20 ms·

I spent ~10 years in the rental car business (although the very very high end of it.) Let me say, it's a weird business with LOTS of quirks. Here's one: One

• odiroot 5y ago
  > You can book any car with any rental company and cancel up until the minute of the rental or just not show up and there's no penalty. Is this some American thing? Every time I rented a car in Germany, I had to pre-pay at least some amount.
• devin 5y ago
  I know someone who exploited this and would just keep a reservation handy in their city in case they needed a car, cancelling at the last minute. It was basically a zipcar for them with no membership fee.
  • rafale 5y ago
    A reputation system could solve this. Do that a few times in a given time period and you become persona non grata.
    • tshaddox 5y ago
      Sure, but that’s just one possible way of implementing enforcement of reservations, which the first commenter claims is untenable because of competition.
      • mst 5y ago
        The untenable part seems to be 'anticipation of sticker shock' though - a reputation system would affect chronic cancelers but (assuming your PR department is on its toes) quite possibly largely not be visible to incidental cancelers or people who're not actually going to cancel and are just scared of getting screwed. It still might not work, but as implementation approaches go, the business risks seem substantially different at least.
  • brezelgoring 5y ago
    How come the rental company doesn't wise up to his phone number or name? Are they that afraid of losing a customer that let them down a hundred times before? I'd just tell him that there's no cars, or something.
    • lozenge 5y ago
      It didn't matter to them because the reservation was just a row in their database and didn't prevent them from renting their cars to anybody else.
      • lotsofpulp 5y ago
        I am sure they have some ratio of cars to reservations they keep based on actual no show/cancelation statistics.
• charlieyu1 5y ago
  Seems like a 80/20 situation. Worrying about losing customers who cause problems that they pay (if any) is overrated.
• tshaddox 5y ago
  The only way that competition could fully explain the lack of reservation enforcement is if people don’t actually care that much about their reserved car being unavailable, right? If there is in fact sufficient competition to cause the rental companies to match customers’ preferences, this must mean that people would rather have the risk of their reserved car being unavailable than to prepay to hold the reservation.
  • nlh 5y ago
    Exactly. Much like the fact that everyone complains about Basic Economy airfares ("they're nickel-and-dime'ing you for carry-on!!!") the reality is that in the face of competition, people still just choose the lowest airfare. Same with rental cars. Everyone complains about reservations, but when push comes to shove people aren't actually willing to put their money where their mouths (and complaints) are.
    • throwaway0a5e 5y ago
      The complainers are not a cross section of customers. The complainers generally are high end luxury consumers who can and would pay more but there aren't enough of them to actually actually matter beyond noise making. The people who are penny pinching are happy they can get the right good or service at the right price.
      • garbagecoder 5y ago
        If it were easy(-ier) to compare apples to apples with the “add ons” I wouldn’t care. But when one airline is $50 for a bag on a certain flight but $30 on others and another airline is $20, it’s hard to know which airfare is actually cheaper. And this is one way they keep you married to them, with rewards and so on, by eliminating those for loyalty. Amex Platinum avoids most of this, but you can only get the nickel and dime repaid from one airline at a time.
      • BeFlatXIII 5y ago
        Thank you for reminding the room that markets can fail to provide at a middle price tier because there simply aren’t enough people willing to pay. The only remaining options are the super-premium, which most of what would have been the middle market can’t afford, and basic economy.
• avar 5y ago
  Just a personal anecdote from dealings with rental companies, but that doesn't seem to be the only reason for this. They're also seemingly cost-optimizing by advertising car A, and then hoping to give you an "or similar" car B at less cost to themselves. Sometimes in a way that blatantly doesn't match their own advertising material. E.g. I've rented something like a VW Passat or other mid-sized-wagon, only to have the car rental try to pass off compact the size of a VW Golf as "similar". They'll then budge when you point out that the suitcases you've got won't fit in the Golf, and that their own website shows that the VW Passat could fit X amount of large suitcases, but won't fit in the "similar" car. Then it'll turn out that they do actually have a car that a reasonable person would classify as "similar" to the car you booked right there on the lot. They might even have the exact model you booked to begin with! I've also experienced "softer" versions of this where the 5-10 advertised cars in a given "similar" category clearly have 1-2 models that stand out as noticeably cheaper. Guess which models I got every time I rented there? Not something you can/should complain about, since the models all similar to a VW Golf, but cases where it clearly wasn't about inventory management. Instead it's systematic "down-selling" via deceptive advertisement that conveniently omits the proportion of the fleet represented by each "similar" model.
