11 ms·

OpenAI releases image generation in the API

487 points by themanmaran 1y ago

minimaxir 1y ago
Pricing-wise, this API is going to be hard to justify the value unless you really can get value out of providing references. A generated `medium` 1024x1024 is $0.04/image, which is in the same cost class as Imagen 3 and Flux 1.1 Pro. Testing from their new playground (https://platform.openai.com/playground/images https://platform.openai.com/playground/images), the medium images are indeed lower quality than either of of two competitor models and still takes 15+ seconds to generate: https://x.com/minimaxir/status/1915114021466017830 https://x.com/minimaxir/status/1915114021466017830 Prompting the model is also substantially more different and difficult than traditional models, unsurprisingly given the way the model works. The traditional image tricks don't work out-of-the-box and I'm struggling to get something that works without significant prompt augmentation (which is what I suspect was used for the ChatGPT image generations)
- tough 1y ago
  It seems to me like this is a new hybrid product for -vibe coders- beacuse otherwise the -wrapping- of prompting/improving a prompt with an LLM before hitting the text2image model can certainly be done as you say cheaper if you just run it yourself. maybe OpenAI thinks model business is over and they need to start sherlocking all the way from the top to final apps (Thus their interest on buying out cursor, finally ending up with windsurf) Idk this feels like a new offering between a full raw API and a final product where you abstract some of it for a few cents, and they're basically bundling their SOTA llm models with their image models for extra margin
  - vineyardmike 1y ago
    > It seems to me like this is a new hybrid product for -vibe coders- beacuse otherwise the -wrapping- of prompting/improving a prompt with an LLM before hitting the text2image model can certainly be done as you say cheaper if you just run it yourself. In case you didn’t know, it’s not just wrapping in an LLM. The image model they’re referencing is a model that’s directly integrated into the LLM for functionality. It’s not possible to extract, because the LLM outputs tokens which are part of the image itself. That said, they’re definitely trying to focus on building products over raw models now. They want to be a consumer subscription instead of commodity model provider.
    - tough 1y ago
      Right! I forgot the new model was a multi-modal one generating image outputs from both image and text inputs, i guess this is good and price will come down eventually. waiting for some FOSS multi-modal model to come out eventually too great to see openAI expanding into making actual usable products i guess
    - spilldahill 1y ago
      yeah, the integration is the real shift here. by embedding image generation into the LLM’s token stream, it’s no longer a pipeline of separate systems but a single unified model interface. that unlocks new use cases where you can reason, plan, and render all in one flow. it’s not just about replacing diffusion models, it’s about making generation part of a broader agentic loop. pricing will drop over time, but the shift in how you build with this is the more interesting part.
- doctorpangloss 1y ago
  It's far and away the most powerful image model right now. $0.04/image is a decent price!
  - arevno 1y ago
    This is extremely domain-specific. Diffusion models work much better for certain things.
    - thot_experiment 1y ago
      Can you cite an example? I'm really curious where that set of usecases lies.
      - koakuma-chan 1y ago
        Explicit adult content.
        thot_experiment 1y ago
        False. That has nothing to do with the model architecture and everything to do with cloud inference providers wanting to avoid regulatory scrutiny.
      - echelon 1y ago
        I work in the space. There are a lot of use cases that get censored by OpenAI, Kling, Runway, and various other providers for a wide variety of reasons: - OpenAI is notorious for blocking copyrighted characters. They do prompt keyword scanning, but also run a VLM on the results so you can't "trick" the model. - Lots of providers block public figures and celebrities. - Various providers block LGBT imagery, even safe for work prompts. Kling is notorious for this. - I was on a sales call with someone today who runs a father's advocacy group. I don't know what system he was using, but he said he found it impossible to generate an adult male with a child. In a totally safe for work context. - Some systems block "PG-13" images of characters that are in bathing suits or scantily clad. None of this is porn, mind you.
- simonw 1y ago
  It may lose against other models on prompt-to-image, but I'd be very excited to see another model that's as good at this one as image+prompt-to-image. Editing photos with ChatGPT over the past few weeks has been SO much fun. Here's my dog in a pelican costume: https://bsky.app/profile/simonwillison.net/post/3lneuquczzs2i https://bsky.app/profile/simonwillison.net/post/3lneuquczzs2...
  - steve_adams_86 1y ago
    The dog ChatGPT generated doesn't actually look like your dog. The eyes are so different. Really cute image, though.
- furyofantares 1y ago
  I find prompting the model substantially easier than traditional models, is it really more difficult or are you just used to traditional models? I suspect what I'll do with the API is iterate at medium quality and then generate a high quality image when I'm done.
- thot_experiment 1y ago
  Similarly to how 90% of my LLM needs are met by Mistral 3.1, there's no reason to use 4o for most t2i or i2i, however there's a definite set of tasks that are not possible with diffusion models, or if they are they require a giant ball of node spaghetti in comfyui to achieve. The price is high but the likelyhood of getting the right answer on the first try is absolutely worth the cost imo.
- Sohcahtoa82 1y ago
  > A generated `medium` 1024x1024 is $0.04/image It's actually more than that. It's about 16.7 cents per image. $0.04/image is the pricing for DALL-E 3.
  - weird-eye-issue 1y ago
    No, it's not
  - mkl 1y ago
    16.7 cents is the high quality cost, and medium is 4.2 cents: https://platform.openai.com/docs/pricing#:~:text=1M%20characters-,Image%20generation,-Price/image https://platform.openai.com/docs/pricing#:~:text=1M%20charac...
    - Sohcahtoa82 1y ago
      Ah, they changed that page since I saw it yesterday. They didn't show low/med/high quality, they just said an image was a certain number of tokens with a price per token that led to $0.16/image.
- raincole 1y ago
  ChatGPT's prompt adherence is light years ahead of all the others. I won't even call Flux/Midjoueny its competitors. ChatGPT image gen is practically a one-of-its-kind unique product on the market: the only usable AI image editor for people without image editing experience. I think in terms of image generation, ChatGPT is the biggest leap since Stable Diffusion's release. LoRA/ControlNet/Flux are forgettable in comparison.
  - soared 1y ago
    This is a take so incredulous it doesn’t seem credible.
    - tacoooooooo 1y ago
      its 100% the correct take
      - fkyoureadthedoc 1y ago
        yeah this is my personal experience. The new image generation is the only reason I keep an OpenAI subscription rather than switching to Google.
    - mediaman 1y ago
      It is correct, the shift from diffusion to transformers is a very, very big difference.
    - stavros 1y ago
      I can confirm, ChatGPT's prompt adherence is so incredibly good, it gets even really small details right, to a level that diffusion-based generators couldn't even dream of.
    - abhpro 1y ago
      Also chiming in to say you're wrong, I mean they're correct
  - thegeomaster 1y ago
- adamhowell 1y ago
  So, I've long dreamed of building an AI-powered https://iconfinder.com https://iconfinder.com. I started Accomplice v1 back in 2021 with this goal in mind and raised some VC money but it was too early. Now, with these latest imagen-3.0-generate-002 (Gemini) and gpt-image-1 (OpenAI) models – especially this API release from OpenAI – I've been able to resurrect Accomplice as a little side project. Accomplice v2 (https://accomplice.ai https://accomplice.ai) is just getting started back up again – I honestly decided to rebuild it only a couple weeks ago in preparation for today once I saw ChatGPT's new image model – but so far 1,000s of free to download PNGs (and any SVGs that have already been vectorized are free too (costs a credit to vectorize)). I generate new icons every few minutes from a huge list of "useful icons" I've built. Will be 100% pay-as-you-go. And for a credit, paid users can vectorize any PNGs they like, tweak them using AI, upload their own images to vectorize and download, or create their own icons (with my prompt injections baked in to get you good icon results) Do multi-modal models make something like this obsolete? I honestly am not sure. In my experience with Accomplice v1, a lot of users didn't know what to do with a blank textarea, so the thinking here is there's value in doing some of the work for them upfront with a large searchable archive. Would love to hear others' thoughts. But I'm having fun again either way.
  - stavros 1y ago
    That looks interesting, but I don't know how useful single icons can be. For me, the really useful part would be to get a suite of icons that all have a consistent visual style. Bonus points if I can prompt the model to generate more icons with that same style.
    - throwup238 1y ago
      Recraft has a style feature where you give some images. I wonder if that would work for icons. You can also try giving an image of a bunch of icons to ChatGPT and have it generate more, then vectorize them.
      - stavros 1y ago
        I think the latter approach is the best bet right now, agree.
- varenc 1y ago
  pretty amazing that in ~two years a 15 second latency AI image generation API that cost 4 cents lags behind competitors.
  - echelon 1y ago
