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As a Waymo-booster on HN for a while now, here's my latest anecdote. I tried to figure out how to take Waymo to LAX even though it's not actually in their terri

As a Waymo-booster on HN for a while now, here's my latest anecdote. I tried to figure out how to take Waymo to LAX even though it's not actually in their territory yet just because I value the experience so much. I was borderline going to take it within walking distance (about half a mile), but got lazy at the last minute. I took Lyft instead, and, as if the universe cursed my laziness, I booked a "comfort" car for $3 more than the base level Lyft. At first I was going to get a Tesla Model Y to take me, but that cancelled. Instead, what must have been a first generation Honda Pilot picked me up, suspension creaking and muffler that had seen better days. Did Lyft recognize what they sent instead of the "comfort" they promised and therefore charge me $3 less? Of course not. When I tried to contact customer service I ran into what I'm sure plenty of HN people have, which is a dead end where you report the issue and they (programmatically?) adjudicate the complaint on the spot. Their determination? I wasn't entitled to a $3 refund. Ironic that the rideshare app with human drivers doesn't allow me to contact their customer service whereas Waymo has no problem with it (yeah, yeah, I get it, "we'll see once they reach a huge scale." But today the experience is so much better than Uber or Lyft that while it lasts I will bask in its driverless glory).

meindnoch 1y ago
I had the opposite once with Uber. I paid regular price (UberX or whatever it's called), then a guy showed up in a black BMW 530 with leather seats.
- harmmonica 1y ago
  I've had the same many many times. I think almost universally it's fair that the product/provider upgrades your experience when you agree to pay for something, but when they are specifically telling you "pay x and we'll give you y" and then they give you <y that's, I think, shitty.
- kelnos 1y ago
  Of course, that happens, but the point is that it's a crapshoot, and you don't know what you're gonna get until the driver confirms, and you don't know what the car's actual condition is until you get in. And regardless, it's always reasonable for someone to provide you a better service/product than you paid for, but it's never ok to do the opposite. With Waymo, you know what you're going to get every time. I've also never experienced a Waymo interior that was in bad shape when I got in the car, though I'm sure that does happen to people.
  - seb1204 1y ago
    Same for cabs who used to be horrible until uber was the alternative. You need to use the vote button on Uber or Lyft. And not get into the car that is crap.
duxup 1y ago
Uber has done that to me. You pick a class but what you get seems unrelated. I need more space for luggage and such and ... some "mid-sized" SUV picks me up that has about as much space a regular sedan anyway ... often the same type of vehicle that picked me up the previous day as a regular vehicle.
- jghn 1y ago
  I believe they bin vehicles by available seating and not by things like luggage.
  - Jubijub 1y ago
    +1 So you may get say a 7 seater where the seats are folded in the trunk, so you can carry 7 people XOR 5 people + light suitcases There is no option to say “send me a mini van”
    - duxup 1y ago
      Agreed. I want van.
    - kaonwarb 1y ago
      There is a newer option that is closer to that - "Uber XXL." (https://www.uber.com/newsroom/airport-travel/ https://www.uber.com/newsroom/airport-travel/)
    - Dylan16807 1y ago
      ...XOR? So it can carry the 2 extra people, it can carry some luggage, it can't carry both, and it can't carry neither?
      - dgoldstein0 1y ago
        ^ Pedant detected
        1y ago
jopsen 1y ago
$3 isn't this kind of a small problem? I miss rideshare service, in Denmark we have mess of expensive high quality taxis that you cannot get hold of when you need one.
- harmmonica 1y ago
  I'm not sure I'm reading you correctly, but if you mean it's a small problem because $3 isn't much money then, heck yes, it's a microscopic problem (is there something smaller than microscopic because if so then it's whatever that thing is)! But I didn't bring it up to complain about the $3 per se. I can elaborate, but I'm not sure if that's what you were specifically referring to or if I'm misunderstanding your question.
- georgemcbay 1y ago
  > $3 isn't this kind of a small problem? Its the principle, not the size of the cost. If a company with good customer service accidentally overcharged me $200 but I could call someone and have it fixed easily that would set me off far less than a company that screwed me out of $1 who has shit-tier dark pattern customer service.
- khazhoux 1y ago
  > $3 isn't this kind of a small problem? You're right -- it's surprising Lyft wouldn't just give back $3 (such a small amount!) to keep a customer.
  - applecrazy 1y ago
    this is so rampant but they know they have a captive market (in many places, only uber or lyft are an option) so they abuse their position
    - internetter 1y ago
      I've had good experiences with Uber. I know others don't, but I have. I used to use Lyft but they treated me like shit so now I don't. If Uber starts treating me like shit I'm going back to taxis. If taxis treat me like shit I'll take the bus, walk, buy a car, or any of the dozens of other ways to get around, even if impractical. The market is only captive because people are lazy and weak willed.
