9 ms·

From burner phones to decks of cards: NYC teens adjusting to the smartphone ban

284 points by geox 1y ago

duxup 1y ago
There's no good description of the actual ban here? At my kid's school phones and all other electronics can't be visible when class starts or ends or the teacher takes it. I'm ok with that. Some of the more universal bans I don't get, we should be educating kids on responsible usage, total ban seems like just pushing bad choices down the road.
- spcebar 1y ago
  They describe the ban in the article. Kids put their phone in pouches at the start of school and get them back at the end of the day. They say they're magnetic, I assume that describes some kind of lock or means to prevent use.
  - rovr138 1y ago
    Maybe like the magnetic tags they use at stores.
- cambrianentropy 1y ago
  https://www.governor.ny.gov/programs/eliminating-distractions-new-york-schools https://www.governor.ny.gov/programs/eliminating-distraction...
- JumpCrisscross 1y ago
  > we should be educating kids on responsible usage, total ban seems like just pushing bad choices down the road Even if this is all it’s doing, that’s a win. Most adults haven’t figured out responsible usage. Down the road, their brains will be more developed. And down the road, the average among them won’t need to learn at the rate we need them to now.
  - duxup 1y ago
    I feel like your description conflicts. If adults can't manage themselves with phones then down the road makes no difference. I feel like experience builds good choices and total bans are like just putting blinders on. My oldest had supervised access to a phone / tablet for a while, when he downloads a game now he takes the game to gauge how much it relies on micro-transactions and so on and passes on it immediately if he thinks it is bad. That only comes form experience, and probably better to learn it when a parent can talk to him about these things rather than later in life when he is blowing his own money.
    - JumpCrisscross 1y ago
      > If adults can't manage themselves with phones then down the road makes no difference Adults today can’t manage. That’s a function of the people and context. Adults tomorrow might. Perhaps because we regulate it. Perhaps because they’re exposed to it more carefully. > probably better to learn it when a parent can talk to him about these things rather than later in life when he is blowing his own money None of this requires he have a smartphone at school.
- Aurornis 1y ago
  > There's no good description of the actual ban here? > At my kid's school phones and all other electronics can't be visible when class starts or ends or the teacher takes it. All of these articles are so confusing to me because they act like banning smartphones in class is something new. Is this actually new? Were there schools where students weren’t getting in trouble for using phones during class? The closest thing I’ve seen to an actual ban is a rule that phones must be kept in lockers during the entire school day, including between classes and during lunch. I could see this requiring adjustment for kids. However I’m baffled by the articles that imply smartphones were not banned from use during class. Was this really ever a thing?
  - duxup 1y ago
    My kid's middle school made national news for their ban for several weeks. Really it wasn't a new thing at all, just enforced appropriately. Teacher sees electronics (of any kind) and it's taken and you pick it up at the office. Multiple violations and parents get to meet with the staff to talk about it (that's the real kicker). Yeah it wasn't new, for some reason these articles just never mention that it's really about a "new" policy that means actual enforcement.
    - Aurornis 1y ago
      > Yeah it wasn't new, for some reason these articles just never mention that it's really about a "new" policy that means actual enforcement This is confirming some of my suspicion. Smartphone ban articles are trending, so journalists feel pressured to write something about it. They all around to schools and learn about their smartphone policy, then write that as a new-ish thing so they can jump on the trend.
      - cooperadymas 1y ago
        The first sentence of the article: > New York City students are one week into the statewide phone ban. Yes, this is a new thing.
        1y ago
- majorchord 1y ago
  Apparently even suggesting that the post title needs a location in it gets you downvoted.
  - immibis 1y ago
    Unless that location is Israel, in which case it gets dead. (This post has nothing to do with Israel, dear reader who didn't click on it)
- cooperadymas 1y ago
  > There's no good description of the actual ban here? The first sentence of this article links to information about the ban itself. Later in the article it summarizes how it is enforced. > Schools have rolled out a range of strategies, with most schools either collecting phones at arrival and storing them in lockers or distributing magnetic pouches that have to be locked and unlocked at the beginning and end of the day.
  - Johnny555 1y ago
    >The first sentence of this article links to information about the ban itself. That article gives little information that's not in the original one, even clicking through to the article linked in that linked article gives scant details. Here's the NYC public school district policy: https://www.schools.nyc.gov/about-us/policies/cell-phone-and-electronic-device-policy https://www.schools.nyc.gov/about-us/policies/cell-phone-and... This is what's covered under the ban: A personal internet-enabled device is any electronic device not issued by a school or NYCPS program that can connect to the internet, allowing the user to access content online. Examples of these personal devices include: * Communication Devices, such as cell phones, smartphones, and smartwatches. * Computing Devices, such as laptops, tablets, and iPads. * Portable music and entertainment systems, such as MP3 players and game consoles.
    - CTOSian 1y ago
      Smart kids then could use retro PDAs like Palm :)
- SchemaLoad 1y ago
  Responsible usage is using them after school to arange getting home if needed. There's no good reason to use a phone during school. Anyone you need to contact during that time is physically present.
- JuniperMesos 1y ago
