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After 50 years, Michael Heizer is finally ready to unveil City, his life's work
- bergenty 4y agoI think it’s pretty stunning tbh
- padolsey 4y agoI think it's unbelievably ugly and pointless tbh
- dmix 4y agoNYTimes has a nice graphical piece about it: https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2022/08/19/arts/design/michael-heizer-city.html https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2022/08/19/arts/design/m...
- bondarchuk 4y agoI could only see the video header, but the shot with a guy walking through it gives a great impression compared to the humanless pics.
- dmix 4y agoThe original article really fails to communicate the scale which is a big part of this project.
- acomjean 4y agoThanks. Great photos and good background info too. This has been worked on for decades.. They made the valley it’s in a national monument to prevent the yuca mountain nuclear storage from being readable: So:’ “City,” because it was now part of the national monument, would have to admit public visitors.’ Here is a “gifted article” link for those without a subscription: https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2022/08/19/arts/design/michael-heizer-city.html?unlocked_article_code=AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAACEIPuomT1JKd6J17Vw1cRCfTTMQmqxCdw_PIxfs9gGPzNiGeVTdcwqNPW9LavB-dIvMyINIpwy_cSNJaMbApA_lzxe9WMkgoSwSpsJae3Z8EPzRzqZ62Wil--aPxao0C0G2gaHileqA4xbujsgiPOySxH_DCgSV3cV5j8pZ6dA2o0GgPlf3BDu90jdBhivckBc0tQmtXNymMrOCoX0slQKiOaBDW7gIyXOBLC3qEzZPHteV2IEgFAknGTXh__W829NheXdsXN675JBQlE9Hs1fRTUic7adf0WOBiAtTchL5osrXSqByTyMrQx_4-FKhcvr2soX9_Ot5P-B_AjmbdVQKSQEKU&smid=url-share https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2022/08/19/arts/design/m...
- hedora 4y agoI was pretty excited to go, then saw this at the end of the article: > Visitors will also need to get themselves to Alamo, Nev., a nearish town. They’ll then be picked up, allowed to roam “City” for a few hours and, because there are no lights on the road and no cellphone service, they will be driven back before dark, meaning they won’t get to see the sun rise and set, prime hours. The "no lights" thing is a pretty lame excuse. It sounds like an exercise in minimum compliance with the order to open it to the public.
- jonah-archive 4y agoFor the curious, here's the satellite view: https://www.google.com/maps/@38.0334984,-115.4461277,1423m/data=!3m1!1e3 https://www.google.com/maps/@38.0334984,-115.4461277,1423m/d...
- quickthrower2 4y agoGrass is very green next door
- onion2k 4y agoJust like most cities.
- LandStander 4y agoIsn't it always
- acomjean 4y agoThose isolated green squares when you zoom out. Looks like a ranch. Those cattle are probably going to explore the site at night when they get bored.
- Barrin92 4y agothe shapes from above almost make it look like those ancient desert sites in Peru
- pram 4y agoIt frankly just looks like a derelict Air Force base. Even has the munitions bunkers.
- zdkl 4y agoIt reminds of a (somewhat recent) article and discussion here on the design parameters for long-term nuclear waste storage facilities. One of the points was that to deter interference from pesky curious humans across the time scales considered, pictographic or lexical warnings may get degraded or lose meaning: the structure and area itself must convey a message of menace, drabness or inhospitability. I'd have bet this was a test site for such a project. Which given the name of the installation might be the goal. If anyone remembers the paper in question, my algolia-fu is failing me.
- 4dregress 4y agoGreat for Skateboarding!
- nitwit005 4y agoI assume there are now a half dozen people working in the desert every day to maintain this thing, given that a lot of it seems to be loose material?
- Kaibeezy 4y agoSo dull and dusty. When entropy wins, where will they put the food trucks and porta potties? New spot for Burning Man?
- everybodyknows 4y agoWondering how it handles monsoonal flash-flooding ...
- bigDinosaur 4y agoFinally, I was thinking just how much I would like something IRL that reminded me of The Witness.
- deleted 4y ago[deleted]
- dirtyid 4y agoHope someone spends an afternoon to building this in Unreal Engine. I know art world gets indulgent, but this project always seemed very extra. Looks like fun counterstrike map though.
- bushbaba 4y agoAnd he’s got a 30M endowment to maintain the thing. Smh
- white_dragon88 4y ago30M? I love art as much as the next guy but that is just a straight up waste of money.
- spaceman_2020 4y agoWould it be better spent paying Stanford grads to make an app that can get you food in 25 minutes instead of 30?
