18 ms·

OnHub

• GutenYe 11y ago
  Which Operating System(OS) does it use? Will it be open sourced? Can you use it without a Google Account?
• mickgardner 11y ago
  "Our product is not available in your country". How predictable.
• chirau 11y ago
  It looks very polished, not sure of its distinct value preposition over other routers currently on the market
  • brokentone 11y ago
    From a quick read, it seems to be an easy to use QOS and security setup.
  • deleted 11y ago
    [deleted]
  • techtalsky 11y ago
    Looks like the advantages as listed are: - Very simple visual configuration software - Ability to view a graphical representation of device usage and prioritize a device - Ability to update the device without interrupting the connection - Sends setup information to Android devices via an audio tone
• adriancooney 11y ago
  Very interesting. From looking at the specs, it looks like they're packaging a server and marketing it as a router. The configuration app is a very nice touch, routers have always a pain to configure. I'd love to stick this in my apartment (even though I can only receive a maximum of 10mb/s). As a side note, I'm surprised this isn't marketed alongside the Nest branch. It really has the look and feel of Nest products with the LEDs and the speaker aesthetic. Also surprised this isn't an "Alphabet" product.
  • astrocyte 11y ago
    "As a side note, I'm surprised this isn't marketed alongside the Nest branch. It really has the look and feel of Nest products with the LEDs and the speaker aesthetic. Also surprised this isn't an "Alphabet" product." It pretty much is... it's their way of sneaking the 'home automation' core/aggregation box into people's homes masked as a wireless router (for now). I'm sure the capability you mention will come heading into the future. The only question will be : execution/security and will a competitor come up w/ a more secure/well executed product which won't serve as a data vacuum hose to google. This kind of product launch on the heels of their massive alphabet re-org with no understanding where it came from (division wise) or what its goal is leads me to question whether the re-org is really going to move google beyond its former execution flaws ...
    • ocdtrekkie 11y ago
      There are decent solutions to this already. INSTEON works great. It's got dual-band connectivity (wired and wireless) and you can either use a cloud hub if you want, or control it locally with a computer.
      • spdustin 11y ago
        I can't tell you how many Insteon switches I've replaced in anger because they start flashing, stop responding to button presses, start beeping - one didn't even stop when I pulled the air gap switch. I'm well versed in their tech and in electrical systems, and everything was installed correctly, in some cases with fresh neutral wires pulled through direct from the neutral buss bar in the service panel, just to avoid potential crosstalk/current leakage, since they communicate over wires as well as via two way radio (newer spec switches). I know it's anecdotal, but the Insteon forums are filled with similar stories. I was a very early adopter and have been through several generations of devices, and I'm committed to using another platform when I start replacing the remaining Insteon switches that will inevitably die. I wouldn't recommend Insteon to anyone. X-10 was more reliable in my house. I'm evaluating Zigbee options now.
        • 11y ago
• mostafah 11y ago
  on.google.com/hub for a product named OnHub? Does that mean more OnXXX products are on the way?
  • andrewstuart2 11y ago
    Maybe O is for On.
• serverholic 11y ago
  I love the design but I wish it had an ethernet port (or two). Edit: I spoke too soon.
  • jamesfmilne 11y ago
    It does. One LAN, one WAN.
  • nevir 11y ago
    From the specs section: Networking 2.4 GHz wireless 802.11b/g/n 3x3 with smart antenna 5 GHz wireless 802.11a/n/ac 3x3 with smart antenna AUX wireless 802.11a/b/g/n/ac 1x1 Ethernet switch QCA8337 Gigabit sw WAN port 1x 10/100/1000 Mbps LAN port 1x 10/100/1000 Mbps
    • serverholic 11y ago
      Oh awesome. I didn't see it in the illustrations so I assumed it just had one internet hookup.
• binarysolo 11y ago
  $200 for the unit -- so it's competing on the higher end of consumer routers against offerings such as Apple's Airport. They seemed to have paid a lot of attention to human-friendly UI/UX though. Would probably wait for reviews to see what's up.
  • bradfitz 11y ago
    Airport Extreme is also $200.
  • zf00002 11y ago
    At $200 you're in the price range of just building yourself a pfsense box.
    • Filligree 11y ago
      Great for people who know how, not so useful a comment otherwise.
      • zf00002 11y ago
        My point was simply a comparison, yes I should have provided my depth. But at $200 for a premium consumer grade router you are definitely within the realm of a nice pfsense (or alternative) system.
    • tomkinstinch 11y ago
      You could, but at that price it would most likely be a full desktop running pfsense, and who wants that kind of power draw at home? Comparable low-power pfsense boxes are about the same price, or even more for the ones advertised on the pfsense website[1]. The OnHub spec page mentions a draw of <36W[2], which is more than I would have guessed, but it's still less than most desktops. For a device running 24/7 in a residential setting, it makes sense to be low-power. 1. http://store.pfsense.org/SG-2220/ http://store.pfsense.org/SG-2220/ 2. https://on.google.com/hub/#specs https://on.google.com/hub/#specs
      • 11y ago
• twoodfin 11y ago
  Hard to believe there's a huge market for $199 WiFi routers, no matter how sophisticated. On the other hand, even a sprinkling of installations is probably pretty valuable if it allows Google to derive more accurate ISP performance numbers. There's got to be some benefit in having thousands of devices directly connected to the ISP's network on the consumer end 24/7.
  • jcastro 11y ago
    It seems that with AC being more mainstream that prices north of $250 are becoming a thing. I was surprised it was only $199.
    • rattray 11y ago
      AC?
      • chrisrhoden 11y ago
        Like 802.11 B/G/N/AC
    • Artemis2 11y ago
      Apple's Airport Extreme sells for the same price and supports AC. I wouldn't expect Google to try to sell something more expensive without Apple's care for details.
      • rsfinn 11y ago
        Obligatory "buy refurbished equipment from Apple" comment (full manufacturer's warranty; I've never had any problems). The refurbished Airport Extreme is $129, which seems like a pretty good deal. Try poking around under "Mac Accessories".
  • ironlady 11y ago
    I spent $150 each or something like that on my apple routers about 5 years ago, they both are still running strong but since technology has of course advanced so much in the past few years, I would spend that on a router with the hope it lasts the same time.
• jqueryin 11y ago
  I have to say it looks like they may have taken some liberties with the product design a la Amazon Echo. Before I read into the product specifications I was expecting an Echo competitor via Google Now tech.
  • olympus 11y ago
    Agreed. It looks a little like a squatter Echo. Cylindrical, ring of light at the top. But I suppose Amazon will avoid any legal action since it's pretty tough to win a court case with the argument "they copied my cylinder." Hopefully the different functionality of each device will keep any ugly legal battles from ensuing. But with the a computer embedded in this router along with a speaker and bluetooth and zigbee radios this could be customized to offer a lot of the features that the Echo offers (minus the voice control). I hope that doesn't cause any problems.
    • johnhattan 11y ago
      About 80% of the space in the Amazon Echo is taken up by the speaker. The Google router just has a little 3w speaker in it, so I don't think Google is gonna be converting it into an entertainment device anytime soon.
• exelius 11y ago
  Hopefully this device actually has the CPU power to run QOS at more than 50mbps... the same can't be said of any other consumer router in the $200 price range.
  • rattray 11y ago
    Can you explain that? What's QOS, how much CPU does it take to run well, and why don't other expensive routers have the power for fast internet?
    • thenipper 11y ago
      Quality of Service is when the router shapes the traffic making sure all devices on the network get their 'fair' share so to speak. It can prioritize traffic depending on application and use. So you could deprioritize streaming video for instance if you want to make sure that your skype call went through. This takes some processing power which not all routers have a lot of. This link covers it a bit more in depth: http://www.pcworld.com/article/2689995/quality-of-service-explained-how-routers-with-strong-qos-make-better-home-networks.html http://www.pcworld.com/article/2689995/quality-of-service-ex...
      • josteink 11y ago
        > This takes some processing power which not all routers have a lot of. I've set up and hand rolled my own Linux-based routers in the past on cheap leftover hardware (first gen Celeron). Adding QoS introduced literally zero noticeable CPU overhead. I'm not saying you're wrong but you're clearly overselling the computational cost of this feature.
