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Tour de France: How professional cycling teams eat and cook on the road
- bell-cot 2y ago> Not so long ago, the professional cycling world's approach to fuelling was remarkably basic. [...] > These days, it is an entirely different prospect, with vast sums spent on custom-built food trucks, personalised nutrition apps and meticulously planned meal regimes all in the name of performance enhancement. > For the nutritionists and chefs tasked with providing sustenance to power their team's riders over 2,170 miles in the coming weeks there are principally two dilemmas [...] > The answers are gleaned from a year-round process that begins in December during pre- season training. You know that it has become the Sport Of The 0.0001% when...
- Ekaros 2y agoSometimes I wonder should we go to basics in many sports. With things like banning any equipment including clothing and shoes... Or with cycling giving one standard mass manufactured piece. And then a pile of standard replacement parts and standard tools. All bought from cheapest supplier randomly distributed to participants.
- LargoLasskhyfv 2y agoHow 'spartan'... That aside, regarding cycling, standard mass manufactured piece? In one size that all have to fit to? Naa...
- sdfgtr 2y agoLookup Japan's Keirin racing. I think it's pretty much that. IIRC at the top levels they also require the racers to stay onsite under observation for several days before a race.
- nradov 2y agoThat would essentially kill cycling as a professional sport. Much of the team revenue comes from equipment sponsors. And while many of the equipment innovations get a bit ridiculous, some of them have really benefitted amateur cyclists. I would hate to still be stuck with a 10-speed drivetrain on a steel tube frame with mechanical friction shifters just because that was "standard".
- nemo44x 2y agoIt’s the same problem in golf. Equipment has gotten so powerful that the strategy of the game has fundamentally changed. They can not realistically continue to make courses longer. So they’re “rolling back” the ball which will limit drive distances a bit but nothing regarding clubs. And the reason why is the pro game makes a lot of money on endorsements. If a top pro is forced to use a club that is different from what amateurs need then the gravy train could stop. But yes, golf is really hard and for amateurs the innovations help make the game more enjoyable. But for pros it’s just too much.
- skeeter2020 2y agoYou saw this with cyclecross bikes for a long time. I had a beautiful cyclecross bike that I rode everywhere and I loved that bike but the cable-pull brakes sucked - like rear-end a car in traffic bad. Nobody made a cyclecross bike with disc brakes until the UCI allowed them in competition; now they all have disc brakes. Same for the extensive use of carbon. Love it or hate it, carbon has fueled intense innovation that you can see on display in higher-end consumer bikes and, while I don't have it or want it, electronic shifting is crisp and perfect. I don't like yet another electronic device but for a weekend rider to never need to tune a mechanical derailleur again is a game changer - you know they already have their phone with them 24/7 (especially you, roadies)
- bluGill 2y agoI'd be perfectly happy on a steel tube 10-speed from 1975 if I was allowed a modern click shifter and modern disk brakes. Steel frame bikes are really nice, and 10 gears is more than you need anyway. Steel frame bikes from 1975 won't win you a modern race, but they won't be far behind.
- cantSpellSober 2y agoYes Steel is Real but the last Tour winner on a steel bike was in the '90s (and that's the subject). Bikes weigh no more than 8kg. The weight weenies are winning, carbon everything down to brake rotors. > I was allowed a modern click shifter and modern disk brakes Doubt you'd see a bike equipped with anything else at the Tour.
- cangeroo 2y agoIt's impossible to take technology out of the equation. I.e. that one person may have superior insights in their physiology/glucose levels, or a superior diet before the race. And so on. Similarly in football, by studying your opponents in previous matches, so that you can identify weaknesses during the match, even if playing in isolation.
- OfficeChad 2y ago[dead]
- jamil7 2y agoI get what you're saying but a part of the culture in my experience is tinkering and upgrading your bike, that doesn't have to necessitate spending huge amounts of money, especially if you do a lot of work yourself and buy parts second hand. The sport might appeal less with all that stripped away, but who knows maybe it would also be interesting to standardize some aspects.
- Ekaros 2y agoWhy not then allow motorcycles? They are just bikes upgraded with motors... Would make competition lot shorter too and interesting. Seeing them driving around without speed limits.
- jamil7 2y agoI'm guessing because they don't meet the criteria to participate, what's your point?
- Ekaros 2y agoThat adding a motor would be upgrade and tinkering of a bike. So why should it not be allowed? Isn't it entirely in same spirit?
- skeeter2020 2y agoNot sure if you honestly believe this or just trying to be "edgy" but because a motorcycle is not a bicycle.
