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The Camera-Shy Hoodie
- deleted 4y ago[deleted]
- pluc 4y agoThere's a bunch more adversarial fashion over at... adversarialfashion.com https://adversarialfashion.com/ https://adversarialfashion.com/
- TechBro8615 4y agoAlso see: https://www.reflectacles.com/ https://www.reflectacles.com/
- mojomark 4y agoReflectacles. I bought myself a pair of brass reflectacles. Reflectacles.
- MonkeyMalarky 4y agoJust don't leave any reviews or buy it with your own credit card, otherwise your unique and cool cyberpunk fashion will lead right back to you: https://www.vice.com/en/article/bv8j8w/a-tattoo-and-an-etsy-shirt-led-cops-to-arrest-woman-accused-of-burning-cop-cars https://www.vice.com/en/article/bv8j8w/a-tattoo-and-an-etsy-...
- TechBro8615 4y agoAlso, don't burn cop cars if you can avoid it.
- selectodude 4y agoOr be a foreigner here using an ESTA. Generally committing crimes after giving the government every little piece of information about you is a bad idea.
- dylan604 4y agoThese seem much less functional and more of a fashion statement. Defeating ALPR readers when you're not a car seems bizarre. Where the OP is actually actively protecting one's identity from being followed. So even though the name says adversarial, how is it actually being adversarial?
- troyvit 4y ago"The patterns on the goods in this shop are designed to trigger Automated License Plate Readers, injecting junk data in to the systems used by the State and its contractors to monitor and track civilians and their locations." I wonder if it does.
- dylan604 4y agoThey have mobile ALPR cameras mounted onto cars aimed at where one would suspect a license plate would be visible from that position. So, unless someone wearing a shirt like this is laying in the street, not likely. Maybe places like parking garages would have some mounted where a person wearing one of these might walk by, but the significantly small numbers would make any junk data insignificant. So, I cannot imagine these being useful to that end. Other cameras like traffic cameras or toll boths or similar mounting locations would also not be hampered by these shirts unless you make them into a complete body wrap for the car. However, I do see them being useful as conversation starters when someone asks WTF you're wearing. It would have a much better chance of increasing awareness of ALPR tech and possibly other camera tracking tech in general. But even that is pretty much meaningless in the grand scheme of things.
- Someone1234 4y agoI'm surprised nobody is producing swag with the EURion constellation[0] on it. You'd be surprised how many random image processing libraries it breaks. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EURion_constellation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EURion_constellation
- myself248 4y agoI've been wondering this for years too. Does it work if it's slightly distorted, as on a garment, or not viewed face-on? I guess it's time to haul out the t-shirt press...
- popcalc 4y agohttps://output.jsbin.com/nikoxod/26/ https://output.jsbin.com/nikoxod/26/ Just need to head over to redbubble now.
- 98codes 4y agoThe strobing seems to defeat the effect -- you only need one good frame with a face showing to defeat the hoodie, and this seemed slow enough that I could pick up the face of the demo guy with my own eyes in realtime.
- jwong_ 4y agoSeems like the strobing is intended to defeat the autoexposure compensation. Otherwise the camera might see the brightlight and reduce exposure to compensate. Concentrating the lighting on the face only and staying far away from cameras might help that without requiring the strobe.
- wstuartcl 4y agoThe leds are placed on the chest -- seems like a miss to not place them also around the hoodie near the face. I would suspect even without strobing the over saturation would work should those leds be surrounding the face. All of that said, wearing something like this out (unless it becomes super commonplace lol) just screams watch me closely (and easily follow me back to some known origin).
- tablespoon 4y ago> The leds are placed on the chest -- seems like a miss to not place them also around the hoodie near the face. Based on the documentation, all that would probably do is allow the effect to work at slightly closer distances.
- tablespoon 4y ago> The leds are placed on the chest -- seems like a miss to not place them also around the hoodie near the face. Based on the documentation, all that would probably do is allow the effect to work at slightly closer distances: > In addition, the LEDs need to be a minimum distance from the camera to be effective, as the cone of light from them needs to be wide enough to overlap with the cameras view of the wearers head. In practice, this is about 12ft (~3m). Putting them on the chest would help with ergonomics. It would work even if you have the hood off and the LEDs would be more consistently positioned.
