16 ms·

UniFi Express

213 points by CharlesW 3y ago

whalesalad 3y ago
I love ubiquiti. My entire home network runs on their gear, with self-hosted management. I have infra deployed across the country in a remote office that runs their gear, with a cloud key. It's solid stuff all around. Don’t use any of their unifi routers tho, can’t speak to that. I have an ER-4 at home and the remote office has a pfsense 1U.
- boringuser2 3y ago
  It's not a particularly good setup, but it's also not a particularly bad one. Actual prosumer+ products like Sophos XG (free), Untangle Home, *sense blow it out of the water, though, by giving actual offerings for features where Unifi gives a diet version. That all being said, it's definitely a cut above most consumer networking setups, maybe with the exception of Asus -- they do a pretty solid job.
  - dixie_land 3y ago
    I feel they all but abandoned the EdgeRouter line, which hits the sweet spot of prosumer for me.
  - Spivak 3y ago
    The part that's missing for me is what hardware do I put it on?
- spacebacon 3y ago
  Same here, I love the UDM Pro SE. Blocking application layer stuff like QUIC is just a couple clicks away. It has decent intrusion detection and response alongside other easy to configure firewall settings.
  - cced 3y ago
    Why and how do you block application layer stuff like quic?
    - jjoonathan 3y ago
      Tiny network tyrants gotta flex somehow.
      - spacebacon 3y ago
        Sure, large network tyrants really don’t like the tiny network tyrants that prefer their network traffic to be fully visible.
    - spacebacon 3y ago
      When UDM shows you QUIC eats up the majority of your bandwidth you may decide to click to add a rule to block it. You may see a large reduction in overall daily bandwidth as a result. If you watch YouTube you are using QUIC. Certain QUIC vulnerabilities are a 3 or 4 packet compromise.
      - cced 3y ago
        I’m Guessing the sites will then fallback to another protocol correct?
        spacebacon 3y ago
        Yes plain UDP or TCP.
      - srj 3y ago
        Youtube will fall back to TCP. If the bandwidth utilization actually did drop it's probably because the stream quality throttled down. What do you mean by "QUIC vulnerabilities are a 3 or 4 packet compromise"?
        spacebacon 3y ago
  - gotbeans 3y ago
    Udm pro SE is the best thing I bought. 10g, protect for camera selfhosting which works great, new updates made wireguard first class citizen, and if you want anything more complicated it's just a dumb debian underneath (which I do a bunch of stuff). I'm reallt happy with it.
    - artificialLimbs 3y ago
      >>> and if you want anything more complicated it's just a dumb debian underneath Are you doing persistence (keep settings/data after reboot) with Unifi OS 3?
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
- xvector 3y ago
  I kinda hate Ubiquiti routers. My UDM Pro felt like a total scam, with the IDS/IPS being nowhere close to advertised. They promised but never introduced WireGuard. I also experienced strange bugs in the stack. I eventually moved to OPNSense but the router I bought from them died. The interface was too cumbersome anyways, from the perspective of someone that just wanted WireGuard server+client, IPS/IDS, and VLAN. I finally moved to Firewalla and it is lightyears ahead of Ubiquiti, OPNSense, and any other solution I've tried from a power user perspective. I use this with Ubiquiti APs connected to my Pi running the Ubiquiti management software, which works out quite well. The Firewalla is far easier to use, has a way better UX, and covers 95% of the power user tasks.
  - ladzoppelin 3y ago
    Do you think Ubiquiti APs are still good, I have not used them since 2018?
    - whalesalad 3y ago
      Love their AP’s.
    - yftsui 3y ago
      I regret my time spent on Ubiquiti devices at home use, in the past five years my view has changed from very positive to entirely negative. They are getting worse instead of better, I am seriously considering getting rid of all Ubiquiti devices from my home, Ubiquiti software updates lack testing and break things often, I simply don’t have time to baby sit them anymore. Their iOS app has become harder to navigate with feature loss instead of improvement as well. My Ubiquiti setup (one LR and one lite) was done back in 2018, devices on the network is roughly the same in the past 5 years, only phones laptops changed due to upgrades. Since 2020/21 their firmware updates started dropping support of old device randomly, or support become worse (devices get disconnected frequently or full bar but not responsive). First was my Kindle 3G keyboard, then Fitbit Aria Scale, then quite a few smart switches/plugs. I literally scratched my head to understand the settings, but they just won’t connect to the Ubiquiti AP. I had to buy an Eero as backup and continuously migrate these older devices as they are unable to connect. Their most recent firmware update last week kicked my Sony TV off the network(bought in 2018), I have no idea what they are thinking and wasted 1 hour rebooting and blaming Sony, then found it connect to the Eero AP just fine.
- stephen_g 3y ago
  I’ve definitely gone off their routers since they basically abandoned the EdgeRouter line. I still use their APs for now, sometimes the switches, they’re all pretty solid, but I’ve been gradually getting more and more negative about Ubiquiti in general…
  - walterbell 3y ago
    ER3-Lite can run OpenBSD.
    - tw04 3y ago
      Unless it supports hardware offloading you’d be better off tossing it in the trash. The thing can only push ~100mbit without it. https://help.ui.com/hc/en-us/articles/205204070-EdgeMAX-How-do-I-disable-IP-offload-for-hardware-acceleration- https://help.ui.com/hc/en-us/articles/205204070-EdgeMAX-How-...
xt00 3y ago
Interesting— looks like it is a Dream Machine plus WiFi AP combo.
- taspeotis 3y ago
  They already have that? The UDR
chenzhekl 3y ago
Could anyone help explain what this is. Is it just a fancy WiFi router?
- lopkeny12ko 3y ago
  > What is UniFi Express? > UniFi Express is a complete UniFi Networking stack in an ultra-compact, plug-and-play form factor. It runs UniFi Network and features a powerful gateway engine and built-in WiFi 6 with seamless meshing.
  - handy2000 3y ago
    Read this several times. Still don't know what I am looking at. What is "UniFi Networking stack", what is "UniFi Network"? Is it a WiFi router? I use a TP-Link router at home, and they don't sell it as "TP-Link Networking stack".
    - gotbeans 3y ago
      A "network stack" should be a somewhat relatively familiar concept if you are acquainted with networking in any way.
    - BHSPitMonkey 3y ago
      More complex networks (e.g. in commercial settings, or the homes of I.T. nerds) will often consist of a router plus one or more switches and/or wireless access points, probably spread out across a site with multiple ethernet drops. A typical router sold for home consumers (like yours I'm guessing) is a combination of all three of those in one convenient package, which is enough for most home use cases. Companies like Ubiquiti (under the UniFi brand), Meraki, etc. make these products such that they can all work together as an ecosystem, e.g. so you can log into a single dashboard and manage the network as well as every individual device's configuration from one place. This is the difference between a so-called "managed" switch (or wireless access point) versus an ordinary dumb one. UniFi also makes PoE security cameras that are managed through their ecosystem in the same manner. This sort of ecosystem is useful for people doing I.T. in commercial settings. You can use a single interface to manage a network in a huge office building with hundreds of devices, or to manage lots of smaller networks spread across different sites. This "UniFi Express" product seems more suitable for the latter, e.g. in cafes or small retail settings where you might just use it on its own or add a small number of additional switches/APs. It's similar to your home router+AP combo, but it also contains the management software I described before which is capable of adopting more UniFi devices and provides remote administration. Edit: If you're curious, TP-Link's equivalent to UniFi is called Omada: https://www.tp-link.com/us/omada-sdn/ https://www.tp-link.com/us/omada-sdn/
huevosabio 3y ago
I love unifi, I have a dream router, and three APs in an airbnb. And it's really solid. But man, it's just too hard to find available stock. It took me time to find the dream router and even now it's out of stock, and, this new device is also out of stock.
- Rinum 3y ago
  Right?! Who's buying? Big businesses or regular retail? Or are they limiting supply to keep prices high?
  - boringuser2 3y ago
    The second one. Businesses aren't buying this shit.
    - entropie 3y ago
      Wrong. I watched a video yesterday from a german medical cannabis business where I recognized unifi APs in the building. Their camera system was (as one would imagine) unifi too.
      - boringuser2 3y ago
        [flagged]
        entropie 3y ago
        As long as you dont provide any reasoning your are just another guy in the internet talking gibberish.
        boringuser2 3y ago
        1. The throughput is inadequate. 2. The IDS/IPS is an inadequate Suricata instance with outdated rulesets and no SSL inspection. 3. There is nothing comparable to a WAF. Gun to my head, I'd trust ASUS AI protect for a business router to substantially outperform Unifi's security offerings. The ASUS at least knows what it is and what it can be: basically a glorified WAF. IDS/IPS don't even work well with up to date rulesets if they can't decrypt traffic.
twisteriffic 3y ago
Never mind that, check this out: https://ca.store.ui.com/ca/en/pro/category/all-cloud-keys-gateways/products/uxg-lite https://ca.store.ui.com/ca/en/pro/category/all-cloud-keys-ga... Finally a viable USG3 replacement.
- gooseyard 3y ago
  I had one arrive yesterday and hooked it up today, was worried I'd foul things up somehow since I'd never replaced the Gateway before (my USG was 6 or 7 years old I think) but I just removed the old one, plugged in the new one, adopted it, and off we went. My cable modem seemed to need a reboot but that was it. I had never enabled the traffic inspection stuff on the USG, so it was neat to finally get a look at that stuff after having it inactive for years. I'd been thinking about getting one of the UDM things but since the USG was working well I figured I'd wait until something like this came along. So far, so good!