- jamil7 2y agoDo you want me to enumerate the ways in which a bike is not a motorbike and the parameters in which people who are interested in bikes operate in their hobby or profession? Or are you asking why professional racing puts guidelines around what types of bikes can participate?
- 1992spacemovie 2y ago
- Lwerewolf 2y agoSounds like the typical case of people not looking at the core work required in order for the very expensive individual items like tailored nutrition, top-end (and even customized) parts, per-race-specific optimized chains and what not to make any sense whatsoever. If your times are, say, 20% or more above the absolute top times for a given course, you've got a long way to go by improving yourself - on just about any bike whatsoever. The super expensive parts make low single digit differences.
- wnc3141 2y agoIt would require a different business model. Cycling is like F1 in that sponsors are trying to sell their equipment.
- tpm 2y agoAll the cycling equipment in races has to be available in mass market and usually can be bought, if you've got the money. It's not cheap but also it's not a F1 car. It's more like.. why would you buy it when you are not a racer.
- NoPicklez 2y agoIt's not a sport of the 0.0001% when anybody can go buy a bike and ride. At the top level of any sport and in the top race or competition of that sport, it is going to represent the pinnacle of that sport.
- n4r9 2y agoI guess the point is that in cycling - relative to other sports - money gives you an easy edge. You can afford much better equipment, nutrition, coaching etc... . Compare that to (say) football in the UK: you just need a £5 ball and a few friends, and if you show promise you can track into your local team's programme and get top quality coaching at minimal cost. It depends on the culture as well. From what I read about China, they're constantly scouting primary schools for Olympic talent, so you can come from any background and reach the top in a sport that would be limited to wealthier people in other countries.
- Arainach 2y agoAt levels lower than the very top, it's easier and cheaper to lose 10 pounds of your own body than 10 pounds of bike. You can go far - even into racing at low levels - on rather cheap equipment.
- alistairSH 2y agoI'm not sure how that's any different than football (soccer) or football (American) or anything else. You need talent as a kid. You need money to fund travel and equipment (either from mom & dad, or the local academy/development squad, or donors). You need to find a coach who can get the most out of your genetics AND find a path for you to go pro. And on and on.
- jamil7 2y agoWhat makes the largest difference is how physically fit and how well you can ride (technique) rather than equipment.
- secondcoming 2y agoI've never seen so many young people on bikes in the UK as I do now. Sure, the bikes are likely stolen and the kids up to no good, but at least one of them has TdF potential
- wasmitnetzen 2y agoA UCI WorldTeam has a budget of about 10 to 60 million euros. That's peanuts in a lot of other sports.
- skeeter2020 2y agoMaybe mainstream sports, but not when you spread it across the number of fans and account for their intensity. The Tour de France is likely the only cycling event most people can name. It's an awful lot of money for a very niche sport.
- jeroen 2y agoThe TdF is apparently the 2nd most watched sporting event in the world, with 3.5 billion viewers. That's not very niche. -- https://www.roadtrips.com/blog/the-most-watched-sporting-events-in-the-world/ https://www.roadtrips.com/blog/the-most-watched-sporting-eve...
- borroka 2y agoThe number, which by the common person is to be interpreted as unique viewers, is blatantly absurd.
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- jdietrich 2y agoIt's a niche sport in the US, but it's huge in lots of European countries. Conversely, most Europeans would struggle to name a single baseball or American football team, but they're far from niche sports in their domestic market.
- bell-cot 2y agoIf that budget is for an 8-man team, in a sport with a 3 1/2-week season... An (American) NFL team has 53 "active" players (plus a practice squad, plus ...), and plays a 5-month season. And has a lot of "maintain a major stadium"-type expenses, which (my guess) cycling teams don't have. Based on your figures, and trying to scale...no, the cycling team budgets really aren't peanuts by comparison. NFL Data: https://shareholder.broadridge.com/pdf/2022-packers-annual-report.pdf https://shareholder.broadridge.com/pdf/2022-packers-annual-r...
- Angostura 2y ago25,000 people took part in last month’s Ride London. It was awesome
- lormayna 2y agoMaratona de Dolomites, probably the most beautiful amateur cycling events in the world, has more than 50k subscribers and they selected only 9k.
- JojoFatsani 2y ago[flagged]
- InDubioProRubio 2y agoSteroids after cancer-survival! Thats steroids on steroids!
- damontal 2y agoSteroids before too. He speculated that the growth hormone actually triggered the cancer growth.
- toyg 2y agoHundreds of thousands of dollars spent on this stuff, and then someone finds the right, undetectable doping mix, and bye bye.
- sdfgtr 2y agoTbf, millions is spent on that part. This seems to be a drop in the bucket.
