35 ms·

Google cracks down on VPN based adblockers

571 points by balboah 4y ago

jaimehrubiks 4y ago
Kiwi Browser (chrome with exts) + uBlock + Instander + YouTube ReVanced = winwin
Justsignedup 4y ago
a) firefox on android is great b) I wasn't even aware blockada was functional on the play store. Been using it on FDroid. So nothing changes for me. c) Blockada without VPN is a fantastic tool. It works well. And 98% of the time app ads are blocked.
monopoliessuck 4y ago
GrapheneOS has "Network" as a permission you can disable per app like any other permission. This is such an obvious and purposeful omission in stock Android's permission model. I see NetGuard was mentioned in a comment, but if you have Graphene you can just install an app and never let it call home via the App Info permission menu. I do it for Google Camera and Snapseed, the few non FOSS apps on my phone.
- ignoramous 4y ago
  > GrapheneOS has "Network" as a permission you can disable per app Most Chinese OEMs (OnePlus, Oppo, Vivo, Realme, Xiaomi, Motorola, Lenovo, Acer) ship with per-app wifi/mobile firewall option too.
matheusmoreira 4y ago
> Google claims to be cracking down on apps that are using the VPN service to track user data or rerouting user traffic to earn money through ads. Okay. Those are essentially malware anyway. As long as uBlock Origin is not affected I see no problem with Google "cracking down" on anything.
- hedora 4y ago
  > However, these policy changes also apply to apps that use the service to filter traffic locally on the device. Apps such as Blokada v5 and Duck Duck Go. Specifically the policy does not allow for “Manipulating ads that can impact apps monetization”.
  - matheusmoreira 4y ago
    I don't trust those apps. If uBlock Origin was affected, I think they would have mentioned it.
petarb 4y ago
Thank you for all the NextDNS recommendations. I’ve been looking for something to help block adds that isn’t a VPN on iOS. Just curious what do folks think of AdGuard. I’ve seen that come up on Reddit but looking at their website it doesn’t look trustworthy and I couldn’t find info about what they actually track.
- 62728494929 4y ago
  The great thing about Adguard for Safari is that you don't need to trust them. They load a blacklist that the OS can read and then blocks accordingly. Compared to extensions on Chrome which can see everything you do.
- AdamJacobMuller 4y ago
  > AdGuard I'm not sure why you found their site untrustworthy, but, I've used it for years and I'm a huge fan. Anyway though, AdGuard on iOS is a VPN and I find it unreliable, on macOS it works great.
cypress66 4y ago
This is what happens when your operating system is developed by an ad company.
noncoml 4y ago
Run pihole on AWS and set it as your DNS globally on android. You will never see ads again, even on apps.
yazzku 4y ago
Sounds like the game of ambiguity. They 'crack down' on the malware while simultaneously hurting Blockada and the other legitimate software/services that protect you from Google's own surveillance. Google wins, everybody else loses. How do Googlers here defend this posture?
radicaldreamer 4y ago
Some extremely privileged takes in here which don't consider a basic truth today: the ad supported web allows information to be accessible to a vast number of relatively poor people who would rather spend their limited discretionary income on something other than online content. It's not good or great or perfect, but the downside of the demise of ads, tracking, ad networks on the web would be a more information impoverished society any way you slice it.
- LesZedCB 4y ago
  the majority of the best information on the web is free
  - hombre_fatal 4y ago
    I don't think I agree with that. Not even Stack Overflow nor Reddit are free in this context since they make money through ads. I don't think any of my staple websites would be around if all we could rely on was their charity, and frankly that's not the internet I want to force on people. I want the people who enrich my life to be able to dedicate their time/energy to that end.
    - deleted 4y ago
      [deleted]
    - LesZedCB 4y ago
      do you think archive.org is immoral/unethical then..? print books were published by publishers who sell physical copies and run ads, tours and stuff. yet pretty much every modern published book (within reason) is freely available to any person who is able to get a library card. similarly those people could use the computers to access archive.org and browse all online content. how is that not free? i'm not even going to get into equivocating "reddit" and "best information on the internet"
    - account42 4y ago
      > I don't think I agree with that. Not even Stack Overflow nor Reddit are free in this context since they make money through ads. The hosts make money through ads, the content creators don't. We could have donation-funded versions of these just like we have Wikipedia.
aussieguy1234 4y ago
You can still install content blocking VPNs from sources other than the play store. I use DNS66, which I got from the F-Droid open source app store. It works very well and blocks ads and trackers on websites and apps.
blacklight 4y ago
I've been using pihole on my home server for a while. Exposed as a DNS over a Wireguard VPN. And all of my clients are connected to that VPN. I haven't seen a single ad on any of my devices in a couple of years, regardless of where I connect, and I don't even need a browser extension or an external VPN service that Google can easily block.
v0idzer0 4y ago
The best ad blocker is your hosts file
tuneloud0 4y ago
[flagged]
thepangolino 4y ago
Wouldn’t favour the growth of alternative app stores? Upcoming European legislation is forcing eve Apple to allow third party stores on iPhones. I doubt Google would get away much longer with those practices.
- MiddleEndian 4y ago
  https://www.theverge.com/2022/3/25/22996248/apple-sideloading-apps-store-third-party-eu-dma-requirement https://www.theverge.com/2022/3/25/22996248/apple-sideloadin... Even better news than third party app stores, sideloading. No gatekeepers required at all.
- mmmmmbop 4y ago
  Third party app stores have always been allowed on Android.
  - account42 4y ago
    That is only a half truth with how restricted they are - e.g. they can't even update anything without asking the user for each app.
  - tpxl 4y ago
    Google successfully killed third party stores on Android and was fined for it in the EU.
yokoprime 4y ago
Pi-hole + PiVpn works wonderful (if you can find a rpi that is... ). Been using that setup for a couple of years, very stable.
- lawn 4y ago
  I run Adguard Home on my router. Even though the name implies you need to run it on a raspberry pi, that's not true.
  - owly 4y ago
    Same here. It’s incredibly simple to set up and add exclusions and inclusions.
- gberger 4y ago
  > if you can find a rpi that is... I'm out of the loop, is there a rpi shortage?
  - humps 4y ago
    Yes, constrained supply means individual customers are going to struggle to find stock. https://www.raspberrypi.com/news/production-and-supply-chain-update/ https://www.raspberrypi.com/news/production-and-supply-chain...
  - fallenhitokiri 4y ago
    I was shopping for 2 8GB models a few months ago. There is / was a shortage and some shops / resellers charge 200-300% above list price. Highest I’ve seen was 350€. This was the German market, but from what I heard it doesn’t seem to look a lot better globally.
  - Root_Denied 4y ago
    Kinda the same way that there was a GPU shortage up until recently. You can go out and order an rPi now and it will get delivered within a week, but the markup is insane. It's basically impossible to find any Pi hardware at MSRP. Chips in general are still experiencing supply chain issues too, so this is unlikely to change.
bloopernova 4y ago
Firefox for Android with ublock origin makes my mobile web browsing sane again. Highly recommended.
- tjpnz 4y ago
  Agreed. The mobile web experience could almost be described as life changing when all of the bullshit is removed.
- ge0rg 4y ago
  I tend to agree, but for a few years now, Firefox has become an ad delivery vehicle for Mozilla. While not as bad as anywhere else on the web, it seems that Mozilla is working hard to destroy their brand value by pushing notification ads for its VPN service to mobile Firefox users (which is a violation of the Google Play ToS), and by using the firefox-was-upgraded page for VPN spam.
- A4ET8a8uTh0 4y ago
  I recently had issues with extensions not working after update in Firefox and I recoiled in horror at how bad the experience is without them. It is ridiculous regular people put up with this ( as in, my wife still uses it AFTER she knows I could just make most of it go away ; it make me question people decision making processes ). Still, going back to the main subject. Clearly, it seems google decided that most people do not care enough to actually make decisions to make browsing not painful. I hate this cat and mouse game. It is getting to the point where I really think legal solution is the only one. All techs need to be brought to heel. Hard. In google's defense, it is not just them. The entire ecosystem is broken. When I try to use my bank's website and I use unprotected chromium, it takes extra minute to load everything up on a page. I am running an equivalent of a supercomputer from 90s and I am stunned at the lazy design. If I try to limit it, it stutters and blocks me at every opportunity. And it is one of the national banks in US. Admittedly, some banks do get it mostly right ( kudos to Discover, Chase and Capital ), but I started going to the branch again and each time they ask me if I used their app/website, I say no and tell them why ( which is usually followed by a survey, which I dutifully fill up... mebbe something will finally filter through ).
- 4y ago
kuratkull 4y ago
Rooted phone + Lucky Patcher hostsfile based adblocking is also pretty good.
elbowjack65 4y ago
Stay true to the article title, don't editorize to bait readers
btdmaster 4y ago
https://f-droid.org https://f-droid.org I've used Netguard off F-Droid before, it's really nice when you turn on the filter: https://github.com/M66B/NetGuard/blob/master/ADBLOCKING.md https://github.com/M66B/NetGuard/blob/master/ADBLOCKING.md.
- ttctciyf 4y ago