    This product does not lag behind competitors. Once you take the time to understand how it works, it's clear that this is an order of magnitude more powerful than anything else on the market. While there's a market need for fast diffusion, that's already been filled and is now a race to the bottom. There's nobody else that can do what OpenAI does with gpt-image-1. This model is a truly programmable graphics workflow engine. And this type of model has so much more value than mere "image generation". gpt-image-1 replaces ComfyUI, inpainting/outpainting, LoRAs, and in time one could imagine it replaces Adobe Photoshop and nearly all the things people use it for. It's an image manipulation engine, not just a diffusion model. It understands what you want on the first try, and it does a remarkably good job at it. gpt-image-1 is a graphics design department in a box. Please don't think of this as a model where you prompt things like "a dog and a cat hugging". This is so much more than that.
- vunderba 1y ago
  > Prompting the model is also substantially more different and difficult than traditional models Can you elaborate? This was not my experience - retesting the prompts that I used for my GenAI image shootout against gpt-image-1 API proved largely similar. https://genai-showdown.specr.net https://genai-showdown.specr.net
- Wowfunhappy 1y ago
  Huh? For me the quality of the API seems to be identical to what I'm getting in ChatGPT.
sebastiennight 1y ago
Hmm seems pricey. What's the current state of the art for API generation of an image from a reference plus modifier prompt? Say, in the 1c per HD (1920*1080) image range?
- minimaxir 1y ago
  "Image from a reference" is a bit of a rabbit hole. For traditional image generation models, in order for it to learn a reference, you have to fine-tune it (LoRA) and/or use a conditioning model to constrain the output (InstantID/ControlNet) The interesting part of this GPT-4o API is that it doesn't need to learn them. But given the cost of `high` quality image generation, it's much cheaper to train a LoRA for Flux 1.1 Pro and generate from that.
  - Tiberium 1y ago
    Imagen supports image references in the API as well, just on Vertex, not on Gemini API yet.
    - BoorishBears 1y ago
      Imagen references don't feel very useful at all. At most it feels like an afterthought meant to make product photoshoots easier.
  - thot_experiment 1y ago
    Reflux is fantastic for the basic reference image based editing most people are using this for, but 4o is far more powerful than any existing models because of it's large scale and cross-modal understanding, there are things possible with 4o that are just 100% impossible with diffusion models. (full glass of wine, horse riding an astronaut, room without pink elephants, etc)
gervwyk 1y ago
Great svg generation would be far more userful! For example, being able to edit svg images after generated by Ai would be quick to modify the last mile.. For our new website https://resonancy.io https://resonancy.io the simple svg workflow images created was still very much created by hand.. and trying various ai tools to make such images yielded shockingly bad off-brand results even when provided multiple examples. By far the best tool for this is still canva for us.. Anyone know of an Ai model for generating svg images? Please share.
- tough 1y ago
  SVGFusion https://arxiv.org/abs/2412.10437 https://arxiv.org/abs/2412.10437 which is a new paper from SVGRender group https://huggingface.co/SVGRender https://huggingface.co/SVGRender OmniSVG https://arxiv.org/abs/2504.06263v1 https://arxiv.org/abs/2504.06263v1
  - gervwyk 1y ago
    Amazing thanks for sharing! Will have a read. A commercial model would be something that I will pay for!
    - tough 1y ago
      I don't know about -commercial- offerings but you can try also something like SVGRender which you should be able to run on your own GPU etc https://ximinng.github.io/PyTorch-SVGRender-project/ https://ximinng.github.io/PyTorch-SVGRender-project/ first paper linked on prior comment is the latest one from SVGRender group, but not sure if any runnable model weights are out yet for it (SVGFusion)
    - corysama 1y ago
      Is free cheap enough ;) https://omnisvg.github.io/ https://omnisvg.github.io/ https://huggingface.co/OmniSVG https://huggingface.co/OmniSVG
- simonw 1y ago
  I was impressed with recraft.ai for SVGs - https://simonwillison.net/2024/Nov/15/recraft-v3/ https://simonwillison.net/2024/Nov/15/recraft-v3/ - though as far as I can tell they generate raster images and then SVG-ize them before returning the result.
smrt 1y ago
I don't understand why this api needs organization verification. More paperwork ahead. Facepalm PermissionDeniedError: Error code: 403 - {'error': {'message': 'To access gpt-image-1, please complete organization verification
- themanmaran 1y ago
  Likely because they've seen a lot of the potential abuse capabilities. i.e. the "generate a drivers license with this face". So the options are: 1) nerf the model so it can't produce images like that, or 2) use some type of KYC verification.
  - magackame 1y ago
    The model is already pretty lobotomized refusing even mundane requests randomly. Upload a picture of a friend -> OK. Upload my own picture -> I can't generate anything involving real people. Also after they enabled global chat memory I started seeing my other chats leaking into the images as literal text. Disabled it since.
  - vunderba 1y ago
    Yep - the API lets you lower the moderation which I observed allows for more violent and graphic prompts, but it still exists and will often reject if you reference popular figures/etc.
- bayesianbot 1y ago
  It says "Organization verification" but I got my personal account (with Personal as organization) verified with just a passport.
animanoir 1y ago
Wow more AI slop
pkulak 1y ago
I don't get it. I've been using `dall-e-3` over the public API for a couple years now. Is this just a new model? EDIT: Oh, yes, that's what it appears to be. Is it better? Why would I switch?
- themanmaran 1y ago
  This is the new model that's available in ChatGPT, which most notably can do transfer generation. i.e. "take this image and restyle it to look like X". Or "take this sneaker and give me a billboard ad for it"
- danielbln 1y ago
  This is their presumably auto regressive image model. It has outstanding prompt adherence and great detail in addition to strong style transfer abilities.
- Sohcahtoa82 1y ago
  The new image generation model is miles ahead of DALL-E 3, especially when generating text.
- bradly 1y ago
  Basically they are charging for the ability to make accurate text generation.
film42 1y ago
I generated 5 images in the playground. One using a text-only prompt and 4 using images from my phone. I spent $0.85 which isn't bad for a fun round of Studio Ghibli portraits for the family group chat, but too expensive to be used in a customer facing product.
- sumedh 1y ago
  > but too expensive to be used in a customer facing product. Enhance headshots for putting on Linkedin.
  - BOOSTERHIDROGEN 1y ago
    is it good?
    - stavros 1y ago
      No, it can't do detail well, AFAIK the images are produced at a lower resolution and then upscaled. This might be specific to the ChatGPT version, however, for cost cutting.
  - bamboozled 1y ago
    Can't wait to meet people in person who look nothing like their profile pictures on linkedin :)
    - martin_a 1y ago
      I already did. Looked in the mirror just an hour ago. Strange guy, very tired, never seen him before.
  - salomonk_mur 1y ago
    It doesn't keep facial details in the generation. The generated person resembles you but is definitely not you.
    - 1y ago
MisterBiggs 1y ago
Lots of comments on the price being too high, what are the odds this is a subsidized bare metal cost?
- kevinqi 1y ago
  just based on how long it takes to produce these images, and how much text responses cost, I wouldn't be surprised at all if it was close to cost
scyzoryk_xyz 1y ago
Intelligence is fast approaching utility status.
1oooqooq 1y ago
aren't you all embarrassed seeing lame press releases of the most uninteresting things on the top of HN front page? i kinda feel bad.
- bobxmax 1y ago
  I'm embarassed that you find revolutionary tech uninteresting.
  - 1oooqooq 1y ago
    it's literary one feature now available in a different billing format. get a gripe.
    - stavros 1y ago
      When I grow up, I too want to dismiss things without even knowing what I'm talking about.
    - urbandw311er 1y ago
      It’s available by API now, previously it was not. That’s pretty big news. This isn’t a billing related thing.
- sumedh 1y ago
  This news is relevant for developers though.
  - GuinansEyebrows 1y ago
    How so? I'm (nominally) a developer and this has nothing to do with my job or personal pursuits.
    - matkoniecz 1y ago
      Noone was claiming that it is relevant to every single developer. Hard to find such news.
drakenot 1y ago
Does the AI have the same content restrictions that the chat service does?
- Wowfunhappy 1y ago
  Yes by default, but you can change it: > Additionally, developers can also control moderation sensitivity with the `moderation` parameter, which can be set to auto (default) for standard filtering, or low for less restrictive filtering. I played around with this last night and although it still sometimes refused to create images, it seemed to be significantly more lenient.
Imnimo 1y ago
I'm curious what the applications are where people need to generate hundreds or thousands of these images. I like making Ghibli-esque versions of family photos as much as the next person, but I don't need to make them in volume. As far as I can recall, every time I've used image generation, it's been one-off things that I'm happy to do in the ChatGPT UI.
- marviel 1y ago
  AI-assisted education is promising.
  - Etheryte 1y ago
    That is true in a broader sense, but education and abundant money don't generally go hand in hand.
    - marviel 1y ago
      don't I know it
  - samtp 1y ago
    I'm still struggling to see how you would need thousands of AI generated images rather than just using existing real images for education.
    - marviel 1y ago
      - personalization (style, analogy to known concepts) - specificity (a diagram that perfectly encapsulates the exact set of concepts you're asking about)
      - indeyets 1y ago