- Jean-Papoulos 2y agoNote for everyone that will come in here to say the secret is drugs : In cyclism taking drugs is not considered a secret, it's common practice.
- knallfrosch 2y agoAnd since everyone is taking them, they're not the discriminator between the world class champions and the merely Tour-de-France participants.
- matthewowen 2y agoThere is a common refrain about the Armstrong era "all the top guys were taking them so it's fair" but it's not really accurate. Because yes, the people at the top were all taking them, but that's because the clean guys that _would_ have been at the top otherwise aren't there: the prevalence of doping meant that you had to dope to even be in the conversation at that level, and so the clean athletes that might have won otherwise aren't coming in 18th, they're at home on the couch or they're racing at the pro-conti level. For example, Greg LeMond won the TdF in 1990. In 1991 he came 7th, and then never completed it again. There is some complication here because of the hunting accident he suffered in '87, but he also said "The speeds were faster and riders that I had easily outperformed were now dropping me", and the guy who won in 1991 was Indurain who was basically the first mega-doper. Without EPO and blood doping becoming prevalent, does Greg LeMond compete for a few more years? Do other guys with similar talent who aren't willing to dope also make it to that top level. I think the answer is probably yes, and so all those guys who doped are responsible for excluding those clean athletes from the top level.
- vbarrielle 2y agoYou're spot on, and there's another point that makes doping unfair even if it was widespread. There is a max hematocrit rule, but riders had different pre-doping base hematocrit levels. Those with the lowest level could benefit more from doping before reaching the limit. In a way, the less gifted would be more advantaged by EPO.
- matsemann 2y agoI'm a bit sad that a topic I find so interesting mostly gathers knee-jerk reactions here on HN. Yes, doping, blah blah we get it. But the logistics of TdF is insane. With a new city every day, things need to move fast and preparations start early. For instance Uno-X team has a small trailer with 800 kgs of ice they travel around with, after having trouble sourcing enough ice in the small villages they stay at. Actually having your own chef source stuff is one way to avoid accidental doping scandals. I've read the Velochef book and like the recipes there. One thing I've never appreciated before is how hard it is to actually get this amount of calories down. Especially since much of it must be consumed on the bike so needs to be easy to transport/store/eat on the fly. And eating while working out can be tough on the stomach. EDB finally got his break through when they managed to nail a nutrition he didn't get cramps from eating.
- mesofile 2y agoSorry, I follow cycling casually but I'm racking my brain trying to think of who 'EDB' refers to.
- wiether 2y agoSame, I can't find anyone close to it.
- matsemann 2y agoSorry, it was an autocorrect by my phone. EDB means Elektronisk Data Behandling, which is an archaic Norwegian way of writing computers, lol.. I meant to write EBH, Edvald Boasson-Hagen. I probably should've spelled it out, but the Velochef book is by the Team Sky chef, the team of EBH.
- wiether 2y agoDon't worry! Given Henrik Orre is Norwegian, I thought about EBH but it was still far from EDB... All is good now!
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- eloycoto 2y agoNowadays, some riders use glucose monitoring devices during training with relation to how long it takes from ingesting and getting into blood. They are now measuring more and more things, and food is a crucial role. Glucose monitoring is banned during races, but I guess that is why you don't see some cyclist collapsing like as 15 years ago is because they understand their glucose levels. For sure, doping it's still a fear, but these guys cannot climb Galibier at that speed only with storoids/drugs, it's insane the effort that they did over the year.
- deff 2y agoThat is indeed why you don´t see them collapsing and also why the finals are much longer nowadays. Riders train their guts to be able to eat up to 120g of carbs per hour, for the whole duration of the race.
- avs733 2y agoI am far FAR from the tour de france but I do train for and run ultramarathons. When I started the general guidance seemed to be about 200 calories (50g of carbs) per hour during training and races. I followed that or a little above for a long time, and constantly had problems both physically and cognitively near the end of races. It took about a year to get used to fueling heavier (for me...about 400 calories per hour or 100g). Lots of figuring out digestion and timing and sources and other factors. But once I got there it was transformative...I could push much harder for much longer without a deep bonk and recovery was faster. More importantly, my ability to think/plan/make decisions at the end of races was orders of magnitude better. I'd bet if you went to an aid station around 80 miles on a 100mile ultra marathon you could pretty reliably identify who had been on the 200cal end of the spectrum and who had been on the 400 + end.
- davidw 2y agoYeah, some of the modern nutrition stuff like gels work really well. I did a 115 mile road bike ride on Sunday and kept eating gels and... I'm not going to say I was super fresh or anything by the end of that, but I was still feeling pretty good.