- __float 3y ago
  This doesn't really seem comparable -- the big draw to the Express seems to be the WiFi built-in; at $149 for the Express vs $172 for the Gateway Lite + (at least) ~$100 for an AP, these are entirely different categories.
  - samcat116 3y ago
    I don't think they're saying they're comparable, its just that a lot of people were waiting for the cheaper standalone firewall, which is what the gateway lite is. also its $129 not $172.
    - twisteriffic 3y ago
      You've got it. I'm on my third boot drive replacement on my USG, have been worried that eventually something was going to break that I couldn't fix. Being able to enable traffic inspection and IDS will be great.
    - __float 3y ago
stbenjam 3y ago
Another confused product from UniFi. Is it targeting home users or businesses? It looks like businesses from their web page yet feels very much like a better fit for home. It only runs UniFi Network, so you have to buy more things, that also run UniFi Network, to get into any of their other products like Protect. I like their stuff but lately a lot of their stuff feels just confused to me, like they don't know what they want to be.
- ikiris 3y ago
  They want to get income like a hardware store, but sell their product as if their value is software, that they then don't maintain because its not selling their latest hardware.
- boringuser2 3y ago
  A business really shouldn't be running this. Anything that isn't basically your home office is running a solid NGFW with SSL interception.
  - marcus0x62 3y ago
    That’s…Not an accurate description of how things work in the real world. There are large enterprises out there with NGFWs that aren’t doing much TLS inspection. Your average mom and pop business is more likely to have a wifi AP/router/NAT gateway combo from their ISP than something as feature rich as Unifi, let alone a real NGFW.
    - fnordpiglet 3y ago
      Every major company I’ve been at absolutely positively does NOT MitM their own traffic. They pay security people well enough to realize what a massive hole that creates in their security posture, and makes the intercepting appliance a cess pit of regulatory toxic waste. PCI, MNPI, even HIPPA from employees visiting their health insurance site? Check, check, check! All on a silver platter for insiders and hackers.
      - 3y ago
xattt 3y ago
I am lucky enough to have FTTH service where the provider furnishes me with an SFP stick with simple DHCP (no PPPoE). Beyond UniFi, Microtik, and rolling your own, there’s very little option in consumer routers.
- latentcall 3y ago
  Yep, just had my ISP take my SFP ONT back for a regular RJ45 ONT so I could use a different firewall with RJ45 only WAN. Hard to find a good box with SFP WAN.
  - minorandromeda 3y ago
    Some Netgate firewalls have SFP WAN ports.
- midasuni 3y ago
  You need a router that takes a standard sfp and can support a dhcp client? That’s basically any router!
smcleod 3y ago
Weird that the ethernet ports are only 1GbE, that discounts everyone with a >1Gbit internet connection
- barkerja 3y ago
  This is my biggest knock against Ubiquiti at the moment. They have no real solutions in the 2.5GbE/10GbE market.
  - samch 3y ago
    The UDM-SE I have has a 10Gbps and 2.5Gbps WAN ports: https://store.ui.com/us/en/pro/category/all-unifi-cloud-gateways/products/udm-se https://store.ui.com/us/en/pro/category/all-unifi-cloud-gate... They also have multi-Gbps switches up to 25Gbps SFP28: https://store.ui.com/us/en?category=all-switching https://store.ui.com/us/en?category=all-switching
    - barkerja 3y ago
      Ah nice! And looking further, it appears their U6-Enterprise and U6-Enterprise-IW both support 2.5GbE uplinks.
    - larrysalibra 3y ago
      From reports online the UDM-SE won’t actually NAT close to 10 Gbps and the manufacturer doesn’t provide any NAT performance numbers…so it becomes a bottle neck if you have 10 Gbps internet which is widely available and not that expensive my part of the world. (Hong Kong). The only reasonably priced router I could find about 6 months ago that would NAT at line speed was the TP-LINK Onada ER8411. I ended up going with an all Oanda network which seems to work fine but ubiquiti had originally been my first choice.
    - fetzu 3y ago
      I recently encounter this as my ISP upgraded me to 10 Gbps over fiber: the UDM-PRO/SE does/can have a 10/2.5 Gbps WAN port over SPF+, but all the Ethernet ports go over to the COU via the same 1/2.5Gbps interface bottleneck [1]. If you really want to use your 10/2.5 Gbps you’re going to have run your services directly on the UDM or go out though the SPF+ port and serve from there via another switch, but then the point of having an UDM is kinda moot. I wish this was more explicitly advertised when I first bought it. [1] https://ubntwiki.com/products/unifi/unifi_dream_machine_pro https://ubntwiki.com/products/unifi/unifi_dream_machine_pro
CobaltFire 3y ago
This is effectively a Dream Router minus any other app support and the switch. For a typical home user who doesn't want/need Protect this seems decent, but I think the $50 upcharge for the UDR is absolutely worth it. That said, the UDR is heavily limited in running Protect. I started hitting occasional problems running Network and Protect together when I hit 4 cameras.
- Kirby64 3y ago
  The dream router can’t route faster than 500mbit, which is a huge limitation. This claims to do 1gbit routing, so pairing with a switch gives you a dream router that can actually route at 1gbit.
  - CobaltFire 3y ago
    With IDS and IPS turned off I can get routing at over 800Mbit consistently with my UDR. It has the typical foibles of UniFi routing so I'm replacing it, but I haven't had too many issues with it tapping out the Gb port (when my cable line allows). I wouldn't even try to add any fancy features to it and expect it to hold up though; it just doesn't have the power. Oh, and one of the foibles is that if I do hit the router with a connection that saturates it it drops every other device on the network. So it being able to route above 500Mbit is kind of a non-starter I guess, as it can't do it to more than one client.
    - Kirby64 3y ago
      Not sure what you settings you used, but I never was able to achieve above ~500Mbit even with everything disabled. The other thing I noticed: you literally cannot access or use the management UI when you're saturating the connection. It just straight up will not load.
      - CobaltFire 3y ago
        I'm pretty light on settings, but I don't remember offhand. I agree on the UI. Now that we are running the Protect app on an iPad all the time (my child is special needs so we use the cameras to keep an eye on everything) it has throttled pretty hard. Maybe 400Mbit now? I honestly hadn't tested it in a while, and haven't had the time to do in depth. It's absolutely slower now. I have a Mikrotik CCR2004-1G-2XS-PCIE that will be my new router when I get around to it, and the UDR will be an AP and run the Network and Protect apps. We've been seeing weird issues ever since leaning on it harder, so I'm going to see how it does just being a Controller and AP.
I_Am_Nous 3y ago
For $150 this looks pretty awesome. We offer home managed Wi-Fi and this replaces the security gateway and AP with a single box.
- peddling-brink 3y ago
  Which security gateway? Not the USG.
  - JonChesterfield 3y ago
    The USG is seems to be consistently unpopular in proper engineering circles but I rather like my one. It runs off PoE (with an adapter, sadly), doesn't fall over, doesn't take any of my time keeping it working.
syntaxing 3y ago
Had a UDR but switched to OPNsense. But the biggest issue with the UDR is that it can only handle about 500 Mbps due to the subpar CPU. Anyone know if this can actually run gigabit speeds?
- buildbot 3y ago
  I too switched to OPNsense., which has been awesome. Partly due to weird dns failure issues, but mostly due to what turned out to be the bullshit claims about security issues :/ krebs did real damage to them by pushing that story.
  - syntaxing 3y ago
    Yup, pretty much why I swapped mine. I think the final nail of the coffin was when they were like, “ok, we need to remove the free shipping so we can stay competitive without increasing prices”. Then a couple months later “jk, we gotta increase the prices too” (surprise to no one). My OPNSense N100 PC + omada switch and AP was like $400 all said and done.
- Kirby64 3y ago
  From their FAQ: UniFi Express can route traffic at speeds up to 1 Gbps. Security features such as Device Identification, Traffic Identification, Country Restrictions, and Ad Blocking can all be enabled without impacting routing performance.
spankalee 3y ago
This page is a bit confusing if you don't already know the terms... What exactly is "A complete UniFi networking stack" anyway? Is UniFi some protocol that extends WiFi?
- handy2000 3y ago
  Exactly, I only understood that it's basically a WiFi router by reading this thread. I guess I am not their target buyer... still, would appreciate more clarity.
- I_Am_Nous 3y ago
  Unifi AP for wifi, Unifi switches, Unifi security gateway of some kind, Unifi point to point for terrestrial wireless to share with another set of Unifi gear in a barn/shed/whatever down the road. All managed by UNMS.
  - handy2000 3y ago
    OK, as an engineer with decades of experience, I give up. What is "Unify AP for WiFi"?
    - _rs 3y ago
      Unifi is just their name for this series of products that all work together with their (free) controller. So you buy an AP, a switch, a router, all from the Unifi line of products and they all get setup from a single controller and work together pretty effortlessly
      - handy2000 3y ago
        I see, thanks. So basically a suite of networking hardware solutions? What I found the most confusing is that they sort of differentiate UniFi from WiFi. E.g. "Instant WiFi for retail POS" - yes, like any other WiFi router? Or is this box going to connect to a global mesh that's called UniFi?..
xoa 3y ago