  When I was in high school (shortly before smartphones became widely available, but when feature phones definitely were), it was explicitly against the rules to use a cell phone in class. I believe that similar small electronic devices like iPods were also banned. The concern was actively using phones or other devices during class, rather than simply having them in your backpack or pocket, and also that if your cell phone ringer went off during class that would be distracting (which is in fact true, that is distracting). My recollection is that some kids did try to violate the rule by surreptitiously texting during class, and did sometimes get their phones confiscated by a teacher; and also some people had their phones confiscated because they got a call or text and it went off in class, since they forgot to turn it off or silence the ringer (although sometimes kids were just asked to turn off the phone and didn't have it confiscated). I personally was not particularly inclined towards rulebreaking (or was smart enough to only break rules I was sure I could get away with), and I wasn't the kind of social butterfly in high school who was constantly texting people anyway, so my own phone never got confiscated. Merely having phones (or other electronic devices) on your person during the school day and using them on campus but outside of class times (e.g. during lunch) wasn't against the rules. I specifically remember playing a lot of the Nokia phone snake game on my phone to pass time during lunch or while waiting to get picked up after school - because it was the only game on the phone that was even mildly interesting. I think if my school had tried to ban having a cell phone on your person at all during the school day, I would've attempted to evade the ban by hiding it more deeply in my backpack or something. And if there were literal bag inspections in order to mitigate this, I would've been genuinely pretty angry about that and tried to think of something else I could do to evade the ban. Being compelled to put your phone in a locked box during the school day, rather than just silence it and not use it during class, seems very draconian to me.
- majorchord 1y ago
  In a high-trust society where people typically follow the rules, yes I think that's a good idea. But unfortunately the West lives in a world where kids see limitations as a challenge to try to push it as far as possible, combined with parents who simply don't care at all, so this is why we can't have nice things.
spcebar 1y ago
Nature is healing. Glad to see this. I was in high school when smart phones really became widespread, and was personally still on a flip phone most of the way through. I think there's something healthy to the boredom the kids describe, which ultimately leads to socialization and introspection. 24/7 social media seems like a very destructive portal to isolation, and having a reprieve from that, if only a few hours a day, seems like a great thing.
- naasking 1y ago
  > I think there's something healthy to the boredom the kids describe, which ultimately leads to socialization and introspection. This. People these days talk about boredom like it's the worst thing ever.
- rTX5CMRXIfFG 1y ago
  I would not have learned to play the guitar if I had a smartphone then, or if the internet was any faster than a dial-up. Now I have an outlet to make something beautiful out of my loneliness whenever it strikes.
  - flir 1y ago
    Internet ruined me for anything long-form. I'm old enough to remember the Before Times, but a lot of people aren't.
    - ghaff 1y ago
      I used to read books voraciously and, while I do still read books, it's a pretty small number compared to what I used to do. I've been trying to pare my bookshelves of books I'm never realistically going to reread or read.
      - bbreier 1y ago
        Funny enough, I've had the opposite experience. Easy access to books and reviews has me reading conservatively 10x as much as I did a decade ago
ranger_danger 1y ago
What ban where? Not everyone wants to read an article to even find out the location they are talking about or if this is relevant to them... otherwise what's the point of titles and headlines? We can write much better post titles than this.
- rovr138 1y ago
  It's in the article. Come on people, read. > Schools have rolled out a range of strategies, with most schools either collecting phones at arrival and storing them in lockers or distributing magnetic pouches that have to be locked and unlocked at the beginning and end of the day.
  - JumpCrisscross 1y ago
    To be fair, the title has been editorialized. From the guidelines: “…please use the original title, unless it is misleading or linkbait; don't editorialize.” (I’ve flagged. Happy to unflag once title is fixed.) https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
  - ranger_danger 1y ago
    Yes I understand it's in the article, but that wasn't my point. People from all over the world read this site and many won't click on articles they aren't sure are relevant to them... why can't we put even the location of the story in the title? Is that too much to ask?
    - rovr138 1y ago
      I don't think the relevant part is where there's a smartphone ban. It's that teens are adjusting to the ban on their phones. That even if they're always on them, they can actually disconnect and adjust to it.
      - ranger_danger 1y ago
        I don't presume to know people's reasons for wanting to read a story or not... I just think we should at least put the applicable location in the title.
Simulacra 1y ago
I like this, phones have become too severe of a distraction throughout the school day, especially in lessons. I don't mind if students have their phone at lunchtime, or outside of the academic time, but allowing them to have their phones in class has just been ruinous.
softwaredoug 1y ago
When our kids learned about substance abuse, they talk about teenage brains being in a critical period. If they get addicted to a substance, while their brain is developing, the addiction runs deeper than if they were an adult. It's a much bigger challenge to break free of the addiction.
trentnix 1y ago
Texas banned phones in schools as well. A local school administrator told me “in the high school, the lunch room is now loud with talking and laughter!” There are still parents that complain. Turns out they are as addicted to texting with their kids all day as their kids are addicted to the same. Regardless, it’s great to see that the ban has seemingly nudged things in a healthier direction. Its a failure of leadership that schools needed a statewide ban to make such an obviously positive change.
- softwaredoug 1y ago
