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Microsoft is testing ads in the Windows 11 File Explorer

499 points by DemiGuru 5y ago

greyhair 5y ago
One more reason to pay slightly more for Windows 11 Pro (which I have). My guess is the pro version will never see this pollution.
WalterGR 5y ago
Wow. And the Audacity of Microsoft to use the warning icon next to the ad: https://mobile.twitter.com/flobo09/status/1502645866204704773/photo/1 https://mobile.twitter.com/flobo09/status/150264586620470477...
- akomtu 5y ago
  Plenty of room for improvement here. Soon Windows will read filenames and show ads based on them. Then it will read your pdf files and let advertisers bid on keywords in those files. Windows 13 will watch the cursor movements, analyze it and book doctor appointment behind your back (billable to your insurance).
- Forgeties79 5y ago
  Wow indeed. That’s incredibly slimy.
- laurent123456 5y ago
  Soon that's how Microsoft apps will look like - https://blog.malwarebytes.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/Ad8.png https://blog.malwarebytes.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/Ad8...
- winternett 5y ago
  The way Twitter displays post images in itself is also terrible UI... :(
  - rejectfinite 5y ago
    Try Nitter instead https://nitter.net/flobo09/status/1502645866204704773 https://nitter.net/flobo09/status/1502645866204704773 No need to login either. I have seen https://github.com/SimonBrazell/privacy-redirect https://github.com/SimonBrazell/privacy-redirect linked here so I use it.
    - rekoil 5y ago
      Hadn't seen this, thanks for the tip!
- khaledh 5y ago
  Funny that you used the word "audacity", which actually appears as a folder in the screenshot :)
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  - WalterGR 5y ago
    ;)
DemiGuru 5y ago
This has the potential to become a serious security risk. Picture the following - you're running File Explorer with admin creds, all while invoking a malvertisement.
- chaorace 5y ago
  FYI: these are in-ecosystem ads (so they all come from MS). The messaging is quite similar what they already do with notifications elsewhere in the system ("Edge is faster than Chrome"). It's still manipulative bullshit, but it's not the gaping security hole that it sounds like it 'ought to be. Even so... this type of behavior is what made me drop Windows over 5 years ago now.
  - Sohcahtoa82 5y ago
    > these are in-ecosystem ads (so they all come from MS). For now. I think it's incredibly naive to believe it would stay that way. Or maybe I'm just cynical. EDIT: Considering the fact that the Start menu displays ads for 3rd party software, nah, I think it's naive to assume the ads in Explorer would always come from MS.
    - notamy 5y ago
      Right? Imagine what happens when a program hijacks it to inject malvertising or smth similarly nefarious...
  - kemotep 5y ago
    In the past Microsoft has had issues with subdomain takeovers[0], resulting in spam being distributed by their own domains. Without strict guarantees and control over the way this content is delivered to end user systems, how can we know that a similar type of attack could not happen? This time in a potentially administrative level file explorer? [0]: https://www.zdnet.com/article/microsoft-has-a-subdomain-hijacking-problem/ https://www.zdnet.com/article/microsoft-has-a-subdomain-hija...
    - 5y ago
matt321 5y ago
I expect paid software not to have ads.
- implying 5y ago
  You should expect any software to not have ads.
- DemiGuru 5y ago
  Let alone your operating system.
- Ajedi32 5y ago
  Kinda ironic how, when it comes to operating systems, it's the Free ones that don't have ads. (Yeah, I know that's not entirely true. Still, I find it kinda hilarious that I might have to switch from a paid operating system to a free one in order to get away from ads.)
JCWasmx86 5y ago
Ads in paid software? This is simply ridiculous.
- PenguinCoder 5y ago
  Heard of cable TV? Or hell, Hulu even? Still a bunch of bullshit I refuse to use because of shit like this. But it has existed for a while.
barbazoo 5y ago
Do we know for sure that these ads actually link to/show 3rd party content? Don't get me wrong, I'd find this confusing and annoying but it does look like it's just a link to Microsoft content promoting more of their own products.
- DemiGuru 5y ago
  This might be an indication of the type of ads Microsoft already embeds in Windows 10's start menu: https://i.redd.it/bfc336ql88sz.png https://i.redd.it/bfc336ql88sz.png
  - barbazoo 5y ago
    I'd find that very annoying, indeed.
- aitchnyu 5y ago
  I've logged in to MS Teams and instead of the web app, I get a landing screen asking me if I want to install the desktop app. Powershell also contains a URL-shortener link to their documentation.
hdjjhhvvhga 5y ago
Give me one single reason to migrate.
partiallypro 5y ago
This is nonsensical, I am a pretty big Microsoft advocate, but there is no need in this. Whatever bonehead in Microsoft thought of this should be fired.
- jason0597 5y ago
  What does being a Microsoft Advocate entail exactly?
  - partiallypro 5y ago
    I really like Windows, Azure and O365 and believe they have no real competition, especially when paired together. I can install Ubuntu or other Linux distros on my Windows PC, connect to my Azure VM or container easily and O365 is just simply unmatched, as hard as others try. So I advocate Azure and O365 especially and am harshly critical of Apple/Google. Microsoft generally handles the cloud aspect very well but seems still a bit lost on the OS side. Which is a bit insane to me, especially when sales skyrocketed during COVID, and Windows 11 is generally pretty solid at this point.
    - faeriechangling 5y ago
      What I can’t help notice about o365 is that the web versions are less buggy and more stable and are catching up in feature completeness. Desktop outlook needs to be purged with fire. This makes me wonder for how long it will be necessary to use Windows to get the full o365 experience.
    - blibble 5y ago
      how exactly does Azure have no competition? I have to use Azure at work, and in my experience it's a worse version of AWS/GCP: - standard MS random indecipherable errors in the GUI (error 0x68482233: consult system administrator) - extremely slow UI performance in the GUI - extremely slow VM performance running their OS (even though it has 4 VCPUs, 32gb of RAM and a giant SSD) it's a standard MS product, one where they (badly) copy the features of their competitors, and it only sells because they bundle it with their other crappy products which your company is already locked into
kazinator 5y ago
Microsoft seem desperate to be in the ad business, but don't have any sites that anyone visits or any wortwhile search engine that effectively controls access to the Internet for the majority of the users. The only "Microsoft surface" left where they can stick advertising is the pixels they control via the OS. I may have a good way of capturing this sentiment: "We are Putin ads in File Explorer!"
phone8675309 5y ago
If you’re not paying for Windows then you’re not the customer, you’re the product. I can’t imagine Enterprise versions of Windows will have this enabled.
- JCWasmx86 5y ago
  You pay for Windows, the price is already in the hardware, if you purchase a PC with Windows
  - 0des 5y ago
    Is this like when you pay for Hulu but still see ads? Is there a word for this?
    - magicalhippo 5y ago
      I call it lose-lose.
    - bitwize 5y ago
      Two bites at the apple?
    - rabuse 5y ago
      Cable
- clhodapp 5y ago
  They might get it later but I'm pretty sure they will get it eventually, given that enterprise versions eventually got bloatware like candy crush. I think the classic truism that you are either the customer or the product is outmodded. Companies are normalizing double-dipping and making you a product even when you are paying them.
  - asimops 5y ago
    I haven't seen candy crush on any enterprise installation to date. Maybe you are mistaken?
humanwhosits 5y ago
I guess they know windows is on-the-way-out if they're trying to eek the last bit of cash from it like this
- WalterGR 5y ago
  What’s the trajectory of Windows’ demise?
  - aaaaaaaaaaab 5y ago
    Not steep enough.
    - immibis 5y ago
      Be careful what you wish for - it might come true. What will replace it? Android on PC?
      - aaaaaaaaaaab 5y ago
        Chrome, unfortunately.
- 51Cards 5y ago
  In what way is Windows "on the way out"? https://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/desktop/worldwide https://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/desktop/worldwide
  - tomjen3 5y ago
    Developers are going Mac and Linux, Schools are going Chromebooks and many adults are going phones. Companies, constantly being behind the curves are still stuck in MS land. You have linked to the desktop market. Yes there rules MS, but the desktop market is being destroyed by the phone market where MS doesn't even have an offer.
    - 5y ago
aaaaaaaaaaab 5y ago
In late capitalism it’s an agreed upon fact of life that poor people’s minds must be bombarded with ads 24/7. Look at the amount of billboards in a poor neighborhood vs a gated community for the elites. This is just a natural extension of this principle to operating systems. Poor people’s operating systems (i.e. Android, Windows) will be filled to the brim with scammy ads, because they have no power to look elsewhere.
- HideousKojima 5y ago
  I'm not sure how copywrited software (a government enforced monopoly on intellectual property) is an example of capitalism but maybe you'll enlighten me?
causi 5y ago
I miss the days when Windows didn't treat me with open contempt.
jmcphers 5y ago
I worked at Microsoft around the time of the Windows Vista disaster, and one of the big lessons that came out of that era was solve distractions, not discoverability. Windows and other Microsoft products tried to make features (and products) "discoverable" by pushing them on you with alerts and banners, but the result, when multiplied by dozens of product teams and PMs, was an overall user experience that was noisy and unpleasant. Looks like a new generation of engineers and designers is ready to learn this lesson the hard way again!
- tomjen3 5y ago
  I wished a lot more companies would learn that lesson. It is such a pain when you have to use some software and then you get the popups about new features. The features may be brilliant, but right now I don't care. I am doing something. Yet somehow PMs never realize that if they let the features be visible in the corner, I would click on them in 10 seconds when I am done with what I am doing and would actually want to read them.
  - antisthenes 5y ago
    Looking at you, Google Maps. No, I don't need an "easier way to do X, Y" or whatever else your obtuse program manager decided would get them a promotion. I'm operating a 2-ton vehicle in traffic, so THE EASIER WAY would be to not obscure 50% of my phone screen, making me take eyes away from the road for an extra 2-3 seconds. Hint for anyone reading this at google - it's in the name. Maps. That's all I want from your app, UNLESS I am specifically searching for Food/Hotels/Groceries. Also, please stop doing a UI redesign every year. No, I don't need a pop-up if you want to reroute me around an accident. If it's faster - just reroute me, if it's not - don't.
    - Fogest 5y ago
      I like all the things in Google Maps that you disagree with. Maybe you're just not the target audience and should switch to an app that works better for your needs? Google Maps does automatically choose the better route if it finds one, but it gives you time to cancel that action if you'd like before it switches.
politelemon 5y ago
MS with the file explorer ads, Apple with settings ads, Samsung with its TV ads. They've normalised ads in paid software.
- melvinram 5y ago
  > Apple with settings ads Say more?
  - yurishimo 5y ago
    I think they’re referring to the upsell of iCloud. If you’re not subscribed to even the $1 tier or wherever, there is a line under the iCloud menu item to upgrade. I don’t think it’s especially egregious but some might have a different opinion.
