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Carrefour puts ‘shrinkflation’ price warnings on food to shame brands
- xenator 3y agoIn France near every price also small LCD display that show price for kilogram or liter. Which also help to fight with companies that like to create idiotic packages.
- Iulioh 3y agoI think that's European law
- notpushkin 3y agoYeah, I think it's the law in many countries now.
- satysin 3y agoYes and it is always worth paying attention to as often items on some kind of offer and so advertised within the store may not be the best value possible for the item. Toilet rolls are a great example. Sometimes you see the 24 pack "on sale" or "buy one get one half price" yet the cost per roll (unit) is higher than if you were to buy a 16 pack. Yes you would have less overall toilet rolls and that may be an issue for you but you are paying less per toilet roll. Laundry detergent is another common one. Look at the price per litre of the item "on sale" and compare it to the not on sale sizes/packs as well. People generally/instinctively expect/feel that if you buy the bigger pack you get a better deal and the companies certainly make you feel that is true but you have to pay attention as more often than not the best deal isn't the deal they're promoting.
- developer93 3y agoI knew someone who worked for Saintsbury's (UK supermarket) & they said 4 wins before xmas runs of roses chocolates went on the shelves at £10 each, and they expected to sell none until 2 weeks before xmas when they cut the price to £5 and advertised 50% off. Apparently this is (or was at the time?) normal industry behaviour.
- satysin 3y agoOh yes price increases before planned "sales" are common. I believe there are laws in the UK/EU regarding time frames an item has to be at a certain price before you can say it is "on sale". Something like 28 days sounds familiar so doubling the price of an item that doesn't sell much and having limited (or none?) of the item in stock then dropping it to usual price and calling "half price" no doubt happens constantly with seasonal items like Cadbury Roses.
- developer93 3y agoYou see this in UK and Germany too, I thought it's a European requirement.
- notorandit 3y agoYes, thanks. But why they keep selling them? Cannot they "simply"(tm) take them out of the shelves? Commerical agreements around the corner or fake image of trusty shop?
- sacnoradhq 3y agoHilarious. Consumer Reports used to track this as well by putting the previous and current products side-by-side.
- Xorakios 3y agoSplitting into two parts so I can get yelled at separately: 1) At least in the US, most large companies converted to FIFO (first-in, first-out) accounting so, if today's input prices are up 10%, but a company raises by 5%, their profits skyrocket for a awhile, and then trend down when inventories and long term/sunk costs like leases, amortization of R&D, and labor contracts catch up.
- Xorakios 3y agoSplitting into two parts so I can get yelled at separately: 2) Money supply is only part of the monetary influence on pricing pressure. velocity also matters - when people are saving stimulus funds, effective monetary stimulus is less than when people are scared and spending to protect against future price hikes
- flutas 3y agoI wish more retailers would start doing this.
- dclowd9901 3y ago> Guigoz infant formula produced by Nestlé went from 900 grams (31.75 oz) to 830 grams, while Unilever’s Viennetta ice-cream cake shrank to 320 grams from 350 grams. Wish I could be surprised at Nestle doing the most evil thing possible, but here we are.
- IMRC21 3y agoEvery brand is doing this
- dclowd9901 3y agoIs every brand a baby formula brand?
- weswilson 3y agoOn Reddit, someone said that even Carrefour is doing this with their own labeled products. Seems like just a negotiation tactic against their suppliers versus doing something pro-consumer.
- rand0m4r 3y agoCan confirm they're doing this (in Spain at least).
- Loughla 3y agoIf the consumer benefits, does the intent matter?
- dclowd9901 3y agoIf it quacks like a duck
- gmerc 3y agoMeanwhile the tale that we need interest rate hikes to soften consumer spending rather than enforcement by market authority continues to be peddled
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- swader999 3y agoI wonder if they account for wood pulp, non meat and meat fillers too.
- shmushmu92 3y ago[flagged]
- thefurdrake 3y agoI think we should place a QR on every product label, and scanning that QR takes me to data about the product such as its historical mass/volume, cost, and unit price, as well as its brand owner right on up the chain. I see you, Nestle. Of course, giving customers information to make an informed decision is Bad For Business.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- robertlagrant 3y agoMostly bad for business because of the massive data and engineering effort required.
- thefurdrake 3y agoIf businesses weren't so intent on lying to customers, I'd feel some empathy for them. But I don't. Liars deserve to suffer.
- scarmig 3y agoA job guarantee for software engineers.
- thefurdrake 3y agoReally terrible ones, if they think that using data already tracked by the store's internal systems (you know, the database attached to the POS, the one that stores all the pricing data and names, the one you could conceivably track changes in, that database, the one with the pre-labeled data available for one to parse) is something that would genuinely adversely affect business on engineering cost and complexity.
- robertlagrant 3y agoIt might be worth thinking for a second about this. You have to link subjectively, not objectively. How do you know a smaller product at the same price should be linked, or not? You don't. Someone has to do that, and over time (should the 4th iteration still be linked through from the 1st, or only from the 3rd, because they're sufficiently different?)
- charles_f 3y agoThis is great, shrinkflation is one of these disgusting practices that play on the human psyche to trick people. But also carrefour (and large retailers like them) are notorious for abusing their power when buying, and are a large part of the systemic problem. I don't know how much this is negotiating technique.
- krisoft 3y ago> I don't know how much this is negotiating technique. 100%. What else would it be?
- monooso 3y agoIt could be a marketing tactic.
- CptKriechstrom 3y agoideally serves as both
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- fatfingerd 3y agoReputation. When you see a different size for the first time at big chains they sometimes are not a change to the manufacturers normal lines. (If you have much faster turn over than other places your customer's shop that could also reinforce the perception that you are complicit.)
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- waihtis 3y agoDoes it matter if the customer benefits?
- BugsJustFindMe 3y agoIt seems somewhat out of linguistic character for them to use the English-"shrink"-based portmanteau, but hopefully there's a universal commonality (especially coupled with the hashtag format) that makes this move more effective.
