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Ask HN: Anyone working 4 day week here, as an employee?

• patatino 4y ago
  At my previous job I was up for a raise and negotiated to reduce to 4 days (32 hours) and keep my full salary. That was a good day.
• detaro 4y ago
  "Hey boss, I'd like to go down to 32 hours/week at least for a bit" "sure, email HR to adjust your contract and tell your teamlead"
• philmcp 4y ago
  In my previous job I asked my boss if he would let me drop down to 3 days per week (60% salary). To my slight surprise, he was totally fine with it I did this after working hard for ~1 year at the company. Once you prove your worth, it's in your employers interests to keep you i.e. it would cost them way more if you left for another job with shorter working hours so don't be afraid to ask If it was doing it again though, I'd request this during my yearly review, and I'd ask for a 4 day week with no drop in salary There are already companies offering a 32 hours work week though: https://4dayweek.io/ https://4dayweek.io/ Disclaimer: I'm the founder
  • akudha 4y ago
    Awesome, thank you for the link and the answer!
    • garciasn 4y ago
      While I’m already very much an advocate for paying my team what why’re worth, the recent shifts with remote work has put extreme pressure on companies to meet salary expectations in much larger markets. I have an employee who needed a 33% increase due to market pressures. While we were going to already meet 15% of that at his next annual, budgets didn’t easily allow for the other 18. Instead, he got a significant raise and a 4-day week to boot. He’s happy. I’m happy. And, frankly, we don’t see any productivity loss. It is absolutely possible.
      • philmcp 4y ago
        Love this! From every 4 day week company I've spoke to, they all say the same thing: Output hasn't changed And if this ever becomes a company wide policy (e.g. 4 days for 100% or 80% salary), please let me know :)
  • tokinonagare 4y ago
    Awesome! I joined the industry temporarily but the 5 days week (with 3 hours commutation) is soul crushing. Four days makes it fine to cope with. I hope I can find something using your website so I can work more on my personal projects.
    • vbezhenar 4y ago
      After few months if everyone's happy with your work, you can definitely ask for some days being remote and gradually increase it to fully remote, if you can manage yourself responsibly. 3 hours commutation is definitely not something you should endure for the rest of your life.
  • ddlutz 4y ago
    Is it typical to find completely unacceptable pay on your site? Listings that have requirement for engineers which could pull home 200-300k a year wanting to pay $15 an hour. I guess this is why "nobody wants to work anymore" One listing (company name omitted to protect the witness): Requirements BS/MS in Computer Science Strong in Data Structure/Algorithms, can solve intermediate-level Leetcode questions with ease Experience in conducting technical interviews and well-trained on how to grade candidate performance Passion for mentorship! Nice To Have Have the flexibility to work 10-20+ hours per week when business needs warrant Have prior start-up experience Compete in Leetcode contests weekly and rank top 2000. Previous experience competing in ACM contests. What's In it for you 100% remote work (1099 basis) Flexible work hours Opportunity to network and build connections with aspiring and established designers Compensation: $15/hr
    • philmcp 4y ago
      Most companies originally had a 5 day week, but dropped to 4 days without effecting salaries So typically the salaries are "market rate". Difficult to say for sure though as most companies still don't disclose this As for the job you mentioned, I know which company this is and its for a part-time job (i.e. not a 4 day week for 100% salary) Speaking honestly, I added the part time jobs are added to "bolster" content (given there are so few 4 day week jobs atm). I'd recommend focusing on the jobs marked as "4 day week", they are typically "higher quality"
    • smeej 4y ago
      Where I live, even Walmart can't get people to show up for less than $15 an hour (even though we have no separate minimum wage than the national $7.25/hr). The KFC across the street from the Walmart was recently advertising $17/hr. $15/hr for that kind of tech experience would never fly here!
    • intelVISA 4y ago
      There's no way that gets filled right? That's completely divorced from reality lol.
      • plasticchris 4y ago
• StevenWaterman 4y ago
  Just accepted a 32hr week job. Was advertised as, and applied for it, as 40hrs. After having an offer from them, I got another offer elsewhere at a much higher salary. I knew the first was a better cultural fit, so went back and asked them to work with me. No room to negotiate on salary, so they offered 32hr weeks and I jumped at it.
  • runnerup 4y ago
    Did it come with a pro-rated lower pay or same pay as the initially negotiated 40hr week?
    • StevenWaterman 4y ago
      Pay and holidays stayed the same as the original offer, not pro-rata. It was a case of "not enough money in the budget" rather than "you're not worth more"
      • Marazan 4y ago
        Well done.
  • gaws 4y ago
    I hope you got the 32-hour agreement in an iron-clad contract. I've seen companies flip the script on people a few months into the job.
    • toomuchtodo 4y ago
      “Today will be my last day.” is the proper response to such an action.
    • StevenWaterman 4y ago
      For sure, they hire people part-time quite often, so its just set up as a part time job. Not too worried about them turning around and screwing me over, because we both know I'm the one holding all the cards. I trust them to look after me and treat me right, which is why I turned down the higher offer. If they betray that trust, there's nothing stopping me leaving. Didn't burn any bridges with the 2nd company, they're happy to have me back if it doesn't work out.
• kqr 4y ago
  "For the foreseeable future, I'm going to take Fridays to be with my family. Can we make that work?" "Good for you! Coordinate with your team and make sure you fill HR in on your absences." This was after working the full 40 weeks for four years* with an employer that knows how important work--life balance is. ---- * Well, I did take one afternoon/week off for medical reasons for half a year. And arranged 60 % work to have time for university in parallel another year. And was away on parental leave for most of yet another year. I guess a good employer does not make it hard to stay with them.
• zackify 4y ago
  I told the employer that I currently work 4 days so I won’t join without keeping that schedule. Before that, I just asked for 4 days and made it clear I provide the value of those who work 5 days a week. No pay cut required.
• Marazan 4y ago
  Was working fulltime. Asked my manager to go down to 4 days. They said yes. Now down to a 3 day week (spread over 5 days) as it fits my situation better.
• RyJones 4y ago
  We switched to four day weeks last year. In practice, it means I now work six days a week instead of seven.
• mfashby 4y ago
  yes :) > Where/How did you find your job? Referral from an old colleague. > If you started at 40 hours per week, how did you negotiate it to 32? Asked. Took 80% full time equivalent pay. Had just received a pay rise, so there wasn't much actual reduction.
• 0x20cowboy 4y ago
  The company just started doing it after the pandemic hit. They mostly did it to support the mental health of engineering, but has now become a perk to try to entice talent.
• nr2x 4y ago
  It’s an interesting question. I’m at a fairly senior level so aside from meetings I’d say my work is semi-continuous as I think about the problems I’m working on regardless of if I’m at my desk or not. So I don’t really think the “hours on the clock” paradigm applies in one sense. It’s not unusual for me to knock out a couple casual meetings on Friday morning then just sign off and go for a hike. But again, there’s a good chance I’m thinking about work on that hike. Is that a 4 day week? Is it 4.5? Is it 7? I dunno!