jostmey 1y ago
Agreeed. My last uber and Lyft rides were an unpleasant experience of late pickups, cancelled pickups, and old rickety rides. I use the train over uber and lyft
shiftpgdn 1y ago
Why did you cancel on the Tesla Model Y?
- ai-christianson 1y ago
  He said "that cancelled" so I think it wasn't on his end.
  - deleted 1y ago
    [deleted]
pokot0 1y ago
People don't hate automation. They hate BAD automation. From your description seems like: Waymo -> Good Automation, Call Center -> Bad Automation. The day we will have a chatgpt level automated customer care experience, we will complain every time humans answer our requests, with their accents and attitudes!
- raldi 1y ago
  "Hi, how can I help y—" "TALK TO A ROBOT"
- harmmonica 1y ago
  Oh man, hope it's ok to poke a little fun. I think we just violently agreed with me praising automation from one company and deriding automation from another. So I'll update your "seems like": Riding with Waymo (IME) -> Good Automation, Lyft customer support when they "stole" $3 from me and didn't provide me with a way to fix it -> Bad Automation.
- rufus_foreman 1y ago
  >> People don't hate automation This is not true.
  - antasvara 1y ago
    In the broad sense, people are in favor of automation. Most people aren't clamoring for the days before the stove, dishwasher, and car (all automated versions of past technologies). That being said, I think a lot of people are against automation when it does something worse than the manual version. Think automated customer service over a human being.
    - xbmcuser 1y ago
      Most people don't like change so are resistant to it. It's the same with electric cars a lot of people are resistant to it because of false range anxiety but when people actually use ev for extended period most of then stay with electric.
chipsrafferty 1y ago
I would pay extra just to never ride in a Tesla. They always make me carsick.
- throwaway2037 1y ago
  > ... Tesla. They always make me carsick. I never heard this once before HN. What is particular about Teslas? Is it the rapid acceleration from the electric motor... or lack of familiar engine sound?
  - maxlin 1y ago
    I'm calling it, it's mainstream media induced psychosomatics
  - jobs_throwaway 1y ago
    > Is it the rapid acceleration from the electric motor Yes. The hard acceleration and braking.
    - throwaway2037 1y ago
      First, thank you to share you first-hand experiences. This is one of the best features of HN discussions. I promise that I am not trolling with these follow-up questions: Have you ever ridden in a "super car" (Ferrari, etc.) that also has very fast accel/braking? Do you experience the same? If a Tesla driver just drove a bit less aggressively, would you not get car sick? Did you ever try "FSD" on a Tesla on regular streets? Is the accel/braking still strong enough to make you feel car sick? I ask all of these question honestly. If I was an electric car maker, I would definitely be concerned about it. To me, it fits the same problem of VR headsets where some people get "VR sick" (like car sick) when using them. They probably spend an enormous amount R&D trying to reduce this effect to a minimum for as many people as possible.
      - natch 1y ago
        I would take these “first hand experiences” with a grain of salt when the commenter is unaware of some basic facts.
liveoneggs 1y ago
all "cab"-like cars that are not shaped like London Black Cabs are failures. The seating and luggage carrying is so much better than a regular car it makes me sick.
- ghaff 1y ago
  And then you'll find plenty of people on here that hate on Black Cabs as ridiculously over priced.
  - jen729w 1y ago
    An issue unrelated to the shape of the vehicle and its capacity to carry humans and luggage.
- billforsternz 1y ago
  I'm on holiday in Japan at the moment and I notice the cabs look like London cabs and are mainly black too. Made by Toyota. I haven't yet taken one, so I don't know if the similarity extends to the interior layout.
paulgb 1y ago
> Their determination? I wasn't entitled to a $3 refund. Frustratingly, Lyft’s position on this is that if you don’t like the car that arrives you should reject it when it arrives, otherwise you’re not entitled to a (even partial) refund, even when they know on their end that the car they sent doesn’t match what you paid extra for.
- dataflow 1y ago
  This seems... interesting, legally speaking. I imagine the idea is that you're implicitly accepting alterations to the previous contract by opting to take the car? Would that argument hold water, legally?
  - bravoetch 1y ago
    I ran into a similar arbitration with a condo I rented for a long weekend. There was a significant issue and they weren't able to provide another place. We stayed there and had contractors in and out for the next couple of days. They refused to refund me, so I tried through my credit card to get a refund and they said "well you should have just left, then we would refund you. But since you stayed, the contract is fulfilled."
    - dataflow 1y ago
      Credit card disputes don't always match up with the law, so I wouldn't put too much weight on this from a legal standpoint, but good anecdote nonetheless.
  - fortran77 1y ago
    Especially since you may have no time to wait for another car. There’s an element of “duress” here
    - user_7832 1y ago
      Yes, when you’re tired after a flight with heavy bags, you’re very much being forced to compromise. Any consumer could easily argue why they didn’t have a choice and had to go with what was available.
usehand 1y ago