    - busymom0 5y ago
      It’s worse: https://i.imgur.com/64sP9yh.jpg https://i.imgur.com/64sP9yh.jpg
  - bertman 5y ago
    https://www.indiatoday.in/technology/news/story/apple-is-putting-ads-iphone-settings-like-android-phones-people-are-talking-about-it-1766969-2021-02-08 https://www.indiatoday.in/technology/news/story/apple-is-put...
  - jen729w 5y ago
    I believe they are referring to Apple’s encouragement to sign up to/in to iCloud within the Settings app on iOS, suggesting that this is an ‘ad’ on a par with the Microsoft ad shown in the OP.
    - oneplane 5y ago
      Not even close. If you go to iCloud (a tiered service with one free offering and only paid options beyond that), you get product messaging about iCloud. Not "how to write confidently in this other unrelated product that you don't have but you can buy from us".
beefman 5y ago
Horrible but predictable: http://lumma.org/microwave/#2006.09.22 http://lumma.org/microwave/#2006.09.22
jug 5y ago
I solely use Windows 11 at home right now and can even take ads in Solitaire or something, but placing ads in system tools is a red line for me. I'd have to move to Linux again if this becomes true with no way of disabling it by officially supported methods, and do some of my current desktop development for Windows in a virtual machine.
- teh_klev 5y ago
  Apropos Solitaire, what made me laugh: https://imgur.com/a/OEAlctw https://imgur.com/a/OEAlctw Absolutely no self-awareness there. I think it's the shitness of the ads in Solitaire, those very low quality "You won't believe how she looks now". Pure scraping of the barrel. I wouldn't mind if I got punted ads for stuff like coffee or Philips LED lights. Fortunately I've been able to block Solitaire's worst offenders, the ones for those lootbox games that play at the highest volume possible. And you can't even mute them permanently because each new one that pops up somehow creates a new "Application" in the Volume Mixer.
- warning26 5y ago
  Adding ads to Solitaire was really the start of darkness for post-Vista Microsoft. Yes, Windows 8 had a lot of bad UX decisions, but those were well-meaning, if totally misguided. Ripping out the (excellent) Windows 10 Solitaire in exchange for the ad-filled monstrosity that was Microsoft Solitaire collection was just malicious.
  - immibis 5y ago
    It's not malicious - it's capitalist.
- downrightmike 5y ago
  I can't even internet with ads. dns blocking, ublock origin and other things. I can't understand why others even put up with all the crap. I've gotten one too many viruses from on-page advertising where I've had to wipe and reinstall.
- tssva 5y ago
dessant 5y ago
My favourite is when you open the Galaxy Store on a flagship Samsung phone and a popup with a promoted game is shoved in your face every single time. The popup will often have a 3 second delay before it interrupts you due to the performance issues of their ad servers, so you open the app store and just wait there for the inevitable popup to appear before you can dismiss it to continue using the app. The "Get news and special offers" option is disabled in the app, but none of that matters, the popup ads at app start are there on all Samsung Galaxy devices I've tested.
- na85 5y ago
  You mean a 3rd-party Android manufacturer bundles bloatware?!?! All sarcasm aside I really don't understand why anyone would voluntarily use a Samsung phone.
  - goosedragons 5y ago
    Shrug. They're fine. It's not hard to ignore that stuff. Honestly Apple's constant iCloud storage notifications are more annoying than pop-ups in the Galaxy Store you'll probably never visit anyways.
    - dessant 5y ago
      Galaxy Store is the only way to update several essential packages on Samsung devices, they don't publish everything on Google Play.
      - goosedragons 5y ago
        But you can update through the app instead which skips going through the front of Galaxy Store. That's what I've always done anyways.
        dessant 5y ago
        That works to some extent, but there are packages which don't have a UI from which to check for updates, so you could end up with some services becoming outdated and broken, or just vulnerable.
bitwize 5y ago
I'd suggest switching to Linux but I suspect the most common response will be a Lemongrab-esque "UNACCEPTABLE."
etagate 5y ago
I'm really sad for people who can't run away from Windows because of work and/or programs they use or because they can't. Ads seem the solution for every failure in making money out of software and it's sad. Some days ago I just randomly downloaded uTorrent and I was scared by the amount of ads they embedded. I think it's a taste of what Windows will be like if they take this direction.
- beardog 5y ago
  I run Windows inside Qubes for work and get by well, but of course I took the time to learn how to do that and have a beefy workstation. I also don't have any special requirements for GPU acceleration or other hardware usage. Side note, if you're not aware you should use qBittorrent, Transmission, BiglyBT or Deluge for torrents.
- zalebz 5y ago
  I've been at a Microsoft/.NET shop for over a decade that has a 90's MS employee as a key board director. However, MS is making such poor decisions with Windows and MSSQL licensing that it's become a high priority to migrate off everything they do going forward. I think it will take enterprise a few years but MS has signed their own death warrant on their old stack - good thing they bought GitHub and went all in on WSL.
- winternett 5y ago
  I'm pretty sure there will be a way to hack things... e.g. blocking the ad servers in your host file... Not saying it will be great, but screw the system if it only works against us.
  - tonyedgecombe 5y ago
    The hosts file is ignored for Microsoft's own domains.
    - winternett 5y ago
      There is always an answer... You could even address it at router level if things went really sideways.
wyager 5y ago
I can't believe that anyone pays money for windows. It's the worst OS by far of any that I use (macos, freebsd, linux, openbsd, etc), it's the only one that costs money, and it's the only one which shows me ads.
- jaywalk 5y ago
  The fact that MacOS can't be purchased separately doesn't make it free.
  - wyager 5y ago
    They don't charge for upgrades.
    - jaywalk 5y ago
      Neither does Microsoft with Windows.
      - wyager 5y ago
        They definitely charged money for e.g. going to windows 10 from windows 7 or whatever. You also don't have to pay to install macos on non-mac hardware. By any reasonable definition, macos is free/gratis.
        jaywalk 5y ago
        > They definitely charged money for e.g. going to windows 10 from windows 7 or whatever. No, they didn't. > You also don't have to pay to install macos on non-mac hardware. You "don't have to pay" because Apple doesn't allow it. If we're going to talk about bypassing restrictions and violating licensing agreements, you "don't have to pay" for most software because you can find a cracked version online for free. That's not an argument.
        wyager 5y ago
bduerst 5y ago
I mean, this is not that much different than Microsoft pushing sky drive, cortana, edge, etc. wherever they can in Windows. It's annoying as hell but feels on par with the course they've been going with Windows anyways.
kuboble 5y ago
Business idea: ads in git status
- agumonkey 5y ago
  If you ever get funding, may I suggest ads if gdb too ?
  - Nextgrid 5y ago
    Ads could be used as canaries/filler for uninitialized memory. Edit: this segmentation fault is sponsored by Raid Shadow Legends. Use the code SIGSEGV at signup to get a free bonus!
    - agumonkey 5y ago
      proper genius
- HL33tibCe7 5y ago
  “GRUB loading… Please watch this 30 second advert before selecting your operating system.”
- rabuse 5y ago
  Stop... you stop that right now.
- phaistra 5y ago
  Don't give them ideas!
- immibis 5y ago
  I'm pretty sure `git push` and `git pull` display whatever banner the server decides to send. So this could be implemented in Github tomorrow with no git update needed.
HeckFeck 5y ago
Ah, reminds me of the good old days when I connected a Windows 98 box directly to the public Internet and was spammed every 10 minutes with WinPopup messages, instructing me to visit a dodgy website for "registry booster virus removal". I'll certainly enjoy the throwback to simpler times.
Animats 5y ago
That's just unacceptable. I'm glad I left Microsoft products behind at the end of the Windows 7 era. Linux on the desktop for years now. Wine is getting pretty good. If I really have to run a Windows executable, I can. I'm even developing something that has to work cross-platform. I compile in Rust with --target x86_64-pc-windows-gnu and test under Wine. Had to get some bugs fixed in a few low level crates for that to work, but now I can do Vulkan graphics in the Windows executable running under Wine. There's still a problem with Tracy profiling with cross-compile, but it's a package level build script problem.
- Dzugaru 5y ago
  I tried to do that a year ago, but the problem was my PC froze (full lock up, even mouse pointer is frozen) regularly. I didn't know how to even start troubleshooting a thing like that so I left to Win10 again (was Linux Mint btw).
  - GeoAtreides 5y ago
    > I didn't know how to even start troubleshooting a thing like that Reading the system logs is always a good place to start.
  - dzaima 5y ago
    I've experienced Cinnamon on Linux Mint crashing (leaving the display frozen), but it was possible to go do a tty with ctrl+alt+functionkey (each of f1-f6 goes to a different tty, f7 goes back to the display) and manually restart it. But this hasn't happened to me in the last couple months, so it's probably fixed. Then I've had some full freezes where precisely nothing at all works, but those happen very rarely and I wouldn't be surprised if that's a hardware problem. Then there's full RAM. Yes, linux still hasn't figured out how to not flop on its head dead when RAM fills up; though usually the mouse pointer isn't immediately frozen.
- xoserr 5y ago
  Same here. I was done after Windows 7 for linux. I would say I can't believe they are doing this but I can completely believe they are doing this. I remember how much I liked Windows 2000 and then they had to "fix" it.
rubyist5eva 5y ago
Thankfully I spend >=90% of my time in Linux or Apple based operating systems these days. When support for Windows 10 dries up, hopefully Proton will be up to snuff or I'll just have to kiss some of my steam library goodbye. That's a sacrifice I'm willing to make. Microsoft can shove it.
whywhywhywhy 5y ago
File Explorer is absolute the worst thing on Windows, kinda disgusting engineering time is spent on this and not improving performance and search. Although not sure I'm surprised, even MacOS/iOS are full of ads these days.
- dlivingston 5y ago
  > even MacOS/iOS are full of ads these days …where? Mac and iOS don’t have any ads, anywhere, except in a couple of apps (Apple News, App Store, and if you want to be pedantic, Apple Music).
  - jawilson2 5y ago
    In Settings on my iPhone, the top 2 entries are: Apple TV+ Free for 3 Months Apple Arcade Free for 3 Months I have no way to get rid of those, as far as I can tell.
    - tssva 5y ago
      Which makes the iPhone worse than Windows. Microsoft allows you to disable the ads in the start menu and allows you to disable the ads mentioned in the article, Microsoft refers to them as suggestions, by disabling "Tips and suggestions" in the System->Notification settings.
    - frankjr 5y ago
      Interesting, I've just checked and I don't have these entries (not any other ads). You can feel special!
    - kotaKat 5y ago
      IIRC tap on it, there's an option to hide it/cancel it/kill it after you tap it once.
  - whywhywhywhy 5y ago
    How is Apple Music ads in Music.app pedantic? I store files locally and have subscribed to iTunes Match for probably a decade, yet it kept showing me an ad for Apple music when I launched my music player once a month. Then it straight up just dedicated buttons on the screen to the ad and the switch to turn the ads off doesn't work keeps turning back on and they removed the switch entirely on MacOS.
