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Canada slashes 100% tariffs on Chinese EVs to 6%

452 points by 1970-01-01 10mo ago

mindslight 10mo ago
Another resounding Trump success! No, not of the kayfabe goals that serve as rallying cries for his dwindling band of cultists. But rather success of the goals of our adversaries who helped put Trump in power and seem to primarily inform his policy. (edit to answer the question below, as throttling has set in: China, obviously)
- philipallstar 10mo ago
  > But rather success of the goals of our adversaries who helped put Trump in power and seem to primarily inform his policy. Do you have any specifics? Which adversary of yours wants lower-tariff Chinese EVs in Canada?
  - decremental 10mo ago
    [dead]
- deleted 10mo ago
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spleen7777 10mo ago
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__s 10mo ago
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mCgSmlpC61A https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mCgSmlpC61A CBC "Q&A: Carney takes questions on China trade deal, EVs and security"
dsfdsfdsffdsfs 10mo ago
Good. This could force Tesla's hand to make super cheap EV. Musk and crew know how to make cheap stuff - they've chosen high margin for Tesla however.
- rcpt 10mo ago
  Not good for the brand to chase byd on price
  - lawn 10mo ago
    They've already become a cheaper brand here in Europe.
    - pzduniak 10mo ago
      BYD quite literally matched their prices here with the Seal and both brands offer equally stupidly good deals vs the current interest rate here in Poland. They just can't compete with luxury brands that don't sympathize with fascism. People just don't want to advocate for their own demise.
- probablycorey 10mo ago
  [flagged]
- frogperson 10mo ago
  Id rather it force him into bankruptcy, but i would settle for slimmer margins.
- esafak 10mo ago
  Almost every model they released was cheaper than the last, and that was Musk's open plan.
- bluGill 10mo ago
  I'm hoping brands like Ford, GM, Toyota, ... take notice. The big names that make a lot of cars don't have a cheap option.
- _ea1k 10mo ago
  I don't think it will change anything for Tesla, unless it lowers their costs through lowered tariffs somehow. TBH, Tesla is in a tough position with their EVs in NA. They can't really build a cheap enough crossover/suv to compete directly with ICE RAV4, and virtually anything they do at >$50k would negatively impact their existing product sales. The base Model 3/Y are too expensive compared to ICE and have met tepid reviews because of their slightly odd mix of price and features. So they've chosen instead to focus on autonomy and car hiring. I can't blame them for that. There's a huge potential for recurring revenue in that space and they've been positioning themselves to be in an excellent position to capture a lot of it over the next five years.
ortusdux 10mo ago
"Canada has agreed to allow an annual quota of 49,000 Chinese electric vehicles into the country at the tariff rate of just 6.1%" https://electricautonomy.ca/data-trackers/ev-sales-data/2025-12-16/statscan-q3-2025-ev-sales-canada/ https://electricautonomy.ca/data-trackers/ev-sales-data/2025... "Canada recorded 45,366 new zero-emission vehicle registrations in Q3 2025, accounting for 9.4 per cent of all new vehicle registrations in the quarter, according to the latest report from Statistics Canada." "Of the total, 26,792 units were battery-electric vehicles (BEVs), while 18,574 were plug-in hybrid electric vehicles (PHEVs). " So this would represent about 1/4 of current annual EV sales.
- Jeff_Brown 10mo ago
  In a country with 42 million inhabitants this doesn't seem like a big change even for canada, let alone for the global economy.
  - justonceokay 10mo ago
    It’s a complete sea change. I feel Canada only set tariffs on cars out of some deference to the US auto industry. I don’t want to use slippery slope thinking, but this to me smells like rolling out a Canadian auto market that is not dependent on the US. For the average family, being able to spend significantly less on a car is a big deal.
    - mkozlows 10mo ago
      Keep in mind that the US auto industry is also very much a Canadian one. A lot of Big Three stuff happens across the border in Ontario. But all the policy support that would have let North American automakers build up a competitive position with China is gone, so this is more about just acknowledging reality now.
      - justonceokay 10mo ago
        Yeah there was never any competing with china, our industry just relies on our market using different values to purchase a car. It’s tough to convince most price-inelastic people they shouldn’t buy a car that is 1/2 price, even if it has fewer features. Edit: to be clear I meant that the US did not compete, not that they could not compete
bawolff 10mo ago
I guess we are still tarrifing solar panels though :(
daedrdev 10mo ago
Its only the first 50K that get 6%, still pretty interesting as being physically so close to the US could cause people in the US to get their first look at Chinese cars. Chinese car companies face far more ruthless competition than western ones so could end up making better cars as a result, imo. There are over 100 brands in china selling electric cars
- HNisCIS 10mo ago
  This x1000, I hope this really turns the screws on the US manufacturers, they need to hurt.
  - irishcoffee 10mo ago
    I suppose you realize the people running those manufacturing companies won't be hurt much at all, everyone who scrapes by trying to making a living work for them will hurt a lot when they get fired.
    - daedrdev 10mo ago
      The vast majority of US auto jobs have already been lost to automation yet I don't hear you asking for those to come back in exchange for twice as expensive cars. This is these companies own fault. These companies have grown cozy rent seeking with little competition and have completely missed the electrification of cars as a result. Cheaper cars will hurt those workers, but all of society will be better off when one of their largest expenses decreases.
      - irishcoffee 10mo ago
        Nothing gets cheaper. The bullwhip effect everyone kept evangelizing never happened. Between the housing crisis and the covid stimulus I’m not sure why anyone ever expected things to get cheaper, or expects it today.
    - hackable_sand 10mo ago
      This is pure propaganda. Keep doing you, Canada.
ChrisArchitect 10mo ago
Some more discussion: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46647955 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46647955
SecretDreams 10mo ago
This is for about 50k cars a year that are priced about 35k CAD or less. It's a small amount compared to Canada's 2mil car sales a year, but it is quite significant in the message it is delivering to the world about Canada being willing to diversify their economy in the wake of hostility from conventional partners. It'll be quite interesting how normal partners react.
fidotron 10mo ago
What will be interesting are the restrictions on where the BYD vehicles are allowed to go. e.g. https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/news/366599/chinese-evs-banned-uk-military-sites-over-spying-concerns https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/news/366599/chinese-evs-banned...
- flowingfocus 10mo ago
  I'm also curious to see if we will see more "no drive zones". We see this in other domains: I recently talked to someone from an asset inspection (think flying around bridges to check for fractures) company. They can't use DJI drones because of security concerns.
  - fidotron 10mo ago
    What has astounded me about all this is the extent to which so much of our industry fall crisply into one of two groups: 1. Chinese stuff is cheap incompetent rubbish anyway, anyone near it is by definition a loser, so who cares? 2. Chinese stuff is perfect, amazing and we should just stop doing everything and buy what they're selling. They'll totally open factories here and give us jobs too! The actual reality, which people like your asset inspection firm are dealing with, is the Chinese have leapfrogged the west in so many important respects, but to preserve security we have to live in an expensive technological backwater since the leaders of our society are so resistant to internal disruptive competition that may result in other people displacing them.
    - rangestransform 10mo ago
      The security concerns are real, China restricts teslas from driving onto military installations for example. Anyhow, this is what we need data protection laws for, not trade protectionism. Canada should prevent exfiltration of data, not the sale of Chinese EVs in general
gpm 10mo ago
Up to 49,000 vehicles. To put that number in context, in 2024 Candians bought 1,918,861 vehicles of which 264,277 where zero-emissions.
- vdupras 10mo ago
  Yes, it's a modest step, but my guess is that those BYD cars will sell like hot cakes and demand will go through the roof. By popular demand, the government will have to lift that limit. That's all China needs to destroy american car manufacturing.
  - warkdarrior 10mo ago
    > to destroy american car manufacturing American car manufacturing is destroying itself just fine.
  - vkou 10mo ago
    > That's all China needs to destroy american car manufacturing. I don't think China can be held responsible for America voting for Donald Trump, one of whose main goals in life has been the destruction of every trading and soft-power partnership that the US has built over the past 80 years.
  - rjrjrjrj 10mo ago
    The announced limit doesn't seem like enough volume for BYD to roll out a dealership network, but maybe they do it in anticipation of higher limits in the future. Volvo could be an immediate beneficiary. The Canadian EX30 was going to be cheaper because they could make them in China, but after the 100% US/Canada tariff was announced they had to switch to ones produced in Belgium iirc. edit: Something I just read that I haven't seen reported elsewhere is that the imported EVs have to cost $33,000 or less. The EX30 currently starts at about $54,000, so... maybe not.
    - hellgas00 10mo ago
      Ironically one of the biggest beneficiary will likely be Tesla. Before the 100% tarriffs were instated Tesla-Canada imported most of their vehicles from China's Shanghai gigafactory. After the Chinese EV tarriffs they began importing from Germany and some from the US. They already have the footprint and sales depth to take advantage of the low tarriffs rate quickly.
