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LG to ban residential proxies from smart TV apps
- pixl97 3mo agoI mean, why didn't they do that from the start?
- steele 3mo agoHoneypot for more logos
- akersten 3mo agois this some kind of tactical distraction from the other LG headlines this week? I thought residential proxies are already banned from SmartTV apps by virtue of practically every APK under the sun being subject to the Google Play terms of service.
- Marsymars 3mo ago> I thought residential proxies are already banned from SmartTV apps by virtue of practically every APK under the sun being subject to the Google Play terms of service. The platforms in question here are webOS and Tizen, neither of which are Android or use the Google Play Store.
- ranger_danger 3mo agoLG webOS is not Android though, it's from the old Palm/HP devices of the early 2010s. And I'm pretty sure there are still tons of play store apps with these proxy SDKs in them, advertised/consented or not.
- ssl-3 3mo agoThat only applies to the subset of TVs that use Google TV/Android TV. Not so much for the rest of them that have operating systems with names like Roku TV OS, Tizen, WebOS, and Fire TV OS. They do their own things.
- cognitiveinline 3mo agoSharing a slice of your internet in a privacy preserving way in exchange for something of value, seems fair, no?
- ryandrake 3mo agoOnly if the app provides 1. prominently-displayed, informed consent, 2. an option to opt-out without losing app functionality, or 3. joining the botnet provides some kind of actual benefit to the user, besides just money to the developer.
- cognitiveinline 3mo agoNo need of (2) and (3) - the user can choose to not install/use the app. (1) is the right fair boundary.
- ryandrake 3mo agoThose apps just shouldn't exist. I don't know how "join your users to a botnet" became some kind of legitimized monetization scheme. Ads are bad enough. What's next? "Participate in a DDOS in order to use our app?"
- NopIdoN 3mo ago"train our machine to identify traffic lights" or something
- Dylan16807 3mo agoSometimes it's botnet, sometimes it's just accessing netflix without hitting big IP range bans. If there are proxy apps that only do the latter sort of work than I'm actually in favor of them existing and being widespread.
- account42 3mo agoExactly. If there is a legitimate use case for sharing your connection it should be a separate apps users intentionally install.
- xena 3mo agoThis is the best news I've heard all week. Finally good news for once!
- glimshe 3mo agoMy TV doesn't know my router's wi-fi password.
- aussieguy1234 3mo agoThis is the best approach
- walrus01 3mo agoI've said it before on HN a long time ago but I'll repeat myself, I have about a thousand times more confidence that Sony and/or Microsoft will keep their PS5 and Xbox operating systems secure and not crapped up with stuff like this, than I do that random TV manufacturers will not result in a cybersecurity or privacy disaster. Yeah, the PS and Xbox OSes show you ads, and they have telemetry. But both companies also have an extremely important core functional need of keeping them secure, because possible fuckery with the OS could result in game piracy/DRM bypasses and a direct threat to their revenue models.
- thewebguyd 3mo agoThe gaming consoles aren't subsidized via the data collection like smart TVs are via content recognition (selling everything on your screen to advertisers). Consoles are sometimes sold at a loss, but the revenue model is different. Playstation plus/game pass, a cut of game sales and microtransactions, exclusives, and accessories. No one should ever connect their TV to the internet. There just isn't any reason to, get access to your streaming apps another way.
- amazingman 3mo agoHope you don't have any open WiFi networks nearby. IMO it's better to put it on one of your networks and isolate it from the internet and other devices.
- MrDrMcCoy 3mo agoIf it connects to another network, it's somebody else's problem. Unless of course, it has a built in webcam or microphone.
- jocelyner 3mo ago[dead]
- s1ncere 3mo agoStop hooking up your LG tv to any network
- CivBase 3mo agoStop buying LG TVs.
- smcleod 3mo agoUnfortunately they make arguably the best OLEDs and webOS is pretty decent to use (especially compared to the terrible OS that Samsung and Sony run). I think the best thing people can do is update their firmware then disconnect it from the internet. Using an AppleTV or similar provides a better experience than any TVs built in apps anyway.
- jedberg 3mo agoI haven’t looked recently but last I checked Samsung made the best panels. Has that changed recently?