  https://f-droid.org/packages/org.jak_linux.dns66/ https://f-droid.org/packages/org.jak_linux.dns66/ Been using this for years, though I don't often use ad-serving apps anyhow, so it's mostly just a second layer of defence behind firefox/u-block (and noscript, to be honest, but I understand not everyone wants to deal with that.)
- k4rli 4y ago
  Adaway is also very nice and simple. Allows for custom hosts lists so requires root. I think they had a VPN option as well but haven't needed it.
- hedora 4y ago
  Honest question: Does anyone here successfully use android without f-droid? From what I can tell, non-nonsense opensource utilities are simply undiscoverable on the app store.
- propogandist 4y ago
  It is/was fantastic and an essential application for android. It is the first app I install before letting a new android phone connect to the internet. edit: the app is still maintained & the dev is still active on the Netguard thread, although there was a prior issue with google where he had stopped development https://forum.xda-developers.com/t/app-6-0-netguard-no-root-firewall.3233012/page-686 https://forum.xda-developers.com/t/app-6-0-netguard-no-root-... https://netguard.me/ https://netguard.me/
  - aceazzameen 4y ago
    He only stopped for a few days before the Google issue ended up being resolved. He's still developing. https://github.com/M66B/FairEmail/releases/tag/1.1957 https://github.com/M66B/FairEmail/releases/tag/1.1957
thro388 4y ago
There is a legitimate problem with malware that hijacks all traffic via VPN. Maybe you should hear other side before making judgement!
- ignoramous 4y ago
  > There is a legitimate problem with malware that hijacks all traffic via VPN Facebook comes to mind: https://hn.algolia.com/?query=onavo https://hn.algolia.com/?query=onavo
- raxxorraxor 4y ago
  There is also a legitimate problem where companies protect their business case with an argument of security.
- zbird 4y ago
  Like Facebook? https://techcrunch.com/2019/01/29/facebook-project-atlas/ https://techcrunch.com/2019/01/29/facebook-project-atlas/
- esrauch 4y ago
  The only reason people are resorting to vpn for adblocking is because Android Chrome and the OS otherwise doesn't allow for ad blocking any other way through...
  - hocuspocus 4y ago
    Android and Chrome OS support DNS-over-TLS/HTTPS. DNS based adblocking is obviously not perfect, but good enough in practice.
    - nottorp 4y ago
      In-browser ad blocking is the perfect solution, they just need to allow it and make money through honest means. Both Google and Apple.
- ojagodzinski 4y ago
criley2 4y ago
The internet is basically unusable on a phone without an adblocker. This is a bad move from Google and will be on a lot of people's minds when they're thinking about their next flagship. "Hmm, an Android? Ah but Google's #1 goal is to make sure you're staring at terrible internet ads at all times..." Having said that, Kiwi Browser on Android still seems safe. You probably have a different browser anyway, now that Chrome has most of the features and featureflags removed.
- zo1 4y ago
  I had my son on an amazon android tablet the other weekend. Internet access disabled using parental controls. And by the end of that weekend, the tabs that I found opened on the default browser was crazy. All from clicking ads in various apps, auto-play videos, and what not. Ads for viagra, credit cards, home loan applications, other loans, mobile subscription content, etc. Luckily internet access was off so none of them loaded, but I could still see all the failed open tabs. Tech giants will turn this example around and say "look we need more walled-gardens to protect users". But in reality, as soon as they open the floodgates, there will be solutions that can do the same without giving away more control to Google/Apple. The narrative has to change, and the first step is to give device owners full control.
  - prasadjoglekar 4y ago
    Assuming you're in the US, if this is really happening, you need to take screenshots of the inappropriate ads, document the experience and send it to your congressman and senator. Go to the local office and speak with the staffers. They need to see and hear from their constituents having this awful experience for there to be any change.
- Tenoke 4y ago
  Most people's phone internet usage is like 95% on apps like Whatsapp, Instagram, Facebook, TikTok etc. and they are well used to their ads.
suprjami 4y ago
Root access and AdAway from F-Droid. I wouldn't even bother using anything else.
- GuB-42 4y ago
  Same, but it is more and more annoying to root your phone with all these banking apps blocking rooted phones. And now, with the new security standards (which are good), banks insist on having you install their proprietary app just to authorize payments (which is annoying). I am not talking about Google Pay here (which I can do without). There are workarounds of course, but I am becoming tired of the cat and mouse game, in fact, I am tired of smartphones altogether. Unless things change, my current phone is probably the last rooted phone I will use as a daily driver, sadly, the last "high end" phone too.
  - mastazi 4y ago
    > with the new security standards (which are good), banks insist on having you install their proprietary app since you say this, I assume you are in the EU or UK? I've heard that several EU banks offer a second 2FA method besides the app, such as hardware code generator[1]. In the UK, banks are actually required by the regulator to offer at least one method that doesn't require a mobile phone [2]. You could tell your bank "I can't use a smartphone" and they will probably be able to assist you (or, worst case scenario, you could find a bank that can) [1] https://www.unicreditbank.hu/en/individual/banking/electronic_services/strong_customer_authentication/hardware_token.html https://www.unicreditbank.hu/en/individual/banking/electroni... [2] https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/77937914/#Comment_77937914 https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/7793...
  - L3viathan 4y ago
    I'm in the same boat. I recently had to upgrade my phone, and oh boy is is annoying to get root working with Google Pay and my banking app. It still works, but it took me a few hours(!). I'm seriously considering switching to iOS for my next phone.
    - 4y ago
red_trumpet 4y ago
Going on a tangent, how is the adblocking story on iOS? As there is not Firefox+uBlock available, is it possible to block ads via VPN or DNS?
- BeenChilling 4y ago
  [dead]
- gbear605 4y ago
  Apple allows ad-blocking filters that are basically Safari extensions but must be downloaded through a separate app. I can’t recommend any specific ad-blocked though. https://support.apple.com/guide/iphone/get-extensions-iphab0432bf6/ios https://support.apple.com/guide/iphone/get-extensions-iphab0... The usual VPN and DNS solutions also work fine.
  - evgen 4y ago
    I have had a very good experience with 1Blocker so far. Not quite ublock origin but close enough that I almost never notice a difference from my daily desktop use. There is another extension called Vinegar that strips out YouTube ads, but unfortunately it only works with Safari on iOS and not Firefox (even though both are using the same core engine) so I need to remember to bounce over to Safari when watching YouTube vids.
    - interpol_p 4y ago
      Vinegar works with Safari on macOS too. I love it, switches YouTube over to the native video player, strips all the recommendations and other crap and only plays the video
- latexr 4y ago
  > is it possible to block ads via VPN 1Blocker¹ does it. It’s the “Firewall” section of the iOS app. ¹ https://1blocker.com https://1blocker.com
  - 4y ago
avel 4y ago
I would take this post with a grain of salt. It is mostly an ad / promotion for "Blokada Cloud".
- sph 4y ago
  It's not an ad, it's a link from their forum. Of course they're talking about their product.
  - ignoramous 4y ago
    They are known to be hyperbolic on their forums. Ex A: Blokada Plus is a VPN optimized to work flawlessly with Blokada. You get one of the strongest encryptions with minimal impact on battery life and speed. Together with the battle-tested content blocking functionality of Blokada, the VPN gives you a peace of mind knowing that your private activity stays private. Even on public WiFi, no-one will be able to see what you’re doing or steal your sensitive information like bank details. Websites you visit will not be able to reveal your real location. https://archive.is/xyVSn https://archive.is/xyVSn - Strongest encryption? From when I read the code, they back-up private-key without armour (plain-text). - Battle-tested content blocking? Blokada v5 and below has leaked DNS over TCP since its inception (v6+ is closed source). - Peace of mind? https://www-computerbase-de.translate.goog/forum/threads/mobile-app-blokada-verletzt-datenschutz-grundlagen.2089582/?_x_tr_sl=de&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en&_x_tr_pto=sc https://www-computerbase-de.translate.goog/forum/threads/mob... - The less I say about protecting bank details, 'private activity', location... the better. Disclosure: I have been accused by Blokada of spreading FUD before: https://gitlab.com/fdroid/fdroiddata/-/merge_requests/8536 https://gitlab.com/fdroid/fdroiddata/-/merge_requests/8536
    - onphonenow 4y ago
      I had to laugh at the no one can see what you are doing claim. How do these scammers route the traffic if they can’t see what websites you are visiting! Of course these guys can see what websites you are visiting if they want to
  - avel 4y ago
naillo 4y ago
I feel like they're just dying to figure out a way to get rid of extensions on desktop as well. Soon enough they'll figure out a way to rationalize them away.
- jacquesm 4y ago
  Who wants to be that 'for your safety and convenience' will be part of the press release?
  - blibble 4y ago
    manifest v3: https://developer.chrome.com/docs/extensions/mv3/intro/ https://developer.chrome.com/docs/extensions/mv3/intro/ > Manifest V3 is part of a shift in the philosophy behind how we approach end-user security and privacy. it requrires you to declaratively specify what to block in advance, so it's going to be pretty easy to write some logic that can't be declaratively specified I suspect killing the adblockers is the entire reason behind it
    - jacquesm 4y ago
      Every time google pulls a trick like this they are inviting regulatory intervention.
    - pineconewarrior 4y ago
      glad firefox is allowing and end-run around this
      - jsheard 4y ago