bilsbie 10mo ago
Could an American go up and buy one and drive it back? Any registration or insurance issues?
- 46493168 10mo ago
  Sure. If you want to pay the 247% tarriff, there’s nothing stopping you from doing this. US import duty applies when you cross the border, calculated on the vehicle’s origin (China), not purchase location.
  - HNisCIS 10mo ago
    At that point just don't register it and pay the fines, it'll be cheaper.
    - frankus 10mo ago
      I think the way this would work is you would have your Canadian friend/owner drive it across and then return via another mode of transport. It's entirely possible you could get away with it pretty much indefinitely (especially in an area where folks are used to seeing Canadian plates), but I could also see someone checking a list of "foreign vehicles that entered the US and never left" at some point and one or both of you having some explaining to do (i.e. being ruled inadmissible).
    - fhdkweig 10mo ago
      I can't tell if you are talking about keeping the car in the US or Canada, but I can tell you in the US, you have to register the car. If you don't register the car, they don't just issue fines, they tow and charge daily storage until you register it. And if you don't pay the fines, you never the car back. The state will auction it off and keep the money, and if the auction price is less than the storage fines, they send you a bill for the rest.
  - cactacea 10mo ago
    This is only correct if you're not planning on ever registering the vehicle. And good luck with the paperwork to prove that during import. This is a great way to waste a bunch of money and get your shiny new car crushed
feverzsj 10mo ago
According to Russian users, Chinese EV works poorly in cold climates. I don't think Canadians prefer EVs anyway.
- jerlam 10mo ago
  The vast majority of Canadians live near the US border. The weather is not tropical but it is quite normal compared to a lot of US states and northern Europeans.
- yabones 10mo ago
  There are a massive amount of new EVs in Quebec, which isn't exactly tropical. Part of it is subsidies, $2K for new EV, and $600 for charging. The other thing is the crazy scale of hydroelectric production in that province, some of which gets exported as far as Baltimore. So electricity is very available and reasonably cheap in QC. We'll see how BYD's handle the bone chilling Montreal winters... Unless they're an absolute flop, I can see some fairly solid future prospects. (I live in Ontario, but I've been to Le Belle Province quite a bit ;) ) https://www.quebec.ca/en/transports/electric-transportation/financial-assistance-electric-vehicle/new-vehicle/amount-financial-assistance https://www.quebec.ca/en/transports/electric-transportation/... https://www.quebec.ca/en/transports/electric-transportation/financial-assistance-electric-vehicle/charging/home-charging-station https://www.quebec.ca/en/transports/electric-transportation/... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Bay_Project https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Bay_Project
  - cmrdporcupine 10mo ago
    As an EV driver from Ontario it's amazing crossing over, or even getting close to the border, the EV situation is just so much better. That said, while hate Tesla the company ... I'll take their chargers over the patchwork of various apps & cards I have to install in order to make use of things there. There's a notable absence of Tesla stations there, but a lot of variety of other things and I had bad luck installing half the apps and it was not fun trying to set that all up while standing in the -20C cold in a gas station parking lot while just trying to get to the ski hill.
- deleted 10mo ago
zjsushsb 10mo ago
I’m assuming this is downstream of trumps move in Venezuela? Canada suffers the most from US access to Venezuelan oil. On top of all the prior rhetoric and moves by his admin. What concerns me is why does the west think China is trustworthy? Why are we all fighting one another? Culture is important. China knows this, and is unequivocally Chinese relative to the Europeans.
- mindslight 10mo ago
  > Why are we all fighting one another? Because of the Chinese/Russian asset that got into the highest leadership position of the western world, and is now using that position to create and inflame fighting amongst ourselves. We had it too good, for too long, people got too entitled, became out of touch with what actually made our society great, and our adversaries took advantage of that. As an American, I am truly sorry to all of our allies and friends who didn't even get to vote on the matter.
- vdupras 10mo ago
  Up until a while ago, I'm pretty sure that the consensus was that China not trustworthy. And then, Trump plays his cards and the consensus is now that the US are even less trustworthy. So here you go.
  - palmotea 10mo ago
    > Up until a while ago, I'm pretty sure that the consensus was that China not trustworthy. And then, Trump plays his cards and the consensus is now that the US are even less trustworthy. So here you go. But that doesn't make China trustworthy, which this move implies. It seems like there's some "narcissism of small differences" kind of thing going on here. Trump may not share Canada/Europe's values to the same degree of prior US presidents, but China does not share those values at all and never has. It's really questionable judgement to throw your lot in with China if you're not happy with the leadership of the US.
    - gpm 10mo ago
      We do trade with plenty of people who we don't think are trustworthy (Trump's US, for instance). I don't see that this move implies that China is trustworthy at all.
footy 10mo ago
Good. Carney also remarked our relationship with China is now more predictable with our relationship with the states (wild shade coming from him) just to really make it clear to certain parties why this is happening. Cheaper car options in this country will be nice, and I say this as a certified car hater who's yet to own one despite pushing 40.
- nsmdkdfk 10mo ago
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  - footy 10mo ago
    neither does America, and they're much closer and dangerous to us at this time.
    - chrisco255 10mo ago
      [flagged]
      - footy 10mo ago
        The US is currently threatening multiple of its NATO partners and serious people don't expect NATO to be around by the end of 2028. I am a less serious person I guess, because I expect it to break up within a year. I'm glad you have so many cool 80 year old anecdotes to tell yourself, but things change.
      - rootusrootus 10mo ago
        > The U.S. does NATO and foots the majority of the bill and human resources for North Atlantic defense. That includes Canada For how much longer? NATO won't survive this administration.
      - deleted 10mo ago
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      - ceejayoz 10mo ago
myrmidon 10mo ago
I wonder if this might even be below reasonable "subsidy-compensation" tariff levels. BYD, for reference, got almost 30% of their 2024 income from the Chinese state (~$1.4b). But this is always difficult to judge because most nations help local industry to some degree, and it can be quite difficult to compare.
- adrian_b 10mo ago
  While Americans very frequently complain that the Chinese state subsidizes various industries, I am astonished that they do not see any similarity with the fact that I never heard of any really big investment project in USA, e.g. the building of any new big factory or new company headquarters, that was done otherwise than after receiving very substantial tax reductions of various kinds from the local government of the place chosen for the project. In many parts of Europe those kinds of tax reductions would be illegal, being considered a form of state aid for a private company.
  - epolanski 10mo ago
    And yet virtually all European lawmakers get $ from governments threatening to cut jobs. Many countries actively lose money for those jobs, Serbia is an example. They go to extreme lengths to underbid competition for stellantis factories and get a net negative impact. If you can't survive without taxpayers paying the bills, just die ffs.
- z2 10mo ago
  In comparison with Musk's companies ($15 billion in 2023, $7b in 2024), this seems to be a pittance. https://www.congress.gov/119/meeting/house/117956/documents/HMKP-119-JU00-20250226-SD003.pdf https://www.congress.gov/119/meeting/house/117956/documents/...
  - myrmidon 10mo ago
    This is exactly why its so hard to compare though; government contracts, emission credits and direct subsidies are all quite different and weighting them is highly subjective.
kingstnap 10mo ago
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- deleted 10mo ago
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- SECProto 10mo ago
  > It's for just 50k vehicles, which means that the first 50k that get sent will be all Luxury high margin electric vehicles. [...] Why would anyone use there quota for cheap stuff? If you find a better primary source, you'll see that the lower price vehicles are the only thing allowed at the low tariff rate: The deal covers vehicles priced at $33,000 or less, and other cars sold at that price are already manufactured offshore https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/livestory/canada-china-electric-vehicles-canola-trade-deal-carney-xi-9.7048058?ts=1768574721727 https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/livestory/canada-china-elec...
nik282000 10mo ago
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- dpc050505 10mo ago
  China isn't threatening to invade Canada. The neighbours to the south that have similar software in our military planes are.
- originalvichy 10mo ago
  I have never before felt pressured about what I can or cannot protest about in Europe by China, but I can’t say the same about our most powerful ally, who has threatened every sector of our society – political or non-political – with consequences if we do not act and speak as they do. China absolutely does not care about our society the same way as that.
- dawnerd 10mo ago
  No different than American companies or European companies. With the US having Palantir in their pocket…
  - adamiscool8 10mo ago
    The accountability and scale are hugely different to the point I don’t see how anyone can make this argument in good faith.
    - tokai 10mo ago
      Are you following the news? Canada is the target of a trade war from the US right now.
    - dorkypunk 10mo ago
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Room_641A https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Room_641A