- jjgreen 3y agoNot at all, contemporary French is stuffed with Englishisms, the regular -er verb liker (to like on Facebook) being one of my favourites.
- inductive_magic 3y agoIs "Englishism" slang? The term I know is "anglicism"
- jjgreen 3y agoSlangy (like liker), I prefer it since it's obvious what it means and it does not get confused with the Anglican Church.
- inductive_magic 3y agoIt means something different than you're insinuating: https://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/englishism https://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/english...
- jjgreen 3y agoIt also means something different [1], English is a huge unmanaged language, for a word with a possible interpretation, there will be a reference to that meaning in a dictionary somewhere. [1] https://www.encyclopedia.com/humanities/encyclopedias-almanacs-transcripts-and-maps/englishism https://www.encyclopedia.com/humanities/encyclopedias-almana...
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- coldtea 3y agoWe need laws to require special labelling with the price per net pound or price per net kiloggram clearly shown, and the previous price. Something like: $2.99/Kg (since 18/09/2023) $2.79/Kg (previous price)
- nicolas_t 3y agoIn France, at least the law requires showing the current price per kilogram. So what Carrefour is doing is highlighting that this has changed compared to the previous price.
- morsch 3y agoThis has been harmonized across the EU for, I think, 25 years. https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/HTML/?uri=CELEX:31998L0006 https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/HTML/?uri=CEL...
- vhcr 3y agoOr a graph of the price per unit over the last 1-3 years. They would probably change the SKU so the comparison is harder.
- coldtea 3y agoThat would manifest as a "price per unit" starting only recently, so immediately appear sus if you were buying the same product for a while. Forcing an SKU change to have to translate to a "clearly labeled name change as well" would also help.
- AlexandrB 3y agoOntario (and maybe all of Canada?) has the former. Adding the previous price would be nice, but I wonder if it can be games by changing prices frequently.
- notpublic 3y agoIn US as well..
- f6v 3y agoYeah but what’s the alternative? Things are expensive, you’ve got to eat. I have to purchase things even if it’s affected by shrinkflation.
- anononaut 3y agoThere are lots of alternatives to PepsiCo, Unilever, and Nestle.
- EduardoBautista 3y agoWell, you just mentioned the companies that own about 90% of what is in Walmart. So, I wouldn't say, "lots".
- some_random 3y agoThe good news is that the remaining 10% is pretty well distributed across the things you actually need. If you're completely addicted to Pepsi co brand empty calories you're out of luck but if you're willing to eat actual food there are still plenty of options.
- gambiting 3y agoWalmart doesn't even exist in France, so I'm not sure how that's relevant.
- EduardoBautista 3y agoYou can replace "Walmart" with most large supermarket brands in the western world. Nestlé and Unilever are both European companies and have an even stronger presence in France than in the USA.
- anononaut 3y agoMy point is stop eating highly processed garbage and start eating whole foods from local sources.
- indigo0086 3y agoEveryone but companies can suffer from the effects of inflation, got it.
- tomrod 3y agoBasic economics. Consumers pay for products. No matter where you increase costs or taxes, consumers pay the difference.
- jsbg 3y agoBasic economics say that given a certain price, you get a certain demand. And if the price rises, then demand goes down. Consumers don't blindly pay more for things when their prices go up.
- tomrod 3y agoUnrelated point, but true. In basic microeconomics, taxes, market power, and other market distortions create deadweight loss. Again, the higher price is borne by the consumer, regardless where in the supply chain/production process it is injected. Higher costs can flow through without deadweight loss, but again this is all in the static scenario.
- indigo0086 3y agoBusinesses fail as profits decrease, one cause of which could be higher cost of inputs. It may lead to those businesses cutting costs elsewhere, or passing it onto the consumer. To shame companies as they find ways to maintain profits when they're the first to be affected by increased cost to inputs is economically illiterate and leads to misguided focus on what the cause of inflation affecting all levels before a consumer gets their smaller chips or soda.
- _ea1k 3y agoI'm still shocked at how quickly and easily most of the industry shifted away from half gallon ice cream containers.
- aimor 3y agoWith Milk so expensive I expect the smaller "gallon" will come out soon. It's already happening to half-gallons, some are at 59 oz now but that's not widespread yet. Alternatives (oat, almond, etc) I think simply started at 54 oz. and never offered full half gallons. Here's the ice cream comparison if anyone's interested: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kr-oq79iur4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kr-oq79iur4
- _ea1k 3y agoIt is funny that it came from a store that sells "bulk" items. What used to be the standard is now oversized. :facepalm
- transcriptase 3y agoIt’s incredible to me that MBAs are still able to pitch “what if we made the product deceptively smaller but charged the same price?”, and don’t get thrown out a window. As if that’s a novel sustainable long-term strategy in CPG.
- Cerium 3y agoDon't worry, in a few months they will make a package that says "Now with 20% more".
- speedgoose 3y agoThe barely legal "20% free" packages. https://www.cdiscount.com/au-quotidien/alimentaire/nestle-crunch-cereales-625g-20-gratuit-x1/f-127010504-nes324623.html https://www.cdiscount.com/au-quotidien/alimentaire/nestle-cr...
- TeaDude 3y agoYou've just given me a wonderful flashback to Adam and Joe. (Hopefully not region locked by Channel 4!) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JWtQW8vAslc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JWtQW8vAslc
- BlueTemplar 3y agoLook what you did, the hn hug of death, and now they are sold out ! :(
- passwordoops 3y agoAnd bump up the prices 15%
- wredue 3y agoIn Canada, they call it a “Party Size” or a “Family Size” box.
- Foobar8568 3y ago
- badcppdev 3y agoThis is such a good idea. I know that everyone in the Western World is told that they eat too much but people need to be able to buy food and eat it. And if the same packaging this week has 90% of what it had last week then then consumers are going to suffer. In the UK many people rely on Food banks and parents skip meals to feed their children. Cutting the amount of food in a package in a manner that is not even visible without carefully examination is a morally dubious practice. Corporate profits are high. This is one of the reasons why.
