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Tesla on track to smash targets after producing almost a million EVs in 6 months
- brucethemoose2 3y agoAdding my sample size of one: I do see quite a few Model 3s on the road these days.
- ripper1138 3y agoThe tax credit is hard to pass up!
- themitigating 3y agoIn CA there's a state tax credit that is equal to the federal which makes it insane to pass up
- currio 3y agoDoesn't California have a income limit for tax credit eligibility? 135k for single income and 200k if you are jointly filing?
- bonestamp2 3y agoThe federal credit has an income limit too. I don't like that there is an income level cutoff. Hear me out... a single person with an income of $299k living in Nebraska has way more expendable income than a single income family with 4 kids with an income of $299k living in the bay area.
- hedora 3y agoYou can lease a kia or hyundai for one month, then buy it, and get the federal credit, regardless of income. In order to bypass the made in America restrictions, they take the commercial fleet credit, then pass it on to you.
- currio 3y agoIs that right? If you lease and buy you get federal credit regardless of the income? Does it apply to any manufacturer?
- themitigating 3y agoYes. This happens with alot of subsidies but how would you determine what a person should receive? People could have multiple children, debt, sick relatives, etc. Maybe that 300k person in Nebraska had 20 kids or something. Using the area as a measurement is complex
- bonestamp2 3y ago> how would you determine what a person should receive? If it's truly an incentive, incentivize everyone. I know people who make $1 million/year who will argue over $10. $7500 would absolutely affect their behavior even though they can afford an EV without it.
- brucethemoose2 3y agoDoes it apply to the Model X? Environmental subsidies on a $100k car doesn't seem quite right... Doubly so if it applies to stuff like the Hummer EV.
- bee_rider 3y agoAlthough, every Hummer that is replaced by a Hummer EV is a pretty big win.
- brianwawok 3y agoFederal does not
- themitigating 3y agoNo, 45k for cars and 60k for pickups , suvs, minivans. https://cleanvehiclerebate.org/en/eligibility-guidelines https://cleanvehiclerebate.org/en/eligibility-guidelines But just to add to a reply. A Hummer EV charged with renewables is better than an SUV as long as it lasts more than x miles . Obviously there's complexity about what it's replacing, where that goes blah blah
- omnimus 3y agoIt is truly insane that its 15k more for large cars. Afaik its really bad that everyone has big cars when they absolutely dont need them. No matter if they are EVs they are still lot less efficient… Seems like this could have been incentive for people to go back to normal sized cars - it should have been same or even more for cars than for large vehicles.
- mensetmanusman 3y agoIt helps create the economies of scale to make the supply chain more likely to support lower costs later.
- frumper 3y agoThe Central Valley in California has another tax credit on top of that too.
- jrflowers 3y agoTargets must be shaped like children
- xref 3y agolol the true karmic hero of this thread, your sacrifice will not be forgotten https://www.theverge.com/2022/8/25/23321553/tesla-takedown-videos-child-mannequins-dawn-project https://www.theverge.com/2022/8/25/23321553/tesla-takedown-v...
- panick21_ 3y agoYou mean the fake video made by a competitor that then refused to actually release the footage from inside the car that proves the video wasn't staged. And the same test was repeated with non fake conditions and couldn't be reproduced. Amazing how people can dislike on person so much to then buy the bullshit from another complete charlatan hook line and sinker.
- ripper1138 3y agoAn amazing achievement. For reference, Toyota produced 10 million cars last year.
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- hackernewds 3y agowhy is it amazing? the govt gives Tesla billions in taxpayer money and carbon offset $, which is both 100% margin.
- yuppie_scum 3y agoSeems like the conversation is about the number of cars it produces, not revenue or profits.
- toomuchtodo 3y agoAny automaker is eligible for those subsides if they sell EVs (with a bonus based on US content). Their lack of will or ability to deliver is all that holds them back. Sell EVs if you want government support. I am unwilling to argue the merit of EV subsidies, that conversation has no value. It’s amazing because Tesla built an EV that is wildly in demand roughly around the price of the average new car accounting for subsides. The Model Y was the best selling car globally last quarter, beating out Toyota. https://electrek.co/2023/05/25/tesla-model-y-is-now-the-worlds-best-selling-car-first-ev-to-do-so/ https://electrek.co/2023/05/25/tesla-model-y-is-now-the-worl...