- tokai 10mo ago
  All that goes for US EVs too. And China hasn't threaten with annexation.
zombiwoof 10mo ago
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czhu12 10mo ago
This new direction of "strategic autonomy", with Donald Trump in the white house just south of the border seems like a difficult hill to occupy. Unfortunately, this is probably what is necessary at this point.
- TheBlight 10mo ago
  Isn't it somewhat laughable when something like 3/4 of Canadian exports are to the US?
  - boringg 10mo ago
    I think that Canada has to de-leverage trade with the US is what the take away should be. Not that this trade deal itself is going to change all the balances -- its that there are other players who can start to trade - reducing dependence on the US. The compounding effects are damaging as are switching costs.
    - TheBlight 10mo ago
      What it looks like to me is that Carney the businessman is trying to work for the best terms in an eventual annexation scenario.
      - boringg 10mo ago
        Trolls be trolls.
        TheBlight 10mo ago
        Bookmark it.
      - LunaSea 10mo ago
        He should negotiate directly with Putin then instead of Trump the middle-man
  - 10mo ago
etchalon 10mo ago
Our not-so-great leader's not-so-great trade policies continue to have not-so-great results for the US.
threethirtytwo 10mo ago
Are BYD cars really subsidized or is that a bunch of BS?
- rootusrootus 10mo ago
  Yes, BYD is tightly intertwined with the CCP and gets a lot of subsidies, grants, favorable loans, etc.
  - standardUser 10mo ago
    Yes, following an almost cookie-cutter-like pattern of emerging economies protecting and supporting their auto industries.
    - taneliv 10mo ago
      I feel like that is not specific to emerging economies.
      - rootusrootus 10mo ago
        Given their war manufacturing ability, I expect any govt to support the industry to some extent. I think that China is additionally doing it to strategically weaken their rivals. Both for economic as well as military objectives.
- maxglute 10mo ago
  PRC just underpricing competitors is frankly retarded cope at this point, the reality is PRC industrial policy also simply permanently drives structural costs down. They're not spending billions in pork barrel jobs program that need reoccurring injections that rarely prioritize manufacturing efficiency. Pretty much every industry where PRC took the value-engineer hammer (initially with subsidies) has stayed cheap (eventually without subsidies). Like it's been 20 years, PRC competitiveness hallowed out a lot of western industrial base already, but their goods remains cheap. They're not subsidizing in perpetuity, their manufacturing is just stupid efficient and producers are willing to live on less margins because before even competing with western incumbents, they're competing with other Chinese competitors foremost and it just so happens survivors of PRC involution is by process of elimination, the most competitive.
Tiktaalik 10mo ago
I expect that this relatively small quota is a good faith opening the door to Chinese product but the main core goal will be deeper, comprehensive Chinese investment, such as securing BYD/NIO/etc car factories in Ontario.
rootusrootus 10mo ago
The US government has really handled this poorly. Let's take one of our closest allies and push them into the arms of our biggest rival. All while helping boost that rival's total exports to record numbers. And boosting their universities to top positions in world rankings. Just brilliant, guys. "Make America Great Again" sure seems like it was intentionally tongue-in-cheek.
- epolanski 10mo ago
  The exports argument is so bloated. US has thrived economically for 5 decades after becoming an import economy. This whole export/import balance is such a lame reasoning...yes you've spent a certain amount of $...and got plenty of stuff in exchange. In the words of some economist I've read "by Trump's reasoning my barber is also taking advantage of me because I cut my hair every month and he never buys anything from me". Last but not least, services are never included in these trade balance arguments. How much money flows to US through their financial and IT services alone...?
  - vannevar 10mo ago
    The trade deficit argument is mostly nonsense, but it's being made disingenuously anyway so the actual merit doesn't really matter to the people making it. Trump is a big fan of tariffs because they give him negotiating leverage to make deals beneficial to his own interests and those of his cronies. There is no national interest involved, this is an administration devoted purely to grift. Any benefit to the country is purely accidental.
  - pstuart 10mo ago
    The trade balance as a number shouldn't matter, but offshoring critical manufacturing capability and production ecosystems does. China has at least 2 key advantages in manufacturing -- cheaper labor and laxer regulations. If the US were to embrace and extend robotics and automation more vigorously that first point could become moot. Also the second point as far as labor regulations go, and if environmental regulations were properly priced then that too would be moot.
ZeroGravitas 10mo ago
It makes more sense if you assume Trump is being paid off by China. I'm not saying that's happening, just that it makes more sense than this chaotic self-destruction of the American empire.
- hungryhobbit 10mo ago
  That is complete and utter conspiracy hogwash! Who believes in such total nonsense ... ... everyone knows Trump is being blackmailed by Russia ;-)
throw0101d 10mo ago
A Canadian satire site has the headline "Canada chooses lawful evil over chaotic evil": * https://thebeaverton.com/2026/01/canada-chooses-lawful-evil-over-chaotic-evil/ https://thebeaverton.com/2026/01/canada-chooses-lawful-evil-... * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alignment_(Dungeons_%26_Dragons) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alignment_(Dungeons_%26_Dragon... Edit: A comment in /r/canada: > TBF I would much rather work for Lex Luthor than The Joker if I had to choose one.
- deleted 10mo ago
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- pixl97 10mo ago
  That first link is a back button capturer.
  - slumberlust 10mo ago
    I didn't have any issues. Running FF w/ UblockO and Privacy Badger.
- choppypoofart 10mo ago
  As an American I'm rooting for everyone else these days. Good for Canada. I hope the EU builds stronger trade with China too and America gets left in the cold to whither and die. Trump, Vance, Miller, Noem, Musk, Bezos all of them just forgotten about and completely irrelevant to the rest of the world.
  - klipklop 10mo ago
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    - mywittyname 10mo ago
      Politics gets people talking.
    - choppypoofart 10mo ago
shevy-java 10mo ago
Canadians are incredibly pissed at Trump and his criminal TechBros. This change here is largely due to that. Trump threatening invasion of Greenland is also aimed against Canada; the USA would have more and more military bases threatening Canada, so Trump's anti-Greenland policy is heavily aimed at threatening Canada rather than China or Russia. One can see how he helps Putin versus Ukraine - one can not trust Trump.
deleted 10mo ago
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ugh123 10mo ago
The result of another self-own by the Trump administration.
deleted 10mo ago
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Waterluvian 10mo ago
A few assorted thoughts: - I'm still not over how great it feels to have confidence that Carney has a strong understanding of the economics of these political manouvers. Not only is he not a !@#$ing moron, he's a deeply experience economist more than he's a politician. - Stratification of trading partners is nothing but good. - This feels like safe toe-dip. Both sides have agreed to terms that are temporary, meaning there is no surprise rug-pull moment. Which is something the Americans are using more and more to keep everyone so !@#$ing wound up. - This could be a long-term play for China: establish a presence in the North American auto market. The U.S. is right there. (Watch the Americans ban Chinese EVs from border crossing) - Even better long-term play: establish North American manufacturing. How about Ontario builds Japanese and Chinese cars, turns CAMI and others into a Roshel or other military vehicle plant, and says good riddance to the American auto makers that have been rug-pulling long before Trump got into politics. - A great opportunity to start improving trade lines for Canola. Possibly a trial balloon for other primary and secondary resources? - Canada cannot stand on its own geopolitically. We must be closely tied to a major power. Intuitively that choice is the EU But I fear that China can move much faster and we'll find ourselves de-facto in their sphere while the EU is still debating this and that.
- 0xTJ 10mo ago
  I don't love that Carney is relatively conservative-leaning for being Liberal, but I do really appreciate the fact that he's professional, competent, and stable. He speaks like (what I see as) a regular person and he's not there to whip supporters into fervent chanting. I'm absolutely relieved that Poilievre didn't win the election (or his original seat). Setting aside just how far to the right he is, I've heard him described as an idiot both by another MP and by someone (who is himself pretty conservative) who met him at some social event.
  - rssoconnor 10mo ago
    I'm pretty sure Carney is a Progressive Conservative.
    - k12sosse 10mo ago
lenerdenator 10mo ago
Money talks, actual values walk. Always. I get that this is seen as a "practical" move north-of-the-border, but understand, this is the kind of move that guys like Trump, Putin, and Xi all require. They want this kind of thing to happen, because it shows the real issue was never one of democratic values and human rights. If Canadians valued that then their PM wouldn't be inking a deal with China in response to what Trump is doing. There would be some sort of deal with Europe, perhaps, but not China. The next time the Canadian government brings up some sort of issue with the treatment of Canadians by ICE or some other kind of issue, you can bet that the horse trading will involve a reference to the fact that this deal happened. That's already more-or-less the rationale in Trump's dealings with Europe: for all of the complaining about Russia as a threat or the sanctity of NATO and how the Greenland affair threatens all of that, there was a solid 15-year-long run where the continent was more than happy to buy petroleum products off the Russians while ignoring escalating human rights violations in Russia along with incursions into South Ossetia and the Donbas. He picks up on these sorts of deals as hypocrisy based in realpolitik, and will exploit it.