So I started seriously using UniFi I think in 2016-ish after using some of their PtP/PtMP stuff for longer. I never ran anything massive peaking at under 200 devices total across various sites, but we did put it pretty hard, and I did enjoy it and find the value proposition excellent. And having said that I'd sound a real note of caution, which is why I've eliminated most of them in favor the same-niche positioned Omada. Ubiquiti turned into a real development dumpster fire, every bad tech trope right from the textbook. They have a long history of introducing constant new hardware that, particular for routing/firewall/gateway services then languishes even as it gets sold new without a single update for ages. Various touted efforts that then got unceremoniously wiped. Really basic core functionality neglected for constant UX churn, let alone useful important new features. "Dumpster fire" has not been an unreasonable descriptor. They've also added a concerning trend towards proprietary lock-in and pushing of cloud, even though to their great credit full local control remains a key selling point. Omada isn't perfect either, and the hardware design is worse, though it's been more reliable and with a lot of basics better locked down for me. I'd be delighted to have two strong competitors there, and there have been a few promising glimmers on UniFi, like PPSK getting some initial attention (4 years late is better than nothing). And certainly the basic switching and WiFi mostly works. Having a whole single pane of glass remains attractive, and either is a big upgrade over the kind of stuff a lot of people are coming from. Just take some of their promotional gloss with a grain of salt is all. And as always AIO is something to balance as well. When I switched out the routing side of things for OPNsense I could maintain the whole rest of the stack as I pleased, including APs in optimal positions. The latter is less of a (or zero) concern in small spaces, but even then WiFi, switching, and routing needs don't always evolve in sync.
jxi 3y ago
What would I get from this both hardware and software-wise that I don't get from ASUS routers?
- aetherspawn 3y ago
  OK, I've had several high-end ASUS routers and I know that your ASUS router is probably not stable and needs to be restarted all the time. At very least, Unifi is a huge step up from that and it will easily run at max performance for 3+ months at a time without a reboot.
  - jxi 3y ago
    I haven't experienced any instability with personal routers to be honest.
- forward1 3y ago
  A ton of proprietary software and the externalization of support on a third party.
hristov 3y ago
I am willing to bet it runs the unifi software on an arm chip. Which is kind of funny considering they dropped official support for arm on third party devices.
qainsights 3y ago
What does this product do? Wanted to purchase, but not sure what the purpose is.
- BHSPitMonkey 3y ago
  Why do you want to purchase it before you know what it does? It's an entry-level WiFi router with UniFi's Network software, which provides the ability to buy more UniFi gear (switches and additional APs) if you have a really big house and/or wish to connect more than 1 device over ethernet. Unlike its bigger siblings, the Dream Router and the Dream Machine, it lacks additional built-in ethernet ports (i.e. you'd need to buy a switch) and can't host security cameras (the UniFi Protect product line).
  - joemi 3y ago
    Pretty good summary, though I'd add that it's also (probably) more stable than a lot of common home routers.
Someone1234 3y ago
This product that has a huge caveat that limits it to many people's applications: > UniFi Express supports up to 5 connected UniFi Network devices, including other UniFi Express units, switches, and WiFi access points. Even my home has one AP per floor (3x) and 3x Unifi switches. This is clearly an artificial limitation for market segmentation reasons. I'm not going to rip out Unifi switches to go unmanaged, just for the pleasure of using Express. Hopefully nobody buys it without reading the small print. I feel like the lack of Protect and the 5 UniFi device limit are going to really limit who will buy this even at this price.
- artificialLimbs 3y ago
  The 50 vlan limit on their top of line stuff is the only reason we don't deploy them exclusively across our biz.
  - windexh8er 3y ago
    The former, EdgeSwitch / EdgeRouter (all black in color), didn't have this low of a limit. I still run a 48 port, 500W PoE switch in my main rack at home and it's got limit of 255 active VLAN.
  - Temporary_31337 3y ago
    Genuinely curious What do you need 50+ vlans for? It feels like you could have physical lans to separate or simply different subnets? It’s hard for me to imagine why you would want to aggregate so many vlans over a single physical connection?
    - Someone1234 3y ago
      In certain scenarios, it may be necessary to assign multiple VLAN tags to the same network port. This is particularly common in environments where devices connected to that port need access to different network segments simultaneously. For example, a networked device in a conference room might require access to VLANs designated for both guest internet and internal company resources. In this case, the port would be configured as a 'trunk' port, allowing traffic from multiple VLANs (each identified by a unique tag) to pass through. This setup ensures that the device can communicate across different departmental or functional network segments, such as VLANs for e.g. IT, Marketing, or Sales, etc. Using VLANs over physical LANs or different subnets is fundamentally about enhancing network management efficiency and flexibility. The core advantage of VLANs is that they allow network administrators to segment and manage the network logically without the need for physical rearrangements. This means an engineer can configure and reconfigure network segments without the need to physically move cables or hardware (or even be on-site).
psyclobe 3y ago
I dig their stack; for a personal nerd setup no one else makes it so easy to deploy advanced networks.
metmac 3y ago
If they had taken the opportunity to make it like an AirPort Express and included airplay and maybe chrome casting audio. It would replace my airport expresses in my UniFi stack immediately. I’d buy 3. But also the device limitation is brutal.
blackoil 3y ago
Does anyone have experience with Omada? Ignoring China/US, how does it compare in terms of tech and ecosystem?
- AviationAtom 3y ago
  It's been discussed elsewhere in the comments. It's affordably prices and just works.
whycombagator 3y ago
Surprised it’s only 2x2 MIMO not 4x4
- kbumsik 3y ago
  It's $150. You might be expecting too much for the price.
cloudking 3y ago
This is the Unifi device hackers can recommend to their friends and family, but not actually use themselves because they already have the more sophisticated set ups.
- forward1 3y ago
  The reason I "hacker" don't use Unifi is because it's not trusted. It's a closed source device which requires proprietary apps to use and collects data on your network and connected devices without explicit consent - colloquially known as a "backdoor". https://community.ui.com/questions/UI-official-urgent-please-answer/14259289-e4c3-4c5e-aaa0-02a5baa6cbbe?page=4 https://community.ui.com/questions/UI-official-urgent-please...
gigatexal 3y ago
For a home setup like mine this thing is awesome. I’m happy with my UniFi AP which costs about as much as this thing does but doesn’t run the service nor does it mesh. Cool little unit. I think it’ll sell rather well.
jnsaff2 3y ago
After some FW update made 2.4Ghz wifi unusable on the UDM I will never again buy anything from them. Tons of bug reports from users that never got answered. The hardware is mediocre anyway. Either buy Mikrotik as cheap and cheerful or go for broke with Ruckus/Meraki/etc. With Ruckus the 2x2 stuff has turned out not too impressive so would need to shell out even more with 4x4. Meraki is incredible but the subscription model is hard to swallow.
- omnimus 3y ago
  I have Mikrotik at home and it works well… But good luck setting up anything on it without a degree in RouterOS. It is very complex
jelavich 3y ago
Are they supporting IPv6 now?
- Astronaut3315 3y ago
  Superficially at best. It’s improving, but support for prefix delegation is nonexistent on the firewall side.
mrweasel 3y ago
It looks really cool, but personally I'm starting to give up on wifi. The spectrum in my neighborhood is so over utilized that at certain points during the evening I get random dropout in my wifi coverage. Every single thing that can be wired will be wired. The UniFi Express seems to be geared towards mesh networking, I still don't trust that to be reliable.
- MaKey 3y ago
  For devices that can't be wired you could try WiFi 6E which supports 6 GHz.
  - mrweasel 3y ago
    The device that struggle the most in my home is those that can't even do 5GHz, so upgrading the APs to WiFi 6 won't do me any good.
jackvalentine 3y ago
No 6ghz wifi no buy in 2023.
flumpcakes 3y ago
I want to like UI products, they seem to be the choice for prosumer equipment, but the lack of 10Gb networking is disappointing. WiFi 6/6e is multi-Gig but most devices only have the capacity to route/switch at the line rate of the physical ports. This is probably asking for too much but I would a set-up that allows me to operate at home: - 10Gb router (packet switching to fully saturate the number of physical ports) - 10Gb switch - 6/6e AP - 10Gb firewall with IPS/IDS Even just wanting a 10Gb switch for the home is nearly impossible, I doubt I will find a 10Gb router/ngfw that runs at line rate. It seems strange that networking, outside of the data centre and WiFi, seems to be stuck in 2001.
- oceanplexian 3y ago
  The lack of 10G across the board in consumer devices is disappointing. Somewhere in the early 00s computers started to come standard with gigabit. I think you could order a PowerMac G4 with gigabit in 2000. To put that in perspective, at that time VCRs were still the most popular way to watch a movie.
- geraldhh 3y ago
  gbit speeds are usually good enough for the majority of applications. even your 6e ap will not archive more than a gbit in most real world scenarios (not testing). the tables turn slowly, but the mass market for 10gig is just not here yet besides all-10gig soho switches beeing available for some time now. major point: 10gig uses vastly more power than 1gig, making integration (esp. in laptops) challenging. other point: ids/dpi at 10gig line speed is challenging, requiring a powerful cpu on the router and flawless integration.
  - vetinari 3y ago
    > even your 6e ap will not archive more than a gbit in most real world scenarios au contraire; even for wifi 5 aps like original Turris Omnia (3x3 MIMO, 80 MHz) or Ubiquiti nanoHD (4x4 MIMO, 80 MHz), the gigabit uplink was the bottleneck. > major point: 10gig uses vastly more power than 1gig, making integration (esp. in laptops) challenging. Only 10GBase-T. For a networking equipment, you would want SFP+ anyway. Laptops slowly are losing wired Ethernet entirely. Meanwhile, 2.5GBase-T is still good enough for laptops, and does not represent integration challenges.