- BlueTemplar 3y agoWell, you can (and should!) check the (mandatory) price/mass or price/volume, but of course there are very smart people being paid a lot to design the packaging so that it's sufficiently compelling for you to still put a higher value on the product...
- hedora 3y agoExpecting people to memorize the per-unit price of everything they buy and compare week to week is unrealistic. Also, at least in the US, the price/weight for the same type of item is often in different units. ($/oz for brand A; $/lb for brand B, etc)
- flir 3y agoSame in the UK, except 10g/100g/1000g so it's a bit easier to work out. Still an antipattern though.
- Symbiote 3y agoThe EU does have some rules about this [1], "The unit price shall refer to a quantity declared in accordance with national and Community provisions", but I've still seen similar products priced per 100g and a different brand priced per "item". [1] https://commission.europa.eu/law/law-topic/consumer-protection-law/unfair-commercial-practices-law/price-indication-directive_en https://commission.europa.eu/law/law-topic/consumer-protecti...
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- throwaway9951zx 3y ago> Guigoz infant formula produced by Nestlé went from 900 grams (31.75 oz) to 830 grams, while Unilever’s Viennetta ice-cream cake shrank to 320 grams from 350 grams. I've always thought "from -> to" so I'm curious when people use "to <- from". Is it more common in the UK? Is there a name for this?
- foundart 3y agoOne reason for doing this is to add variety to the sentence structure rather than just repeating the same from- to construction for both items. Whether that’s a good choice in this case is a different matter.
- tom_ 3y agoFrom... to is usual in the UK, and to...from is common for Americans. I don't think I've ever seen both used in the same sentence. (See also: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37250458 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37250458)
- hnarn 3y agoI don’t know what the correct term is in English but in my country, “comparative pricing” is mandatory, so when you’re buying coffee for example there’s a secondary price listed that tells you what the cost is per kilogram or whatever other unit makes sense. For me this already solves the problem, because what I really care about isn’t whether I get 500g or 400g of coffee, I care about the real price compared to the other options on the shelf.
- tyingq 3y agoYou do miss though, those situations where every supplier took advantage of inflation to stack extra margin on. Seeing that diff to the last price is helpful.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- Gigachad 3y agoHelpful in what way? The prices 6 months ago are no longer available so how does it help to see them?
- tyingq 3y agoCan't tell if you're serious. People on a budget want to know which line item increases are driving the overspend in the "grocery" category. So they can take some action to counteract it. Source that item elsewhere, consider store brands for that item, do without that item, etc.
- BlueTemplar 3y agoThis either means that they have a cartel (which is illegal), or they effectively had no choice for some reason or another. ("Inflation" is such a nebulous concept...)
- tyingq 3y agoThere's quite a few stories outlining how many companies are taking advantage of the "cover" of inflation to take on additional margin. Like, they see cost increases of 5% on their side, but raise prices 10%. It doesn't require a cartel for every notable supplier in a market to have the same idea.
- charles_f 3y agoAn interesting tidbit of information is that a number of products (butter, flour, milk, sugar,...) used to be sold in standardized weights and volumes (1kg, 500g, etc.). It got repealed in the 80s under pressure from manufacturing AND commercial lobbys.
- mortenjorck 3y agoA brand of laundry detergent I use recently decreased the size of its 36oz bottle to 28oz. The kicker, however, is the approximate number of loads listed on the bottle changed from 27… to 28. The instructions on the back now recommend filling the cap to a lower bar for “medium” loads. I’ve been meaning to write to the manufacturer to ask if they’ve quietly changed their formulation to something more concentrated, though I have a pretty good idea of the canned response I'd receive.
- Ylpertnodi 3y agoWhy keep it a secret? Name and shame.
- mortenjorck 3y agoIt's Arm & Hammer, though I presume the branding is a more or less interchangeable packaging detail from the other detergent brands produced by CPG giant Church & Dwight.
- whymauri 3y agoAt this point it feels like most brands are ripping me off; I'd be more interested in finding out which ones aren't, lol. Edit: this is what Carrefour is doing to an extent, but we don't have them in the US.
- Symbiote 3y agoI doubt they've have done this quietly, as it gives the opportunity for some greenwashing. "More concentrated, so less CO₂ used in transport!"
- Dylan16807 3y agoIf it's true, and has no downside, then it's not greenwashing.
- secretsatan 3y agoI recently discovered detergents and powders regularly overstate how much is required for a wash, and it even leads to worse results, I'm normally sceptical (or just ignorant) of such articles but I halved how much I used and it seemed to be pretty much true for day to day washing (Don't know about massively dirty clothes, but talking weekly wash here) https://www.nytimes.com/wirecutter/blog/stop-using-so-much-laundry-detergent/ https://www.nytimes.com/wirecutter/blog/stop-using-so-much-l...
- gnicholas 3y agoI wonder if they do the same for house brands.
- h1fra 3y agoFor those wondering if it's truly representative, it's estimated that 50% of the inflation in Europe is due to margin increase not bc of the inflation itself. https://www.imf.org/en/Blogs/Articles/2023/06/26/europes-inflation-outlook-depends-on-how-corporate-profits-absorb-wage-gains https://www.imf.org/en/Blogs/Articles/2023/06/26/europes-inf...
- oneTbrain23 3y agoMostly due to supporting American stand of sanctioning Russia for Zelenskyy and partially sanctioning Chinese companies. In short, they did it to themselves. As for their citizens, I would say they are getting what they voted for (or didn't do any unalivement when some of those voted leaders betrayed their interest).
- hcks 3y agoInflation manifests itself as margin increases. There’s too little goods being produced for too much people having money. Therefore the people selling goods can raise prices. For some reason people assume that workers can’t be left worse off with inflation bc they assume wages have to increase to follow it. It doesn’t have to be the case. In Europe, workers are becoming poorer.