mftb 5y ago
Microsoft, if you're listening; Ads in Windows, is what pushed me to leave. I have no intention of ever returning. Ads in the tools that I use for my work are unacceptable.
- ultra_nick 5y ago
  That and Linux gaming
  - mftb 5y ago
    Indeed. Now, I'm trying to get the gamers that I know to switch.
    - AnIdiotOnTheNet 5y ago
      Good luck if they happen to use VR at all. Even Valve isn't doing a great job there.
      - mftb 5y ago
        True, it's an uphill battle, particularly with any kind of specialized HW, but I'm all in now.
- paxys 5y ago
  I'm pretty sure Microsoft is operating under the assumption that everyone who could quit Windows has done so already. Sadly most of the world lacks the technical knowledge (for Linux) or money (for Mac) to make a switch, and on the corporate side Windows is pretty much a mandate, so what can the end user even do?
  - mftb 5y ago
    Agree, for the average end-user switching is still difficult. I do think for some of the more technically oriented ones (some gamers, etc...) it may be possible.
phendrenad2 5y ago
I'll believe it when I see it in my start menu. Till then it's speculation.
HL33tibCe7 5y ago
We’re rapidly approaching https://i.redd.it/67inxepejfqz.png https://i.redd.it/67inxepejfqz.png
skyde 5y ago
is it April yet ?
manishsharan 5y ago
This is an awesome news from Microsoft. Kudos to whoever thought of this! I have been waiting for so long for Linux desktop to gain mass popularity. This move from Microsoft will finally make my dreams come true. 2022/2023 will be the year of Linux desktop!
HL33tibCe7 5y ago
Microsoft act with utter contempt for their users. I now recommend to anyone who asks me that they purchase a Mac instead. Their machines will last longer, they will get better customer support, and they won’t have to put up with stupid shit like this. I can’t in good conscience recommend Windows any longer.
- faeriechangling 5y ago
  Apple may be better but they’re getting into using their OS to push ads themselves. Only Linux is truly free of adware, at least if you install the right distro.
- immibis 5y ago
  No company is better. Any company that tries to do better is driven to bankruptcy by market forces. Don't buy a Mac - they may not have ads but they have their own problems. Your best option is apparently to buy a PC and run Linux.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
pmarreck 5y ago
Good thing “Files” already exists, then: https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/p/files-app/9nghp3dx8hdx?activetab=pivot:overviewtab https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/p/files-app/9nghp3dx8hdx?act...
sys_64738 5y ago
When is a file explorer about being distracted from going about your business? People will just migrate to Q-Dir.
wintermutestwin 5y ago
Does anyone make a serious OS for people who need to get real work done on their computer anymore? Some recent frustrations with the big 3 OSs: 1. MacOS: The File>Save dialog has a unchangeable 35 character limit for what can be viewed in the file name field. WTF?! It's like these jokers have never worked in a real office where people create documents with dictated naming conventions like [Customer Name]_[Project Name]_[Project subtask]-[Date]. Maybe they think it is a way to force businesses to use Tags? Dear Apple, your OS seems toy like. 2. Linux: There is an age old Ubuntu bug (which bleeds into many Ubuntu based Distributions) where the installer wipes out the bootloader of a drive that you aren't even installing the OS on. Dear open source community: your desktop OSs are still hobbyist tweaker mode. I 3. Windows: First data mining telemetry and now you are going to show me ads? Dear MS, you keep trying to be Google or Facebook and all it has done is undermine a once serious OS. (note that this is just a "what pissed me off this week list" and not intended to be a comprehensive criticism)
- zamalek 5y ago
  There are multiple ways to solve the bootloader issue, but the easiest is putting your Linux drive ahead of your Windows drive in firmware settings, during installation.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  - wintermutestwin 5y ago
    What I found was that you could remove the other drive. That won't work on an Intel MacBook though...
  - zamalek 5y ago
    Windows will absolutely blast your boot sector/UEFI partition with no concern for other OSes (it won't chain load). Mac avoids this with Bootcamp, which is more similar to firmware than an OS. I'm surprised the parent comment has this issue. They are either using BIOS, or the automatic disk mode (and just complained about the installer doing things automatically on their disk). Avoiding this scenario is UEFI is as simple as creating a exFAT partition and mounting it to /boot. Any calamares-based installer will let you do that.
sandworm101 5y ago
Every bad day for Microsoft is a good day for Linux. Better question: Where in windows won't there be any ads? Will there be ghost ads behind the command line interface? Will they sell space on the BSOD?
signal11 5y ago
This has got to be an Apple mole attempting corporate sabotage in the Windows team, right? right? :-) This comment is a joke, to be clear. But the idea of irrelevant infobars / ads in Windows Explorer is ... pretty daft.
samsaga2 5y ago
Maybe we don't need Windows anymore. Even Elden Ring works pretty well using wine.
- smoldesu 5y ago
  Works better, actually. Valve fixed the stuttering issue with Proton, which still remains an issue on Windows.
- rejectfinite 5y ago
  "pretty well" is still not going to be enough. If it is not using the hardware as well as Windows, then I am losing performance. There is also all the multiplayer games with anticheat that wont work or ban you on Linux. Destiny 2 for a recent example. And I understand them at one point.
p0d 5y ago
This makes me nervous. I am realising we are at the end of a giant saas experiment. Get users, monetise them later. If Microsoft take the OS down this route then I am offski. It's not about parting with cash, it's about forcing crap on people who don't want it.
u2077 5y ago
I’ve been noticing this for a while, but I no longer “own” my devices. I’m buying the product and continually paying for it with my attention. Everything I have can be taken away. Empty spaces filled with ads, telemetry with zero opt-out, data watched by thousands of eyes, DRM for home appliances. At what point will people do something about this? I have a feeling that even though all of us use technology for hours every day, only a few have even a basic understanding of what they are doing. Everyone else isn’t even aware of what’s happening and blindly click away their rights.
- HideousKojima 5y ago
  Some sort of combined hardware and software consortium that specializes in devices that are repairable, DRM-free, etc. is the only solution I can think of, and even then they'd have to fend off entryism from established players (like when Microsoft subverted standards bodies to get their very proprietary document standard declared as open and not proprietary).
- matkoniecz 5y ago
  > I no longer “own” my devices. (...) At what point will people do something about this? Depends on person, I upgraded from Windows 7 to Lubuntu for example because Windows 8 appeared to be unacceptably bad.
- FearlessNebula 5y ago
  Don’t misinterpret my comment as approving of this behavior. But it just occurred to me that this is a societal issue not a tech issue. We have billboards on the highway, on buildings, before computers we had tv in the home that pushed ads. So really this is just tech catching up. 70% of the population is overweight, if people can’t bother to care about their body / health then why would they care about being spied on by telemetry or denied access to their licensed content via DRM? It feels shitty to think about, but it seems like this is just a tech extension to some of the flaws in society, rather than a problem that’s unique to tech.
  - jodrellblank 5y ago
imwillofficial 5y ago
::Emperor Palpatine Voice:: “Do it!!”
tiffanyh 5y ago
There are just certain things I'm not expecting to experience ads. On my OS is one, in my car while driving is another, I really hope we're not moving towards world where ads are literally everywhere.
johndfsgdgdfg 5y ago
The reality is developing an OS is very expensive. I can totally understand why MS is going down that path. It's great that MS is asking for feedback from users. Unlike Google, which is keeping users hostages for some extra money.
- MisterSandman 5y ago
  > The reality is developing an OS is very expensive Linux? And ignoring that, Windows is already a paid product, and a very expensive one at that ($100+ for a new license).
  - k8sToGo 5y ago
    Linux is quite expensive in terms of manhours
- pjerem 5y ago
  Windows works and is printing money since more than three decades. Of course they don’t need to add ads. Since at least Windows 7 they could have done nothing other than changing colors and styles and still print money. I’m not saying that Windows shouldn’t evolve. But since Windows 7, basically everything is just worse. I can’t see a single thing that I could qualify as "better". I just lost more and more control as the time passes. Heck I can’t even resize and move the taskbar anymore. There is a lot of thing I like in my current job but the day I’ll quit, quitting Windows will be a relief. And I’m saying that as someone who grew up with Windows, learned computing with Windows, played with Windows… Although I prefer Linux/macOS, I’ve never been "anti" anything. But Windows 11 is just insulting me on a daily basis, I can’t stand it anymore.
emerged 5y ago
Hah. I’ve been using Windows for my primary desktop for 30 years. I’m removing it the instant I start getting ads like that. That’s my limit.
pdpi 5y ago
Two things standout to me here. One is, whatever your opinion on ads on file explorer see might be, using the triangle/exclamation mark Hazard signage for ads is absolutely unacceptable. The other is, is it just me, or is all the negative press about Microsoft these days caused by the Windows division?
- HideousKojima 5y ago
  Developer division has caused some issues recently, see the dotnet watch issue for an example
tabtab 5y ago
Actually I'm okay with the idea, but only under these conditions: * They are "to the side", not pop-ups and not blocking or pushing primary content into canned sardines. * One can close/minimize them to make room when needed. * They are clearly ads and can't be mistaken for normal content, because you know sleazy marketers (ad purchasers) will try to trick viewers. * One can pay more to get an ad-free version, or even tiered so one can choose multiple levels between parting with money and annoyance level. * User can change spam level/features down the road without a big change-fee. * Does not mine personal info to target ad content, or at least offer a clear and easy way to opt out of targeted ads and related personal content mining. * Doesn't use "dark UI patterns" to trick users out of money, into loss of privacy, etc. (Amazon is doing more of that, it's friggen annoying.)
fleddr 5y ago
The article suggests these are ads to push other Microsoft products. That makes its worse than "just" an annoying generic distraction to consumers, it's a massive legal liability in it being anti competitive behavior.
akagusu 5y ago
It's an interesting thing to read people complaining about their shitty Windows experience and yet continuing to use Windows in of changing their computer's OS. Another thing is that people forget about software ownership. You don't own your computer's OS, Microsoft does,and according its abusive terms of service that no one cares about, they can do whatever they want with their products, including show you ads or anything that disrupt your experience, because the OS is made to serve them, not you.
WhyNotHugo 5y ago
It's always nice to see Microsoft trying to push more users to Linux.
blibble 5y ago