  Phones might be as much a symptom as a cause The related issue is parents are overly protective of teens and don't give them enough independence. You see this in a lot of different ways from parents wanting to text their kids, to only letting kids do highly managed structured activities, to treating teens as their best friends, to helicopter parenting protecting kids from all adversity, etc etc And a similar thing happens not just with parents, but society, there are not a lot of places teens can just hang out. A lot of fun things teens would do increasingly ban minors. If you want teens off devices, you need to give them alternatives
  - soupfordummies 1y ago
    There's also the symptom that almost our entire society is addicted to staring at their phones for at least 4 hours a day. Go literally ANYWHERE and just look at the people around you if you don't think so.
    - softwaredoug 1y ago
      The counter to phone is dog. My dog stares up at someone until they acknowledge him. Then I end up talking to the person. And everyone has a nice interaction. Usually they get a nice serotonin bump.
    - rkomorn 1y ago
      Yeah. As someone who spends way too much time on their phone... I'm pretty sure that I have access to all kinds of alternatives, and that I have the agency necessary to getting off my phone. I'm pretty sure there's an awful lot more to it.
orionsbelt 1y ago
Sounds delightful. Now do it for adults. - an adult phone addict
- wmeredith 1y ago
  iPhone dumbphone https://stopa.io/post/297 https://stopa.io/post/297
- j-bos 1y ago
  Adults need to be adults and manage themselves, with or without help. Otherwise they're children.
  - SchemaLoad 1y ago
    What we really need is regulation of the tech companies driving the addiction. We've long since discovered that megacorps engineering addiction are more powerful than individuals ability to resist.
  - lanfeust6 1y ago
    Adding to this, I never understood why it's considered so addictive. Smartphones are banal and frustrating to me. However, I'm often on my personal laptop. I suspect there is something to the refrain that phones are a crutch in those cases where our range of actions is constrained. Through habit they then reflexively take over in other contexts.
    - j-bos 1y ago
      This seems like reasobable mechanism, also matches what I saw of older generations developing parasocial relationships with soap operas, often started after being bedridden for some weeks.
MisterTea 1y ago
Excellent news. Though what bothers me is all the high schools mentioned are the top prestigious ones you had to apply to, not zoned. Brooklyn Tech, Gramercy Arts, Bronx Science, I'm surprised no comments from Stuyvesant students. > Alia Soliman, a senior at Bronx Science, said cards “are making a big comeback.” She said kids are playing poker when they’re done with their work in some classes. Ha! When I was in NYC high school in the 90s we were not allowed to have playing cards or dominoes. The staff would confiscate them because it was believed to encourage gambling. Quite amusing that now they are the saving a generation of kids from mindless scrolling.
- HPsquared 1y ago
  They still could encourage gambling, but someone somewhere judged it's the lesser of two evils.
  - stronglikedan 1y ago
    Anything could encourage gambling to a person who has a penchant for gambling. Cards and dominoes are no different than anything else that can be bet on, which is pretty much everything.
    - HPsquared 1y ago
      Yeah indeed, phones have many games of chance also.
  - InitialLastName 1y ago
    Among other things, lots of those kids are probably using their phones to gamble way more money than they'll ever lose playing poker with their friends. Playing poker with friends is at worst zero-sum with limited downside; your friends will probably cut you off when you run out of money and the money stays in your little pool. Betting sports against a faceless profit-maximizing corporation is negative-sum and if it turns into a problem for they're happy to raise your minimum and encourage dumber bets.
  - samus 1y ago
teekert 1y ago
Our school started this year: Heard one kid says: "What am I supposed to do in the breaks!!" OMG. But, the kids are playing games, talking to each other. Learning viral skills for the workplace all while relaxing. Winwinwin.
- Simulacra 1y ago
  We played chess in school
  - xattt 1y ago
    I went to a smaller school in a large school system, and our chess club was one of our school’s only “competitive” teams. That, and the annual Avogadro competitions.
rickydroll 1y ago
Somebody should introduce these kids to Meshtastic. The Lily T-Deck series features a built-in keyboard and screen, eliminating the need for a phone. I'm sure someone bright could put a repeater up in a place administrators would never find to cover the entire school.
unglaublich 1y ago
Lovely news.
tootie 1y ago
[flagged]
- spiderice 1y ago
  "Louder lunchroom" is a measurable outcome. So is kids playing Poker
  - lmm 1y ago
    Was it measured before and after? Or did they take a couple of anecdotes (from people with a vested interest, at that) as fact?
- kelnos 1y ago
  The article is full of accounts of positive, measurable outcomes, that are already happening.
  - tootie 1y ago
    Outcomes meaning test scores, behavior, mental health. I have two kids in NYC high schools including at least one of the schools they were canvassing at. They have not observed any changes. My oldest used to use her phone for schoolwork during the day pretty frequently and now she can't, so homework is taking longer.
aaomidi 1y ago
A single school shooting is going to reverse this.
- pessimizer 1y ago
  Yes, we'll miss getting to listen to recordings of children being murdered while the police fail to go in.
  - ragnot 1y ago
    It's more that parents are afraid of not being in contact with their child when a school shooting happens. It's not some far flung thing in America unfortunately.
astrobe_ 1y ago
Playing cards during breaks, reading a lot, interacting with others, listening to radio a lot, that was the student me when I went no tv, no computer (cause I was already addicted to programming, Internet wasn't yet everywhere) to force myself to socialize more. I hope these kids will have nostalgic memories of that time as well.
pilingual 1y ago
One interesting aspect of technology is that there is little if any structure. I just posted a talk by Seymour Papert from 1991 where he said that kids were on computers or Nintendo for 6 hours at a time, which surprised me that even then they were "addictive." He notes that poetry, music, Shakespeare aren't "addictive" in the same way. I'm optimistic that there will be balance in the future. If Thomson is right that smartphones weren't really the beginning of detachment from society but instead it started more around the television era, it requires us to think how to handle all modern technology to optimize overall well being.