  • mensetmanusman 4y ago
    Same, mix in the 6 AM Tokyo meetings and the 8 PM Seoul and you have to take afternoons off to stay sane.
    • nr2x 4y ago
      Ha, I’m in PST working with a lot of people in EEA. So yeah, if I’m taking a 7am meeting I’m clocking out “early”.
  • macNchz 4y ago
    > Is that a 4 day week? Is it 4.5? Is it 7? I dunno! To me that sounds like 4.5 days–in this modern work environment I see “working days” as days where there is an expectation of availability and/or action. An off day therefore should involve no expectation that you’re reachable, or that you’ll make outwardly visible progress on your projects. Personally I really try not to work weekends, but some weekend days I’ll have an idea, or feel the need to get ahead of things, and I’ll do some work. I don’t consider myself to have a six day a week job in that case–nobody has the expectation that I’m reachable then or that things on my todo list will be getting checked off.
  • Aeolun 4y ago
    > I’m at a fairly senior level so aside from meetings I’d say my work is semi-continuous as I think about the problems I’m working on regardless of if I’m at my desk or not. This is true for me as well, but somehow my boss doesn’t seem to think that way. For the sake of consistency I think we should say time not spent at your desk is time off.
• Apreche 4y ago
  I just recently started a 32 hour a week salaried job. Here’s my story. I was at a very good job. My ultimate goal is to just go to the beach and not work at all. I realized that’s too big of a leap, so I set a shorter term more realistic goal of working 4 days a week. My employer at the time rejected the idea, so instead of ignoring recruiters like usual, I answered them. If a job wasn’t immoral, the interview process wasn’t arduous, and I felt I could do the job, I went through with interviews in good faith. Every time I did this, I got to the offer phase. With nothing to lose, at that moment I asked to work four days a week. I didn’t demand it. I just asked for it. I think I even said the exact words “I know you’ll probably say no to this, but I want to work four days a week.” One place made an offer that wasn’t better enough compared to my existing job. I didn’t accept and moved on. Eventually a place made an offer I couldn’t refuse. I have been here almost two months. Have yet to work on a Friday. I’m actually working harder than ever on Monday through Thursday. I am motivated to make this last, because honestly it is just as fantastic as I imagined. My life is so good right now despite the world being terrible. My new salary is higher as well.
  • adventured 4y ago
    > My life is so good right now despite the world being terrible. The world is overwhelmingly amazing, not terrible. For the majority of people this is one of the best times to be alive in all of human history. Rivaled only by the years prior to the pandemic.
    • roey2009 4y ago
      War, Deglobalization, Climate Change, Resource scarcity, Economic bubbles. What the fuck are you on about, the world is olympic diving into the garbage heap. Edit: If you downvote, please have the decency to explain your reasoning. Are you saying this opinion is incorrect? Why? It is to my understanding a race against time, when concerning climate change alone. One we are losing. Do you just dislike hearing about it?
      • Group_B 4y ago
        As if none of that existed in the past?
• cnorthwood 4y ago
  When joining my current company I said in the negotiation phase that I'd like to do a 4 day week in exchange for 80% of the offered salary. They agreed.
• gedy 4y ago
  Company wouldn't budge on salary (~20% lower than I was aiming for), but manager really wanted me so I proposed 4-day work week. Fair compromise imho.
  • bootloop 4y ago
    Same salary then or also 20% less?
    • gedy 4y ago
      Same salary
  • StopHammoTime 4y ago
    That is some 4D chess on your part. Well played!
• flyingfences 4y ago
  Earlier this summer, my employer switched the entire company from a 5x8 to a 4x10 schedule. We're still working 40 hours per week, but the three-day weekends and the avoided commute definitely outweigh the earlier mornings.
• isomorph 4y ago
  I went down from 5 days to 2 days and then up to 3 days all in the same FAANG role thanks to a doctor’s note for a chronic illness
• Nimitz14 4y ago
  Yup, in switzerland. The work-life balance is amazing. I asked for it when negotiating the job offer, employer had to accept since there were no other candidates and I was a perfect fit. Tired of being the most knowledgeable person in the room though, so accepted a full-time position in the US I will change to soon.
  • nhooyr 4y ago
    Will you miss Switzerland?
    • Nimitz14 4y ago
      yup, the QoL is amazing. I can understand non-sporty people not liking it though.
  • hobo_mark 4y ago
    So... are they hiring? :)
• jen729w 4y ago
  Yes. I’m a contractor at a large IT integrator in Australia. It helps that my boss was (see below) a good friend. I think it was mid-last-year, I just realised I’d be mentally healthier if I worked 4 days a week. So I said, I’m going to start working 4 days a week. And he said, okay. Because he’s great. And it is glorious. You go from spending almost three-quarters of your life at work (71.4%) to just over half (57.1%) and I know those numbers are silly but I put them there because that’s really what it feels like. Previously the weekend was this fleeting thing that came and went. I barely remembered it before it was over. Now … well, right now it’s Monday morning, and Monday is the day that I don’t work. Monday is the day that I spend on my side projects. Monday is the day that we go to the movies or go shopping or to a gallery. FAQs, do I still work 40 hours? No. I did for a spell, when it was busy. I’d say my average has been 36. But now I’m on 32. Do I get less done? Not really. There’s so much wasted time in the typical day, and I do think that this has focused me the times that I am at work. When I’m on, I’m on. I’ll fight tooth and nail to keep this arrangement. I’m looking for a new job. The boss moved on to a different role, it’s that transition time when everyone seems to move on. I’ve put my 4 day thing in the front section of my résumé. Which is on GitHub, so if anyone in Canberra is reading and wants to hire the guy behind Johnny.Decimal, all my details are here. https://github.com/johnnydecimal/resume https://github.com/johnnydecimal/resume
  • lethologica 4y ago
    Bit if a tangent but I absolutely love the Johnny Decimal system so much. It has become my defacto way of sorting things now. Didn’t know the person who invented was Aussie too, very cool! Good luck with your job search.
  • jackvalentine 4y ago
    Well that's annoying, I left Canberra last year but would have absolutely loved to both meet you and employ you on some projects I had while there!
  • worthless-trash 4y ago
    I use JD as my baseline organization technique, works a treat.
• nameless912 4y ago
  My company has pretty flexible PTO (though most of the work is client driven so our deadlines are pretty firm). My partner and I are expecting a baby in January, and my partner has one day off of work per week (they work 10's at a hospital). I basically just _told_ my boss that I'm dropping to 32 hours to accommodate for my family's needs, and he more or less accepted it. It helps that I'm a staff engineer and I've always gotten my work in on time, and after a couple weeks of adjustment I'm right back up to my normal productivity. So, I guess what I have to say is: - have a good reason (and your own mental health/WLB is a good enough reason, but you need to have one for people to take you seriously) - show you're capable of getting the work done - accept that not everyone will be accommodating, and figure out how valuable this accommodation is for you.
• deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
• thrawn0r 4y ago
  I work 4 days at Microsoft in Germany (PM at Github) In Germany employees have the right to demand part time. for new hires it's usually 40h and then reduce after the probation period. might reduce your career growth but I still got promoted and am happy with Fridays off
  • lumberjack24 4y ago
    open to referrals?
• ErrantX 4y ago
  I don't, however I am generally able to flex my days a lot due to working mostly from home and also being able to complete my work fairly quickly. A lot of people at my employer do work different schedules though. Either 4 day weeks or compressed hours (9 longer days & one day off). I think it's a cultural thing where the organisation recognises work is work and you also deserve a life on your terms. All of us seem pretty happy with our setups...
• heikkilevanto 4y ago
  I used to work 4 days a week for some years. Used to hate Mondays, then I loved Mondays, and hated Tuesdays instead. Worked fine until the company changed direction and the work got too stressful, so I ended up quitting and retiring. It was an easy negotiation, we already had one guy taking every Wednesday off.
• thejackgoode 4y ago
  I negotiated this year down to 36 hours, being 4 days of 9 hours and Wednesdays off. It’s amazing. How to do it? I think it’s one of those things you can target on purpose. Regarding my case, I have a good relationship with my superiors, I fulfill the goals which are put in front of me, team is happy etc, etc.
• maveonair 4y ago
  Yes, I have been working 4 days a week (80%) in Switzerland for ten years. Here in Switzerland there are many job opportunities in different positions, from junior to very high positions, including engineering management. Nowadays it is not uncommon for other colleagues to work 80% as well, especially if they have become parents.
• slater 4y ago
  Negotiated it to 32h due to COVID pandemic; there wasn't enough work for 40h, so I floated the idea, boss was OK with it. Never going back to 40h though, 3 days off in a row is pretty spiffy :D
• Cockbrand 4y ago
  German here, where part-time arrangements in tech are somewhat normal. I negotiated my 32 hour work week right at the beginning, and there was no discussion about it, and none was expected. I kind of get only an 80% salary, which seems a bit unfair as studies prove that part-time workers are more efficient [1], but the way better work-life balance is definitely worth it. [1] Researching the validity of this claim is left as an exercise for the reader. [EDIT] I have Wednesdays off, which is fantastic and somewhat based on science: https://www.rdasia.com/healthsmart/conditions/mental-health/best-day-take-work-and-its-not-friday https://www.rdasia.com/healthsmart/conditions/mental-health/...
  • schrodinger 4y ago
    Agree on the 80% thing but it's so hard to quantify output that a simple formula probably ends up feeling the most fair to most people. Also, remember what another person pointed out—it's not really a 20% pay cut because it's your highest-taxed salary that's been cut.
  • Someone 4y ago
    > and there was no discussion about it, and none was expected. That’s EU regulation. https://europa.eu/youreurope/business/human-resources/employment-contracts/part-time-work/index_en.htm https://europa.eu/youreurope/business/human-resources/employ...: “Equal employment conditions You must offer your part‑time staff the same employment conditions as full-time workers, including pay, leave, notice periods and other rights and benefits linked to their employment. Modifying working arrangements Whenever possible, you should try to accommodate requests from your employees if they want to change their working schedules, such as: - transferring from full-time to part-time - transferring from part-time to full-time - increasing their working hours You cannot dismiss an employee if they refuse to transfer from part-time to full-time work or vice versa.” (Equal pay, leave, pension, etc. are pro rata) In the EU, about 1:5 of employees work part time, most of them to their satisfaction (https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/web/products-eurostat-news/-/DDN-20180608-1 https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/web/products-eurostat-news/-/D...)
• jokethrowaway 4y ago
  Fairly common among contractors. You just negotiate how many days you want to work on that client. Plenty of coworkers from Italy do it to avoid paying higher taxes: they increase their hourly rate until they hit the 65k pa limit and then they just start dropping days. If they were to earn even 66k, they would start paying way more taxes and they would need to earn ~30k more to get the same salary after taxes.
  • jcparkyn 4y ago
    It sounds like you're saying their total after-tax income would decrease if they worked more hours? I'm not sure how, because that's definitely not how income tax works (Italian or otherwise).
    • flicken 4y ago
      It's an unintended consequence of the reduced (5-15% flat) taxes available via "regime forfettario"[1] which only applies to businesses with <65k income. Otherwise you have to pay much more (23%-43%) via the regular progressive tax brackets. Somewhat similarly, in the USA there is a "welfare trap"[2] where earning more income would reduce other benefits (eg housing, food) enough to result in an effective >100% tax on income. [1] https://publicnewstime.com/travel/explained-the-pros-and-cons-of-italys-five-percent-flat-tax-for-freelancers/ https://publicnewstime.com/travel/explained-the-pros-and-con... [2] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Welfare_trap https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Welfare_trap
• i_like_robots 4y ago
  I work four days in my current role and will continue doing so in my next one. I don't have much choice in the matter so I always raise it at the earliest opportunity and have even added it to my CV to make sure I don't waste anybody's time. I've found the majority of the companies I've spoken to over the last few years (in the UK) have been open to me working 4 days a week but I've also had the frustrating experiencing of being told this isn't an option after interviewing successfully. At the moment people with my experience are in huge demand so having this leverage must be a big help and I'm happy to take advantage of it while it lasts.
  • triyambakam 4y ago
    What industry or domain are you in?
• aeze 4y ago
  We made the change company-wide a few months ago. No reduction in pay, employees are able to choose their 32-hour schedule based on their needs. Some people take off Mondays, some Fridays, some work 5 days but shorter hours. We're just expected to coordinate with our coworkers which has worked out fine so far. As someone who has historically worked long hours, I wasn't expecting to enjoy the change so much. It will be very hard to move back if/when I move companies in the future.
• oddeyed 4y ago
  I have negotiated a four day week twice. I would recommend a four day week to anyone who can afford it. Don't forget that because of tax bands the effective pay cut is less than 20%. The first time I just straight up asked my boss in a conversation and with a request in writing. I said I was unhappy in my life in general and wanted more time to spend on other things than work. There is legislation in the UK that means that employers must consider these requests and reply with an answer and explanation in a fixed time frame. They accepted and I worked it for about 4 months before other circumstances meant I had to relocate and leave that company. The job I moved to was a start-up. After a string of executive resignations and engineering team redundancies I was left as the most experienced team member. I had another job offer in hand that I didn't really want but took it to the only remaining senior lead and asked for 4 days (at full pay this time) or I'd leave. They accepted in an informal way rather than modify my contract in this case and just called it "taking a day off when you need it". I would not recommend accepting this in general as it puts you in a vulnerable position for being punished for doing what you thought was the agreed deal. In any case, working 4 days at this job was a disaster because the company was such a mess and I had so little support that I spent my day off and my weekends obsessing about work unhealthily. I ultimately went back to 5 days in a more senior role to try to help right the ship but couldn't take the stress then either so ended up leaving. I'm now at 5 days again. If I stick my new job out I plan to request 4 days after my probation period ends. The decision for an employer comes down to retention - do they want to keep you enough to accept 4 days instead of the risk of you leaving? So if you have a manager who can understand your value and represent that to internal decision makers then that's the main key.