- smcleod 3mo agoTheir panels are often over-saturated with that fake HDR like look, similar to their phones.
- ahartmetz 3mo agoMost screens come with "showroom settings" out of the box. You need to configure them to something more neutral once and then it's fine.
- smcleod 3mo agoI'm aware of that setting, but this is the Samsung baseline. The panels they export for OEMs / other manufacturers don't seem to have the same hyper saturation. Even just standing next to someone using a Samsung phone or tablet you can often spot it straight away we know you what to look for.
- 4rt 3mo agolg's had a good run of being a monitor, their software was a bit shit but the hardware supported e-arc etc. i've got 2 expensive lg tvs and i bought them because you don't need to use their remote, it just turns on and shows the picture.
- jchw 3mo agoNone of my TVs are connected to the Internet. That said, I could really do with a better open source fullscreen UI, especially since I mainly just want a web browser that works good. I'm just using KDE Plasma with a custom daemon to control the TV power state over an HDMI CEC adapter plus an old K830 keyboard. I'm, frankly, a bit annoyed by this whole thing; I'd rather have USB adapter RF wireless because it is simpler to deal with vs Bluetooth, but actually I can't even find other Bluetooth keyboards that are as compelling as this K830 and worse yet, they don't even make the K830 anymore. I don't really mind KDE Plasma with just some minor customizations but I don't really like any of the options like Kodi. Maybe Plasma BigScreen will eventually be what I want for that. And finally, HDMI CEC is a pain in the ass. For reasons, I actually use an adapter to get CEC support on a normal PC platform, because most PC HDMI ports can't do it. And also, it's just a bizarre and overly complicated thing. I have it working reliably, but it took some time to iron out all the kinks, particularly because my TV responds quite differently depending on how recently it was powered off. I really just want a big monitor and to basically just use DPMS... Like a computer does, but large computer monitors tend to be expensive and don't always have remote controls, which admittedly are handy.
- saint_yossarian 3mo agoK400+ user here, you might be interested in the upcoming Framework Wireless Touchpad Keyboard.
- JoshTriplett 3mo ago> integrated touchpad that you don’t hate. > no mouse buttons Failed at the first sentence.
- account42 3mo agoMind sharing what HDMI CEC adapter you use? As for remote control - why would you want one for the monitor. For the PC I'm using an Air Mouse which is just a remote gyro-based mouse with keyboard buttons with a driverless USB dongle that acts like any other USB HID. I also have a miniature no-name wireless keyboard with a touchpad but rarely need to use it.
- symfoniq 3mo agoThis is madness. Only LG themselves should be able to have this kind of invasive control over your television.
- spudlyo 3mo agoOne day there will be a decent TV that can be relatively easily hacked to run on open source firmware. My wife and I are moving soon, and I'm happy we've decided not to have a TV in the new place. Neither of our current LG TV's have ever been connected to the network, but it will feel good when I sell or give the cursed things away.
- ram_rattle 3mo agoApparently all these vendors did nothing to prevent this, a nice article from spur intelligence https://www.cbsnews.com/newyork/video/how-smart-tvs-may-be-sharing-your-data/ https://www.cbsnews.com/newyork/video/how-smart-tvs-may-be-s...
- boredatoms 3mo agoTell your relatives, buy an apple tv
- amlib 3mo agoI don't think apple makes actual tvs
- boredatoms 3mo agoWhats your point exactly? Are you purposely being obtuse? Plenty of uninformed people let their tv on the network, they shouldn’t. A separate box should instead. Tell me I'm wrong?
- mDyJzDPmBdG 3mo agoYou are wrong. Just idea of having to use to remotes is unacceptable level of friction to most people. We should not hail separate device as excuse to allow this shitty behaviour by TV manufacturers. I guess the lawmakers won't move a finger and we have wait for consumer network equipment manufacturers[1] to advertise build in pi-hole and ACR/TV ads blocking on firewall level. [1] Let's just forget for a second they are famous for low quality software full of security bugs
- boredatoms 3mo agoOk I’m convinced, we rally at dawn?
