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> ask for regulation then ask for exempt That's exactly what has been happening: Ask HN: Why is OpenAI pushing for regulation so much - 2023 https://news.yco
by svilen_dobrev 2y ago
> ask for regulation then ask for exempt
That's exactly what has been happening:
Ask HN: Why is OpenAI pushing for regulation so much - 2023
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36045397 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36045397
- api 2y agoOpenAI lobbied for restrictive rules, and now they want an "out" but only for themselves. Absolute naked regulatory capture.
- hnlurker22 2y agoJust like when people complain about OpenAI's ill practices then they use it the most
- henriquez 2y ago[flagged]
- TheRealNGenius 2y ago[dead]
- smt88 2y agoYou need a big "/s" after this. Or maybe just not post it at all, because it's just value-less snark and not a substantial comment on how hypocritical and harmful OpenAI is (which they certainly are).
- henriquez 2y agoBut I already posted it so how could I not post it at all? Do any of us even have a reason to exist? Maybe Sam Altman was right all along
- tdeck 2y agoCan anyone say which of the LLM companies is the least "shady"? If I want to use an LLM to augment my work, and don't have a massively powerful local machine to run local models, what are the best options? Obviously I saw the news about OpenAI's head of research openly supporting war crimes, but I don't feel confident about what's up with the other companies.
- bakuninsbart 2y agoThe Claude people seem to be quite chill.
- disgruntledphd2 2y agoAgreed. They're a bit mental on "safety" but given that's not likely to be a real issue then they're fine.
- neuronexmachina 2y agoGiven the growing focus on AIs as agents, I think it's going to be a real issue sooner rather than later.
- adastra22 2y ago“Safety” was in air quotes for a reason. The Claude peoples’ idea of “AI safety” risks are straight out of the terminator movies.
- robbiep 2y agoWouldn’t you rather have a player concerned with worst case scenarios?
- chithanh 2y agoDefending against movie plot threats has been found not a good use of resources already 20 years ago in the war on terrorism. https://www.schneier.com/essays/archives/2005/09/terrorists_dont_do_m.html https://www.schneier.com/essays/archives/2005/09/terrorists_...
- bigbuppo 2y agoMy AI strategy is still "No".
- ramses0 2y ago[flagged]
- fuzztester 2y agoAmen
- ceejayoz 2y agohttps://knowyourmeme.com/memes/we-should-improve-society-somewhat/ https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/we-should-improve-society-som...
- hnlurker22 2y agohttps://knowyourmeme.com/memes/analogia-is-my-passion https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/analogia-is-my-passion
- sitkack 2y agoAlso textbook Fascism. Trump should have a Most Favored Corporate status, each corporation in a vertical can compete for favor and the one that does gets to be "teacher's pet" when it comes to exemptions, contracts, trade deals, priority in resource right access, etc.
- yadaeno 2y agoCan you explain why this is associated with fascism specifically, and not any other form of government which has high levels of oligarchical corruption (like North Korea, Soviet Russia, etc). I am not saying you’re wrong, but please educate me why is this form of corruption/cronyism is unique to fascism?
- tdeck 2y agoIt might be basic, but I found the Wikipedia article to be a good place to start: > An important aspect of fascist economies was economic dirigism,[35] meaning an economy where the government often subsidizes favorable companies and exerts strong directive influence over investment, as opposed to having a merely regulatory role. In general, fascist economies were based on private property and private initiative, but these were contingent upon service to the state. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economics_of_fascism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economics_of_fascism
- the_optimist 2y agoIt’s a poor definition. The same “subsidization and directive influence” applies to all of Krugman’s Nobel-wining domestic champion, emerging market development leaders, in virtually all ‘successful’ economies. It also applies in the context of badly run, failed and failing economies. Safe to say this factor is only somewhat correlated. Broad assertions are going to be factually wrong.
- matthewdgreen 2y agoThe key element here is that the power exchange in this case goes both ways. The corporations do favors for the administration (sometimes outright corrupt payments and sometimes useful favors, like promoting certain kinds of content in the media, or firing employees who speak up.) And in exchange the companies get regulatory favors. While all economic distortions can be problematic — national champion companies probably have tradeoffs - this is a form of distortion that hurts citizens both by distorting the market, and also by distorting the democratic environment by which citizens might correct the problems.
- arkadiytehgraet 2y agoI believe with regulatory capture the companies that pushed for the regulation in the first place at least comply with it (and hopefully the regulation is not worthless). This behaviour by ClosedAI is even worse: push for the regulation, then push for the exemption.