        • thenipper 11y ago
          Fair enough! I've never really delved too deeply into it as most of the time the stuff I deal with is pretty simple. Though some other comments parallel to mine seem to agree with me
        • montecarl 11y ago
• sixdimensional 11y ago
  Just interesting to note that the form factor is quite similar to Amazon Echo (slim cylindrical tube), although the function is completely different (router vs "personal assistant device").
  • anujdeshpande 11y ago
    It has a speaker built in. So they'll have that with Google Cast Audio, Google Now, etc. I am pretty sure they have a taken a leaf or two out of Amazons book.
    • sixdimensional 11y ago
      True, although the audio engineering on the Echo appears to have been quite purposeful. Not sure what kind of performance they'll get out of the speaker on this Google device. But the functionality may well be there, I agree.
    • Navarr 11y ago
      3W so.. probably not
    • dragonwriter 11y ago
      The speaker is to talk to your phone, not to you. (Its a low-powered speaker that's used to communicate to a mobile device for configuration.)
  • neumino 11y ago
    A slim cylindrical tube is also a box for a whisky bottle. It's just a cylindrical tube...
  • prawn 11y ago
    I presume they're designing something to sit visibly on a shelf, but I quite like having things in a more stackable form factor. e.g., an external 3.5" on top of a Mac Mini sitting on top of a four-bay NAS, etc. I guess that creates issues with interference with the antenna functioning though?
• bferri 11y ago
  Google #OnHub slogan: "Because if we didn't already know most things about you now we'll know exactly everything you do on the internet"
• franze 11y ago
  their rel-alternate <link href="https://on.google.com/intl/en_ca/hub/" hreflang="en-ca" rel="alternate"> <link href="https://on.google.com/intl/fr_ca/hub/" hreflang="fr-ca" rel="alternate"> points to a 404
  • simbas 11y ago
    This seems to show that they will launch the device in Canada (en_ca, fr_ca)
    • lstamour 11y ago
      The OnHub will be available for $269 on Aug. 31 in Canada, from Best Buy and the Google Store. More at: http://business.financialpost.com/fp-tech-desk/cio/google-inc-unveils-cylinder-shaped-onhub-wi-fi-router-with-made-in-canada-software http://business.financialpost.com/fp-tech-desk/cio/google-in...
• new2 11y ago
  Can anyone explain why a Router needs 4GB of storage ? What do they mean by "OnHub has 4GB of storage space, so there’s plenty of room for auto-updates and the latest software features." ? Is software for a router that large ?
  • bradfitz 11y ago
    Storage is that cheap.
  • ghola2k5 11y ago
    With the "Weave Ready" comment, I think it might be a smart home hub, too.
  • kevinSuttle 11y ago
    Let me tell you, if my Apple TV had any sort of storage, I'd be a lot happier. Getting a little old streaming everything from "the CLOUD".
    • callumjones 11y ago
      The Apple TV has 8GB of storage, so when you start streaming a TV show or movie it begins downloading the whole thing so internet interruptions don't mess up your viewing.
      • kevinSuttle 11y ago
        Hm. I guess it's a UI issue. It always appears as if its loading/streaming.
    • spicyj 11y ago
      Surprise! If I remember right, Apple TV has a 4GB disk that it uses as a cache.
  • detaro 11y ago
    The pure router parts? No. But stuff like the home automation features I can see why they'd fit more storage, especially in early versions where they don't know quite yet what they'll want to put in later. (Of course, swappable storage would be even better for that, but has other issues)
• nodesocket 11y ago
  OnHub looks nice, but honestly the Apple AirPort Time Capsule is a great device, and also gives you Time Machine backups. The only feature I've found missing, is VPN site-to-site and VPN client connections.
  • smackfu 11y ago
    It is missing SNMP or any kind of traffic monitoring. The WAN to LAN speed is also a bit lacking if you have a very fast connection.
• ghola2k5 11y ago
  Coolest thing I see is on the NewEgg page where it says it's "weave" ready, and you can see the Zigbee/Bluetooth radios. It's a router, and it's the smart home hub.
  • bizzleDawg 11y ago
    I'm really surprised this part didn't generate more attention from the HN crowd. Currently IoT devices always end up having some kind of protocol adaptor unit, like wifi->zigbee and it sucks! As far as I know, the Almond+ is the only other router with 802.15.4 support.
    • jessaustin 11y ago
      I've been quite pleased with my Almond+. Certainly more than I have been with other Kickstarter stuff.
  • erbdex 11y ago
    1. Overall-- this can, theoretically speaking, integrate all- WiFi IoT, Zigbee IoT, Thread IoT, Weave IoT. Whichever way the market picks-up, Google can. 2. On top of that, the specs are good enough to stream multiple IP cams. 3​. Shot in the dark, but with all the "six 2.4GHz antennas, six 5GHz antennas, and a congestion-sensing antenna"​ they're probably trying to fix the classical WiFi congestion and star-topology range issues that comes with WiFi IoT. Especially because it supports 128 devices in WiFi. ​ 4. Rumors are, it already runs Brillo, their IoT OS they showcased at IO.​ ​ 5. Its bridge mode support be something they can use to have "multiple BRs" as promised by Thread? ​ [4] http://nextmarket.co/blogs/smarthomeweekly/29309313-google-iot-os-brillo-effort-reports-to-barratt-targeting-home-routers http://nextmarket.co/blogs/smarthomeweekly/29309313-google-i... [5] https://support.google.com/onhub/answer/6275097?vid=1-635755167092747292-3029280237307171546 https://support.google.com/onhub/answer/6275097?vid=1-635755...
• christop 11y ago
  The only privacy link I could find on the page was Google's generic privacy policy. Is there more information somewhere? With its "advanced and always-evolving security features", I'm wondering whether and what information Google would be gathering about my local network and my network traffic.
  • christop 11y ago
    From the Terms of Service linked from the support site https://support.google.com/onhub/answer/6270620?hl=en&ref_topic=6246512 https://support.google.com/onhub/answer/6270620?hl=en&ref_to... "You agree that Google may collect and use technical and related information, including but not limited to information about your computer and/or mobile device, operating system, peripherals, applications, connected devices, network traffic, and data use to facilitate the provision of the Software and Services, including support and other related services." It goes on to state "The OnHub Privacy FAQ describes the categories of data collected and how you can use privacy settings to change what data is collected by the Services." But I couldn't find the OnHub Privacy FAQ and https://support.google.com/onhub/search?q=privacy https://support.google.com/onhub/search?q=privacy oddly says "Your search - privacy - did not match any answers in OnHub Help".
    • jaboutboul 11y ago
      I wouldn't trust Google with this much access to my internet traffic.
      • deleted 11y ago
        [deleted]
      • dvlsg 11y ago
        I would if I got Google fiber speeds. For this, though? Probably not.
    • magicalist 11y ago
      As wora points out, you're probably looking for https://support.google.com/onhub/answer/6279845 https://support.google.com/onhub/answer/6279845 Unclear why they refer to it as "The OnHub Privacy FAQ" (implying proper noun) but then the page is called "OnHub, the Google On app and your privacy" and it's not structured as an FAQ. I can't find anything else it could refer to, though.
• philip1209 11y ago
  Do they allow you to configure DNS, or do they force Google DNS use like on Chromecasts?
  • ironlady 11y ago
    Since it is a full router I'm sure you can change it, but on a side note you can re-direct the chromecast DNS pretty easily too https://www.google.ca/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ion=1&espv=2&es_th=1&ie=UTF-8#q=redirect%20chromecast%20dns&es_th=1 https://www.google.ca/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ion=1&es...
  • christop 11y ago
    "OnHub sets your default DNS provider to Google Public DNS. (This can be changed in the Advanced Networking settings of the Google On app.)" According to https://support.google.com/onhub/answer/6279845 https://support.google.com/onhub/answer/6279845
• jcfrei 11y ago
  Here in CH virtually everyone receives a modem/router combo for free from their provider (ie. they borrow it to you). They are also usually preconfigured - so you just need to plug them in. Is it the same in the US? I guess at a 199$ price point this will be a tough sell.
  • jasonellis 11y ago
    Yes, it's the same in the US. ISPs provide a modem/router combo and charge like $7 a month for it. The disadvantage is that the router portion of the unit is usually very poor. AT&T is still giving out modem/router combos that us 802.11b/g, not even n, much less ac. Purchasing a separate router lets you use better wifi technology as well as enable useful features like QoS settings that aren't available on the ISP-provided hardware.