Charges for goods not delivered as agreed falls under the protection of the Fair Credit Billing Act. If you made a good faith attempt to resolve with the merchant (which you did) you should use your credit card to charge back the amount (some let you request a partial charge back, but if not you can request a full one and explain in the extra info that you want a partial one). This might not seem worth it for $3, but if they get a lot of these the credit cards/banks might start giving them a hard time about it, so I think it's worth the minor hassle (everything can be done via the credit card app usually)
- ribosometronome 1y ago
  And then you're forever barred from using the service.
  - ryandrake 1y ago
    Why would you want to continue using a service that is ripping you off? If you're at the point where your only recourse is to charge back, that's kind of a bridge burning moment.
    - overfeed 1y ago
      Let's retain a sense of proportion here; it was $3.
      - ryandrake 1y ago
        IMO it's attitudes like this that allow companies to continue ripping us all off for small amounts here and small amounts there. They know it's a small amount and most people won't push back, so they keep getting away with it. I suppose the only thing that stops me from hitting the nuclear button every time this happens is that there are a limited number of companies offering many categories of services, and I'd eventually have to charge back each of them and lose access to an entire industry composed entirely of shitty companies. It would be much better if companies were inclined to amicably settle small dollar disputes rather than the default which seems to be to stonewall, and then ban when the customer uses the only tool they have to push back.
Havoc 1y ago
[flagged]
deleted 1y ago
[deleted]
ChrisMarshallNY 1y ago
Another recent anecdote. A friend was recently in Milwaukee (first time ever. He was there for a conference). He, his wife, and another friend, wanted to go out to eat. They were given a wrong address. Could have been the source, or it could have been they screwed up writing it down. It was definitely a wrong address, though, that they gave to Uber. The driver picked them up, and took them to the address, which was deep in Da Hood. Not a good area for three middle-class white folks to be wandering around. The driver insisted they get out, even though it was clearly a wrong address, and a downright dangerous neighborhood (my friend has some experience with rough neighborhoods. If he said it was bad, it was bad). My friend offered to pay whatever it took, to get to the correct address (they had figured out their mistake, by then), but the driver refused to do that. It was probably algorithmically prohibited. My friend had never used Uber before (and never will, again), so wasn’t aware that you are supposed to be able to appeal to Uber. I have a feeling that my friend offered to rearrange the driver’s dental work (Did I mention that he was familiar with tough neighborhoods?), and got the driver to drop them off in a better area, where they caught a cab. Sounds like a bad customer experience. I doubt Uber ever heard the story. My friend never bothered contacting them, and I will bet that the driver didn’t.
- School-Cotton 1y ago
  Huh? Your friend paid uber to take them to an address, and they did.
  - ChrisMarshallNY 1y ago
    Actually, it sounds like my friend was robbed. Classic gypsy cab robbery.
    - lcnPylGDnU4H9OF 1y ago
      The confusion around getting the address wrong is an interesting tell. If you think you’re not likely to make that mistake, anyway. It’s also a bit late to realize at that point since you’re already in the bad area. But it reminds me of tech support scams which usually have an element of convincing the victim that they made a mistake.
rfurmani 1y ago
I've had a couple bad experiences with Lyft recently, including one time the driver must have clicked that they picked me up while a block away, because I could see the lyft driving to the destination without me. I tried to get a refund since I was obviously waiting my start location the whole time, but the system claimed the drive went from start to finish (even though I wasn't in the car), so no refund.
- z2 1y ago
  Same thing happened to me, and the support system automatically decided nothing was wrong whatsoever despite my phone certainly sending a very different location from the driver. And the madness was I couldn't even book another ride as I was technically in one. So I ended up getting it resolved via the security panic button which did put me through to a real person who was empathetic to the issue.
  - SOLAR_FIELDS 1y ago
    Is this some sort of a scam? The driver cannot even mark the ride as completed without being in the area right? So they have to drive it anyway. I can’t imagine they would be on the platform for long if this happened on a regular basis. I would say it’s probably an accident but how could this behavior be accidental? Someone might accidentally say that they picked you up, but they couldn’t accidentally then drive an empty car to the destination.
    - dgoldstein0 1y ago
      Maybe they picked up the wrong person and neither of them realized?
      - SOLAR_FIELDS 1y ago
        Entirely possible, people do get into wrong rideshare vehicles. Especially late night after people have been drinking. A decent driver will confirm the name when you’re in a place with a lot of pickups happening but if the language barrier is strong that might not happen.
ronyeh 1y ago