- bluedino 4y agoPeople wear facemasks in camera footage now, so you have to go by their pants, belts, shoes, fingerprints..
- TechBro8615 4y agoGait analysis is a more surveillable fingerprint anyway, since it can work with lower resolution cameras. Tag someone on a high res camera with facial recognition and as long as you've seen their gait once, you'll be able to identify them again.
- jamiek88 4y agoStones in our shoes, masks on our faces, strobing hoodies a boring dystopia indeed.
- TechBro8615 4y agoDiscussed previously, apparently (found via Google search for `anti gait recognition shoes`, lol): https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18401892 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18401892 I like the comment about the Ministry of Silly Walks.
- mananaysiempre 4y agoIIRC stones in shoes as a gait recognition defence were a plot point in Doctorow’s Little Brother (2008).
- jamiek88 4y agoYeah I read that in a novel too. It’s a common idea.
- beardedwizard 4y agoBecause spies actively use the technique and it's routinely discussed in that setting.
- deleted 4y ago[deleted]
- RicoElectrico 4y agoThere's always a relevant xkcd: https://xkcd.com/1105/ https://xkcd.com/1105/
- blobbers 4y agoGreat, so now when the cops get aggressive with you there will be an IR LED blurring any evidence you might have had? >_> It’s 2023 pandemic if you want to be anonymous wear a mask.
- radlad 4y agoHah, I had a different thought: How long until every Ring/Nest doorbell video looks like this? It does seem to only work against IR cameras though - presumably brightly lit scenes won't struggle.
- _2uwr 4y agoIF you submit a UK GDPR DSAR or equivalent in your own country, the cops will deliberately not hand over the data, including Axiom bodycam footage, under the pretence its all used for law enforcement purposes, which the legislation lets them do. I know, I've tried. I've even been told its up to the individual officer whether they want to submit their bodycam footage, which is a great way for the police to cover up crimes, considering they already have the option to switch on the recording, and these bodycams have a 30sec buffer which gets included when they enable recording. Police cars also have built in AV recording to monitor what goes on inside a police car. You would be amazed at how criminal the Police in the UK really are, they do a good job of PR on social media and the press doing them favours to get leads on stories. You are better off having your own stealth AV devices recording your every move and sound 24/7, built into jewellery, head torches, clothing, dash cams for vehicles, and smart phones recording all the time, so you dont even have to bother taking a photo or video, just point and record. And where possible have it streamed live back to your servers with a dead man's switch. Its the only way to combat the intelligent entity's who seek to dominate. You are living through a technological arms race.
- LegitShady 4y agosure, but this hoodie works as effectively as the wyze cameras that make my own surveillance around my home.
- 4y ago
- ShuffleBoard 4y agoObligatory Key & Peele prior art reference: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ztRSm_SJP58 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ztRSm_SJP58
- patja 4y agoAlso was a key plot device in Luther season 5
- Fricken 4y agoOff camera it's just a generic, anonymous hoody, but on camera it is readily identified as the unique and unmistakeable camera shy hoody!
- brianwawok 4y agoImagine you are working for a three letter agency scanning a crowd. 999/1000 people look similar. One is just a glowing sun of light. Which one do you go take to the backroom?
- Brian_K_White 4y agoThe shiny decoy.
- deleted 4y ago[deleted]
- amelius 4y agoThe point of this webpage is that more people should be wearing it.
- TechBro8615 4y agoProtest organizers should hand out these hoodies, or someone should sell them to protestors through some kind of pop-up shop ambassador program where an affiliate at each protest sells the apparel on consignment.
- ilyt 4y agoOnly really work at night tho.
- justinator 4y agoIR Cameras are used in daytime, too.
- deeviant 4y agoPrivacy is both important and valuable. However, during the product demonstration, was it truly necessary to have the actor dressed entirely in black, walking into someone's backyard? What specific use case do they believe they are showcasing with this demonstration?
- verall 4y agoLooks like a safety concern honestly, a bunch of bright IR lights flashing around your face isn't good for your eyes.