    • djhworld 11y ago
      Why do you get charged $7 for it? Here in the UK most providers seem to offer the router as a sign up bonus. The disadvantage is that router is mostly cheap garbage, but it's effectively yours once your contract starts, no rental/need to give back
  • carlosdp 11y ago
    Yea, many of the major ISPs lease out a modem that acts as a router by default.
  • tantalor 11y ago
    CH = Switzerland?
    • squidbidness 11y ago
      Oui, ja, si, gea, yes.
  • detaro 11y ago
    Here in Germany those offers are similar. And nearly everybody somewhat tech-savvy doesn't get or use them, because most of the time they are pretty crappy. 150€+ routers are a limited market though, I've mostly seen top fritzbox models that come with DECT phone support etc.
• kevinSuttle 11y ago
  BRB going to give Google 100% of my network traffic directly from their router. https://31.media.tumblr.com/a71ef8257d0bd0d3a15fe01b4fc4911c/tumblr_inline_n3pyzflw6s1s7tidj.gif https://31.media.tumblr.com/a71ef8257d0bd0d3a15fe01b4fc4911c...
  • astrocyte 11y ago
    Sadly, there will be tons of people lining up to do so...
  • kevinSuttle 11y ago
    Really, downvotes?
• osipovas 11y ago
  I wonder what sort of ramifications this has for improving indoor location services for Google's connected properties.
• 0xdeadbeefbabe 11y ago
  So how does it connect to the app? Buttons and lights are a lot better than no connection.
  • aroch 11y ago
    They tell you, they just tucked it away at the bottom: >When you set up OnHub using an Android device, it uses an audio tone to send a setup code directly to your mobile device for easy and secure setup.
    • rgoodwintx 11y ago
      I imagine it's like Echo, and the various sticks out now; if not on Android, you connect to it from your phone as a wifi access point, and set it up from there. When done it reboots and becomes part of your regular network.
• impish19 11y ago
  So what does this device primarily do that I need right now? Just throttling internet for certain devices and prioritizing others? I'm not even entirely sure what 'uses smart software to find the best WiFi connection' means. What's the value prop here given the device costs $200? It's not like it can better your internet somehow.
  • keehun 11y ago
    It does have prioritizing: https://support.google.com/onhub/answer/6246483 https://support.google.com/onhub/answer/6246483
    • fs111 11y ago
      any plastic router has some sort of QoS build in. This seems to have a nicer UI though.
      • outworlder 11y ago
        "any plastic router has some sort of QoS build in"... that doesn't work. If you don't have an expensive product, do some tests with and without the router's QoS. You'd be better of with a raspberry Pi doing QoS in most cases.
        • keehun 11y ago
          Agreed. Found that none of the routers I've ever bought came with QoS that actually worked, or at least made a noticeable difference.
        • wtallis 11y ago
          Even if you do have an expensive product, the QoS in the stock firmware is guaranteed to have major problems.
  • blakeyrat 11y ago
    The only way I can interpret that quote is, "it can automatically switch wifi radio channels when the one its using gets congested". I don't know, maybe there's more to it than that. Because $40 routers can do that.
• ocdtrekkie 11y ago
  The thing that throws me here that others haven't commented on yet... it's built 'in partnership with TP-Link'. TP-Link makes budget hardware, that doesn't last much longer than it's one year warranty. Charging $199 for a TP-Link device sounds... overpriced. If this had been built by ASUS, then maybe they'd have something.
  • lstamour 11y ago
    There will be one from ASUS in the future: > Google’s hardware partner for the initial OnHub is TP-LINK; it plans future devices with other manufacturers as well, including one from ASUS later this year. http://business.financialpost.com/fp-tech-desk/cio/google-inc-unveils-cylinder-shaped-onhub-wi-fi-router-with-made-in-canada-software http://business.financialpost.com/fp-tech-desk/cio/google-in...
  • edude03 11y ago
    That may be your experience, but I've been using TP-Link as my go to access points for myself and my clients (home and small business) for the past 6 or so years. I've deployed maybe 20 APs in that time and none have failed yet.
• agumonkey 11y ago
  Not communicating by blinking lights is not a feature to me. Progressive enhancement all you want, have a nice app for involved communication, but keep some LEDs for core status please.
  • rattray 11y ago
    > OnHub uses a dimmable light ring that uses one of four color indicators to give you feedback.
    • agumonkey 11y ago
      Ha, I didn't get that message at all. So the emphasis was on 'not blinking', the colored rim is the ~LED. My apologies.
• anujdeshpande 11y ago
  This is something that will be amazing to reverse engineer too actually. Something similar to bunnie taking apart the xbox.
• anonymuse 11y ago
  From the design goals outlined in the FAQ, it seems clear to me that Google expects there to be a great deal more bandwidth hungry devices in the home speaking first to each other, and then out to the WAN, in the near term. Including Bluetooth, Weave, and Thread, along with up to 128 devices, gives me a rough sense of the scale of connected devices they anticipate in each home. Given that it also has a reasonable compute capabilities and cooling as one of the highlights, I think it's far to say that it could do a lot of processing on its own before reaching back home to the GOOG DCs.
  • sixdimensional 11y ago
    ...likely part of their "Internet of Things" strategy.
• imarios 11y ago
  Looks like a direct competitor to Apple's airport series: http://www.apple.com/shop/product/ME918/airport-extreme http://www.apple.com/shop/product/ME918/airport-extreme
  • hashgowda 11y ago
    Nope. It is competitor for Apple TV which is going to be the hub for Apple Homekit devices.
    • deleted 11y ago
      [deleted]
• JustSomeNobody 11y ago
  It speaks, but does it listen? (Have a microphone)?
  • erbdex 11y ago
    No.
    • JustSomeNobody 11y ago
      Oh, good.
• daveloyall 11y ago
  You can almost hear the TLA's grunt of relief. Maybe they won't 'go dark' after all. I mean, hell, even if the consumer monitors the thing, a constant X mbps stream of strongly encrypted traffic to Google is normal. What do we do? Demand that the device must give us (per-device) keys for the purposes of audit? Somebody will argue that that would open an attack vector... @EFF, what do we do?
  • thrownaway2424 11y ago
    I know, let's all act like retards on the Internet.
• dazbradbury 11y ago
  Interesting - but I'm not sure what this gives me over something in a similar price range, for example: http://www.amazon.com/RT-AC68U-Wireless-AC1900-Dual-Band-Gigabit-Router/dp/B00FB45SI4 http://www.amazon.com/RT-AC68U-Wireless-AC1900-Dual-Band-Gig... Presumably either you know something about routers and want to enable QoS, install your own firmware, or use some other advanced feature - and you spend money on a decent router. Or you don't, and use whatever your ISP provides (which if it's bad, you blame the ISP for without thinking twice). So perhaps this is the new router bundled with Google Fibre?
  • thrownaway2424 11y ago
    The AC68U is the perfect AP for the discerning user who enjoys going into the basement every two weeks to reboot things.
    • dvlsg 11y ago
      I've had mine for over a year now, and I've only had to reboot it 3 times - 4 if you count the time I unplugged it and moved to a new city.
      • CrazedGeek 11y ago
        I've had mine for a similar time frame and I've never needed to restart it, except to install updates. My cable modem goes out more often.
        • seanalltogether 11y ago
          My biggest issue with this router has simply been the media server, however the wifi connections and vpn have always worked.
      • thrownaway2424 11y ago
        If you have to manually reboot something quarterly then it's a piece of shit. Your standards are way too low.
• fraXis 11y ago
  I see no mention of being able to use 2 or 3 of these things in an Wi-Fi extender type of scenario that I can do with my current Airport Extreme routers.
  • gregpilling 11y ago
    I was wondering the same thing.
  • tomkinstinch 11y ago
    Their FAQ suggests increasing coverage by having one unit act as the router (doing NAT), and having others act as (bridged) access points: https://support.google.com/onhub/answer/6275097?vid=1-635755167092747292-3029280237307171546 https://support.google.com/onhub/answer/6275097?vid=1-635755...
    • fraXis 11y ago
      This method seems really cumbersome compared to the Airport Extreme and their wireless bridging method.
      • izacus 11y ago
        Ehm... that's pretty much the exact same method you use on Airport Extreme if you care about speeds (one being the NAT machine, others APs connected with cables). If you're doing the wireless bridge you're trading off a lot of wireless bandwidth (and added noise) just to get data from one Airport to another. Far from an optimal setup.