deleted 3y ago
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megous 3y ago
My goto heuristic is: The slicker the presentation, the worse the actual product is. And this presentation is very slick. :) Does it hold with this company?
- indrora 3y ago
  Fifty fifty. Their hardware is quite good. Their consumer line (AmpliFi) is Solidly Okay. From a management perspective, their UniFi system is bar none one of the better solutions for large deployments where you've bought into their whole stack: Routers, switches, Firewalls, APs, everything. There's some things it does OK with other vendors (particularly switches) but it's meant to be managed under their garden. The nice part is that you can preconfigure hardware, chuck them into a bin, and make it Just Work on the other side. Deploying 100 APs to a new location? Ship 'em direct to the site, they'll just Show Up in the unifi interface. New deployment? Drop a few bits of hardware on a bench, set it up locally, yeet to new location, install the rest, configure over the 'net. Some people have sworn off them for a lot of papercuts: There's a few points where their UI just Doesn't Work. There's occasional spots where if you preconfigure it manually then try to use the management interface, you might exhaust a DHCP pool in an hour. But the hardware has, and continues to be, maybe not "cutting edge" but slightly behind it at a price point that makes enterprises salivate and Prosumers go "Hmmm I could probably swing that." And it works for a lot of people. That isn't to say every product they've put out has been a Banger. The Dream Machine was, at first, very much a mixed bag (and took several YEARS of True Believers really working with Ubiquti to get it right) and this is absolutely them recouping some design loss from their Aplifi Instant product (the case, design, even the screen is Very Similar to it). There's been versions of the controller hardware (and software) that have been... let's put it: Enough to send some people selling all their gear and moving vendors.
davidhyde 3y ago
I bought 3 ubiquity access points a couple of years ago for my parents and was shocked to find that they could only be configured by the unify mobile app which doesn’t recognise them because they’re so old. Just be aware of that behaviour when buying into this ecosystem! https://help.ui.com/hc/en-us/articles/12594679474071-Standalone-Access-Points-without-UniFi- https://help.ui.com/hc/en-us/articles/12594679474071-Standal...
- dewey 3y ago
  I think this happens quite frequently that people are also not aware of the controller software, which is the thing actually providing the value in the UI ecosystem. I just picked up another UniFi Protect camera that was only taken out of the box once on a marketplace, just because the person wasn't aware of what they are buying.
- MobileVet 3y ago
  Yep. I ran into that as well. Had to update the firmware using my laptop first. Less than ideal… but doable. On the upside, I haven’t touched the device since. In my experience they are fantastic for zero maintenance and ‘just works’ once setup
bhouston 3y ago
I was on unifi for a long time but I found it somewhat unreliable with a lot of issues. I switched over to TP-Link's Omada and now I never touch my network. I believe that TP-Link isn't as flashy, but they are rock solid. I prefer rock solid.
- heywire 3y ago
  Another vote for TP-Link here. I’m a big fan of how easy it is to adopt new devices too. Most recently I had to add a switch for work VLAN purposes. While waiting for it to arrive, I preconfigured the VLANs in the controller. When it arrived, it was basically just plug and play.
- papascrubs 3y ago
  Went from unifi to Omada here as well. The APs have better specs for half the price. UI is comparable (at least for wireless, can't comment on their edge stuff but if you're familiar with the standard unifi controller setup you'll be comfortable with Omada).
jFriedensreich 3y ago
I am quite turned off after a short honeymoon with unifi. They push setup via their mobile apps to the point that connecting to a dreammachine and entering its ip adress just shows a download link to the app store. The app could not connect without any hint of reason so i just consider this bricket now. Even before there were many red flags such as login flows to a local device going via .com domains. Completely confusing architecture where it is not obvious to me what parts of the admin setup run on unifis servers vs on the device. Why do all companies selling great looking devices poison everything with their cloud crap.
- midasuni 3y ago
  Companies aren’t satisfied with selling a great product for a profit, they have to keep growing. Their view is that not doing things like cloud services, adverts, selling personal data, etc is “leaving money on the table”
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
- forward1 3y ago
  I refuse to buy any device that requires an "app" to configure. It's clear the developers care more about your data than the product at that point.
Arch-TK 3y ago
The UniFi hardware is always tempting but the ecosystem is such a turn-off. I've never felt like my home network required vendor lock-in, cloud management and proprietary management software/firmware. I was so displeased with having to run a proprietary server on my internal infrastructure (which depended on MongoDB of all things, which no distro seems to ship anymore) just to manage my UniFi AP-Lite that I flashed it with OpenWRT and never looked back. I'll stick to my PCEngines box running OpenBSD + mikrotik managed switches + OpenWRT, thanks. This setup is hardly much more complicated than the inherent complexity of any non-trivial home network and can be managed with SSH and a web browser.
tosh 3y ago
I'm not that familiar with the UI product lineup but recently found the Beryl AX https://www.gl-inet.com/products/gl-mt3000/ https://www.gl-inet.com/products/gl-mt3000/ which comes with a 2.5 Gbit ethernet port (the UniFI Express caps out at 1 Gbit ports) and OpenWRT based firmware which looks like a decent price/value/form factor combo at ~USD 90. Anyone who has more experience with UI: is this a comparable product? Edit: it sounds like the UI products have a fleet management concept and are designed to work together (Apple-esque sum is greater, plug and play …)
InTheArena 3y ago
This thread is kinda bonkers. People complain about the USG3 not being able to route 1gb/s (IIRC, it's 10 years old, and always capped at 250mb/s), or the UDMP Pro at 10GB/s IDS/IDP (It can run at 2.5GB/s with IDP and IDS). Wireguard and policy based routing (which is why most people were sticking away from their routers) are in place, and far simpler to maintain then alternating options from PFSense and Cisco. The magic VPN stuff really feels like Apple when it just works. Their WAPs are a bit pricey on for 6E support, but otherwise are generally considered the best prosumer WAPs available, and competitive (and cheaper) then most enterprise options. They are overkill if you don't need management, but in a IoT world, you need VLAN management. The VOP and security cameras and phones are solid. Best of all this run cloudless. You buy the hardware, the software is free and runs locally. Even their enterprise software is being ported to run on device (and free for prosumer use cases) This is part of three new devices that are strongly targeting the old Apple base station market. The third - UDR ultra - is coming out soon (it was leaked in the same art dump that this and the other device was leaked) and has 2.5GB/s WAN and LAN. IF you want to run their VOIP / camera / door system, there is the UDM Pro and UDM Pro SE. I have the base level UDM Pro with a 2.5 GB/s primary and a 1GB fiber secondary. Works great, auto-failover, firewall management, VPN, RADIUS, etc. In general, if you want WIFI and network that just works, but still does policy based routing, VLAN management, can dump to Prometheus (with unifipoller), run VOIP and security cameras (even with Homekit secure support, thanks to Scrypted), this is the solution for you. I run my in-laws and my parents network stack remotely with UDRs. I highly recommend them. If you want to run your own hardware, or have even more power, buy your own and run OPNsense, or go upmarket. For everyone else, this stack rocks.
- wredue 3y ago
  And also, $192 is not at all a bad price tag. It’s actually a bit surprising as UI stuff is classically viewed as a bit overpriced. That said, I have a UniFi router and 3 wifi 6 APs and my network is super solid. Way better than any prosumer targeted router (note that I previously ran 3 netgear nighthawk). The UniFi stack was actually cheaper and is unquestionably more reliable. If you’re looking at those very high end prosumer routers, I’d very much advise taking a step back and looking at alternatives.
forward1 3y ago
Always been intrigued by UniFi stuff, is it still the case you need an app to set up and configure their devices? I don't have an app store, and they don't publish their app elsewhere, so this was always a non-starter for me, and a weird design choice at that.
- wredue 3y ago
  You can deploy instances of their config software at will. There are docker containers out there for you. This device runs UniFi Network so it can host the configuration. There is the cloudkey that can host the config There are routers that host the config in their product line. I don’t think it’s ever been the case that you “need” the app.
  - forward1 3y ago
    Step 9 is install an app from an app store https://dl.ui.com/qig/u6+/#A https://dl.ui.com/qig/u6+/#A There is no other instruction for people without an app store. Not even in their help article. https://help.ui.com/hc/en-us/articles/12594679474071-Standalone-Access-Points-without-UniFi- https://help.ui.com/hc/en-us/articles/12594679474071-Standal... > Log in to the UniFi Mobile App (iOS / Android). Why do I need to log in to an app to set up a LAN device? It's complete nonsense and makes me ultimately distrust Unifi.
NelsonMinar 3y ago
It's funny the screenshots include their traffic accounting graphs. The data in those are complete garbage and have been for years. I run the installable controller on an Ubuntu server. It shows me last month my Playstation downloaded 66.7GB, or 6GB, or 1.66GB. Two of those on the same screen! (The real number may be close to 66.7GB.)
ecoffey 3y ago
Trying to see from specs and such if the mesh supports ethernet backhaul vs wifi radio like the google wifi does.