- brk 4y agoactually no, the 850nm wavelength of common IR LEDs does not have any adverse affect on your eyes at these power levels.
- verall 4y agoDo you have a source or something? I'm not trying to doubt you but I'm interested in learning further. I work on cameras with IR emitter and there are many safety protocols, emitter covers, warning signs, etc. for a simple IR camera that we are instructed to abide by.
- brk 4y agoI work with a company that makes high-power IR illuminators and we just went through certification testing with some units that are roughly 100x the output power of this example and they did not pose an eye hazard. There is a bunch of stuff online about exposure to IR-A wavelengths, which covers the common IR LED/illuminator wavelengths. You certainly CAN build something which can cause various kinds of eye damage, but it is going to be a unit that you can literally feel the heat off of. For practical purposes, you couldn't make a wearable battery powered device that would be likely to cause eye damage without the entire thing being very large and unwieldy, assuming of course you are using standard incoherent (eg:non-laser) source.
- elif 4y agoThe actually invisible NIR is 940nm but generally IR therapy devices come with blockout goggles like you'd use in a tanning bed. I'm not sure the power levels of this hoodie but if you're 3 meters away from an LED it's way different from if you are 10cm away.. I wouldn't assume safety when making up new use cases for a 'safe' product.
- mc32 4y agoWouldn't IR filters defeat this once it becomes an issue? You can just glue them on the front of the lens or it can be on the sensor though the latter requires a new sensor.
- qwertox 4y agoThey probably would, but in this case it's the camera's IR lights which enable the capability to see at night.
- AntonyGarand 4y agoCameras frequently use IR as a night vision light frequency, so adding an IR filter also disables night vision assuming they use this frequency.
- brk 4y agoThis would not be highly effective with most modern security cameras. First, color low-light video is becoming more common, as image sensor technology has progressed. When a digital/surveillance camera is in color mode, there is an IR filter in front of the lens to remove these wavelengths from reaching the imager (they cause color tinge issues). Even for cameras that are not in color mode in low-light video, most newer units have good dynamic range, whereas these low-power IR LEDs would likely not be able to fully obscure a persons face in the video.
- Valgrim 4y agoNot every color camera has an IR filter, many phones and webcam lack such a filter and can see IR very well (on my phone it has a distinctive purple hue). Probably this tint is compensated for in normal light.
- atahanacar 4y agoThat distinctive purple hue is a result of the IR filter. Filters on consumer cameras don't block 100% of IR, which is visible as that purple color. Useful for checking if remotes are working properly.
- dTal 4y agoI don't think it's because of the IR filter. I have removed filters from several color webcams and they always see IR as purpley. I think it's the bayer filter - the different color channels clearly have different sensitivities to IR.
- atahanacar 4y agoYeah, what I mean is the existence, the visibility of a slight purple hue. If the camera has no IR filter, you don't just see a slight purple hue on the LED itself, but you see the light just like you'd see a visible wavelength LED. I actually was obsessed with IR cameras and mods for some reason around 10-12 years ago. I remember using developed empty photo films to block visible light and let only IR through after removing the IR filter.
- qwertox 4y agoI wonder if such strong IR light is capable of harming the eye, even if we're unable to see it. High power LEDs in the visible spectrum are terribly bright, and when I accidentally get them shined into the eye, it really feels concerning if any harm has been done.
- fitzroy 4y agoAren't traditional (non-LED) lightbulbs that get hot much higher in the IR spectrum since they're dissipating most of their energy as heat?
- Zak 4y agoBright visible light causes the pupil to constrict and triggers an instinct to squint, blink, or look away. IR alone does not.
- barelyauser 4y agoWe can stare at a burning campfire and barely get damaged. Long term exposure is another thing. The emitter power would have to be insanely high, or some kind of laser.
- drdaeman 4y agoYes, but a campfire emits a lot of visible light, so our eyes adjust accordingly. While we're not cats with their amazing pupil dilation, we have some too. If one wears an IR-shiny hood, they may be at higher risk in the low-light conditions, if their eyes adjust to the dark, brain not realizing they're flooded with IR.