• daveloyall 11y ago
  > For initial setup, the Google On app on a device with Android 4.0 or higher or iOS 7 or higher is required. Bah! What's wrong with my Thinkpad?
  • edgyswingset 11y ago
    Adding support for Linux/OSX/Windows is probably not a priority for them to get this thing off the ground.
    • josteink 11y ago
      How about, eh, you know... Web based? No need for this platform-specific bullshit. Last I heard Google was pretty good at creating good web applications.
      • MichaelGG 11y ago
        Perhaps it uses some local comms to bootstrap it. Like Bluetooth or sound waves.
        • daveloyall 11y ago
          Yes, it says somewhere on the site that it uses soundwaves to share the initial key with your device. But that's NOT an excuse to make the device depend on the Mobile ecosystem. If it can play a code on the speaker, it can just talk. In English. Via thirty-six audio files: a.wav, b.wav, ... 9.wav. Ok, thirty-seven recordings--can't forget welcome_to_your_new_router_your_key_is.wav. :)
          • MichaelGG 11y ago
            I'd wager that whatever they're doing, it's far more reliable than reading out English letters and doing speech recognition on it. Accomplishing the key exchange might not have been reliable in all browsers.
• angryasian 11y ago
  From the comments in this thread its pretty clear that most consumers probably don't understand QOS/prioritization. While most routers allow manual configuration if Google's router can automate this task this is a huge benefit. Imagine if you're using your network for wifi calls and others are just browsing the net. Your calls should clearly take priority over other traffic. The same goes for gaming etc. The hardware specs are incredible for a home router at this price point. I'm really looking forward to the intelligence aspect and how much it can actually improve the overall network performance. The nice integrated app to share passwords and see who's on the network is just a nice to have feature. edit: appears to be sold out on google store, and amazon is only selling the blue model
• driverdan 11y ago
  Why would anyone want this over the latest Asus AC1900 router? Asus' web interface is easy to use and their QoS is surprisingly good out of the box. Also, Asus isn't going to spy on everything you do.
  • snaky 11y ago
    Why would anyone want the router not supported by OpenWRT? > Asus isn't going to spy on everything you do How do you know that?
    • vanadium 11y ago
      I have the AC2400 and just use the Merlin distribution, which is based on OpenWRT. I rarely have the problems some report about the Asus line, but then again I'm just one data point.
      • wtallis 11y ago
        And the kernel in that Merlin distro is from which year? You're really not getting the full benefit of OpenWRT when you're using Broadcom's proprietary drivers and ancient kernels.
  • freehunter 11y ago
    Because it's pretty, it's made by Google, and look at all of the fancy marketing they've done. More seriously, it offers a lot more integration with non-wifi wireless devices than the Asus does, tighter integration with Android and other Google services, and some value-add features like password-less pairing and a friendly app.
    • larrys 11y ago
      "look at all of the fancy marketing they've done" They are trying to be Apple even the design seems close to what Apple might do at least to my eye. The thing is Apple does this and gets business because there was a core of important and vital products and software that got people using Apple for a different reason. So if I buy (as I have) Apple's Airport extreme it's because I am buying other Apple products. I can't say if that weren't the case that would be what I would go with. (I mean I might but since I am already buying the brand I am biased and just go for the IBM choice so to speak...). My point is that a company can't simply take a product here and a product there and hope to have great success with just a great isolated device for a particular purpose. Which means that since google is not stupid they must be doing this for another reason (as others have mentioned). They aren't doing it because they honestly expect and need to sell routers and make money from that or even another play that they are building on that we don't know about. Must be something else going on here. Lastly, end users in flyover country don't care about all of this unless they know about or have a particular problem. And how many people even have these problems? (I don't as only one example..) If they did they would be protesting outside of cable companies and demanding better remote controls for their fios or comcast dvr's.
• deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
• mrtalented 11y ago
  I've been dogfooding the device for about 4 months now. Before, I was using the previous generation Airport Extreme. It is far better - the app makes it super simple to set up, the signal seems to be stronger throughout my apartment, and I love having a convenient way to monitor / admin it remotely (via the app). Well worth the price imo. >inb4 shill :)
  • Filligree 11y ago
    How well will it work in a complex network configuration? E.g. my network looks like this: Modem - L3 switch - Server 1 - Desktop \ \ \ - Wifi AP - Server 2 If I replace the AP with one of these, is it going to work? Server 1 does NAT for the wifi network.
    • tomkinstinch 11y ago
      It looks like it supports a "bridge mode" (AP only, no NAT): https://support.google.com/onhub/answer/6240987?hl=en&ref_topic=6246470&vid=1-635755165356935124-14285033767779996327 https://support.google.com/onhub/answer/6240987?hl=en&ref_to...
  • kingnight 11y ago
    Hi, Could you elaborate on what you believe to be far better than the extreme. AExtreme was super simple to set up and has an app too. Did you position your OnHub differently than your extreme? I have had an Extreme for years but recently moved and found some issues with connectivity in the new location so I've been weighing options.
    • mrtalented 11y ago
      Just as simple to set up as the Extreme if you're on iOS, and even simpler on Android. I placed it in the same spot where the Extreme was formerly located; my signal strength at the other end of the apartment and outside is noticeably stronger, perhaps due to the multi-directional antenna.
• jamesblonde 11y ago
  In the Clommunity project, designed for the world's largest wireless community network (Guifi.net), we have developed a Linux Distro, called cloudy, for these kind of boxes: http://cloudy.community/ http://cloudy.community/ We are using the boxes to provide "cloud" services to other users in the Guifi network (30K+ deployments). We currently have 20 rolled out with another 20 coming soon. We're expecting 100+ by the end of next year. It supports different hardware profiles, but Intel Atom and ARM are quite popular.
  • gregpilling 11y ago
    could you make a small local cloud with that, in Arizona?
    • jamesblonde 11y ago
      Yeah sure. It's built using decentralized (gossip-based) protocols such as Serf (https://www.serfdom.io/ https://www.serfdom.io/) and you just need one IP to act as a bootstrap.
• skarap 11y ago
  Woohoo, another phallic gadget, almost exactly looks like a Mac Pro!
  • smacktoward 11y ago
    I'm not sure you understand what "phallic" means...
    • skarap 11y ago
      I really do - round and tall. This was supposed to be a joke, but I guess I don't know how to interact with HN community yet.
      • deleted 11y ago
        [deleted]
    • pluma 11y ago
      Technically any round thing that's considerably taller than it is wide is phallic. I've heard people call obelisks phallic on more than one occasion and they're not even round. Sure, it's a stretch, but it nearly always is. Sometimes a cigar is just a phallus. ... I mean cigar. EDIT: I'm having suspicions that HN is trying to prevent me from using the more obvious word for the male dangly bit. If this comment ends up dead, that's probably why.
• untog 11y ago
  About the only real improvement I'm seeing here is the automatic, silent updates. That could be a lifesaver if a crucial bug were ever found. Aside from that, eh. It looks good, I don't doubt that with that number of antennas etc. it'll work well, but if anyone else is like me they've long since forgotten what their router even is - it just sits there, doing its job, and has done for years. I find the intelligent NAS boxes far more interesting - I have a Synology box that basically provides it's own cloud storage, download manager, etc.
  • scott_karana 11y ago
    > automatic, silent updates. That could be a lifesaver if a crucial bug were ever found. And what if a crucial bug was introduced? ;)
  • londonsexplorer 11y ago
    Most people with old routers don't even realise the router is randomly bugging out and slowing down your web page load speeds. Fun fact: Old routers generally don't support WiFi power saving features. That means your phone battery will drain waaay faster than it could if you had a new router. Having WiFi switched on with a phone connected to a new router will in fact generally increase battery life because it can use the cell radio less often. http://www.techworld.com/mobile/a-guide-to-wi-fi-power-save-technologies-4103/ http://www.techworld.com/mobile/a-guide-to-wi-fi-power-save-...
• webXL 11y ago
  The mobile Overview UI looks similar to Apple's Airport Utility. Looks like they took the best part (the graph). Hopefully the UI is more straightforward. Things got lost when Apple moved to version 6.0.
• tomkinstinch 11y ago
  Interesting that it has a TPM[1]. Any guesses about the uses/implications of that? I wonder if it can be configured to act solely as an access point--I already have a ubnt EdgeRouter Lite, but wouldn't mind replacing my aging access point. EDIT: It does support bridge mode[2]. 1. https://on.google.com/hub/#specs https://on.google.com/hub/#specs 2. https://support.google.com/onhub/answer/6240987?hl=en&ref_topic=6246470&vid=1-635755165356935124-14285033767779996327 https://support.google.com/onhub/answer/6240987?hl=en&ref_to...