- Talanes 1y ago
  >I just posted a talk by Seymour Papert from 1991 where he said that kids were on computers or Nintendo for 6 hours at a time, which surprised me that even then they were "addictive." He notes that poetry, music, Shakespeare aren't "addictive" in the same way. He doesn't make any claim as to the addictiveness of poetry, music, or Shakespeare: he pointed out that we use different language to describe childhood compulsions for one activity than we do for another. My own anecdotal experience on the topic is that I was such a voracious reader as a child that it was a problem in much the same way I see people today complain about kids in screens. I'd hide personal books behind textbooks while I ignored classes, hide under the covers with a flashlight to stay up all night reading, the works.
  - bitwize 1y ago
    My wife was like this. Her teachers came to her mother with concerns that she was reading too much.
- kjkjadksj 1y ago
  Books are definitely that addictive as well.
averygarten 1y ago
hello, i’m usually a lurker on this website, but i decided to make an account and comment since this is somewhat relevant to me. i’m a senior in high school in one of those states with new laws about cell phones and electronics. i’m not particularly in favor of these new laws since i’m affected by them firsthand, but i can understand why they were implemented. a few of my habits have had to change because of these new rules: - i now write my to-do lists on sticky notes instead of on my phone. - i write notes in a small a6 size notebook instead of using a notes app. - i now carry a book and my ipod nano to lunch. because of these new rules, i do spend more time on my school-provided ipad, however. the school blocks a lot of the websites i typically visit. there are bypasses though — i can easily find instances of redlib if i want to scroll reddit, use a “cookie free youtube watcher” and paste a youtube link if i want to watch a video, and github isn’t blocked, but github pages are. most llm websites are blocked (claude, deepseek, mistral, gemini), but chatgpt isn’t for some reason. if i want to look at a blocked website that isn’t one of those above, i can use startpage.com’s anonymous view. i think the days feel longer now without my phone.
- A4ET8a8uTh0_v2 1y ago
  It has always been a cat and mouse game. To an extent, some expect the net to not be 100% proof ( though I will admit that the holes you pointed out are a little odd -- buddy is an IT admin at a school so while there is obviously a lot of variation, I would think most are pretty locked down ). Anyway, first rule of bypass is not to mention it:D
  - averygarten 1y ago
    you’re right… maybe i shouldn’t have mentioned them. oh well, only a few months left anyway. or maybe you could tell the methods i mentioned to your school it admin friend, just a thought. :3
    - A4ET8a8uTh0_v2 1y ago
      I honestly don't know enough to share. And the stuff I do know or could share would only get me in trouble in this context. That said, none of this information is really hidden. But if you only have few months left, I would just try to enjoy it. It is highly unlikely you will get that kind of quiet time after school is over. Fwiw, the article does actually list viable ways of bypassing some of the restrictions
lrvick 1y ago
I am all for phone bans in schools, but if the alternative is forcing them to use googleshit, and agree to googleshit terms of service, also hard pass. I would insist any kid of mine be allowed to use open source tools that can be studied and improved, or nothing at all.
jrochkind1 1y ago
> Alia Soliman, a senior at Bronx Science, said cards “are making a big comeback.” She said kids are playing poker when they’re done with their work in some classes. Fellow students reported a surge in Uno. In my day in the US midwest, it was Euchre.
- neRok 1y ago
  I imagine some would like to play pokemon cards, but the kids are priced out!
  - ozgrakkurt 1y ago
    I remember begging my father for yu-gi-oh cards, monopoly and beyblades. they were really expensive
rudimentary_phy 1y ago
I'm not really against phones, but I don't understand when they became acceptable to begin with. I keep reading about them being recently banned in my area as well, but I distinctly remember them not being allowed when I was younger. It was the early era of flip phones back then, but they also got after most other electronics as well.
alberth 1y ago
Maybe we’ll get back to an era where people connected & form friendships and bonds in a non digital way. Like the video below. https://youtube.com/shorts/CUfwcIVq6H0?feature=shared https://youtube.com/shorts/CUfwcIVq6H0?feature=shared
jb1991 1y ago
This is becoming more and more common to see these bans in Europe as well. When you combine these changes with current or upcoming social media bans in many countries, and other similar initiatives, it really could be, hopefully, a turning point in civilization’s relationship and understanding of the damages that technology can bring.
cracki 1y ago
These kids are still required to have a programmable graphing calculator in high school, right? Those things, today, are basically phones without the cellular circuitry. Some have Wi-Fi, and those that don't, have enough I/O to be capable of an IR-based classroom LAN.
cestith 1y ago
When I was in school, way back in the Before Times, when cell phones were expensive and smartphones were in their infancy, cards or dice would get confiscated and held until the end of the day if the administration suspected they could be used for even simulating gambling.
- aprilthird2021 1y ago
  I grew up in a similar time. Back then there was a huge negative emphasis on gambling and now in the world of PrizePicks and DraftKings, I kinda see why people were so down on it. These instant gambling machines are disasters, and we should never have allowed them
lanfeust6 1y ago
Further to the truism that constraining and micromanaging kids have driven up smartphone use: adults do this to themselves too, particularly parents. Watching kids can be fun, but then again, it can be incredibly boring most of the time. You're not going to constantly ask banal questions; kids will often be creative on their own. But as a parent, you're compelled to hover. And hover. And do nothing. Probably having more of a "village" to help (grandparents especially) would relieve pressure. Also, multiple kids will engage with each other more instead of looking to parents for all social stimulation as only-children.