I look forward to the Microsoft brigade telling me again that none of the following exists: - ads in file explorer - ads on the lockscreen - ads as notifications - ads in the start menu - ads in the "change file association" dialog - ads in the apps (e.g. solitaire) - mandatory updates that cannot be disabled and reboot your machine without asking - pc turning itself on in the middle of the night OR when in my backpack to install updates - un-disableable spyware ("telemetry") Windows would be classed as malware by the 2002 definition
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- lostgame 5y ago
  >> Windows would be classed as malware by the 2002 definition Literally. And adware by the mid-00's definition. Like, I can't understand why they'd do this. I really can't. What a joke. Do people still work on the Windows project who are proud of what they do anymore? You gotta think, there's an actual team of real, live, people at Microsoft who decided that getting paid enough would be worth it to put this shit in and degrade millions and millions of people's daily experiences using their software. If I ever become that person, may I rot. I just could never see selling out to that level and living with myself.
  - FearlessNebula 5y ago
    Honestly I imagine the people working on Windows have drank the Kool-aid. They think this is what people want. The ads are “relevant suggestions”. Pre installed Candy crush is “awesome, everyone wants that!”. Telemetry to them is “learning about the users needs”. And there’s a grain of truth in all of these.
    - omgmajk 5y ago
      It's always been a mystery to me who these users are, the ones that do not care about the VD that comes pre-installed with OEM's or with the OS itself. But working with support has taught me that a lot of people really have no idea where the OS ends and third party apps begins. Candy crush pre-installed? Must be part of Windows.
at_a_remove 5y ago
I wonder if this will make its way into the Enterprise LTSC version or not. I will likely be recommending it -- we really do NOT have an alternative to Windows (and I know someone will try to be clever about it and make any number of suggestions that aren't going to actually work for us) -- but I can imagine some fairly large software vendors starting to consider Linux compatibility just because of how noxious this is.
dm319 5y ago
Lots of people asking about alternatives to Windows here. I've found Ubuntu-MATE to be very good for my needs. It uses the Ubuntu base which gives it access to the debian software repo as well as being a popular distro so often particular use-cases have been fixed for it. However the MATE aspect is a follow-on from an older desktop environment (Gnome 2), which is a fairly no-nonsense, feature rich and polished environment. It remains under active development and keeps thing simple. I prefer this to the changing sands that is Gnome 3 / Unity or Ubuntu's adaption of Gnome 3.
jeppester 5y ago
I have primarily used Linux for ~15 years. At this point I honestly believe that it's less painful to switch from Windows to Linux than the other way around. It's obviously still painful to change habits. And I won't downplay how Linux can often be difficult to get working perfectly. The problem with Windows is that it just feels downright user hostile. Ads here and there, MS products constantly pushed, wizards everywhere, taskbar icons for every piece of hardware. It's like you are renting your PC instead of owning it.
- rejectfinite 5y ago
  > taskbar icons for every piece of hardware What?
  - aeldidi 5y ago
    For example, my laptop (https://support.hp.com/ph-en/document/c07686423 https://support.hp.com/ph-en/document/c07686423 I think) has a taskbar icon for the touchpad and a taskbar icon for the AMD graphics. Neither of those things are custom parts, just default out of the factory.
    - rejectfinite 5y ago
      Yea those are the drivers :=)
  - jeppester 5y ago
    I'm aware that Windows doesn't come with these out of the box, but they easily add up as you install drivers. On my gaming PC there are: - Two for audio (if we count the built in one and the one from the driver) - One for Bluetooth - One for fan management - One (or maybe two?) for graphics - One for driver updates. When logging in I can see these icons showing up one by one, obviously unnecessarily using resources and just cluttering the UI. Then when you click the icons they each use a different and often "loud" UI framework, some have embedded ads. Some icons you have to double click, others right click. You can close many of them, and even disable a lot of them - but not all. Overall it's just not a clean experience.
jmnicolas 5y ago
I use Linux and uBlock on desktop and Graphene OS and Bromite on mobile... what's an ad anyway?
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
er4hn 5y ago
It sometimes feels like Microsoft has their own "Tick-Tock" development model for Windows. This is the tock where we get to break prior working hardware, have ugly design decisions made, and who knows what else. Hopefully the tick for Windows 12 will be better than this tock.
datavirtue 5y ago
Never thought I would say this...Apple here I come.
9erdelta 5y ago
I've spent a lot of time learning how to use the Win32 api and overall I like using the Windows OS. But the user hostile design decisions of the UI/UX is making it more and more likely that I'll move on. I don't want ads, I don't want cloud, I don't want a store. I just want to use _my_ computer.
- tonyedgecombe 5y ago
  >I've spent a lot of time learning how to use the Win32 api Me too but the world has moved on. Even Microsoft don't care about that anymore [1][2][3]. [1] https://www.justin-credible.net/2017/05/15/the-visual-studio-2017-installer-is-an-electron-app/ https://www.justin-credible.net/2017/05/15/the-visual-studio... [2] https://microsoft.github.io/react-native-windows/blog/2022/02/11/settings https://microsoft.github.io/react-native-windows/blog/2022/0... [3] https://www.electronjs.org/apps/visual-studio-code https://www.electronjs.org/apps/visual-studio-code
yummybear 5y ago
“This file is sponsored by Squarespace. How dystopian.
kergonath 5y ago
First thought: hell no! Second thought: fucking hell no!
AdamN 5y ago
I tried setting up my Mom's computer a few weeks ago. I can't imagine anybody using Windows these days, truly awful CX.
shmde 5y ago
I am still using Windows 10 LTSC version and have dual booted it Pop OS. I do everything on Windows for now but I have all my work setup configured on pop. The day MS pulls this stunt on win 10 and hard codes Ads on file explorer, I am yeeting out all windows service for good. Planning to use windows 10 till they support it then I will switch completely to Linux because I am NEVER downgrading to Windows 11. ( Have you seen the UI pffft)
encryptluks2 5y ago
Just today, discovered a couple apps on my son's Windows profile that he must have accidentally installed since just browsing Windows can cause you to accidentally install apps from the Microsoft Store. After I uninstalled them, I went to hide them from the Store to prevent the same issue, and nope. Microsoft won't even let you hide apps that you accidentally installed now from the Store. This is in addition to not being able to delete apps from your account either that you installed from their pathetic Store. Don't get me started on them collecting everything you click on and search for in Windows as well even if you disable telemetry by simply logging into a Microsoft account for the Windows Store (for example, if you use Xbox for PC).
lostgame 5y ago
Wow; wow, wow. I honestly can't believe anyone uses this pile of shit OS anymore. I left Windows because adware and spyware became such a prevalent problem that I just got tired of dealing with it. But when the OS itself is the adware, I just...I honestly don't even know what to say. You couldn't pay me enough to use Windows. You really couldn't.
basicplus2 5y ago
use windows server instead
quattrofan 5y ago
usednet 5y ago
This is why I only use Enterprise LTSC versions of Windows.
rkagerer 5y ago
Words can't express the visceral anger this level of obnoxious, user-hostile behavior provokes.
egberts1 5y ago
I vote for this OP, only because there isn’t a downvote and that it is distasteful.
windex 5y ago
Humanity is solving the wrong problems. Money and ways to make it seem to be pointing in directions that are odds with the general good of the species at large. Ad tech has poisoned so many wells in the last 30 years.
joeman1000 5y ago
I’m glad I dropped windows in 2011 when they started down this unsavoury path. Now they’re finally in Xiaomi territory: serving you ads inside essential programs. MacOS has issues, but it is just miles better in terms of invasiveness. I keep a win10 machine for gaming and I cringe every time I have to use it for anything else. Luckily Proton is coming along well, so the win10 installation will be wiped soon. In 10y time no one will use MS garbage any more.
pipeline_peak 5y ago
Considering how often devs rely on explorer, I wonder what the ones at Microsoft will think. Maybe they have a special key to get rid of ads. Either way, there are 1000 other FS managers on Windows. The only obstacle is matching the integration Explorer has. They have the advantage of being an in house app. Other file managers have identical integration to basic functionalities like opening a folder today. What’s stopping Microsoft from closing out these features?
Rairden 5y ago
Windows vs Linux is similar to the chess.com vs lichess.org comparison. chess.com is worse performance, bloated to the moon w/ ads and popups, costs money, not open-source. And lichess.org is the opposite in every way (free, way higher quality, zero ads). I can't believe MS would put ads in system tools. What the hell are they thinking!? I've used linux for 5 years now and not looking back!
theshrike79 5y ago
The old adage went like this: Windows for games, macOS for work, Linux for servers. I'm hoping that Steam Deck will change this to Linux (Proton) for games, macOS for work and Linux for servers.
fbhabbed 5y ago
Just switch to an open source OS like Linux already
blippage 5y ago
Debian Stable user here. I used to use Win 7, which I was happy with. I never used Win 10, except at a library. The chances are minimal that I will install wither Win 10 or 11 on my machine. Why should I pay beaucoup dollars for an OS that thinks it's their machine, when I can get a free, no-hassle one that does what I want it to do? I've noticed that there's been a certain amount of historical revisionism, too. People are saying how great Win 10 was. Win 10 great?? Are you mad? I've read complaint after complaint as to how bad Win 10 is. Microsoft has done a real number on peoples' expectations about what constitutes good and bad. Meanwhile, on Debian, the OS just stays out of my way. Mozilla has been giving off a "feudal overlord" vibe for some time now, too. I do use VSCode on Linux on occasion, though. It's actually quite a nippy piece of software. I dread anything involving Java like Eclipse. Of course, real programmers use vim anyway.
akagusu 5y ago
When I was reading the comments, I remembered that all this s#it was already predicted by one man that people love to hate: https://stallman.org/microsoft.html https://stallman.org/microsoft.html
- throwaway5486nv 5y ago
  Either that or people worship RMS
kkfx 5y ago
IMVHO (not using Windows myself) if I buy a product and it bundle ads I ask for refund. With a TV I buy the device, not the service and ads coming from the service are a separate thing (not counting modern dumb TV sold as smart) BUT if I buy an OS the OS even with a limited usage license is MINE, witch means no ads on it. If that's not the case then the OS must be given for free. Pure and simple. A thing that MUST be enforced by law with sanctions severe enough (significant percentage of global income from the ads themselves) to discourage any abuse.
aagha 5y ago
Microsoft says Windows 11 File Explorer ads were ‘not intended to be published externally’ - https://www.theverge.com/2022/3/15/22979251/microsoft-file-explorer-ads-windows-11-testing?scrolla=5eb6d68b7fedc32c19ef33b4 https://www.theverge.com/2022/3/15/22979251/microsoft-file-e...
XOXO1 5y ago
leave the file explorer alone. or ms would ask for subscription fees to avoid ads.