- barelyauser 4y agoRetinal damage is not the only kind of damage the eye can be subjected to. The cornea has no blood flow to cool itself and is fully exposed to incoming radiation.
- analog31 4y ago
- gfd 4y agoI remember my old android phone would pick up IR as a purpleish color: https://qph.cf2.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-d8d68a82c1ec4b4975b8e43baba2ab93.webp https://qph.cf2.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-d8d68a82c1ec4b4975b8e... I wonder if it's possible to make it bright enough to blind regular (non IR filtered) cameras too?
- tjkrusinski 4y agoNo, older smart phone cameras lacked IR filters because the IR filter didn't only block IR light, but also a distribution of wavelengths around IR. Filtering out IR means many of the visible light wavelengths are attenuated as well, decreasing the amount of light arriving at the sensor. With better noise reduction algorithms, more sensitive sensors and lower noise sensors, IR filters are now almost always used in smart phone cameras.
- jandrese 4y agoAlso, without an IR filter those cameras could partially see through light clothing in bright conditions. This of course formed a creepy online community and enough backlash that the manufacturers decided to include IR filters for all future products.
- SnooSux 4y agoI work with IR sensors at work and modern smartphones pick up NIR frequencies as well. It's picked up by the red channel so combining that with the blue is probably what's making the purple color. My guess would be that something bright enough to wash out the red channel would still leave the blue and green intact. So there should be enough information that the image is degraded but not necessarily blinded. But I could be wrong, depending on how independently the color sensors and processing work.
- joering2 4y agoOur gated community spent $80,000 on upgrading their cameras system and bought state-of-the-art 5MP surveillance cams (total of 5 of them) that "lets you read license plates from within 100 meters" and "does a color-in-the-night type recording". They were sold on upgrading the whole freaking network of cables to cat 9 for God only knows reason. And I kid you not - less than 2 months later, we were hit and 6 cars were stolen. Apparently it doesn't matter how fancy your camera is, if the perpetrator setup a stand alone red laser at cost of $6 that shines directly at it...
- ec109685 4y agoReminds me of the time I was looking at my uncle's AV setup. Back then, you had multiple ways of delivering video between components: RCA, Composite and a variety of others. The tech person had every possible path wired up with Monster video cables. A waste of probably $500! For your gated community, it seems like a detection for the video feed going haywire that calls the cops might be useful.
- joering2 4y agoThat's another 80 grand, man...
- LoganDark 4y ago> state-of-the-art 5MP surveillance cams How is that state of the art? My phone from 2015 had 21 megapixels[0]. [0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moto_X_Play#Hardware https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moto_X_Play#Hardware
- adolph 4y agoMany security CMS at this point use wifi for data. Wouldn’t a network attack with a deauthor or the like be as effective and less eye catching?
- bb88 4y agoNo. Many cameras are wired or use cellular for their data. Or they just use a battery and internal storage (trail cams).
- ThrowawayTestr 4y agoIs having this much IR light right by your face dangerous?
- SeanLuke 4y agoI don't like the idea of a hoodie blasting high power IR which could easily get into your eyes. Perhaps it'd be better to make a camera-shy baseball cap.
- samstave 4y agoDoes it have A 100% FARADAY cage pocket to put the biometronomic tracking device (phone) within in addition to shield that, plus an array of UV lights to shim cams off?
- m1117 4y agoPerfect for people in san francisco robbery business!
- unxdfa 4y agoJust wear a buff over your face. The batteries don’t go flat on those.
- cronix 4y agoWouldn't the brim of the hat be the best place as it's closest to the face, and probably more robust than within clothing?
- stainablesteel 4y agoif you really wanted this to work you would wear the strobes all over so they don't pick up arm movements or leg gait, i'd even go as far as all of your knees, feet, elbows, shoulders, and wrists/fingers if you can eliminate your movements and shape then you're ahead of the game, otherwise you're identifiable
- mikece 4y agoNothing like putting giant flashing sign on yourself that says "I'm purposely trying to avoid surveillance"...
- bobsoap 4y ago> As the hoodie uses IR light, it’s [sic] effects are imperceptible by human eyes when activated, only effecting IR sensitive equipment.
