14 ms·
Ozempic and Wegovy are selected for Medicare's price negotiations
- DrBenCarson 2y agoWould rather have Mounjaro and Zepbound
- Someone1234 2y agoOr do both, and let them compete with each other for Medicare's business.
- arcticbull 2y agoThat's been so effective so far.
- Retric 2y agoCheap drugs have massive downward price pressure on alternatives.
- RobotToaster 2y agoThe cynic in me thinks they are only going for Semaglutide because the patent expires in several places in 2026, tirzepatide has another ten years.
- hobobaggins 2y agoThe patent on the manufacturing process, not the peptide itself.
- some_random 2y agoVery glad to see this, it's worth noting that the compounded semiglutide pricing (think generic, although it's more complicated than that) has been plummeting ever since it was introduced onto the market. We've seen some pretty incredible results and I really hope they get cheap enough to be prescribed more widely.
- Someone1234 2y agoIt is worth noting that Compounded Semaglutide sold in the US is still more expensive than branded Semaglutide sold in other markets, where national price negotiations occur. For example, it can be under $100/month in several European nations. The US just has no mechanism to control prices. There isn't really competition for specific drugs.
- chriscappuccio 2y agoThe research peptide sites are about the only reasonable places to buy this stuff
- malfist 2y agoNonsetrile compounding, like you'd do from the peptide sites is only safe for immediate use, and semaglutide is not that way. You mix up a vial and use it for a month or so. Can you do it? Sure. Are you going to get an infection from it? Probably not. Is it riskier than having a compounding pharmacy doing it the right way? Absolutely, and in a meaningful amount of risk. The type of infections you get from contaminated injections are not something you want to deal with
- spondylosaurus 2y agoHaven't done it myself but there is a robust DIY community for GLP-1 drugs. No idea if anyone's gotten hurt yet or if it's been pretty okay so far.
- malfist 2y agoOh sure, there absolutely is. Not only for glp-1s but for all kinds of peptides, especially SARMs. Doesn't mean it's safe. Lots of people trade off a small risk of harm for immediate benefits. Hell, look at alcohol.
- 2y ago
- qeternity 2y agoWhy is there a specific list? Why don't we just let Medicare negotiate.
- mportela 2y agoUnfortunately, that's all the Biden administration could get written into law. The Big Pharma lobby is too strong and definitely battled to keep this list as small as possible.
- ourmandave 2y agoAt least the door is cracked open and it's a start. Of course, Big Pharma will fight to slam it shut again.
- refurb 2y agoThat's because it's not really a solution. It's not a negotiation between two parties with equal power, it's just the government saying "either pay this price or you'll be penalized". The better solution is to allow parallel trade of pharmaceutical across borders. It will force countries paying far less to pay more and conversely the US paying less.
- Auracle 2y agoOr simply set our prices to the average or median of something like 5 hand-picked other countries - and make that not only for Medicare/caid but also for everyone else. It's ridiculous that hasn't been done yet.
- refurb 2y agoThat doesn’t work because other countries already do that - set price reference to a basket. You end up with a circular reference that spirals prices down. At some point that price is lower than the net positive profit point.
- autoexec 2y ago
- chvid 2y agoThe US is trying to squeeze the Danes to get hold of Greenland.
- chvid 2y agoIt is front page news in dk - leaders from major Danish companies have been called in by the government … novo is the biggest exporter to the us and the most obvious squeeze. Technically this is done by the Biden admin but obviously coordinated with the incoming Trump admin who has made their attention of using trade to squeeze Denmark in order to get full control of Greenland very clear.
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- xiphias2 2y agoNovo is just worth $300B, it's nothing compared to the many trillions of dollars Greenland is worth. But I guess politicians are much cheaper than that.
- phonon 2y agoWorth to whom? Greenland has about 44,000 inhabitants over age 17. I would imagine a majority would be willing to sell their citizenship to the US for quite a bit less than a million dollars each....
- ThrowawayTestr 2y agoThe natural resources that haven't been exploited
- 8note 2y agoalso, taxes on the northwest passage
- jajko 2y ago
- mh- 2y agoAre people who pay for their own prescriptions able to purchase them at these Medicare-negotiated prices?
- gnkyfrg 2y agoA lot if times yes. Almost always cash buyers pay the least, even less than those with insurance.