- barry-cotter 4y agoYes. By any moral framework.
- spaceman_2020 4y agoWhat moral framework prioritizes loss making food delivery apps over art?
- fipar 4y agoWhat if in order to get city dwellers (who were already able to get food, albeit having to wait 5 more minutes for it) food the app makes unreasonable demands on delivery workers (who probably won’t be employees but “associates” instead) to the point that it becomes a high-risk job, except it’s not a job so they’re on their own when they have an accident, and if they don’t, they barely make ends meet anyway? Honestly, my moral framework prefers the art.
- TaylorAlexander 4y agoAh finally someone has made a real life version of Gridmap from BeamNG: https://documentation.beamng.com/official_content/levels/gridmap_1.jpg https://documentation.beamng.com/official_content/levels/gri...
- mwidell 4y agoI have to say, it looks pretty boring and underwhelming to me.
- notimetorelax 4y agoPictures probably don’t do it justice. Things like that may need to be experienced live.
- ekianjo 4y agoYou mean experience boredom in real life? There is absolutely nothing to see there.
- ggm 4y agoI think you mean "I don't like this art"
- robertlagrant 4y agoIf you intend on commenting to replace any positive critique with "I like this art" as well then carry on.
- ggm 4y agoI'm genuinely unsure. The photos are alienating. Usually, I don't like that kind of art, but sometimes its interesting and being in something massive, created, somebody else's vision, is occasionally great. Nazca. Different. I saw Richard Serrra's work in Bilbao, it was amazing. Andy Goldsworthy did giant pieces in the forests of the UK and also tiny ones. Art in nature can be fantastic, there are metal figures set into the Nullarbor plain thousands of kilometres from anyone by Anthony Gormley I'd love to see. Frank Lloyd wrights place in Phoenix AZ would have been monumental if he could have afforded it. Arcosanti? Christo and the curtain across the valley? What's not to love? What does it mean? I have no idea.
- TaylorAlexander 4y ago
- avodonosov 4y agoTrolling future archeologists?
- quickthrower2 4y agoQuick everyone, get rid of all the cranes and cement mixers! That'll have them scratching their heads.
- alganet 4y agoThey'll be fine. Evidence will point out that people traveled long distances to be there, supposedly to participate in some kind of ritual. Which is all true.
- Ambolia 4y agoI tried to visit the website on mobile, but the content disappears as soon as I scroll, and only the header and footer remain
- prawn 4y agoIf you like large format art, Storm King in New York state has some great stuff including Storm King Wall and Storm King Wavefield. https://collections.stormking.org/Browse/objects https://collections.stormking.org/Browse/objects Separately, Salvation Mountain in California is worth a look too. I've always wanted to see people do something similar to Wavefield in a desertscape. I'm travelling from the other side of the planet to be reasonably close to City in a month or so, and even "reasonably close" makes it a 4-5+ hour detour. :(
- Kaibeezy 4y agoI liked the Crawick Multiverse by Charles Jencks, located south of Glasgow. Sort of like this City thing, but smaller, more varied, much more accessible, and most importantly, cool, green and inviting. It’s like he designed it for humans, not despite them. https://www.crawickmultiverse.co.uk/ https://www.crawickmultiverse.co.uk/
- acomjean 4y agoStorm king is great fun. The one Near me when I lived in white plains NY was the PepsiCo headquarters sculpture gardens. Smaller and the hours are limited to weekends and you can’t go inside the offices, but free! https://www.pepsico.com/sculpture-gardens https://www.pepsico.com/sculpture-gardens. Dia Beacon is modern art in a old cracker factory that is huge and fun to explore. I have a love/hate relationship with modern art, but in the context of this giant building it was fun. https://www.diaart.org/visit/visit-our-locations-sites/dia-beacon-beacon-united-states https://www.diaart.org/visit/visit-our-locations-sites/dia-b...
- sickcodebruh 4y agoI love Storm King! If you do during the week, you might be one of the only people there. It feels like you’re exploring a desolate alien planet.
- anovikov 4y agoReminds me of the Multiple Protective Shelter site, in real life.
- unsupp0rted 4y agoWhat a waste. He could have made it livable and relatively self-sustaining. Instead of "hey look at this" it could have been "hey look at this and real people live here and maintain it". > The foundation has built a $30 million endowment to care for City. Moving forward, it will be under the custodianship of a coalition of major U.S. institutions: Crystal Bridges Museum of American Art (Bentonville, Arkansas), Glenstone Museum (Potomac, Maryland), the Los Angeles County Museum of Art (Los Angeles, California), and the Museum of Modern Art (New York).
