lines, and cannot be used for freight. China currently lacks freight train capacity, and freight is more profitable and its revenue outlook continues to grow. The planning document calls for more commuter and freight duo use lines for middle and western part of the country.
- some_random 5y agoAlways interesting to see ultra-authoritarian apologists come out of the woodwork whenever the discussion of trains comes up.
- Haemm0r 5y agoI am quite sceptical about the whole thing. The train is finished and the track is not. The track seems to be hard part of the system. Chinese managed to copy the German maglev trains, however they seem to have problems with the track technology. Ever since the Shanghai maglev was built, every two to four years Chinese maglev projects hit the media big. Changsha maglev is all that they could get to work so far.
- sudosysgen 5y agoAccording to CGTN a test track was built and tested, but not at a high speed (https://news.cgtn.com/news/2020-06-21/China-s-600-km-h-high-speed-maglev-completes-trial-run-RvueeEECTm/index.html https://news.cgtn.com/news/2020-06-21/China-s-600-km-h-high-...)
- mensetmanusman 5y agoI wonder how high your social credit score has to be to get tickets for this.
- _carbyau_ 5y agoSeems a bit of a premature announcement. Train is supposedly capable of it. No tracks it can do it on though. Both are required for this to work. 600kph is awful quick and with that much mass behind it I hope the engineering is super well sorted out.
- fleshfly 5y agoIn China any flights that take around an hour (around 700km of land distance) would probably be better traveled via HSR. Flights that around 2-3 hours long usually make more sense compare to HSR, although I know people who would prefer train as long as it is anywhere under 6 hours. - Even the busiest security lines in a typical HSR station say during holidays would take 10 minutes tops. Regular weekday or weekend the security lines take about 2 minutes. They don't scan you very thoroughly, liquids are allowed, don't ask you to take off shoes belts or scan laptops, lithium batteries etc. They're usually just checking for weapons and explosives. - HSR gates typically close 4 minutes before departure and the gates open about 12 minutes before departure. If you factor into security you rarely need to arrive more than 20 minutes before your actual time of departure. For flights, most people do well to arrive at least 40 minutes before departure otherwise you would be cutting it close. - In the case you miss a particular train usually you can wait 30-60 minutes for the next one. If you're desperate there is standing room. - I have almost never encountered a delayed train but flight departure delays happen nearly 30% of the time, factoring into things like weather. And when you are delayed it can be for hours. - You can order takeout between stations and it is delivered to your seat.