499 points by DemiGuru 5y ago

One more reason to pay slightly more for Windows 11 Pro (which I have). My guess is the pro version will never see this pollution.

WalterGR 5y ago

Wow. And the Audacity of Microsoft to use the warning icon next to the ad: https://mobile.twitter.com/flobo09/status/1502645866204704773/photo/1 https://mobile.twitter.com/flobo09/status/150264586620470477...

akomtu 5y ago
Plenty of room for improvement here. Soon Windows will read filenames and show ads based on them. Then it will read your pdf files and let advertisers bid on keywords in those files. Windows 13 will watch the cursor movements, analyze it and book doctor appointment behind your back (billable to your insurance).
Forgeties79 5y ago
Wow indeed. That’s incredibly slimy.
laurent123456 5y ago
Soon that's how Microsoft apps will look like - https://blog.malwarebytes.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/Ad8.png https://blog.malwarebytes.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/Ad8...
winternett 5y ago
The way Twitter displays post images in itself is also terrible UI... :(
- rejectfinite 5y ago
  Try Nitter instead https://nitter.net/flobo09/status/1502645866204704773 https://nitter.net/flobo09/status/1502645866204704773 No need to login either. I have seen https://github.com/SimonBrazell/privacy-redirect https://github.com/SimonBrazell/privacy-redirect linked here so I use it.
  - rekoil 5y ago
    Hadn't seen this, thanks for the tip!
khaledh 5y ago
Funny that you used the word "audacity", which actually appears as a folder in the screenshot :)
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- WalterGR 5y ago
  ;)

DemiGuru 5y ago

This has the potential to become a serious security risk. Picture the following - you're running File Explorer with admin creds, all while invoking a malvertisement.

chaorace 5y ago
FYI: these are in-ecosystem ads (so they all come from MS). The messaging is quite similar what they already do with notifications elsewhere in the system ("Edge is faster than Chrome"). It's still manipulative bullshit, but it's not the gaping security hole that it sounds like it 'ought to be. Even so... this type of behavior is what made me drop Windows over 5 years ago now.
- Sohcahtoa82 5y ago
  > these are in-ecosystem ads (so they all come from MS). For now. I think it's incredibly naive to believe it would stay that way. Or maybe I'm just cynical. EDIT: Considering the fact that the Start menu displays ads for 3rd party software, nah, I think it's naive to assume the ads in Explorer would always come from MS.
  - notamy 5y ago
    Right? Imagine what happens when a program hijacks it to inject malvertising or smth similarly nefarious...
- kemotep 5y ago
  In the past Microsoft has had issues with subdomain takeovers[0], resulting in spam being distributed by their own domains. Without strict guarantees and control over the way this content is delivered to end user systems, how can we know that a similar type of attack could not happen? This time in a potentially administrative level file explorer? [0]: https://www.zdnet.com/article/microsoft-has-a-subdomain-hijacking-problem/ https://www.zdnet.com/article/microsoft-has-a-subdomain-hija...
  - 5y ago

matt321 5y ago

I expect paid software not to have ads.

implying 5y ago
You should expect any software to not have ads.
DemiGuru 5y ago
Let alone your operating system.
Ajedi32 5y ago
Kinda ironic how, when it comes to operating systems, it's the Free ones that don't have ads. (Yeah, I know that's not entirely true. Still, I find it kinda hilarious that I might have to switch from a paid operating system to a free one in order to get away from ads.)

JCWasmx86 5y ago

Ads in paid software? This is simply ridiculous.

PenguinCoder 5y ago
Heard of cable TV? Or hell, Hulu even? Still a bunch of bullshit I refuse to use because of shit like this. But it has existed for a while.

barbazoo 5y ago

Do we know for sure that these ads actually link to/show 3rd party content? Don't get me wrong, I'd find this confusing and annoying but it does look like it's just a link to Microsoft content promoting more of their own products.

DemiGuru 5y ago
This might be an indication of the type of ads Microsoft already embeds in Windows 10's start menu: https://i.redd.it/bfc336ql88sz.png https://i.redd.it/bfc336ql88sz.png
- barbazoo 5y ago
  I'd find that very annoying, indeed.
aitchnyu 5y ago
I've logged in to MS Teams and instead of the web app, I get a landing screen asking me if I want to install the desktop app. Powershell also contains a URL-shortener link to their documentation.

hdjjhhvvhga 5y ago

Give me one single reason to migrate.

partiallypro 5y ago

This is nonsensical, I am a pretty big Microsoft advocate, but there is no need in this. Whatever bonehead in Microsoft thought of this should be fired.

jason0597 5y ago
What does being a Microsoft Advocate entail exactly?
- partiallypro 5y ago
  I really like Windows, Azure and O365 and believe they have no real competition, especially when paired together. I can install Ubuntu or other Linux distros on my Windows PC, connect to my Azure VM or container easily and O365 is just simply unmatched, as hard as others try. So I advocate Azure and O365 especially and am harshly critical of Apple/Google. Microsoft generally handles the cloud aspect very well but seems still a bit lost on the OS side. Which is a bit insane to me, especially when sales skyrocketed during COVID, and Windows 11 is generally pretty solid at this point.
  - faeriechangling 5y ago
    What I can’t help notice about o365 is that the web versions are less buggy and more stable and are catching up in feature completeness. Desktop outlook needs to be purged with fire. This makes me wonder for how long it will be necessary to use Windows to get the full o365 experience.
  - blibble 5y ago
    how exactly does Azure have no competition? I have to use Azure at work, and in my experience it's a worse version of AWS/GCP: - standard MS random indecipherable errors in the GUI (error 0x68482233: consult system administrator) - extremely slow UI performance in the GUI - extremely slow VM performance running their OS (even though it has 4 VCPUs, 32gb of RAM and a giant SSD) it's a standard MS product, one where they (badly) copy the features of their competitors, and it only sells because they bundle it with their other crappy products which your company is already locked into

kazinator 5y ago

Microsoft seem desperate to be in the ad business, but don't have any sites that anyone visits or any wortwhile search engine that effectively controls access to the Internet for the majority of the users. The only "Microsoft surface" left where they can stick advertising is the pixels they control via the OS. I may have a good way of capturing this sentiment: "We are Putin ads in File Explorer!"

phone8675309 5y ago

If you’re not paying for Windows then you’re not the customer, you’re the product. I can’t imagine Enterprise versions of Windows will have this enabled.

JCWasmx86 5y ago
You pay for Windows, the price is already in the hardware, if you purchase a PC with Windows
- 0des 5y ago
  Is this like when you pay for Hulu but still see ads? Is there a word for this?
  - magicalhippo 5y ago
    I call it lose-lose.
  - bitwize 5y ago
    Two bites at the apple?
  - rabuse 5y ago
    Cable
clhodapp 5y ago
They might get it later but I'm pretty sure they will get it eventually, given that enterprise versions eventually got bloatware like candy crush. I think the classic truism that you are either the customer or the product is outmodded. Companies are normalizing double-dipping and making you a product even when you are paying them.
- asimops 5y ago
  I haven't seen candy crush on any enterprise installation to date. Maybe you are mistaken?

humanwhosits 5y ago

I guess they know windows is on-the-way-out if they're trying to eek the last bit of cash from it like this

WalterGR 5y ago
What’s the trajectory of Windows’ demise?
- aaaaaaaaaaab 5y ago
  Not steep enough.
  - immibis 5y ago
    Be careful what you wish for - it might come true. What will replace it? Android on PC?
    - aaaaaaaaaaab 5y ago
      Chrome, unfortunately.
51Cards 5y ago
In what way is Windows "on the way out"? https://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/desktop/worldwide https://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/desktop/worldwide
- tomjen3 5y ago
  Developers are going Mac and Linux, Schools are going Chromebooks and many adults are going phones. Companies, constantly being behind the curves are still stuck in MS land. You have linked to the desktop market. Yes there rules MS, but the desktop market is being destroyed by the phone market where MS doesn't even have an offer.
  - 5y ago

aaaaaaaaaaab 5y ago

In late capitalism it’s an agreed upon fact of life that poor people’s minds must be bombarded with ads 24/7. Look at the amount of billboards in a poor neighborhood vs a gated community for the elites. This is just a natural extension of this principle to operating systems. Poor people’s operating systems (i.e. Android, Windows) will be filled to the brim with scammy ads, because they have no power to look elsewhere.

HideousKojima 5y ago
I'm not sure how copywrited software (a government enforced monopoly on intellectual property) is an example of capitalism but maybe you'll enlighten me?

causi 5y ago

I miss the days when Windows didn't treat me with open contempt.

jmcphers 5y ago

I worked at Microsoft around the time of the Windows Vista disaster, and one of the big lessons that came out of that era was solve distractions, not discoverability. Windows and other Microsoft products tried to make features (and products) "discoverable" by pushing them on you with alerts and banners, but the result, when multiplied by dozens of product teams and PMs, was an overall user experience that was noisy and unpleasant. Looks like a new generation of engineers and designers is ready to learn this lesson the hard way again!

tomjen3 5y ago
I wished a lot more companies would learn that lesson. It is such a pain when you have to use some software and then you get the popups about new features. The features may be brilliant, but right now I don't care. I am doing something. Yet somehow PMs never realize that if they let the features be visible in the corner, I would click on them in 10 seconds when I am done with what I am doing and would actually want to read them.
- antisthenes 5y ago
  Looking at you, Google Maps. No, I don't need an "easier way to do X, Y" or whatever else your obtuse program manager decided would get them a promotion. I'm operating a 2-ton vehicle in traffic, so THE EASIER WAY would be to not obscure 50% of my phone screen, making me take eyes away from the road for an extra 2-3 seconds. Hint for anyone reading this at google - it's in the name. Maps. That's all I want from your app, UNLESS I am specifically searching for Food/Hotels/Groceries. Also, please stop doing a UI redesign every year. No, I don't need a pop-up if you want to reroute me around an accident. If it's faster - just reroute me, if it's not - don't.
  - Fogest 5y ago
    I like all the things in Google Maps that you disagree with. Maybe you're just not the target audience and should switch to an app that works better for your needs? Google Maps does automatically choose the better route if it finds one, but it gives you time to cancel that action if you'd like before it switches.

politelemon 5y ago

MS with the file explorer ads, Apple with settings ads, Samsung with its TV ads. They've normalised ads in paid software.