- NickM 3y agoSupply constraints typically lead to higher prices and higher margins. The fact that the margins have gone up does not somehow imply that the higher prices are something other than inflation.
- eddtests 3y agoWhy does it cause such higher margins?
- psychoslave 3y agoBecause the middle man typically see there an opportunity to extort more money?
- programmertote 3y agoThe worse combo is shrinkflation with significantly increased price. I used to buy Arm and Hammer detergent (250 FL OZ) from Costco for ~$11 about a year ago. Last week, I went to Costco and saw that they have reduced the size of the container (in a very subtle way so it is hard to notice) with 200 FL OZ and charges $14.89. That is like double rip-off. My salary did not increase 35% between this and last year. For Church & Dwight (Arm and Hammer brand manufacturer) to not only increase the price by at least 35% with shrinkflation, I wonder where the extra profit are going toward. When I just immigrated 20 years ago, I used to be in awe at the size of commodities and food portions in the US. Nowadays, things are shrinking noticeably and eventually, stuff bought in the US would look just the same in terms of size as what's available in Burma (Myanmar), which is my home country. That observation makes me feel like the US (and probably all of the affluent western nations) is approaching the end of the era of abundance, and life for the future generation would be tougher. Pretty sad/concerning to think about it.
- mikrl 3y agoI bought a jar of some new Nutella type spread and while the lid is round, the jar footprint is lozenge shaped. From the front it looks like a normal jar, from the side I actually started laughing at this skinny little thing with a giant overhanging lid.
- Dunedan 3y agoI had a similar experience recently. The jar looked the same, but as it turned out they simply used significantly thicker glass to hide the weight difference caused by the reduced content.
- mgkimsal 3y ago> For Church & Dwight (Arm and Hammer brand manufacturer) to not only increase the price by at least 35% with shrinkflation, I wonder where the extra profit are going toward. That assumes there's extra profits. They also have to pay for materials, labor, etc. which have also gone up recently. Perhaps they're making the same profit (amount or percent) they were 4 years ago at that size/price?
- efrecon 3y agoWhat is disgusting with shrinkflation is that it also has an environmental impact. In the end, the same volume/weight will require even more packaging.
- hedora 3y agoCereal boxes are my favorite example of this. Each year, material scientists at the box factory push the physics of cardboard just a little more so they can increase the aspect ratio of the top panel. One of my favorite health food cereal brands now offers their stuff in just the plastic bag at a bit of a discount. The environmentally friendly packaging lands on the bottom shelf with the less reputable brands, but whatever. (I’d prefer it just be in the cardboard with no plastic, but it is still a win).
- langsoul-com 3y agoChocolate bars are most notorious for this. Someone needs to do a 10 years ago comparison and there's a massive difference. These days, chocolate bars are all bite sized.
- TeaDude 3y ago"Fun-Size". Although, like many more famous people who've made this observation: Where's the "fun" in less chocolate?
- wredue 3y agoCandy bars is a bit of an “outside this issue”. Around the world, you’re seeing sugar taxes, pushes for healthier snacks, and general government action against things that are sugar to excess. Not saying they’re not greedflating like everything else. But they do have significantly different pressures.
- jsbg 3y agohttps://www.appliancecity.co.uk/news/updates/is-our-chocolate-getting-smaller/ https://www.appliancecity.co.uk/news/updates/is-our-chocolat...
- jjslocum3 3y agoThe rise of robust middle classes in Asia have also put a squeeze on the world's chocolate supply in the last decade or two. These days in the US, it's hard to even discern the cocoa in most "chocolate" bars.
- marcosdumay 3y agoI don't know how much of this is shrinkflation and how much is companies adjusting to modern preferences. Lots and lots of people prefer candy in small packages.
- matthewfelgate 3y agoIs there an app where you can scan a barcode and it will suggest cheaper alternatives?
- hedora 3y agoThe Amazon app apparently supports that. I’ve never tried to use that feature. I looked for the feature because you asked. I’d much rather have an AR app that scans a shelf, grays out anything that doesn’t meet my dietary preferences, and highlights the 3 cheapest options.
- bjourne 3y agoWe have the same problem in Sweden with retailers blaming supermarket chains and supermarket chains blaming retailers. In reality they are probably both screwing the consumers. Then they have the gall to say "if you don't like it shop in a different store" when the prices are going up in every store because of (easily obfuscated) price collusion between supermarket chains. Consumers doesn't read the papers in which the chains brag about their "record profits" to their shareholders and even when they do most are unable to connect the dots.
- powvans 3y agoInfuriating when I need 12oz of a product for a recipe and now I can only buy it in 9.5oz cans. Way to go. Now you sold two. More packaging, more waste, more profits!
- mjh2539 3y agoWe must bring back the Assize of Bread and Ale.
- 2devnull 3y agoGreat idea but there’s a slippery slope problem. Report on shrinkflation packaging and companies will switch to other less transparent means (ie changing ingredients) and so this adds a bit of perverse incentive. I suppose companies already do the cost cutting, adding filler, etc… I’m a fan of just mandating price per ounce labels on everything. Stores could show current price per ounce and last year’s, no calling out specific brands, just make that data available to consumers on each price tag.
- kergonath 3y ago> Great idea but there’s a slippery slope problem. Report on shrinkflation packaging and companies will switch to other less transparent means (ie changing ingredients) and so this adds a bit of perverse incentive. What makes you think that they are not changing ingredients as well, at the same time? It’s just another button they can tweak to increase margins. If we follow that kind of logic, then we never put in place any regulation because it would just push people towards worse behaviours. A bit like when people who don’t want taxes say that it would just lead to tax evasion. In reality, there is room for reasonable regulations. > I’m a fan of just mandating price per ounce labels on everything. There is already a law to that effect. > Stores could show current price per ounce and last year’s, no calling out specific brands, just make that data available to consumers on each price tag. That would be definitely interesting. At the moment they just have to put the old price during sales.