- fritzorino 10mo ago
  Trump doesn't care about values at all, he cares about money more than anyone else does. I find it laughable you can even talk about values whilst having that main in charge of your country. And so what if he turns around and goes "ha your values are worthless". Trump is a literal paedophile and a literal rapist. Why should we accept being brow beat by such a man? So? We're moving on without you.
  - lenerdenator 10mo ago
    > Trump doesn't care about values at all, he cares about money more than anyone else does. That's exactly what I'm saying. He's going to use this sort of deal as an example to Canadians that when it all comes down to it, they're no better than he is. He's going to say that you're perfectly fine talking trade deals with authoritarians who are literally abducting Chinese nationals on Canadian soil and doing God-knows-what with them [0], so long as the money is right. [0] https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/rcmp-chinese-police-stations-1.6862336 https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/rcmp-chinese-police-st...
PeterStuer 10mo ago
Wouldn't them creating artificial scarcity be just another way to keep prices at the same level as tarrifs, but with the huge margins going to the private sector instead of the public?
- epolanski 10mo ago
  This will likely happen indeed. There will be a huge mark up from dealerships and not enough volume to prompt for pricing competition.
DefundPortland 10mo ago
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vannevar 10mo ago
Trump is binding US automakers tightly to the fossil fuel industry, which at this point in history is like tying a boat anchor to a drowning man.
ck2 10mo ago
Have they solved the cold weather vs lithium charge leak problem? And whatever happened to that mysterious one-day $50 million in tesla rebates?
markvdb 10mo ago
The Mercosur-EU trade deal, the India-EU trade deal and this China-Canada trade deal. A pattern perhaps? A frantic search for reliable trade partnerships, or just random noise?
- deleted 10mo ago
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- barbazoo 10mo ago
  Mercosur-EU trade deal was agreed 2019 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EU%E2%80%93Mercosur_Association_Agreement https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EU%E2%80%93Mercosur_Associatio... India-EU have deepened ties since long ago too https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/India%E2%80%93European_Union_relations https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/India%E2%80%93European_Union_r...
  - jaredklewis 10mo ago
    > Mercosur-EU trade deal was agreed 2019 Sure the details were negotiated in 2019, but it isn't even in effect yet. It still needs to be approved by legislative bodies on both sides of the Atlantic. Which will probably happen sometime this year.
seydor 10mo ago
Globalization always wins
diego_moita 10mo ago
Good! The less we depend on Trumpistan the better.
guywithahat 10mo ago
This feels like a poor long-term play for a short term political win. Canada has a robust automotive supply industry to US auto manufacturers, and this industry could be in long-term risk in an attempt to hurt relations with freer, traditionally more conservative nations. It’s not a shock but it is always disappointing to see major political decisions made for the benefit of the next election cycle.
- jackling 10mo ago
  I largely agree, but there are conflicting goals which makes it hard to evaluate if this really is a bad long-term play. Canada has environmental commitments, and giving the population access to cheap EVs will help meet those goals. I don't think this decision is just a short-term political win, there is potential for it to help with the longer term vision of Canada. But I do agree, this is bad for the local automotive industry in Canada.
- cmrdporcupine 10mo ago
  The message here is that western Canadian agricultural & energy interests are of potential more strategic value than a dying technically backwards auto sector led by three moribund regressive manufacturers who have shown their willingness to show their belly to Trump anyways. As an Ontarian, I'm saddened. But I don't think the Big3 deserve anymore state support. They've pushed it too far. Just earlier this week they were running editorials against the gov't on EV mandates. Again. Ok, here you go. Don't want to make EVs? Only want to sell giant Canyoneros? It's ok. China will service that market. Have fun becoming irrelevant. If consumers really don't want EVs, like they said earlier in the week, then there's nothing to fear. Right? Right?
  - maxglute 10mo ago
    More that Ontario auto is projected to have no value since Trump has explicitly signaled he wants to kill Canadian auto and reshore to US. If Ontario auto is going, no sense in losing also agriculture especially if oil also going in 5-10 years if VZ ever works to US favor. The only hedge is to save Canadian auto is hoping for some sort PRC JV where Canadian plants keep some jobs and grab some margins, possibly a lot of margins (i.e. no truly cheap EVs) since PRC inputs cheap. Best case scenario is Canada has meaningfully cheaper EVs, but not Chinese cheap, get to hold onto some auto work, have access to worlds largest ag buyer, maybe free up an extra million barrels of oil to export since US will want VZ heavy instead of WCS from Alberta. Although US has many other ways to punish Canada.
dcarmo 10mo ago
In case you're not aware, Chinese cars have the same or even better quality than US, European and Japanese cars. Their electric vehicles are cheap and high quality, it's really impressive.
- gligorot 10mo ago
  Source on this? I mean I’d like this to be true, but for brands that are younger than a 30yo Corolla (thats still running), its a big statement to make.
maxglute 10mo ago
PRC slashed tariffs on Canadian ag in reciprocation, which unlike Canada on PRC EVs is uncapped. Meanwhile EV cap only raises based on PRC auto investments and plenty of ways US can throw cold water on that. Either way, this more bargaining chip for Canada vs USMCA renegotiation next year. Like it would be nice to get chinese EVs, or even shoring some of their manufacturing in CA to keep auto sector going, but I wouldn't hold my breath on it being geopolitically sustainable. Imagine US flexes, PRC pulls out, and early adopters get screwed.
zmmmmm 10mo ago
The battle is already lost as far as China owning the future markets for EVs and probably energy in general. It doesn't seem conceivable anybody else could match their scale, efficiency and technology advantages. If you're going to fight economically, might as well do it in areas that aren't (a) a lost cause (b) going to hurt you economically since you'll have to settle for worse and more expensive products and (c) the alternative supplier's country isn't threatening to literally invade you and surrounding nations.
constantcrying 10mo ago
Which just means that most new cars in Canada will be made in China and that this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automotive_industry_in_Canada https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automotive_industry_in_Canada will soon be a thing of the past. No country can compete with China on even footing in regards to car manufacturing, despite the frequent denials, they offer extremely good products, at costs no European or American company can compete with.
tw04 10mo ago
This is what happens when you abandon your allies and soft power. The US is about to find out that their economy isn't capable of surviving in 2026 without the soft power they've had since WWII. Steven Miller is also about to find out that, no you can't just "take what you want" and expect the rest of the world to do nothing.
- timeon 10mo ago
  > when you abandon your allies Threatening is worse than just "abandon".
- hashstring 10mo ago
  Thanks to the kleptrocrats and oligarchs… sold ya sold ya sold ya.
- deleted 10mo ago
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- k12sosse 10mo ago
  "There is only one thing worse than fighting with allies, and that is fighting without them" - Jean Luc Picard
Beijinger 10mo ago
I am not sure this is a good move. They have the option to align closer with the EU. But let's see. Canada may also break apart: https://globalnews.ca/news/11615147/alberta-separatists-praise-turnout-petition-signing/ https://globalnews.ca/news/11615147/alberta-separatists-prai...
- iOsiris 10mo ago
  The is is literally just the fringe influencing politics. The majority of Albertans do not support this.
frenchman_in_ny 10mo ago
Interesting - will this open a back door to having Chinese EVs on US roads? I would assume some sort of kei truck loopholes would have to be found to solve state-level registration or insurance requirements.
m463 10mo ago
I remember renting a house once and the gas water heater went out. The landlord replaced it... with another cheap-ass gas water heater with a pilot light. "they're more reliable" he said maybe he's right, but it definitely used more gas which he didn't pay for. EDIT: oh wait, we had a gas heater problem too. It wouldn't heat the house. (same landlord) When the service guy came over, he tried working on it, but eventually threw a huge fit. <LandLord> this is a piece of crap, it is the original heater from the house, too old and decrepit to get going again. You just have to replace it. I think the service guy was actually a decent, upstanding guy and he knew what he was doing. Landlord put in a new heating system, and lo and behold... the house actually got warm easily and the gas bill dropped over half.
ndjeosibfb 10mo ago
what’s with all the pro china propaganda on here lately
mbfg 10mo ago
Is there anything stopping americans buying chinese EVs in canada and bringing them home?
lgxz 10mo ago
That’s reasonable because China never threatened to invade Canada.
amai 10mo ago
Don't trust China. China is asshole!
ScampMichael 10mo ago
Canada can tell Trump to keep his stolen oil.
Stancyhd8 9mo ago
Hire a hacker for review Henryclarkethicalhacker @ gmail com. They offer services like ( phone hack, GPS track, facebook recovery, delete criminal record, whatsApp recovery, retrieve lost wallet and many more.