- 7e 3y agoTesla holds special government status in China that other non-domestic car companies do not have.
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- wnevets 3y agoFSD will also be released next year [1] [1] https://futurism.com/video-elon-musk-promising-self-driving-cars https://futurism.com/video-elon-musk-promising-self-driving-...
- alex_young 3y agoFSD will be released last year and the year before that and the year before that and the year before that.
- bonestamp2 3y agoYep, that's a good summary of the link.
- LeoPanthera 3y agoFSD will always be released next year.
- berbec 3y agohttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Five-year_plans_of_the_Soviet_Union https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Five-year_plans_of_the_Soviet_...
- fiddlerwoaroof 3y agoI drive with FSD almost every day and it does a great job.
- phkahler 3y agoUntil it doesn't.
- seanmcdirmid 3y agoThat is true with driving in general. You might get lucky and avoid that 1 in a million chance of getting into an accident for a long time.
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- stubybubs 3y ago> well placed to achieve its target of producing 2 million in 2023. Wasn't the original goal to sell 2 million, not produce 2 million?
- jandrese 3y agoI think most Teslas are already sold before they leave the factory floor.
- stubybubs 3y agoThat definitely used to be the case, they seem to be building inventory and idling factories lately.
- jfoster 3y agoYou could be right about the inventory, but isn't idling factories the exact opposite of what they're doing if they're smashing production targets?
- 93po 3y agoshhhh just go with it
- manquer 3y agoBoth could theoretically possible if they have bought on online a lot of factories or lines . This is not the actual case while possible, they have been investing heavily in production capacities in Berlin , Shanghai, Texas etc however they are not so far outstripping demand with new capacity.
- jfoster 3y agoYeah, theoretically of course, but if they were bringing online that degree of manufacturing then they would also match it with higher targets.
- NotYourLawyer 3y agoGood. Now where’s my cybertruck?
- spacekarenbad 3y ago[flagged]
- aresant 3y agoAmericas best selling vehicle, decades running is the F150 and place 2/3 usually are Chevy/Dodge trucks. What is HNs view on the Cybertruck? Outside of the design will it be substantially differentiated from the American leaders?
- XorNot 3y agoIt's going to launch and then be silently killed. The Cybertruck is late to the party, where Ford is delivering actual products normal people can want. Worse, the Cybertruck is looking less and less useful: the payload capacity is ? The tray size is ? Basically what is a Cybertruck for? Who is buying it compared to another vehicle at this point? It's a pile of features which no one needs, and very quiet about the ones people do. No one needs "shatter proof windows" in a car. No one needs it to be a boat. What I need is it to carry heavy loads and seat 5 people. Can it do that? Can it do that better then something else?
- lost_tourist 3y agoIf the bed size is like the lightning couldn't it just be an expensive electric pickup for the top 10% earners to drive around in the city?
- kortilla 3y agoThe lightning has a dog shit battery though. It has terrible range even without towing/payload load. Nobody has an actual viable electric truck right now. Cybertruck stats remain to be seen.
- helf 3y agoUm, it's rated for 230 miles with the standard battery and 320 with extended. This is dogshit... how?
- clouddrover 3y agoYou'll just have to buy a Chevy Silverado EV then: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oUN358zio7A https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oUN358zio7A https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TGPxjg_jDog https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TGPxjg_jDog
- 7e 3y agoBYD had an even better June: https://www.forbes.com/sites/russellflannery/2023/07/02/warren-buffett-backed-ev-maker-byds-sales-nearly-doubled-in-june/?sh=4b214e7d41bd https://www.forbes.com/sites/russellflannery/2023/07/02/warr.... It’s now on track to eclipse Tesla as the world’s biggest BEV manufacturer.
- bufferoverflow 3y agoDon't confuse production numbers with sales. China has a problem with overproduction in some areas, EVs in particular. That's why they have fields of rotting EVs that they can't sell. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1SEfwoqKRU8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1SEfwoqKRU8 Notice how that Forbes article confuses sales with shipments. They aren't the same thing.
- resolutebat 3y agoChina has a much larger problem with unsellable ICE vehicles which don't meet the new emission standards they're about to introduce.