        But LLMs are not reliable enough, so you can not actually expect “specificity”
cuuupid 1y ago
When this was up yesterday I complained that the refusal rate was super high especially on government and military shaped tasks, and that this would only push contractors to use CN-developed open source models for work that could then be compromised. Today I'm discovering there is a tier of API access with virtually no content moderation available to companies working in that space. I have no idea how to go about requesting that tier of access, but have spoken to 4 different defense contractors in the last day who seem to already be using it.
- refulgentis 1y ago
  It's "tier 5", I've had an account since the 3.0 days so I can't be positive I'm not grandfathered in, but, my understanding is as long as you have a non-trivial amount of spend for a few months you'll have that access. (fwiw for anyone curious how to implement it, it's the 'moderation' parameter in the JSON request you'll send, I missed it for a few hours because it wasn't in Dalle-3)
  - dunkmaster 1y ago
    API shows either auto or low available. Is there another secret value with even lower restrictions?
    - refulgentis 1y ago
      Not that I know of. I just took any indication that the parent post meant absolute zero moderation as them being a bit loose with their words and excitable with how they understand things, there were some signs: 1. it's unlikely they completed an API integration quickly enough to have an opinion on military / defense image generation moderation yesterday, so they're almost certainly speaking about ChatGPT. (this is additionally confirmed by image generation requiring tier 5 anyway, which they would have been aware of if they had integrated) 2. The military / defense use cases for image generation are not provided (and the steelman'd version in other comments is nonsensical, i.e. we can quickly validate you can still generate kanban boards or wireframes of ships) 3. The poster passively disclaims being in military / defense themself (grep "in that space") 4. it is hard to envision cases of #2 that do not require universal moderation for OpenAI's sake, i.e. lets say their thought process is along the lines of: defense/military ~= what I think of as CIA ~= black ops ~= image manipulation on social media, thus, the time I said "please edit this photo of the ayatollah to have him eating pig and say I hate allah" means its overmoderated for defense use cases 5. It's unlikely openai wants to be anywhere near PR resulting from #4. Assuming there is a super secret defense tier that allows this, it's at the very least, unlikely that the poster's defense contractor friends were blabbing about about the exclusive completely unmoderated access they had, to the poster, within hours of release. They're pretty serious about that secrecy stuff! 6. It is unlikely the lack of ability to generate images using GPT Image 1 would drive the military to Chinese models (there aren't Chinese LLMs that do this! even if they were, there's plenty of good ol' American diffusion models!)
jonplackett 1y ago
Does anyone know if you can give this endpoint an image as input along with text - not just an image to mask, but an image as part of a text input description. I can’t see a way to do this currently, you just get a prompt. This, I think, is the most powerful way to use the new image model since it actually understands the input image and can make a new one based on it. Eg you can give it a person sitting at a desk and it can make one of them standing up. Or from another angle. Or in the moon.
- loktarogar 1y ago
  Seems like exactly one of their examples, or am I missing something? "Create a new image using image references" https://platform.openai.com/docs/guides/image-generation#create-a-new-image-using-image-references https://platform.openai.com/docs/guides/image-generation#cre...
  - jonplackett 1y ago
    Awesome. Thank you!
- adamhowell 1y ago
  I think this is technically "image variations" and I think image variations are still only dall-e 3 for now (best I could tell earlier today from the API)
badmonster 1y ago
Usage of gpt-image-1 is priced per token, with separate pricing for text and image tokens: Text input tokens (prompt text): $5 per 1M tokens Image input tokens (input images): $10 per 1M tokens Image output tokens (generated images): $40 per 1M tokens In practice, this translates to roughly $0.02, $0.07, and $0.19 per generated image for low, medium, and high-quality square images, respectively. that's a bit pricy for a startup.
- m4thfr34k 1y ago
  Isn't there also a cost per image? The pricing page shows $0.25 for a high quality 1536x1024 image. 25 cents per image is ... steep lol
  - BoorishBears 1y ago
    Cost per image is based on output tokens (because they're output tokens)
GaggiX 1y ago
Far too expensive, I think I will wait for an equivalent Gemini model.
claiir 1y ago
> GoDaddy is actively experimenting to integrate image generation so customers can easily create logos that are editable [..] I remember meeting someone on Discord 1-2 years ago (?) working on a GoDaddy effort to have customer-generated icons using bespoke foundation image gen models? Suppose that kind of bespoke model at that scale is ripe for replacement by gpt-image-1, given the instruction-following ability / steerability?
jumploops 1y ago
This new model is autoregression-based (similar to LLMs, token by token) rather than diffusion based, meaning that it adheres to text prompts with much higher accuracy. As an example, some users (myself included) of a generative image app were trying to make a picture of person in the pouch of a kangaroo. No matter what we prompted, we couldn’t get it to work. GPT-4o did it in one shot!
- yousif_123123 1y ago
  It's a mix of both it feels to me as I've been testing it. For example, you can't get it to make a clock showing custom time like 3:30, or someone writing with their left hand.. And it can't do follow many instructions or do them very precisely. But it shows that this kind of architecture will be be capable of that if scaled up most likely.
  - jumploops 1y ago
    These are great tests, thanks for sharing! And you seem to be right, though the only reference I can find is in one of the example images of a whiteboard posted on the announcement[0]. It shows: tokens -> [transformer] -> [diffusion] pixels hjups22 on Reddit[1] describes it as: > It's a hybrid model. The AR component generates control embeddings that then get decoded by a diffusion model. But the control embeddings are accurate enough to edit and reconstruct the images surprisingly well. [0]https://openai.com/index/introducing-4o-image-generation/ https://openai.com/index/introducing-4o-image-generation/ [1]https://www.reddit.com/r/MachineLearning/comments/1jkt42w/comment/mjyvwx5/ https://www.reddit.com/r/MachineLearning/comments/1jkt42w/co...
    - yousif_123123 1y ago
      Yes. Also, when testing low vs high, it seems the difference is mainly in the diffusion part, as the structure of the image and the instruction following ability is usually the same. Still, very exciting and for the future as well. It's still pretty expensive and slow. But moving in the right direction.
- 1y ago
tezza 1y ago
For the curious I generated the same prompt for each of the quality types. ‘Auto’, ‘low’, ‘medium’, ‘high’. Prompt: “a cute dog hugs a cute cat” https://x.com/terrylurie/status/1915161141489136095 https://x.com/terrylurie/status/1915161141489136095 I also then showed a couple of DALL:E 3 images for comparison in a comment
- latexr 1y ago
  > the same prompt for each of the quality types. ‘Auto’, ‘low’, ‘medium’, ‘high’. “Auto” is just whatever the best quality is for a model. So in this case it’s the same as “high”.
- echelon 1y ago
  > a cute dog hugs a cute cat This prompt is best served by Midjourney, Flux, Stable Diffusion. It'll be far cheaper, and chances are it'll also look a lot better. The place where gpt-image-1 shines if if you want to do a prompt like: "a cute dog hugs a cute cat, they're both standing on top of an algebra equation (y=$2x^{2}-3x-2$). Use the first reference image I uploaded as a source for the style of the dog. Same breed, same markings. The cat can contrast in fur color. Use the second reference image I uploaded as a guide for the background, but change the lighting to sunset. Also, solve the equation for x." gpt-image-1 doesn't make the best images, and it isn't cheap, and it isn't fast, but it's incredibly -- almost insanely -- powerful. It feels like ComfyUI got packed up into an LLM and provided as a natural language service.
  - stavros 1y ago
    I wonder if we can use gpt-image-1 outputs, with some noise, as inputs to diffusion models, so GPT takes care of adherence and the diffusion model improves the quality. Does anyone know whether that's at all possible?
    - levzzz 1y ago
      yes it's what a lot of people have been doing with newer models which have better prompt adherence, passing them through older models with better aesthetics
verelo 1y ago
“ Editing videos: invideo enables millions of users to transform their ideas into videos using AI. With the integration of gpt-image-1, the platform now offers improved text generation, fine-grain editing controls, and advanced style guidance.” Does this mean this also does video in some manner?
hexo 1y ago
Thank you for a great contribution to global warming.
greatgib 1y ago
Any one has an idea of what represent an "image token" for the pricing? Is it a block of an image from a given fixed size?
gcrfelix 1y ago
lesson: never build your moat around optimizing the existing AI capability
deleted 1y ago
[deleted]
jeevships 1y ago
Genuinely curious, why would someone buy from your gpt image wrapper when they can just create it in gpt themselves?
- tarikozket 1y ago
  different personas require different UXs. not everyone is going to understand and enjoy the chat interface; many will require a different UX.
- jonahx 1y ago