- cogman10 2y agoRegulatory capture is usually the company pushing for regulations that align with the business practices they already implement and would be hard for a competitor to implement. For example, a car company that wants to require all other manufactures to build and operate wind tunnels for aerodynamics testing. Or more realistically, regulations requiring 3rd party sellers for vehicles.
- m463 2y agoRegulators can require all manufactures to build and operate wind tunnels for aerodynamics testing, or alternatively allow someone from south africa to be president.
- idiotsecant 2y agoThat's the first time I've ever heard someone make this unusual and very specific definition. It's almost always much simpler - you get favorable regulatory findings and exemptions by promising jobs or other benefits to the people doing the regulating. It's not complicated, it's just bribery with a different name.
- adastra22 2y agoThat’s not regulatory capture at all. Grandparent’s definition is correct.
- ghshephard 2y agoI haven't heard that definition of "Regulatory Capture" before. I mostly thought it was just when the regulators are working for industry instead of the people. That is, the regulators have been "Captured." The politicians who nominate the regulatory bodies are paid off by industry to keep it that way.
- samstave 2y ago[flagged]
- mystified5016 2y agoNo amount of exposure so far has had any effect on corruption. That AI will somehow improve this is just magical thinking.
- samstave 2y agoNo - I mean the accessibility to the information and blatant use of power whereby we always knew it existed, but now we can tabulate and analyze it.
- Terr_ 2y ago> now we can tabulate and analyze Very doubtful: The current "AI" hype craze centers on LLMs, and they don't do math. If anything they capabilities favor the other side, to obfuscate and protect falsehoods.
- samstave 2y ago>>favor the other side, to obfuscate and protect falsehoods. Unless they delete the Internet Archive of such info? >>*and they don't do math.* Have you ever considered the "Math of Politics" Yeah - they do that just fine ((FYI -- Politics == Propaganda.. the first iteration of models is CHAT == Politics... They do plenty of "Maths"))
- MegaButts 2y agoI genuinely have no idea what you're trying to say.
- Terr_ 2y agoI worry I'm just trying too hard to make it make sense, and this is a TimeCube [0] situation. The most-charitable paraphrase I can come up with it: "Bad people can't use LLMs to hide facts, hiding facts means removing source-materials. Math doesn't matter for politics which are mainly propaganda." However even that just creates contradictions: 1. If math and logic are not important for uncovering wrongdoing, why was "tabulation" cited as an important feature in the first post? 2. If propaganda dominates other factors, why would the (continued) existence of the Internet Archive be meaningful? People will simply be given an explanation (or veneer of settled agreement) so that they never bother looking for source-material. (Or in the case of IA, copies of source material.) [0] https://web.archive.org/web/20160112000701/http://www.timecube.com/ https://web.archive.org/web/20160112000701/http://www.timecu...
- artursapek 2y agonice to see HN is no longer glazing Sam Altman
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- mkoubaa 2y agoAnd it probably would have worked if David Sacks wasn't the AI czar. The Harris administration would probably have caved by now
- bmitc 2y agoIt's a common tactic in new fields. Fusion, AI, you name it are all actively lobbying to get new regulation because they are "different", and the individual companies want to ensure that it's them that sets the tone.
- mkagenius 2y agoLooks the same as taking "rebate for green energy" and then asking to "stop such rebates" a few years later
- nand_gate 2y agoThey've no moat so I don't see them surviving without a gov't bail out like this.
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- claude_thinking 2y agoLLM usage is still gaining traction. OpenAI may not be on top anymore, but they still have useful services, and they aren’t going under anytime soon. And time spent dealing with laws and regulations may decrease efficiency, leading to increased power consumption, resulting in greater water usage in datacenters for cooling and more greenhouse gas emissions. Controlling demand for services is something that could stop this, but it’s technological progress, which could enable solutions for global warming, hunger, and disease. It’s a locomotive out-of-control. Prayer is the answer I’d think of.
- potato3732842 2y ago>And time spent dealing with laws and regulations may decrease efficiency, leading to increased power consumption, resulting in greater water usage in datacenters for cooling and more greenhouse gas emissions. They don't care about that if they get a regulatory moat around them.
- claude_thinking 2y agoThere’s only so much of that you can do without it becoming a problem you have to deal with. There is a limited supply of water in any area of the earth.
- clown_strike 2y agoMaybe buying up all the water rights so nobody can use it to cool their own server farm is the literal moat that would serve them best.