284 points by geox 1y ago

There's no good description of the actual ban here? At my kid's school phones and all other electronics can't be visible when class starts or ends or the teacher takes it. I'm ok with that. Some of the more universal bans I don't get, we should be educating kids on responsible usage, total ban seems like just pushing bad choices down the road.

spcebar 1y ago
They describe the ban in the article. Kids put their phone in pouches at the start of school and get them back at the end of the day. They say they're magnetic, I assume that describes some kind of lock or means to prevent use.
- rovr138 1y ago
  Maybe like the magnetic tags they use at stores.
cambrianentropy 1y ago
https://www.governor.ny.gov/programs/eliminating-distractions-new-york-schools https://www.governor.ny.gov/programs/eliminating-distraction...
JumpCrisscross 1y ago
> we should be educating kids on responsible usage, total ban seems like just pushing bad choices down the road Even if this is all it’s doing, that’s a win. Most adults haven’t figured out responsible usage. Down the road, their brains will be more developed. And down the road, the average among them won’t need to learn at the rate we need them to now.
- duxup 1y ago
  I feel like your description conflicts. If adults can't manage themselves with phones then down the road makes no difference. I feel like experience builds good choices and total bans are like just putting blinders on. My oldest had supervised access to a phone / tablet for a while, when he downloads a game now he takes the game to gauge how much it relies on micro-transactions and so on and passes on it immediately if he thinks it is bad. That only comes form experience, and probably better to learn it when a parent can talk to him about these things rather than later in life when he is blowing his own money.
  - JumpCrisscross 1y ago
    > If adults can't manage themselves with phones then down the road makes no difference Adults today can’t manage. That’s a function of the people and context. Adults tomorrow might. Perhaps because we regulate it. Perhaps because they’re exposed to it more carefully. > probably better to learn it when a parent can talk to him about these things rather than later in life when he is blowing his own money None of this requires he have a smartphone at school.
Aurornis 1y ago
> There's no good description of the actual ban here? > At my kid's school phones and all other electronics can't be visible when class starts or ends or the teacher takes it. All of these articles are so confusing to me because they act like banning smartphones in class is something new. Is this actually new? Were there schools where students weren’t getting in trouble for using phones during class? The closest thing I’ve seen to an actual ban is a rule that phones must be kept in lockers during the entire school day, including between classes and during lunch. I could see this requiring adjustment for kids. However I’m baffled by the articles that imply smartphones were not banned from use during class. Was this really ever a thing?
- duxup 1y ago
  My kid's middle school made national news for their ban for several weeks. Really it wasn't a new thing at all, just enforced appropriately. Teacher sees electronics (of any kind) and it's taken and you pick it up at the office. Multiple violations and parents get to meet with the staff to talk about it (that's the real kicker). Yeah it wasn't new, for some reason these articles just never mention that it's really about a "new" policy that means actual enforcement.
  - Aurornis 1y ago
    > Yeah it wasn't new, for some reason these articles just never mention that it's really about a "new" policy that means actual enforcement This is confirming some of my suspicion. Smartphone ban articles are trending, so journalists feel pressured to write something about it. They all around to schools and learn about their smartphone policy, then write that as a new-ish thing so they can jump on the trend.
    - cooperadymas 1y ago
      The first sentence of the article: > New York City students are one week into the statewide phone ban. Yes, this is a new thing.
      - 1y ago
majorchord 1y ago
Apparently even suggesting that the post title needs a location in it gets you downvoted.
- immibis 1y ago
  Unless that location is Israel, in which case it gets dead. (This post has nothing to do with Israel, dear reader who didn't click on it)
cooperadymas 1y ago
> There's no good description of the actual ban here? The first sentence of this article links to information about the ban itself. Later in the article it summarizes how it is enforced. > Schools have rolled out a range of strategies, with most schools either collecting phones at arrival and storing them in lockers or distributing magnetic pouches that have to be locked and unlocked at the beginning and end of the day.
- Johnny555 1y ago
  >The first sentence of this article links to information about the ban itself. That article gives little information that's not in the original one, even clicking through to the article linked in that linked article gives scant details. Here's the NYC public school district policy: https://www.schools.nyc.gov/about-us/policies/cell-phone-and-electronic-device-policy https://www.schools.nyc.gov/about-us/policies/cell-phone-and... This is what's covered under the ban: A personal internet-enabled device is any electronic device not issued by a school or NYCPS program that can connect to the internet, allowing the user to access content online. Examples of these personal devices include: * Communication Devices, such as cell phones, smartphones, and smartwatches. * Computing Devices, such as laptops, tablets, and iPads. * Portable music and entertainment systems, such as MP3 players and game consoles.
  - CTOSian 1y ago
    Smart kids then could use retro PDAs like Palm :)
SchemaLoad 1y ago
Responsible usage is using them after school to arange getting home if needed. There's no good reason to use a phone during school. Anyone you need to contact during that time is physically present.
JuniperMesos 1y ago
When I was in high school (shortly before smartphones became widely available, but when feature phones definitely were), it was explicitly against the rules to use a cell phone in class. I believe that similar small electronic devices like iPods were also banned. The concern was actively using phones or other devices during class, rather than simply having them in your backpack or pocket, and also that if your cell phone ringer went off during class that would be distracting (which is in fact true, that is distracting). My recollection is that some kids did try to violate the rule by surreptitiously texting during class, and did sometimes get their phones confiscated by a teacher; and also some people had their phones confiscated because they got a call or text and it went off in class, since they forgot to turn it off or silence the ringer (although sometimes kids were just asked to turn off the phone and didn't have it confiscated). I personally was not particularly inclined towards rulebreaking (or was smart enough to only break rules I was sure I could get away with), and I wasn't the kind of social butterfly in high school who was constantly texting people anyway, so my own phone never got confiscated. Merely having phones (or other electronic devices) on your person during the school day and using them on campus but outside of class times (e.g. during lunch) wasn't against the rules. I specifically remember playing a lot of the Nokia phone snake game on my phone to pass time during lunch or while waiting to get picked up after school - because it was the only game on the phone that was even mildly interesting. I think if my school had tried to ban having a cell phone on your person at all during the school day, I would've attempted to evade the ban by hiding it more deeply in my backpack or something. And if there were literal bag inspections in order to mitigate this, I would've been genuinely pretty angry about that and tried to think of something else I could do to evade the ban. Being compelled to put your phone in a locked box during the school day, rather than just silence it and not use it during class, seems very draconian to me.
majorchord 1y ago
In a high-trust society where people typically follow the rules, yes I think that's a good idea. But unfortunately the West lives in a world where kids see limitations as a challenge to try to push it as far as possible, combined with parents who simply don't care at all, so this is why we can't have nice things.