  Not being glib, but this is like the famous comment when dropbox was first announced: "you can already build such a system yourself quite trivially by getting an FTP account, mounting it locally with curlftpfs, and then using SVN or CVS on the mounted filesystem". [1] You might say, "but chatGPT is already as dead simple an interface as you can imagine". And the answer to that is, for specific tasks, no general interface is ever specific enough. So imagine you want to use this to create "headshots" or "linkedin bio photos" from random pictures of yourself. A bespoke interface, with options you haven't even considered already thought through for you, and some quality control/revisions baked into the process, is something someone might pay for. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9224 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9224
- darajava 1y ago
  I am using it in a little mini-company I built! https://clevercoloringbook.com https://clevercoloringbook.com
  - acyou 1y ago
    You can get custom 1-off printing for that cheap? What paper/binding do you use? Is the printer just drop shipping? Do you use a single printer, or is there a printing service that contracts the closer physical shop?
    - darajava 1y ago
      Yes it's dropshipping, I use Lulu.com's api - it's awesome!
p1dda 1y ago
For how long can OpenAI beat the dead horse that is LLM
topaz0 1y ago
Criminally wasteful.
ChaitanyaSai 1y ago
Almost every image has a yellow tint. Any discussion of why and when that's being fixed?
- thinkingemote 1y ago
  maybe it's a kind of watermark?
alasano 1y ago
I built a local playground for it if anyone is interested (your openai org needs to be verified btw..) https://github.com/Alasano/gpt-image-1-playground https://github.com/Alasano/gpt-image-1-playground Openai's Playground doesn't expose all the API options. Mine covers all options, has built in mask creation and cost tracking as well.
- test1235Mega 1y ago
  I really like that you build it, but I'm getting errors "Your organization must be verified to use the model `gpt-image-1" Can we talk in discord, please?
  - alasano 1y ago
    I think I linked to the verification process on OpenAI's website in then documentation. You need to verify your identity with a driver's license or passport with OpenAI to have access to certain things like chain of thought summaries in the API and image generation with the new model. Nothing I can do there, you gotta verify unfortunately.
pknerd 1y ago
I would like to know some resources about prompt engineering to use the Image gen module by OpenAI, especially for products related to images or Ads. PS: Does anyone know a good LLM/service to turn images into Videos?
_pdp_ 1y ago
We have integrated it into our platform and we already have use-cases for it to help create ads and other marketing material. However, while being better than my other models, it is not perfect. The image edit api will make a similar looking picture (even with masking) but exactly the same with some modifications.
rahulg 1y ago
Been waiting for this to implement Ghibli, Muppets etc. in my WhatsApp bot that converts your photos into AI generated art. Check it out at https://artstudiobot.com https://artstudiobot.com. 80% vibe-coded, 20% engineer friend.
- lucis 1y ago
  Very cool! The Stripe integration is neat BTW, if you can help me: I've been struggling with WhatsApp Business API for some days to make my app receive webhooks. It receives the GET verification request but when I send a message to the number I never get the POST. Have you had this problem?
  - rahulg 1y ago
    Thanks! Are you directly working with the business API? I'm using Gupshup's bot builder for this, so didn't really face any issues.
    - lucis 1y ago
      Yes, I was using the official one. But just gave a try to Gupshup and it's looking good, thanks for the recommendation!
hnthrowaway0315 1y ago
I wonder which model is the best to output standard 2d game resources: - N by N sprite sheets - Isometric sprite sheets Basically anything that I can directly drop into my little game engine.
- GaggiX 1y ago
  https://www.pixellab.ai/ https://www.pixellab.ai/ Maybe this one.
  - hnthrowaway0315 1y ago
    Thanks. I'm trying out this one. But somehow it is just spinning. I wonder why.
    - acyou 1y ago
      Which 2D game engine do you use? What is the game?
      - hnthrowaway0315 1y ago
        I'm writing my own engine. I'm trying to generate something similar to the original Ultima-IV style spritesheet. https://wiki.ultimacodex.com/images/0/0d/Ultima_4_-_Tiles.png https://wiki.ultimacodex.com/images/0/0d/Ultima_4_-_Tiles.pn...
        acyou 1y ago
        Very cool, are you using WebGL? Or WebGPU?
        hnthrowaway0315 1y ago
        Thanks, it's just a simple C++/SDL2 engine, unfinished though.
- 1y ago
PeterStuer 1y ago
My number one ask as am almost 2 year OpenAI in production user: Enable Tool Use in the API so I can evaluate OpenAI models in agentic environments without jumping through hoops.
- killthebuddha 1y ago
  https://platform.openai.com/docs/guides/agents#tools https://platform.openai.com/docs/guides/agents#tools
  - PeterStuer 1y ago
    I know I can code it up myself and then offer it as a model to Roo Code, but an "out of the box" api served model that can use tools like the Claude 3 family would be nice.
qhwudbebd 1y ago
I hope the images support in the responses API is more competently executed than the mess piling up in the v1/images/generations endpoint. To pick an example, we have a model parameter and a response_format parameter. The response_format parameter selects whether image data should be returned as a URL (old method) or directly, base64-encoded. The new model only supports base64, whereas the old models default to a URL return, which is fine and understandable. But the endpoint refuses to accept any value for response_format including b64_json with the new model, so you can't set-and-forget the new behaviour and allow the model to be parameterised without worrying about it. Instead, you have to request the new behaviour with the older models, and not request it (but still get it) with the new one. sigh
- qhwudbebd 1y ago
  Another masterpiece of elegance: v1/images/generations supports only application/json requests, whereas v1/images/edits supports only multipart/form-data. (The keys expected by the two calls are otherwise entirely compatible.)
JPKab 1y ago
As a paying customer, you get completely hosed every time they add a new feature for the non-paying users. The website is barely responding today, and the Desktop client always has massively degraded performance. Really annoying having their desire for user growth killing the experience for those of us who are financing it.
hombre_fatal 1y ago
I would have expected an API like: let imageId = api.generateImage(prompt) let {url, isFinished} = api.imageInfo(id) But instead it's: let bytes = api.generateImage(prompt) It's interesting to me how AI APIs let you hold such a persistent, active connection. I'm so used to anything that takes more than a second becoming an async background process where you notify the recipient when it's ready. With Netflix, it makes sense that you can open a connection to some static content and receive gigabytes over it. But streaming tokens from a GPU is a much more active process. Especially in this case where you're waiting tens of seconds for an image to generate.
- starik36 1y ago
  I can understand that for text answers, but what can you possibly do with streaming tokens for images?
  - radicality 1y ago
    AFAIK, The newer models for image gen like this OpenAI one, don’t actually use the normal diffusion process (image generates all at once from blurry to finished), but use transformer architecture where the full final image is generated from top to bottom, as a stream of ‘tokens’. That’s why when you generate an image in chatgpt nowadays, it will start displaying in full resolution from the top pixel row and start loading towards the bottom.
johnyzee 1y ago
I wanted to try this in the image playground, but I was told I have to add a payment method. When adding this, I was told I would also have to pay a minimum of $5. Did this. Then when trying to generate an image, I was told I would have to do "verification" of my organization (?). OK, I chose 'personal'. I was then told I have to complete the verification though some third party partner of OpenAI, which included giving permission to process my biometric information. Yeah, I don't want to try this that bad, but now I already paid you and have to struggle to figure out how to get my money back. Horrible UX.
- rideontime 1y ago
  Chargeback. Yes, this may result in your being banned from purchasing any OpenAI services in the future; I would see this as an added benefit to prevent making the same mistake again.
- vizzah 1y ago
  Be aware that OpenAI API credits expire after a year. I've added $5 year ago expecting to use the API, but only consumed $.02 or something. The API started throwing out "Too many requests" HTTP error when I needed it again and ooops!.. there were nothing left. All credit has gone. Wouldn't have expected that from a honest player.
  - funwares 1y ago
    Big thanks for the heads up, I had no idea about this. It looks like I will not be able to get any prepaid money back [0] so I will be careful not to put any further money on it. I guess I better start using some of the more expensive APIs to make it worth the $20 I prepaid. [0] https://openai.com/policies/service-credit-terms/ https://openai.com/policies/service-credit-terms/ 4. "All sales of Services, including sales of prepaid Services, are final. Service Credits are not refundable and expire one year after the date of purchase or issuance if not used, unless otherwise specified at the time of purchase."
gitroom 1y ago
Man, pain in the ass just to try an image API, and then all these hoops for payments, ID, even biometrics? Stuff like this always makes me think does anyone up top even try their own product? you figure all this extra friction just ends up pushing users somewhere else?
system2 1y ago
Jesus, $0.19 for an image you may or may not use. I think it is still super expensive to be useful. I go through 10 AI images until I find a useful one. This might not work for everyone.
- Wowfunhappy 1y ago
  You paid $1.90 for a useful image. Relative to the cost of commissioning an artist, that seems like a steal.
  - system2 1y ago
    If you are lucky*