People paying more for Waymo doesn’t surprise me. I also once called for a comfort car, but it was a filthy Lexus. I’d much rather ride in a clean and well maintained Corolla. I pay more for Waymo and I’m happy to do it (as long as Waymo can detect when its interior is dirty so it can return itself to home base for cleaning.) I don’t have to sit awkwardly in a car with another guy who may drive in a way that annoys me. I can talk on my phone or with my family without having a random person listen in.
- fragmede 1y ago
  Though, the cameras on the Waymo are always on and pointed down at you looking at your screen.
- throwaway2037 1y ago
  I have only used car share once in my life. (My mother ordered it, and it was fine.) To me, a dirty car is pretty much unforgivable as a car share service. Do you report it on the app or just give a one/zero star rating and hope the car share service will fix it? > I don’t have to sit awkwardly in a car with another guy who may drive You hit the nail on the head. I cannot belive that I am 100+ posts into this discussion and no one has mentioned it. It was the first idea that popped into my head. How about if you are woman? I would gladly pay a bit more to have no other strangers in the car with me.
- tuna74 1y ago
  Instead you will have all of Google listen in.
hidelooktropic 1y ago
The Uber comfort designation frustratingly has nothing to do with the condition of the vehicle. I believe the parameters are age, seats, and model. From the driver's point of view, it just means that you are allowed to accept comfort rides but most of the time you're probably going to be picking up UberX passengers which are more plentiful. That means you're only slightly more likely to get one of the good comfort vehicles if you actually select the comfort tier.
bgwalter 1y ago
Before Uber and Lyft destroyed the functioning taxi market, you got Mercedes by default for a traditional, regulated taxi in many EU countries. You didn't have to argue, interact with a surveillance company, interact with customer service etc. All you needed to do is pick up the phone and get a luxury ride without tracking or surveillance.
- FirmwareBurner 1y ago
  >the functioning taxi market Was it? In many EU countries a lot of taxi drivers act like scammers: take you the long way around, they don't issue you receipt by default because they do tax fraud or steal from their employer, you can't pay by card because suddenly the card machine "doesn't work" so they drive you to an ATM, then you pay cash and they try to keep the change, they don't speak English or even the local language, they don't know the local streets or landmarks you're referring to because they're not from there, etc. All that is super annoying. Multiply it if you're a tourist or on a business trip or job interview. Ride sharing fixed all that since you just punched in the destination in the app (in your own language) and got the price upfront and shielded you from the antics of scammy drivers and the friction of getting to your destination. That's why ride sharing apps were so successful initially. It wasn't about the price, it was about the friction or lack thereof. >you got Mercedes by default for a traditional, regulated taxi in many EU countries Mostly IIRC Berlin, Brussels, Stockholm and some other rich countries, definitely not EU wide.
  - nottorp 1y ago
    In the Mercedes running countries taxi rides are also something you do very rarely because they cost a lot. The rest are like the poster above me described. In Romania, the taxi drivers tried to strike in the capital when Uber showed up and everybody basically laughed at them.
  - yb6677 1y ago
    [dead]
- vachina 1y ago
  The surveillance is exactly why Uber and Lyft works. If drivers misbehave, evidence is all there. I’d honestly trade reliability over a temporary luxury ride in a Mercedes.
andrepd 1y ago
This is the kind of comment I'd expect to see on trustpilot, not hn
1oooqooq 1y ago
why do you think you will get better service with waymo when it's as established as the others? the whole market is a race to the bottom to extract rent from what should have been a municipality cost center. oh, do you like waymo automated support and driver better than Lyft automated support? or just can't imagine a world where tomorrow waymo will have aging cars too?
thanatosmin 1y ago
Tip: You can take Waymo to just outside the economy lot, then hop on the shuttle to the terminals. The shuttles have their own dedicated lane for going around the loop, so this isn't even that much more time. It's my new favorite way to get to LAX.
- harmmonica 1y ago
  Ah, I saw the economy lot as a potential option. I tried to get the location to resolve on the app, but I think I only tried the lot itself and not directly adjacent to it. Thank you for pointing this out!
perfectstorm 1y ago
another anecdote taking Lyft - they showed me $10.76 price for a trip to the airport when Uber showed $21. obviously i called Lyft and they placed a temporary charge on my credit card for $10.76. Once the driver dropped me off, i noticed that the base charge jumped to $16.76 + airport fees and my total with tips came to a bit over $27. I contacted Lyft and they denied and claimed that they always showed me $16.76. smh. i have proof from my credit card that they placed a hold for $10.76 and yet they refused to adjust the price.
aunty_helen 1y ago
You’ve got to invest with the VC money. As companies mature and enshitification begins, jump onto the next hot thing that’s going to disrupt the now incumbent. There’s no free lunch, but this is the closest we’ve got.