- 2devnull 3y agoYeah and it’s still not very useful for certain things. Like I was shopping for toilet paper the other day. The prices seemed outrageous but trying to compare price per square foot is meaningless when some paper is thick, some extra soft, some 1ply, etc. I like the price per weight unit, without packaging to compare not across products, but for the same product over time.
- IngvarLynn 3y agoIn my experience shrinkflated products already use inferior ingredients, so it's a very useful signal that should be boosted, not eliminated. So putting a warning is a good thing, but shaming is not. To develop the idea further, most grocery shopping should move online, so I could trivially filter out products with shrinkflated packaging, containing palm oil, nestle brands, etc.
- what-no-tests 3y agoWow if only the State could mandate how much something should cost, and then perhaps the Politburo could meet once every five years to discuss how much of everything should be manufactured, we could regulate our way out of this mess. /s
- hedora 3y agoYou are describing the Chicago Board of Trade. They set depressed prices for farm goods so the middlemen can take a bigger markup without causing civil unrest. This is one reason the farm subsidy still exists.
- asow92 3y agoAnecdotally, I've started to see this with furniture sold at places like Homegoods in the last couple of years. The furniture is smaller but the price is about the same.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- jollyllama 3y agoAmericans will basically put up with a lot, both as workers and as consumers. The French, not so much.
- claviola 3y agoThis has been going on in Brazil for so long that for two years now companies must, by law, disclose any reduction in weight. Examples: https://i0.wp.com/sfnoticias.com.br/wp-content/uploads/2022/06/reduflacao-.jpg https://i0.wp.com/sfnoticias.com.br/wp-content/uploads/2022/...
- WirelessGigabit 3y agoIs Brazil also the country where you must disclose when you change something in the recipe of the product?
- solatic 3y agoBuy items priced by bulk weight to begin with. Meat, vegetables, nuts, also items in standard packaging sizes like milk per liter or gallon. All this processed junk (with its non-standard package sizing) is bad for you anyway. If someone will start packaging toothpaste in bulk liter sizes, I'll switch to that, and find some kind of more permanent dispenser to fill that looks better in my bathroom anyway.
- hedora 3y agoIt amazing to me how much premium “health” food has all the fiber removed and is then loaded with salt and sugar. Those are the main health issues with cheap processed food. At the same time, finding food that is high fiber, low salt and unsweetened is nearly impossible. Such food is literally made of precursor ingredients and subsets of the stuff added to the unhealthy stuff. I switched to eating more of the latter, and feel much better in multiple dimensions. Also, most of what I eat now tastes better and is more filling. My weight is slowly going down too. My current litmus test is that the fiber % daily value should be more than the carbohydrates %DV and the salt %DV should be less than it. I try to buy stuff with zero salt added (I have a nice collection of salty condiments at home already), and no sugar added (though that metric is already being gamed by manufacturers). Simply avoiding all processed foods would achieve a similar effect, but that eliminates staple foods that are often loaded with salt, sugar or worse (e.g. yogurt, bread, peanut butter) and making them all from scratch is too time consuming.
- solatic 3y ago> finding food that is high fiber, low salt and unsweetened is nearly impossible I mean, this is pretty much anything in the fresh produce section. Chop it up and eat as a salad, made palatable with a sprinkle of salt (nowhere near as much as what is added to processed food) and a simple homemade vinaigrette (olive oil + vinegar). > yogurt, bread, peanut butter You should be able to find relatively healthy versions of each in a store; perhaps you'll need a trip to a health-focused store or Whole Foods, but it should definitely be possible to find plain-nothing-added yogurt, simple sourdough whole wheat bread, and plain-nothing-added peanut butter.
- WalterBright 3y agoMy dad told me when he was a boy there was a chocolate bar called the "Nickle Bar" that sold for, you guessed it, a nickel. As inflation/deflation changed prices, the Nickle Bar remained costing a nickel, but the size of the bar changed.
- readyplayernull 3y agoLay's bags (a PepsiCo brand) are always half-empty doubling plastic waste. There should be laws to tax emptyness in packaging. Half-empty = 50% tax.
- nebula8804 3y agoThere needs to be some room for the nitrogen gas although I agree that they are probably putting in more gas than is needed: https://www.tasteofhome.com/article/the-surprising-reason-why-your-potato-chip-bag-is-half-empty/ https://www.tasteofhome.com/article/the-surprising-reason-wh...
- hackererror404 3y agoThey should also do the reverse to give praise to companies who do the opposite.
- ncruces 3y agoA few years ago local mobile operators decided to create (and heavily market) prepaid plans that charged you a per week flat fee (if you had balance on your account). Turns out that (for most people) prepaid 3.50€/week mentally equates to 14€/month postpaid, whereas in reality it's closer to 15.20€/month (or an additional 8.7%, plus credit risk).
- m000 3y agoIt was about time. For the past few years, manufacturers just make absurd raises and let the supermarkets get all the flak from the angry consumers. I had heard about that anecodtally about a local supermarket chain and I was frankly surprised at the time. As most consumers, I also thought that the supermarkets were the ones profiteering. A giant like Carrefour having to call out the manufacturers just shows how much this practice has been used and abused.
- _Nat_ 3y ago> For example, Carrefour said a bottle of sugar-free peach-flavoured Lipton iced tea, produced by PepsiCo, shrank to 1.25 litres (0.33 gallon) from 1.5 litres, resulting in a 40% effective increase in the price a litre. That's only a 20% -- rather than 40% -- effective increase in the price-per-volume, right? [Calculation on WolframAlpha](https://www.wolframalpha.com/input?i=%28+%281%2F1.25%29+-+%281%2F1.5%29%29+%2F+%281%2F1.5%29+in+percent https://www.wolframalpha.com/input?i=%28+%281%2F1.25%29+-+%2... Trying to figure out what went on there. For example, maybe they meant that the price-per-volume did go up 40%, and they meant that the reduced-size contributed to (rather than "resulted in") that 40% increase? Or, maybe ChatGPT did the math?