spcebar 1y ago

Nature is healing. Glad to see this. I was in high school when smart phones really became widespread, and was personally still on a flip phone most of the way through. I think there's something healthy to the boredom the kids describe, which ultimately leads to socialization and introspection. 24/7 social media seems like a very destructive portal to isolation, and having a reprieve from that, if only a few hours a day, seems like a great thing.

naasking 1y ago
> I think there's something healthy to the boredom the kids describe, which ultimately leads to socialization and introspection. This. People these days talk about boredom like it's the worst thing ever.
rTX5CMRXIfFG 1y ago
I would not have learned to play the guitar if I had a smartphone then, or if the internet was any faster than a dial-up. Now I have an outlet to make something beautiful out of my loneliness whenever it strikes.
- flir 1y ago
  Internet ruined me for anything long-form. I'm old enough to remember the Before Times, but a lot of people aren't.
  - ghaff 1y ago
    I used to read books voraciously and, while I do still read books, it's a pretty small number compared to what I used to do. I've been trying to pare my bookshelves of books I'm never realistically going to reread or read.
    - bbreier 1y ago
      Funny enough, I've had the opposite experience. Easy access to books and reviews has me reading conservatively 10x as much as I did a decade ago

ranger_danger 1y ago

What ban where? Not everyone wants to read an article to even find out the location they are talking about or if this is relevant to them... otherwise what's the point of titles and headlines? We can write much better post titles than this.

rovr138 1y ago
It's in the article. Come on people, read. > Schools have rolled out a range of strategies, with most schools either collecting phones at arrival and storing them in lockers or distributing magnetic pouches that have to be locked and unlocked at the beginning and end of the day.
- JumpCrisscross 1y ago
  To be fair, the title has been editorialized. From the guidelines: “…please use the original title, unless it is misleading or linkbait; don't editorialize.” (I’ve flagged. Happy to unflag once title is fixed.) https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
- ranger_danger 1y ago
  Yes I understand it's in the article, but that wasn't my point. People from all over the world read this site and many won't click on articles they aren't sure are relevant to them... why can't we put even the location of the story in the title? Is that too much to ask?
  - rovr138 1y ago
    I don't think the relevant part is where there's a smartphone ban. It's that teens are adjusting to the ban on their phones. That even if they're always on them, they can actually disconnect and adjust to it.
    - ranger_danger 1y ago
      I don't presume to know people's reasons for wanting to read a story or not... I just think we should at least put the applicable location in the title.

Simulacra 1y ago

I like this, phones have become too severe of a distraction throughout the school day, especially in lessons. I don't mind if students have their phone at lunchtime, or outside of the academic time, but allowing them to have their phones in class has just been ruinous.

softwaredoug 1y ago

When our kids learned about substance abuse, they talk about teenage brains being in a critical period. If they get addicted to a substance, while their brain is developing, the addiction runs deeper than if they were an adult. It's a much bigger challenge to break free of the addiction.

trentnix 1y ago

Texas banned phones in schools as well. A local school administrator told me “in the high school, the lunch room is now loud with talking and laughter!” There are still parents that complain. Turns out they are as addicted to texting with their kids all day as their kids are addicted to the same. Regardless, it’s great to see that the ban has seemingly nudged things in a healthier direction. Its a failure of leadership that schools needed a statewide ban to make such an obviously positive change.

softwaredoug 1y ago
Phones might be as much a symptom as a cause The related issue is parents are overly protective of teens and don't give them enough independence. You see this in a lot of different ways from parents wanting to text their kids, to only letting kids do highly managed structured activities, to treating teens as their best friends, to helicopter parenting protecting kids from all adversity, etc etc And a similar thing happens not just with parents, but society, there are not a lot of places teens can just hang out. A lot of fun things teens would do increasingly ban minors. If you want teens off devices, you need to give them alternatives
- soupfordummies 1y ago
  There's also the symptom that almost our entire society is addicted to staring at their phones for at least 4 hours a day. Go literally ANYWHERE and just look at the people around you if you don't think so.
  - softwaredoug 1y ago
    The counter to phone is dog. My dog stares up at someone until they acknowledge him. Then I end up talking to the person. And everyone has a nice interaction. Usually they get a nice serotonin bump.
  - rkomorn 1y ago
    Yeah. As someone who spends way too much time on their phone... I'm pretty sure that I have access to all kinds of alternatives, and that I have the agency necessary to getting off my phone. I'm pretty sure there's an awful lot more to it.