- 0xblinq 3mo agoI'm very worried with all this bullshit around TVs. I've been running the same Samsung UE40C6530 since 2010. It's 16 f'ng years and the thing works flawlessly like the first day. No other electronic device in my life worked so well, during so long. But I'm about to move to a new home, and it feels like it's about time to get something more modern, at least a 4k TV. But I'm honestly totally lost at what to buy. I do not want a "Smart" tv that's slow to start, bloated with crap, installing updates every day, and maybe even spying on me. I want a plain, old, normal TV. If possible without Android or any advanced operating system. Just a TV. I'll plug external content myself, either via a Chromecast device, or something similar. I don't want my TV to be a full fledged computer. Is there such a thing? What would you buy nowadays? It seems you're forced to get yet another computer to maintain and be worried about whatever you buy.
- Fantosism 3mo agoYou buy a commercial panel used for advertising/signage that's 3x the price of the "Smart" consumer panels.
- thewebguyd 3mo agothe smart consumer panels would also be more expensive if they weren't subsidized via the spyware.
- kaelwd 3mo agoAre there even any OLED commercial panels with HDR and VRR?
- Fantosism 3mo agoGenerally no, given that the expectation for commercial panels is to run 24/7.
- jdmarble 3mo agoIf you’re fine with “okay” picture quality, try a Sceptre. You can get them on Amazon. I’ve had good success with them. I heard you can still disable some smart features on Sony TVs.
- 12_throw_away 3mo ago42% of the apps on LG's platform have these quasi-malware SDKs in them? Seems kinda bad, whether it's due to negligence or just pure incompetence? You'd think there might be legal consequences for a corporation that lets their app store turn into a malware delivery system?
- drnick1 3mo agoIt's not "quasi-malware," it is malware.
- b3orn 3mo ago15 years ago people would've called it spyware.
- TeMPOraL 3mo ago20 years ago people would've called it a trojan horse. But then, by standards of two decades ago, every website that cannot legally avoid showing a GDPR popup would be classified as malware. As it should be today. Alas, standards have changed.
- yodon 3mo agoIf other non-Android-based TV manufacturers follow, this will have a much bigger impact on the spread (and cost) of scraping than either Anubis or Cloudflare.
- kh2engab 3mo agoIs there a (technical) difference between a residential proxy and bot network node?
- Nursie 3mo agoA figleaf of "We gave ourselves permission on page 247, paragraph 3 of your user agreement"
- markasoftware 3mo agoResidential proxies operated by "legitimate" providers can only open TCP connections, which more or less rules out DDoS attacks, which seem to be the most common use of botnets. (And all tcp connections typically have to go through the proxy providers datacenter first to get through NAT, which effectively limits the total amount of traffic/connections you can make)
- account42 3mo agoTCP only does NOT rule out DDoS, it just limits it to a subset of potentially less effective methods. All DDoS means is that you get a bunch of machines hammering a system.
- charcircuit 3mo agoAs they are both distributed systems there will be some inherit underlying similarities, but a botnet has things like antidebug, stealth, privilege escalation, etc. They typically include attack payloads or spying features like taking screenshots, keyloggers and stealing account information. Additionally they may include further ways of spreading to other computers such as messaging people on Discord or using other vulnerabilities. They might also try and take exclusive control of the device by patching security vulnerabilities and uninstalling other malware. Well unless they sell dropper capabilities letting other people deploy malware to the machine.
- deleted 3mo ago[deleted]
- inigyou 3mo ago
- charcircuit 3mo ago>“The risk is amplified when consent comes from individuals within the household who use the device but shouldn’t give consent, such as minors.” Note that the same applies for the other privacy invasive webos features. But since that doesn't harm big tech's monopoly they will conveniently avoid mentioning it.
- BrenBarn 3mo agoThe messed up thing is that we need to rely on LG to stop allowing it rather than just making it illegal.
- inigyou 3mo agoWhy would it be illegal though? What law?
- BrenBarn 3mo agoWhy not just ban all apps that "allow unknown third-parties to route their Internet traffic through a user’s TV"? (Or similarly for other devices.)
- inigyou 3mo agoSo basically ban VPN servers that are also TVs? Very specific law. If you don't limit it to TVs, then you just mandated KYC on all VPN services
- BrenBarn 2mo agoVPN services aren't generally running out of someone's house, and I think I might be okay with saying they cannot be. I think VPNs are a legitimate service but that doesn't necessarily mean we need to let everyone run one at home. The VPN may not need to know their customer but the VPN provider itself may need to register as a business, and then be held accountable if their service is being used to run botnets.