- hawski 2y agoI understand that those drugs are very useful, but in a way it feels for me like ancient Rome with its orgies and vomit inducing so they can eat more. At least looking at USA from Europe. The problem of sugar content, dietary choices and portion sizes remains. It is similar to gas guzzling cars. Sorry if it seems not empathic enough, that was not my intention. I know that the use of such drugs may be medically necessary. Edit: To serious answers: I was wrong, I stay corrected.
- rodonn 2y agoThese drugs (mostly) don't allow you to eat more unhealthy food, instead they make it easier to have the self control to avoid over eating / choose healthier foods.
- unshavedyak 2y agoTo add, they actually prevent you from eating some bad foods too. At least in the compound versions that i know people on. If they eat a lot of foods (some even good), their gastro issues are significant. So not only has it had substantial mental shifts around what they desire, but a bunch of foods are just not edible even if they wanted them anyway.
- platelminto 2y agoFrom what I understand these medications make you want to eat less in the first place, so it's not quite the same thing.
- unshavedyak 2y agoYup. The people i know on this didn't even get it for the weight, but the behavior changes. This isn't letting them eat the same stuff and lose weight, this is changing what they want to eat. They went from ADHD driven boredom eaters to not even thinking about food.
- cjbgkagh 2y ago
- siliconc0w 2y agoIt would be easier to squeeze Novo if they included Zepbound from Eli Lilly in the mix - we could argue that if we're going to spend unfathomable amounts on these medications we might as well buy the more effective medication from an American company.
- ein0p 2y agoThere's no need to spend unfathomable amounts. We just need to establish and enforce the favored nation status if they want to sell their drugs here. No drug (least of all US developed drug) should cost more in the US than it does elsewhere. That's what Trump was proposing in his last term. Because the Congress is corrupt AF, that went nowhere, but maybe we could give it another try now that his mandate is much stronger? As things currently are, we're getting robbed.
- alephnerd 2y agoOr we can offer to take Greenland off the table /s
- ein0p 2y agoIt's not on the table in the first place. Trump is just forcing fake news MSM to talk about BS to disorient them and make it harder to attack his transition. Expect more of this - he seems to be advised by someone competent this time.
- tonymet 2y agomy favorite part of ozempic is that it settled the debate on calorie reduction.
- parpfish 2y agoDid it? The drugs clearly lead to reduced appetite, therefore reduced calories. But do we know that the drugs aren’t also causing other important metabolic changes?
- nradov 2y agoThe drugs seem to cause a small increase in resting heart rate. Whether that is due to metabolic or neurologic changes (or something else) isn't completely clear.
- bitmasher9 2y agoWas it ever really a debate? There’s tons of experimental evidence that shows calorie reduction leads to weight loss, even without pharmaceuticals. The Ozempic data can be explained simply by this factor. There doesn’t seem to be enough data fluctuation between the two sets to indicate a significant set of unknown variables impacting the data.
- parpfish 2y agoyeah, but do ozempic et al only rely on calorie reduction? i find it hard to believe that hormones only affect one thing in isolation. it may be doing something like a) suppressing appetite to reduce caloric intake AND b) shielding against a lowered metabolism due to calorie restriction.
- tonymet 2y agoIf there is predominant evidence of significant calorie reduction leading to weight loss, and no evidence of the metabolic hypothesis , what should be our conclusion?
- 2y ago
- aurizon 2y agoThe USA is a racket cubed. https://www.healthsystemtracker.org/brief/prices-of-drugs-for-weight-loss-in-the-us-and-peer-nations/#List%20prices%20of%20drugs%20used%20for%20weight%20loss%20in%20the%20U.S.%20and%20peer%20nations https://www.healthsystemtracker.org/brief/prices-of-drugs-fo... The pharmacies are also in on it https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC11147645/ https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC11147645/
- thrance 2y agoDon't forget the tariffs that are bound to make it 30% more expensive.
- aurizon 2y agoThe Pharma chains get product at world wholesale, and in the case of Ozempic = about $100 at the pharmacy where it is picked up = pharmacy pays $75. Same cost base = $500-900 in the USA. 30% tariff will be based on the $75 base import cost = small
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- samaltmanfried 2y agoI find something really gross and dystopian about the idea of Ozempic. Developing the willpower to resist short-term gratification, and the ability to make long-term decisions about your diet and health are some of the most important ingredients to living a good life. The idea of letting a drug do the thinking for you because you just can't trust yourself really horrifies me.