  • tjohns 11y ago
    Just a guess, but the TPM is probably for secure boot, just like on a Chromebook. Since security is one of the selling points. https://www.chromium.org/chromium-os/chromiumos-design-docs/verified-boot https://www.chromium.org/chromium-os/chromiumos-design-docs/...
    • tomkinstinch 11y ago
      That would make sense. We'll have to wait and see if the OnHub has a "dev" switch like Chromebooks. Hopefully it will be possible to put custom software on it (even if the Google software is just fine, the flexibility would be nice).
  • katruchu 11y ago
    I have the same set up as you do. EdgeRouter Lite with an old Linksys E2000 acting solely as an access point. OnHub might be a good replacement, but I’m wondering if it supports VLAN tagging as I’d like to separate my private network from the guest network.
  • Natanael_L 11y ago
    Interacting with security hardware? Smart locks, FIDO alliance protocols, etc?
    • tired_man 11y ago
      That would not be an option I'd consider. I think controlling your locks without the use of an outside entity is the safest way to avoid problems.
• thrillgore 11y ago
  It looks nice, but since there's more wired ethernet devices in my residence than Wifi, it really doesn't fit an immediate need for me. Still seeing native ZigBee support is awesome. Wonder if the OnHub provides an interface to it.
• sbarre 11y ago
  Not available outside the US. :-(
  • guyzero 11y ago
    Available in Canada, technically not the US.
    • sbarre 11y ago
      That must be new because I am in Canada, and it said "not available in your country".
• wnevets 11y ago
  The biggest positive about a company like google releasing a router is the security updates. Most consumer routers out there are left to rot and you're forced to buy a one when its exploited.
  • noja 11y ago
    https://github.com/RMerl/asuswrt-merlin https://github.com/RMerl/asuswrt-merlin
    • therealmarv 11y ago
      well... I use this and it definitely not auto updates! Also keep in mind this is a one man show. https://github.com/RMerl/asuswrt-merlin/wiki/Questions-&-Answers https://github.com/RMerl/asuswrt-merlin/wiki/Questions-&-Ans... I even set a alarm on http://watchthatpage.com/ http://watchthatpage.com/ to track changes of that router software.
  • busterarm 11y ago
    You mean like phones locked on old versions of Android once Google moves on to new ones?
    • shawn-furyan 11y ago
      And don't they have Brillo? Having this without Brillo duplicates (particularly security related) effort and signals that Google doesn't consider Brillo to be acceptable for use in its own products. I imagine going w/ Brillo would have set back the release schedule, but Brillo, if their vision for both products were to come to pass, is by far the more consequential product. Also... The wireless router market isn't exactly teaming with competitive one-upsmanship. They could have waited 0.5-2+ years without losing significant ground. Note: Brillo is the stripped down variant of Android aimed at IoT (internet of things) devices that Google announced at the last Google I/O. This is an ideal early device for Brillo, since it's relatively powerful and isn't battery powered, so constraints aren't quite as high as they are in many IoT devices, yet it shares much of the problem space. https://developers.google.com/brillo/?hl=en https://developers.google.com/brillo/?hl=en [edited 6:39PM UTC to add the Note]
• thom_nic 11y ago
  This is definitely like the Nest in that it's an "entry" into the home, clearly it has ambitions to be more than just a router. On the surface, a $200 router doesn't even make sense. 99% of the time congestion is probably not at the router/Wi-Fi level (any 5GHz wifi router should do) but somewhere upstream (ISP or WAN latency.) If you have a very large property there are plenty of routers already on the market with good external antennas. Number of people who think "man the wifi in my house sucks" is very small. Clearly they're selling this as a boutique product (similar to Nest) with the hopes of expanding it to perform other tasks, probably similar to Amazon Echo. Heck it even looks like the Echo.
  • btmorex 11y ago
    Clearly, you don't live in a city. 2.4Ghz on any channel is nearly unusable in my apartment (5Ghz fairs better I think because it penetrates obstructions less easily). My laptop can currently detect >50 wifi networks.
• thezach 11y ago
  now available for order on Amazon. http://amzn.to/1HUa2oB http://amzn.to/1HUa2oB
• so898 11y ago
  Only one LAN port? This reminds me of the HiWifi router which build by a Chinese company. I still think this one LAN port design is terrible.
  • andrewstuart2 11y ago
    Well, a nice 8-port metal gigabit switch will only run you about $20. True, it may be a lot harder or more expensive to do anything with port-specific VLAN tagging, but hardware support for that using something like DD-WRT is spotty anyway. I'd also guess that the round design may play a part in that decision. It would definitely be less aesthetically pleasing to have a wagon-wheel of cables coming out of the base.
  • snuxoll 11y ago
    While it's silly, a cheap desktop switch is only going to cost you like $20 to get up to four ports - and it only has a 1Gbps internet port so it's not like even if you had a faster connection you're going to be wasting it.
• pratikch 11y ago
  it could have been better if google have added storage and caching facility right on the box, that would've helped people to reduce the total data usage for passive contents like videos.
• noja 11y ago
  and dust? it can't be for out in the open with an open rim around the top.
• pknerd 11y ago
  WOW!!! Now they can monitor all activities without injecting any tools at OS or application level.
  • VikingCoder 11y ago
    Because they couldn't already, when they were an ISP. Google Fiber.
• chinathrow 11y ago
  Why does this thing need an ambient light detector? Really? Since when should infrastructure care what the environment looks like? Also TPM? Can't wait for the teardown to find that there is a microphone in it.
  • ocb 11y ago
    Ever slept in a room with a wireless router before? Those flashing lights get annoying.
    • MichaelGG 11y ago
      Pretty much any modern hardware. I bought a nice das keyboard only to find that they don't know how to make lights on it. Instead of having some sort of diffuser or screen to light up, like normal numlock indicators, this projects light in a cone. At night, it projects a big circle on my ceiling. Emailed them and they were flabbergasted this was a thing.
• methehack 11y ago
  My read is that this about Google Fiber. You get a 1Gb connection but your router gets you like 80Mb/sec... that's a bummer, this fixes it (if it works).
• sangd 11y ago
  It's nice that we have Google ensure our TP-Link router to function correctly, hopefully. I'm frustrated with my current TP-Link router since it often needs a reset once in a while. Btw, should this design be changed because it looks to me that the top is very good at collecting dust and dead bugs. I don't expect to buy this and box it.
  • therealmarv 11y ago
    same experience here. I would never buy TP-Link again because of bad experiences. Flashing dd-wrt on one of its routers helped but it was still unstable from time to time. Well the same I said about LG phones (but having a LG Nexus). Seems software can be really important.
• andrewla 11y ago
  From [1] Get started Welcome! To set up your OnHub, you’ll also need: Google account Android or iOS device Broadband connection Google account? That seems like an unnecessary requirement for a router. [1] https://on.google.com/hub/support/#get-started https://on.google.com/hub/support/#get-started
  • dafrankenstein2 11y ago
    haha..u got it right!!
  • Spooky23 11y ago
    Sounds a lot like the Meraki model. Makes sense... I'm sure one of the top consumer issues is losing router credentials.
    • scott_karana 11y ago
      > losing router credentials I suspect 95% of people do not change the default credentials, which are stickered or engraved on their routers.
      • nadams 11y ago
        > default credentials, which are stickered or engraved on their routers. Which having a seemingly random admin and wifi password with WPA pre-configured is better than no password. I remember a story where an individual connected to an open AP, scanned the network, found a windows network share with everyone read access, that had NES roms and their tax returns. The sad part, and still is true today, you couldn't help them without admitting that you committed a crime (a felony I believe).
        • raldi 11y ago
          Sure you could -- just drop off a file someplace visible.
          • 11y ago
• blixt 11y ago
  I wonder if these will be capable of lending spare (encrypted) bandwidth to anonymous mobile devices. I.e., can Google Fi[1] users benefit from Wi-Fi when walking past a house that has an OnHub running? [1] https://fi.google.com/about/ https://fi.google.com/about/
  • danielsamuels 11y ago
    Two Google services working together? Don't be silly!
  • rtkwe 11y ago
    Every time a company has tried to do open wifi sharing there's been a lot of kickback. Mostly because it's opt out instead of opt in but that's put a big damper on anyone doing similar things.