        With Firefoxes market share continuously declining, and AFAICT no real indication they're going to be able to turn things around, I fear it's only a matter of time before they pull an Edge/Opera and turn into another Chromium reskin to cut costs.
        silon42 4y ago
david_arcos 4y ago
Original title is about "Google cracks down on VPN based adblockers". Changing "VPN Adblockers" to "Android Adblockers" is misleading, at least. BTW, I'm using Brave because of having u-block origin, and I recommend it. Needed to change the default chrome widget for a brave widget, and lost the chrome sync. Other than that, works as a charm.
- ejb999 4y ago
  another vote for Brave browser - switched and never looked back.
t0bia_s 4y ago
Pi-hole in home network, AdAway on all smartphones, uBlock Origin an all Firefox browsers. I'm shocked when browsing web on different devices. I always recommend to at least install uBlock Origin to users of those devices. Most of them never heard about ad-blocking and they are very, very happy with new web browsing experience. 99% of theme do not want go back. 1% don't care.
- 2OEH8eoCRo0 4y ago
  Adguard works so well that I forget it's there until I try browsing the web away from home.
  - t0bia_s 4y ago
    AdAway is main reason, why I root android devices. It block ads in all apps and browsers even on data, without VPN. Another way how to block ads on data is using OpenVPN to connect data through you home router that has ad-blocking. But it is limited by upload speed of home network connection and battery drain of your smartphone is worse with active OpenVPN.
    - ytch 4y ago
      I use OpenVPN/Wireguard to setup split-tunnel VPN, only route DNS traffic to Pi-hole at home network. Although my connection may be leaked, I thought it's faster since 5G is faster than my home network upload speed.
      - t0bia_s 4y ago
        But your speed in device connected to OpenVPN/Wireguard is limited by upload speed of you home connection. Not by data connection speed on client device.
        ytch 4y ago
        Yeah, So I use split-tunnel. For example only route 192.168.1.0/24 via VPN, then set 192.168.1.10 as DNS server. Therefore I can use pi-hole at home and other traffic are routed by 5G directly.
kuon 4y ago
I use adaway which simply replace the /etc/hosts file, but requires root. I consider a phone a paperweight if I cannot have root on it, but I realize this might be different for other users.
- josephcsible 4y ago
  What are you going to do once Google makes TEE-based bootloader unlock checking a mandatory part of SafetyNet? Right now, I'm in the same camp as you, and I don't have a good answer to that myself.
  - hedora 4y ago
    I'll likely just not use banking software that requires safetynet. If that means I need to switch banks, that's OK.
    - josephcsible 4y ago
      It's a lot more than just banking apps. It's also McDonald's, Netflix, Snapchat, Pokemon Go, Super Mario Run, etc. Will you just stop using all of them too?
      - kuon 4y ago
        Yes. If an app dont run, I do not use it. If I cannot root my phone, I'll stop having one, I'll have a dumb phone.
      - MichaelCollins 4y ago
        I've never used any of those apps. But McDonald's particularly? I know those other apps are popular, but who actually installs the app for a fast food restaurant? I thought this was something these companies wasted money on because they wanted to feel techy and trendy, I didn't think anybody actually fell for it though. Just walk up to the counter and say "I'll have number whatever"
TrianguloY 4y ago
I use DNS66, installed from F-droid. Play Store has more and more restrictions each month...but it may be a good thing? because people is now discovering the alternate stores and the advantages of them.
- jerrygoyal 4y ago
  why not just use private dns from nextdns
- eleitl 4y ago
  Not to forget LineageOS et al.
ignoramous 4y ago
I co-develop a FOSS VPN-based (tcp/udp) firewall for Android. The original policy is documented here: https://web.archive.org/web/20220818100735/https://support.google.com/googleplay/android-developer/answer/12253906?hl=en https://web.archive.org/web/20220818100735/https://support.g... What the post misses is Google has exceptions for: - Parental control and enterprise management apps. - App usage tracking. - Device security apps (for example, anti-virus, mobile device management, firewall). - Network related tools (for example, remote access). - Web browsing apps. - Carrier apps that require the use of VPN functionality to provide telephony or connectivity services. The part where manipulation of ad-based monetization isn't allowed has always been there in one form or another. A firewall can also be used to firewall ads/trackers though, and so it remains to be seen what Google makes of such apps (there are plenty!) come November (supposed deadline for compliance). Blokada v5 (and below), otoh, isn't a firewall, but a UDP-only DNS client.
- raxxorraxor 4y ago
  I think having exceptions for that is an extremely severe security flaw. Kudos to you for developing something like this, but honestly even with a solid firewall leveraging VPN I would not trust crapware like Android or iOS with anything substantial. We have reached ridiculous levels of paternalism from pretty crappy companies.
- wTj8yqRLkg7Dfsp 4y ago
  > Ads that appear ... during the beginning of a content segment are not allowed. > Here are some examples of common violations: Unexpected ads that appear ... during the beginning of a content segment (for example, after a user has clicked on a button, and before the action intended by the button click has taken effect). These ads are unexpected for users, as users expect to ... engage in content instead. ??? isn't this like... incredibly and blatantly anti-competitive considering that their own app (Youtube), which they still offer on said store, does this?
  - smileybarry 4y ago
    Not entirely, I think they mean ads in games between "new game"/"next level" and the game/level starting. Free games are filled with them. Pre-roll ads in video apps like YouTube are different.
lenova 4y ago
Adguard provides public DNS servers that can be used for blocking ads on your phone as well, no VPN required: https://adguard-dns.io/kb/general/dns-providers/ https://adguard-dns.io/kb/general/dns-providers/
- Terretta 4y ago
  Which has now gone open-source: https://adguard.com/en/blog/adguard-dns-2-0-goes-open-source.html https://adguard.com/en/blog/adguard-dns-2-0-goes-open-source...
  - lenova 4y ago
    Very cool, I didn't know about that, thanks for sharing!
Jason_Protell 4y ago
Firefox Nightly + uBlock Origin seems to work well on Android
- GekkePrutser 4y ago
  You don't even need nightly, ublock works great on the production version too
  - Jason_Protell 4y ago
    I use Firefox Nightly because I also run Bypass Paywalls Clean (c)
    - GekkePrutser 4y ago
      Oooh you can use that on nightly?? I had no idea, in that case I will try it also. I use this a lot on my desktop.
therealmarv 4y ago
Adguard adblocker for Android works also with an internal device only "VPN" and is not on the Play Store for a while (because of problems with Google Play Store rules). They are amazing and if you use an Android browser without internal adblocking (which I still think is better) such a VPN adblocker is a must for Android devices. I only had to whitelist a few applications like e.g. Google Photos. Have been using the app for some years and it's actively maintained. https://adguard.com/en/adguard-android/overview.html https://adguard.com/en/adguard-android/overview.html
exabrial 4y ago
Google needs to be slapped with an anti trust lawsuit so hard their children feel it. This is so brazen they don’t even care
hestefisk 4y ago
“Improved ad experience”…
- anaganisk 4y ago
  For your own safety and convenience.
causi 4y ago
In my experience the biggest problem with VPN-based adblocking is the battery drain when the signal is poor. I regularly spend time in a well-insulated room and forgetting to turn my VPN off has a very noticeable impact at the end of the day. Which is a shame, because Chrome is a hell of a lot snappier than Firefox Android.
- flerchin 4y ago
  Is it? Chrome is definitely not snappier than Firefox with ublock origin on Android.
  - causi 4y ago
    Perhaps it depends on your setup. My device only has 6GB of ram.
DavideNL 4y ago
So, "The biggest advertising company in the world cracks down on [...] adblockers." I don't understand why people are surprised about this.
- nathanaldensr 4y ago
  Your characterization of people announcing it and discussing it as "surprise" is incorrect. Consider it more of a reminder or notification.
sobkas 4y ago
I don't use ad blockers, I only block trackers. So if you want me to see your adds better not try to track me. If your site complaints about it, then I don't see any reason to use it.
- InCityDreams 4y ago
  Please show how...
- badRNG 4y ago
  How do you go about doing that?
pmontra 4y ago
For all the love I have for Blockada I'm not going to send my traffic through their cloud. I wonder if I can run something like PiHole on a VPS somewhere so that I can protect my devices both when I'm at home on WiFi and when I'm outside on 4G. I'll investigate but does anybody already experienced such a setup?
- mtremsal 4y ago
  That's exactly the problem I had while traveling this month. I just posted about my setup: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32512576 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32512576 -- so far it's been great. See also nextdns.io for a turnkey alternative.
- cricalix 4y ago
  Tailscale have a knowledgebase article on doing it - https://tailscale.com/kb/1114/pi-hole/ https://tailscale.com/kb/1114/pi-hole/ There's probably other ways.
  - tssva 4y ago
    I have been using this setup for about 3 months and it works great.
- wmeredith 4y ago
  The Pi-hole docs have a an article on setting up a VPN for your pi-hole so you can use it from anywhere: https://docs.pi-hole.net/guides/vpn/openvpn/overview/ https://docs.pi-hole.net/guides/vpn/openvpn/overview/
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- qdl 4y ago
  there is easy to setup options like wirehole https://github.com/IAmStoxe/wirehole https://github.com/IAmStoxe/wirehole
daitangio 4y ago
I will never stop to talk about PiHole and how much changed my home browsing experience: https://pi-hole.net/ https://pi-hole.net/ I suggest everybody to give it a spin