- firesteelrain 2y agoI took compounded Mounjaro for two months. It was like a jolt to the system and got me back on track. I learned how to eat better and alter what I eat plus tracking it. Started walking and going to the gym. Started with 7k steps and now easily over 12k a day on average. I don’t drink soda and if I do it js Coke Zero, Pepsi Zero or Diet Coke. We just don’t buy it. I didn’t know about maximizing my protein and fiber. It wasn’t short term at all like you say. Something was seriously wrong. It’s everything though - if it was that easy to just start doing it then people would. I needed a jolt and impetus to get better. I was depressed, worryful, everything. I have lost 40 lb. I went from 255 to 229 with the assistance of Mounjaro. I stopped taking it but kept up with the regimen. I am now down to 214. Some people who take it don’t do it right, they still eat crap and so those are the people who rebound or think they need to go up to 15. I was taking 2.5 then 5 when I stopped. Yea it is willpower and discipline. Being on the medicine as an assistant along with a lot of research spurred by the community such as maximizing protein, fiber and water intake to become satiated was all that did it with exercise.
- foxyv 2y agoConsider the fact that, if a drug can make you skinny, perhaps a drug can also make you fat. Or, even your own body can make you fat. Sometimes, what we think are our choices, have more to do with our biology and environment. Just like you can't will yourself to be healthy if you are sick with the Flu. Some people can't just will themselves to be skinny. This is why we have drugs and treatments, because our bodies are not perfect machines that work the way we want them to.
- pkaye 2y ago
- rs999gti 2y agoNot the lifeline for us fatties. > Medicare enrollees, however, still won’t be able to access the drugs for obesity under a federal law that prohibits the program from paying for weight loss treatments Also, you have to be severely ill or elderly to get Medicare. This is for their diabetic treatment.
- BoingBoomTschak 2y ago[flagged]
- tclancy 2y agoI am intrigued to know what would cause you to post a raw thought that unkind.
- knuckleheadsmif 2y agoThat’s because Medicare only covers drugs for approved FDA usage. It’s covered for diabetes but not weight loss. In general this is good policy. It is possible to challenge for some cases but generally that is the rule. It’s a perfectly reasonable way to both control costs and prevent harm. If the drug manufacturers wanted it to be covered for weight loss there IS a process. File the correct paperwork with the FDA and do the rigorous studies that were don’t for the approved usage.
- djur 2y agoWegovy is approved for weight loss (since 2021).
- wormius 2y agoMy ACA insurance (because I was unemployed) covered Rybelsus (pill form, which is a much higher dose due to lack of absorption through the stomach), then in like October or November they said "nah" and said "go to Ozempic" I had just completed my first two sets of increases before the final uppage to be on the stable dose, when insurance said "Nah." So my doc RX'd Trulicity to see if they would cover that, which, for some reason they also didn't. I haven't had the time or energy during the holidays to deal with it, so now I'm dealing with increased hunger from going cold turkey off these things all because of bullshit micromanagement from shitty insurance companies on the market place. If this makes it better and easier for companies to actually pay out for this I am 100% for it, there should not be a constant jerking about for what is or isn't paid. Also - this wasn't for weightloss (which I assume would have been Wegovy approved), this was for diabetes, and it was under control with Rybelsus, and I assume Ozempic, though we were still in the process of building up to it (I was on max dose of Rybelsus and I'm pretty sure I needed the max Ozempic as well). If they had given a reason for the denial it'd be one thing but it was just a blanket denial. I just hope this makes it easier for folks who need it to be able to obtain it.
- ddorian43 2y agoJust do keto diet. Assuming T2D. Its the easiest disease it fixes. Some people cant have it all in life. You gotta sacrifice. The carbs in our case. Source: I do it for other reasons.
- solresol 2y agoWhen I last looked up the literature, Keto diet was one of the least effective interventions. That is, if you follow it, I'm sure it works. But the vast majority of people drop out of keto diets very quickly. So it's lousy advice and an unsuccessful intervention. It's a bit like saying to a patient "you gotta sacrifice -- you should doing 3 hours a day of cardio". If they do follow through with it, it will work. But the vast majority of people won't be able to maintain doing that.