orionsbelt 1y ago

Sounds delightful. Now do it for adults. - an adult phone addict

wmeredith 1y ago
iPhone dumbphone https://stopa.io/post/297 https://stopa.io/post/297
j-bos 1y ago
Adults need to be adults and manage themselves, with or without help. Otherwise they're children.
- SchemaLoad 1y ago
  What we really need is regulation of the tech companies driving the addiction. We've long since discovered that megacorps engineering addiction are more powerful than individuals ability to resist.
- lanfeust6 1y ago
  Adding to this, I never understood why it's considered so addictive. Smartphones are banal and frustrating to me. However, I'm often on my personal laptop. I suspect there is something to the refrain that phones are a crutch in those cases where our range of actions is constrained. Through habit they then reflexively take over in other contexts.
  - j-bos 1y ago
    This seems like reasobable mechanism, also matches what I saw of older generations developing parasocial relationships with soap operas, often started after being bedridden for some weeks.

MisterTea 1y ago

Excellent news. Though what bothers me is all the high schools mentioned are the top prestigious ones you had to apply to, not zoned. Brooklyn Tech, Gramercy Arts, Bronx Science, I'm surprised no comments from Stuyvesant students. > Alia Soliman, a senior at Bronx Science, said cards “are making a big comeback.” She said kids are playing poker when they’re done with their work in some classes. Ha! When I was in NYC high school in the 90s we were not allowed to have playing cards or dominoes. The staff would confiscate them because it was believed to encourage gambling. Quite amusing that now they are the saving a generation of kids from mindless scrolling.

HPsquared 1y ago
They still could encourage gambling, but someone somewhere judged it's the lesser of two evils.
- stronglikedan 1y ago
  Anything could encourage gambling to a person who has a penchant for gambling. Cards and dominoes are no different than anything else that can be bet on, which is pretty much everything.
  - HPsquared 1y ago
    Yeah indeed, phones have many games of chance also.
- InitialLastName 1y ago
  Among other things, lots of those kids are probably using their phones to gamble way more money than they'll ever lose playing poker with their friends. Playing poker with friends is at worst zero-sum with limited downside; your friends will probably cut you off when you run out of money and the money stays in your little pool. Betting sports against a faceless profit-maximizing corporation is negative-sum and if it turns into a problem for they're happy to raise your minimum and encourage dumber bets.
- samus 1y ago

teekert 1y ago

Our school started this year: Heard one kid says: "What am I supposed to do in the breaks!!" OMG. But, the kids are playing games, talking to each other. Learning viral skills for the workplace all while relaxing. Winwinwin.

Simulacra 1y ago
We played chess in school
- xattt 1y ago
  I went to a smaller school in a large school system, and our chess club was one of our school’s only “competitive” teams. That, and the annual Avogadro competitions.

rickydroll 1y ago

Somebody should introduce these kids to Meshtastic. The Lily T-Deck series features a built-in keyboard and screen, eliminating the need for a phone. I'm sure someone bright could put a repeater up in a place administrators would never find to cover the entire school.

unglaublich 1y ago

Lovely news.

tootie 1y ago

[flagged]

spiderice 1y ago
"Louder lunchroom" is a measurable outcome. So is kids playing Poker
- lmm 1y ago
  Was it measured before and after? Or did they take a couple of anecdotes (from people with a vested interest, at that) as fact?
kelnos 1y ago
The article is full of accounts of positive, measurable outcomes, that are already happening.
- tootie 1y ago
  Outcomes meaning test scores, behavior, mental health. I have two kids in NYC high schools including at least one of the schools they were canvassing at. They have not observed any changes. My oldest used to use her phone for schoolwork during the day pretty frequently and now she can't, so homework is taking longer.

aaomidi 1y ago

A single school shooting is going to reverse this.

pessimizer 1y ago
Yes, we'll miss getting to listen to recordings of children being murdered while the police fail to go in.
- ragnot 1y ago
  It's more that parents are afraid of not being in contact with their child when a school shooting happens. It's not some far flung thing in America unfortunately.

astrobe_ 1y ago

Playing cards during breaks, reading a lot, interacting with others, listening to radio a lot, that was the student me when I went no tv, no computer (cause I was already addicted to programming, Internet wasn't yet everywhere) to force myself to socialize more. I hope these kids will have nostalgic memories of that time as well.

pilingual 1y ago

One interesting aspect of technology is that there is little if any structure. I just posted a talk by Seymour Papert from 1991 where he said that kids were on computers or Nintendo for 6 hours at a time, which surprised me that even then they were "addictive." He notes that poetry, music, Shakespeare aren't "addictive" in the same way. I'm optimistic that there will be balance in the future. If Thomson is right that smartphones weren't really the beginning of detachment from society but instead it started more around the television era, it requires us to think how to handle all modern technology to optimize overall well being.