- whynotmaybe 4y ago
  It also works on Roku. I know that ads are used to pay content creator on the web but I don't see why I should see ads on the home screen of a TV I fully paid.
  - psychlops 4y ago
    The amount of times roku pings scribe.logs.roku.com just makes me angry. I let them see nothing.
- snarf21 4y ago
  We need a $20 appliance that is plug and play. Most users aren't installing Docker containers.
  - hedora 4y ago
    Like a raspberry pi?
  - int_19h 4y ago
    Most PiHole users aren't, either. You insert an SD card into a Raspberry Pi or similar, and it boots. Some people sell preimaged SD cards, some sell prebuilt devices - I've seen both on eBay.
  - dvtrn 4y ago
    Crazy though, but hear me out: what about an old laptop
    - klez 4y ago
      I'm pretty sure they mean a pre-configured appliance, not something you have to provide the hardware for and install the software on on your own.
rdudek 4y ago
I've been using NextDNS for quite some time and it's been working great for blocking ads on my iOS devices while away from home.
fortran77 4y ago
> This could mean Google is cracking down on VPN-based ads and tracker filtering apps behind the scenes.
smileybarry 4y ago
I started using NextDNS years ago and it's been a blessing. Blocks almost every ad on a DNS level on mobile devices, and on PC I still augment it with uBlock Origin. Per-device logs also let me debug connectivity if something breaks, and it's great for mapping local device names without mDNS debugging or some dnsmasq resolver lying around.
- laundermaf 4y ago
  I regularly find websites that don’t work until I disable the Adblock, usually on mobile. This isn’t intentional generally. How do you deal with that? Are you just not going to buy a plane ticket on the airline’s website just ‘cause?
  - smileybarry 4y ago
    Turning off affiliate blocking fixed 99% of those, and the rest I just manually add to my allowlist. It’s not many but if that doesn’t fix quickly then I just switch it off for a minute.
  - leokennis 4y ago
    There is a blocklist with the explicit goal to not break sites (at the expense of sometimes being tracked or seeing an ad): https://oisd.nl/ https://oisd.nl/ > Why this list? > Where most other blocklists go for the "block ads/trackers and when something breaks it's up to the user to figure out what to whitelist"-approach .. > > This list prioritizes functionality over blocking. > > Thís is the list to use at home, at work or at your (grand-)parents place. > Users report it "passes the girlfriend-test" ;) I used to run more strict lists and then whitelist domains or temporarily disable blocking, but I have to say I switched to oisd only and now I'm seeing maybe 0.5% more ads without having to go through that hassle, which is a fine compromise for me.
- neop1x 4y ago
  I think DNS-based blocking will eventually be less effective over time. It shouldn't be difficult to host ads on the main domain, modern distributed reverse proxies are very fast. So they will probably soon just stop using ad-only domains and host everything on the main one.
kaiusbrantlee 4y ago
Yeah I can understand google needing to do this. I mean, they aren't making nearly enough money already
gumby 4y ago
> These changes aim to improve the ads experience, tighten security and limit misinformation according to the company. Yes, according to the company. But improving the ad experience for google, not for the user. What Orwellian doublespeak!
disintegore 4y ago
I categorically reject ads. I want them completely abolished. I will do everything that's in my power to get them out of my machines. If I had just a little bit more courage I would go out at night with cans of spray paint and deface billboards.
- sofixa 4y ago
  How do you propose sites/YouTube channels monetise themselves (for sustenance or profit)?
  - disintegore 4y ago
    I don't really care about their bottom line. They're the middle-men. Virtual landlords. They're there to squeeze the lemon. Not to say that the service they provide isn't useful. It's obviously more economical to operate media platforms at scale, and obviously most content creators don't have the technical ability to do it themselves. When you look at say, podcasts for instance, you have this giant shared wealth of free content and you can pick a number of creators to support depending on your budget. You usually get extra episodes or perks as an incentive for doing so. Imagine if, instead of paying YouTube X dollars or watching Y ads and letting them choose out how to spread that money around, you pay the people you actually watch and the platform vendors, who ought to be the least important and most replaceable factor in this transaction, gets the cut they actually deserve. Before they were ruined by copyright trolls, streaming services like Netflix demonstrated that charging everyone a reasonable amount of money for access to the entire park was a viable business model.
    - Bakary 4y ago
      YouTube sounds replaceable or unimportant in an ethical sense but in a practical sense it's certainly not that simple from the POV of someone trying to build an audience for their videography or even the audience itself.
      - disintegore 4y ago
scarface74 4y ago
Google > Google claims to be cracking down on apps that are using the VPN service to track user data Also Google https://www.helpnetsecurity.com/2019/01/31/google-apple-developer-certificate/ https://www.helpnetsecurity.com/2019/01/31/google-apple-deve...
userbinator 4y ago
At least you can still "sideload", i.e. download the software straight from the source and install it that way, the way software used to be distributed before this walled-garden dystopia started... I personally run a MITM proxy on my network which all traffic goes through. IMHO the security concerns are overblown and largely come from companies like Google trying to stop people doing things like this. They are only securing their profits, nothing more and nothing less. These changes aim to improve the ads experience, tighten security and limit misinformation according to the company. The truth is probably closer to "increase the number of ads you see, secure you from getting around that, and limit the proliferation of anything but their official propaganda."
rixthefox 4y ago
Wouldn't this be more evidence that Google shouldn't be running the Play Store? If they are going to start blocking apps that do adblocking on-device that sounds like an abuse of power and a HUGE conflict of interest with Google running the Play Store AND being owned by an advertising company.
twistedpair 4y ago
Ghostery browser on Android is pretty easy to use.
- Terretta 4y ago
  It had been excellent. Have you kept track of their ownership and business model since the mid 2010s? - monetization strategy involves affiliate marketing and the sale of ad analytics data - shows advertisements of its own to users
kornhole 4y ago
Does this only apply to phones with Google Play Services installed?
jl6 4y ago
The problem is not just ads. In this comment I’m going to explain why the problem is not just ads. What are ads? Advertizing, or marketing, is a common means of monetizing content. Here are the top three reasons ads are used on websites: 1. Monetization 2. Tracking users 3. Malware distribution Want to know more about how ads track users? Read on. As a guy growing up in rural Wyoming, ads weren’t something that ever really bothered me. Sure there was the occasional billboard and sure television had a lot of commercials breaks, but I was used to it. The idea of using an ad blocker on my television set never occurred to me. I remember this one time when my uncle was moving house and he needed some help and I helped him move the packing crates into the truck and the crates had the logo and name of the shipping company stencilled on the side, and it never bothered me, although that was in fact an ad. Experts agree that the following method is great for dealing with ads: First, make sure what you are looking at is an ad. You can often tell by the little x in the corner of the ad. If you click this, you will be able to close the ad and maybe even give some feedback about why you didn’t like the ad. Top tip: always fill this in to let the ad vendor know how to improve the ad for next time. But take care! This next tip is really important. If you don’t hit the little x exactly on target, you will be taken to the website of the ad. If you didn’t want the ad in the first place, this is surely something to avoid! Here are 17 resolutions for dealing with accidentally visiting a website you didn’t want to visit: 1. Try restarting your phone, laptop or PC. 2. Close the browser window. Click here for help on how to accomplish this task. 3. Try clicking the back button on your browser. 4. Write to the FCC if the website caused you distress. 5. Take a walk. Besides being good exercise, the problem may have resolved itself by the time you return. 6. Hit refresh on your browser. If you didn’t like the website first time round, you know what they say? Try, try again! 7. Go to the URL bar on your browser and type in a different address. Don’t forget to hit the Enter key. Try the following helpful URLs from our trusted partners: https://www.geico.com https://www.geico.com https://www.espn.com https://www.espn.com https://www.target.com https://www.target.com 8. Raise a ticket with Apple support. 9. Install Google Chrome. 10. Re-install Google Chrome. 11. Contact your ISP. My top tip? Threaten to cancel unless they can resolve your issue completely right away! 12. Close all open windows and applications and wait 30 seconds. 13. Clear your cookies and web browsing history. 14. … Show more.
tananaev 4y ago
I use Bromite (Chromium fork + ad block) on Android. It's pretty sad to see Google stoop so low. Back in the day they used to win because of the innovation, best products and openness. Now they can't build anything new and just trying to squeeze every last penny from what they already have.
- anaganisk 4y ago
  Well its an Ad company end of the day, all their innovations add up to showing better ads.
grishka 4y ago
Uhh what exactly is Google cracking down on if Blokada has always been distributed as an apk precisely because Google has never allowed this sort of thing on Google Play?
- avel 4y ago
  Nothing. This post seems to be just a promo with the intention to cause some stir and publicity for Blokada.