- ddorian43 2y ago
- honestSysAdmin 2y agohttps://www.vox.com/22553793/gila-monster-lizard-venom-inspired-obesity-drug-semaglutide
- BurningFrog 2y agoThe tradeoff with these price controls is that they make current medications cheaper, but make future medications substantially less profitable, making them less likely to be developed. It's rare to see this mentioned, so I'm trying to build awareness.
- thrance 2y agoYou believe in a lie, most of the insane margins go towards sharholders of private laboratories or insurance companies and other parasites. Very little of it goes toward actual R&D, and the foundational part of it is done by public labs anyway, that are payed for by taxes.
- BurningFrog 2y agoDeveloping an approved drug costs 1-2 billion dollars. If you can't recoup that by selling the drug, developing drugs is not sustainable and will not happen. And the US is really the only country where you can sell for substantially more than manufacturing cost. Ozempic manufacturers do make huge profits now, but that's quite rare. This is a tough industry to make money in.
- loeg 2y agoInteresting that they're negotiating semaglutide (Ozempic/Wegovy) but not tirzepatide (Zepbound/Mounjaro). Cynically, maybe a ploy to bolster a US pharma (Lily) as opposed to Danish Novo? I don't know anything about how this program selects drugs to negotiate.
- lstamour 2y agoIt wouldn't surprise me if they picked who would be included based on which drugs should be relatively price flexible yet cost a lot. I've noticed that ozempic/wegovy prices have dropped in many markets recently, even price controlled ones, especially compared to Mounjaro, as the latter is seen as more effective and in short supply and has fewer generics available still. In fact, by introducing new multi-dose versions to different regions, I'm starting to see Mounjaro prices reportedly double for some. The real kicker is that for some brands/doses the price doesn't vary whether you get more or less of the drug - so people end up asking to for a prescription to the highest dose off-label and then split the dose themselves. For example, you can click the auto-injector pen a fewer number of clicks to measure out a smaller dose than what is normally injected by the pen, then relatively safely save it in the fridge for longer than recommended even without preservatives (some pens have and some don't). It's frustrating when pricing decisions are made assuming insurance benefits and yet insurance isn't always available, e.g. unemployment. This thinking even applies in places that do regulate drug prices. But hey, you can always sign up for the manufacturer's discount program to get it cheaper, so, win-win right?
- loeg 2y agoAs others have pointed out, the drugs on this list go into effect in 2027, which is after the EU semaglutide patents expire (2026), so that might be a pretty compelling reason for semaglutide pricing to be more flexible than tirzepatide. > The real kicker is that for some brands/doses the price doesn't vary whether you get more or less of the drug - so people end up asking to for a prescription to the highest dose off-label and then split the dose themselves. FWIW, I'm paying cash buying it directly from Lily, and they charge $400/mo for the 2.5mg dose and $550/mo for the 5mg dose. So, some price differentiation between dose sizes, but not linear.
- black_13 2y ago[dead]
- dbg31415 2y agoThe fact that it's up to the insurance provider to choose what medication they cover is so absurd. Your doctor can prescribe medication, and the insurance company can say, "Nah, we choose not to cover that. And we don't cover the generic versions either!" It's so shitty when you have to change insurance plans, and then get stuck holding the bill for medication that you were taking, but is no longer covered under your new plan -- especially for weight loss drugs that don't seem to be even like 80% covered under any plan you can get on your own. Insurance should cover everything. Period. Full stop. Just because you change jobs doesn't mean you should ever have to change medications. Anyway, Free Luigi! =P
- bdauvergne 2y agoJust coming here to say that most of the world (outside the USA) does not need Ozempic at all to be healthy. So maybe this medication is really a luxury.
- mateus1 2y agoI'm not in the US and know plenty of people that use it. It's also maybe a 1/5 of the US cost, even accounting for the exchange rate.
- bdauvergne 2y agoIn France it's reimbursed but only if you are diabetic. I'm not sure people talking about it here are diabetic.
- nojito 2y agoThis isn't true at all. The obesity epidemic is international. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_obesity_rate https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_obesity_r...
- bdauvergne 2y agoSelf inflicted epidemic...
- hackeraccount 2y agoIf you were a drug company how much money would you spend on developing an Ozempic/Wegovy follow on drug? Price controls like this are popular because the benefits are easy to see and the costs are distributed and nebulous. Excepting things like the fires in LA which are distributed and obvious.