    • pbhjpbhj 11y ago
      I think BT in the UK (one of the main ISPs) do this: >"When you buy any BT broadband package you receive unlimited FREE access to BT Wi-fi, the UK's largest wi-fi network, plus millions of Fon hotspots overseas. Simply use the BT broadband email address and password you were given when you joined us. >"To get the FREE service you'll share a small, separate and secure portion of your home broadband connection with other members of the BT Wi-fi community. This is what creates the millions of hotspots you can use out and about." (http://www.btwifi.com/help/login-with-bt/help-broadband-customer.jsp http://www.btwifi.com/help/login-with-bt/help-broadband-cust...) // In other words "you can't buy a BT broadband package without giving your router to be used as part of our wi-fi network". Marketing, probably most users don't realise they're part of the "wi-fi network"?
    • puls 11y ago
      Comcast does this under the "xfinitywifi" network name as a default setup for anybody who uses the standard cable modem/router-in-one box, with thousands and thousands of access points: http://wifi.xfinity.com/ http://wifi.xfinity.com/
    • xur17 11y ago
• emilburzo 11y ago
  Not sure if this is the best place to ask, but since it's a router thread, I'll go ahead. I'm looking to buy a router with better performance than the Linksys E3200 that I currently have. Lots of VMs, torrents with many connections, etc are taking a toll on it, especially towards the NAT connection count limit (wifi signal/speed is enough for me). ERLite from Ubiquiti Networks seems interesting, but it's not so popular and I'm past the days where debugging routers was fun. Any suggestions?
  • jon-wood 11y ago
    The ERLite is a fantastic router. I picked one up with the same worries you seem to have, but there's a decent community around them, and even then you'll likely only need that if you're doing something exotic like failover connections (although even those are now supported through the web UI). For $99 the only drawback is that it doesn't also do wifi, but given how poorly my previous all in one APs have done that's possibly a feature. Ubiquiti's Unifi APs piss all over older access points I've had, I just wish I'd ponied up for at least one AC standard one instead of cheaping out on the G band ones.
    • emilburzo 11y ago
      Yeah, I'm starting to consider it a bonus if the devices are separated (router/wifi). Thank you, I'll give the product another look.
• api 11y ago
  Here's one for the FAQ: "Does OnHub send all my browsing information including SSL SNI header information to Google?"
• heywire 11y ago
  The design reminds me of something between a Mac Pro, Amazon Echo, and D-Link's "cloud" routers.
• vishalzone2002 11y ago
  Apart from having even more user data, I think if this gets to masses, it places google in a very strong position to own the IoT space.
• misterbwong 11y ago
  Am I the only one thinking this is Google's stealth echo competitor? It has all the right pieces. It's constantly connected to internet and power, zigbee/bluetooth/wifi, speaker, decent (enough) CPU, front end app. I'm sure they already have an API built into the back end. All they would need to do would be to build a gateway API for developers and add a mic.
  • donpdonp 11y ago
    I too have suspicions the OnHub is a stealth echo competitor. After going through the comments here though, being the hub for home automation/IoT is compelling enough on its own. It'll be very interesting if a tear-down reveals internal microphones.
  • speechduh 11y ago
    Far field speech recognition is _really_ hard. You can't just throw any random set of mic / speaker into a tube and expect it to work. The echo is almost exclusively mic / speaker, in a very specific configuration. There's no way the product they're shipping will be able to do far field speech recognition (much less while playing music).
• mentat 11y ago
  Did anyone see whether it supported IPv6 on Comcast?
• fimoreth 11y ago
  I find it odd how it seems to be marketed to the general consumer, who usually won't need the high specs. What is the average person going to use USB on the router for? I have a $200+ router myself, but would feel too restricted with the OnHub's single LAN port. Still very interesting. Just wondering why the high price point and (imo) over the top specs.
  • ascagnel_ 11y ago
    > What is the average person going to use USB on the router for? It's a good way to share a printer, especially if you don't have a printer that supports WiFi.
    • fimoreth 11y ago
      Ah, okay. Hadn't thought of that, thanks.
• rthomas6 11y ago
  So can I use it to do all the nerdy things I use my DD-WRT flashed router for? Like QoS, adblocking at the router, a separate guest WiFi, VPN support, MAC address filtering, etc?
  • therealmarv 11y ago
    you are not the target audience!
    • scrumper 11y ago
      Well maybe they are... If it can do all that without learning DD-WRT, then I'll buy it. I understand all those things and want most of them enabled at home, I just don't have the time or motivation to learn the configuration files despite being a programmer who's perfectly capable of it. The interface should be distinct from the capability.
      • rthomas6 11y ago
        You are thinking of OpenWRT, I believe. DD-WRT is pretty much flash and go. Ad blocking is a bit of a pain, but the rest of the things I named have a GUI.
    • druska 11y ago
      Router enthusiasts are definitely a target audience. Average demographics won't pay $200 for a router.
      • therealmarv 11y ago
        Tell that to Apple Airport Extreme users ;)
• mrbill 11y ago
  This had to come out two weeks after I upgraded at home to a Cisco 1252AG, didn't it? I still want one...
• j_s 11y ago
  Does it have a microphone? Did not see it mentioned in the specs...
• scottmcdot 11y ago
  I get a 404 error when I try to pre order in Google Store. I have an Australian account - maybe that's why? http://i.imgur.com/x0soYdJ.png http://i.imgur.com/x0soYdJ.png
• bg0 11y ago
  Seems a little pricey. My TP-Link router was $45 and is amazing. I'm probably missing something but $200 doesn't seem "worth it" at first glance when set up really only consists of looking at the bottom of the router to find the WPA Key.
  • tormeh 11y ago
    OnHub is made by TP-Link, it seems. I have a TP-Link and it has worked flawlessly too.
• ahamino 11y ago
  Google is taking over the worrrrld
• mmanfrin 11y ago
  I'm not sure what the advantage of this is over any other router, other than vague 'built for all the ways you wifi'. Simplicity is nice, maybe this is trying to duplicate Nest-like success in the router realm, but people don't actively fiddle with routers like they do thermostats.
  • wmf 11y ago
    Automatic security patches.
• yellowapple 11y ago
  This is actually cheaper than what my current router - a Linksys WRT1900AC - is going for. On the other hand, said WRT1900AC was designed explicitly for OpenWRT support (and is even advertised as being OpenWRT-compatible - which it indeed is as of Chaos Calmer RC3), whereas OnHub's page makes zero mention of installing custom firmware.
• tibbon 11y ago
  I'm just curious why so many wireless routers are flakey, need frequently reset, have connection issues, etc. That, and what Google is actually doing differently than other high quality routers.
  • flurpitude 11y ago
    To your first question: they're rushed out of the door in a hurry to catch the next trend, and have poor cooling and poor software. To your second question: other high quality routers don't enable Google to spy on you quite so effortlessly.
  • orky56 11y ago
    Most the consumer hardware networking industry is based on costs. Components are sourced based on the lowest cost and quality tends to be prioritized for SMB/enterprise products. Typically, routers are relatively inelastic in demand and industrial design, brand recognition, and price point make up the decision criteria for consumers. Testing is mostly spent on integrating all these various components and very little is spent on general UI. I'm a bit wary on Google's approach unless they have some great QA process or are bringing higher quality components to consumers at a lower price point. (Used to work for one of the big consumer networking companies)
    • wmf 11y ago
      Or they're selling this router at a loss by accounting the firmware as $0 so they can give the customer more for their money.
  • djhworld 11y ago
    Google seem to be approaching their marketing from a consumers perspective, capitalising on the common experience of flakey WiFi and shitty tech support telling you that "turning it off, waiting 30 seconds and on again" should "solve" the problem. I'd imagine they've approached the design and development of this product from that angle too.