melvinram 5y ago
> Apple with settings ads Say more?
- yurishimo 5y ago
  I think they’re referring to the upsell of iCloud. If you’re not subscribed to even the $1 tier or wherever, there is a line under the iCloud menu item to upgrade. I don’t think it’s especially egregious but some might have a different opinion.
  - busymom0 5y ago
    It’s worse: https://i.imgur.com/64sP9yh.jpg https://i.imgur.com/64sP9yh.jpg
- bertman 5y ago
  https://www.indiatoday.in/technology/news/story/apple-is-putting-ads-iphone-settings-like-android-phones-people-are-talking-about-it-1766969-2021-02-08 https://www.indiatoday.in/technology/news/story/apple-is-put...
- jen729w 5y ago
  I believe they are referring to Apple’s encouragement to sign up to/in to iCloud within the Settings app on iOS, suggesting that this is an ‘ad’ on a par with the Microsoft ad shown in the OP.
  - oneplane 5y ago
    Not even close. If you go to iCloud (a tiered service with one free offering and only paid options beyond that), you get product messaging about iCloud. Not "how to write confidently in this other unrelated product that you don't have but you can buy from us".

beefman 5y ago

Horrible but predictable: http://lumma.org/microwave/#2006.09.22 http://lumma.org/microwave/#2006.09.22

jug 5y ago

I solely use Windows 11 at home right now and can even take ads in Solitaire or something, but placing ads in system tools is a red line for me. I'd have to move to Linux again if this becomes true with no way of disabling it by officially supported methods, and do some of my current desktop development for Windows in a virtual machine.

teh_klev 5y ago
Apropos Solitaire, what made me laugh: https://imgur.com/a/OEAlctw https://imgur.com/a/OEAlctw Absolutely no self-awareness there. I think it's the shitness of the ads in Solitaire, those very low quality "You won't believe how she looks now". Pure scraping of the barrel. I wouldn't mind if I got punted ads for stuff like coffee or Philips LED lights. Fortunately I've been able to block Solitaire's worst offenders, the ones for those lootbox games that play at the highest volume possible. And you can't even mute them permanently because each new one that pops up somehow creates a new "Application" in the Volume Mixer.
warning26 5y ago
Adding ads to Solitaire was really the start of darkness for post-Vista Microsoft. Yes, Windows 8 had a lot of bad UX decisions, but those were well-meaning, if totally misguided. Ripping out the (excellent) Windows 10 Solitaire in exchange for the ad-filled monstrosity that was Microsoft Solitaire collection was just malicious.
- immibis 5y ago
  It's not malicious - it's capitalist.
downrightmike 5y ago
I can't even internet with ads. dns blocking, ublock origin and other things. I can't understand why others even put up with all the crap. I've gotten one too many viruses from on-page advertising where I've had to wipe and reinstall.
tssva 5y ago

dessant 5y ago

My favourite is when you open the Galaxy Store on a flagship Samsung phone and a popup with a promoted game is shoved in your face every single time. The popup will often have a 3 second delay before it interrupts you due to the performance issues of their ad servers, so you open the app store and just wait there for the inevitable popup to appear before you can dismiss it to continue using the app. The "Get news and special offers" option is disabled in the app, but none of that matters, the popup ads at app start are there on all Samsung Galaxy devices I've tested.

na85 5y ago
You mean a 3rd-party Android manufacturer bundles bloatware?!?! All sarcasm aside I really don't understand why anyone would voluntarily use a Samsung phone.
- goosedragons 5y ago
  Shrug. They're fine. It's not hard to ignore that stuff. Honestly Apple's constant iCloud storage notifications are more annoying than pop-ups in the Galaxy Store you'll probably never visit anyways.
  - dessant 5y ago
    Galaxy Store is the only way to update several essential packages on Samsung devices, they don't publish everything on Google Play.
    - goosedragons 5y ago
      But you can update through the app instead which skips going through the front of Galaxy Store. That's what I've always done anyways.
      - dessant 5y ago
        That works to some extent, but there are packages which don't have a UI from which to check for updates, so you could end up with some services becoming outdated and broken, or just vulnerable.

bitwize 5y ago

I'd suggest switching to Linux but I suspect the most common response will be a Lemongrab-esque "UNACCEPTABLE."

etagate 5y ago

I'm really sad for people who can't run away from Windows because of work and/or programs they use or because they can't. Ads seem the solution for every failure in making money out of software and it's sad. Some days ago I just randomly downloaded uTorrent and I was scared by the amount of ads they embedded. I think it's a taste of what Windows will be like if they take this direction.

beardog 5y ago
I run Windows inside Qubes for work and get by well, but of course I took the time to learn how to do that and have a beefy workstation. I also don't have any special requirements for GPU acceleration or other hardware usage. Side note, if you're not aware you should use qBittorrent, Transmission, BiglyBT or Deluge for torrents.
zalebz 5y ago
I've been at a Microsoft/.NET shop for over a decade that has a 90's MS employee as a key board director. However, MS is making such poor decisions with Windows and MSSQL licensing that it's become a high priority to migrate off everything they do going forward. I think it will take enterprise a few years but MS has signed their own death warrant on their old stack - good thing they bought GitHub and went all in on WSL.
winternett 5y ago
I'm pretty sure there will be a way to hack things... e.g. blocking the ad servers in your host file... Not saying it will be great, but screw the system if it only works against us.
- tonyedgecombe 5y ago
  The hosts file is ignored for Microsoft's own domains.
  - winternett 5y ago
    There is always an answer... You could even address it at router level if things went really sideways.

wyager 5y ago

I can't believe that anyone pays money for windows. It's the worst OS by far of any that I use (macos, freebsd, linux, openbsd, etc), it's the only one that costs money, and it's the only one which shows me ads.

jaywalk 5y ago
The fact that MacOS can't be purchased separately doesn't make it free.
- wyager 5y ago
  They don't charge for upgrades.
  - jaywalk 5y ago
    Neither does Microsoft with Windows.
    - wyager 5y ago
      They definitely charged money for e.g. going to windows 10 from windows 7 or whatever. You also don't have to pay to install macos on non-mac hardware. By any reasonable definition, macos is free/gratis.
      - jaywalk 5y ago
        > They definitely charged money for e.g. going to windows 10 from windows 7 or whatever. No, they didn't. > You also don't have to pay to install macos on non-mac hardware. You "don't have to pay" because Apple doesn't allow it. If we're going to talk about bypassing restrictions and violating licensing agreements, you "don't have to pay" for most software because you can find a cracked version online for free. That's not an argument.
        wyager 5y ago

bduerst 5y ago

I mean, this is not that much different than Microsoft pushing sky drive, cortana, edge, etc. wherever they can in Windows. It's annoying as hell but feels on par with the course they've been going with Windows anyways.

kuboble 5y ago

Business idea: ads in git status

agumonkey 5y ago
If you ever get funding, may I suggest ads if gdb too ?
- Nextgrid 5y ago
  Ads could be used as canaries/filler for uninitialized memory. Edit: this segmentation fault is sponsored by Raid Shadow Legends. Use the code SIGSEGV at signup to get a free bonus!
  - agumonkey 5y ago
    proper genius
HL33tibCe7 5y ago
“GRUB loading… Please watch this 30 second advert before selecting your operating system.”
rabuse 5y ago
Stop... you stop that right now.
phaistra 5y ago
Don't give them ideas!
immibis 5y ago
I'm pretty sure `git push` and `git pull` display whatever banner the server decides to send. So this could be implemented in Github tomorrow with no git update needed.

HeckFeck 5y ago

Ah, reminds me of the good old days when I connected a Windows 98 box directly to the public Internet and was spammed every 10 minutes with WinPopup messages, instructing me to visit a dodgy website for "registry booster virus removal". I'll certainly enjoy the throwback to simpler times.

Animats 5y ago

That's just unacceptable. I'm glad I left Microsoft products behind at the end of the Windows 7 era. Linux on the desktop for years now. Wine is getting pretty good. If I really have to run a Windows executable, I can. I'm even developing something that has to work cross-platform. I compile in Rust with --target x86_64-pc-windows-gnu and test under Wine. Had to get some bugs fixed in a few low level crates for that to work, but now I can do Vulkan graphics in the Windows executable running under Wine. There's still a problem with Tracy profiling with cross-compile, but it's a package level build script problem.

Dzugaru 5y ago
I tried to do that a year ago, but the problem was my PC froze (full lock up, even mouse pointer is frozen) regularly. I didn't know how to even start troubleshooting a thing like that so I left to Win10 again (was Linux Mint btw).
- GeoAtreides 5y ago
  > I didn't know how to even start troubleshooting a thing like that Reading the system logs is always a good place to start.
- dzaima 5y ago
  I've experienced Cinnamon on Linux Mint crashing (leaving the display frozen), but it was possible to go do a tty with ctrl+alt+functionkey (each of f1-f6 goes to a different tty, f7 goes back to the display) and manually restart it. But this hasn't happened to me in the last couple months, so it's probably fixed. Then I've had some full freezes where precisely nothing at all works, but those happen very rarely and I wouldn't be surprised if that's a hardware problem. Then there's full RAM. Yes, linux still hasn't figured out how to not flop on its head dead when RAM fills up; though usually the mouse pointer isn't immediately frozen.
xoserr 5y ago
Same here. I was done after Windows 7 for linux. I would say I can't believe they are doing this but I can completely believe they are doing this. I remember how much I liked Windows 2000 and then they had to "fix" it.

rubyist5eva 5y ago

Thankfully I spend >=90% of my time in Linux or Apple based operating systems these days. When support for Windows 10 dries up, hopefully Proton will be up to snuff or I'll just have to kiss some of my steam library goodbye. That's a sacrifice I'm willing to make. Microsoft can shove it.

whywhywhywhy 5y ago

File Explorer is absolute the worst thing on Windows, kinda disgusting engineering time is spent on this and not improving performance and search. Although not sure I'm surprised, even MacOS/iOS are full of ads these days.

dlivingston 5y ago
> even MacOS/iOS are full of ads these days …where? Mac and iOS don’t have any ads, anywhere, except in a couple of apps (Apple News, App Store, and if you want to be pedantic, Apple Music).
- jawilson2 5y ago
  In Settings on my iPhone, the top 2 entries are: Apple TV+ Free for 3 Months Apple Arcade Free for 3 Months I have no way to get rid of those, as far as I can tell.
  - tssva 5y ago
    Which makes the iPhone worse than Windows. Microsoft allows you to disable the ads in the start menu and allows you to disable the ads mentioned in the article, Microsoft refers to them as suggestions, by disabling "Tips and suggestions" in the System->Notification settings.
  - frankjr 5y ago
    Interesting, I've just checked and I don't have these entries (not any other ads). You can feel special!
  - kotaKat 5y ago
    IIRC tap on it, there's an option to hide it/cancel it/kill it after you tap it once.
- whywhywhywhy 5y ago
  How is Apple Music ads in Music.app pedantic? I store files locally and have subscribed to iTunes Match for probably a decade, yet it kept showing me an ad for Apple music when I launched my music player once a month. Then it straight up just dedicated buttons on the screen to the ad and the switch to turn the ads off doesn't work keeps turning back on and they removed the switch entirely on MacOS.

mftb 5y ago

Microsoft, if you're listening; Ads in Windows, is what pushed me to leave. I have no intention of ever returning. Ads in the tools that I use for my work are unacceptable.

ultra_nick 5y ago
That and Linux gaming
- mftb 5y ago
  Indeed. Now, I'm trying to get the gamers that I know to switch.
  - AnIdiotOnTheNet 5y ago
    Good luck if they happen to use VR at all. Even Valve isn't doing a great job there.
    - mftb 5y ago
      True, it's an uphill battle, particularly with any kind of specialized HW, but I'm all in now.
paxys 5y ago
I'm pretty sure Microsoft is operating under the assumption that everyone who could quit Windows has done so already. Sadly most of the world lacks the technical knowledge (for Linux) or money (for Mac) to make a switch, and on the corporate side Windows is pretty much a mandate, so what can the end user even do?
- mftb 5y ago
  Agree, for the average end-user switching is still difficult. I do think for some of the more technically oriented ones (some gamers, etc...) it may be possible.

phendrenad2 5y ago

I'll believe it when I see it in my start menu. Till then it's speculation.