- ydant 2y agoI enjoyed this show about feeding the tour riders: Eat. Race. Win. https://www.amazon.com/Eat-Race-Win-Season-1/dp/B086HVQ5RB https://www.amazon.com/Eat-Race-Win-Season-1/dp/B086HVQ5RB Related, Unchained (https://www.netflix.com/title/81153133 https://www.netflix.com/title/81153133) has been an interesting view into the race although food isn't discussed at all. Before Eat. Race. Win. I had this entirely uninformed idea the food the riders ate would be incredibly streamlined and controlled - I was thinking something like Soylent and protein powder and supplements. To see them chowing down on "normal" food and drinking alcohol (at all) was surprising for me.
- gullywhumper 2y agoThe alcohol really surprises me given how meticulous they are about everything else - especially sleep monitoring. After a big win, it's not uncommon for the entire team to have sparkling wine or beer that night. Maybe not a big deal for one day races, but with stage races they usually have another hard race the next day. On the podium during stage races, victors will often drink sparkling wine/beer too. After winning a stage at last year's Vuelta a España (one of the major multi-day stage races) Sepp Kuss took a huge long chug on the podium - and then went on to when the entire race [1]! Some riders used to drink during races too. Freddy Maertens was able to do it and still win [2]. [1] https://www.atwistedspoke.com/sepp-kuss-champagne-supernova/ https://www.atwistedspoke.com/sepp-kuss-champagne-supernova/ [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freddy_Maertens#Alcohol https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freddy_Maertens#Alcohol
- jdietrich 2y agoAny risks in terms of performance have to be weighed up against the benefits to morale. A grand tour is long, a full year's calendar of racing is even longer, but a glass of champagne to celebrate a win goes a long way towards breaking up the monotony of suffering.
- xarope 2y agoand then there's the Radler, a beer and lemonade mixture specifically created for cyclists. It's quite tasty and thirst quenching, although I'm not sure I'd use it as as peri-workout drink (post-workout? sure)!
- deff 2y agoRegarding drugs, yes it´s most likely still happening, but nowhere near the levels it used to be. Riders are tested a lot and have to provide year-round whereabouts for random testing. They also have a frequently updated blood passport to detect sudden changes in values caused by PEDs. It can never be fully waterproof, but at least serious efforts are made.
- flosstop 2y agoThey have moved on from pharmaceutical doping due to the extensive testing to what is referred to as "mechanical doping". Motors are hidden in hubs/frames and the organisation is busy doing everything they can to pretend that it isn't a problem.
- cptcobalt 2y agoReally, hidden motors in the tour? That would be an interesting read.
- kergonath 2y agoNo, not really. These motors exist, but it’s not really a thing on the Tour de France. And I only mention this race because I am not much of a devotee and don’t really follow the others, but I would expect quite a lot of noise if it were a thing in the other big races.
- fuzzylightbulb 2y agoMechanical doping, a problem so wide-spread that only one person at the elite level has ever been found to have been doing it. To date, no one has ever provided hard evidence of another rider using a motor. I am not saying that this doesn't happen at the amateur level (it certainly does) but to imply that this is a pervasive problem in elite cycling is little more than a baseless conspiracy theory until someone shows up with some actual evidence of motors being used in major events. Ghost in the Machine [1] is a great podcast on this topic. [1] https://play.pocketcasts.com/discover/podcast/de6ba1d0-9132-013c-9fe5-0acc26574db2 https://play.pocketcasts.com/discover/podcast/de6ba1d0-9132-...
- frereubu 2y agoThe part about not eating too much fibre because it irritates the gut reminded me of an amusing anecdote in Dan Martin's autobiography, where he talked about coming (I think) third in The Tour and was sitting with Chris Froome and Geraint Thomas from Team Sky (now Ineos Grenadiers) after the finish in Paris. He was looking forward to a big burger and chips, and Froome and Thomas were discussing how they were really looking forward to a nice salad (i.e. lots of fibre). He partly admired the dedication, but at the same time wondered how on earth they could live like that.
- AndrewOMartin 2y agoSalads can be really good in Paris! :D Martin might just be imagining a slice of tomato on a leaf of lettuce, Froome and Thomas might have been imagining a range of herbs and roasted nuts with a delicious oil or vinaigrette, chunks of an interesting cheese or two and some powerful olives and garlic. Or thereabouts.
- frereubu 2y agoYeah, I'm sure he knows that - he lives in Andorra - but I read it as him being surprised that of all the tasty things they weren't allowed to eat (as the article makes clear the food during the Tour tends to be pretty bland) the first thing they'd crave is a salad.