487 points by themanmaran 1y ago

Pricing-wise, this API is going to be hard to justify the value unless you really can get value out of providing references. A generated `medium` 1024x1024 is $0.04/image, which is in the same cost class as Imagen 3 and Flux 1.1 Pro. Testing from their new playground (https://platform.openai.com/playground/images https://platform.openai.com/playground/images), the medium images are indeed lower quality than either of of two competitor models and still takes 15+ seconds to generate: https://x.com/minimaxir/status/1915114021466017830 https://x.com/minimaxir/status/1915114021466017830 Prompting the model is also substantially more different and difficult than traditional models, unsurprisingly given the way the model works. The traditional image tricks don't work out-of-the-box and I'm struggling to get something that works without significant prompt augmentation (which is what I suspect was used for the ChatGPT image generations)

tough 1y ago
It seems to me like this is a new hybrid product for -vibe coders- beacuse otherwise the -wrapping- of prompting/improving a prompt with an LLM before hitting the text2image model can certainly be done as you say cheaper if you just run it yourself. maybe OpenAI thinks model business is over and they need to start sherlocking all the way from the top to final apps (Thus their interest on buying out cursor, finally ending up with windsurf) Idk this feels like a new offering between a full raw API and a final product where you abstract some of it for a few cents, and they're basically bundling their SOTA llm models with their image models for extra margin
- vineyardmike 1y ago
  > It seems to me like this is a new hybrid product for -vibe coders- beacuse otherwise the -wrapping- of prompting/improving a prompt with an LLM before hitting the text2image model can certainly be done as you say cheaper if you just run it yourself. In case you didn’t know, it’s not just wrapping in an LLM. The image model they’re referencing is a model that’s directly integrated into the LLM for functionality. It’s not possible to extract, because the LLM outputs tokens which are part of the image itself. That said, they’re definitely trying to focus on building products over raw models now. They want to be a consumer subscription instead of commodity model provider.
  - tough 1y ago
    Right! I forgot the new model was a multi-modal one generating image outputs from both image and text inputs, i guess this is good and price will come down eventually. waiting for some FOSS multi-modal model to come out eventually too great to see openAI expanding into making actual usable products i guess
  - spilldahill 1y ago
    yeah, the integration is the real shift here. by embedding image generation into the LLM’s token stream, it’s no longer a pipeline of separate systems but a single unified model interface. that unlocks new use cases where you can reason, plan, and render all in one flow. it’s not just about replacing diffusion models, it’s about making generation part of a broader agentic loop. pricing will drop over time, but the shift in how you build with this is the more interesting part.
doctorpangloss 1y ago
It's far and away the most powerful image model right now. $0.04/image is a decent price!
- arevno 1y ago
  This is extremely domain-specific. Diffusion models work much better for certain things.
  - thot_experiment 1y ago
    Can you cite an example? I'm really curious where that set of usecases lies.
    - koakuma-chan 1y ago
      Explicit adult content.
      - thot_experiment 1y ago
        False. That has nothing to do with the model architecture and everything to do with cloud inference providers wanting to avoid regulatory scrutiny.
    - echelon 1y ago
      I work in the space. There are a lot of use cases that get censored by OpenAI, Kling, Runway, and various other providers for a wide variety of reasons: - OpenAI is notorious for blocking copyrighted characters. They do prompt keyword scanning, but also run a VLM on the results so you can't "trick" the model. - Lots of providers block public figures and celebrities. - Various providers block LGBT imagery, even safe for work prompts. Kling is notorious for this. - I was on a sales call with someone today who runs a father's advocacy group. I don't know what system he was using, but he said he found it impossible to generate an adult male with a child. In a totally safe for work context. - Some systems block "PG-13" images of characters that are in bathing suits or scantily clad. None of this is porn, mind you.
simonw 1y ago
It may lose against other models on prompt-to-image, but I'd be very excited to see another model that's as good at this one as image+prompt-to-image. Editing photos with ChatGPT over the past few weeks has been SO much fun. Here's my dog in a pelican costume: https://bsky.app/profile/simonwillison.net/post/3lneuquczzs2i https://bsky.app/profile/simonwillison.net/post/3lneuquczzs2...
- steve_adams_86 1y ago
  The dog ChatGPT generated doesn't actually look like your dog. The eyes are so different. Really cute image, though.
furyofantares 1y ago
I find prompting the model substantially easier than traditional models, is it really more difficult or are you just used to traditional models? I suspect what I'll do with the API is iterate at medium quality and then generate a high quality image when I'm done.
thot_experiment 1y ago
Similarly to how 90% of my LLM needs are met by Mistral 3.1, there's no reason to use 4o for most t2i or i2i, however there's a definite set of tasks that are not possible with diffusion models, or if they are they require a giant ball of node spaghetti in comfyui to achieve. The price is high but the likelyhood of getting the right answer on the first try is absolutely worth the cost imo.
Sohcahtoa82 1y ago
> A generated `medium` 1024x1024 is $0.04/image It's actually more than that. It's about 16.7 cents per image. $0.04/image is the pricing for DALL-E 3.
- weird-eye-issue 1y ago
  No, it's not
- mkl 1y ago
  16.7 cents is the high quality cost, and medium is 4.2 cents: https://platform.openai.com/docs/pricing#:~:text=1M%20characters-,Image%20generation,-Price/image https://platform.openai.com/docs/pricing#:~:text=1M%20charac...
  - Sohcahtoa82 1y ago
    Ah, they changed that page since I saw it yesterday. They didn't show low/med/high quality, they just said an image was a certain number of tokens with a price per token that led to $0.16/image.
raincole 1y ago
ChatGPT's prompt adherence is light years ahead of all the others. I won't even call Flux/Midjoueny its competitors. ChatGPT image gen is practically a one-of-its-kind unique product on the market: the only usable AI image editor for people without image editing experience. I think in terms of image generation, ChatGPT is the biggest leap since Stable Diffusion's release. LoRA/ControlNet/Flux are forgettable in comparison.
- soared 1y ago
  This is a take so incredulous it doesn’t seem credible.
  - tacoooooooo 1y ago
    its 100% the correct take
    - fkyoureadthedoc 1y ago
      yeah this is my personal experience. The new image generation is the only reason I keep an OpenAI subscription rather than switching to Google.
  - mediaman 1y ago
    It is correct, the shift from diffusion to transformers is a very, very big difference.
  - stavros 1y ago
    I can confirm, ChatGPT's prompt adherence is so incredibly good, it gets even really small details right, to a level that diffusion-based generators couldn't even dream of.
  - abhpro 1y ago
    Also chiming in to say you're wrong, I mean they're correct
- thegeomaster 1y ago
adamhowell 1y ago
So, I've long dreamed of building an AI-powered https://iconfinder.com https://iconfinder.com. I started Accomplice v1 back in 2021 with this goal in mind and raised some VC money but it was too early. Now, with these latest imagen-3.0-generate-002 (Gemini) and gpt-image-1 (OpenAI) models – especially this API release from OpenAI – I've been able to resurrect Accomplice as a little side project. Accomplice v2 (https://accomplice.ai https://accomplice.ai) is just getting started back up again – I honestly decided to rebuild it only a couple weeks ago in preparation for today once I saw ChatGPT's new image model – but so far 1,000s of free to download PNGs (and any SVGs that have already been vectorized are free too (costs a credit to vectorize)). I generate new icons every few minutes from a huge list of "useful icons" I've built. Will be 100% pay-as-you-go. And for a credit, paid users can vectorize any PNGs they like, tweak them using AI, upload their own images to vectorize and download, or create their own icons (with my prompt injections baked in to get you good icon results) Do multi-modal models make something like this obsolete? I honestly am not sure. In my experience with Accomplice v1, a lot of users didn't know what to do with a blank textarea, so the thinking here is there's value in doing some of the work for them upfront with a large searchable archive. Would love to hear others' thoughts. But I'm having fun again either way.
- stavros 1y ago
  That looks interesting, but I don't know how useful single icons can be. For me, the really useful part would be to get a suite of icons that all have a consistent visual style. Bonus points if I can prompt the model to generate more icons with that same style.
  - throwup238 1y ago
    Recraft has a style feature where you give some images. I wonder if that would work for icons. You can also try giving an image of a bunch of icons to ChatGPT and have it generate more, then vectorize them.
    - stavros 1y ago
      I think the latter approach is the best bet right now, agree.
varenc 1y ago
pretty amazing that in ~two years a 15 second latency AI image generation API that cost 4 cents lags behind competitors.
- echelon 1y ago
  This product does not lag behind competitors. Once you take the time to understand how it works, it's clear that this is an order of magnitude more powerful than anything else on the market. While there's a market need for fast diffusion, that's already been filled and is now a race to the bottom. There's nobody else that can do what OpenAI does with gpt-image-1. This model is a truly programmable graphics workflow engine. And this type of model has so much more value than mere "image generation". gpt-image-1 replaces ComfyUI, inpainting/outpainting, LoRAs, and in time one could imagine it replaces Adobe Photoshop and nearly all the things people use it for. It's an image manipulation engine, not just a diffusion model. It understands what you want on the first try, and it does a remarkably good job at it. gpt-image-1 is a graphics design department in a box. Please don't think of this as a model where you prompt things like "a dog and a cat hugging". This is so much more than that.
vunderba 1y ago
> Prompting the model is also substantially more different and difficult than traditional models Can you elaborate? This was not my experience - retesting the prompts that I used for my GenAI image shootout against gpt-image-1 API proved largely similar. https://genai-showdown.specr.net https://genai-showdown.specr.net
Wowfunhappy 1y ago
Huh? For me the quality of the API seems to be identical to what I'm getting in ChatGPT.