  • pkulak 5y ago
    Yup, this happened to me all the time. My family of four will always rent the minivan, which will inevitably be swapped for some SUV. All you have to say is that you don't want the SUV, you want a minivan, but it's annoying to have to go through the charade every time.
    • b112 5y ago
      Typically this is called a "upgrade", eg, "We upgraded you for free!" Gee, thanks.
  • dnautics 5y ago
    I had the opposite problem, I always reserve a small four door fuel sedan, and several times they upselled me an SUV or sports car "at no cost". Well I don't like driving big or fast cars and I want good fuel economy since I'm driving 100+ miles. That's a real cost!! No can do. One time, I took the fast car because TINA and didn't notice how light the pedal was on a downhill section of the freeway and got a speeding ticket. So that "free upsell" cost me $350.
• nobodyandproud 5y ago
  I always assumed there was a penalty for not showing up. I may be in the naive minority, however.
  • toast0 5y ago
    You can often make a reservation without providing billing information, so there's no mechanism to enforce a payment for no-show. If you prepay for the rental it's different, but there may also be a significant discount.
    • nobodyandproud 5y ago
      That’s both interesting and unfortunate. I do feel the remaining rental car businesses could live past their reluctance to enforce a partial reservation payment. A single day’s payment (for, say, one week’s rental) I feel is reasonable or $50.00. Especially if it means better service, better cars, and a more consistent experience. However, I only rent for vacations and I may be blind to the what the average renter demands/expects.
• waynecochran 5y ago
  Why still use the term "reservation" then since that is not what it is? e.g., call it a "booking" or something...
  • markdown 5y ago
    That's no better, at least in my part of the world. Reservation = booking.
• jliptzin 5y ago
  And what is the reason for every agent seemingly needing to rewrite the computer operating system in assembly for each new customer that approaches the kiosk? Seriously why does it take 30+ min to gather someone's basic information, sign a few forms and hand them the keys?
  • vmarsy 5y ago
    It might be network slowness, one day at the rental counter all the paperwork had to be done by hand (and visa contacted by phone to process payment) because their system was down. It took a literal hour. The terminal was unresponsive and displaying the following error: "cannot connect to mainframe" (This was in 2019).
  • deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  • antsar 5y ago
    One guess, from recent experience at Enterprise: so that you're nice and exhausted by the time they quickly flip to the signatures page, which is your first and last chance to catch whatever bullshit fees they tacked on. That was a $100+ lesson, and my credit card sided w/ Enterprise when I tried to dispute (because of course, my signature is right there on the contract).
  • toddsiegel 5y ago
    I feel like this too, but only when other people are at the counter. When I’m at the counter the whole thing never seems to take more than a few minutes. It’s always quick, and smooth, and I’m out of there, seemingly, in no time at all. I desperately want to know what other people are saying or doing at the rental car counter.
    • mitigating 5y ago
      They probably didn't rent online
      • ajmurmann 5y ago
• pkulak 5y ago
  I'm not renting cars now, but when I did, I would just find the cheapest middle-tier car I could to reserve. The website always had, for example, a Chrysler 200 and a BMW in the "luxury" tier, the former for half the price, cus it's a POS. But, in my experience, no matter which one you reserve, you're gonna get a random vehicle from the tier (or higher), so might as well save the money.