HL33tibCe7 5y ago

We’re rapidly approaching https://i.redd.it/67inxepejfqz.png https://i.redd.it/67inxepejfqz.png

skyde 5y ago

is it April yet ?

manishsharan 5y ago

This is an awesome news from Microsoft. Kudos to whoever thought of this! I have been waiting for so long for Linux desktop to gain mass popularity. This move from Microsoft will finally make my dreams come true. 2022/2023 will be the year of Linux desktop!

HL33tibCe7 5y ago

Microsoft act with utter contempt for their users. I now recommend to anyone who asks me that they purchase a Mac instead. Their machines will last longer, they will get better customer support, and they won’t have to put up with stupid shit like this. I can’t in good conscience recommend Windows any longer.

faeriechangling 5y ago
Apple may be better but they’re getting into using their OS to push ads themselves. Only Linux is truly free of adware, at least if you install the right distro.
immibis 5y ago
No company is better. Any company that tries to do better is driven to bankruptcy by market forces. Don't buy a Mac - they may not have ads but they have their own problems. Your best option is apparently to buy a PC and run Linux.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]

pmarreck 5y ago

Good thing “Files” already exists, then: https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/p/files-app/9nghp3dx8hdx?activetab=pivot:overviewtab https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/p/files-app/9nghp3dx8hdx?act...

sys_64738 5y ago

When is a file explorer about being distracted from going about your business? People will just migrate to Q-Dir.

wintermutestwin 5y ago

Does anyone make a serious OS for people who need to get real work done on their computer anymore? Some recent frustrations with the big 3 OSs: 1. MacOS: The File>Save dialog has a unchangeable 35 character limit for what can be viewed in the file name field. WTF?! It's like these jokers have never worked in a real office where people create documents with dictated naming conventions like [Customer Name]_[Project Name]_[Project subtask]-[Date]. Maybe they think it is a way to force businesses to use Tags? Dear Apple, your OS seems toy like. 2. Linux: There is an age old Ubuntu bug (which bleeds into many Ubuntu based Distributions) where the installer wipes out the bootloader of a drive that you aren't even installing the OS on. Dear open source community: your desktop OSs are still hobbyist tweaker mode. I 3. Windows: First data mining telemetry and now you are going to show me ads? Dear MS, you keep trying to be Google or Facebook and all it has done is undermine a once serious OS. (note that this is just a "what pissed me off this week list" and not intended to be a comprehensive criticism)

zamalek 5y ago
There are multiple ways to solve the bootloader issue, but the easiest is putting your Linux drive ahead of your Windows drive in firmware settings, during installation.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- wintermutestwin 5y ago
  What I found was that you could remove the other drive. That won't work on an Intel MacBook though...
- zamalek 5y ago
  Windows will absolutely blast your boot sector/UEFI partition with no concern for other OSes (it won't chain load). Mac avoids this with Bootcamp, which is more similar to firmware than an OS. I'm surprised the parent comment has this issue. They are either using BIOS, or the automatic disk mode (and just complained about the installer doing things automatically on their disk). Avoiding this scenario is UEFI is as simple as creating a exFAT partition and mounting it to /boot. Any calamares-based installer will let you do that.

sandworm101 5y ago

Every bad day for Microsoft is a good day for Linux. Better question: Where in windows won't there be any ads? Will there be ghost ads behind the command line interface? Will they sell space on the BSOD?

signal11 5y ago

This has got to be an Apple mole attempting corporate sabotage in the Windows team, right? right? :-) This comment is a joke, to be clear. But the idea of irrelevant infobars / ads in Windows Explorer is ... pretty daft.

samsaga2 5y ago

Maybe we don't need Windows anymore. Even Elden Ring works pretty well using wine.

smoldesu 5y ago
Works better, actually. Valve fixed the stuttering issue with Proton, which still remains an issue on Windows.
rejectfinite 5y ago
"pretty well" is still not going to be enough. If it is not using the hardware as well as Windows, then I am losing performance. There is also all the multiplayer games with anticheat that wont work or ban you on Linux. Destiny 2 for a recent example. And I understand them at one point.

p0d 5y ago

This makes me nervous. I am realising we are at the end of a giant saas experiment. Get users, monetise them later. If Microsoft take the OS down this route then I am offski. It's not about parting with cash, it's about forcing crap on people who don't want it.

u2077 5y ago

I’ve been noticing this for a while, but I no longer “own” my devices. I’m buying the product and continually paying for it with my attention. Everything I have can be taken away. Empty spaces filled with ads, telemetry with zero opt-out, data watched by thousands of eyes, DRM for home appliances. At what point will people do something about this? I have a feeling that even though all of us use technology for hours every day, only a few have even a basic understanding of what they are doing. Everyone else isn’t even aware of what’s happening and blindly click away their rights.

HideousKojima 5y ago
Some sort of combined hardware and software consortium that specializes in devices that are repairable, DRM-free, etc. is the only solution I can think of, and even then they'd have to fend off entryism from established players (like when Microsoft subverted standards bodies to get their very proprietary document standard declared as open and not proprietary).
matkoniecz 5y ago
> I no longer “own” my devices. (...) At what point will people do something about this? Depends on person, I upgraded from Windows 7 to Lubuntu for example because Windows 8 appeared to be unacceptably bad.
FearlessNebula 5y ago
Don’t misinterpret my comment as approving of this behavior. But it just occurred to me that this is a societal issue not a tech issue. We have billboards on the highway, on buildings, before computers we had tv in the home that pushed ads. So really this is just tech catching up. 70% of the population is overweight, if people can’t bother to care about their body / health then why would they care about being spied on by telemetry or denied access to their licensed content via DRM? It feels shitty to think about, but it seems like this is just a tech extension to some of the flaws in society, rather than a problem that’s unique to tech.
- jodrellblank 5y ago

imwillofficial 5y ago

::Emperor Palpatine Voice:: “Do it!!”

tiffanyh 5y ago

There are just certain things I'm not expecting to experience ads. On my OS is one, in my car while driving is another, I really hope we're not moving towards world where ads are literally everywhere.

johndfsgdgdfg 5y ago

The reality is developing an OS is very expensive. I can totally understand why MS is going down that path. It's great that MS is asking for feedback from users. Unlike Google, which is keeping users hostages for some extra money.

MisterSandman 5y ago
> The reality is developing an OS is very expensive Linux? And ignoring that, Windows is already a paid product, and a very expensive one at that ($100+ for a new license).
- k8sToGo 5y ago
  Linux is quite expensive in terms of manhours
pjerem 5y ago
Windows works and is printing money since more than three decades. Of course they don’t need to add ads. Since at least Windows 7 they could have done nothing other than changing colors and styles and still print money. I’m not saying that Windows shouldn’t evolve. But since Windows 7, basically everything is just worse. I can’t see a single thing that I could qualify as "better". I just lost more and more control as the time passes. Heck I can’t even resize and move the taskbar anymore. There is a lot of thing I like in my current job but the day I’ll quit, quitting Windows will be a relief. And I’m saying that as someone who grew up with Windows, learned computing with Windows, played with Windows… Although I prefer Linux/macOS, I’ve never been "anti" anything. But Windows 11 is just insulting me on a daily basis, I can’t stand it anymore.

emerged 5y ago

Hah. I’ve been using Windows for my primary desktop for 30 years. I’m removing it the instant I start getting ads like that. That’s my limit.

pdpi 5y ago

Two things standout to me here. One is, whatever your opinion on ads on file explorer see might be, using the triangle/exclamation mark Hazard signage for ads is absolutely unacceptable. The other is, is it just me, or is all the negative press about Microsoft these days caused by the Windows division?

HideousKojima 5y ago
Developer division has caused some issues recently, see the dotnet watch issue for an example

tabtab 5y ago

Actually I'm okay with the idea, but only under these conditions: * They are "to the side", not pop-ups and not blocking or pushing primary content into canned sardines. * One can close/minimize them to make room when needed. * They are clearly ads and can't be mistaken for normal content, because you know sleazy marketers (ad purchasers) will try to trick viewers. * One can pay more to get an ad-free version, or even tiered so one can choose multiple levels between parting with money and annoyance level. * User can change spam level/features down the road without a big change-fee. * Does not mine personal info to target ad content, or at least offer a clear and easy way to opt out of targeted ads and related personal content mining. * Doesn't use "dark UI patterns" to trick users out of money, into loss of privacy, etc. (Amazon is doing more of that, it's friggen annoying.)

fleddr 5y ago

The article suggests these are ads to push other Microsoft products. That makes its worse than "just" an annoying generic distraction to consumers, it's a massive legal liability in it being anti competitive behavior.

akagusu 5y ago

It's an interesting thing to read people complaining about their shitty Windows experience and yet continuing to use Windows in of changing their computer's OS. Another thing is that people forget about software ownership. You don't own your computer's OS, Microsoft does,and according its abusive terms of service that no one cares about, they can do whatever they want with their products, including show you ads or anything that disrupt your experience, because the OS is made to serve them, not you.