sebastiennight 1y ago

Hmm seems pricey. What's the current state of the art for API generation of an image from a reference plus modifier prompt? Say, in the 1c per HD (1920*1080) image range?

minimaxir 1y ago
"Image from a reference" is a bit of a rabbit hole. For traditional image generation models, in order for it to learn a reference, you have to fine-tune it (LoRA) and/or use a conditioning model to constrain the output (InstantID/ControlNet) The interesting part of this GPT-4o API is that it doesn't need to learn them. But given the cost of `high` quality image generation, it's much cheaper to train a LoRA for Flux 1.1 Pro and generate from that.
- Tiberium 1y ago
  Imagen supports image references in the API as well, just on Vertex, not on Gemini API yet.
  - BoorishBears 1y ago
    Imagen references don't feel very useful at all. At most it feels like an afterthought meant to make product photoshoots easier.
- thot_experiment 1y ago
  Reflux is fantastic for the basic reference image based editing most people are using this for, but 4o is far more powerful than any existing models because of it's large scale and cross-modal understanding, there are things possible with 4o that are just 100% impossible with diffusion models. (full glass of wine, horse riding an astronaut, room without pink elephants, etc)

gervwyk 1y ago

Great svg generation would be far more userful! For example, being able to edit svg images after generated by Ai would be quick to modify the last mile.. For our new website https://resonancy.io https://resonancy.io the simple svg workflow images created was still very much created by hand.. and trying various ai tools to make such images yielded shockingly bad off-brand results even when provided multiple examples. By far the best tool for this is still canva for us.. Anyone know of an Ai model for generating svg images? Please share.

tough 1y ago
SVGFusion https://arxiv.org/abs/2412.10437 https://arxiv.org/abs/2412.10437 which is a new paper from SVGRender group https://huggingface.co/SVGRender https://huggingface.co/SVGRender OmniSVG https://arxiv.org/abs/2504.06263v1 https://arxiv.org/abs/2504.06263v1
- gervwyk 1y ago
  Amazing thanks for sharing! Will have a read. A commercial model would be something that I will pay for!
  - tough 1y ago
    I don't know about -commercial- offerings but you can try also something like SVGRender which you should be able to run on your own GPU etc https://ximinng.github.io/PyTorch-SVGRender-project/ https://ximinng.github.io/PyTorch-SVGRender-project/ first paper linked on prior comment is the latest one from SVGRender group, but not sure if any runnable model weights are out yet for it (SVGFusion)
  - corysama 1y ago
    Is free cheap enough ;) https://omnisvg.github.io/ https://omnisvg.github.io/ https://huggingface.co/OmniSVG https://huggingface.co/OmniSVG
simonw 1y ago
I was impressed with recraft.ai for SVGs - https://simonwillison.net/2024/Nov/15/recraft-v3/ https://simonwillison.net/2024/Nov/15/recraft-v3/ - though as far as I can tell they generate raster images and then SVG-ize them before returning the result.

smrt 1y ago

I don't understand why this api needs organization verification. More paperwork ahead. Facepalm PermissionDeniedError: Error code: 403 - {'error': {'message': 'To access gpt-image-1, please complete organization verification

themanmaran 1y ago
Likely because they've seen a lot of the potential abuse capabilities. i.e. the "generate a drivers license with this face". So the options are: 1) nerf the model so it can't produce images like that, or 2) use some type of KYC verification.
- magackame 1y ago
  The model is already pretty lobotomized refusing even mundane requests randomly. Upload a picture of a friend -> OK. Upload my own picture -> I can't generate anything involving real people. Also after they enabled global chat memory I started seeing my other chats leaking into the images as literal text. Disabled it since.
- vunderba 1y ago
  Yep - the API lets you lower the moderation which I observed allows for more violent and graphic prompts, but it still exists and will often reject if you reference popular figures/etc.
bayesianbot 1y ago
It says "Organization verification" but I got my personal account (with Personal as organization) verified with just a passport.

animanoir 1y ago

Wow more AI slop

pkulak 1y ago

I don't get it. I've been using `dall-e-3` over the public API for a couple years now. Is this just a new model? EDIT: Oh, yes, that's what it appears to be. Is it better? Why would I switch?

themanmaran 1y ago
This is the new model that's available in ChatGPT, which most notably can do transfer generation. i.e. "take this image and restyle it to look like X". Or "take this sneaker and give me a billboard ad for it"
danielbln 1y ago
This is their presumably auto regressive image model. It has outstanding prompt adherence and great detail in addition to strong style transfer abilities.
Sohcahtoa82 1y ago
The new image generation model is miles ahead of DALL-E 3, especially when generating text.
bradly 1y ago
Basically they are charging for the ability to make accurate text generation.

film42 1y ago

I generated 5 images in the playground. One using a text-only prompt and 4 using images from my phone. I spent $0.85 which isn't bad for a fun round of Studio Ghibli portraits for the family group chat, but too expensive to be used in a customer facing product.

sumedh 1y ago
> but too expensive to be used in a customer facing product. Enhance headshots for putting on Linkedin.
- BOOSTERHIDROGEN 1y ago
  is it good?
  - stavros 1y ago
    No, it can't do detail well, AFAIK the images are produced at a lower resolution and then upscaled. This might be specific to the ChatGPT version, however, for cost cutting.
- bamboozled 1y ago
  Can't wait to meet people in person who look nothing like their profile pictures on linkedin :)
  - martin_a 1y ago
    I already did. Looked in the mirror just an hour ago. Strange guy, very tired, never seen him before.
- salomonk_mur 1y ago
  It doesn't keep facial details in the generation. The generated person resembles you but is definitely not you.
  - 1y ago

MisterBiggs 1y ago

Lots of comments on the price being too high, what are the odds this is a subsidized bare metal cost?

kevinqi 1y ago
just based on how long it takes to produce these images, and how much text responses cost, I wouldn't be surprised at all if it was close to cost

scyzoryk_xyz 1y ago

Intelligence is fast approaching utility status.

1oooqooq 1y ago

aren't you all embarrassed seeing lame press releases of the most uninteresting things on the top of HN front page? i kinda feel bad.

bobxmax 1y ago
I'm embarassed that you find revolutionary tech uninteresting.
- 1oooqooq 1y ago
  it's literary one feature now available in a different billing format. get a gripe.
  - stavros 1y ago
    When I grow up, I too want to dismiss things without even knowing what I'm talking about.
  - urbandw311er 1y ago
    It’s available by API now, previously it was not. That’s pretty big news. This isn’t a billing related thing.
sumedh 1y ago
This news is relevant for developers though.
- GuinansEyebrows 1y ago
  How so? I'm (nominally) a developer and this has nothing to do with my job or personal pursuits.
  - matkoniecz 1y ago
    Noone was claiming that it is relevant to every single developer. Hard to find such news.

drakenot 1y ago

Does the AI have the same content restrictions that the chat service does?

Wowfunhappy 1y ago
Yes by default, but you can change it: > Additionally, developers can also control moderation sensitivity with the `moderation` parameter, which can be set to auto (default) for standard filtering, or low for less restrictive filtering. I played around with this last night and although it still sometimes refused to create images, it seemed to be significantly more lenient.