meindnoch 1y ago

I had the opposite once with Uber. I paid regular price (UberX or whatever it's called), then a guy showed up in a black BMW 530 with leather seats.

harmmonica 1y ago
I've had the same many many times. I think almost universally it's fair that the product/provider upgrades your experience when you agree to pay for something, but when they are specifically telling you "pay x and we'll give you y" and then they give you <y that's, I think, shitty.
kelnos 1y ago
Of course, that happens, but the point is that it's a crapshoot, and you don't know what you're gonna get until the driver confirms, and you don't know what the car's actual condition is until you get in. And regardless, it's always reasonable for someone to provide you a better service/product than you paid for, but it's never ok to do the opposite. With Waymo, you know what you're going to get every time. I've also never experienced a Waymo interior that was in bad shape when I got in the car, though I'm sure that does happen to people.
- seb1204 1y ago
  Same for cabs who used to be horrible until uber was the alternative. You need to use the vote button on Uber or Lyft. And not get into the car that is crap.

duxup 1y ago

Uber has done that to me. You pick a class but what you get seems unrelated. I need more space for luggage and such and ... some "mid-sized" SUV picks me up that has about as much space a regular sedan anyway ... often the same type of vehicle that picked me up the previous day as a regular vehicle.

jghn 1y ago
I believe they bin vehicles by available seating and not by things like luggage.
- Jubijub 1y ago
  +1 So you may get say a 7 seater where the seats are folded in the trunk, so you can carry 7 people XOR 5 people + light suitcases There is no option to say “send me a mini van”
  - duxup 1y ago
    Agreed. I want van.
  - kaonwarb 1y ago
    There is a newer option that is closer to that - "Uber XXL." (https://www.uber.com/newsroom/airport-travel/ https://www.uber.com/newsroom/airport-travel/)
  - Dylan16807 1y ago
    ...XOR? So it can carry the 2 extra people, it can carry some luggage, it can't carry both, and it can't carry neither?
    - dgoldstein0 1y ago
      ^ Pedant detected
      - 1y ago

jopsen 1y ago

$3 isn't this kind of a small problem? I miss rideshare service, in Denmark we have mess of expensive high quality taxis that you cannot get hold of when you need one.

harmmonica 1y ago
I'm not sure I'm reading you correctly, but if you mean it's a small problem because $3 isn't much money then, heck yes, it's a microscopic problem (is there something smaller than microscopic because if so then it's whatever that thing is)! But I didn't bring it up to complain about the $3 per se. I can elaborate, but I'm not sure if that's what you were specifically referring to or if I'm misunderstanding your question.
georgemcbay 1y ago
> $3 isn't this kind of a small problem? Its the principle, not the size of the cost. If a company with good customer service accidentally overcharged me $200 but I could call someone and have it fixed easily that would set me off far less than a company that screwed me out of $1 who has shit-tier dark pattern customer service.
khazhoux 1y ago
> $3 isn't this kind of a small problem? You're right -- it's surprising Lyft wouldn't just give back $3 (such a small amount!) to keep a customer.
- applecrazy 1y ago
  this is so rampant but they know they have a captive market (in many places, only uber or lyft are an option) so they abuse their position
  - internetter 1y ago
    I've had good experiences with Uber. I know others don't, but I have. I used to use Lyft but they treated me like shit so now I don't. If Uber starts treating me like shit I'm going back to taxis. If taxis treat me like shit I'll take the bus, walk, buy a car, or any of the dozens of other ways to get around, even if impractical. The market is only captive because people are lazy and weak willed.

jostmey 1y ago

Agreeed. My last uber and Lyft rides were an unpleasant experience of late pickups, cancelled pickups, and old rickety rides. I use the train over uber and lyft

shiftpgdn 1y ago

Why did you cancel on the Tesla Model Y?