WhyNotHugo 5y ago

It's always nice to see Microsoft trying to push more users to Linux.

blibble 5y ago

I look forward to the Microsoft brigade telling me again that none of the following exists: - ads in file explorer - ads on the lockscreen - ads as notifications - ads in the start menu - ads in the "change file association" dialog - ads in the apps (e.g. solitaire) - mandatory updates that cannot be disabled and reboot your machine without asking - pc turning itself on in the middle of the night OR when in my backpack to install updates - un-disableable spyware ("telemetry") Windows would be classed as malware by the 2002 definition

deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
lostgame 5y ago
>> Windows would be classed as malware by the 2002 definition Literally. And adware by the mid-00's definition. Like, I can't understand why they'd do this. I really can't. What a joke. Do people still work on the Windows project who are proud of what they do anymore? You gotta think, there's an actual team of real, live, people at Microsoft who decided that getting paid enough would be worth it to put this shit in and degrade millions and millions of people's daily experiences using their software. If I ever become that person, may I rot. I just could never see selling out to that level and living with myself.
- FearlessNebula 5y ago
  Honestly I imagine the people working on Windows have drank the Kool-aid. They think this is what people want. The ads are “relevant suggestions”. Pre installed Candy crush is “awesome, everyone wants that!”. Telemetry to them is “learning about the users needs”. And there’s a grain of truth in all of these.
  - omgmajk 5y ago
    It's always been a mystery to me who these users are, the ones that do not care about the VD that comes pre-installed with OEM's or with the OS itself. But working with support has taught me that a lot of people really have no idea where the OS ends and third party apps begins. Candy crush pre-installed? Must be part of Windows.

at_a_remove 5y ago

I wonder if this will make its way into the Enterprise LTSC version or not. I will likely be recommending it -- we really do NOT have an alternative to Windows (and I know someone will try to be clever about it and make any number of suggestions that aren't going to actually work for us) -- but I can imagine some fairly large software vendors starting to consider Linux compatibility just because of how noxious this is.

dm319 5y ago

Lots of people asking about alternatives to Windows here. I've found Ubuntu-MATE to be very good for my needs. It uses the Ubuntu base which gives it access to the debian software repo as well as being a popular distro so often particular use-cases have been fixed for it. However the MATE aspect is a follow-on from an older desktop environment (Gnome 2), which is a fairly no-nonsense, feature rich and polished environment. It remains under active development and keeps thing simple. I prefer this to the changing sands that is Gnome 3 / Unity or Ubuntu's adaption of Gnome 3.

jeppester 5y ago

I have primarily used Linux for ~15 years. At this point I honestly believe that it's less painful to switch from Windows to Linux than the other way around. It's obviously still painful to change habits. And I won't downplay how Linux can often be difficult to get working perfectly. The problem with Windows is that it just feels downright user hostile. Ads here and there, MS products constantly pushed, wizards everywhere, taskbar icons for every piece of hardware. It's like you are renting your PC instead of owning it.

rejectfinite 5y ago
> taskbar icons for every piece of hardware What?
- aeldidi 5y ago
  For example, my laptop (https://support.hp.com/ph-en/document/c07686423 https://support.hp.com/ph-en/document/c07686423 I think) has a taskbar icon for the touchpad and a taskbar icon for the AMD graphics. Neither of those things are custom parts, just default out of the factory.
  - rejectfinite 5y ago
    Yea those are the drivers :=)
- jeppester 5y ago
  I'm aware that Windows doesn't come with these out of the box, but they easily add up as you install drivers. On my gaming PC there are: - Two for audio (if we count the built in one and the one from the driver) - One for Bluetooth - One for fan management - One (or maybe two?) for graphics - One for driver updates. When logging in I can see these icons showing up one by one, obviously unnecessarily using resources and just cluttering the UI. Then when you click the icons they each use a different and often "loud" UI framework, some have embedded ads. Some icons you have to double click, others right click. You can close many of them, and even disable a lot of them - but not all. Overall it's just not a clean experience.

jmnicolas 5y ago

I use Linux and uBlock on desktop and Graphene OS and Bromite on mobile... what's an ad anyway?

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

er4hn 5y ago

It sometimes feels like Microsoft has their own "Tick-Tock" development model for Windows. This is the tock where we get to break prior working hardware, have ugly design decisions made, and who knows what else. Hopefully the tick for Windows 12 will be better than this tock.

datavirtue 5y ago

Never thought I would say this...Apple here I come.

9erdelta 5y ago

I've spent a lot of time learning how to use the Win32 api and overall I like using the Windows OS. But the user hostile design decisions of the UI/UX is making it more and more likely that I'll move on. I don't want ads, I don't want cloud, I don't want a store. I just want to use _my_ computer.

tonyedgecombe 5y ago
>I've spent a lot of time learning how to use the Win32 api Me too but the world has moved on. Even Microsoft don't care about that anymore [1][2][3]. [1] https://www.justin-credible.net/2017/05/15/the-visual-studio-2017-installer-is-an-electron-app/ https://www.justin-credible.net/2017/05/15/the-visual-studio... [2] https://microsoft.github.io/react-native-windows/blog/2022/02/11/settings https://microsoft.github.io/react-native-windows/blog/2022/0... [3] https://www.electronjs.org/apps/visual-studio-code https://www.electronjs.org/apps/visual-studio-code

yummybear 5y ago

“This file is sponsored by Squarespace. How dystopian.

kergonath 5y ago

First thought: hell no! Second thought: fucking hell no!

AdamN 5y ago

I tried setting up my Mom's computer a few weeks ago. I can't imagine anybody using Windows these days, truly awful CX.

shmde 5y ago

I am still using Windows 10 LTSC version and have dual booted it Pop OS. I do everything on Windows for now but I have all my work setup configured on pop. The day MS pulls this stunt on win 10 and hard codes Ads on file explorer, I am yeeting out all windows service for good. Planning to use windows 10 till they support it then I will switch completely to Linux because I am NEVER downgrading to Windows 11. ( Have you seen the UI pffft)

encryptluks2 5y ago

Just today, discovered a couple apps on my son's Windows profile that he must have accidentally installed since just browsing Windows can cause you to accidentally install apps from the Microsoft Store. After I uninstalled them, I went to hide them from the Store to prevent the same issue, and nope. Microsoft won't even let you hide apps that you accidentally installed now from the Store. This is in addition to not being able to delete apps from your account either that you installed from their pathetic Store. Don't get me started on them collecting everything you click on and search for in Windows as well even if you disable telemetry by simply logging into a Microsoft account for the Windows Store (for example, if you use Xbox for PC).

lostgame 5y ago

Wow; wow, wow. I honestly can't believe anyone uses this pile of shit OS anymore. I left Windows because adware and spyware became such a prevalent problem that I just got tired of dealing with it. But when the OS itself is the adware, I just...I honestly don't even know what to say. You couldn't pay me enough to use Windows. You really couldn't.

basicplus2 5y ago

use windows server instead

quattrofan 5y ago

usednet 5y ago

This is why I only use Enterprise LTSC versions of Windows.

rkagerer 5y ago

Words can't express the visceral anger this level of obnoxious, user-hostile behavior provokes.

egberts1 5y ago

I vote for this OP, only because there isn’t a downvote and that it is distasteful.

windex 5y ago

Humanity is solving the wrong problems. Money and ways to make it seem to be pointing in directions that are odds with the general good of the species at large. Ad tech has poisoned so many wells in the last 30 years.

joeman1000 5y ago

I’m glad I dropped windows in 2011 when they started down this unsavoury path. Now they’re finally in Xiaomi territory: serving you ads inside essential programs. MacOS has issues, but it is just miles better in terms of invasiveness. I keep a win10 machine for gaming and I cringe every time I have to use it for anything else. Luckily Proton is coming along well, so the win10 installation will be wiped soon. In 10y time no one will use MS garbage any more.

pipeline_peak 5y ago

Considering how often devs rely on explorer, I wonder what the ones at Microsoft will think. Maybe they have a special key to get rid of ads. Either way, there are 1000 other FS managers on Windows. The only obstacle is matching the integration Explorer has. They have the advantage of being an in house app. Other file managers have identical integration to basic functionalities like opening a folder today. What’s stopping Microsoft from closing out these features?

Rairden 5y ago

Windows vs Linux is similar to the chess.com vs lichess.org comparison. chess.com is worse performance, bloated to the moon w/ ads and popups, costs money, not open-source. And lichess.org is the opposite in every way (free, way higher quality, zero ads). I can't believe MS would put ads in system tools. What the hell are they thinking!? I've used linux for 5 years now and not looking back!

theshrike79 5y ago

The old adage went like this: Windows for games, macOS for work, Linux for servers. I'm hoping that Steam Deck will change this to Linux (Proton) for games, macOS for work and Linux for servers.

fbhabbed 5y ago

Just switch to an open source OS like Linux already

blippage 5y ago

Debian Stable user here. I used to use Win 7, which I was happy with. I never used Win 10, except at a library. The chances are minimal that I will install wither Win 10 or 11 on my machine. Why should I pay beaucoup dollars for an OS that thinks it's their machine, when I can get a free, no-hassle one that does what I want it to do? I've noticed that there's been a certain amount of historical revisionism, too. People are saying how great Win 10 was. Win 10 great?? Are you mad? I've read complaint after complaint as to how bad Win 10 is. Microsoft has done a real number on peoples' expectations about what constitutes good and bad. Meanwhile, on Debian, the OS just stays out of my way. Mozilla has been giving off a "feudal overlord" vibe for some time now, too. I do use VSCode on Linux on occasion, though. It's actually quite a nippy piece of software. I dread anything involving Java like Eclipse. Of course, real programmers use vim anyway.

akagusu 5y ago

When I was reading the comments, I remembered that all this s#it was already predicted by one man that people love to hate: https://stallman.org/microsoft.html https://stallman.org/microsoft.html

throwaway5486nv 5y ago
Either that or people worship RMS

kkfx 5y ago

IMVHO (not using Windows myself) if I buy a product and it bundle ads I ask for refund. With a TV I buy the device, not the service and ads coming from the service are a separate thing (not counting modern dumb TV sold as smart) BUT if I buy an OS the OS even with a limited usage license is MINE, witch means no ads on it. If that's not the case then the OS must be given for free. Pure and simple. A thing that MUST be enforced by law with sanctions severe enough (significant percentage of global income from the ads themselves) to discourage any abuse.

aagha 5y ago

Microsoft says Windows 11 File Explorer ads were ‘not intended to be published externally’ - https://www.theverge.com/2022/3/15/22979251/microsoft-file-explorer-ads-windows-11-testing?scrolla=5eb6d68b7fedc32c19ef33b4 https://www.theverge.com/2022/3/15/22979251/microsoft-file-e...

XOXO1 5y ago

leave the file explorer alone. or ms would ask for subscription fees to avoid ads.