• taurusnoises 4y ago
  In NYC "summer Fridays" were a thing where some 9-5 jobs gave Fridays off for a couple months. Back in 2005-2010 I worked at a magazine that did that until my boss was like, wait, if we can put out the magazine in four days for a few months, we can do it in four all year. No one objected, and thus began the best job I ever had. Managing editor for a 4-day-a-week magazine.
• outsider7 4y ago
  Currently working 35 hours a week, in a unionized job with banked time starting at 36h (1:1), (2:1 at 40+ hrs), 4 weeks vacation & unlimited sick days up to a point(6 per year I hear...), meaning I can take a day off whenever I'm too tired/sick. Due to the negotiated conditions, it's also really not advantageous for the employer to force us to be on call or have us do any amount of OT. Thus the workload is really stable. In a way I now have too much free time. It's been a bliss overall on my work/life balance. I've never been that healthy and my stress level has never been so low in my life. I know I'll live longer and once I am more stable financially, I'll be able to have time to contribute to my community. The salaries are also quite good. I highly encourage people to unionize, it is the only way to get proper leverage in this highly inequitable period we live in. The union we have is small and consists exclusively of people with at minimum university degrees. Most of them have some form of life accomplishments due to the hiring process also. Due to the conditions negotiated, the well provisioned pension fund and general job advantages, most people coming in are experienced (5+ years) except for some amount of diversity/equity hires (which the company kinda needed since everyone stays there until retirement...). Thus, the union is well organized to have leverage, well structured and reasonable with whom they should defend when there is abuse on the side of the employer. People are mostly diligent in their work obligations. There is some rare exceptions, some employees with too much mastery of transferring issues to others. Frankly, I've seen the same or worst in Big Corpo, mostly in middle management, the only difference here is some employees do it instead of the managers...
  • carabiner 4y ago
    Wild guess, but is this in a smaller, suburban town, rather than a big city?
• TomVDB 4y ago
  A friend on mine quit his FAANG job, took a one year sabbatical, and went back on the job market. He found a remote-only job at a boutique bank in NYC, negotiated his compensation, and then told them he'd only accept the offer if it was 4 days instead of 5 at the same salary. They accepted without any pushback. He totally loves his 3-day weekends.
• viraptor 4y ago
  I was happy doing 40h, but after we had a baby I asked for 4 days instead for an undefined amount of time. Tbh, I don't think my productivity changed at all with the day dropped so it's a bit of a shame that the salary did. But given I work in tech and basically get a very comfortable lifestyle either way, I don't think I'll go back to 5 days if possible. I know the current company won't push me to do it, and I interviewed with another which was fine with 4 days. My wife also does 4 days (different), so my son gets an extra weekday with each of us independently which is also a great thing.
• marvin 4y ago
  Yup. Been for a few years now. Hired through normal application, full time developer on a team of 6-ish. Worked there for a few years before negotiating down to 90%; a day off every other week. Then a year after that negotiated down to 80%. Proportional salary cuts in both cases. Wasn't very hard to convince them. Made sure I was available for whatever coordination is required. Made sure I still meet expectations. Argued that my productivity wouldn't fall proportionally to the drop in time. No one has complained. Was a few months of adaption to make people realize I'm normally not available one of the days a week, but everyone has taken it in stride. Most are a little jealous.
• 2muchcoffeeman 4y ago
  I have worked a 4 day week for a year and a half and it is indeed as glorious as people make out IF you retain control of that day off. If it turns out that people expect you to do chores for them, it feels like you're just working for no pay.
• schrodinger 4y ago
  I'm not, but I manage an engineer who recently asked. He's fantastic, why would I care? I just filled out a form with HR and he's now at 80% pay 4 days a week. I treat him with respect and he treats me with respect. If it ends up turning into a really difficult situation for the team, we might have a discussion about how to improve. But honestly knowing he's out every Friday will probably be a good forcing function for us to have a day with few meetings etc.
  • jononomo 4y ago
    It seems like people are 95% as effective working 4 days as they are working 5, and quality of life for everyone goes up massively -- shouldn't this just become the norm.
    • schrodinger 4y ago
      Agreed. Maybe if I’m the CTO some day… hah.
• bamboozled 4y ago
  Yeah but really I work 5
• simonblack 4y ago
  Many employers are looking for the hours to be filled, without necessarily specifying that each employee works the whole hours. That is especially the case for enterprises that work 7 days a week or (say) 12 hours a day. In those cases, you either negotiate upfront before you start that you are only available for 3, 4 or five days a week or whatever number you want. Or you state at some point that you want to reduce your hours to whatever figure suits you, in which case there is an opening for another person to fill those now-unstaffed hours. If the employer is only open for business 40 hours (5 x 8 hours) a week, then there is a situation which is more difficult to vary. But it's still doable to have two or more people sharing that single position: that's called "job-sharing".
  • jhugo 4y ago
    This perspective looks at programming like factory work: output == hours worked * some factor. But in reality, most employers in tech that have allowed some or all employees to reduce their hours have found no productivity loss, or in some cases productivity gains. That's why often employers are OK with leaving the salary the same when moving to 4-day weeks.
• baobob 4y ago
  I've worked formal 3 and 4 day week arrangements. Net experience: it's pointless, if you're working 4 day weeks and you're feeling behind, you may well end up working that 5th day without anyone asking. Similarly in a 5 day week arrangement, I've never felt compelled to actually work the full week especially when I'm ahead. Ignoring any formality, I think most folk work a 2-3 week if they were honest about it. I wouldn't sweat having a 3/4 day arrangement as a reason to pick one company over another, especially if the offer is implicitly part of attempting to screw you on salary
  • icedchai 4y ago
    Exactly this, and especially with "remote work", you can pretty much regulate your own hours.
  • soupfordummies 4y ago
    >>Similarly in a 5 day week arrangement, I've never felt compelled to actually work the full week especially when I'm ahead. Ignoring any formality, I think most folk work a 2-3 week if they were honest about it. While I agree with you, ya gotta admit that most don’t have the luxury to just say “I got my work done already im just gonna take Friday off.” Most of us are expected to be available at the least from M-F, 9-5.
  • ojame 4y ago
    We work 4 days a week (4x7.5) and we have a very strict “policy” that no one works on a Monday. The same way that no one works on a Saturday or a Sunday. It’s easy to see when people work outside of work, and we don’t celebrate it, we try and find out why it happened and to change process to better protect time off. Generally employees working “overtime” is not a failure of them, it’s a failure of process (estimation, workload, support, roadmap etc) “Most folk work a 2-3 day week” - while this maybe true, don’t let it discount a bonafide 4 day work week. On the extra day off I’m presumed uncontactable and not at my desk. There’s a big difference between that and being at work but not really working.