- fsckboy 4y ago> only effecting IR sensitive equipment to which it shows up as a giant flashing sign
- carlosjobim 4y agoYou turn it on when you don't want to be identified by cameras.
- shagie 4y agoSo all those digital video cameras that are pointing around to be used in visible light or low light conditions (like those for retail surveillance) will now have a person with a blinking light on them as people look at the closed circuit feeds during regular business hours. https://www.sony.com/electronics/support/articles/00025283 https://www.sony.com/electronics/support/articles/00025283
- mnw21cam 4y ago> effecting [sic]
- LAC-Tech 4y agoI mean that's what regular hoodies are to me already. It makes you look like you're going to rob a petrol station for meth money with a screw driver.
- 4y ago
- interweb 4y agoSee also Becca Ricks https://beccaricks.space/Unidentified-Halo https://beccaricks.space/Unidentified-Halo
- frankus 4y agoIf the camera has its own co-located IR source, you can just use a normal retro-reflective hoodie like this one https://www.amazon.com/TR-Super-Bright-Reflective-Jacket/dp/B01N1G1PSR https://www.amazon.com/TR-Super-Bright-Reflective-Jacket/dp/... (also great for walking/biking at night). In a dark area it completely obscures your face (https://twitter.com/frankus/status/1499257277894705155 https://twitter.com/frankus/status/1499257277894705155), and you have plausible deniability in terms of wearing it specifically for defeating cameras.
- dmix 4y ago> It's nice and subdued in a sort of futuristic way until you shine a light on it, at which point it's almost painfully reflective. Is there any downside to these? Such as distracting cars or blinding other cyclists?
- frankus 4y agoJust doing the physics in my head, I think it’s slightly less bright than the light source shining on it viewed from the same distance. So probably no more distracting to the person with the light than the light is to the person wearing the hoodie. In any case it’s a similar material as road signs that are a similar size.
- natebc 4y agoThe reflections from these jackets are not dazzling so much as ... broad spectrum? Basically they just look like a bright white sheet. Very hard to miss, hopefully.
- fsckboy 4y agoFreud taught us an enduring lesson, pay attention to to the words we use, they tell us what we are thinking. > Hoodie is a DIY adversarial garment who wants to wear an adversarial garment? adversarial people. man, life is so much better when you don't approach it adversarially. most people are happy to see your face, and you can see it on theirs.
- noirbot 4y agoHow many people who are happy to see your face are watching you on surveillance cameras? It's not like this hides your face from a human, and you can always put the hood down if you're at your friend's house or somewhere else you trust.
- fsckboy 4y agoyou can't skulk through a crowd worrying about surveillance cameras without... worrying. I'm saying that selecting the word adversarial to describe this garment is not a coincidence, it's an attitude, and I'm linking it to the emotional life of people who would be interested in the garment. worrying is stressful anxiety that your friends (who can see your face) can't completely erase for you. adversarial essentially means "looking for anxiety". I'm saying step back, it's not the only way to live. downvoting btw is also adversarial so have at it, you'll feel better... not :)
- LoganDark 4y ago> downvoting btw is also adversarial so have at it, you'll feel better... not :) lmao?
- noirbot 4y agoOr it's something people enjoy as a thought experiment? I work adjacent to computer security industries and have always found the sort of cat-and-mouse of circumventing various detection and security mechanisms to be engaging and interesting. There's certainly people who are doing it out of anxiety, either intentionally or because of their own history or mental issues. For them, it may not be easy or possible to just decide to live another way. Either there actually is something they need to be adversarial towards or they're well aware that it's not necessarily rational, but it's not any easier for them to stop than it is for a depressed person to "just be happy".
- kabdib 4y agoHow much do you have to worry about high-intensity IR damaging eyesight?
- snshn 4y agohttps://www.exer.ai/posts/gait-recognition-using-deep-learning-to-collect-better-data https://www.exer.ai/posts/gait-recognition-using-deep-learni...
- deleted 4y ago[deleted]
- ldehaan 4y ago[dead]
- metadat 4y agoCould these IR-LEDs be effective for movie theaters to prevent pirate cammers from creating viable recordings? Seems like it'd be pretty easy to implement if the studios really felt threatened by piracy.