- iugtmkbdfil834 3mo agoHeh. tinfoil hat on I always suspected that the AI gods would manifest themselves through TV. Hat stays on from this point on. It is not like LG suddenly found it in their heart to stop the money flow from the offending apps. Not when combined with recent security incident at frontier labs and current admin freaking out over open models.
- jmward01 3mo agoHonestly I have nothing but anger for all parties involved here. We need to treat any appliance as hostile. Vote for people that will stop this stuff. Don't buy it. This is digital assault and should be treated as such. If any of the HN crowd reading this are tech reviewers, make privacy and security a first class feature of the things you review. If it has a network connection then ask hard questions of the manufacturer about how they are managing that massive responsibility and what promises they have about how they will, and won't, use it. Ask what qualifies a 'trusted partner' and get a list of them so you can dig into them and report on how much those partners can or can't be trusted. I really don't care how bright the screen is if this type of stuff happens. I'd rather watch nothing.
- gblargg 3mo agoSo does this mean that using a proxy will cause all of the "smart" features to stop working? Win-win.
- jbverschoor 3mo agoThanks for the heads up, LG. Those cheap/discount tv brands make soo much sense these days
- BetterThanSober 3mo agoStop buying "smart" TV
- JoshTriplett 3mo agoI'd love to. Last I checked, nobody makes large-format high-quality tandem OLEDs that aren't smart TVs.
- ifh-hn 3mo agoMy question is how would a user know their TV is being used like this? Also this is the reason you down download random crap onto your devices. I have an LG that is connected on its own network with bare minimal apps (netflix, prime, etc) because it's too convenient for my family. I actually bought it because it didn't display ads on the home screen like the other smart TVs I'd researched. Thought LG was the lesser evil, turns out they're all a bad as each other.
- iso1631 3mo agoOnly reason LG doesn't have adverts is by forcing it to use a pihole, but even that needs updating -- recently they've managed to push things through and I need to do another investigation to see what needs blocking. Trouble is I only see them when I'm not in the mood to be working, and then forget about them
- regexorcist 3mo agoThey hardcode DNS servers into the TV. You need a firewall in front of the pihole intercepting that traffic, I use OpenWrt.
- piguin 3mo agoGiven how cheap screens are, I'm puzzled as to why keeping a smart-ass TV is worth this effort?
- regexorcist 3mo agoI have that setup for my home network regardless. And my TV is the original C1 OLED, nothing compared when I got it. I wouldn't buy LG today.
- inigyou 3mo agoBecause all TVs are like this. There are no big non-smart screens on the market.
- 3mo ago
- atoav 3mo agoLG is on my blacklist. That means I won't buy LG products and in my job actively fight against buying products from them. And they put themselves onto that lost with their behavior.
- awllau 3mo agoWhat happens to the copies already installed? Spur says these SDKs can keep running after the app is closed and only stop when the user deletes the app or opts out. LG says developers must remove them or have their apps suspended, but the article doesn’t say whether that disables existing installs. If it doesn’t, LG needs to tell affected users which apps to remove. Does webOS have any way to kill an installed app remotely?
- mastazi 3mo agoI am afraid that my dumb TV, which I've been holding onto for many years, might be on its last leg. I remember seeing privacy guides for smart TVs over the years, does anyone know a place with up to date info? Most 55inch monitors are now "smart" sadly, so are most "digital signage" products. So there is no longer a way to get a true dumb panel at least over 50 inch EDIT I am in Australia, there might be products that are available elsewhere but cannot be bought/shipped here
- tikkabhuna 3mo agoI share your disappointment. I just want a screen with a tuner. If I want any “apps”, I’ll pair it with another device which will probably be an Apple TV. I’m starting to wonder if a monitor and a soundbar with an external tuner is possible.
- crote 3mo agoI don't even care about the tuner part. If I ever get the desire to watch linear TV again, I'll just get an IPTV subscription. A decent-ish TV-sized panel with at least a single HDMI input really is all I need.
- qq66 3mo agoIf you don't ever give your network credentials to the Smart TV you've closed off 99% of the attack surface.