Imnimo 1y ago

I'm curious what the applications are where people need to generate hundreds or thousands of these images. I like making Ghibli-esque versions of family photos as much as the next person, but I don't need to make them in volume. As far as I can recall, every time I've used image generation, it's been one-off things that I'm happy to do in the ChatGPT UI.

marviel 1y ago
AI-assisted education is promising.
- Etheryte 1y ago
  That is true in a broader sense, but education and abundant money don't generally go hand in hand.
  - marviel 1y ago
    don't I know it
- samtp 1y ago
  I'm still struggling to see how you would need thousands of AI generated images rather than just using existing real images for education.
  - marviel 1y ago
    - personalization (style, analogy to known concepts) - specificity (a diagram that perfectly encapsulates the exact set of concepts you're asking about)
    - indeyets 1y ago
      But LLMs are not reliable enough, so you can not actually expect “specificity”

cuuupid 1y ago

When this was up yesterday I complained that the refusal rate was super high especially on government and military shaped tasks, and that this would only push contractors to use CN-developed open source models for work that could then be compromised. Today I'm discovering there is a tier of API access with virtually no content moderation available to companies working in that space. I have no idea how to go about requesting that tier of access, but have spoken to 4 different defense contractors in the last day who seem to already be using it.

refulgentis 1y ago
It's "tier 5", I've had an account since the 3.0 days so I can't be positive I'm not grandfathered in, but, my understanding is as long as you have a non-trivial amount of spend for a few months you'll have that access. (fwiw for anyone curious how to implement it, it's the 'moderation' parameter in the JSON request you'll send, I missed it for a few hours because it wasn't in Dalle-3)
- dunkmaster 1y ago
  API shows either auto or low available. Is there another secret value with even lower restrictions?
  - refulgentis 1y ago
    Not that I know of. I just took any indication that the parent post meant absolute zero moderation as them being a bit loose with their words and excitable with how they understand things, there were some signs: 1. it's unlikely they completed an API integration quickly enough to have an opinion on military / defense image generation moderation yesterday, so they're almost certainly speaking about ChatGPT. (this is additionally confirmed by image generation requiring tier 5 anyway, which they would have been aware of if they had integrated) 2. The military / defense use cases for image generation are not provided (and the steelman'd version in other comments is nonsensical, i.e. we can quickly validate you can still generate kanban boards or wireframes of ships) 3. The poster passively disclaims being in military / defense themself (grep "in that space") 4. it is hard to envision cases of #2 that do not require universal moderation for OpenAI's sake, i.e. lets say their thought process is along the lines of: defense/military ~= what I think of as CIA ~= black ops ~= image manipulation on social media, thus, the time I said "please edit this photo of the ayatollah to have him eating pig and say I hate allah" means its overmoderated for defense use cases 5. It's unlikely openai wants to be anywhere near PR resulting from #4. Assuming there is a super secret defense tier that allows this, it's at the very least, unlikely that the poster's defense contractor friends were blabbing about about the exclusive completely unmoderated access they had, to the poster, within hours of release. They're pretty serious about that secrecy stuff! 6. It is unlikely the lack of ability to generate images using GPT Image 1 would drive the military to Chinese models (there aren't Chinese LLMs that do this! even if they were, there's plenty of good ol' American diffusion models!)

jonplackett 1y ago

Does anyone know if you can give this endpoint an image as input along with text - not just an image to mask, but an image as part of a text input description. I can’t see a way to do this currently, you just get a prompt. This, I think, is the most powerful way to use the new image model since it actually understands the input image and can make a new one based on it. Eg you can give it a person sitting at a desk and it can make one of them standing up. Or from another angle. Or in the moon.

loktarogar 1y ago
Seems like exactly one of their examples, or am I missing something? "Create a new image using image references" https://platform.openai.com/docs/guides/image-generation#create-a-new-image-using-image-references https://platform.openai.com/docs/guides/image-generation#cre...
- jonplackett 1y ago
  Awesome. Thank you!
adamhowell 1y ago
I think this is technically "image variations" and I think image variations are still only dall-e 3 for now (best I could tell earlier today from the API)

badmonster 1y ago

Usage of gpt-image-1 is priced per token, with separate pricing for text and image tokens: Text input tokens (prompt text): $5 per 1M tokens Image input tokens (input images): $10 per 1M tokens Image output tokens (generated images): $40 per 1M tokens In practice, this translates to roughly $0.02, $0.07, and $0.19 per generated image for low, medium, and high-quality square images, respectively. that's a bit pricy for a startup.

m4thfr34k 1y ago
Isn't there also a cost per image? The pricing page shows $0.25 for a high quality 1536x1024 image. 25 cents per image is ... steep lol
- BoorishBears 1y ago
  Cost per image is based on output tokens (because they're output tokens)

GaggiX 1y ago

Far too expensive, I think I will wait for an equivalent Gemini model.

claiir 1y ago

> GoDaddy is actively experimenting to integrate image generation so customers can easily create logos that are editable [..] I remember meeting someone on Discord 1-2 years ago (?) working on a GoDaddy effort to have customer-generated icons using bespoke foundation image gen models? Suppose that kind of bespoke model at that scale is ripe for replacement by gpt-image-1, given the instruction-following ability / steerability?

jumploops 1y ago

This new model is autoregression-based (similar to LLMs, token by token) rather than diffusion based, meaning that it adheres to text prompts with much higher accuracy. As an example, some users (myself included) of a generative image app were trying to make a picture of person in the pouch of a kangaroo. No matter what we prompted, we couldn’t get it to work. GPT-4o did it in one shot!

yousif_123123 1y ago
It's a mix of both it feels to me as I've been testing it. For example, you can't get it to make a clock showing custom time like 3:30, or someone writing with their left hand.. And it can't do follow many instructions or do them very precisely. But it shows that this kind of architecture will be be capable of that if scaled up most likely.
- jumploops 1y ago
  These are great tests, thanks for sharing! And you seem to be right, though the only reference I can find is in one of the example images of a whiteboard posted on the announcement[0]. It shows: tokens -> [transformer] -> [diffusion] pixels hjups22 on Reddit[1] describes it as: > It's a hybrid model. The AR component generates control embeddings that then get decoded by a diffusion model. But the control embeddings are accurate enough to edit and reconstruct the images surprisingly well. [0]https://openai.com/index/introducing-4o-image-generation/ https://openai.com/index/introducing-4o-image-generation/ [1]https://www.reddit.com/r/MachineLearning/comments/1jkt42w/comment/mjyvwx5/ https://www.reddit.com/r/MachineLearning/comments/1jkt42w/co...
  - yousif_123123 1y ago
    Yes. Also, when testing low vs high, it seems the difference is mainly in the diffusion part, as the structure of the image and the instruction following ability is usually the same. Still, very exciting and for the future as well. It's still pretty expensive and slow. But moving in the right direction.
1y ago

tezza 1y ago

For the curious I generated the same prompt for each of the quality types. ‘Auto’, ‘low’, ‘medium’, ‘high’. Prompt: “a cute dog hugs a cute cat” https://x.com/terrylurie/status/1915161141489136095 https://x.com/terrylurie/status/1915161141489136095 I also then showed a couple of DALL:E 3 images for comparison in a comment

latexr 1y ago
> the same prompt for each of the quality types. ‘Auto’, ‘low’, ‘medium’, ‘high’. “Auto” is just whatever the best quality is for a model. So in this case it’s the same as “high”.
echelon 1y ago
> a cute dog hugs a cute cat This prompt is best served by Midjourney, Flux, Stable Diffusion. It'll be far cheaper, and chances are it'll also look a lot better. The place where gpt-image-1 shines if if you want to do a prompt like: "a cute dog hugs a cute cat, they're both standing on top of an algebra equation (y=$2x^{2}-3x-2$). Use the first reference image I uploaded as a source for the style of the dog. Same breed, same markings. The cat can contrast in fur color. Use the second reference image I uploaded as a guide for the background, but change the lighting to sunset. Also, solve the equation for x." gpt-image-1 doesn't make the best images, and it isn't cheap, and it isn't fast, but it's incredibly -- almost insanely -- powerful. It feels like ComfyUI got packed up into an LLM and provided as a natural language service.
- stavros 1y ago
  I wonder if we can use gpt-image-1 outputs, with some noise, as inputs to diffusion models, so GPT takes care of adherence and the diffusion model improves the quality. Does anyone know whether that's at all possible?
  - levzzz 1y ago
    yes it's what a lot of people have been doing with newer models which have better prompt adherence, passing them through older models with better aesthetics

verelo 1y ago

“ Editing videos: invideo enables millions of users to transform their ideas into videos using AI. With the integration of gpt-image-1, the platform now offers improved text generation, fine-grain editing controls, and advanced style guidance.” Does this mean this also does video in some manner?

hexo 1y ago

Thank you for a great contribution to global warming.

greatgib 1y ago

Any one has an idea of what represent an "image token" for the pricing? Is it a block of an image from a given fixed size?

gcrfelix 1y ago

lesson: never build your moat around optimizing the existing AI capability

deleted 1y ago

[deleted]

jeevships 1y ago

Genuinely curious, why would someone buy from your gpt image wrapper when they can just create it in gpt themselves?

tarikozket 1y ago
different personas require different UXs. not everyone is going to understand and enjoy the chat interface; many will require a different UX.
jonahx 1y ago
Not being glib, but this is like the famous comment when dropbox was first announced: "you can already build such a system yourself quite trivially by getting an FTP account, mounting it locally with curlftpfs, and then using SVN or CVS on the mounted filesystem". [1] You might say, "but chatGPT is already as dead simple an interface as you can imagine". And the answer to that is, for specific tasks, no general interface is ever specific enough. So imagine you want to use this to create "headshots" or "linkedin bio photos" from random pictures of yourself. A bespoke interface, with options you haven't even considered already thought through for you, and some quality control/revisions baked into the process, is something someone might pay for. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9224 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9224
darajava 1y ago
I am using it in a little mini-company I built! https://clevercoloringbook.com https://clevercoloringbook.com
- acyou 1y ago
  You can get custom 1-off printing for that cheap? What paper/binding do you use? Is the printer just drop shipping? Do you use a single printer, or is there a printing service that contracts the closer physical shop?
  - darajava 1y ago
    Yes it's dropshipping, I use Lulu.com's api - it's awesome!

p1dda 1y ago

For how long can OpenAI beat the dead horse that is LLM

topaz0 1y ago

Criminally wasteful.