• james_pm 5y ago
  The reason I have multiple "reservations" and only use one, is because it's quite honestly the only way to ensure I might have a chance at one of them having a car for me. Literally yesterday I showed up at the airport, armed with two reservations for a mid-sized SUV. Neither company had one and both companies were the same parent. I ended up with a smaller car than I "reserved". I would happily pay a non-refundable deposit at the time of making the "reservation" if that meant when I walked up to the counter, they would have the car I want.
  • et2o 5y ago
    Paying ahead of time is often an option now. I just did it.
    • jen20 5y ago
      I did this recently with Hertz in Los Angeles. They still didn’t have a car, and the only recourse was to talk to someone on a phone instead of fixing it at the counter. Also that trip I learned that Los Angeles has a subway, though it’s not particularly good.
• pdonis 5y ago
  > One of the biggest frustrations people have is that it seems impossible to actually get the car you reserved. There is one way to avoid this, at least in my experience: be a business traveler. I've noticed a big difference in speed of service when traveling for business vs. traveling for personal reasons. I suspect that rental car companies know that business reservations are (a) much more reliable in terms of the person actually showing up for the car, and (b) much less likely to be able to change from the specific car type that's been reserved, since that's being determined by some corporation's booking rules rather than an individual's preferences.
  • toast0 5y ago
    You do get better service (very little upselling), but I haven't seen much better in terms of getting the car selected. When travelling for business, I usually book the smallest car available (or the least expensive if it's not the smallest), because it's just me. I've been given three row SUVs and minivans. OTOH, it takes nothing to sign up for the rental company's 'frequent renter' programs and that usually gets you access to a priority counter or line, which can save a lot of time when the regular counter is busy. Usually a car will be waiting for you when you get there, but depends on the facility and the busyness factor.
    • pdonis 5y ago
      > it takes nothing to sign up for the rental company's 'frequent renter' programs and that usually gets you access to a priority counter or line Yes, I've done that with most of the major rental companies, and I agree it does cut down on wait time considerably. My experience has been that the service itself still varies considerably by location (although I've still found it to be better when traveling on business). The vast majority of my rentals have been at airports and it's very hard to predict which ones will have better service; I've had very bad experiences at large airports where you would think they would have the process down pat, and good experiences at smaller airports.
      • com2kid 5y ago
        I've had good luck explicitly not renting at airports. Airport rentals often cost more, some airports charge an additional fee to rental car agencies who then pass that on to the customer, and I'll often have an easier time getting the car I want at a medium sized lot.
• HALtheWise 5y ago
  It seems like this would be a relatively easy thing to make optional, along the lines of "pay ahead for a gauraunteed car (no refund)". Customers that want to pay at the counter can still do so, but will be competing for cars with any other customers that didn't pay ahead.
• mbg721 5y ago
  As with many things related to travel, most of the time it works and nobody really cares, some smaller percentage of the time it's an inconvenience customers will grumble about but put up with, and then very occasionally it's a deal-breaking experience. If you don't travel that often, chances are you had a bunch of "it just worked" experiences and maybe one or two "grumbly inconvenience" ones.
• la6471 5y ago
  Well that opens up a niche to actually start a rental car business called “Real Reservations” and charge extra for actually reserving the car the customer is willing to pay extra premium for.
  • et2o 5y ago
    You could actually offer discounts and still come out ahead, likely far ahead as you’d be both guaranteeing a car and offering a cheaper car. Win-win, you just lose the terrible customers acting unethically.
• tokumei 5y ago
  What about in the case where you pay online in full with a credit card? I did that for my last trip, and I got the exact car that I reserved.
  • xeromal 5y ago
    Which company lets you pick a car model?
    • et2o 5y ago
      Sixt
      • xeromal 5y ago
        Thanks! What a strange name. Haha
• HWR_14 5y ago
  You left out a giant source of the unknown - return times.
• MrFoof 5y ago
  >Seinfeld even has a whole schtick about this - why is it called a "reservation" if it's not actually....a reservation? The kicker is that episode actually aired just over 30 years ago (December 4th, 1991).