452 points by 1970-01-01 10mo ago

Another resounding Trump success! No, not of the kayfabe goals that serve as rallying cries for his dwindling band of cultists. But rather success of the goals of our adversaries who helped put Trump in power and seem to primarily inform his policy. (edit to answer the question below, as throttling has set in: China, obviously)

philipallstar 10mo ago
> But rather success of the goals of our adversaries who helped put Trump in power and seem to primarily inform his policy. Do you have any specifics? Which adversary of yours wants lower-tariff Chinese EVs in Canada?
- decremental 10mo ago
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deleted 10mo ago
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spleen7777 10mo ago

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__s 10mo ago

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mCgSmlpC61A https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mCgSmlpC61A CBC "Q&A: Carney takes questions on China trade deal, EVs and security"

dsfdsfdsffdsfs 10mo ago

Good. This could force Tesla's hand to make super cheap EV. Musk and crew know how to make cheap stuff - they've chosen high margin for Tesla however.

rcpt 10mo ago
Not good for the brand to chase byd on price
- lawn 10mo ago
  They've already become a cheaper brand here in Europe.
  - pzduniak 10mo ago
    BYD quite literally matched their prices here with the Seal and both brands offer equally stupidly good deals vs the current interest rate here in Poland. They just can't compete with luxury brands that don't sympathize with fascism. People just don't want to advocate for their own demise.
probablycorey 10mo ago
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frogperson 10mo ago
Id rather it force him into bankruptcy, but i would settle for slimmer margins.
esafak 10mo ago
Almost every model they released was cheaper than the last, and that was Musk's open plan.
bluGill 10mo ago
I'm hoping brands like Ford, GM, Toyota, ... take notice. The big names that make a lot of cars don't have a cheap option.
_ea1k 10mo ago
I don't think it will change anything for Tesla, unless it lowers their costs through lowered tariffs somehow. TBH, Tesla is in a tough position with their EVs in NA. They can't really build a cheap enough crossover/suv to compete directly with ICE RAV4, and virtually anything they do at >$50k would negatively impact their existing product sales. The base Model 3/Y are too expensive compared to ICE and have met tepid reviews because of their slightly odd mix of price and features. So they've chosen instead to focus on autonomy and car hiring. I can't blame them for that. There's a huge potential for recurring revenue in that space and they've been positioning themselves to be in an excellent position to capture a lot of it over the next five years.

ortusdux 10mo ago

"Canada has agreed to allow an annual quota of 49,000 Chinese electric vehicles into the country at the tariff rate of just 6.1%" https://electricautonomy.ca/data-trackers/ev-sales-data/2025-12-16/statscan-q3-2025-ev-sales-canada/ https://electricautonomy.ca/data-trackers/ev-sales-data/2025... "Canada recorded 45,366 new zero-emission vehicle registrations in Q3 2025, accounting for 9.4 per cent of all new vehicle registrations in the quarter, according to the latest report from Statistics Canada." "Of the total, 26,792 units were battery-electric vehicles (BEVs), while 18,574 were plug-in hybrid electric vehicles (PHEVs). " So this would represent about 1/4 of current annual EV sales.

Jeff_Brown 10mo ago
In a country with 42 million inhabitants this doesn't seem like a big change even for canada, let alone for the global economy.
- justonceokay 10mo ago
  It’s a complete sea change. I feel Canada only set tariffs on cars out of some deference to the US auto industry. I don’t want to use slippery slope thinking, but this to me smells like rolling out a Canadian auto market that is not dependent on the US. For the average family, being able to spend significantly less on a car is a big deal.
  - mkozlows 10mo ago
    Keep in mind that the US auto industry is also very much a Canadian one. A lot of Big Three stuff happens across the border in Ontario. But all the policy support that would have let North American automakers build up a competitive position with China is gone, so this is more about just acknowledging reality now.
    - justonceokay 10mo ago
      Yeah there was never any competing with china, our industry just relies on our market using different values to purchase a car. It’s tough to convince most price-inelastic people they shouldn’t buy a car that is 1/2 price, even if it has fewer features. Edit: to be clear I meant that the US did not compete, not that they could not compete

bawolff 10mo ago

I guess we are still tarrifing solar panels though :(

daedrdev 10mo ago

Its only the first 50K that get 6%, still pretty interesting as being physically so close to the US could cause people in the US to get their first look at Chinese cars. Chinese car companies face far more ruthless competition than western ones so could end up making better cars as a result, imo. There are over 100 brands in china selling electric cars

HNisCIS 10mo ago
This x1000, I hope this really turns the screws on the US manufacturers, they need to hurt.
- irishcoffee 10mo ago
  I suppose you realize the people running those manufacturing companies won't be hurt much at all, everyone who scrapes by trying to making a living work for them will hurt a lot when they get fired.
  - daedrdev 10mo ago
    The vast majority of US auto jobs have already been lost to automation yet I don't hear you asking for those to come back in exchange for twice as expensive cars. This is these companies own fault. These companies have grown cozy rent seeking with little competition and have completely missed the electrification of cars as a result. Cheaper cars will hurt those workers, but all of society will be better off when one of their largest expenses decreases.
    - irishcoffee 10mo ago
      Nothing gets cheaper. The bullwhip effect everyone kept evangelizing never happened. Between the housing crisis and the covid stimulus I’m not sure why anyone ever expected things to get cheaper, or expects it today.
  - hackable_sand 10mo ago
    This is pure propaganda. Keep doing you, Canada.

ChrisArchitect 10mo ago

Some more discussion: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46647955 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46647955

SecretDreams 10mo ago

This is for about 50k cars a year that are priced about 35k CAD or less. It's a small amount compared to Canada's 2mil car sales a year, but it is quite significant in the message it is delivering to the world about Canada being willing to diversify their economy in the wake of hostility from conventional partners. It'll be quite interesting how normal partners react.

fidotron 10mo ago

What will be interesting are the restrictions on where the BYD vehicles are allowed to go. e.g. https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/news/366599/chinese-evs-banned-uk-military-sites-over-spying-concerns https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/news/366599/chinese-evs-banned...

flowingfocus 10mo ago
I'm also curious to see if we will see more "no drive zones". We see this in other domains: I recently talked to someone from an asset inspection (think flying around bridges to check for fractures) company. They can't use DJI drones because of security concerns.
- fidotron 10mo ago
  What has astounded me about all this is the extent to which so much of our industry fall crisply into one of two groups: 1. Chinese stuff is cheap incompetent rubbish anyway, anyone near it is by definition a loser, so who cares? 2. Chinese stuff is perfect, amazing and we should just stop doing everything and buy what they're selling. They'll totally open factories here and give us jobs too! The actual reality, which people like your asset inspection firm are dealing with, is the Chinese have leapfrogged the west in so many important respects, but to preserve security we have to live in an expensive technological backwater since the leaders of our society are so resistant to internal disruptive competition that may result in other people displacing them.
  - rangestransform 10mo ago
    The security concerns are real, China restricts teslas from driving onto military installations for example. Anyhow, this is what we need data protection laws for, not trade protectionism. Canada should prevent exfiltration of data, not the sale of Chinese EVs in general

gpm 10mo ago

Up to 49,000 vehicles. To put that number in context, in 2024 Candians bought 1,918,861 vehicles of which 264,277 where zero-emissions.

vdupras 10mo ago
Yes, it's a modest step, but my guess is that those BYD cars will sell like hot cakes and demand will go through the roof. By popular demand, the government will have to lift that limit. That's all China needs to destroy american car manufacturing.
- warkdarrior 10mo ago
  > to destroy american car manufacturing American car manufacturing is destroying itself just fine.
- vkou 10mo ago
  > That's all China needs to destroy american car manufacturing. I don't think China can be held responsible for America voting for Donald Trump, one of whose main goals in life has been the destruction of every trading and soft-power partnership that the US has built over the past 80 years.
- rjrjrjrj 10mo ago
  The announced limit doesn't seem like enough volume for BYD to roll out a dealership network, but maybe they do it in anticipation of higher limits in the future. Volvo could be an immediate beneficiary. The Canadian EX30 was going to be cheaper because they could make them in China, but after the 100% US/Canada tariff was announced they had to switch to ones produced in Belgium iirc. edit: Something I just read that I haven't seen reported elsewhere is that the imported EVs have to cost $33,000 or less. The EX30 currently starts at about $54,000, so... maybe not.
  - hellgas00 10mo ago
    Ironically one of the biggest beneficiary will likely be Tesla. Before the 100% tarriffs were instated Tesla-Canada imported most of their vehicles from China's Shanghai gigafactory. After the Chinese EV tarriffs they began importing from Germany and some from the US. They already have the footprint and sales depth to take advantage of the low tarriffs rate quickly.

bilsbie 10mo ago

Could an American go up and buy one and drive it back? Any registration or insurance issues?