- sgtnoodle 4y agoThat's one of the best maps in beamng.drive
- spaceman_2020 4y agoThis image does a better job of representing the scale: https://preview.redd.it/3bnqb0cali771.jpg?width=640&crop=smart&auto=webp&s=8a2762bef35e7fd7767dda3d7764a4904c844d21 https://preview.redd.it/3bnqb0cali771.jpg?width=640&crop=sma...
- dathos 4y agoLooks more like a skatepark to me
- teekert 4y agoI was gonna say indeed Id like to bring my rollerblades (yeah Im old).
- enneff 4y agoIt’s all gravel, not paved smooth, so maybe a dirt bike would be more appropriate.
- fuzzfactor 4y agoThat one "little" paved section looks like it could be creatively used as an outdoor court for some type of team racquetball.
- ben_w 4y agoI thought the same for about a second, then I realised the small dots surrounding it are trees. Well, small trees and large bushes, but still.
- samatman 4y agoThat particular sort of ground cover has a name: high chaparral. It's about waist high, and smells wonderful, being dominated by mesquite and sage.
- maciekpaprocki 4y agoOk. I would kind of like it, but environmental impact of that needs to be insane. I guess 50 years ago people were not that concerned about it. And then how much energy they will have to spend just removing sand. Seems like a pretty pointless job for someone.
- morelisp 4y agoI'd guess this is one of the least environmentally disruptive constructions in the Nevada desert. The green fields across the street look infinitely worse.
- EugeneOZ 4y agoWell, it looks like an art object, definitely - idea, style, composition. But it will only look good in a desert. Real cities should be green. In Barcelona, we have a place called “Parc del Fòrum” - a huge area covered by asphalt (14 acres, 5.7 ha), with just a few buildings. Looks great, for sure (you can ride a bike/scooter here with a wind). Mostly being used for music festivals. But before every festival, organizers put artificial grass to create the areas in front of the stages. And the rest of the time you can find just a few young souls riding here (2-5 persons). There is only one place in Forum Park where you can always find a lot of people - the children's playground. Because it has trees, grass, and shadow. What might look great and stylish isn’t always comfortable. I love Parc del Forum because I like to ride and it has spectacular sea views, but I think it was a great experiment to highlight the importance of trees in a city design. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parc_del_Fòrum https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parc_del_Fòrum
- lastdong 4y agoCan we have a VR version pls
- braingenious 4y agoThat’s a lot of divots and some shapes in the desert! I am not familiar with this artist or what this is intended to evoke, but I don’t think I’m the intended… audience?
- tastemykungfu 4y agoHe spent his life (50 years) making this.. I think the audience are those are willing to pay ridiculous prices for "high contemporary art". If you don't regularly buy paintings for 100k+, I don't think this is for us :)
- bradwood 4y agoYeah, some guy jacking off in the desert for 50 years. Good luck with that mate. Not really my cup of tea, and frankly a bit of a shame you couldn't have done something a little more productive with your 50 years, than move a bit of sand around...
- Gene_Parmesan 4y agoThis obsession on here with 'productivity' is depressing. I thought the HN crowd was beyond all that. Frankly, to suggest that this man should have given up on his dream so he could.. what? be an office drone for 50 years?... is lame. 99% of us will live un-noteworthy lives and then die. This man has built something that will be inviting thought and discussion for potentially hundreds of years. Humans have always built monuments. Should the Hopewell peoples have not built their burial mounds because there were more productive things for them to do? If you don't understand this piece (and I sure don't), that's fine. I just think it's a pretty callous thing to dismiss someone's life passion as "jacking off in the desert."
- samatman 4y agoYou use kubernetes professionally and are therefore not entitled to judge the productivity of others, ever, for the rest of your life. You jack off machines and they don't even give you a reach-around.
- white_dragon88 4y agoOne of the most pointless wastes of money I’ve ever seen. I consider myself an artist and understand it’s value, but a 30M fund for what, some blocks of concrete in a desert??? That money could go to far more useful applications, and instead it’s dedicated to a monument to hubris. ‘Magnum opus’ my ass.
- padolsey 4y agoAgreed. I love art that challenges our perceptions of reality, society, even that which questions urbanism as a form of aesthetic pursuit. But this is just absolutely poo. A self-indulgent stain of hubris.
- bergenty 4y agoDisagree. You could say that about any monument but really over the long term that’s what builds culture and meaning.