ChaitanyaSai 1y ago

Almost every image has a yellow tint. Any discussion of why and when that's being fixed?

thinkingemote 1y ago
maybe it's a kind of watermark?

alasano 1y ago

I built a local playground for it if anyone is interested (your openai org needs to be verified btw..) https://github.com/Alasano/gpt-image-1-playground https://github.com/Alasano/gpt-image-1-playground Openai's Playground doesn't expose all the API options. Mine covers all options, has built in mask creation and cost tracking as well.

test1235Mega 1y ago
I really like that you build it, but I'm getting errors "Your organization must be verified to use the model `gpt-image-1" Can we talk in discord, please?
- alasano 1y ago
  I think I linked to the verification process on OpenAI's website in then documentation. You need to verify your identity with a driver's license or passport with OpenAI to have access to certain things like chain of thought summaries in the API and image generation with the new model. Nothing I can do there, you gotta verify unfortunately.

pknerd 1y ago

I would like to know some resources about prompt engineering to use the Image gen module by OpenAI, especially for products related to images or Ads. PS: Does anyone know a good LLM/service to turn images into Videos?

_pdp_ 1y ago

We have integrated it into our platform and we already have use-cases for it to help create ads and other marketing material. However, while being better than my other models, it is not perfect. The image edit api will make a similar looking picture (even with masking) but exactly the same with some modifications.

rahulg 1y ago

Been waiting for this to implement Ghibli, Muppets etc. in my WhatsApp bot that converts your photos into AI generated art. Check it out at https://artstudiobot.com https://artstudiobot.com. 80% vibe-coded, 20% engineer friend.

lucis 1y ago
Very cool! The Stripe integration is neat BTW, if you can help me: I've been struggling with WhatsApp Business API for some days to make my app receive webhooks. It receives the GET verification request but when I send a message to the number I never get the POST. Have you had this problem?
- rahulg 1y ago
  Thanks! Are you directly working with the business API? I'm using Gupshup's bot builder for this, so didn't really face any issues.
  - lucis 1y ago
    Yes, I was using the official one. But just gave a try to Gupshup and it's looking good, thanks for the recommendation!

hnthrowaway0315 1y ago

I wonder which model is the best to output standard 2d game resources: - N by N sprite sheets - Isometric sprite sheets Basically anything that I can directly drop into my little game engine.

GaggiX 1y ago
https://www.pixellab.ai/ https://www.pixellab.ai/ Maybe this one.
- hnthrowaway0315 1y ago
  Thanks. I'm trying out this one. But somehow it is just spinning. I wonder why.
  - acyou 1y ago
    Which 2D game engine do you use? What is the game?
    - hnthrowaway0315 1y ago
      I'm writing my own engine. I'm trying to generate something similar to the original Ultima-IV style spritesheet. https://wiki.ultimacodex.com/images/0/0d/Ultima_4_-_Tiles.png https://wiki.ultimacodex.com/images/0/0d/Ultima_4_-_Tiles.pn...
      - acyou 1y ago
        Very cool, are you using WebGL? Or WebGPU?
        hnthrowaway0315 1y ago
        Thanks, it's just a simple C++/SDL2 engine, unfinished though.
1y ago

PeterStuer 1y ago

My number one ask as am almost 2 year OpenAI in production user: Enable Tool Use in the API so I can evaluate OpenAI models in agentic environments without jumping through hoops.

killthebuddha 1y ago
https://platform.openai.com/docs/guides/agents#tools https://platform.openai.com/docs/guides/agents#tools
- PeterStuer 1y ago
  I know I can code it up myself and then offer it as a model to Roo Code, but an "out of the box" api served model that can use tools like the Claude 3 family would be nice.

qhwudbebd 1y ago

I hope the images support in the responses API is more competently executed than the mess piling up in the v1/images/generations endpoint. To pick an example, we have a model parameter and a response_format parameter. The response_format parameter selects whether image data should be returned as a URL (old method) or directly, base64-encoded. The new model only supports base64, whereas the old models default to a URL return, which is fine and understandable. But the endpoint refuses to accept any value for response_format including b64_json with the new model, so you can't set-and-forget the new behaviour and allow the model to be parameterised without worrying about it. Instead, you have to request the new behaviour with the older models, and not request it (but still get it) with the new one. sigh

qhwudbebd 1y ago
Another masterpiece of elegance: v1/images/generations supports only application/json requests, whereas v1/images/edits supports only multipart/form-data. (The keys expected by the two calls are otherwise entirely compatible.)

JPKab 1y ago

As a paying customer, you get completely hosed every time they add a new feature for the non-paying users. The website is barely responding today, and the Desktop client always has massively degraded performance. Really annoying having their desire for user growth killing the experience for those of us who are financing it.

hombre_fatal 1y ago

I would have expected an API like: let imageId = api.generateImage(prompt) let {url, isFinished} = api.imageInfo(id) But instead it's: let bytes = api.generateImage(prompt) It's interesting to me how AI APIs let you hold such a persistent, active connection. I'm so used to anything that takes more than a second becoming an async background process where you notify the recipient when it's ready. With Netflix, it makes sense that you can open a connection to some static content and receive gigabytes over it. But streaming tokens from a GPU is a much more active process. Especially in this case where you're waiting tens of seconds for an image to generate.

starik36 1y ago
I can understand that for text answers, but what can you possibly do with streaming tokens for images?
- radicality 1y ago
  AFAIK, The newer models for image gen like this OpenAI one, don’t actually use the normal diffusion process (image generates all at once from blurry to finished), but use transformer architecture where the full final image is generated from top to bottom, as a stream of ‘tokens’. That’s why when you generate an image in chatgpt nowadays, it will start displaying in full resolution from the top pixel row and start loading towards the bottom.

johnyzee 1y ago

I wanted to try this in the image playground, but I was told I have to add a payment method. When adding this, I was told I would also have to pay a minimum of $5. Did this. Then when trying to generate an image, I was told I would have to do "verification" of my organization (?). OK, I chose 'personal'. I was then told I have to complete the verification though some third party partner of OpenAI, which included giving permission to process my biometric information. Yeah, I don't want to try this that bad, but now I already paid you and have to struggle to figure out how to get my money back. Horrible UX.

rideontime 1y ago
Chargeback. Yes, this may result in your being banned from purchasing any OpenAI services in the future; I would see this as an added benefit to prevent making the same mistake again.
vizzah 1y ago
Be aware that OpenAI API credits expire after a year. I've added $5 year ago expecting to use the API, but only consumed $.02 or something. The API started throwing out "Too many requests" HTTP error when I needed it again and ooops!.. there were nothing left. All credit has gone. Wouldn't have expected that from a honest player.
- funwares 1y ago
  Big thanks for the heads up, I had no idea about this. It looks like I will not be able to get any prepaid money back [0] so I will be careful not to put any further money on it. I guess I better start using some of the more expensive APIs to make it worth the $20 I prepaid. [0] https://openai.com/policies/service-credit-terms/ https://openai.com/policies/service-credit-terms/ 4. "All sales of Services, including sales of prepaid Services, are final. Service Credits are not refundable and expire one year after the date of purchase or issuance if not used, unless otherwise specified at the time of purchase."

gitroom 1y ago

Man, pain in the ass just to try an image API, and then all these hoops for payments, ID, even biometrics? Stuff like this always makes me think does anyone up top even try their own product? you figure all this extra friction just ends up pushing users somewhere else?

system2 1y ago

Jesus, $0.19 for an image you may or may not use. I think it is still super expensive to be useful. I go through 10 AI images until I find a useful one. This might not work for everyone.

Wowfunhappy 1y ago
You paid $1.90 for a useful image. Relative to the cost of commissioning an artist, that seems like a steal.
- system2 1y ago
  If you are lucky*