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- hangonhn 3y agoI really love it when stores put the per unit price on their labels (at least they do in California), i.e. $2 per ounce. It would be neat if they can also add a historical graph of those prices to the label.
- McDyver 3y agoIn Europe price labels have to have the price per kg or per unit (eg box of dishwasher tablets), so that you can easily compare. https://commission.europa.eu/law/law-topic/consumer-protection-law/unfair-commercial-practices-law/price-indication-directive_en https://commission.europa.eu/law/law-topic/consumer-protecti...
- everybodyknows 3y ago> Consumer groups say shrinkflation is a widespread practice, which supermarkets like Carrefour are also guilty of in their own-label products. No reason to doubt this, given: > “Obviously, the aim in stigmatising these products is to be able to tell manufacturers to rethink their pricing policy,” Stefen Bompais, the director of client communications at Carrefour, said in an interview. Long story short, Carrefour doesn't actually give a shit about the deception of customers, except to the extent that their natural rage can be redirected against its suppliers in order to soften negotiating positions. Shrinking their margins either helps maintain total sales revenue, or shifts a larger share of the operating margin to Carrefour. Carrefour cares about volume pricing, not the size of the packages.
- balls187 3y agoThere is something offputting about paying more for the same. Paying more for less...yeesh. Insert some clever parallel between RTO mandates and shrinkflation.
- carapace 3y agoI still remember when 12oz cans became 11.5oz cans.
- PopAlongKid 3y agoAnother form of shrinkflation is related to sales tax. Something I never used to see, across dozens of U.S. states, is sales tax being added separately to the posted price of beeer. But now, when I pay $8 for a 16-oz. drink, they often add the sales tax to that instead of including it in the price as they used to. I guess few enough people pay cash any more that making change with coins doesn't slow down the process too much.
- iamnotsure 3y ago[flagged]
- guyzyl 3y agoIn Israel there’s actually a law to protect consumers from such cases. It requires food manufacturers to add a notice on the package if they decreased the amount of content inside without making major changes to the look of the packaging.
- stuaxo 3y agoWas just in France, and was already wishing Carrefour would open in the UK.
- nickserv 3y agoThere's Carrefour in many countries, but this campaign is only in France.
- Thev00d00 3y agoI wish UK supermarkets would do the same, but they are too cosy with the suppliers and the kickbacks
- pipo234 3y agoIt would be in customers interest for organize products by category, but large AAA brands (Unilever, PepsiCo, Proctor Gamble) often bully shops into brand-designated floor space. Large supermarkets (Carefour, Intermarche, Ahold Delhaize) bully back by designing their house brand products to look exactly like AAA brands. In France this had led to cat and mouse game changes to colour scheme and shape rebranding. Shrinkflation stickers are yet another (pretty brilliant) move in the chess game. AAA brands spend fortunes in commercials to guide customers to their product in the supermarket only to have them change their mind last moment in favour of the lower priced freeloader copy-cat.
- BrandoElFollito 3y agoIt's not only Carrefour, the idea was started by Intermarché - another large supermarket brand in France
- mensetmanusman 3y agoShrinkflation in regards to sugar drinks is oddly in the best interests of the state due to the incredible obesity crisis.
- Retric 3y agoOnly if smaller sizes actually reduced people’s weight which seems unlikely.
- jeffbee 3y agoAre you suggesting that people will simply buy more units, at a higher total price? That would be a novel result in economic history. Local taxes on soda in American cities have demonstrably lowered sales of those drinks, in those jurisdictions. Buyers are sensitive to price. In fact, demand for sugary drinks is highly elastic. A tax of just 1¢/oz in Oakland caused a 27% decline in sales, without countervailing increases of sales in neighboring markets without the tax. https://journals.plos.org/plosmedicine/article?id=10.1371/journal.pmed.1004212 https://journals.plos.org/plosmedicine/article?id=10.1371/jo...
- bluedays 3y agoLmao it’s Oakland. In many cases you can just walk a block to the next city. That doesn’t actually prove anything.
- thefurdrake 3y ago> Lmao it’s Oakland. In many cases you can just walk a block to the next city. That doesn’t actually prove anything. From the PLOS article: "There were no detectable changes in purchases of untaxed beverages or sweet snacks or purchases in border areas surrounding cities." From the post you replied to: "without countervailing increases of sales in neighboring markets without the tax." Why do you even bother replying?
- 3y ago
- a-dub 3y agoit's funny, i was thinking about this last year. "is there a technology solution that would arm shoppers with better knowledge so that the market may reward participants based on their good behavior with respect to inflation?" i was thinking things like leaderboards, smartphone apps and big databases. "let the retailer slap a sticker on it to build customer loyalty" is the simple and elegant solution i missed.
- vitaliyf 3y agoI wondered why this article doesn't have a very obvious thing for the topic it's trying to cover - a photo of mentioned stickers. Perhaps because it's a rewrite of another article originally for European audience - for example https://www.theguardian.com/business/2023/sep/14/carrefour-puts-shrinkflation-price-warnings-on-food-to-shame-brands https://www.theguardian.com/business/2023/sep/14/carrefour-p... CNN removed the French photo and also introduced a mistake - when they converted "1.5 litres" for US audience they wrote "0.3 gallons" instead of "0.4"
- lucidguppy 3y agoThis is causing more package waste.
- dundarious 3y agoI presume you mean the shrinkflation is causing the package waste, not the supermarket signage of said shrinkinflation?
- jxramos 3y agoWhich is interesting to think about the margins eaten up by packaging vs the product itself. Packaging must be a very small fraction the cost of the product I’m guessing.
- diligiant 3y agoCarrefour is the worst -> "supermarkets like Carrefour are also guilty of in their private label products."
- dkjaudyeqooe 3y agoMy pet peeve is that price per round measurement unit (eg kilogram) is in tiny writing compared to product cost, even though they are arguably equally important. Given that the former is mandated, they should also mandate that they appear in equal size fonts on price labels.