46493168 10mo ago
Sure. If you want to pay the 247% tarriff, there’s nothing stopping you from doing this. US import duty applies when you cross the border, calculated on the vehicle’s origin (China), not purchase location.
- HNisCIS 10mo ago
  At that point just don't register it and pay the fines, it'll be cheaper.
  - frankus 10mo ago
    I think the way this would work is you would have your Canadian friend/owner drive it across and then return via another mode of transport. It's entirely possible you could get away with it pretty much indefinitely (especially in an area where folks are used to seeing Canadian plates), but I could also see someone checking a list of "foreign vehicles that entered the US and never left" at some point and one or both of you having some explaining to do (i.e. being ruled inadmissible).
  - fhdkweig 10mo ago
    I can't tell if you are talking about keeping the car in the US or Canada, but I can tell you in the US, you have to register the car. If you don't register the car, they don't just issue fines, they tow and charge daily storage until you register it. And if you don't pay the fines, you never the car back. The state will auction it off and keep the money, and if the auction price is less than the storage fines, they send you a bill for the rest.
- cactacea 10mo ago
  This is only correct if you're not planning on ever registering the vehicle. And good luck with the paperwork to prove that during import. This is a great way to waste a bunch of money and get your shiny new car crushed

feverzsj 10mo ago

According to Russian users, Chinese EV works poorly in cold climates. I don't think Canadians prefer EVs anyway.

jerlam 10mo ago
The vast majority of Canadians live near the US border. The weather is not tropical but it is quite normal compared to a lot of US states and northern Europeans.
yabones 10mo ago
There are a massive amount of new EVs in Quebec, which isn't exactly tropical. Part of it is subsidies, $2K for new EV, and $600 for charging. The other thing is the crazy scale of hydroelectric production in that province, some of which gets exported as far as Baltimore. So electricity is very available and reasonably cheap in QC. We'll see how BYD's handle the bone chilling Montreal winters... Unless they're an absolute flop, I can see some fairly solid future prospects. (I live in Ontario, but I've been to Le Belle Province quite a bit ;) ) https://www.quebec.ca/en/transports/electric-transportation/financial-assistance-electric-vehicle/new-vehicle/amount-financial-assistance https://www.quebec.ca/en/transports/electric-transportation/... https://www.quebec.ca/en/transports/electric-transportation/financial-assistance-electric-vehicle/charging/home-charging-station https://www.quebec.ca/en/transports/electric-transportation/... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Bay_Project https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Bay_Project
- cmrdporcupine 10mo ago
  As an EV driver from Ontario it's amazing crossing over, or even getting close to the border, the EV situation is just so much better. That said, while hate Tesla the company ... I'll take their chargers over the patchwork of various apps & cards I have to install in order to make use of things there. There's a notable absence of Tesla stations there, but a lot of variety of other things and I had bad luck installing half the apps and it was not fun trying to set that all up while standing in the -20C cold in a gas station parking lot while just trying to get to the ski hill.
deleted 10mo ago

zjsushsb 10mo ago

I’m assuming this is downstream of trumps move in Venezuela? Canada suffers the most from US access to Venezuelan oil. On top of all the prior rhetoric and moves by his admin. What concerns me is why does the west think China is trustworthy? Why are we all fighting one another? Culture is important. China knows this, and is unequivocally Chinese relative to the Europeans.

mindslight 10mo ago
> Why are we all fighting one another? Because of the Chinese/Russian asset that got into the highest leadership position of the western world, and is now using that position to create and inflame fighting amongst ourselves. We had it too good, for too long, people got too entitled, became out of touch with what actually made our society great, and our adversaries took advantage of that. As an American, I am truly sorry to all of our allies and friends who didn't even get to vote on the matter.
vdupras 10mo ago
Up until a while ago, I'm pretty sure that the consensus was that China not trustworthy. And then, Trump plays his cards and the consensus is now that the US are even less trustworthy. So here you go.
- palmotea 10mo ago
  > Up until a while ago, I'm pretty sure that the consensus was that China not trustworthy. And then, Trump plays his cards and the consensus is now that the US are even less trustworthy. So here you go. But that doesn't make China trustworthy, which this move implies. It seems like there's some "narcissism of small differences" kind of thing going on here. Trump may not share Canada/Europe's values to the same degree of prior US presidents, but China does not share those values at all and never has. It's really questionable judgement to throw your lot in with China if you're not happy with the leadership of the US.
  - gpm 10mo ago
    We do trade with plenty of people who we don't think are trustworthy (Trump's US, for instance). I don't see that this move implies that China is trustworthy at all.

footy 10mo ago

Good. Carney also remarked our relationship with China is now more predictable with our relationship with the states (wild shade coming from him) just to really make it clear to certain parties why this is happening. Cheaper car options in this country will be nice, and I say this as a certified car hater who's yet to own one despite pushing 40.

nsmdkdfk 10mo ago
[flagged]
- footy 10mo ago
  neither does America, and they're much closer and dangerous to us at this time.
  - chrisco255 10mo ago
    [flagged]
    - footy 10mo ago
      The US is currently threatening multiple of its NATO partners and serious people don't expect NATO to be around by the end of 2028. I am a less serious person I guess, because I expect it to break up within a year. I'm glad you have so many cool 80 year old anecdotes to tell yourself, but things change.
    - rootusrootus 10mo ago
      > The U.S. does NATO and foots the majority of the bill and human resources for North Atlantic defense. That includes Canada For how much longer? NATO won't survive this administration.
    - deleted 10mo ago
      [deleted]
    - ceejayoz 10mo ago

myrmidon 10mo ago

I wonder if this might even be below reasonable "subsidy-compensation" tariff levels. BYD, for reference, got almost 30% of their 2024 income from the Chinese state (~$1.4b). But this is always difficult to judge because most nations help local industry to some degree, and it can be quite difficult to compare.

adrian_b 10mo ago
While Americans very frequently complain that the Chinese state subsidizes various industries, I am astonished that they do not see any similarity with the fact that I never heard of any really big investment project in USA, e.g. the building of any new big factory or new company headquarters, that was done otherwise than after receiving very substantial tax reductions of various kinds from the local government of the place chosen for the project. In many parts of Europe those kinds of tax reductions would be illegal, being considered a form of state aid for a private company.
- epolanski 10mo ago
  And yet virtually all European lawmakers get $ from governments threatening to cut jobs. Many countries actively lose money for those jobs, Serbia is an example. They go to extreme lengths to underbid competition for stellantis factories and get a net negative impact. If you can't survive without taxpayers paying the bills, just die ffs.
z2 10mo ago
In comparison with Musk's companies ($15 billion in 2023, $7b in 2024), this seems to be a pittance. https://www.congress.gov/119/meeting/house/117956/documents/HMKP-119-JU00-20250226-SD003.pdf https://www.congress.gov/119/meeting/house/117956/documents/...
- myrmidon 10mo ago
  This is exactly why its so hard to compare though; government contracts, emission credits and direct subsidies are all quite different and weighting them is highly subjective.

kingstnap 10mo ago

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deleted 10mo ago
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SECProto 10mo ago
> It's for just 50k vehicles, which means that the first 50k that get sent will be all Luxury high margin electric vehicles. [...] Why would anyone use there quota for cheap stuff? If you find a better primary source, you'll see that the lower price vehicles are the only thing allowed at the low tariff rate: The deal covers vehicles priced at $33,000 or less, and other cars sold at that price are already manufactured offshore https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/livestory/canada-china-electric-vehicles-canola-trade-deal-carney-xi-9.7048058?ts=1768574721727 https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/livestory/canada-china-elec...

nik282000 10mo ago

[flagged]

dpc050505 10mo ago
China isn't threatening to invade Canada. The neighbours to the south that have similar software in our military planes are.
originalvichy 10mo ago
I have never before felt pressured about what I can or cannot protest about in Europe by China, but I can’t say the same about our most powerful ally, who has threatened every sector of our society – political or non-political – with consequences if we do not act and speak as they do. China absolutely does not care about our society the same way as that.
dawnerd 10mo ago
No different than American companies or European companies. With the US having Palantir in their pocket…
- adamiscool8 10mo ago
  The accountability and scale are hugely different to the point I don’t see how anyone can make this argument in good faith.
  - tokai 10mo ago
    Are you following the news? Canada is the target of a trade war from the US right now.
  - dorkypunk 10mo ago
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Room_641A https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Room_641A
tokai 10mo ago
All that goes for US EVs too. And China hasn't threaten with annexation.

zombiwoof 10mo ago

[dead]

czhu12 10mo ago

This new direction of "strategic autonomy", with Donald Trump in the white house just south of the border seems like a difficult hill to occupy. Unfortunately, this is probably what is necessary at this point.