213 points by CharlesW 3y ago

I love ubiquiti. My entire home network runs on their gear, with self-hosted management. I have infra deployed across the country in a remote office that runs their gear, with a cloud key. It's solid stuff all around. Don’t use any of their unifi routers tho, can’t speak to that. I have an ER-4 at home and the remote office has a pfsense 1U.

boringuser2 3y ago
It's not a particularly good setup, but it's also not a particularly bad one. Actual prosumer+ products like Sophos XG (free), Untangle Home, *sense blow it out of the water, though, by giving actual offerings for features where Unifi gives a diet version. That all being said, it's definitely a cut above most consumer networking setups, maybe with the exception of Asus -- they do a pretty solid job.
- dixie_land 3y ago
  I feel they all but abandoned the EdgeRouter line, which hits the sweet spot of prosumer for me.
- Spivak 3y ago
  The part that's missing for me is what hardware do I put it on?
spacebacon 3y ago
Same here, I love the UDM Pro SE. Blocking application layer stuff like QUIC is just a couple clicks away. It has decent intrusion detection and response alongside other easy to configure firewall settings.
- cced 3y ago
  Why and how do you block application layer stuff like quic?
  - jjoonathan 3y ago
    Tiny network tyrants gotta flex somehow.
    - spacebacon 3y ago
      Sure, large network tyrants really don’t like the tiny network tyrants that prefer their network traffic to be fully visible.
  - spacebacon 3y ago
    When UDM shows you QUIC eats up the majority of your bandwidth you may decide to click to add a rule to block it. You may see a large reduction in overall daily bandwidth as a result. If you watch YouTube you are using QUIC. Certain QUIC vulnerabilities are a 3 or 4 packet compromise.
    - cced 3y ago
      I’m Guessing the sites will then fallback to another protocol correct?
      - spacebacon 3y ago
        Yes plain UDP or TCP.
    - srj 3y ago
      Youtube will fall back to TCP. If the bandwidth utilization actually did drop it's probably because the stream quality throttled down. What do you mean by "QUIC vulnerabilities are a 3 or 4 packet compromise"?
      - spacebacon 3y ago
- gotbeans 3y ago
  Udm pro SE is the best thing I bought. 10g, protect for camera selfhosting which works great, new updates made wireguard first class citizen, and if you want anything more complicated it's just a dumb debian underneath (which I do a bunch of stuff). I'm reallt happy with it.
  - artificialLimbs 3y ago
    >>> and if you want anything more complicated it's just a dumb debian underneath Are you doing persistence (keep settings/data after reboot) with Unifi OS 3?
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
xvector 3y ago
I kinda hate Ubiquiti routers. My UDM Pro felt like a total scam, with the IDS/IPS being nowhere close to advertised. They promised but never introduced WireGuard. I also experienced strange bugs in the stack. I eventually moved to OPNSense but the router I bought from them died. The interface was too cumbersome anyways, from the perspective of someone that just wanted WireGuard server+client, IPS/IDS, and VLAN. I finally moved to Firewalla and it is lightyears ahead of Ubiquiti, OPNSense, and any other solution I've tried from a power user perspective. I use this with Ubiquiti APs connected to my Pi running the Ubiquiti management software, which works out quite well. The Firewalla is far easier to use, has a way better UX, and covers 95% of the power user tasks.
- ladzoppelin 3y ago
  Do you think Ubiquiti APs are still good, I have not used them since 2018?
  - whalesalad 3y ago
    Love their AP’s.
  - yftsui 3y ago
    I regret my time spent on Ubiquiti devices at home use, in the past five years my view has changed from very positive to entirely negative. They are getting worse instead of better, I am seriously considering getting rid of all Ubiquiti devices from my home, Ubiquiti software updates lack testing and break things often, I simply don’t have time to baby sit them anymore. Their iOS app has become harder to navigate with feature loss instead of improvement as well. My Ubiquiti setup (one LR and one lite) was done back in 2018, devices on the network is roughly the same in the past 5 years, only phones laptops changed due to upgrades. Since 2020/21 their firmware updates started dropping support of old device randomly, or support become worse (devices get disconnected frequently or full bar but not responsive). First was my Kindle 3G keyboard, then Fitbit Aria Scale, then quite a few smart switches/plugs. I literally scratched my head to understand the settings, but they just won’t connect to the Ubiquiti AP. I had to buy an Eero as backup and continuously migrate these older devices as they are unable to connect. Their most recent firmware update last week kicked my Sony TV off the network(bought in 2018), I have no idea what they are thinking and wasted 1 hour rebooting and blaming Sony, then found it connect to the Eero AP just fine.
stephen_g 3y ago
I’ve definitely gone off their routers since they basically abandoned the EdgeRouter line. I still use their APs for now, sometimes the switches, they’re all pretty solid, but I’ve been gradually getting more and more negative about Ubiquiti in general…
- walterbell 3y ago
  ER3-Lite can run OpenBSD.
  - tw04 3y ago
    Unless it supports hardware offloading you’d be better off tossing it in the trash. The thing can only push ~100mbit without it. https://help.ui.com/hc/en-us/articles/205204070-EdgeMAX-How-do-I-disable-IP-offload-for-hardware-acceleration- https://help.ui.com/hc/en-us/articles/205204070-EdgeMAX-How-...

xt00 3y ago

Interesting— looks like it is a Dream Machine plus WiFi AP combo.

taspeotis 3y ago
They already have that? The UDR

chenzhekl 3y ago

Could anyone help explain what this is. Is it just a fancy WiFi router?

lopkeny12ko 3y ago
> What is UniFi Express? > UniFi Express is a complete UniFi Networking stack in an ultra-compact, plug-and-play form factor. It runs UniFi Network and features a powerful gateway engine and built-in WiFi 6 with seamless meshing.
- handy2000 3y ago
  Read this several times. Still don't know what I am looking at. What is "UniFi Networking stack", what is "UniFi Network"? Is it a WiFi router? I use a TP-Link router at home, and they don't sell it as "TP-Link Networking stack".
  - gotbeans 3y ago
    A "network stack" should be a somewhat relatively familiar concept if you are acquainted with networking in any way.
  - BHSPitMonkey 3y ago
    More complex networks (e.g. in commercial settings, or the homes of I.T. nerds) will often consist of a router plus one or more switches and/or wireless access points, probably spread out across a site with multiple ethernet drops. A typical router sold for home consumers (like yours I'm guessing) is a combination of all three of those in one convenient package, which is enough for most home use cases. Companies like Ubiquiti (under the UniFi brand), Meraki, etc. make these products such that they can all work together as an ecosystem, e.g. so you can log into a single dashboard and manage the network as well as every individual device's configuration from one place. This is the difference between a so-called "managed" switch (or wireless access point) versus an ordinary dumb one. UniFi also makes PoE security cameras that are managed through their ecosystem in the same manner. This sort of ecosystem is useful for people doing I.T. in commercial settings. You can use a single interface to manage a network in a huge office building with hundreds of devices, or to manage lots of smaller networks spread across different sites. This "UniFi Express" product seems more suitable for the latter, e.g. in cafes or small retail settings where you might just use it on its own or add a small number of additional switches/APs. It's similar to your home router+AP combo, but it also contains the management software I described before which is capable of adopting more UniFi devices and provides remote administration. Edit: If you're curious, TP-Link's equivalent to UniFi is called Omada: https://www.tp-link.com/us/omada-sdn/ https://www.tp-link.com/us/omada-sdn/

huevosabio 3y ago

I love unifi, I have a dream router, and three APs in an airbnb. And it's really solid. But man, it's just too hard to find available stock. It took me time to find the dream router and even now it's out of stock, and, this new device is also out of stock.

Rinum 3y ago
Right?! Who's buying? Big businesses or regular retail? Or are they limiting supply to keep prices high?
- boringuser2 3y ago
  The second one. Businesses aren't buying this shit.
  - entropie 3y ago
    Wrong. I watched a video yesterday from a german medical cannabis business where I recognized unifi APs in the building. Their camera system was (as one would imagine) unifi too.
    - boringuser2 3y ago
      [flagged]
      - entropie 3y ago
        As long as you dont provide any reasoning your are just another guy in the internet talking gibberish.
        boringuser2 3y ago
        1. The throughput is inadequate. 2. The IDS/IPS is an inadequate Suricata instance with outdated rulesets and no SSL inspection. 3. There is nothing comparable to a WAF. Gun to my head, I'd trust ASUS AI protect for a business router to substantially outperform Unifi's security offerings. The ASUS at least knows what it is and what it can be: basically a glorified WAF. IDS/IPS don't even work well with up to date rulesets if they can't decrypt traffic.

twisteriffic 3y ago

Never mind that, check this out: https://ca.store.ui.com/ca/en/pro/category/all-cloud-keys-gateways/products/uxg-lite https://ca.store.ui.com/ca/en/pro/category/all-cloud-keys-ga... Finally a viable USG3 replacement.