  • wtallis 11y ago
    There's wide variation in hardware quality, but consumer-oriented stuff is a lot more likely to have thermal issues and crappy power supplies. For software, things are more uniformly bad. Almost every commercial router uses the drivers provided by the chipset vendor, and those are always bad. Even the poster child for open-source drivers (Atheros ath9k 802.11n) still had some nasty lockup bugs this year (eg. https://dev.openwrt.org/browser/trunk/package/kernel/mac80211/patches/379-ath9k-fix-DMA-stop-sequence-for-AR9003.patch?rev=45874 https://dev.openwrt.org/browser/trunk/package/kernel/mac8021...). The closed-source drivers get much less maintenance. And then the router vendors have a team of morons slap together a web interface where all the priorities are on branding, and none on actually exposing the right functionality of the underlying Linux system in a secure manner. And that's if they're even using Linux. OpenWRT makes an extremely powerful argument that the problems is the fragmentation of development instead of a single ongoing centralized project. The jury's still out on where this effort from Google will fall. They've got some people who definitely know what they're doing (eg. Avery Pennarun, though I don't know if he's involved with this). On the other hand, core networking performance and stability clearly isn't what they're emphasizing, and they appear to be using the same ath10k hardware and drivers as everyone else.
• intrasight 11y ago
  Cool. Can I flash with Tomato or DD-WRT?
• Pxtl 11y ago
  I have a new-ish Tp-Link router that's been driving me utterly batty, so I'm looking forward to Google getting into this game. Hope they develop a full line of products, like having a second device for range-boosting.
  • nathanm412 11y ago
    Just an FYI, this is a TP-Link router that is being rebranded by Google. (TP-Link TGR1900)
    • wmf 11y ago
      It looks more like a Google-designed router that is manufactured by TP-Link. Notably, the firmware is from Google.
    • Pxtl 11y ago
      Ouch. I have an Asus/Google Nexus 7 2012 that makes me suspicious how much Google software and service can overcome underlying terrible hardware.
• VikingCoder 11y ago
  Huh... Just thinking about what a smart router COULD do... What if this thing allowed you to punch holes in the firewall through the app, wherever you are? That'd be fairly nifty... And what if it had VPN built in to the router and the app? That'd be nice as well... Viewing access log files remotely? Hmmm - what if it has parental locks? Like, a whitelist of websites for THIS device (kid's tablet), but dad's phone and mom's phone can do anything... I also can't help but wonder if this thing has Google Fi BUILT IN to it. Meaning, anyone driving by on your street gets to send some packets through your router with really fast switching.... If you allow it. And if you have Google Fiber (gigabit), why wouldn't you allow it? Oh, and the other one that occurs to me... With all of those antennas... Do you think they might actually be able to estimate your radial location, relative to the device? To some amount of accuracy? Might be interesting. Probably estimate distance, too... Put them together... If I were slightly evil, I'd be thinking about designing a router that I could market to small businesses. Walk in to your Starbucks, and the guy behind the counter automatically sees your picture, and your regular orders up on the screen...
• adamrights 11y ago
  The 13 antennas and form factor is kind of cool, but after that I'd rather install OpenWrt and if going for home automation, my own server. Wonder how rootable Google will leave it.
  • Natanael_L 11y ago
    I hope it will take after Chrome OS, not Chromecast, in that regard...
• getdavidhiggins 11y ago
  Will be interesting to see if Tomato works on this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tomato_(firmware) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tomato_(firmware)
• ksmithbaylor 11y ago
  TAKE MY MONEY
• stygiansonic 11y ago
  As some others have mentioned, the hardware for this unit is made by TP-LINK: "To develop OnHub, Google partnered with network hardware maker TP-LINK. Another model, built with ASUS, is coming later this year." [0] 0. http://www.cbc.ca/news/technology/google-onhub-router-aims-to-make-home-wi-fi-easy-reliable-1.3194948 http://www.cbc.ca/news/technology/google-onhub-router-aims-t...
• mike-cardwell 11y ago
  The market for this seems very small to me. Here in the UK, 99.9% of people just plug in whatever their ISP give them. They're not going to buy some box from Google to make their Internet faster. And even if they do, there's a good chance it wasn't the quality of the WiFi that was their problem, so they're just going to be pissed off at Google for taking their money and not fixing anything.
• deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
• jshelly 11y ago
  A Google branded TP-Link router
• astrocyte 11y ago
  My biggest issue with this is that Google wants to inject a piece of hardware into my home that acts as the gateway to my data. A device through which all : > Incoming data runs through > Internal data runs through > Outgoing data runs through And then wants to be vague about what data they will be pumping to their back-end for analytics/data mining. I have had a long standing proposal for home automation and I'm curious to know, in this era of insecurity and people vacuuming up all your data, how many of the tech minded people here would be interested in a device which ensures your 'home automation' data stays in your home. This can be quite clearly achieved in hardware and by having an out-of-band oversight controller that literally will not allow certain data to exit the physical domain of your home... Cloud nonsense? It's called an application and a home automation application doesn't need to run in someone's cloud... Whose interested? I think it's about time this cloud foolishness for the sake of monetizing someone else's data in an insecure manner come to an end. Everyone loves to rant about 'disruption'... I feel its about time this data monetization cloud bananza be disrupted.
  • TeMPOraL 11y ago
    I'm very interested. The whole idea of home automation (and most of IoT) over cloud is absurd. The devices in your home should not communicate by sending packets around the entire globe. The data should never leave your internal network unless explicitly meant to (web interfaces are cool and all, and you want to have remote access). I'm actually somewhat surprised people don't seem how wrong the current model is, but I suspect it's a mix of cloud being The Hot Sexy Thing and being paid not to understand this (via business models that rely on monetizing users through cloud solution; as some of my hardware startup friends told me once after talking with the investors, hardware won't be making money, the cloud platform will). So yes, I would be very willing to help reverse this and make local network communication the default for home automation and relevant technologies.
    • x5n1 11y ago
      Google's model of how it wants computing to work is fundamentally flawed and now it's infected Microsoft. Really the only shelter is Linux, when will the ignorant masses wake up and realize this?
• electriclove 11y ago
  No Z-Wave support? That's a huge FAIL for home automation. Sooooo close Google. Add Z-Wave support and you'll have an instant winner. Make the speaker high quality (if it isn't already) and encroach on Sonos and Amazon. But without Z-Wave, you won't sell enough to make an impact.
• makeitsuckless 11y ago
  I'll try not to put this in a way that may be interpreted as "gratuitous negativity", but I stopped caring about Google branded hardware a long time ago, since the odds of it being available in many countries outside the US sometime this century are near zero.
• noodly 11y ago
  > To set up your OnHub, you’ll also need: > Google Account No, thanks. SpyHub would be more adequate name. I would reconsider it when I could put my own software on it, that would not require untrusted third-party accounts.
  • kevando 11y ago
    lol. I like your name. I wonder how ISPs will react to this.
  • eliben 11y ago
    I suppose you should stay far away from Google Fiber then, as well. And anything else done by the evil Google. Much better to keep with the good guys like Comcast. They will never, ever spy on you.
    • noodly 11y ago
      I'm outside US, so yeah I'm gonna stay far away from Google Fiber as well as from Comcast. Don't worry.
    • somedudethere 11y ago
      Thats a false dichotomy. There have always been fiber providers, its just that Google Fiber is the "sexy" one that people look to for salvation instead of locally campaigning for fiber (which has been successful in quite a number of cities across the USA).
      • pluma 11y ago
        This reminds me of how (in some parts of Europe at least) a lot of communities are trying to buy back the municipal water and power plants that were originally privatised "because privatisation benefits the economy". Turns out creating a (new) monopoly by selling all the public infrastructure to the same company isn't actually good for anyone (other than that company).
• vinceguidry 11y ago
  The wireless radios in routers deteriorate and should be replaced every two years. The ones on your device deteriorates too, but not as quickly because it's not constantly in use like a router's. I will not be buying one of these as I consider these to be infrastructure and infrastructure should be built to industry standards so that it's easily maintained by swapping components. The privacy concerns bug me, but what bugs me more is the prospect that my lifestyle might start relying on a product that the company putting is out has a nasty tendency to discontinue when it's no longer convenient to support. See: Google Reader.
  • JonahBraun 11y ago
    > The wireless radios in routers deteriorate Citation needed. What exactly do you think is deteriorating here? It's not like the antenna is oxidizing from use…
• cyanbane 11y ago
  This is one of those things that I would never use however I think is great for the majority of people out there that I know that probably have not opened up their router's interface since setting it up (years ago). Pushed (forced) updates is a good thing in some cases. An interesting thought is also what if Google starts making use of that 4gb by prepushing/caching sites that you visit daily down to the device for instantaneous retrieval. Another interesting idea is that this probably comes with a nice UI for people to see their inbound/outbound traffic for a given timespan. My guess is a lot of people (ie non Y! news readers) don't configure their current routers for this. Once they start seeing an exact number, it will be interesting to see how it compares to their ISP if it is similar to Comcast and has caps and overage fees for metered cities.