- ElCheapo 4y agoFact is, up until recently, monuments were dismantled and their materials used for other purposes both by subsequent rulers and by the population at large. If this art installation were to become the basis of an actual settlement in 100 years I'd say the money wasn't wasted. Unfortunatly we have so much unjustified reverence towards art that doing so would probably be forbidden and these structures will simply rot and disintegrate
- padolsey 4y agoCulture is created therefore by literal dirt on the bottom of my shoe. By the very nature of being. Well, that's great. But eventually the word loses all meaning. It becomes a filler for "this thing exists at least ephemerally in the world we inhabit... how... monumental." If anything is art, then all judgement is moot. It's pointless for any of us to even engage. Agree. Agree. Disagree. Blah. I may as well throw my mooty mud into the mix of debate. To me, there is not a singular emotion this piece evokes other than a self-indulgent egotistic lump of cement articulated with, (reviews await), likely, essays of arbitrarily cloying fascination. It's fine as a thing that exists. Whatever. But it is equally a sinkhole of value.
- shrx 4y agoFrom the NYT article: > Visitors will also need to get themselves to Alamo, Nev., a nearish town. They’ll then be picked up, allowed to roam “City” for a few hours and, because there are no lights on the road and no cellphone service, they will be driven back before dark, meaning they won’t get to see the sun rise and set, prime hours. I feel this is such a bad decision, hope they reconsider.
- smitty1e 4y agoHow long before Burning Man moves in?
- thanatos519 4y agohttps://harvestfestival.org/location/midlothian-castle/ https://harvestfestival.org/location/midlothian-castle/ is a great place to party! City might be, too!
- ram_rar 4y agoCan someone with eye for art enlighten me on whats so good about this? Feels like a skateboard park in the dessert.
- nine_k 4y agoSome guy enjoyed building it for several decades. I think that's good!
- hoten 4y agoTotally. But, what's with everyone in the article being so grandiose about it. I never felt like I just "didn't get art" until reading the quotes in this article.
- christophilus 4y agoWhen I’m around certain artsy friends, I sometimes feel like the kid from “The Emperor’s New Clothes”.
- ggm 4y ago99% of them hate that you just like it or not. Sometimes the analysis is pointless. Stick to your guns. In the best possible sense and with no intended patronising notes: "you do you"
- egypturnash 4y agoThere is a lot of art whose major criteria is “does it make the uninitiated feel that way”. Anything that makes you want to say “My kid could do this!” probably falls into this category, and it is probably attached to an absurdly large price tag that makes you start wondering how much of its value is simply as a tax dodge for some obscenely rich person.
- failrate 4y ago"My kid could do this!" "Your kid did do this, Mrs. Twombly."
- simonebrunozzi 4y agohttps://archive.ph/stHER https://archive.ph/stHER
- drno123 4y agoHonestly, why is this even considered art?
- EB-Barrington 4y agoOne reason: it serves no other function.
- daitonthebeast 4y agoLooks to me like when you break of the map in video game and find developer testing areas
- baxtr 4y agoI think this is super amazing. What a piece of art. I have seen a couple of Maya city ruins, and this reminds me of them. It’s also a great reminder of what you can achieve if you focus a considerable amount of time on something.
- padolsey 4y ago> It’s also a great reminder of what you can achieve if you focus a considerable amount of time on something. Is it? 50 years for a bunch of cement? Is it a great reminder? I'm so confused by the positivist tilt on every piece of grey meh that exudes from the armpits of these supposed apex artistic cogitators. We are allowed to just say how rubbish it is, right? This artist has projected it into the world of public opinion. And while I respect his autonomous ambitions and sheer willpower, I don't believe this is an exemplar of achievement, and I struggle in good faith to see how such a perception is arrived at. FWIW I guess nobody here has skin in the game. I get to sit here like you and froth on the sidelines. I best get back to my own toils.
- baxtr 4y agoWell it’s art isn’t it? What’s the reason you believe I shouldn’t be liking it? When I watched the NYT flyover videos I got an instant positive gut reaction, a sort of resonance. I was skeptical at first but changed my mind. In a transient world where people mindlessly swipe TikTok videos, focusing 50 years on something is just mind blowing.
- frozenport 4y agoLooks like the kind of course work architecture students do...
- morelisp 4y ago> positivist tilt This seems more apt to describe your comment rejecting any purely phenomenological value of the work. Maybe you meant a different word?
- holler 4y agoAny coincidence it's strangely close to Area 51? Just sayin...
- dereg 4y agoFar as much discussion as there is here about how this was a colossal waste of time and resources, I’d be curious how many people here work for a company that’s net profitable. It’s very easy to be moralistic about other peoples money, especially when it comes to art. However, I wonder if it’s a bit hypocritical.