TheBlight 10mo ago
Isn't it somewhat laughable when something like 3/4 of Canadian exports are to the US?
- boringg 10mo ago
  I think that Canada has to de-leverage trade with the US is what the take away should be. Not that this trade deal itself is going to change all the balances -- its that there are other players who can start to trade - reducing dependence on the US. The compounding effects are damaging as are switching costs.
  - TheBlight 10mo ago
    What it looks like to me is that Carney the businessman is trying to work for the best terms in an eventual annexation scenario.
    - boringg 10mo ago
      Trolls be trolls.
      - TheBlight 10mo ago
        Bookmark it.
    - LunaSea 10mo ago
      He should negotiate directly with Putin then instead of Trump the middle-man
- 10mo ago

etchalon 10mo ago

Our not-so-great leader's not-so-great trade policies continue to have not-so-great results for the US.

threethirtytwo 10mo ago

Are BYD cars really subsidized or is that a bunch of BS?

rootusrootus 10mo ago
Yes, BYD is tightly intertwined with the CCP and gets a lot of subsidies, grants, favorable loans, etc.
- standardUser 10mo ago
  Yes, following an almost cookie-cutter-like pattern of emerging economies protecting and supporting their auto industries.
  - taneliv 10mo ago
    I feel like that is not specific to emerging economies.
    - rootusrootus 10mo ago
      Given their war manufacturing ability, I expect any govt to support the industry to some extent. I think that China is additionally doing it to strategically weaken their rivals. Both for economic as well as military objectives.
maxglute 10mo ago
PRC just underpricing competitors is frankly retarded cope at this point, the reality is PRC industrial policy also simply permanently drives structural costs down. They're not spending billions in pork barrel jobs program that need reoccurring injections that rarely prioritize manufacturing efficiency. Pretty much every industry where PRC took the value-engineer hammer (initially with subsidies) has stayed cheap (eventually without subsidies). Like it's been 20 years, PRC competitiveness hallowed out a lot of western industrial base already, but their goods remains cheap. They're not subsidizing in perpetuity, their manufacturing is just stupid efficient and producers are willing to live on less margins because before even competing with western incumbents, they're competing with other Chinese competitors foremost and it just so happens survivors of PRC involution is by process of elimination, the most competitive.

Tiktaalik 10mo ago

I expect that this relatively small quota is a good faith opening the door to Chinese product but the main core goal will be deeper, comprehensive Chinese investment, such as securing BYD/NIO/etc car factories in Ontario.

rootusrootus 10mo ago

The US government has really handled this poorly. Let's take one of our closest allies and push them into the arms of our biggest rival. All while helping boost that rival's total exports to record numbers. And boosting their universities to top positions in world rankings. Just brilliant, guys. "Make America Great Again" sure seems like it was intentionally tongue-in-cheek.

epolanski 10mo ago
The exports argument is so bloated. US has thrived economically for 5 decades after becoming an import economy. This whole export/import balance is such a lame reasoning...yes you've spent a certain amount of $...and got plenty of stuff in exchange. In the words of some economist I've read "by Trump's reasoning my barber is also taking advantage of me because I cut my hair every month and he never buys anything from me". Last but not least, services are never included in these trade balance arguments. How much money flows to US through their financial and IT services alone...?
- vannevar 10mo ago
  The trade deficit argument is mostly nonsense, but it's being made disingenuously anyway so the actual merit doesn't really matter to the people making it. Trump is a big fan of tariffs because they give him negotiating leverage to make deals beneficial to his own interests and those of his cronies. There is no national interest involved, this is an administration devoted purely to grift. Any benefit to the country is purely accidental.
- pstuart 10mo ago
  The trade balance as a number shouldn't matter, but offshoring critical manufacturing capability and production ecosystems does. China has at least 2 key advantages in manufacturing -- cheaper labor and laxer regulations. If the US were to embrace and extend robotics and automation more vigorously that first point could become moot. Also the second point as far as labor regulations go, and if environmental regulations were properly priced then that too would be moot.

ZeroGravitas 10mo ago

It makes more sense if you assume Trump is being paid off by China. I'm not saying that's happening, just that it makes more sense than this chaotic self-destruction of the American empire.

hungryhobbit 10mo ago
That is complete and utter conspiracy hogwash! Who believes in such total nonsense ... ... everyone knows Trump is being blackmailed by Russia ;-)

throw0101d 10mo ago

A Canadian satire site has the headline "Canada chooses lawful evil over chaotic evil": * https://thebeaverton.com/2026/01/canada-chooses-lawful-evil-over-chaotic-evil/ https://thebeaverton.com/2026/01/canada-chooses-lawful-evil-... * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alignment_(Dungeons_%26_Dragons) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alignment_(Dungeons_%26_Dragon... Edit: A comment in /r/canada: > TBF I would much rather work for Lex Luthor than The Joker if I had to choose one.

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pixl97 10mo ago
That first link is a back button capturer.
- slumberlust 10mo ago
  I didn't have any issues. Running FF w/ UblockO and Privacy Badger.
choppypoofart 10mo ago
As an American I'm rooting for everyone else these days. Good for Canada. I hope the EU builds stronger trade with China too and America gets left in the cold to whither and die. Trump, Vance, Miller, Noem, Musk, Bezos all of them just forgotten about and completely irrelevant to the rest of the world.
- klipklop 10mo ago
  [flagged]
  - mywittyname 10mo ago
    Politics gets people talking.
  - choppypoofart 10mo ago

shevy-java 10mo ago

Canadians are incredibly pissed at Trump and his criminal TechBros. This change here is largely due to that. Trump threatening invasion of Greenland is also aimed against Canada; the USA would have more and more military bases threatening Canada, so Trump's anti-Greenland policy is heavily aimed at threatening Canada rather than China or Russia. One can see how he helps Putin versus Ukraine - one can not trust Trump.

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ugh123 10mo ago

The result of another self-own by the Trump administration.

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Waterluvian 10mo ago

A few assorted thoughts: - I'm still not over how great it feels to have confidence that Carney has a strong understanding of the economics of these political manouvers. Not only is he not a !@#$ing moron, he's a deeply experience economist more than he's a politician. - Stratification of trading partners is nothing but good. - This feels like safe toe-dip. Both sides have agreed to terms that are temporary, meaning there is no surprise rug-pull moment. Which is something the Americans are using more and more to keep everyone so !@#$ing wound up. - This could be a long-term play for China: establish a presence in the North American auto market. The U.S. is right there. (Watch the Americans ban Chinese EVs from border crossing) - Even better long-term play: establish North American manufacturing. How about Ontario builds Japanese and Chinese cars, turns CAMI and others into a Roshel or other military vehicle plant, and says good riddance to the American auto makers that have been rug-pulling long before Trump got into politics. - A great opportunity to start improving trade lines for Canola. Possibly a trial balloon for other primary and secondary resources? - Canada cannot stand on its own geopolitically. We must be closely tied to a major power. Intuitively that choice is the EU But I fear that China can move much faster and we'll find ourselves de-facto in their sphere while the EU is still debating this and that.