- upsidesinclude 4y agoThe movie isnt in IR
- metadat 4y agoThe idea is the IR lighting would be placed up front beside, below, or above the projector screen, and interfere with the visual recording device to ruin the captures. In my experience digital camera sensors are sensitive to IR light in low light environments. I've never tried in a movie theater :p but have noticed this effect by pointing my phone camera at an IR television remote and pressing some buttons. The IR LED lights up and is only visible to the camera and not the naked eye. Anyhow, I'm more just curious why studios / cinemas don't take relatively simple measures like this to prevent pirate recordings from being created. Perhaps the IR would be too easy to circumvent via a physical lens filter.
- realworldperson 4y ago[dead]
- world2vec 4y agoNow that more and more cameras use AI models to detect and infer things in real time, wonder if a very specific adversarial t-shirt could render the wearer completely invisible to the AI (not to humans looking at the CCTV monitors or the video recordings). I think William Gibson wrote something like that in the Zero History book, "the ugliest t-shirt in the world" or something
- pixl97 4y agoAssuming that only one AI model is in use against you....
- thfuran 4y agoThere are a bunch of papers about adversarial patterns on shirts, glasses frames, make-up, etc. The problem is that the more discreet it is, the more overtuned to specific models it'll tend to be. If you really want to reliably foil face recognition, you can walk around in a ghillie suit and camo face mask, I suppose.
- fortran77 4y ago> As the hoodie uses IR light, it’s effects are imperceptible by human eyes when activated, only effecting IR sensitive equipment Just because you can’t see it doesn’t mean it can’t hurt you. If it’s it’s not directed away from your eyes, a bright IR light an inch away from your eye can cause harm. https://ehs.lbl.gov/resource/documents/radiation-protection/non-ionizing-radiation/light-and-infrared-radiation/ https://ehs.lbl.gov/resource/documents/radiation-protection/...
- NikolaNovak 4y agoDoes this only work at night? During daytime, I assume cameras use visible ambient light (that's at least how my baby monitor works fwiw :-). And of course any regular camera e.g. Dslr I assume wouldn't care much?
- major505 4y agoThere's a scene in Baby Driver where they go rob a mail agency, and use google with IR leds to confuse the local cameras.
- hyperific 4y agoAlso check out: https://petapixel.com/2016/07/01/anti-paparazzi-scarf-makes-flash-photography-impossible/ https://petapixel.com/2016/07/01/anti-paparazzi-scarf-makes-... https://adam.harvey.studio/cvdazzle/ https://adam.harvey.studio/cvdazzle/
- 10g1k 4y agoOr buy a $0.95 mask.
- dmillar 4y agoGreat 2600 vibe
- AbusiveHNAdmin 4y ago[dead]
- a-dub 4y agointeresting. i always thought that IR LEDs wouldn't be bright enough, guess they are (at least in total darkness)! as mentioned all over in the thread, adding jitter would probably help. worth noting that every camera is going to have a different AE algo, so it could not be relied on and you only need one frame to succeed for the system to be defeated. what you would definitely get, however, is excessive triggering of any region of interest detection for the video stream. not exactly low key! all told, pretty cool experiment nonetheless! on a related note, i often used to think it would be cool to put IR LEDs in public places where people take pictures, sort of like hidden messages or art for people to discover, but only after they look through their phone cameras.
- tanseydavid 4y agoI thought I remembered this exact post as being shown by others to be "non-functional". In other words: click-bait. But I trust this community understands this tech better than I do.
- rasz 4y ago2009 just called https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eaIIswjQ8OA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eaIIswjQ8OA
- glenstein 4y agoIt appears there's a terribly contagious case of switcheroo fever in the comment section here. The objective of the hoodie is to prevent face recognition. Those who have come down with switcheroo fever are saying "aha! This actually makes you more recognizable, not less!" But this is not a trick question and this is not the type of thing where the switcheroo is meaningfully responsive. The objective is to prevent a camera from recognizing your face, and it does that. If you have tested positive for switcheroo fever, you should start your comment by stating out loud that you understand this is the objective and you understand that it does indeed achieve the objective before proceeding elaborate on your own personal variation of the switcheroo. And perhaps, if you dare, proceed to challenge mode, where you acknowledge that this might be a trade-off that was consciously chosen, and does not come as a surprise to the people who designed the product.