  • doix 4y ago
    > Ignoring any formality, I think most folk work a 2-3 week if they were honest about it. The real difference maker is if you need to show up to the office or be reachable. I am sure there were weeks where I did 16 hours of work(i.e 2 days) at BigCo but I still showed up to the office 5 days as week. It didn't really matter to me if I was working at the office or just goofing off in the coffee room, I still couldn't go surfing or do something I enjoy. > if you're working 4 day weeks and you're feeling behind, you may well end up working that 5th day without anyone asking. If you're behind on a 5 day work week, do you work the weekend? I don't see how this is any different.
• gaadd33 4y ago
  Does anyone do this in a management role? Team lead or better, department head?
  • maveonair 4y ago
    Yes, and I am still doing it as department head.
• yodsanklai 4y ago
  It's something relatively common in some European countries. I did it at the very beginning of my career. I just asked, and most companies were fine with it. I understand the appeal (particularly for people with kids) but nowadays I'm pretty anxious about the future and I'm not sure I'll be able to earn the same salary in 2 years, let alone 10 years when ageism will hit. I'd rather save when I can.
• k__ 4y ago
  None of my friends works fulltime anymore. In Germany, you're allowed to reduce your time as you like.
• mrmincent 4y ago
  I dropped down to a 4 day week so that I could look after my son one day a week. The negotiations were pretty simple, I just told my boss that due to our circumstances I needed to drop down to 4 days, and his reaction was basically I’d rather have you working for 4 days than to see you have to quit ( I never even mentioned quitting, but I guess I put it in a way that my circumstances didn’t give me much wriggle room). And honestly it’s the best thing ever. I get a whole day each week where my son and I get to explore and play and have fun together. He’s 15 months old and he’s never going to be this young again. I’m super grateful to my work giving me the flexibility, and I enjoy work more than ever before because I get to have a better life balance.
  • uranium 4y ago
    That's how and why I got down to 3 days a week. I went to 4 to get my next job, then down to 2 at my current job. If you can afford it and arrange it, it's fantastic.
    • soupfordummies 4y ago
      Isn’t that just a (very) part time job at that point? Sounds like pseudo-retirement really, so I would assume you had quite a bit of savings by the time you went to 2-day-job.
      • EddySchauHai 4y ago
        Depends on the company/salary - I'm on 10x my initial salary when I started in tech 8 years ago so if I went down to a two day work week I'd be on 4x my initial salary still. I couldn't afford this nowadays because of lifestyle creep, but it's fun to think about. If you were in Europe and found a 2 day remote role for a US based startup you could probably find a comparable salary!
  • yellow_lead 4y ago
    Did your boss or company drop your salary?
• hackernewds 4y ago
  Yes. working at Bolt
• sqwrell 4y ago
  A couple friends work 4 - 10 hours days (medical) Another works 24 hours on and 72 hours off. (fire)
• cebert 4y ago
  I don’t currently work 4 day work weeks. However, when I worked at Lockheed Martin, they had flexible work schedules. You could work the standard 40 hour work week, 9-80’s (work 9 hours with every other Friday off), or 4-10’s. Friday was a day you knew not to schedule meetings because there was a good likelihood people would be out of the office. I miss having this flexible working benefit. To me it costs employers almost nothing to support, but can make a huge impact to their employees.
• gaws 4y ago
  > Anyone working 4 day week here, as an employee? Yes, making the same salary as someone in the same position working 40 hours. > Where/How did you find your job? Knowing the right people who value my skills to trust me and understand that work isn't my life. > If you started at 40 hours per week, how did you negotiate it to 32? I used to work 40 hours but, since the pandemic started, realized I could do the same job with the same efficiency at 32. Best decision of my life.
• creakingstairs 4y ago
  I worked 4d weekday in my last job, taking every Wednesday off. I lost 20% of my salary but I loved it, the break into middle meant that Mondays were no longer dreaded things and I could do all the chores during Wednesday, freeing up my weekend to do whatever I wanted. (Also Fridays had free drinks , pre-covid) I think the company got a good deal out of it too, as they paid 20% less for almost no productivity loss at all.
• hahamrfunnyguy 4y ago
  I worked 24 hours a week for a few years for an IT service company. Before I switched to the 24 hour weeks, I was managing the software division and was getting burned out. I told my boss I would be putting in my resignation. He asked if there was anything he could to do keep me on. I asked to move back to a development role with 24 hour weeks of three contiguous days. My boss agreed. The schedule was great, but I eventually quit because I started a new business and wanted to focus all my time on that.
• phendrenad2 4y ago
  More like 1. But seriously: Most tech companies only care if you're doing a fair amount of work for what they're paying you. If you have the skills to do more work than others on the team in 4 hours per day instead of 8 hours a day, no healthy company is going to complain.
• sossles 4y ago
  I'm a long term employee of a large software company. When I had kids I asked to go down to 4 days so they wouldn't be in childcare for the whole week. Now the kids are all in school but I've kept the 4 day week as I'm much happier this way. A few years ago a colleague asked to go to 4 days (with no kids) and was rejected, so I doubt I'll ever give it up, otherwise I'll never get it back, and I don't know how I'd ever find another job that would support this style of work, so I guess it has worked in my employer's favour.
• notjulianjaynes 4y ago
  I'm a reporter with a Thursday weekly deadline. Hourly, no overtime so can't exceed 40hrs. My week usually looks like: M: 8hr T: 6hr W: 12hr Th: 12hr F: 2hr
• mrlucax 4y ago
  I'm working for a company that was originally a 40h workplace, but since last month and until the end of January will test a 32h week, with preferably the Fridays off (preferably because there are some departments that must have at least one person every day). After this test period the management will evaluate the productivity, basically some OKRs set before the change and if objectives were met we will keep this benefit. Important to mention that no other benefit was removed or any salary reduced.
  • kvirani 4y ago
    Nice! How big in size of FTEs is this company and what industry is it in?
    • mrlucax 4y ago
      I'm sorry, I don't know what FTE is, but the company has abou 300 employees about half of it in engineering. The industry is financial services.
• irrational 4y ago
  So… do you mean I work 4 days a week and my work is aware of it (and, presumably, approves of it), or I work 4 days a week and my work has no clue because we don’t do meetings on Fridays?
• plondon514 4y ago
  I was working 4 days a week. I started out at 5. Left the company and stayed in touch with the CEO. The CEO asked me if I was interested in returning and I agreed with the stipulation I could work 4 days a week, so I could work 1 day a week on my side project.
• deleted 4y ago
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• pm90 4y ago
  I did not negotiate this but we get some Fridays off and I use unlimited PTO for the others to make it a 4 day workweek (except when oncall). When there’s a deadline or shits broken Ill put in the effort but for the most part its a 4 day workweek and its great.
• sjs382 4y ago
  I eork a "9/80" schedule, which ammounts to working 9 hours M-Th and alternating between an 8 hour day on Friday and having a Friday off. So I have a 3 day weekend every other weekend. In my company, it's something that every "creative" employee has the option to do. It's based on the idea that we're billed out to clients hourly and all of our work should be scheduled a bit in advance. Fridays are staggered though, so there should always be some availability.