- gnicholas 3y agoYeah Safeway typically shows price per unit, but Trader Joe’s (which is often thought of as a ‘friendly’ grocery) never does. I wish they did!
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- tacker2000 3y agoIn the EU its mandatory everywhere.
- f1shy 3y agoBut often not respected. Heck sometimes the price is just not there… any price!
- Terretta 3y agoSurely coincidence rather than collusion (ahem*), manufacturers sharing the same competitive shelf space mysteriously all prefer different units. * see tacit collusion: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tacit_collusion https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tacit_collusion
- milesvp 3y agothank you for this term. I’ve been struggling lately with this topic because collusion has some fairly well defined regulatory meaning, and I’ve had to quote the term collusion to avoid some argumentative pushback. I think the rise of computation and networking has allowed for collusion at levels that were impossible 30 years ago. The biggest example of algorithmic collusion brought to my attention in the last few years is a SaaS that many landlord use that all but tells them to raise rents to bring them up to “market rates”. And I’m sure this kind of thing is becoming super prevalent in all kinds of places.
- sneak 3y agoThese stickers would make me angry at the market itself. If they are bad products, why are you trying to sell them to me? Carry something from a brand that doesn't employ dark patterns to deceive me. It's literally the job of the market to editorialize and choose the best options for the limited shelf space.
- leduyquang753 3y agoThose brands are too popular that if you take them off the shelf, you are driving customers away from your store too.
- pipo234 3y agoAlso, French supermarkets have a long history of bullying AAA labels, nudging customers to buy their "home label" copy cat alternatives instead.
- alephnerd 3y agoThat's all supermarkets. That's kind of the whole point, as margins are better and allows you to negotiate better rates from labelled brands. This is a big reason why Costco is able to outperform it peers.
- kjkjadksj 3y agoThe secret sauce of costco is the insatiable demand and seemingly exponentially large customer base. You could realistically be waiting 10 mins for gas because people want the ~10% discount so bad. The lines inside to checkout are also huge, another 10-15 min process. Cafeteria lines are just as long. You can hardly find parking in the lot itself because its packed to the brim. Usually its easier to park in a neighboring business. The only other business I’ve seen with such a constant flow of customers is In n out. Sure its good to have healthy margin but when you are getting 10x the number of daily transactions as your nearest comparable business in the area, you are playing a different game from them entirely.
- 3y ago
- satvikpendem 3y agoIf you as a shopper can track the unit price of what you want to buy, does shrinkflation really matter? For example, if I want to buy a liter of soda, I'll buy a liter's worth regardless of whether the packaging is now smaller.
- cyanydeez 3y agoRules and regulations should make it easier and always blaming the user is how you get into this type of mess.
- Longhanks 3y agoNo, the client being to lazy to make uninformed decisions him- or herself is the mess here. Most countries require a price per liter/per kilo anyway, so you always can compare. And if you can’t, more regulation won’t make that happen, either, see the failed "Nutri Score".
- grogenaut 3y agoSee the greatly successful nutrition info block on everything in the US.
- vkou 3y agoIn this country, equivalent products on the shelf alternate between listing a price per oz, and a price per lb, to make it more difficult to compare the two. Its also in tiny 8 point font.
- blibble 3y agono-one commits the price for litre/kg to memory
- satvikpendem 3y agoIf you shop often enough, you do start to remember it. I buy a lot of groceries every week and would absolutely notice if things got smaller or the unit price got larger.
- nantersand 3y agoWhen ppl noticed they raise prices, they swapped to shrinkflation. When ppl notice inflation, they swap to enshitification. When ppl notice enshitification, they will create new brands at higher price points. And so the cycle continues.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- phendrenad2 3y agoWhy does shrinkflation exist? Are people really fooled by smaller sodas? I think that anyone who believes that doesn't actually drink soda. Anyway, that leads me to believe that there must be some other factor, like maybe some law or contract prevents them from raising prices. Or maybe supermarket shelf space cost is tied to price somehow. Makes you think.
- ericmay 3y agoI’m not sure about pop, but I think you could see this play out easily with a bag of chips. The bag size stays the same, yet there is less in it.
- johnchristopher 3y agoAnother one: width and height of cereal boxes stay the same but it's less deep than it used to.
- Shaanie 3y agoCustomers are absolutely fooled by smaller sizes. I've almost fallen for it myself when a coffee package was reduced from 500g to 450. Thankfully I noticed the price per kg was off, but without it I wouldn't have noticed.
- mistercheph 3y agoThis is often done by products using alternative packaging schemes that are meant to evoke personality or authenticity of the food. There are many ‘organic’ brands that sell milk in nonstandard packaging that appears to be a gallon or half gallon but is 10-20% smaller.
- pkaye 3y agoOf course the supermarket also does shrinkflation but I bet they never put the stickers there. > Consumer groups say “shrinkflation” is a widespread practice, which supermarkets like Carrefour are also guilty of in their private label products.
- lm28469 3y agoMost supermarkets in France operate at low single digit net margin on most products. If something goes up 20% it's very rarely on them
- older 3y agoHow is number of digits in their margin of any relevance? They post record profits with these tiny margins: https://www.reuters.com/business/retail-consumer/carrefour-predicts-further-profit-growth-this-year-2023-02-14/ https://www.reuters.com/business/retail-consumer/carrefour-p...
- edouard-harris 3y agoWhile the trend they're highlighting is absolutely real, it looks like the math in their first example isn't quite right: > For example, Carrefour said a bottle of sugar-free peach-flavored Lipton Ice Tea, produced by PepsiCo, shrank to 1.25 liters (0.33 gallons) from 1.5 liters (0.3 gallons), resulting in a 40% effective increase in the price per liter. Assuming the price per unit stayed the same (which is the implication), this is a 20% effective increase, not 40%.