571 points by balboah 4y ago

Kiwi Browser (chrome with exts) + uBlock + Instander + YouTube ReVanced = winwin

a) firefox on android is great b) I wasn't even aware blockada was functional on the play store. Been using it on FDroid. So nothing changes for me. c) Blockada without VPN is a fantastic tool. It works well. And 98% of the time app ads are blocked.

monopoliessuck 4y ago

GrapheneOS has "Network" as a permission you can disable per app like any other permission. This is such an obvious and purposeful omission in stock Android's permission model. I see NetGuard was mentioned in a comment, but if you have Graphene you can just install an app and never let it call home via the App Info permission menu. I do it for Google Camera and Snapseed, the few non FOSS apps on my phone.

ignoramous 4y ago
> GrapheneOS has "Network" as a permission you can disable per app Most Chinese OEMs (OnePlus, Oppo, Vivo, Realme, Xiaomi, Motorola, Lenovo, Acer) ship with per-app wifi/mobile firewall option too.

matheusmoreira 4y ago

> Google claims to be cracking down on apps that are using the VPN service to track user data or rerouting user traffic to earn money through ads. Okay. Those are essentially malware anyway. As long as uBlock Origin is not affected I see no problem with Google "cracking down" on anything.

hedora 4y ago
> However, these policy changes also apply to apps that use the service to filter traffic locally on the device. Apps such as Blokada v5 and Duck Duck Go. Specifically the policy does not allow for “Manipulating ads that can impact apps monetization”.
- matheusmoreira 4y ago
  I don't trust those apps. If uBlock Origin was affected, I think they would have mentioned it.

petarb 4y ago

Thank you for all the NextDNS recommendations. I’ve been looking for something to help block adds that isn’t a VPN on iOS. Just curious what do folks think of AdGuard. I’ve seen that come up on Reddit but looking at their website it doesn’t look trustworthy and I couldn’t find info about what they actually track.

62728494929 4y ago
The great thing about Adguard for Safari is that you don't need to trust them. They load a blacklist that the OS can read and then blocks accordingly. Compared to extensions on Chrome which can see everything you do.
AdamJacobMuller 4y ago
> AdGuard I'm not sure why you found their site untrustworthy, but, I've used it for years and I'm a huge fan. Anyway though, AdGuard on iOS is a VPN and I find it unreliable, on macOS it works great.

cypress66 4y ago

This is what happens when your operating system is developed by an ad company.

noncoml 4y ago

Run pihole on AWS and set it as your DNS globally on android. You will never see ads again, even on apps.

yazzku 4y ago

Sounds like the game of ambiguity. They 'crack down' on the malware while simultaneously hurting Blockada and the other legitimate software/services that protect you from Google's own surveillance. Google wins, everybody else loses. How do Googlers here defend this posture?

radicaldreamer 4y ago

Some extremely privileged takes in here which don't consider a basic truth today: the ad supported web allows information to be accessible to a vast number of relatively poor people who would rather spend their limited discretionary income on something other than online content. It's not good or great or perfect, but the downside of the demise of ads, tracking, ad networks on the web would be a more information impoverished society any way you slice it.

LesZedCB 4y ago
the majority of the best information on the web is free
- hombre_fatal 4y ago
  I don't think I agree with that. Not even Stack Overflow nor Reddit are free in this context since they make money through ads. I don't think any of my staple websites would be around if all we could rely on was their charity, and frankly that's not the internet I want to force on people. I want the people who enrich my life to be able to dedicate their time/energy to that end.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - LesZedCB 4y ago
    do you think archive.org is immoral/unethical then..? print books were published by publishers who sell physical copies and run ads, tours and stuff. yet pretty much every modern published book (within reason) is freely available to any person who is able to get a library card. similarly those people could use the computers to access archive.org and browse all online content. how is that not free? i'm not even going to get into equivocating "reddit" and "best information on the internet"
  - account42 4y ago
    > I don't think I agree with that. Not even Stack Overflow nor Reddit are free in this context since they make money through ads. The hosts make money through ads, the content creators don't. We could have donation-funded versions of these just like we have Wikipedia.

aussieguy1234 4y ago

You can still install content blocking VPNs from sources other than the play store. I use DNS66, which I got from the F-Droid open source app store. It works very well and blocks ads and trackers on websites and apps.

blacklight 4y ago

I've been using pihole on my home server for a while. Exposed as a DNS over a Wireguard VPN. And all of my clients are connected to that VPN. I haven't seen a single ad on any of my devices in a couple of years, regardless of where I connect, and I don't even need a browser extension or an external VPN service that Google can easily block.

v0idzer0 4y ago

The best ad blocker is your hosts file

tuneloud0 4y ago

[flagged]

thepangolino 4y ago

Wouldn’t favour the growth of alternative app stores? Upcoming European legislation is forcing eve Apple to allow third party stores on iPhones. I doubt Google would get away much longer with those practices.

MiddleEndian 4y ago
https://www.theverge.com/2022/3/25/22996248/apple-sideloading-apps-store-third-party-eu-dma-requirement https://www.theverge.com/2022/3/25/22996248/apple-sideloadin... Even better news than third party app stores, sideloading. No gatekeepers required at all.
mmmmmbop 4y ago
Third party app stores have always been allowed on Android.
- account42 4y ago
  That is only a half truth with how restricted they are - e.g. they can't even update anything without asking the user for each app.
- tpxl 4y ago
  Google successfully killed third party stores on Android and was fined for it in the EU.

yokoprime 4y ago

Pi-hole + PiVpn works wonderful (if you can find a rpi that is... ). Been using that setup for a couple of years, very stable.

lawn 4y ago
I run Adguard Home on my router. Even though the name implies you need to run it on a raspberry pi, that's not true.
- owly 4y ago
  Same here. It’s incredibly simple to set up and add exclusions and inclusions.
gberger 4y ago
> if you can find a rpi that is... I'm out of the loop, is there a rpi shortage?
- humps 4y ago
  Yes, constrained supply means individual customers are going to struggle to find stock. https://www.raspberrypi.com/news/production-and-supply-chain-update/ https://www.raspberrypi.com/news/production-and-supply-chain...
- fallenhitokiri 4y ago
  I was shopping for 2 8GB models a few months ago. There is / was a shortage and some shops / resellers charge 200-300% above list price. Highest I’ve seen was 350€. This was the German market, but from what I heard it doesn’t seem to look a lot better globally.
- Root_Denied 4y ago
  Kinda the same way that there was a GPU shortage up until recently. You can go out and order an rPi now and it will get delivered within a week, but the markup is insane. It's basically impossible to find any Pi hardware at MSRP. Chips in general are still experiencing supply chain issues too, so this is unlikely to change.

bloopernova 4y ago

Firefox for Android with ublock origin makes my mobile web browsing sane again. Highly recommended.

tjpnz 4y ago
Agreed. The mobile web experience could almost be described as life changing when all of the bullshit is removed.
ge0rg 4y ago
I tend to agree, but for a few years now, Firefox has become an ad delivery vehicle for Mozilla. While not as bad as anywhere else on the web, it seems that Mozilla is working hard to destroy their brand value by pushing notification ads for its VPN service to mobile Firefox users (which is a violation of the Google Play ToS), and by using the firefox-was-upgraded page for VPN spam.
A4ET8a8uTh0 4y ago
I recently had issues with extensions not working after update in Firefox and I recoiled in horror at how bad the experience is without them. It is ridiculous regular people put up with this ( as in, my wife still uses it AFTER she knows I could just make most of it go away ; it make me question people decision making processes ). Still, going back to the main subject. Clearly, it seems google decided that most people do not care enough to actually make decisions to make browsing not painful. I hate this cat and mouse game. It is getting to the point where I really think legal solution is the only one. All techs need to be brought to heel. Hard. In google's defense, it is not just them. The entire ecosystem is broken. When I try to use my bank's website and I use unprotected chromium, it takes extra minute to load everything up on a page. I am running an equivalent of a supercomputer from 90s and I am stunned at the lazy design. If I try to limit it, it stutters and blocks me at every opportunity. And it is one of the national banks in US. Admittedly, some banks do get it mostly right ( kudos to Discover, Chase and Capital ), but I started going to the branch again and each time they ask me if I used their app/website, I say no and tell them why ( which is usually followed by a survey, which I dutifully fill up... mebbe something will finally filter through ).
4y ago

kuratkull 4y ago

Rooted phone + Lucky Patcher hostsfile based adblocking is also pretty good.

elbowjack65 4y ago

Stay true to the article title, don't editorize to bait readers

btdmaster 4y ago

https://f-droid.org https://f-droid.org I've used Netguard off F-Droid before, it's really nice when you turn on the filter: https://github.com/M66B/NetGuard/blob/master/ADBLOCKING.md https://github.com/M66B/NetGuard/blob/master/ADBLOCKING.md.