• ClimaxGravely 4y ago
  My company switched to 4x8 and it's been great. I personally feel like I'm getting more work done. I believe one of the reasons they did this was to prevent people from leaving the company and it's certainly worked for me. I don't see myself wanting to change companies as long as I stay in my current country (Canada). Even for double my salary I think I wouldn't move.
• imjared 4y ago
  My gig has been doing 4-day x 8hour work weeks since long before I started. We have Wednesdays off which is a bit unusual but means I never work more than two days in a row (unless I want to swap a Wednesday for a Friday). It's pretty great.
• the__alchemist 4y ago
  US Military. I have a pile of leave that accumulates at a reasonable rate. When I'm not deployed or TDY (Where leave continues to accumulate), I take almost every Friday or Monday off. When you mix in the federal holidays, it's sustainable.
• scarecrowbob 4y ago
  I work 6h x 5d. 7 person company doing CMS customization and operations for large gov, edu, and ngo clients. I started as a contractor at that schedule, and when my boss wanted to "put a ring on it" they didn't want to up my pay by 30%. If you account for that time, I am in the top 10% of earners for my stack according to stack overflow. That process took a long time and a willingness to work for "less", as well as a lot of uncertainty and a willingness to do a lot of shit work that should be "not my problem". Also, after having worked with the same business for the last 7 years, there are some things that I feel I could improve: - I'm the old guy who is supposed to know fix the hard issues and if I can't figure it out then it probably isn't getting fixed - I haven't gotten reasonable raises but I don't want to start my own business or take a full-time position (though I have gotten some okay bonuses) - I'm working mostly with WordPress, which has a number of infuriating flaws and while I've gotten better at identifying, preventing, and remediating them it's still a crappy stack - I've had to learn a lot of infrastructure stuff I don't particularly care about But I do have health insurance, and have been working a relaxed schedule remotely the entire time. I've spent a lot of time practicing various musical instruments while ruminating on my work. And we're usually pretty easy-going about moving hours around if (for instance) the snow is really good and I want to get out and ski. Also, I get the idea that everyone in my business has gone through some serious depressive or other personal issues (based on their periodic lack of availability) over the time we've been working together... I know that when my second marriage was breaking up there were multi-day periods where I was literally phoning it in for several months. I consider the fact that we're all still working and getting a lot of useful, remunerative things done to be one fact that keeps me working this business instead of, like, taking up electrical contracting (that is, finding another trade) where I think I could have more control over my working conditions. I also have enough extra time that I can work side gigs, mostly involved with performing music in a variety of capacities. I happily engineered a concert last night and played a trio gig at a beautiful winery today. I feel incredibly fortunate, even though I could probably triple my annual income if I were motivated.
• deleted 4y ago
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• in_cahoots 4y ago
  I’m curious, do any managers do this?
• xelxebar 4y ago
  My company basically affords us the freedom to choose how much or how little we work. The ideal target we discuss is 3-day work weeks. Surprisingly, this still affords each of us around 70th percentile salary. Grated, we're not a "product company" and instead work essentially as hired IT mercenaries, i.e. contract work, but it's a pretty sweet gig. The job kind of found me. I posted my CV to some online forums (include here) and mailing lists, and a few random small companies contacted me over the course of about a year. We actually keep our ears to the ground for interesting individuals, so if you're interested, feel free to shoot me an email: local-part: wilson, domain: rainlab.co.jp. We're fully remote, so timezone concerns aside, physical location is mostly irrelevant.
• ehnto 4y ago
  Yep, best decision I have made. I am focussed at work in a way I have never been before, because I don't feel as though the treadmill of life is getting away from me. I solve bigger more complex problems faster because I feel comfortable comitting my full focus, as I know I will get time to myself to catch up with the rest of life. I work 4 x 7.5 hour days, I just took a paycut in theory. So I negotiated a full time wage and then calculated what I get paid at 4/5ths of that number. I was freelancing for about 4 years prior, and I am currently preferring this arrangement as I truly get to focus and commit both to work and hobbies rather than splitting focus. I am getting more fulfillment by performing highly at work now too, which was an unexpected benefit. I also enjoy the camaraderie I get from work over freelancing, which can be a very lonely affair. Of all the arrangements I have had, including a "sabatical" of 6 months, I prefer this. Retirement I hope to work 0 days of course, buy while earning, 4 days has proven a good balance.
• soueuls 4y ago
  I tried but then I switched to doing the opposite. I am now working 7 days a week (freelancing), but then I try to stick to roughly 4 hours a day. Except for when I want to take vacation with friends or family, I realized that I did not really need 2-3 days off every week. Waking up around 8am and working until 1pm gives me a lot more joy.
• ronyfadel 4y ago
  I’m a contractor working 4 days per week for a well known YC startup. I indie hack on Fridays and weekends. I found the job on Twitter, almost by mistake. The 4-day workweek was a non-negotiable for me because the indie hacking part is so much fun, and it’s making me around $60-70k/year, and I’d very much like to keep on developing the business.
  • nazavo 4y ago
    Dream life! How did you go about negotiating 4-day week at a startup? From experience sturtups have been a "6 days in a 5-day week grind". Seeing a 4-day week is refreshing!
    • ronyfadel 4y ago
      I just made it clear from the beginning that that was what I was looking for. They had no issue with it. It does feel like 5 days in a 4-day grind sometimes, but at least I get the time to indie hack.
• quickthrower2 4y ago
  I am working 19 hours at the moment due to sickness. However, some people have negotiated 32 without being sick, both before joining and during employment. This is outside the US. Think carefully about WHO you ask. Some people just like to say no. You might want to think about whether it is HR, your immediate boss or another boss to ask first. I have worked at places where the "NO" person can be bypassed and might give you the wrong impression that something is impossible. As kids know "NO" can often be a short-circuit response to avoid a commitment, and avoid time thinking about the thing.
• physicles 4y ago
  Yes, went from 40 to 32 about a year ago. One of the best decisions I've ever made. I'm about 15 years into my career, with about 5 years as senior tech guy at my current company. I have a great relationship with leadership. Another tech guy was already working 4 days (I think it was part of his initial negotiation), so I asked if I could too. I got the OK and took the pay cut. At 5 days a week, I felt close to burnout for years (the work is interesting and challenging, and therefore tiring). Now work feels sustainable, life is so much better, and I have energy for personal projects. It also helps that the company is already fully remote so I can work from anywhere. I wouldn't want to do 3 days a week -- projects would drag on 30% longer and I think I'd really feel that hit to my velocity. 4 is the sweet spot for me.
• resonanormal 4y ago
  I work 4 days a week. 8hrs a day in Zurich. It's generally accepted at companies if you have a child. I have previously worked 3 days a week in Berlin as it's the law to allow you to do so for 3 years after your child is born. I think 3 days a week is definitely the most optimal as it's 4 days off 3 days on per week. Meaning the balance is in favour for your personal time.