Talanes 1y ago
>I just posted a talk by Seymour Papert from 1991 where he said that kids were on computers or Nintendo for 6 hours at a time, which surprised me that even then they were "addictive." He notes that poetry, music, Shakespeare aren't "addictive" in the same way. He doesn't make any claim as to the addictiveness of poetry, music, or Shakespeare: he pointed out that we use different language to describe childhood compulsions for one activity than we do for another. My own anecdotal experience on the topic is that I was such a voracious reader as a child that it was a problem in much the same way I see people today complain about kids in screens. I'd hide personal books behind textbooks while I ignored classes, hide under the covers with a flashlight to stay up all night reading, the works.
- bitwize 1y ago
  My wife was like this. Her teachers came to her mother with concerns that she was reading too much.
kjkjadksj 1y ago
Books are definitely that addictive as well.

averygarten 1y ago

hello, i’m usually a lurker on this website, but i decided to make an account and comment since this is somewhat relevant to me. i’m a senior in high school in one of those states with new laws about cell phones and electronics. i’m not particularly in favor of these new laws since i’m affected by them firsthand, but i can understand why they were implemented. a few of my habits have had to change because of these new rules: - i now write my to-do lists on sticky notes instead of on my phone. - i write notes in a small a6 size notebook instead of using a notes app. - i now carry a book and my ipod nano to lunch. because of these new rules, i do spend more time on my school-provided ipad, however. the school blocks a lot of the websites i typically visit. there are bypasses though — i can easily find instances of redlib if i want to scroll reddit, use a “cookie free youtube watcher” and paste a youtube link if i want to watch a video, and github isn’t blocked, but github pages are. most llm websites are blocked (claude, deepseek, mistral, gemini), but chatgpt isn’t for some reason. if i want to look at a blocked website that isn’t one of those above, i can use startpage.com’s anonymous view. i think the days feel longer now without my phone.

A4ET8a8uTh0_v2 1y ago
It has always been a cat and mouse game. To an extent, some expect the net to not be 100% proof ( though I will admit that the holes you pointed out are a little odd -- buddy is an IT admin at a school so while there is obviously a lot of variation, I would think most are pretty locked down ). Anyway, first rule of bypass is not to mention it:D
- averygarten 1y ago
  you’re right… maybe i shouldn’t have mentioned them. oh well, only a few months left anyway. or maybe you could tell the methods i mentioned to your school it admin friend, just a thought. :3
  - A4ET8a8uTh0_v2 1y ago
    I honestly don't know enough to share. And the stuff I do know or could share would only get me in trouble in this context. That said, none of this information is really hidden. But if you only have few months left, I would just try to enjoy it. It is highly unlikely you will get that kind of quiet time after school is over. Fwiw, the article does actually list viable ways of bypassing some of the restrictions

lrvick 1y ago

I am all for phone bans in schools, but if the alternative is forcing them to use googleshit, and agree to googleshit terms of service, also hard pass. I would insist any kid of mine be allowed to use open source tools that can be studied and improved, or nothing at all.

jrochkind1 1y ago

> Alia Soliman, a senior at Bronx Science, said cards “are making a big comeback.” She said kids are playing poker when they’re done with their work in some classes. Fellow students reported a surge in Uno. In my day in the US midwest, it was Euchre.

neRok 1y ago
I imagine some would like to play pokemon cards, but the kids are priced out!
- ozgrakkurt 1y ago
  I remember begging my father for yu-gi-oh cards, monopoly and beyblades. they were really expensive

rudimentary_phy 1y ago

I'm not really against phones, but I don't understand when they became acceptable to begin with. I keep reading about them being recently banned in my area as well, but I distinctly remember them not being allowed when I was younger. It was the early era of flip phones back then, but they also got after most other electronics as well.

alberth 1y ago

Maybe we’ll get back to an era where people connected & form friendships and bonds in a non digital way. Like the video below. https://youtube.com/shorts/CUfwcIVq6H0?feature=shared https://youtube.com/shorts/CUfwcIVq6H0?feature=shared

jb1991 1y ago

This is becoming more and more common to see these bans in Europe as well. When you combine these changes with current or upcoming social media bans in many countries, and other similar initiatives, it really could be, hopefully, a turning point in civilization’s relationship and understanding of the damages that technology can bring.

cracki 1y ago

These kids are still required to have a programmable graphing calculator in high school, right? Those things, today, are basically phones without the cellular circuitry. Some have Wi-Fi, and those that don't, have enough I/O to be capable of an IR-based classroom LAN.

cestith 1y ago

When I was in school, way back in the Before Times, when cell phones were expensive and smartphones were in their infancy, cards or dice would get confiscated and held until the end of the day if the administration suspected they could be used for even simulating gambling.

aprilthird2021 1y ago
I grew up in a similar time. Back then there was a huge negative emphasis on gambling and now in the world of PrizePicks and DraftKings, I kinda see why people were so down on it. These instant gambling machines are disasters, and we should never have allowed them

lanfeust6 1y ago

Further to the truism that constraining and micromanaging kids have driven up smartphone use: adults do this to themselves too, particularly parents. Watching kids can be fun, but then again, it can be incredibly boring most of the time. You're not going to constantly ask banal questions; kids will often be creative on their own. But as a parent, you're compelled to hover. And hover. And do nothing. Probably having more of a "village" to help (grandparents especially) would relieve pressure. Also, multiple kids will engage with each other more instead of looking to parents for all social stimulation as only-children.