- lormayna 2y agoI remember Fabio Aru saying that he was allowed to eat a pizza once in an year, at the end of the season. This is one of the reason why several modern cyclist had a mental breakdown like Tom Dumolin
- Optimal_Persona 2y agoTomorrow's headline: Turd de France - How professional cyclists poop (or don't) on the road...
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- laweijfmvo 2y agoThat any human can complete a race like this is still mind boggling to me, regardless of what you eat.
- philshem 2y ago> "The food I make is all transparent," says (chef) Blandy. "There are no rich sauces, it's all plain, simple cooking with a light amount of seasoning, light amount of oil, fresh herbs and citrus. That’s some top-notch nominative determinism. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nominative_determinism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nominative_determinism
- jeffrallen 2y agoAptronym: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aptronym https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aptronym
- tdumitrescu 2y agoHey if they wanna pay me for real transparent food I'll cook them up some "Emperor's New Hollandaise"
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- abcd_f 2y agoHey, there's a sub for that! https://www.reddit.com/r/NominativeDeterminism/ https://www.reddit.com/r/NominativeDeterminism/
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- frankhhhhhhhhh 2y agoA great basic formula I stole from NorCal Cycling's YouTube channel for coming up with a nutrition plan for a bike ride is: TRAINING TIME(HOURS)x60=CARBS(GRAMS) https://youtu.be/WNhOAIMDmQ0 https://youtu.be/WNhOAIMDmQ0
- gield 2y ago= 1 gram of carbs per minute of training
- wnolens 2y agoI recently participated in an 85 mile race, and all the nutritional advice boiled down to.. drink a water bottle with a ton of pure sugar and some table salt every 10-20 miles. Bananas and gummies etc. were had, but mostly because they're pleasant to consume.
- vlachen 2y agoInterestingly, that same advice was offered to recruits in U.S. Marine Corps boot camp for the final series of tests and challenges, known as The Cruicible. We were directed to put the salt and sugar packets from our MREs into our canteens and chug them. Disgusting, but effective.
- wnolens 2y agoFastest possible carbs to process and electrolytes. Works surprisingly well
- 11235813213455 2y agoI wish these races were without any assistance at all, and without food/liquid at the start, a bit like in the past, if you're hungry try to spot a fruit tree, if you've a flat repair yourself, thirsty stop at next fountain
- temporarara 2y agoThat's really the kind of fun that is completely missing in most of today's professional sports. Everything is just too good and planned ahead for my tastes to be worth actively watching. The surprising elements still around, like crashes and injuries, are just not that exciting at all.
- WalterBright 2y agoI'd get rid of the radio communication with the rider. In Formula 1, too.
- mhh__ 2y agoThey tried to make it such that the drivers could not be "coached" over the radio during F1 races but it just became a farce with drivers getting stuck with (say) a loud alarm blaring the whole race because they obviously don't know every page on the screen (let alone at 190mph).
- lmm 2y agoPBP still runs every 4 years if that's what you want - there are official food/rest areas (there have to be with that many people) but no motorised support allowed. Sports cycling races are for an audience that cares about the racing and athleticism rather than random luck, and I don't blame them for it.
- wyre 2y agoEntirely self-supported bike races still exist, but they don't get the publicity and media attention the TdF gets. The Tour Divide and the Trans Am Bike Race are two ultra-endurance races that are self-supported. I would recommend bikepacking.com for coverage for self-supported mountain bike races.
- jimbokun 2y ago> "Instead of putting flavour in with cream, salt and butter we're adding it with herbs and citrus because they are low calorie and contain antioxidants." Aren’t they trying to maximize calories?
- mvdtnz 2y agoIf you think you have no interest in cycle road racing I strongly recommend watching the Netflix series Tour de France Unchained. I watched it on a whim with no interest whatsoever in road racing and I found it addictive and it got me hooked on the sport (to the extent I can be hooked - UCI is a garbage organisation that makes it as difficult as possible to actually watch it). Start with series 1, even though it's 2 years out of date. They explain how the sport works, and they skip over this in series 2. It's important information.
- WalterBright 2y agoWatching the TdF, I wonder how the cyclists cope with the motorcycle/car right in front of them spewing exhaust in their faces the whole race.
- hervature 2y agoThey obviously breathe in exhaust occasionally but the caravan tries to stay far enough that there is no slipstream and the wind would make it a non-issue. Those dunces that light flares during mountain summits are probably much worse.
- TomMasz 2y agoI try to make sure my pre-ride meals and in-ride fueling and hydration are adequate after I faded badly on my first 100K ride but this is more than one step beyond. I'm sure I could do better but it wouldn't have the effort vs. results that pro riders demand. I'm just happy to be able to ride.