gooseyard 3y ago
I had one arrive yesterday and hooked it up today, was worried I'd foul things up somehow since I'd never replaced the Gateway before (my USG was 6 or 7 years old I think) but I just removed the old one, plugged in the new one, adopted it, and off we went. My cable modem seemed to need a reboot but that was it. I had never enabled the traffic inspection stuff on the USG, so it was neat to finally get a look at that stuff after having it inactive for years. I'd been thinking about getting one of the UDM things but since the USG was working well I figured I'd wait until something like this came along. So far, so good!
__float 3y ago
This doesn't really seem comparable -- the big draw to the Express seems to be the WiFi built-in; at $149 for the Express vs $172 for the Gateway Lite + (at least) ~$100 for an AP, these are entirely different categories.
- samcat116 3y ago
  I don't think they're saying they're comparable, its just that a lot of people were waiting for the cheaper standalone firewall, which is what the gateway lite is. also its $129 not $172.
  - twisteriffic 3y ago
    You've got it. I'm on my third boot drive replacement on my USG, have been worried that eventually something was going to break that I couldn't fix. Being able to enable traffic inspection and IDS will be great.
  - __float 3y ago

stbenjam 3y ago

Another confused product from UniFi. Is it targeting home users or businesses? It looks like businesses from their web page yet feels very much like a better fit for home. It only runs UniFi Network, so you have to buy more things, that also run UniFi Network, to get into any of their other products like Protect. I like their stuff but lately a lot of their stuff feels just confused to me, like they don't know what they want to be.

ikiris 3y ago
They want to get income like a hardware store, but sell their product as if their value is software, that they then don't maintain because its not selling their latest hardware.
boringuser2 3y ago
A business really shouldn't be running this. Anything that isn't basically your home office is running a solid NGFW with SSL interception.
- marcus0x62 3y ago
  That’s…Not an accurate description of how things work in the real world. There are large enterprises out there with NGFWs that aren’t doing much TLS inspection. Your average mom and pop business is more likely to have a wifi AP/router/NAT gateway combo from their ISP than something as feature rich as Unifi, let alone a real NGFW.
  - fnordpiglet 3y ago
    Every major company I’ve been at absolutely positively does NOT MitM their own traffic. They pay security people well enough to realize what a massive hole that creates in their security posture, and makes the intercepting appliance a cess pit of regulatory toxic waste. PCI, MNPI, even HIPPA from employees visiting their health insurance site? Check, check, check! All on a silver platter for insiders and hackers.
    - 3y ago

xattt 3y ago

I am lucky enough to have FTTH service where the provider furnishes me with an SFP stick with simple DHCP (no PPPoE). Beyond UniFi, Microtik, and rolling your own, there’s very little option in consumer routers.

latentcall 3y ago
Yep, just had my ISP take my SFP ONT back for a regular RJ45 ONT so I could use a different firewall with RJ45 only WAN. Hard to find a good box with SFP WAN.
- minorandromeda 3y ago
  Some Netgate firewalls have SFP WAN ports.
midasuni 3y ago
You need a router that takes a standard sfp and can support a dhcp client? That’s basically any router!

smcleod 3y ago

Weird that the ethernet ports are only 1GbE, that discounts everyone with a >1Gbit internet connection

barkerja 3y ago
This is my biggest knock against Ubiquiti at the moment. They have no real solutions in the 2.5GbE/10GbE market.
- samch 3y ago
  The UDM-SE I have has a 10Gbps and 2.5Gbps WAN ports: https://store.ui.com/us/en/pro/category/all-unifi-cloud-gateways/products/udm-se https://store.ui.com/us/en/pro/category/all-unifi-cloud-gate... They also have multi-Gbps switches up to 25Gbps SFP28: https://store.ui.com/us/en?category=all-switching https://store.ui.com/us/en?category=all-switching
  - barkerja 3y ago
    Ah nice! And looking further, it appears their U6-Enterprise and U6-Enterprise-IW both support 2.5GbE uplinks.
  - larrysalibra 3y ago
    From reports online the UDM-SE won’t actually NAT close to 10 Gbps and the manufacturer doesn’t provide any NAT performance numbers…so it becomes a bottle neck if you have 10 Gbps internet which is widely available and not that expensive my part of the world. (Hong Kong). The only reasonably priced router I could find about 6 months ago that would NAT at line speed was the TP-LINK Onada ER8411. I ended up going with an all Oanda network which seems to work fine but ubiquiti had originally been my first choice.
  - fetzu 3y ago
    I recently encounter this as my ISP upgraded me to 10 Gbps over fiber: the UDM-PRO/SE does/can have a 10/2.5 Gbps WAN port over SPF+, but all the Ethernet ports go over to the COU via the same 1/2.5Gbps interface bottleneck [1]. If you really want to use your 10/2.5 Gbps you’re going to have run your services directly on the UDM or go out though the SPF+ port and serve from there via another switch, but then the point of having an UDM is kinda moot. I wish this was more explicitly advertised when I first bought it. [1] https://ubntwiki.com/products/unifi/unifi_dream_machine_pro https://ubntwiki.com/products/unifi/unifi_dream_machine_pro

CobaltFire 3y ago

This is effectively a Dream Router minus any other app support and the switch. For a typical home user who doesn't want/need Protect this seems decent, but I think the $50 upcharge for the UDR is absolutely worth it. That said, the UDR is heavily limited in running Protect. I started hitting occasional problems running Network and Protect together when I hit 4 cameras.

Kirby64 3y ago
The dream router can’t route faster than 500mbit, which is a huge limitation. This claims to do 1gbit routing, so pairing with a switch gives you a dream router that can actually route at 1gbit.
- CobaltFire 3y ago
  With IDS and IPS turned off I can get routing at over 800Mbit consistently with my UDR. It has the typical foibles of UniFi routing so I'm replacing it, but I haven't had too many issues with it tapping out the Gb port (when my cable line allows). I wouldn't even try to add any fancy features to it and expect it to hold up though; it just doesn't have the power. Oh, and one of the foibles is that if I do hit the router with a connection that saturates it it drops every other device on the network. So it being able to route above 500Mbit is kind of a non-starter I guess, as it can't do it to more than one client.
  - Kirby64 3y ago
    Not sure what you settings you used, but I never was able to achieve above ~500Mbit even with everything disabled. The other thing I noticed: you literally cannot access or use the management UI when you're saturating the connection. It just straight up will not load.
    - CobaltFire 3y ago
      I'm pretty light on settings, but I don't remember offhand. I agree on the UI. Now that we are running the Protect app on an iPad all the time (my child is special needs so we use the cameras to keep an eye on everything) it has throttled pretty hard. Maybe 400Mbit now? I honestly hadn't tested it in a while, and haven't had the time to do in depth. It's absolutely slower now. I have a Mikrotik CCR2004-1G-2XS-PCIE that will be my new router when I get around to it, and the UDR will be an AP and run the Network and Protect apps. We've been seeing weird issues ever since leaning on it harder, so I'm going to see how it does just being a Controller and AP.

I_Am_Nous 3y ago

For $150 this looks pretty awesome. We offer home managed Wi-Fi and this replaces the security gateway and AP with a single box.

peddling-brink 3y ago
Which security gateway? Not the USG.
- JonChesterfield 3y ago
  The USG is seems to be consistently unpopular in proper engineering circles but I rather like my one. It runs off PoE (with an adapter, sadly), doesn't fall over, doesn't take any of my time keeping it working.

syntaxing 3y ago

Had a UDR but switched to OPNsense. But the biggest issue with the UDR is that it can only handle about 500 Mbps due to the subpar CPU. Anyone know if this can actually run gigabit speeds?

buildbot 3y ago
I too switched to OPNsense., which has been awesome. Partly due to weird dns failure issues, but mostly due to what turned out to be the bullshit claims about security issues :/ krebs did real damage to them by pushing that story.
- syntaxing 3y ago
  Yup, pretty much why I swapped mine. I think the final nail of the coffin was when they were like, “ok, we need to remove the free shipping so we can stay competitive without increasing prices”. Then a couple months later “jk, we gotta increase the prices too” (surprise to no one). My OPNSense N100 PC + omada switch and AP was like $400 all said and done.
Kirby64 3y ago
From their FAQ: UniFi Express can route traffic at speeds up to 1 Gbps. Security features such as Device Identification, Traffic Identification, Country Restrictions, and Ad Blocking can all be enabled without impacting routing performance.

spankalee 3y ago

This page is a bit confusing if you don't already know the terms... What exactly is "A complete UniFi networking stack" anyway? Is UniFi some protocol that extends WiFi?

handy2000 3y ago
Exactly, I only understood that it's basically a WiFi router by reading this thread. I guess I am not their target buyer... still, would appreciate more clarity.
I_Am_Nous 3y ago
Unifi AP for wifi, Unifi switches, Unifi security gateway of some kind, Unifi point to point for terrestrial wireless to share with another set of Unifi gear in a barn/shed/whatever down the road. All managed by UNMS.
- handy2000 3y ago
  OK, as an engineer with decades of experience, I give up. What is "Unify AP for WiFi"?
  - _rs 3y ago
    Unifi is just their name for this series of products that all work together with their (free) controller. So you buy an AP, a switch, a router, all from the Unifi line of products and they all get setup from a single controller and work together pretty effortlessly
    - handy2000 3y ago
      I see, thanks. So basically a suite of networking hardware solutions? What I found the most confusing is that they sort of differentiate UniFi from WiFi. E.g. "Instant WiFi for retail POS" - yes, like any other WiFi router? Or is this box going to connect to a global mesh that's called UniFi?..