- Tor3 3mo agoFrom previous discussions there are apparently TVs which will connect to any open network nearby, if it can find one. I got myself a normal, non-smart Philips 49" TV some ten years ago, it's good, but I don't expect to be able to find something similar anymore.
- kyriakos 3mo agoWho runs open WiFi networks in 2026?
- miki123211 3mo ago> researchers found that more than 42 percent of games and other apps available for download on LG’s webOS store allow unknown third-parties to route their Internet traffic through a user’s TV. Eh, so even sources as reliable as Krebs on Security sometimes engage in bad statistics. This is a statistic that feels significant, but actually tells you nothing. For all we know, "42% of all apps" can mean a single spray-and-pray campaign with a few hundred downloads in total, with the vast majority of users only downloading apps from the top10, which are all unaffected. Or maybe the problem is widespread across the entire distribution of app downloads, with the majority of users having at least one infected app. We don't know either way, because "42% of apps" is a completely meaningless statistic.
- signalbright 3mo agoIt's absolutely crazy that they were accepted in the first place
- Utilera 3mo agoI can imagine someone choosing "no ads" without realizing they just agreed to let strangers route traffic through their home IP indefinitely
- inigyou 3mo agoWhy would 99% of people care, even if they knew what that meant?
- aucisson_masque 3mo ago[dead]
- xacky 3mo agoThey should be banned from all app stores and added to anti virus definitions. Many smaller sites have already shutdown due to being DDOSed. Even Wikipedia gets attacked by them.
- sourav276 3mo ago[flagged]
- deleted 3mo ago[deleted]
- lorreyfum 3mo agoLG is malware and spyware.
- Farfignoggen 3mo ago"DO NOT BUY: LG’s Spyware TVs, Monitors, and Wiretapping Concerns Gamers Nexus" - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q9uefFYe6bM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q9uefFYe6bM
- mancerayder 3mo agoAfter some research I went with a Sony Bravia. The screen is ridiculously reflective which is unusable next to any window at certain angles, and it wasn't the cheapest, but after some research since it uses that Google TV crap and has no splash screens, I could keep WiFi off on it and use my Apple TV. TCL and now LG are to be fully avoided, Samsung isn't to be trusted (a future update if you allow it can lead to what happened here with LG). Samsung probably has the best hardware, but too bad. If we don't vote with our wallets the enshittification of everything tech will march over and trample us that much faster.
- deleted 3mo ago[deleted]
- kittikitti 3mo agoAn angle that's often not explored is that companies like BrightData that install spyware on your smart gadgets are based in Tel Aviv, Israel. It's not unreasonable to assume that these Israeli cybersecurity firms are also sending data to the Israeli military. While everyone is complaining about AI scrapers and bots, they aren't even looking at the main culprits.
- inigyou 3mo agoResidential proxies aren't spyware. I mean, they could be both, but they'd be two separate things.
- xnx 3mo agoI'm against undisclosed proxies, but I would pick pay-by-residential-proxy over pay-by-ads every time.
- beej71 3mo agoThey just straight up ask people to be a proxy? And people say yes? SMH...
- jacobgold 3mo agoUS residential proxies are the bane of the internet. They're the major source of social media manipulation and spam. Services can dramatically reduce abuse by blocking entire IP ranges based on country of origin, organization, or type (hosting providers). But a company can't block US residential IPs if it would also cut off many of their real customers. The US government (probably the NSA) should be cracking down hard on US residential proxy networks. They're a genuine national security threat, actual data/identity loss of American citizens, act as infra for foreign covert influence campaigns, botnets used in hacking/DoS attacks, etc. Major US ISPs (Comcast, AT&T) should detect clearly suspicious activity coming from customer IPs and warn them to scan their computers, check their TV apps, and find whatever is turning their internet into a proxy. It's very bad for the customers too (slows things down, gets their IP banned, etc)
- wyldberry 3mo agoI'm glad someone else is saying this. Entire companies exist (that do a great job at it) that primarily surface this information in the form of "threat intelligence" for companies to make risk decisions based off of.