ai-christianson 1y ago
He said "that cancelled" so I think it wasn't on his end.
- deleted 1y ago
  [deleted]

pokot0 1y ago

People don't hate automation. They hate BAD automation. From your description seems like: Waymo -> Good Automation, Call Center -> Bad Automation. The day we will have a chatgpt level automated customer care experience, we will complain every time humans answer our requests, with their accents and attitudes!

raldi 1y ago
"Hi, how can I help y—" "TALK TO A ROBOT"
harmmonica 1y ago
Oh man, hope it's ok to poke a little fun. I think we just violently agreed with me praising automation from one company and deriding automation from another. So I'll update your "seems like": Riding with Waymo (IME) -> Good Automation, Lyft customer support when they "stole" $3 from me and didn't provide me with a way to fix it -> Bad Automation.
rufus_foreman 1y ago
>> People don't hate automation This is not true.
- antasvara 1y ago
  In the broad sense, people are in favor of automation. Most people aren't clamoring for the days before the stove, dishwasher, and car (all automated versions of past technologies). That being said, I think a lot of people are against automation when it does something worse than the manual version. Think automated customer service over a human being.
  - xbmcuser 1y ago
    Most people don't like change so are resistant to it. It's the same with electric cars a lot of people are resistant to it because of false range anxiety but when people actually use ev for extended period most of then stay with electric.

chipsrafferty 1y ago

I would pay extra just to never ride in a Tesla. They always make me carsick.

throwaway2037 1y ago
> ... Tesla. They always make me carsick. I never heard this once before HN. What is particular about Teslas? Is it the rapid acceleration from the electric motor... or lack of familiar engine sound?
- maxlin 1y ago
  I'm calling it, it's mainstream media induced psychosomatics
- jobs_throwaway 1y ago
  > Is it the rapid acceleration from the electric motor Yes. The hard acceleration and braking.
  - throwaway2037 1y ago
    First, thank you to share you first-hand experiences. This is one of the best features of HN discussions. I promise that I am not trolling with these follow-up questions: Have you ever ridden in a "super car" (Ferrari, etc.) that also has very fast accel/braking? Do you experience the same? If a Tesla driver just drove a bit less aggressively, would you not get car sick? Did you ever try "FSD" on a Tesla on regular streets? Is the accel/braking still strong enough to make you feel car sick? I ask all of these question honestly. If I was an electric car maker, I would definitely be concerned about it. To me, it fits the same problem of VR headsets where some people get "VR sick" (like car sick) when using them. They probably spend an enormous amount R&D trying to reduce this effect to a minimum for as many people as possible.
    - natch 1y ago
      I would take these “first hand experiences” with a grain of salt when the commenter is unaware of some basic facts.

liveoneggs 1y ago

all "cab"-like cars that are not shaped like London Black Cabs are failures. The seating and luggage carrying is so much better than a regular car it makes me sick.

ghaff 1y ago
And then you'll find plenty of people on here that hate on Black Cabs as ridiculously over priced.
- jen729w 1y ago
  An issue unrelated to the shape of the vehicle and its capacity to carry humans and luggage.
billforsternz 1y ago
I'm on holiday in Japan at the moment and I notice the cabs look like London cabs and are mainly black too. Made by Toyota. I haven't yet taken one, so I don't know if the similarity extends to the interior layout.

paulgb 1y ago

> Their determination? I wasn't entitled to a $3 refund. Frustratingly, Lyft’s position on this is that if you don’t like the car that arrives you should reject it when it arrives, otherwise you’re not entitled to a (even partial) refund, even when they know on their end that the car they sent doesn’t match what you paid extra for.

dataflow 1y ago
This seems... interesting, legally speaking. I imagine the idea is that you're implicitly accepting alterations to the previous contract by opting to take the car? Would that argument hold water, legally?
- bravoetch 1y ago
  I ran into a similar arbitration with a condo I rented for a long weekend. There was a significant issue and they weren't able to provide another place. We stayed there and had contractors in and out for the next couple of days. They refused to refund me, so I tried through my credit card to get a refund and they said "well you should have just left, then we would refund you. But since you stayed, the contract is fulfilled."
  - dataflow 1y ago
    Credit card disputes don't always match up with the law, so I wouldn't put too much weight on this from a legal standpoint, but good anecdote nonetheless.
- fortran77 1y ago
  Especially since you may have no time to wait for another car. There’s an element of “duress” here
  - user_7832 1y ago
    Yes, when you’re tired after a flight with heavy bags, you’re very much being forced to compromise. Any consumer could easily argue why they didn’t have a choice and had to go with what was available.