xoa 3y ago

So I started seriously using UniFi I think in 2016-ish after using some of their PtP/PtMP stuff for longer. I never ran anything massive peaking at under 200 devices total across various sites, but we did put it pretty hard, and I did enjoy it and find the value proposition excellent. And having said that I'd sound a real note of caution, which is why I've eliminated most of them in favor the same-niche positioned Omada. Ubiquiti turned into a real development dumpster fire, every bad tech trope right from the textbook. They have a long history of introducing constant new hardware that, particular for routing/firewall/gateway services then languishes even as it gets sold new without a single update for ages. Various touted efforts that then got unceremoniously wiped. Really basic core functionality neglected for constant UX churn, let alone useful important new features. "Dumpster fire" has not been an unreasonable descriptor. They've also added a concerning trend towards proprietary lock-in and pushing of cloud, even though to their great credit full local control remains a key selling point. Omada isn't perfect either, and the hardware design is worse, though it's been more reliable and with a lot of basics better locked down for me. I'd be delighted to have two strong competitors there, and there have been a few promising glimmers on UniFi, like PPSK getting some initial attention (4 years late is better than nothing). And certainly the basic switching and WiFi mostly works. Having a whole single pane of glass remains attractive, and either is a big upgrade over the kind of stuff a lot of people are coming from. Just take some of their promotional gloss with a grain of salt is all. And as always AIO is something to balance as well. When I switched out the routing side of things for OPNsense I could maintain the whole rest of the stack as I pleased, including APs in optimal positions. The latter is less of a (or zero) concern in small spaces, but even then WiFi, switching, and routing needs don't always evolve in sync.

jxi 3y ago

What would I get from this both hardware and software-wise that I don't get from ASUS routers?

aetherspawn 3y ago
OK, I've had several high-end ASUS routers and I know that your ASUS router is probably not stable and needs to be restarted all the time. At very least, Unifi is a huge step up from that and it will easily run at max performance for 3+ months at a time without a reboot.
- jxi 3y ago
  I haven't experienced any instability with personal routers to be honest.
forward1 3y ago
A ton of proprietary software and the externalization of support on a third party.

hristov 3y ago

I am willing to bet it runs the unifi software on an arm chip. Which is kind of funny considering they dropped official support for arm on third party devices.

qainsights 3y ago

What does this product do? Wanted to purchase, but not sure what the purpose is.

BHSPitMonkey 3y ago
Why do you want to purchase it before you know what it does? It's an entry-level WiFi router with UniFi's Network software, which provides the ability to buy more UniFi gear (switches and additional APs) if you have a really big house and/or wish to connect more than 1 device over ethernet. Unlike its bigger siblings, the Dream Router and the Dream Machine, it lacks additional built-in ethernet ports (i.e. you'd need to buy a switch) and can't host security cameras (the UniFi Protect product line).
- joemi 3y ago
  Pretty good summary, though I'd add that it's also (probably) more stable than a lot of common home routers.

Someone1234 3y ago

This product that has a huge caveat that limits it to many people's applications: > UniFi Express supports up to 5 connected UniFi Network devices, including other UniFi Express units, switches, and WiFi access points. Even my home has one AP per floor (3x) and 3x Unifi switches. This is clearly an artificial limitation for market segmentation reasons. I'm not going to rip out Unifi switches to go unmanaged, just for the pleasure of using Express. Hopefully nobody buys it without reading the small print. I feel like the lack of Protect and the 5 UniFi device limit are going to really limit who will buy this even at this price.

artificialLimbs 3y ago
The 50 vlan limit on their top of line stuff is the only reason we don't deploy them exclusively across our biz.
- windexh8er 3y ago
  The former, EdgeSwitch / EdgeRouter (all black in color), didn't have this low of a limit. I still run a 48 port, 500W PoE switch in my main rack at home and it's got limit of 255 active VLAN.
- Temporary_31337 3y ago
  Genuinely curious What do you need 50+ vlans for? It feels like you could have physical lans to separate or simply different subnets? It’s hard for me to imagine why you would want to aggregate so many vlans over a single physical connection?
  - Someone1234 3y ago
    In certain scenarios, it may be necessary to assign multiple VLAN tags to the same network port. This is particularly common in environments where devices connected to that port need access to different network segments simultaneously. For example, a networked device in a conference room might require access to VLANs designated for both guest internet and internal company resources. In this case, the port would be configured as a 'trunk' port, allowing traffic from multiple VLANs (each identified by a unique tag) to pass through. This setup ensures that the device can communicate across different departmental or functional network segments, such as VLANs for e.g. IT, Marketing, or Sales, etc. Using VLANs over physical LANs or different subnets is fundamentally about enhancing network management efficiency and flexibility. The core advantage of VLANs is that they allow network administrators to segment and manage the network logically without the need for physical rearrangements. This means an engineer can configure and reconfigure network segments without the need to physically move cables or hardware (or even be on-site).

psyclobe 3y ago

I dig their stack; for a personal nerd setup no one else makes it so easy to deploy advanced networks.

metmac 3y ago

If they had taken the opportunity to make it like an AirPort Express and included airplay and maybe chrome casting audio. It would replace my airport expresses in my UniFi stack immediately. I’d buy 3. But also the device limitation is brutal.

blackoil 3y ago

Does anyone have experience with Omada? Ignoring China/US, how does it compare in terms of tech and ecosystem?

AviationAtom 3y ago
It's been discussed elsewhere in the comments. It's affordably prices and just works.

whycombagator 3y ago

Surprised it’s only 2x2 MIMO not 4x4

kbumsik 3y ago
It's $150. You might be expecting too much for the price.

cloudking 3y ago

This is the Unifi device hackers can recommend to their friends and family, but not actually use themselves because they already have the more sophisticated set ups.

forward1 3y ago
The reason I "hacker" don't use Unifi is because it's not trusted. It's a closed source device which requires proprietary apps to use and collects data on your network and connected devices without explicit consent - colloquially known as a "backdoor". https://community.ui.com/questions/UI-official-urgent-please-answer/14259289-e4c3-4c5e-aaa0-02a5baa6cbbe?page=4 https://community.ui.com/questions/UI-official-urgent-please...

gigatexal 3y ago

For a home setup like mine this thing is awesome. I’m happy with my UniFi AP which costs about as much as this thing does but doesn’t run the service nor does it mesh. Cool little unit. I think it’ll sell rather well.

jnsaff2 3y ago

After some FW update made 2.4Ghz wifi unusable on the UDM I will never again buy anything from them. Tons of bug reports from users that never got answered. The hardware is mediocre anyway. Either buy Mikrotik as cheap and cheerful or go for broke with Ruckus/Meraki/etc. With Ruckus the 2x2 stuff has turned out not too impressive so would need to shell out even more with 4x4. Meraki is incredible but the subscription model is hard to swallow.

omnimus 3y ago
I have Mikrotik at home and it works well… But good luck setting up anything on it without a degree in RouterOS. It is very complex

jelavich 3y ago

Are they supporting IPv6 now?

Astronaut3315 3y ago
Superficially at best. It’s improving, but support for prefix delegation is nonexistent on the firewall side.

mrweasel 3y ago

It looks really cool, but personally I'm starting to give up on wifi. The spectrum in my neighborhood is so over utilized that at certain points during the evening I get random dropout in my wifi coverage. Every single thing that can be wired will be wired. The UniFi Express seems to be geared towards mesh networking, I still don't trust that to be reliable.

MaKey 3y ago
For devices that can't be wired you could try WiFi 6E which supports 6 GHz.
- mrweasel 3y ago
  The device that struggle the most in my home is those that can't even do 5GHz, so upgrading the APs to WiFi 6 won't do me any good.

jackvalentine 3y ago

No 6ghz wifi no buy in 2023.

flumpcakes 3y ago

I want to like UI products, they seem to be the choice for prosumer equipment, but the lack of 10Gb networking is disappointing. WiFi 6/6e is multi-Gig but most devices only have the capacity to route/switch at the line rate of the physical ports. This is probably asking for too much but I would a set-up that allows me to operate at home: - 10Gb router (packet switching to fully saturate the number of physical ports) - 10Gb switch - 6/6e AP - 10Gb firewall with IPS/IDS Even just wanting a 10Gb switch for the home is nearly impossible, I doubt I will find a 10Gb router/ngfw that runs at line rate. It seems strange that networking, outside of the data centre and WiFi, seems to be stuck in 2001.

oceanplexian 3y ago
The lack of 10G across the board in consumer devices is disappointing. Somewhere in the early 00s computers started to come standard with gigabit. I think you could order a PowerMac G4 with gigabit in 2000. To put that in perspective, at that time VCRs were still the most popular way to watch a movie.
geraldhh 3y ago
gbit speeds are usually good enough for the majority of applications. even your 6e ap will not archive more than a gbit in most real world scenarios (not testing). the tables turn slowly, but the mass market for 10gig is just not here yet besides all-10gig soho switches beeing available for some time now. major point: 10gig uses vastly more power than 1gig, making integration (esp. in laptops) challenging. other point: ids/dpi at 10gig line speed is challenging, requiring a powerful cpu on the router and flawless integration.
- vetinari 3y ago
  > even your 6e ap will not archive more than a gbit in most real world scenarios au contraire; even for wifi 5 aps like original Turris Omnia (3x3 MIMO, 80 MHz) or Ubiquiti nanoHD (4x4 MIMO, 80 MHz), the gigabit uplink was the bottleneck. > major point: 10gig uses vastly more power than 1gig, making integration (esp. in laptops) challenging. Only 10GBase-T. For a networking equipment, you would want SFP+ anyway. Laptops slowly are losing wired Ethernet entirely. Meanwhile, 2.5GBase-T is still good enough for laptops, and does not represent integration challenges.