• lutorm 4y ago
  I've worked 20h weeks for the past 18 months. It's been great. I actually wanted to do 24h but they said they only allowed 75% and 50% part time. I was wondering how it would work to do a 4h day but it's actually a nice way to soft-start the "weekend". As for how I negotiated it, I just told my manager I wanted to do it. He was like "well, if it's that or lose you, sure." Part time is not very common where I work, so approval had to go up to VP level but was not a problem. I'm paid 50% of what I was paid before, I didn't feel the need to negotiate this. Full benefits. My nominal work week is 8h+8h+4h, but when we've had deadlines I've also done 4 full weeks and them 4 weeks off. Both have their advantages and disadvantages.
• Curzel 4y ago
  My former employer mandated that everyone took days off every Friday of July. I happen to live ~2 hours away from the see and 10 minutes away from the lake and in a area with a lot of hiking to do, so that was cool. Still, I can’t picture myself doing it all year around… maybe because I don’t have kids… I would prefer a shorter workday Also, Friday off, but that it taken out of your own paid leave days!! I guess this was a big deal 30-40-50 years ago when it was setup, especially for factory workers, but it’s 2022, come on!
  • te_chris 4y ago
    Yeah that’s really not the vibe! That’s just stingy by your old boss. In NZ, loads of professional firms shut down over Xmas as it’s summer. They basically make their staff take at least two weeks leave over this time because there’s no provision in employment law to force them to find work for people who don’t want to holiday then. My wife was a lawyer so she got caught up in this, used to annoy the shit out of me being forced to use so much leave at a time we did’t want to.
    • Curzel 4y ago
      Most Italian companies do this for Christmas/new years eve, but also for “Ferragosto” 15th of august, some mandating even 2 weeks off!! Italy, as a whole is basically completely shut off during the central weeks in august, with hotel prices easily doubling July prices… go figure out why hahaah By law, there’s generally 4 weeks go paid leave, and the unwritten agreement is that the employer peeks 2 of them for you… Tech companies generally dont do this, maybe to feel more international and modern
• foobarbecue 4y ago
  Everybody is talking about living at the beach in this thread and nobody's talking about surfing! That's the whole point of the beach for me... I moved to the beach and got a telework agreement so I can surf any day I want to. It's amazing.
• fergie 4y ago
  A few years ago I got a "pro rata" pay rise which meant working 4 days for the same pay as 5. I really loved the feeling of a 3 day weekend every week- it felt as if you were off work half of the time. Eventually, somebody in the organisation decided that everbody had to work 100%, so I was given a 25% pay rise and told to turn up on Fridays. In terms of work capacity, I feel like I delivered pretty much the same to the organisation at 80% as I did at 100%
• blablabla123 4y ago
  I used to, an internal recruiter contacted me on LinkedIn. Actually I answered quickly because the job was really interesting and the interview was the other day I think. The overall processes went over a few weeks though but eventually I asked if it's okay with the contract that I still have a freelance job on the side. HR said I could be working part-time until I'm done (or the whole time) They asked what I'll be doing the whole time and I said just going for hobby projects
• BjornW 4y ago
  In the Netherlands (Europe), where I reside there are plenty of jobs offering 36 or 32 hours. I think most employers are ok with it since they often also work 36 or 32 hrs. Quite a lot of people share the 'load' of bringing up a family, taking care of parents or sick family members & basic house chores & therefor will (have to) work a bit less than 40hrs.
• midasz 4y ago
  When my kid was born I wanted to have a day off with her every week, so I just asked for 36 hours so I could work 4x9. I was so used to working 40 hours I thought the jump to 32 would be too much. How wrong I was haha.. 4x9 with a kid is not doable unless your partner can also be flexible. Asked to go down to 32 hours, was asked if I could hold on for a month since a new engineer was joining and said OK. The cut in salary is 100% worth it to spend a day with my daughter. I feel happier.
• yc-kraln 4y ago
  I started at 24 hours a week and they negotiated me up to 32. :)
• nazavo 4y ago
  I did a 4 day week experiment couple years back. I used the leave time to book every Friday through upcoming four months. I loved the experiment a lot. It's not only an extra day you get (50% increase in free time) but also an extra night (100% increase!). Saturdays sometimes felt like "Sundays" and it was good to remind myself there's a whole extra day to live life. When I asked to make 4-day week a thing, at least for me, the request was rejected. The reasoning had to do with "synergy" in a team and lack of much overlap in a remote team. Example I was given: if everyone started taking 4-day weeks it might be that Bob has Mondays off, Kate is off on Wednesday, and I would be out on Friday. Fair enough. We are trialing a longer (2-3 moths at a time)time offs. Hopefully the experiment sticks. Having loads of free time is the best!
  • OJFord 4y ago
    > When I asked to make 4-day week a thing, at least for me, the request was rejected. The reasoning had to do with "synergy" in a team and lack of much overlap in a remote team. Example I was given: if everyone started taking 4-day weeks it might be that Bob has Mondays off, Kate is off on Wednesday, and I would be out on Friday. Fair enough. Alternative framing: encourages good communication and high bus factor.
• m_eiman 4y ago
  In Sweden we're allowed by law to work 75% while we have kids under 8. I started doing that when the kids were small, and continued even though my youngest is now 9. I work 7 hours per day Monday to Thursday, and Fridays I alternate between 8 hours and having the day off. Over two weeks, this equals 80%. If needed I do some work on my "free" Fridays as well, but it's usually not needed. If you ask me, I'd say I'm as productive on this schedule as I would have been on 8 hours per day - if not more. So it's win-win: my employer gets the output of 100% but only pays 80%, and I get time off to do other things.
• Lutger 4y ago
  Dutch here. Haven't worked more than 32 hours a week in 20 years. I did downgrade to 24 a week for a while, convinced my boss I wanted to do a masters and he let me. Salary was just enough to pay for everything. Its mostly normal to work 32 hours in my country. I feel 32 should be the norm actually. In my line of work - software development, 32, 36 and 40 hours are all very common. Less than 32 is really uncommon though, as a salaried employee. I consider 32 hours to be a full-time job these days and noticed a lot of people around me are starting to do the same.
  • krageon 4y ago
    > Dutch > mostly normal to work 32 hour It is absolutely not if you work in the tech sector. The expectation is full-time and this is 40 hours at most companies.
    • tmnvdb 4y ago
      When I working in NL (small embedded tech company) all my colleagues were doing 32 hrs. My friend in different company did the same. Some companies do have a 40 hr culture, but it's quite normal to do 32 hrs in my experience. I Live in Vienna now, most of my colleagues do 32 hrs. Boss doesn't love it, but it's better than losing people.
    • cr1895 4y ago
      I’d interpret their comment as 32 hour weeks being normal and acceptable, whether or not it is most common.
    • fakelvis 4y ago
      Agree on this, and not just in tech. I work for a large financial co in NL (~50k employees) and 36-hour contracts are the standard for all full-time employees. 32 is considered part-time for us. Regardless, most people certainly work 4 days a week here. Of all my friends and contacts, I think I know of only a handful working 5 days a week.
    • Lutger 4y ago
      That is strange. I am working in the tech sector and it is normal and accepted everywhere I work. Maybe not the norm, at some companies most people work 40 hours - but its not like 32 is unacceptable. Maybe its different for people in leadership positions, or embedded development or some other domain I am not so familiar with?