usehand 1y ago

Charges for goods not delivered as agreed falls under the protection of the Fair Credit Billing Act. If you made a good faith attempt to resolve with the merchant (which you did) you should use your credit card to charge back the amount (some let you request a partial charge back, but if not you can request a full one and explain in the extra info that you want a partial one). This might not seem worth it for $3, but if they get a lot of these the credit cards/banks might start giving them a hard time about it, so I think it's worth the minor hassle (everything can be done via the credit card app usually)

ribosometronome 1y ago
And then you're forever barred from using the service.
- ryandrake 1y ago
  Why would you want to continue using a service that is ripping you off? If you're at the point where your only recourse is to charge back, that's kind of a bridge burning moment.
  - overfeed 1y ago
    Let's retain a sense of proportion here; it was $3.
    - ryandrake 1y ago
      IMO it's attitudes like this that allow companies to continue ripping us all off for small amounts here and small amounts there. They know it's a small amount and most people won't push back, so they keep getting away with it. I suppose the only thing that stops me from hitting the nuclear button every time this happens is that there are a limited number of companies offering many categories of services, and I'd eventually have to charge back each of them and lose access to an entire industry composed entirely of shitty companies. It would be much better if companies were inclined to amicably settle small dollar disputes rather than the default which seems to be to stonewall, and then ban when the customer uses the only tool they have to push back.

Havoc 1y ago

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deleted 1y ago

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ChrisMarshallNY 1y ago

Another recent anecdote. A friend was recently in Milwaukee (first time ever. He was there for a conference). He, his wife, and another friend, wanted to go out to eat. They were given a wrong address. Could have been the source, or it could have been they screwed up writing it down. It was definitely a wrong address, though, that they gave to Uber. The driver picked them up, and took them to the address, which was deep in Da Hood. Not a good area for three middle-class white folks to be wandering around. The driver insisted they get out, even though it was clearly a wrong address, and a downright dangerous neighborhood (my friend has some experience with rough neighborhoods. If he said it was bad, it was bad). My friend offered to pay whatever it took, to get to the correct address (they had figured out their mistake, by then), but the driver refused to do that. It was probably algorithmically prohibited. My friend had never used Uber before (and never will, again), so wasn’t aware that you are supposed to be able to appeal to Uber. I have a feeling that my friend offered to rearrange the driver’s dental work (Did I mention that he was familiar with tough neighborhoods?), and got the driver to drop them off in a better area, where they caught a cab. Sounds like a bad customer experience. I doubt Uber ever heard the story. My friend never bothered contacting them, and I will bet that the driver didn’t.

School-Cotton 1y ago
Huh? Your friend paid uber to take them to an address, and they did.
- ChrisMarshallNY 1y ago
  Actually, it sounds like my friend was robbed. Classic gypsy cab robbery.
  - lcnPylGDnU4H9OF 1y ago
    The confusion around getting the address wrong is an interesting tell. If you think you’re not likely to make that mistake, anyway. It’s also a bit late to realize at that point since you’re already in the bad area. But it reminds me of tech support scams which usually have an element of convincing the victim that they made a mistake.

rfurmani 1y ago

I've had a couple bad experiences with Lyft recently, including one time the driver must have clicked that they picked me up while a block away, because I could see the lyft driving to the destination without me. I tried to get a refund since I was obviously waiting my start location the whole time, but the system claimed the drive went from start to finish (even though I wasn't in the car), so no refund.

z2 1y ago
Same thing happened to me, and the support system automatically decided nothing was wrong whatsoever despite my phone certainly sending a very different location from the driver. And the madness was I couldn't even book another ride as I was technically in one. So I ended up getting it resolved via the security panic button which did put me through to a real person who was empathetic to the issue.
- SOLAR_FIELDS 1y ago
  Is this some sort of a scam? The driver cannot even mark the ride as completed without being in the area right? So they have to drive it anyway. I can’t imagine they would be on the platform for long if this happened on a regular basis. I would say it’s probably an accident but how could this behavior be accidental? Someone might accidentally say that they picked you up, but they couldn’t accidentally then drive an empty car to the destination.
  - dgoldstein0 1y ago
    Maybe they picked up the wrong person and neither of them realized?
    - SOLAR_FIELDS 1y ago
      Entirely possible, people do get into wrong rideshare vehicles. Especially late night after people have been drinking. A decent driver will confirm the name when you’re in a place with a lot of pickups happening but if the language barrier is strong that might not happen.