- dpoloncsak 3mo ago> Major US ISPs (Comcast, AT&T) should detect clearly suspicious activity coming from customer IPs and warn them to scan their computers, check their TV apps, and find whatever is turning their internet into a proxy. It's very bad for the customers too (slows things down, gets their IP banned, etc) Is there incentive for them to? If anything, you might be paying extra for the data use and not even know it, right? They would lose money
- jacobgold 3mo agoIt may actually be costing them money through higher peak usage (requiring more capacity). I'm not sure but either way the government should have a role if market incentives aren't sufficient.
- 3mo ago
- jhallenworld 3mo agoI have a new LG TV, holy moly what a terrible user experience. Out of the box it requires you to create an LG account. PITA, but OK. Except I was supposed to set the location first, instead I set it after. So now you have the problem that you can not log into LG.com using my own email (even from a web browser) because it says: "incorrect country". I contacted their tech support about this, the only fix is to switch back the country code on the TV (to US_Other), then delete the account from there, then set country code to US, then create it again. OMG. I guess there is no fix if TV breaks before you do this..or if you forget what the original country code was. You are then forced to use a different email for any future LG product. I notice that all LG smart products use the same phone app, BTW. Also, I bought an LG soundbar to go along with it. You would think they would work well together. The soundbar sounds fine, but the synchronization drifts over time. I've tried optical, LG's enhanced optical (allows you to control the volume) and HDMI eARC. In theory optical in PCM mode works better, but then you give up the volume control. Why should an end customer know about any of this? Lip sync is a simple problem to solve (timing pulses and code slipping will always work) and they have failed at it. Also: their remote sucks (compared with Roku). Anyway, so no respect for LG.
- nostrademons 3mo agoI had an LG TV for work because my team developed some of the software on it. Similar experience - it got progressively worse (including the software my team developed, which in true Google fashion was deprioritized, discontinued, team laid off, and left to rot without anyone bothering to tell LG that it was no longer being maintained) until by the time I left that team it was nearly unusable as a "smart" TV and all I did was run Netflix and Disney+ on it. Then my kid broke it with a well-placed whack of a plastic sword. Would definitely not buy with my own money. I actually really like a lot of LG's other appliances (we have a washer, dryer, and dual ovens from them that are great), but for a TV, I just want a dumb screen that I can hook an HDMI cable to and run off a computer.
- mschuster91 3mo ago> but for a TV, I just want a dumb screen that I can hook an HDMI cable to and run off a computer. Look into Digital Signage displays. You pay a brickload more money but get (much) higher quality in return.
- n1ivih 3mo agoI have a Samsung odyssey ultrawide. All I want to do is have it display what I plug into the inputs. But I constantly have to approve new terms of service, install updates and worst of all switching inputs takes forever and often leads me to some tv guide like feature where I can stream a bunch of media. Lg, Samsung… I mean are there any companies that make a non-smart monitor? This monitor I have was highly recommended on many review sites. Are we just accepting the fact that we don’t truly get to own or control these devices? It’s so frustrating.
- TitaRusell 3mo agoHa yeah just last night I had Samsung television make me agree to some new terms. Its bloody annoying when you are watching Netflix. And ofcourse they actually want you to read it.
- gigel82 3mo agoBecause... they want to corner that market opportunity themselves at the system level? I doubt it'd be anything less given LG (and other smart TV manufacturers)'s track record.
- madhu_ghalame 3mo ago[dead]
- br0ceph 3mo ago2026, the year of the trojaned pacman app, lmfao puck, man; how are ppl so stupid
- boomskats 3mo agoSome of you might want to check out throwaway96/dejavuln-autoroot or the older throwaway96/faultmanager-autoroot, www.webosbrew.org/rooting and cani.rootmy.tv. Looks like it's patchy for the very latest models, but you might find the literature useful anyway.
- sureshpaulchamy 3mo agoI face a different issue on LG TV, Every time i turn off the Live Plus option, but it got enabled again on its own without being asked. no consent at all. Has anyone else seen this ?
- SlightlyLeftPad 3mo agoYes. Mine isn’t even connected to the internet. It triggers rage when shortly thereafter a full screen page takes over during the final minutes of a world cup game telling me that I need to connect to the internet to use voice control. I watch using apple tv so that turns into a panic to find the lg remote I never use to skip this menu.
- sureshpaulchamy 3mo agothats weird i thought of getting Apple tv will solve this issue, looks like it bring new issues