- toomuchtodo 3y agoGenuinely surprised they haven’t shipped them for sale to Africa. It’s where a lot of old combustion vehicles from Europe end up. Maybe not worth the effort?
- resolutebat 3y ago23 million cars were sold in China last year, and that figure was lower than usual because of COVID. https://www.factorywarrantylist.com/car-sales-by-country.html https://www.factorywarrantylist.com/car-sales-by-country.htm... Meanwhile, the number in all of Africa combined was 790,100. https://www.statista.com/statistics/473598/passenger-car-sales-in-africa/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/473598/passenger-car-sal... I'm sure they'll ship some off to Africa if they can't find any other options, but as you say they're competing against used clunkers from Europe, so the margins will be terrible.
- refurb 3y agoFor all the trash talk about how Tesla will implode, the stock is at ~5/8th of it's peak in 2021. Pretty good considering the tech stock drop.
- ceejayoz 3y agoThe folks who predicted the subprime mortgage crisis nearly went bankrupt waiting for their bets to pay off. Sometimes predictions are correct on the facts but not the timing; we'll see. (Twitter similarly took longer than a lot of folks expected to implode, but the wheels seem to be coming off...) Tesla's share price is still that of a technology company rather than a car company. It's not yet entirely clear whether that's warranted, but their self-driving moat is rapidly shrinking. I'd much rather be a SpaceX investor than a Tesla one.
- _fizz_buzz_ 3y agoI do believe there was a point where Tesla could have imploded. But I think we are well past this now. Tesla figured out their production and most of their technical issues. The competition is getting a bit stiffer, however Tesla has so much volume now that traditional car makers missed the point where they could have been a real danger to Tesla by competing in the EV market.
- ceejayoz 3y agoTesla the company, I think, is unlikely to implode and disappear. I think they'll be one of the large automakers for a long time, competing with the other big ones. Their share price still has a decent chance of doing so, down to a P/E ratio more similar to the other car makers.
- CameronNemo 3y agoYes I think the pe is largely based on the assumption that they will be able to transition to selling high margin assisted driving services, but that remains to be seen. Other self driving plays are much more mature and actually in production (e.g. Waymo), but still facing criticisms and odd behavior.
- Pxtl 3y agoSo the trick is to get Elon distracted with other projects, huh.
- victor9000 3y agoIt's amazing what competent people can achieve once they stop being micromanaged by a narcissist.
- panick21_ 3y agoWhat's amazing is how people on HN can be so ignorant. Look at Tesla sales growth over the last 10 years. Its pretty consistent. You can not look at that growth and say 'look here is where Musk got distracted'. Also, the success now, is because of the technology and investment work done 3-5 years ago. Not liking a person is fine, Musk has issues, but there is no reason to drop your brain when evaluating business numbers.
- victor9000 3y agoIt's amazing how you switched metrics from production numbers to sales numbers to make a point. Nevermind the number of unrealized buyers who are passing on the brand because of it's toxic leadership, but perhaps you can switch metrics again to counter this point?
- panick21_ 3y agoThe difference between production and sales is literally utterly and completely irrelevant in regards to the argument you made. How you can even think that matters in this context is beyond me. > Nevermind the number of unrealized buyers who are passing on the brand because of it's toxic leadership, but perhaps you can switch metrics again to counter this point? What could have happened in some other theoretical universe that only exists in your imagination is utterly irrelevant.
- victor9000 3y ago
- ronnier 3y agoI have a 2021 Model Y and a 2023 S Plaid. I'll never go back. The Plaid is truly an amazing car. It will beat super cars in 0-60 and the quarter mile (at a fraction of the cost), seat 5, reach speeds over 200 mph, has lots of storage in the trunk + frunk, has an SSD + GPU with an 18" screen that has Steam installed and works with wireless controllers, self driving is great, the phone placement is the most optimal I've ever seen in a car, no key needed (just walk up to the car and it knows you are you because of your phone, or use a credit card style key), and the audio system it outstanding. Oh, and the white interior looks like a space ship, makes no noise, has long range, has a screen in the back to watch Netflix and YouTube. Other than looks, I can't figure out why I'd buy an exotic car (I don't track them).