• hum3hum3 4y ago
  >Anyone working 4 day week here, as an employee? I do, working at Atom bank in the UK. We switched to a a 4 day week 4 8.5 hours at the end of Covid. It works great - I am also working from home. It is noticiably more focused during the 4 days. Eg not doing meetings unless you need to. I was lucky and I started on a 37.5 5 7.5 hours a day in the office.
• ABoredBirb 4y ago
  4 days/32hrs, working at current job for over 2 years now. It's not a common arrangement over here, sadly. I just decided that that is how i want to do things and simply asked for it, when looking for jobs, until i got a good offer that accepted this. I did take 20% off from my salary, were i working 40hrs, but still ended up with more than i was making at my previous job. I like it, the weekday/weekend balance seems just right.
• dzogchen 4y ago
  Yes I recently changed to a 4 day job with higher pay. Right now I have a week off while taking up only two vacation days, because I worked the last two Fridays. Pretty neat. It's pretty common in Europe I would say. In Germany you even have a right to reduce your hours after half a year of working somewhere, and your employee has to accept it unless they have a very good reason to reject it (e.g. it would be devastating for the company). Good software developers are still scarse and lots of companies are competing for them, so generally companies are very accomodating for these wishes. I said working 4 days does not necessarily make me less productive. And on top I use the extra time I have to become better at my work and contribute to open source (which is true).
• mcv 4y ago
  I've always worked 32 hours. When I got my first job in 2001, I told them I wanted to work 4 days, taking Wednesday off (giving me two two-day work weeks with a mini-weekend in between). All my later jobs were also 4 days. This was never a problem. I once spoke to a prospective employer for a really interesting sounding job that really didn't want people working 4 days per week, and couldn't be budged no matter what arguments I used (they understood, and agreed, but still wouldn't move), so I had to let them go. Never regretted it. For the past 10 years I've been freelancing, and still 4 days a week. It's a good standard, and it has never been a problem for any client. It probably helps that I live in Netherland, though. Part-time work is completely accepted here. Lots of parents work 3 or 4 days to have more time with their children. Before Covid, lots of people had one WFH day. Nowadays, many teams have one office day. Work-life balance is important. Don't sacrifice it.
• dvfjsdhgfv 4y ago
  I have - in my country as a parent of a child up to 4 years old you can demand part time work and your employer can't refuse it. I chose Wendesday, and it was wonderful. Monday and Tuesday were wonderful and efficient, there was no Monday blues or anything like that. Thursday and Friday were even better. I felt like I was living, and my work is and interesting addition to my life, not the other way round. An extremely positive experience. And nobody complained - I got excellent yearly reviews as well.
• boffinAudio 4y ago
  By 'here' do you mean in the USA? Here in Europe (Austria) - it is very common to simply state during employment interviews that you wish to work 30-hour weeks. Its just a part of the negotiation stage and the company can take it or leave it - no questions asked. If you're already signed up for a 40-hour week, well then this is a renegotiation - and you also have to be prepared to take it, or leave it.
• tytho 4y ago
  My input probably isn’t as valuable except as a data point, but the company I work for (around 100 employees) moved all employees over to a 32 hour/4 day work week without a change in salary. No negotiation involved technically, though there were a few employees who have been talking about 4-day work weeks for a long time. They made this change with a 6-month trial period where we would determine if we would keep it at a later time based on some sort of productivity measurements. Everyone, including the CEO, seemed to agree that trying to measure productivity would yield few meaningful metrics. The consensus at the end was that productivity was either the same or a little less, but we ended up keeping it anyway.
  • vancouverwill 4y ago
    which company is that?
• nconrad 4y ago
  I work for a small fulfillment business. When I found out I was pregnant with my second baby I told them I was either giving 8 months notice or I could work remote 4 days a week. After they hired someone to cover my maternity leave, they offered me full salary to stay on because I was that valuable to them. Even after training someone else for 6 months, she still couldn't keep up with the work I was pushing out.
• throwawayben 4y ago
  I asked, they agreed. I'm paid 4/5ths of a slightly below market rate salary, but I'm happy.
• sriram_malhar 4y ago
  I worked a 4-day week for years, but that only means you get the same shit done in 4 days, not 7. I was due to get a promotion as an engineering manager, but I refused the promotion and the increased salary in lieu of fewer days at work. Over time, lesser quantum of work gets thrown your way because you are away from people's faces for a larger fraction of the time. That particular equation has changed because of WFH. It was fantastic to have a long weekend every week. I also miraculously became more disciplined, because I promised and delivered by Thu evening. For some reason Friday evening used to always spill into Saturday, then Sunday, into the interstitial spaces between home and social life. The downside was that people would more often than not hold meetings without me, and get to work on more juicy projects, and I would feel hurt at the beginning. I had to continually remind myself of the increased free time. At the peak frenetic pace of the early 2000's and the dot com boom, this was seen as career suicide. I knew that it wasn't any such thing, that you can always get work when you show quality, but the social pressure still made me doubt myself sometimes. As edith piaf sang, je ne regrette rien. I regret nothing.
• T3RMINATED 4y ago
• xtiansimon 4y ago
  Not 32 hours specifically. Mine started with a volunteer commitment when I started a new job. That was fine, because I was starting and they wanted trial period, and part-time was ok. Also, the best commute time (pre-Rona) put me in my seat 0700-0800. And the best return train had me leave at 1750. This basically gave me four tens. And pre-Rona my firm had a culture of work from home when you need to, wish, catch up. Put all this together and people accepted my four day schedule, and work got done. Plus, we’re a small company with a working owner. There is no BS attendance requirement—just productivity.
• deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
• InternalAwards 4y ago
  I'm currently working a 3 day week (24 hours - mon, tue, wed) as a software developer. At first I went down to 32 hours at my old job, but then got an oppurtunity at another company and this was my demand. Sure, I make less money but I definitely got enough to get by and then some. It fits well with my current project since we have a few other people working as consultants for a few days each week (They have other projects as well).
• Ecio78 4y ago
  I was working classic full time 40h/week, then took a parental leave for my first newborn that allowed to work 80% (so 32h/week). Based on the law here, the employer could have denied the 80% but I could have asked 6m totally off and they couldn't have said no. Anyway, they accepted the 80%. This lasted for 20months. I then asked to have another one for my second kid, as no issue arose during the first one and I was productive, it was granted. Finally, I negotiated to remain at 80% permanently.
• mattdanger 4y ago
  Yes, sort of. My company, a web agency with offices in DC and Seattle, does a 9:80. a 9hr days M-Th and then get every other Fri off. It's optional because not everyone wants to work longer days. We first started a few years ago with a "no meetings" friday rule, which was very successful. We expanded to the 9:80 program two years ago and it has also been successful.
• gorgabal 4y ago
  Yes, I always let it be known early in the interview process. Sometimes I get rejected. I have medical reasons. I have autism, and experience has taught me that working 40 hours simply burns me out within 3 months. I usually ask for the 4-days without mentioning the autism. But if they ask why, I won't hide it either.