• richardw 5y ago
  Offer option of a reservation, maybe at extra fee. Pay if you cancel within 24h. Now clients have an option. Some might really want an X and be willing to pay a slight premium.
  • et2o 5y ago
    They actually are going the other way and offering discounts for prepayment since it ensures they will have a customer. The math it pretty easy: if the discount % is < than the no show percentage on regular reservations they’re making money
• ErikVandeWater 5y ago
  > And why don't they do that? Good 'ol competition. Everyone is afraid to start enforcing reservations because if Hertz does but Enterprise doesn't, people are going to book with Enterprise ("Book w/ us and never pay a penalty when your plans change!"). Competition brings out the best solution. The current system is the best overall solution. Most people don't really care what car they rent, and probably sometimes get an upgrade to a better car if they complain about not getting the car they reserved. By having this system, rental car companies can substantially reduce the cost of renting a car. It would be very expensive to intentionally have cars waiting on the lot for upcoming customers.
• danr4 5y ago
  In your opinion why isn't the industry "distrupted"? It seems pretty ripe for a new startup built by industry veterans and with funding to build an app that allows users to rent a car smoothly, manage fleets, keep cars for longer, track them, without all the dark patterns and hidden costs. Am I being an idealist? Are the dark patterns and hidden costs mandatory to become profitable? What are the unit economics preventing from such a thing to exist? Renting car is painful and stressful if you're not a business user (or high tier member). Yeah it seems it'll be pretty rough and capital intensive entering the market, but it seems so obvious that I wonder why there isn't a company like Uber or Airbnb that VCs want to pour money into. Turo would be the obvious comparison but I don't think the same model can apply for cars.
  • tempestn 5y ago
    Isn't Turo disrupting classical car rental?
  • hannob 5y ago
    It kinda is in cities, but the challenge is having a country-wide network. I'm in Germany, which may obviously differ from the US, but here's what I see: In cities new app-based services that are much, much more convenient to use take over. But they're only available in large cities (and even there only in the inner part of the cities). If you need a car from "small city X" to "small city Y" there's simply no company other than Hertz, Europcar and Sixt that can offer you that. And it's hard for any other company to create such a network of locations.
  • llampx 5y ago
    SV Startups have literally written the book on dark patterns, I would not hold my breath expecting them to disrupt an industry and get rid of them. Going by recent threads, it is more likely that you would be cancelled as a customer and still have to pay for your reservation.
  • anonred 5y ago
    Uber and Lyft have car rental options, although the experience between the two differs quite a bit, having used both in the past few months. Uber car rentals is just a proxy for traditional car rental services like Hertz. All the aforementioned problems like reservation flakiness and weird fees applies. On the other hand, Lyft car rentals is operated in-house and feels delightful in comparison. I usually reserve a few days before, take a Lyft to the fleet HQ with the provided credit, and roll out in <10m. Overall a super nice experience both times I’ve used it.
• throwntoday 5y ago
  I've only rented a car a handful of times but it's funny I had that exact experience. Wasn't aware that reservations weren't actually holding the car. In my case they tried to force me to upgrade and when I refused they gave me the upgraded car for the same price as my reserve (~$20 less per day)
• Wowfunhappy 5y ago
  What if you could opt in to a penalty in exchange for being guaranteed the car you reserved? You’d have to find a palatable way to present it to consumers, but that seems surmountable, you’d just need to do some delicate copyrighting.
• kwhitefoot 5y ago
  Surely this doesn't apply at the high end? When I rented a BMW438i a few years ago I would have been severely upset if I had been offered a Toyota Camry instead. Similarly when I rented a rather nice Land Rover. On the other hand I was not especially concerned when I didn't get the Skoda Octavia I had booked on another occasion; I was lucky then, I got a Mercedes C230 instead.
  • taspeotis 5y ago
    I hear of rental car companies having brackets, so you can rent an Audi A4 or alike and they might give you a Kia Stinger.
• spamtarget 5y ago
  lying to everyone's face is certainly not a solution for this problem