- qwerpy 3y agoReally interesting the almost universally negative replies to this. From the class of people who gush about whatever latest shiny device Apple put out. Is it jealousy? Or politically motivated?
- eat 3y agoThe only thing motivated here is your implication that the answer must be one of these two reductive answers, while so many commenters have given very reasonable and valid reasons for their opinion.
- cbeach 3y agoThe “Musk Bad” responses are 100% political. He’s revealed his hand, in that he’s not a Blue Tribe member like most other tech CEOs. So now, every member of the Blue Tribe hate him. They will attack him just as they attack anyone prominent from outside their own tribe. Tribalism sucks. I wish people could rise above it.
- Shawnj2 3y agoTeslas do have problems other cars at their price point don’t. I’ve been in my fair share of Model 3’s and my 2006 Lexus RX handles much better and has a vastly nicer interior than a new 2023 luxury car. Also software wise driver assist is awesome but honestly as long as I can get CarPlay to work anything else is fluff, and I bought a $400 box you can mod into the car to make that happen. Without the tax credit it’s arguably not a great value What I do think people don’t give credit Musk enough for is that he’s willing to put money into some completely bonkers ideas and make them work. EV’s and affordable space travel were laughable ideas until Tesla and SpaceX. Without Elon we would not have the nuspace industry as it exists today
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- izacus 3y agoAre we cheering a road to single manufacturer monopoly again?
- dickersnoodle 3y agoI wonder if that's because Musk is really busy flushing Twitter down the toilet and isn't around to interfere as much in Tesla...
- panick21_ 3y agoThat makes absolutely no sense. Tesla has had amazing growth for the last 10 plus years. They are now able to sell as much as they do because of all the investment and engineering done 3-5 years ago. The CEO paying slightly less attention for a few months doesn't magically make factories produce more cars.
- oldnet 3y agoA few things - Tesla beat estimates about 20k but tesla had severals sales - I thing 4 or 5 times - Tesla still didn't delivery 15k cars = parked in warehouse because no orders
- relativ575 3y ago> Tesla beat estimates about 20k but tesla had severals sales - I thing 4 or 5 times Yes they did do discount. Tesla still has higher margin than pretty much all the other car makers. They still have room to adjust price if they want. > Tesla still didn't delivery 15k cars = parked in warehouse because no orders Any difference that other car makers? There are always cars in the inventory for all makers. For Tesla you can see the numbers. Others may hide it by shipping unsold vehicles to dealers. It's also not "no orders", only "not yet ordered" Also, Tesla did deliver 466K vehicles, which is a record. With all the competition coming and the headwinds, they still manage to beat the record.
- panick21_ 3y agoTesla inventory rates are still very low in terms of overall industry. And this quarter the inventory went from 15 to 16, so it almost didn't change at all.
- guerby 3y ago15k cars is three days of production for Tesla. So that's about no stock.
- RickJWagner 3y agoEvery EV Tesla sells is an EV another producer does NOT sell. Tesla also has a good margin, making money on every sale. Other producers LOSE money on every sale. It's impossible to predict the future, but it's not hard to imagine one where Tesla dominates the EV market in a pretty big way.
- gryzzly 3y agoThe guy is busy destroying twitter so they managed to do some work in his absence.
- xyst 3y agoI wonder if TSLA improved their build quality or if it took a nose dive during this push. I guess we will see over the next year.
- cevn 3y agoAnecdata, my recent Tesla is better and worse in some ways - well put together, slight panel gaps, but some edges are sharp enough to cut myself on. Wonder what service will say. If you are looking for build quality I would still look elsewhere. Tesla is literally cutting corners.
- iamleppert 3y agoDoes anyone find the timing of all this suspicious? It’s like once Elon left to focus on Twitter (and destroy what’s left of it), Tesla is suddenly doing a lot better. Probably without his constant meddling people are actually able to do their jobs.
- wiihack 3y agoIn which sense is Tesla doing better after Elon "left"? The sales seem to be pretty much on track with what's expected [1]. Software and manufacturing quality doesn't seem to be much affected either. [1] https://www.statista.com/statistics/502208/tesla-quarterly-vehicle-deliveries/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/502208/tesla-quarterly-v...
- zeku 3y agoI think the process of getting a car into the hands of a consumer takes much longer than 1 year so I wouldn't put this up to Elon being less involved.