ttctciyf 4y ago
https://f-droid.org/packages/org.jak_linux.dns66/ https://f-droid.org/packages/org.jak_linux.dns66/ Been using this for years, though I don't often use ad-serving apps anyhow, so it's mostly just a second layer of defence behind firefox/u-block (and noscript, to be honest, but I understand not everyone wants to deal with that.)
k4rli 4y ago
Adaway is also very nice and simple. Allows for custom hosts lists so requires root. I think they had a VPN option as well but haven't needed it.
hedora 4y ago
Honest question: Does anyone here successfully use android without f-droid? From what I can tell, non-nonsense opensource utilities are simply undiscoverable on the app store.
propogandist 4y ago
It is/was fantastic and an essential application for android. It is the first app I install before letting a new android phone connect to the internet. edit: the app is still maintained & the dev is still active on the Netguard thread, although there was a prior issue with google where he had stopped development https://forum.xda-developers.com/t/app-6-0-netguard-no-root-firewall.3233012/page-686 https://forum.xda-developers.com/t/app-6-0-netguard-no-root-... https://netguard.me/ https://netguard.me/
- aceazzameen 4y ago
  He only stopped for a few days before the Google issue ended up being resolved. He's still developing. https://github.com/M66B/FairEmail/releases/tag/1.1957 https://github.com/M66B/FairEmail/releases/tag/1.1957

thro388 4y ago

There is a legitimate problem with malware that hijacks all traffic via VPN. Maybe you should hear other side before making judgement!

ignoramous 4y ago
> There is a legitimate problem with malware that hijacks all traffic via VPN Facebook comes to mind: https://hn.algolia.com/?query=onavo https://hn.algolia.com/?query=onavo
raxxorraxor 4y ago
There is also a legitimate problem where companies protect their business case with an argument of security.
zbird 4y ago
Like Facebook? https://techcrunch.com/2019/01/29/facebook-project-atlas/ https://techcrunch.com/2019/01/29/facebook-project-atlas/
esrauch 4y ago
The only reason people are resorting to vpn for adblocking is because Android Chrome and the OS otherwise doesn't allow for ad blocking any other way through...
- hocuspocus 4y ago
  Android and Chrome OS support DNS-over-TLS/HTTPS. DNS based adblocking is obviously not perfect, but good enough in practice.
  - nottorp 4y ago
    In-browser ad blocking is the perfect solution, they just need to allow it and make money through honest means. Both Google and Apple.
ojagodzinski 4y ago

criley2 4y ago

The internet is basically unusable on a phone without an adblocker. This is a bad move from Google and will be on a lot of people's minds when they're thinking about their next flagship. "Hmm, an Android? Ah but Google's #1 goal is to make sure you're staring at terrible internet ads at all times..." Having said that, Kiwi Browser on Android still seems safe. You probably have a different browser anyway, now that Chrome has most of the features and featureflags removed.

zo1 4y ago
I had my son on an amazon android tablet the other weekend. Internet access disabled using parental controls. And by the end of that weekend, the tabs that I found opened on the default browser was crazy. All from clicking ads in various apps, auto-play videos, and what not. Ads for viagra, credit cards, home loan applications, other loans, mobile subscription content, etc. Luckily internet access was off so none of them loaded, but I could still see all the failed open tabs. Tech giants will turn this example around and say "look we need more walled-gardens to protect users". But in reality, as soon as they open the floodgates, there will be solutions that can do the same without giving away more control to Google/Apple. The narrative has to change, and the first step is to give device owners full control.
- prasadjoglekar 4y ago
  Assuming you're in the US, if this is really happening, you need to take screenshots of the inappropriate ads, document the experience and send it to your congressman and senator. Go to the local office and speak with the staffers. They need to see and hear from their constituents having this awful experience for there to be any change.
Tenoke 4y ago
Most people's phone internet usage is like 95% on apps like Whatsapp, Instagram, Facebook, TikTok etc. and they are well used to their ads.

suprjami 4y ago

Root access and AdAway from F-Droid. I wouldn't even bother using anything else.

GuB-42 4y ago
Same, but it is more and more annoying to root your phone with all these banking apps blocking rooted phones. And now, with the new security standards (which are good), banks insist on having you install their proprietary app just to authorize payments (which is annoying). I am not talking about Google Pay here (which I can do without). There are workarounds of course, but I am becoming tired of the cat and mouse game, in fact, I am tired of smartphones altogether. Unless things change, my current phone is probably the last rooted phone I will use as a daily driver, sadly, the last "high end" phone too.
- mastazi 4y ago
  > with the new security standards (which are good), banks insist on having you install their proprietary app since you say this, I assume you are in the EU or UK? I've heard that several EU banks offer a second 2FA method besides the app, such as hardware code generator[1]. In the UK, banks are actually required by the regulator to offer at least one method that doesn't require a mobile phone [2]. You could tell your bank "I can't use a smartphone" and they will probably be able to assist you (or, worst case scenario, you could find a bank that can) [1] https://www.unicreditbank.hu/en/individual/banking/electronic_services/strong_customer_authentication/hardware_token.html https://www.unicreditbank.hu/en/individual/banking/electroni... [2] https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/77937914/#Comment_77937914 https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/7793...
- L3viathan 4y ago
  I'm in the same boat. I recently had to upgrade my phone, and oh boy is is annoying to get root working with Google Pay and my banking app. It still works, but it took me a few hours(!). I'm seriously considering switching to iOS for my next phone.
  - 4y ago

red_trumpet 4y ago

Going on a tangent, how is the adblocking story on iOS? As there is not Firefox+uBlock available, is it possible to block ads via VPN or DNS?

BeenChilling 4y ago
[dead]
gbear605 4y ago
Apple allows ad-blocking filters that are basically Safari extensions but must be downloaded through a separate app. I can’t recommend any specific ad-blocked though. https://support.apple.com/guide/iphone/get-extensions-iphab0432bf6/ios https://support.apple.com/guide/iphone/get-extensions-iphab0... The usual VPN and DNS solutions also work fine.
- evgen 4y ago
  I have had a very good experience with 1Blocker so far. Not quite ublock origin but close enough that I almost never notice a difference from my daily desktop use. There is another extension called Vinegar that strips out YouTube ads, but unfortunately it only works with Safari on iOS and not Firefox (even though both are using the same core engine) so I need to remember to bounce over to Safari when watching YouTube vids.
  - interpol_p 4y ago
    Vinegar works with Safari on macOS too. I love it, switches YouTube over to the native video player, strips all the recommendations and other crap and only plays the video
latexr 4y ago
> is it possible to block ads via VPN 1Blocker¹ does it. It’s the “Firewall” section of the iOS app. ¹ https://1blocker.com https://1blocker.com
- 4y ago

avel 4y ago

I would take this post with a grain of salt. It is mostly an ad / promotion for "Blokada Cloud".

sph 4y ago
It's not an ad, it's a link from their forum. Of course they're talking about their product.
- ignoramous 4y ago
  They are known to be hyperbolic on their forums. Ex A: Blokada Plus is a VPN optimized to work flawlessly with Blokada. You get one of the strongest encryptions with minimal impact on battery life and speed. Together with the battle-tested content blocking functionality of Blokada, the VPN gives you a peace of mind knowing that your private activity stays private. Even on public WiFi, no-one will be able to see what you’re doing or steal your sensitive information like bank details. Websites you visit will not be able to reveal your real location. https://archive.is/xyVSn https://archive.is/xyVSn - Strongest encryption? From when I read the code, they back-up private-key without armour (plain-text). - Battle-tested content blocking? Blokada v5 and below has leaked DNS over TCP since its inception (v6+ is closed source). - Peace of mind? https://www-computerbase-de.translate.goog/forum/threads/mobile-app-blokada-verletzt-datenschutz-grundlagen.2089582/?_x_tr_sl=de&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en&_x_tr_pto=sc https://www-computerbase-de.translate.goog/forum/threads/mob... - The less I say about protecting bank details, 'private activity', location... the better. Disclosure: I have been accused by Blokada of spreading FUD before: https://gitlab.com/fdroid/fdroiddata/-/merge_requests/8536 https://gitlab.com/fdroid/fdroiddata/-/merge_requests/8536
  - onphonenow 4y ago
    I had to laugh at the no one can see what you are doing claim. How do these scammers route the traffic if they can’t see what websites you are visiting! Of course these guys can see what websites you are visiting if they want to
- avel 4y ago

naillo 4y ago

I feel like they're just dying to figure out a way to get rid of extensions on desktop as well. Soon enough they'll figure out a way to rationalize them away.

jacquesm 4y ago
Who wants to be that 'for your safety and convenience' will be part of the press release?
- blibble 4y ago
  manifest v3: https://developer.chrome.com/docs/extensions/mv3/intro/ https://developer.chrome.com/docs/extensions/mv3/intro/ > Manifest V3 is part of a shift in the philosophy behind how we approach end-user security and privacy. it requrires you to declaratively specify what to block in advance, so it's going to be pretty easy to write some logic that can't be declaratively specified I suspect killing the adblockers is the entire reason behind it
  - jacquesm 4y ago
    Every time google pulls a trick like this they are inviting regulatory intervention.
  - pineconewarrior 4y ago
    glad firefox is allowing and end-run around this
    - jsheard 4y ago
      With Firefoxes market share continuously declining, and AFAICT no real indication they're going to be able to turn things around, I fear it's only a matter of time before they pull an Edge/Opera and turn into another Chromium reskin to cut costs.
      - silon42 4y ago

david_arcos 4y ago

Original title is about "Google cracks down on VPN based adblockers". Changing "VPN Adblockers" to "Android Adblockers" is misleading, at least. BTW, I'm using Brave because of having u-block origin, and I recommend it. Needed to change the default chrome widget for a brave widget, and lost the chrome sync. Other than that, works as a charm.

ejb999 4y ago
another vote for Brave browser - switched and never looked back.

t0bia_s 4y ago

Pi-hole in home network, AdAway on all smartphones, uBlock Origin an all Firefox browsers. I'm shocked when browsing web on different devices. I always recommend to at least install uBlock Origin to users of those devices. Most of them never heard about ad-blocking and they are very, very happy with new web browsing experience. 99% of theme do not want go back. 1% don't care.