• EugeneOZ 11y ago
  site is written in AngularJS :)
• hobarrera 11y ago
  > We’re streaming and sharing in new ways our old routers were never built to handle. Meet OnHub, a new router from Google that’s built for all the ways you Wi-Fi. Honestly, this is stupidly vague. How are modern routers failing us? This just looks like a high-end router, with nothing groundbreaking.
• T3RMINATED 11y ago
  guys i work for google and our router spies on you we collaborate with the NSA who has a dedicated backdoor with the key nazer9$%*nsUSGOV
• mrmondo 11y ago
  I don't know how I would feel about Google having a device in my house that monitors all my internet traffic, I think they already know enough about me and I'm not sure I'm in a position to I trust them. Made me think of a funny comparison: I wouldn't buy a car or condom from Microsoft.
  • zadjii 11y ago
    What about a car from Google? Perhaps one that drives itself?
• arihant 11y ago
  OK, I'm trying really hard to figure out the $199 price tag. My cheap as dirt N+ router works pretty darn well connecting 12-15 devices at my home. I almost never had problems in years with it. All the smart services Google offers, work through cloud, like Cloud Print. Not through a router like Airport express. Even Android Wear now supports Wifi so having BLE isn't that attractive to me. All the smart features that can happen with BLE and Wifi combined are always better offered with phone. So I don't see home automation/IoT benefit here either. Phone is a better hub. So what's exactly the point here? The only thing I can think of is security patches from Google. But $199 is very steep for that. I know it has a bunch of smart engineering and more antennas. But I don't know anyone having connectivity problems that are related to their routers.
  • adventured 11y ago
    There's no reason to buy this device for $200. It's the equivalent of Amazon's Fire phone. It's richly priced, and does very little feature wise to justify its high price. It'll flop accordingly. $49 or $99 (max) was the correct price point. They have to beat or match routers on price (high quality routers having become dirt cheap), or otherwise provide astounding new capabilities (which this doesn't).
• zobzu 11y ago
  199 in exchange of google having another active spy system directly at your network edge, in case you run non google devices. What a privilege. Think I'll pass thanks.
• BufordTJustice 11y ago
  Just as a note, if range is really one of the selling points, I have found Mikrotik's RB951 class routers to be relatively affordable and have excellent range and features, for significantly less than OnHub ($20-80 for a good home router). OpenWRT routers with a lot of the same features, and the ability to boost range can also be sourced for even less.
  • SXX 11y ago
    Did Mikrotik stopped violate GPL already? It's was big reason to not buy any of their hardware.
• warrentr 11y ago
  Newegg says "Release Date: 08/31/2015"
• pbreit 11y ago
  Why is wifi so darn expensive? Does this thing really have $200 worth of electronics? Is it that much better than the $12 TP-links?
• onetimeusename 11y ago
  These articles about Google's past with wi-fi might be relevant. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/news/google-wifi-snooping/ http://www.huffingtonpost.com/news/google-wifi-snooping/
• pluma 11y ago
  Step 1: Get people to buy a ChromeCast to view their media Step 2: Make ChromeCast randomly vanish from WiFi Step 3: Get people to buy an OnHub to fix their WiFi Step 4: ??? Step 5: All your data
• jtemplin 11y ago
  It's surprising to see this announcement in the wake of the Alphabet restructuring. Because of privacy concerns, I suspect they'd sell many more of these under the Nest brand, than they will under the Google brand.
• revelation 11y ago
  Man, 500 comments? At the end of the day, this is a 199$ WLAN router. Frankly, normal customers don't care for routers. They certainly don't care paying for them. Most of them are probably oblivious to even owning one. The entire target market for guys looking at Android app graph visualizations of their home router network is about the size of HN.
• ericfrederich 11y ago
  If there's one thing Google doesn't know its WiFi. Stupid Chromecast cannot connect to like 95% of Hotel WiFi. For something named after a web browser I find it mind boggling that it can't display a web page for you to enter your room number in or agree to terms.
  • spinchange 11y ago
    The splash screens aren't the only problem, some hotels enforce device isolation on the network too. Some kind of travel router (or laptop) sharing the hotel's WiFi to your own little hotspot is the way to go. You probably wouldn't want your chromecast open to other guests connected directly to the hotel's wifi anyway.
• slaney 11y ago
  "From Google". Oh OK, a spying device. No thanks.
• adamkochanowicz 11y ago
  How does it–It's really fast! Yes but how can it be faster–Why is fast good? Because of all the things you do in your life. Okay, but what technology does—Circular antenna LOLz!1
  • tajano 11y ago
    It's fast because it supports the 802.11ac standard, which offers faster rates than 802.11n. The 802.11ac standard provisions for various rates, including the 1900 Mbps rate supported by this device. That's 600 Mbps over the 2.4 GHz band, plus 1,300 Mbps over the 5 GHz band. 802.11ac enables faster rates primarily by supporting wider bandwidths, more antennas, and larger symbol constellations (each symbol transmitted over the wireless channel can take on one value from a larger set of possible values, thereby conveying more information per symbol).
• jaysoncena 11y ago
  Even with all these data privacy issues, I am still interested on how it performs since 2.4ghz and 5ghz has their own 6 anntennas. This is important for me since on the country where I am living now, 1gbps internet connection is the norm.
• zanethomas 11y ago
  why would i invite google into my home?
• ketralnis 11y ago
  I had an original Google TV. They appear to have all but dropped that project, and in the process my device has become terrible to use. I don't know how it actually got worse, but it did. I bought an Apple TV to replace it and I'm reasonable happy with it. I wouldn't buy first or even second gen hardware from Google.
• finalight 11y ago
  in before "another project that google use it as a toy and then just throw it away if it fails"
• thebouv 11y ago
  Privacy issues aren't even the first thing I worry about with OnHub. What I worry about is it being another project from Google that dies and leaves me with a brick cause it doesn't update any more. Or it is so connected, that when they kill the backend services, then it is a brick.
• Too 11y ago
  What a misleading video. When was the last time you got connection issues due to your wireless router? Uninformed people are going to buy this and then plug it in to their crappy 250kbps DSL and not notice any difference at all. The video make it seem like this solves every connection problem ever, a video will never ever buffer again! I would say, based on experience, the probability of YouTube being down or overloaded while I stream a movie is higher than the risk that I loose WiFi connection in my home, and yet my router is 5+ years old and dirt cheap then.
• 1arity 11y ago
  The perspective of the phone on the desk in the hero shot of the "onhub" seems out of wack with respect to all the other objects on the desk, and the shadow of the onhub. Is that phone levitating slightly? Oh, and it's clearly a telescreen.
• EdSharkey 11y ago
  It seems like the moves by the FCC to closed source/keep proprietary the baseband firmware on routers is a move to ensure backdoors and exploits always exist on these wireless systems. So, here's what I'd like Google, you tell me if this would be possible and I might buy your hardware. Could you sell me a wifi router with an open source baseband firmware that you "own" and provide regular signed updates for to comply with the FCC rules? As for the rest of what you have to offer, no thanks - I would need to flash your firmware and run my own software on your router hardware. Thanks!
• Corrado 11y ago
  While this looks very interesting and I'm sure is great for a lot of people, I think I'll stick to my Apple Extreme base station. It has pretty good software for configuration and provides Time Machine support for my multiple OS X machines in the house. That said, I think that everyone on HN complaining about privacy and cost and how you can "just install your own firmware" is completely missing the point of the OnHub. Most people have a crappy router running insecure software and does terrible things to the internet and never gets updated. OnHub fixes all that and in a way that my Mom could actually install and use the thing. Almost no other solution (besides maybe the Apple products) would be able to cover all these bases. So, I'm happy that someone (else) is finally making good hardware with easy to use software. More power to Google and keep the good stuff coming!
• Tepix 11y ago
  "Choose a password you can remember, and share it with a friend using the Google On app." No, but no thanks. Not with Google. It's already hard to prevent people from syncing my wifi password with them as part of the Android cloud stuff.
• ksec 11y ago
  All the features and problem are solved by EERO, and solved in a much more elegant and consumer friendly way. I mean Christ, do google even understand UX?
• atarkmani 11y ago
  I could see something great coming out from OnHub once you start connecting other devices around the home thru thread mesh network http://threadgroup.org/ http://threadgroup.org/