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megous 3y ago

My goto heuristic is: The slicker the presentation, the worse the actual product is. And this presentation is very slick. :) Does it hold with this company?

indrora 3y ago
Fifty fifty. Their hardware is quite good. Their consumer line (AmpliFi) is Solidly Okay. From a management perspective, their UniFi system is bar none one of the better solutions for large deployments where you've bought into their whole stack: Routers, switches, Firewalls, APs, everything. There's some things it does OK with other vendors (particularly switches) but it's meant to be managed under their garden. The nice part is that you can preconfigure hardware, chuck them into a bin, and make it Just Work on the other side. Deploying 100 APs to a new location? Ship 'em direct to the site, they'll just Show Up in the unifi interface. New deployment? Drop a few bits of hardware on a bench, set it up locally, yeet to new location, install the rest, configure over the 'net. Some people have sworn off them for a lot of papercuts: There's a few points where their UI just Doesn't Work. There's occasional spots where if you preconfigure it manually then try to use the management interface, you might exhaust a DHCP pool in an hour. But the hardware has, and continues to be, maybe not "cutting edge" but slightly behind it at a price point that makes enterprises salivate and Prosumers go "Hmmm I could probably swing that." And it works for a lot of people. That isn't to say every product they've put out has been a Banger. The Dream Machine was, at first, very much a mixed bag (and took several YEARS of True Believers really working with Ubiquti to get it right) and this is absolutely them recouping some design loss from their Aplifi Instant product (the case, design, even the screen is Very Similar to it). There's been versions of the controller hardware (and software) that have been... let's put it: Enough to send some people selling all their gear and moving vendors.

davidhyde 3y ago

I bought 3 ubiquity access points a couple of years ago for my parents and was shocked to find that they could only be configured by the unify mobile app which doesn’t recognise them because they’re so old. Just be aware of that behaviour when buying into this ecosystem! https://help.ui.com/hc/en-us/articles/12594679474071-Standalone-Access-Points-without-UniFi- https://help.ui.com/hc/en-us/articles/12594679474071-Standal...

dewey 3y ago
I think this happens quite frequently that people are also not aware of the controller software, which is the thing actually providing the value in the UI ecosystem. I just picked up another UniFi Protect camera that was only taken out of the box once on a marketplace, just because the person wasn't aware of what they are buying.
MobileVet 3y ago
Yep. I ran into that as well. Had to update the firmware using my laptop first. Less than ideal… but doable. On the upside, I haven’t touched the device since. In my experience they are fantastic for zero maintenance and ‘just works’ once setup

bhouston 3y ago

I was on unifi for a long time but I found it somewhat unreliable with a lot of issues. I switched over to TP-Link's Omada and now I never touch my network. I believe that TP-Link isn't as flashy, but they are rock solid. I prefer rock solid.

heywire 3y ago
Another vote for TP-Link here. I’m a big fan of how easy it is to adopt new devices too. Most recently I had to add a switch for work VLAN purposes. While waiting for it to arrive, I preconfigured the VLANs in the controller. When it arrived, it was basically just plug and play.
papascrubs 3y ago
Went from unifi to Omada here as well. The APs have better specs for half the price. UI is comparable (at least for wireless, can't comment on their edge stuff but if you're familiar with the standard unifi controller setup you'll be comfortable with Omada).

jFriedensreich 3y ago

I am quite turned off after a short honeymoon with unifi. They push setup via their mobile apps to the point that connecting to a dreammachine and entering its ip adress just shows a download link to the app store. The app could not connect without any hint of reason so i just consider this bricket now. Even before there were many red flags such as login flows to a local device going via .com domains. Completely confusing architecture where it is not obvious to me what parts of the admin setup run on unifis servers vs on the device. Why do all companies selling great looking devices poison everything with their cloud crap.

midasuni 3y ago
Companies aren’t satisfied with selling a great product for a profit, they have to keep growing. Their view is that not doing things like cloud services, adverts, selling personal data, etc is “leaving money on the table”
- deleted 3y ago
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forward1 3y ago
I refuse to buy any device that requires an "app" to configure. It's clear the developers care more about your data than the product at that point.

Arch-TK 3y ago

The UniFi hardware is always tempting but the ecosystem is such a turn-off. I've never felt like my home network required vendor lock-in, cloud management and proprietary management software/firmware. I was so displeased with having to run a proprietary server on my internal infrastructure (which depended on MongoDB of all things, which no distro seems to ship anymore) just to manage my UniFi AP-Lite that I flashed it with OpenWRT and never looked back. I'll stick to my PCEngines box running OpenBSD + mikrotik managed switches + OpenWRT, thanks. This setup is hardly much more complicated than the inherent complexity of any non-trivial home network and can be managed with SSH and a web browser.

tosh 3y ago

I'm not that familiar with the UI product lineup but recently found the Beryl AX https://www.gl-inet.com/products/gl-mt3000/ https://www.gl-inet.com/products/gl-mt3000/ which comes with a 2.5 Gbit ethernet port (the UniFI Express caps out at 1 Gbit ports) and OpenWRT based firmware which looks like a decent price/value/form factor combo at ~USD 90. Anyone who has more experience with UI: is this a comparable product? Edit: it sounds like the UI products have a fleet management concept and are designed to work together (Apple-esque sum is greater, plug and play …)

InTheArena 3y ago

This thread is kinda bonkers. People complain about the USG3 not being able to route 1gb/s (IIRC, it's 10 years old, and always capped at 250mb/s), or the UDMP Pro at 10GB/s IDS/IDP (It can run at 2.5GB/s with IDP and IDS). Wireguard and policy based routing (which is why most people were sticking away from their routers) are in place, and far simpler to maintain then alternating options from PFSense and Cisco. The magic VPN stuff really feels like Apple when it just works. Their WAPs are a bit pricey on for 6E support, but otherwise are generally considered the best prosumer WAPs available, and competitive (and cheaper) then most enterprise options. They are overkill if you don't need management, but in a IoT world, you need VLAN management. The VOP and security cameras and phones are solid. Best of all this run cloudless. You buy the hardware, the software is free and runs locally. Even their enterprise software is being ported to run on device (and free for prosumer use cases) This is part of three new devices that are strongly targeting the old Apple base station market. The third - UDR ultra - is coming out soon (it was leaked in the same art dump that this and the other device was leaked) and has 2.5GB/s WAN and LAN. IF you want to run their VOIP / camera / door system, there is the UDM Pro and UDM Pro SE. I have the base level UDM Pro with a 2.5 GB/s primary and a 1GB fiber secondary. Works great, auto-failover, firewall management, VPN, RADIUS, etc. In general, if you want WIFI and network that just works, but still does policy based routing, VLAN management, can dump to Prometheus (with unifipoller), run VOIP and security cameras (even with Homekit secure support, thanks to Scrypted), this is the solution for you. I run my in-laws and my parents network stack remotely with UDRs. I highly recommend them. If you want to run your own hardware, or have even more power, buy your own and run OPNsense, or go upmarket. For everyone else, this stack rocks.

wredue 3y ago
And also, $192 is not at all a bad price tag. It’s actually a bit surprising as UI stuff is classically viewed as a bit overpriced. That said, I have a UniFi router and 3 wifi 6 APs and my network is super solid. Way better than any prosumer targeted router (note that I previously ran 3 netgear nighthawk). The UniFi stack was actually cheaper and is unquestionably more reliable. If you’re looking at those very high end prosumer routers, I’d very much advise taking a step back and looking at alternatives.

forward1 3y ago

Always been intrigued by UniFi stuff, is it still the case you need an app to set up and configure their devices? I don't have an app store, and they don't publish their app elsewhere, so this was always a non-starter for me, and a weird design choice at that.

wredue 3y ago
You can deploy instances of their config software at will. There are docker containers out there for you. This device runs UniFi Network so it can host the configuration. There is the cloudkey that can host the config There are routers that host the config in their product line. I don’t think it’s ever been the case that you “need” the app.
- forward1 3y ago
  Step 9 is install an app from an app store https://dl.ui.com/qig/u6+/#A https://dl.ui.com/qig/u6+/#A There is no other instruction for people without an app store. Not even in their help article. https://help.ui.com/hc/en-us/articles/12594679474071-Standalone-Access-Points-without-UniFi- https://help.ui.com/hc/en-us/articles/12594679474071-Standal... > Log in to the UniFi Mobile App (iOS / Android). Why do I need to log in to an app to set up a LAN device? It's complete nonsense and makes me ultimately distrust Unifi.

NelsonMinar 3y ago

It's funny the screenshots include their traffic accounting graphs. The data in those are complete garbage and have been for years. I run the installable controller on an Ubuntu server. It shows me last month my Playstation downloaded 66.7GB, or 6GB, or 1.66GB. Two of those on the same screen! (The real number may be close to 66.7GB.)

ecoffey 3y ago

Trying to see from specs and such if the mesh supports ethernet backhaul vs wifi radio like the google wifi does.