2OEH8eoCRo0 4y ago
Adguard works so well that I forget it's there until I try browsing the web away from home.
- t0bia_s 4y ago
  AdAway is main reason, why I root android devices. It block ads in all apps and browsers even on data, without VPN. Another way how to block ads on data is using OpenVPN to connect data through you home router that has ad-blocking. But it is limited by upload speed of home network connection and battery drain of your smartphone is worse with active OpenVPN.
  - ytch 4y ago
    I use OpenVPN/Wireguard to setup split-tunnel VPN, only route DNS traffic to Pi-hole at home network. Although my connection may be leaked, I thought it's faster since 5G is faster than my home network upload speed.
    - t0bia_s 4y ago
      But your speed in device connected to OpenVPN/Wireguard is limited by upload speed of you home connection. Not by data connection speed on client device.
      - ytch 4y ago
        Yeah, So I use split-tunnel. For example only route 192.168.1.0/24 via VPN, then set 192.168.1.10 as DNS server. Therefore I can use pi-hole at home and other traffic are routed by 5G directly.

kuon 4y ago

I use adaway which simply replace the /etc/hosts file, but requires root. I consider a phone a paperweight if I cannot have root on it, but I realize this might be different for other users.

josephcsible 4y ago
What are you going to do once Google makes TEE-based bootloader unlock checking a mandatory part of SafetyNet? Right now, I'm in the same camp as you, and I don't have a good answer to that myself.
- hedora 4y ago
  I'll likely just not use banking software that requires safetynet. If that means I need to switch banks, that's OK.
  - josephcsible 4y ago
    It's a lot more than just banking apps. It's also McDonald's, Netflix, Snapchat, Pokemon Go, Super Mario Run, etc. Will you just stop using all of them too?
    - kuon 4y ago
      Yes. If an app dont run, I do not use it. If I cannot root my phone, I'll stop having one, I'll have a dumb phone.
    - MichaelCollins 4y ago
      I've never used any of those apps. But McDonald's particularly? I know those other apps are popular, but who actually installs the app for a fast food restaurant? I thought this was something these companies wasted money on because they wanted to feel techy and trendy, I didn't think anybody actually fell for it though. Just walk up to the counter and say "I'll have number whatever"

TrianguloY 4y ago

I use DNS66, installed from F-droid. Play Store has more and more restrictions each month...but it may be a good thing? because people is now discovering the alternate stores and the advantages of them.

jerrygoyal 4y ago
why not just use private dns from nextdns
eleitl 4y ago
Not to forget LineageOS et al.

ignoramous 4y ago

I co-develop a FOSS VPN-based (tcp/udp) firewall for Android. The original policy is documented here: https://web.archive.org/web/20220818100735/https://support.google.com/googleplay/android-developer/answer/12253906?hl=en https://web.archive.org/web/20220818100735/https://support.g... What the post misses is Google has exceptions for: - Parental control and enterprise management apps. - App usage tracking. - Device security apps (for example, anti-virus, mobile device management, firewall). - Network related tools (for example, remote access). - Web browsing apps. - Carrier apps that require the use of VPN functionality to provide telephony or connectivity services. The part where manipulation of ad-based monetization isn't allowed has always been there in one form or another. A firewall can also be used to firewall ads/trackers though, and so it remains to be seen what Google makes of such apps (there are plenty!) come November (supposed deadline for compliance). Blokada v5 (and below), otoh, isn't a firewall, but a UDP-only DNS client.

raxxorraxor 4y ago
I think having exceptions for that is an extremely severe security flaw. Kudos to you for developing something like this, but honestly even with a solid firewall leveraging VPN I would not trust crapware like Android or iOS with anything substantial. We have reached ridiculous levels of paternalism from pretty crappy companies.
wTj8yqRLkg7Dfsp 4y ago
> Ads that appear ... during the beginning of a content segment are not allowed. > Here are some examples of common violations: Unexpected ads that appear ... during the beginning of a content segment (for example, after a user has clicked on a button, and before the action intended by the button click has taken effect). These ads are unexpected for users, as users expect to ... engage in content instead. ??? isn't this like... incredibly and blatantly anti-competitive considering that their own app (Youtube), which they still offer on said store, does this?
- smileybarry 4y ago
  Not entirely, I think they mean ads in games between "new game"/"next level" and the game/level starting. Free games are filled with them. Pre-roll ads in video apps like YouTube are different.

lenova 4y ago

Adguard provides public DNS servers that can be used for blocking ads on your phone as well, no VPN required: https://adguard-dns.io/kb/general/dns-providers/ https://adguard-dns.io/kb/general/dns-providers/

Terretta 4y ago
Which has now gone open-source: https://adguard.com/en/blog/adguard-dns-2-0-goes-open-source.html https://adguard.com/en/blog/adguard-dns-2-0-goes-open-source...
- lenova 4y ago
  Very cool, I didn't know about that, thanks for sharing!

Jason_Protell 4y ago

Firefox Nightly + uBlock Origin seems to work well on Android

GekkePrutser 4y ago
You don't even need nightly, ublock works great on the production version too
- Jason_Protell 4y ago
  I use Firefox Nightly because I also run Bypass Paywalls Clean (c)
  - GekkePrutser 4y ago
    Oooh you can use that on nightly?? I had no idea, in that case I will try it also. I use this a lot on my desktop.

therealmarv 4y ago

Adguard adblocker for Android works also with an internal device only "VPN" and is not on the Play Store for a while (because of problems with Google Play Store rules). They are amazing and if you use an Android browser without internal adblocking (which I still think is better) such a VPN adblocker is a must for Android devices. I only had to whitelist a few applications like e.g. Google Photos. Have been using the app for some years and it's actively maintained. https://adguard.com/en/adguard-android/overview.html https://adguard.com/en/adguard-android/overview.html

exabrial 4y ago

Google needs to be slapped with an anti trust lawsuit so hard their children feel it. This is so brazen they don’t even care

hestefisk 4y ago

“Improved ad experience”…

anaganisk 4y ago
For your own safety and convenience.

causi 4y ago

In my experience the biggest problem with VPN-based adblocking is the battery drain when the signal is poor. I regularly spend time in a well-insulated room and forgetting to turn my VPN off has a very noticeable impact at the end of the day. Which is a shame, because Chrome is a hell of a lot snappier than Firefox Android.

flerchin 4y ago
Is it? Chrome is definitely not snappier than Firefox with ublock origin on Android.
- causi 4y ago
  Perhaps it depends on your setup. My device only has 6GB of ram.

DavideNL 4y ago

So, "The biggest advertising company in the world cracks down on [...] adblockers." I don't understand why people are surprised about this.

nathanaldensr 4y ago
Your characterization of people announcing it and discussing it as "surprise" is incorrect. Consider it more of a reminder or notification.

sobkas 4y ago

I don't use ad blockers, I only block trackers. So if you want me to see your adds better not try to track me. If your site complaints about it, then I don't see any reason to use it.