ronyeh 1y ago

People paying more for Waymo doesn’t surprise me. I also once called for a comfort car, but it was a filthy Lexus. I’d much rather ride in a clean and well maintained Corolla. I pay more for Waymo and I’m happy to do it (as long as Waymo can detect when its interior is dirty so it can return itself to home base for cleaning.) I don’t have to sit awkwardly in a car with another guy who may drive in a way that annoys me. I can talk on my phone or with my family without having a random person listen in.

fragmede 1y ago
Though, the cameras on the Waymo are always on and pointed down at you looking at your screen.
throwaway2037 1y ago
I have only used car share once in my life. (My mother ordered it, and it was fine.) To me, a dirty car is pretty much unforgivable as a car share service. Do you report it on the app or just give a one/zero star rating and hope the car share service will fix it? > I don’t have to sit awkwardly in a car with another guy who may drive You hit the nail on the head. I cannot belive that I am 100+ posts into this discussion and no one has mentioned it. It was the first idea that popped into my head. How about if you are woman? I would gladly pay a bit more to have no other strangers in the car with me.
tuna74 1y ago
Instead you will have all of Google listen in.

hidelooktropic 1y ago

The Uber comfort designation frustratingly has nothing to do with the condition of the vehicle. I believe the parameters are age, seats, and model. From the driver's point of view, it just means that you are allowed to accept comfort rides but most of the time you're probably going to be picking up UberX passengers which are more plentiful. That means you're only slightly more likely to get one of the good comfort vehicles if you actually select the comfort tier.

bgwalter 1y ago

Before Uber and Lyft destroyed the functioning taxi market, you got Mercedes by default for a traditional, regulated taxi in many EU countries. You didn't have to argue, interact with a surveillance company, interact with customer service etc. All you needed to do is pick up the phone and get a luxury ride without tracking or surveillance.

FirmwareBurner 1y ago
>the functioning taxi market Was it? In many EU countries a lot of taxi drivers act like scammers: take you the long way around, they don't issue you receipt by default because they do tax fraud or steal from their employer, you can't pay by card because suddenly the card machine "doesn't work" so they drive you to an ATM, then you pay cash and they try to keep the change, they don't speak English or even the local language, they don't know the local streets or landmarks you're referring to because they're not from there, etc. All that is super annoying. Multiply it if you're a tourist or on a business trip or job interview. Ride sharing fixed all that since you just punched in the destination in the app (in your own language) and got the price upfront and shielded you from the antics of scammy drivers and the friction of getting to your destination. That's why ride sharing apps were so successful initially. It wasn't about the price, it was about the friction or lack thereof. >you got Mercedes by default for a traditional, regulated taxi in many EU countries Mostly IIRC Berlin, Brussels, Stockholm and some other rich countries, definitely not EU wide.
- nottorp 1y ago
  In the Mercedes running countries taxi rides are also something you do very rarely because they cost a lot. The rest are like the poster above me described. In Romania, the taxi drivers tried to strike in the capital when Uber showed up and everybody basically laughed at them.
- yb6677 1y ago
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vachina 1y ago
The surveillance is exactly why Uber and Lyft works. If drivers misbehave, evidence is all there. I’d honestly trade reliability over a temporary luxury ride in a Mercedes.

andrepd 1y ago

This is the kind of comment I'd expect to see on trustpilot, not hn

1oooqooq 1y ago

why do you think you will get better service with waymo when it's as established as the others? the whole market is a race to the bottom to extract rent from what should have been a municipality cost center. oh, do you like waymo automated support and driver better than Lyft automated support? or just can't imagine a world where tomorrow waymo will have aging cars too?

thanatosmin 1y ago

Tip: You can take Waymo to just outside the economy lot, then hop on the shuttle to the terminals. The shuttles have their own dedicated lane for going around the loop, so this isn't even that much more time. It's my new favorite way to get to LAX.

harmmonica 1y ago
Ah, I saw the economy lot as a potential option. I tried to get the location to resolve on the app, but I think I only tried the lot itself and not directly adjacent to it. Thank you for pointing this out!

perfectstorm 1y ago

another anecdote taking Lyft - they showed me $10.76 price for a trip to the airport when Uber showed $21. obviously i called Lyft and they placed a temporary charge on my credit card for $10.76. Once the driver dropped me off, i noticed that the base charge jumped to $16.76 + airport fees and my total with tips came to a bit over $27. I contacted Lyft and they denied and claimed that they always showed me $16.76. smh. i have proof from my credit card that they placed a hold for $10.76 and yet they refused to adjust the price.

aunty_helen 1y ago

You’ve got to invest with the VC money. As companies mature and enshitification begins, jump onto the next hot thing that’s going to disrupt the now incumbent. There’s no free lunch, but this is the closest we’ve got.