0xTJ 10mo ago
I don't love that Carney is relatively conservative-leaning for being Liberal, but I do really appreciate the fact that he's professional, competent, and stable. He speaks like (what I see as) a regular person and he's not there to whip supporters into fervent chanting. I'm absolutely relieved that Poilievre didn't win the election (or his original seat). Setting aside just how far to the right he is, I've heard him described as an idiot both by another MP and by someone (who is himself pretty conservative) who met him at some social event.
- rssoconnor 10mo ago
  I'm pretty sure Carney is a Progressive Conservative.
  - k12sosse 10mo ago

lenerdenator 10mo ago

Money talks, actual values walk. Always. I get that this is seen as a "practical" move north-of-the-border, but understand, this is the kind of move that guys like Trump, Putin, and Xi all require. They want this kind of thing to happen, because it shows the real issue was never one of democratic values and human rights. If Canadians valued that then their PM wouldn't be inking a deal with China in response to what Trump is doing. There would be some sort of deal with Europe, perhaps, but not China. The next time the Canadian government brings up some sort of issue with the treatment of Canadians by ICE or some other kind of issue, you can bet that the horse trading will involve a reference to the fact that this deal happened. That's already more-or-less the rationale in Trump's dealings with Europe: for all of the complaining about Russia as a threat or the sanctity of NATO and how the Greenland affair threatens all of that, there was a solid 15-year-long run where the continent was more than happy to buy petroleum products off the Russians while ignoring escalating human rights violations in Russia along with incursions into South Ossetia and the Donbas. He picks up on these sorts of deals as hypocrisy based in realpolitik, and will exploit it.

fritzorino 10mo ago
Trump doesn't care about values at all, he cares about money more than anyone else does. I find it laughable you can even talk about values whilst having that main in charge of your country. And so what if he turns around and goes "ha your values are worthless". Trump is a literal paedophile and a literal rapist. Why should we accept being brow beat by such a man? So? We're moving on without you.
- lenerdenator 10mo ago
  > Trump doesn't care about values at all, he cares about money more than anyone else does. That's exactly what I'm saying. He's going to use this sort of deal as an example to Canadians that when it all comes down to it, they're no better than he is. He's going to say that you're perfectly fine talking trade deals with authoritarians who are literally abducting Chinese nationals on Canadian soil and doing God-knows-what with them [0], so long as the money is right. [0] https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/rcmp-chinese-police-stations-1.6862336 https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/rcmp-chinese-police-st...

PeterStuer 10mo ago

Wouldn't them creating artificial scarcity be just another way to keep prices at the same level as tarrifs, but with the huge margins going to the private sector instead of the public?

epolanski 10mo ago
This will likely happen indeed. There will be a huge mark up from dealerships and not enough volume to prompt for pricing competition.

DefundPortland 10mo ago

[flagged]

vannevar 10mo ago

Trump is binding US automakers tightly to the fossil fuel industry, which at this point in history is like tying a boat anchor to a drowning man.

ck2 10mo ago

Have they solved the cold weather vs lithium charge leak problem? And whatever happened to that mysterious one-day $50 million in tesla rebates?

markvdb 10mo ago

The Mercosur-EU trade deal, the India-EU trade deal and this China-Canada trade deal. A pattern perhaps? A frantic search for reliable trade partnerships, or just random noise?

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barbazoo 10mo ago
Mercosur-EU trade deal was agreed 2019 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EU%E2%80%93Mercosur_Association_Agreement https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EU%E2%80%93Mercosur_Associatio... India-EU have deepened ties since long ago too https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/India%E2%80%93European_Union_relations https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/India%E2%80%93European_Union_r...
- jaredklewis 10mo ago
  > Mercosur-EU trade deal was agreed 2019 Sure the details were negotiated in 2019, but it isn't even in effect yet. It still needs to be approved by legislative bodies on both sides of the Atlantic. Which will probably happen sometime this year.

seydor 10mo ago

Globalization always wins

diego_moita 10mo ago

Good! The less we depend on Trumpistan the better.

guywithahat 10mo ago

This feels like a poor long-term play for a short term political win. Canada has a robust automotive supply industry to US auto manufacturers, and this industry could be in long-term risk in an attempt to hurt relations with freer, traditionally more conservative nations. It’s not a shock but it is always disappointing to see major political decisions made for the benefit of the next election cycle.

jackling 10mo ago
I largely agree, but there are conflicting goals which makes it hard to evaluate if this really is a bad long-term play. Canada has environmental commitments, and giving the population access to cheap EVs will help meet those goals. I don't think this decision is just a short-term political win, there is potential for it to help with the longer term vision of Canada. But I do agree, this is bad for the local automotive industry in Canada.
cmrdporcupine 10mo ago
The message here is that western Canadian agricultural & energy interests are of potential more strategic value than a dying technically backwards auto sector led by three moribund regressive manufacturers who have shown their willingness to show their belly to Trump anyways. As an Ontarian, I'm saddened. But I don't think the Big3 deserve anymore state support. They've pushed it too far. Just earlier this week they were running editorials against the gov't on EV mandates. Again. Ok, here you go. Don't want to make EVs? Only want to sell giant Canyoneros? It's ok. China will service that market. Have fun becoming irrelevant. If consumers really don't want EVs, like they said earlier in the week, then there's nothing to fear. Right? Right?
- maxglute 10mo ago
  More that Ontario auto is projected to have no value since Trump has explicitly signaled he wants to kill Canadian auto and reshore to US. If Ontario auto is going, no sense in losing also agriculture especially if oil also going in 5-10 years if VZ ever works to US favor. The only hedge is to save Canadian auto is hoping for some sort PRC JV where Canadian plants keep some jobs and grab some margins, possibly a lot of margins (i.e. no truly cheap EVs) since PRC inputs cheap. Best case scenario is Canada has meaningfully cheaper EVs, but not Chinese cheap, get to hold onto some auto work, have access to worlds largest ag buyer, maybe free up an extra million barrels of oil to export since US will want VZ heavy instead of WCS from Alberta. Although US has many other ways to punish Canada.

dcarmo 10mo ago

In case you're not aware, Chinese cars have the same or even better quality than US, European and Japanese cars. Their electric vehicles are cheap and high quality, it's really impressive.

gligorot 10mo ago
Source on this? I mean I’d like this to be true, but for brands that are younger than a 30yo Corolla (thats still running), its a big statement to make.

maxglute 10mo ago

PRC slashed tariffs on Canadian ag in reciprocation, which unlike Canada on PRC EVs is uncapped. Meanwhile EV cap only raises based on PRC auto investments and plenty of ways US can throw cold water on that. Either way, this more bargaining chip for Canada vs USMCA renegotiation next year. Like it would be nice to get chinese EVs, or even shoring some of their manufacturing in CA to keep auto sector going, but I wouldn't hold my breath on it being geopolitically sustainable. Imagine US flexes, PRC pulls out, and early adopters get screwed.

zmmmmm 10mo ago

The battle is already lost as far as China owning the future markets for EVs and probably energy in general. It doesn't seem conceivable anybody else could match their scale, efficiency and technology advantages. If you're going to fight economically, might as well do it in areas that aren't (a) a lost cause (b) going to hurt you economically since you'll have to settle for worse and more expensive products and (c) the alternative supplier's country isn't threatening to literally invade you and surrounding nations.

constantcrying 10mo ago

Which just means that most new cars in Canada will be made in China and that this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automotive_industry_in_Canada https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automotive_industry_in_Canada will soon be a thing of the past. No country can compete with China on even footing in regards to car manufacturing, despite the frequent denials, they offer extremely good products, at costs no European or American company can compete with.

tw04 10mo ago

This is what happens when you abandon your allies and soft power. The US is about to find out that their economy isn't capable of surviving in 2026 without the soft power they've had since WWII. Steven Miller is also about to find out that, no you can't just "take what you want" and expect the rest of the world to do nothing.

timeon 10mo ago
> when you abandon your allies Threatening is worse than just "abandon".
hashstring 10mo ago
Thanks to the kleptrocrats and oligarchs… sold ya sold ya sold ya.
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k12sosse 10mo ago
"There is only one thing worse than fighting with allies, and that is fighting without them" - Jean Luc Picard

Beijinger 10mo ago

I am not sure this is a good move. They have the option to align closer with the EU. But let's see. Canada may also break apart: https://globalnews.ca/news/11615147/alberta-separatists-praise-turnout-petition-signing/ https://globalnews.ca/news/11615147/alberta-separatists-prai...

iOsiris 10mo ago
The is is literally just the fringe influencing politics. The majority of Albertans do not support this.

frenchman_in_ny 10mo ago

Interesting - will this open a back door to having Chinese EVs on US roads? I would assume some sort of kei truck loopholes would have to be found to solve state-level registration or insurance requirements.

m463 10mo ago

I remember renting a house once and the gas water heater went out. The landlord replaced it... with another cheap-ass gas water heater with a pilot light. "they're more reliable" he said maybe he's right, but it definitely used more gas which he didn't pay for. EDIT: oh wait, we had a gas heater problem too. It wouldn't heat the house. (same landlord) When the service guy came over, he tried working on it, but eventually threw a huge fit. <LandLord> this is a piece of crap, it is the original heater from the house, too old and decrepit to get going again. You just have to replace it. I think the service guy was actually a decent, upstanding guy and he knew what he was doing. Landlord put in a new heating system, and lo and behold... the house actually got warm easily and the gas bill dropped over half.

ndjeosibfb 10mo ago

what’s with all the pro china propaganda on here lately

mbfg 10mo ago

Is there anything stopping americans buying chinese EVs in canada and bringing them home?

lgxz 10mo ago

That’s reasonable because China never threatened to invade Canada.

amai 10mo ago

Don't trust China. China is asshole!

ScampMichael 10mo ago

Canada can tell Trump to keep his stolen oil.

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