InCityDreams 4y ago
Please show how...
badRNG 4y ago
How do you go about doing that?

pmontra 4y ago

For all the love I have for Blockada I'm not going to send my traffic through their cloud. I wonder if I can run something like PiHole on a VPS somewhere so that I can protect my devices both when I'm at home on WiFi and when I'm outside on 4G. I'll investigate but does anybody already experienced such a setup?

mtremsal 4y ago
That's exactly the problem I had while traveling this month. I just posted about my setup: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32512576 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32512576 -- so far it's been great. See also nextdns.io for a turnkey alternative.
cricalix 4y ago
Tailscale have a knowledgebase article on doing it - https://tailscale.com/kb/1114/pi-hole/ https://tailscale.com/kb/1114/pi-hole/ There's probably other ways.
- tssva 4y ago
  I have been using this setup for about 3 months and it works great.
wmeredith 4y ago
The Pi-hole docs have a an article on setting up a VPN for your pi-hole so you can use it from anywhere: https://docs.pi-hole.net/guides/vpn/openvpn/overview/ https://docs.pi-hole.net/guides/vpn/openvpn/overview/
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
qdl 4y ago
there is easy to setup options like wirehole https://github.com/IAmStoxe/wirehole https://github.com/IAmStoxe/wirehole

daitangio 4y ago

I will never stop to talk about PiHole and how much changed my home browsing experience: https://pi-hole.net/ https://pi-hole.net/ I suggest everybody to give it a spin

whynotmaybe 4y ago
It also works on Roku. I know that ads are used to pay content creator on the web but I don't see why I should see ads on the home screen of a TV I fully paid.
- psychlops 4y ago
  The amount of times roku pings scribe.logs.roku.com just makes me angry. I let them see nothing.
snarf21 4y ago
We need a $20 appliance that is plug and play. Most users aren't installing Docker containers.
- hedora 4y ago
  Like a raspberry pi?
- int_19h 4y ago
  Most PiHole users aren't, either. You insert an SD card into a Raspberry Pi or similar, and it boots. Some people sell preimaged SD cards, some sell prebuilt devices - I've seen both on eBay.
- dvtrn 4y ago
  Crazy though, but hear me out: what about an old laptop
  - klez 4y ago
    I'm pretty sure they mean a pre-configured appliance, not something you have to provide the hardware for and install the software on on your own.

rdudek 4y ago

I've been using NextDNS for quite some time and it's been working great for blocking ads on my iOS devices while away from home.

fortran77 4y ago

> This could mean Google is cracking down on VPN-based ads and tracker filtering apps behind the scenes.

smileybarry 4y ago

I started using NextDNS years ago and it's been a blessing. Blocks almost every ad on a DNS level on mobile devices, and on PC I still augment it with uBlock Origin. Per-device logs also let me debug connectivity if something breaks, and it's great for mapping local device names without mDNS debugging or some dnsmasq resolver lying around.

laundermaf 4y ago
I regularly find websites that don’t work until I disable the Adblock, usually on mobile. This isn’t intentional generally. How do you deal with that? Are you just not going to buy a plane ticket on the airline’s website just ‘cause?
- smileybarry 4y ago
  Turning off affiliate blocking fixed 99% of those, and the rest I just manually add to my allowlist. It’s not many but if that doesn’t fix quickly then I just switch it off for a minute.
- leokennis 4y ago
  There is a blocklist with the explicit goal to not break sites (at the expense of sometimes being tracked or seeing an ad): https://oisd.nl/ https://oisd.nl/ > Why this list? > Where most other blocklists go for the "block ads/trackers and when something breaks it's up to the user to figure out what to whitelist"-approach .. > > This list prioritizes functionality over blocking. > > Thís is the list to use at home, at work or at your (grand-)parents place. > Users report it "passes the girlfriend-test" ;) I used to run more strict lists and then whitelist domains or temporarily disable blocking, but I have to say I switched to oisd only and now I'm seeing maybe 0.5% more ads without having to go through that hassle, which is a fine compromise for me.
neop1x 4y ago
I think DNS-based blocking will eventually be less effective over time. It shouldn't be difficult to host ads on the main domain, modern distributed reverse proxies are very fast. So they will probably soon just stop using ad-only domains and host everything on the main one.

kaiusbrantlee 4y ago

Yeah I can understand google needing to do this. I mean, they aren't making nearly enough money already

gumby 4y ago

> These changes aim to improve the ads experience, tighten security and limit misinformation according to the company. Yes, according to the company. But improving the ad experience for google, not for the user. What Orwellian doublespeak!

disintegore 4y ago

I categorically reject ads. I want them completely abolished. I will do everything that's in my power to get them out of my machines. If I had just a little bit more courage I would go out at night with cans of spray paint and deface billboards.

sofixa 4y ago
How do you propose sites/YouTube channels monetise themselves (for sustenance or profit)?
- disintegore 4y ago
  I don't really care about their bottom line. They're the middle-men. Virtual landlords. They're there to squeeze the lemon. Not to say that the service they provide isn't useful. It's obviously more economical to operate media platforms at scale, and obviously most content creators don't have the technical ability to do it themselves. When you look at say, podcasts for instance, you have this giant shared wealth of free content and you can pick a number of creators to support depending on your budget. You usually get extra episodes or perks as an incentive for doing so. Imagine if, instead of paying YouTube X dollars or watching Y ads and letting them choose out how to spread that money around, you pay the people you actually watch and the platform vendors, who ought to be the least important and most replaceable factor in this transaction, gets the cut they actually deserve. Before they were ruined by copyright trolls, streaming services like Netflix demonstrated that charging everyone a reasonable amount of money for access to the entire park was a viable business model.
  - Bakary 4y ago
    YouTube sounds replaceable or unimportant in an ethical sense but in a practical sense it's certainly not that simple from the POV of someone trying to build an audience for their videography or even the audience itself.
    - disintegore 4y ago

scarface74 4y ago

Google > Google claims to be cracking down on apps that are using the VPN service to track user data Also Google https://www.helpnetsecurity.com/2019/01/31/google-apple-developer-certificate/ https://www.helpnetsecurity.com/2019/01/31/google-apple-deve...

userbinator 4y ago

At least you can still "sideload", i.e. download the software straight from the source and install it that way, the way software used to be distributed before this walled-garden dystopia started... I personally run a MITM proxy on my network which all traffic goes through. IMHO the security concerns are overblown and largely come from companies like Google trying to stop people doing things like this. They are only securing their profits, nothing more and nothing less. These changes aim to improve the ads experience, tighten security and limit misinformation according to the company. The truth is probably closer to "increase the number of ads you see, secure you from getting around that, and limit the proliferation of anything but their official propaganda."

rixthefox 4y ago

Wouldn't this be more evidence that Google shouldn't be running the Play Store? If they are going to start blocking apps that do adblocking on-device that sounds like an abuse of power and a HUGE conflict of interest with Google running the Play Store AND being owned by an advertising company.

twistedpair 4y ago

Ghostery browser on Android is pretty easy to use.

Terretta 4y ago
It had been excellent. Have you kept track of their ownership and business model since the mid 2010s? - monetization strategy involves affiliate marketing and the sale of ad analytics data - shows advertisements of its own to users

kornhole 4y ago

Does this only apply to phones with Google Play Services installed?

jl6 4y ago

The problem is not just ads. In this comment I’m going to explain why the problem is not just ads. What are ads? Advertizing, or marketing, is a common means of monetizing content. Here are the top three reasons ads are used on websites: 1. Monetization 2. Tracking users 3. Malware distribution Want to know more about how ads track users? Read on. As a guy growing up in rural Wyoming, ads weren’t something that ever really bothered me. Sure there was the occasional billboard and sure television had a lot of commercials breaks, but I was used to it. The idea of using an ad blocker on my television set never occurred to me. I remember this one time when my uncle was moving house and he needed some help and I helped him move the packing crates into the truck and the crates had the logo and name of the shipping company stencilled on the side, and it never bothered me, although that was in fact an ad. Experts agree that the following method is great for dealing with ads: First, make sure what you are looking at is an ad. You can often tell by the little x in the corner of the ad. If you click this, you will be able to close the ad and maybe even give some feedback about why you didn’t like the ad. Top tip: always fill this in to let the ad vendor know how to improve the ad for next time. But take care! This next tip is really important. If you don’t hit the little x exactly on target, you will be taken to the website of the ad. If you didn’t want the ad in the first place, this is surely something to avoid! Here are 17 resolutions for dealing with accidentally visiting a website you didn’t want to visit: 1. Try restarting your phone, laptop or PC. 2. Close the browser window. Click here for help on how to accomplish this task. 3. Try clicking the back button on your browser. 4. Write to the FCC if the website caused you distress. 5. Take a walk. Besides being good exercise, the problem may have resolved itself by the time you return. 6. Hit refresh on your browser. If you didn’t like the website first time round, you know what they say? Try, try again! 7. Go to the URL bar on your browser and type in a different address. Don’t forget to hit the Enter key. Try the following helpful URLs from our trusted partners: https://www.geico.com https://www.geico.com https://www.espn.com https://www.espn.com https://www.target.com https://www.target.com 8. Raise a ticket with Apple support. 9. Install Google Chrome. 10. Re-install Google Chrome. 11. Contact your ISP. My top tip? Threaten to cancel unless they can resolve your issue completely right away! 12. Close all open windows and applications and wait 30 seconds. 13. Clear your cookies and web browsing history. 14. … Show more.

tananaev 4y ago

I use Bromite (Chromium fork + ad block) on Android. It's pretty sad to see Google stoop so low. Back in the day they used to win because of the innovation, best products and openness. Now they can't build anything new and just trying to squeeze every last penny from what they already have.

anaganisk 4y ago
Well its an Ad company end of the day, all their innovations add up to showing better ads.

grishka 4y ago

Uhh what exactly is Google cracking down on if Blokada has always been distributed as an apk precisely because Google has never allowed this sort of thing on Google Play?

avel 4y ago
Nothing. This post seems to be just a promo with the intention to cause some stir and publicity for Blokada.