- freetime2 4y agoWhy should commenters be constrained to only comment on the stated objective of the hoodie, and not all of its pros and cons? > If you have tested positive for switcheroo fever, you should start your comment by stating out loud that you understand this is the objective and you understand that it does indeed achieve the objective before proceeding elaborate on your own personal variation of the switcheroo. I don't think this is necessary. If someone doesn't make any mention of whether or not it succeeds at preventing facial recognition, then they are simply not offering an opinion on the matter. Not mentioning it, or bringing up a different concern, should not be taken as disagreement. In fact, I would interpret silence on the matter as a sort of implicit agreement. > And perhaps, if you dare, proceed to challenge mode, where you acknowledge that this might be a trade-off that was consciously chosen, and does not come as a surprise to the people who designed the product. So commenters here are obligated to acknowledge a bunch of considerations about the designer's objective and state of mind when creating the hoodie, but the designer is not obligated to point out these trade-offs in their product listing? Isn't this a double standard?
- LeonB 4y agoEqually - perhaps the product should have a disclaimer that it is only suited to people with a 1 dimensional threat model?
- arvinsim 4y agoI am pretty sure there was a comic where everyone were wearing hoodies like these due to global surveillance. Just can't remember it.
- djmips 4y agoI think this idea has been kicking around for decades. Fun to see someone make one.
- csours 4y agoOi! 'Ave you got a loicense for that 'oody?
- starky 4y agoAs someone with experience in this area I always find these proposals to add IREDs to block identification hilarious. First, almost every security camera on the market these days has a IR cut filter switcher which means these aren't going to be affective against cameras in the daytime as the IR light is filtered out. Second, there are other methods of identifying people using cameras if facial recognition fails. You can identify people by their gait, or by their clothing, track them back to their car and get their license plate, etc.
- throwaway743 4y agoHasn't this already been done before with hats, hoodies, and glasses? What makes this any different from projects 10+ years ago that used IR LEDs for this purpose? The model of the LED? Strobing effect?
- elif 4y agoCuriously enough, the 940nm NIR wavelength used in this hoodie was recently shown to reduce covid symptom severity resulting in an average 3.7 day earlier hospital discharge when compared to a placebo group using the same LED vest without turning it on. So this hoodie is actually a covid hoodie too (assuming you turn it inside out) https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1011134422002342 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S101113442...
- petodo 4y agoIn last few seconds of video (around 0:49) you can clearly see the face even with strobe LEDs turned on, if CCTV looks directly at the face and not from the angle, so they actually showed it doesn't really work with well placed CCTV at face level.
- nextlevelwizard 4y agoOK, but why? If you aren't doing anything illicit wearing this seems like a hassle (does this even work on non-IR cameras?) and if you are doing something illicit wearing this will make you standout.
- assimpleaspossi 4y agoIt's a sad state of one's affairs and mindset that they feel they need such a thing.
- freehorse 4y agoThe way the LEDs are blinking together one can definitely see the face in the periods they are all turned off. The only advantage I see is that this is not humanly possible to do in real time, but not sure how big an advantage this is.
- fennecfoxy 4y agoWonder if CCTV cameras will start to detect incoming infrared and use a visible light spotlight in response. >Darkness is no longer the refuge it used to be Tbh from personal experience darkness still is the refuge for people like me going on quiet night walks, until the time I got mugged. Darkness was a great refuge for them, not so much for me after that day. Or the time that a burglar entered my house at 4am and was cleaning out my room, reaching over my sleeping body to grab my phone charging next to my pillow. Great refuge, felt so safe. For home surveillance I may just have to equip motion spotlights as well, now.
- tppiotrowski 4y agoI believe the iPhone front facing camera can pick up infrared wavelengths so you can use it in the dark to pick up any IR illumination. Point it at the front of your TV remote control and press a button to see it in action.
- alsargent 4y agoWill be popular with shoplifters, package thieves, and bus thugs.