- huhtenberg 3y agoI peer-reviewed your nitpick and it is indeed a 20% increase.
- moritzwarhier 3y agoApperently you did not.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- huhtenberg 3y agoBased on the figures from GP's comment it's 20%.
- extasia 3y agoThey also made this mistake in the guardian article, I emailed them to correct it!
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- marsokod 3y agoI was able to find the details (source in French: https://photo.capital.fr/shrinkflation-voici-la-liste-des-produits-concernes-56672#lipton-fad50 https://photo.capital.fr/shrinkflation-voici-la-liste-des-pr...) In addition to the volume reduction, the price also went up from 1.45€ to 1.63€. So the price per litre went from 0.97€/L to 1.36€/L. Much closer to the 40% figure.
- zuminator 3y agoPeople here are complaining about Carrefour selling the products it's stickering. At least they're taking some steps. The supermarket in my neighborhood is much, much worse. They use dark patterns to further obscure the real price of things to the consumer. They are mandated to provide a per unit price, and they comply with the letter of the law. But what they'll do is use totally different units. The 48 ounce size of a product, going for $2.99, will be priced in ounces at 6.2 cents an ounce. But the 36 ounce size, which costs $2.10, will have a unit price of $1.87 a quart. So now you need a calculator (or at least, an aptitude for division in your head) to figure out which one is more economical. And maybe around 10% of the time, the unit price is just flat out wrong.
- nolist_policy 3y agoHappy metric system noises
- kirykl 3y agoNotice this with app food delivery as well. Smaller portions than in restaurant, for the same order on delivery, with higher charge due to app fees
- IronWolve 3y agoI noticed this at my favorite thai place also. Delivery orders are way smaller than when I picked it up on the way home. I have no idea how they knew the difference between pick up and delivery, but appears to be.
- beebeepka 3y agoThese apps are just scamming young people and the restaurants. Get a wife, love and treat her well, and she'll likely cook for you.
- vjerancrnjak 3y agoIs a man incapable to cook for himself?
- beebeepka 3y agoMaybe the person I replied to is a woman. I have a female coworker and she tells me her boyfriend is the playing the homemaker role. My wife almost never lets me cook or do the dishes. I could help worded my post differently but decided I would rather attract some downvotes and maybe have some fun with comments like yours. Edit: your profile is so much fun. Is that Serbian?
- vjerancrnjak 3y agoIt’s more on the Croatian side, but the languages are basically the same. Yes, but I guess the neutral spirit of your comment is just “Things are getting out of hand so maybe we should all just cook for ourselves”
- 3y ago
- JoshTko 3y agoLove this. I would switch to retailers that did this.
- smeej 3y agoI would have appreciated if the article would have included information about where the profits from these changes are going. Without that information, the other plausible narrative is more like, "Governments try to cover up the negative consequences to consumers of their massive inflation of the monetary supply by forcing companies to continue providing products at the same price (especially products like food staples that are included in consumer price indices)." In all likelihood, it's probably both the government officials and the execs/owners who are profiting off the situation at the expense of everybody who still needs to eat food.
- eastbound 3y agoThe article is incomplete, as usual for CNN. Headline makes a bold statement, there isn’t even a photo of a sticker showing the French translation for “shrinkflation”, which I’m not sure exists, and it does put the opinions in perspective of others.
- johnchristopher 3y agoMy gut feeling is that it's a reaction to or at least has something to do with Inflation : Bruno Le Maire menace de publier la "liste des industriels de l'agroalimentaire qui ont refusé faire baisser les prix" https://www.francetvinfo.fr/economie/inflation/inflation-bruno-le-maire-menace-de-publier-avant-la-fin-du-mois-de-juin-la-liste-des-industriels-de-l-agroalimentaire-qui-ont-ont-refuse-faire-baisser-les-prix_5870288.html https://www.francetvinfo.fr/economie/inflation/inflation-bru... Bruno Le Maire threatens once again to publish the names of industrialists who do not play the game https://www.archyde.com/bruno-le-maire-threatens-once-again-to-publish-the-names-of-industrialists-who-do-not-play-the-game/ https://www.archyde.com/bruno-le-maire-threatens-once-again-...
- costanzaDynasty 3y agoThis isn't a new thing, it's started to ramp up around 2008. PepsiCo will often change sizes and names of those sizes to create the illusion of value. Im sure other Mega Corps do the same. They do have to buy commodities many years in advance so a lot of these changes are baked in. They also have other things they do. If the price of say potatoes is going to be high for the next couple of years and they can't justify a price change or a bag size change, then they will move up corn products to eye level and move down the potatoes so that customers are drawn to the higher margin product.
- lostlogin 3y agoMeanwhile Carrefour profits rise even when accounting for inflation. ‘It’s them, not us!’. https://www.reuters.com/business/retail-consumer/carrefour-predicts-further-profit-growth-this-year-2023-02-14/ https://www.reuters.com/business/retail-consumer/carrefour-p...
- giomasce 3y agoThey should write something like "25% less fat in this package!".
- glimshe 3y ago"Same great taste, but LESS SUGAR AND FAT!"
- frereubu 3y ago"We always comply with the labelling laws and regulations requiring objective information about how much product is in the package, including a net weight statement, a serving size, and a servings-per-container statement. "Consumers can use this information to make accurate and informed purchasing decisions about the amount of product they are buying." Only if I can remember from one purchase to the next what the price per gram of a specific bar of Lindt chocolate is.
- nerbert 3y agoContrary to the US where you can commonly see 2 bottles of milk sitting next to one another with a price per oz and a price per gallon, in France there is a relatively good uniformity for prices per x. Unless you haven't had the experience yet, you'd know that it makes shopping and product comparison extremely easy, whatever the type of product you're buying.
- Noahhhhhishere 3y agoI honestly wish they did this in the UK. It makes it so hard to budget for a family of 5 when products suddenly reduce in size by 20%.
- GordonS 3y agoIME not only does the size reduce by 20%, but the price also increases by 10-75%....