- gizmo385 4y agoWhile I agree with the larger point you're making here, asking whether or not the company people are working for is net profitable is a poor counter here, specifically because it centers "meaning" purely around monetary amount. There is value to be derived and created that has nothing to do with the dollar amount that ends up in your's or someone else's bank account at the end of the day.
- chongli 4y agoA lot of people feel this way about modern art in general. At some point along the way, art stopped being about trying to bring beauty and happiness and clarity into the human condition. Since then, art has become a pure signalling death spiral. What passes as “good art” these days is completely relegated to the art community and utterly unintelligible to regular people. Is there any wonder that people dismiss it as a waste of resources? It’s every bit as bad as NFTs, academic turf wars, and Twitter purity spirals [1]. It’s yet another warning sign of the impending decline of civilization, if Toynbee’s thesis is to be believed. [1] https://unherd.com/2020/01/cast-out-how-knitting-fell-into-a-purity-spiral/ https://unherd.com/2020/01/cast-out-how-knitting-fell-into-a...
- Ancapistani 4y ago> At some point along the way, art stopped being about trying to bring beauty and happiness and clarity into the human condition I’m no art critic, but you’ve only described one purpose of art as far as I can see. Art is about communicating emotion. Some art attempts to make you feel “happiness and clarity into the human condition”, sure - but other works make you feel all kinds of things, including horror in disillusionment. I think this is why I see some value in at least the idea of Dada, while others look at it and see nothing worthwhile. In fact, in that case, the reaction of those people is itself part of the installation. I remember coming to that conclusion in a city museum, where someone had taken a (new, obviously) toilet bowl and installed it as a water fountain. I had never heard of Duchamp at the time, but I immediately felt like I was seeing something that was, in fact, “art”. I came away from it thinking things like “we all have preconditions that color how we see the world”, “objects with common uses can fit other uses”, “just because something fits a purpose, doesn’t mean it’s a good choice”, “people are pretentious for scoffing at this without even considering why it was created”, etc. The point is, it caused me to feel things, and think about things that I wouldn’t have otherwise considered. My youngest child at the time was probably 3 or 4, and I remember her sitting in a stroller and looking at me like horns had sprouted from my head when I took a drink from it. I filled one of her sippy cups from it, and she refused to drink it. On one hand - it was just a porcelain fixture with municipal water piped into it, like every other fountain that we’d ever used. On the other, the mere fact that it looked like something that she associated with human waste meant that she was unwilling to consider that it was clean. The way other people looked at me when I drank from it carried between amusement, shock, and outright disgust. At that point the bystanders became the “art”. Hell, my actions became the art when I drank from it. A couple of others followed, some shook their heads, etc. So… yeah. I got wordy there, but from my perspective I’d say that anything that evokes emotions in others is in fact art.
- mkl95 4y agoIt reminds me of some of the architecture in the area I grew up in. A product of an era where coal was more important than man.
- Kaibeezy 4y agoHave a look at the Crawick Multiverse land art site I mentioned in another comment. It’s actually built in a reclaimed open pit coal mine.
- sandgiant 4y agoSome fairly negative comments here. I think it looks fantastic. I'd love to roam the site, imagining that I just stepped through a farcaster portal into some alien civilization. I can't recall seeing anything that would be able to provide the same sort of experience at scale like this.
- deleted 4y ago[deleted]
- peatmoss 4y agoThis is my favorite take. For me, desert landscapes prove fascinating. The unnatural geometric forms set against the mountains and desert and blue sky sounds utterly unreal. Everyone here going off about how they don’t “get” this—well, neither do I. I just think it would be cool to experience. It’s ultimately as pointless as love or music.
- stemlord 4y agoFor me it's not fantastical at all, it's an utterly spot-on take on our actual real life experience of urban life in America: giant parking lots, freeways, corporate parks, long walks through airport terminals and other liminal spaces designed at car-scale. But taken out of context so we're forced to reckon with it's weirdness, oppressiveness, scale, how starkly it juxtaposes against the natural world, how it will all last far beyond our own lifetimes and make us feel like lemmings in a giant maze devised by deities, and so on. I think the way it looks like some kind of landing bay on Mars speaks just as much to how our sci-fi stories were influenced by our urban architecture as it does the reverse.
- just-tom 4y agoI like it. It's big, abstract, depressing. I imagine walking there alone at night, must be something. Edit: also, i dont think 50 years of one person is a lot of time. 50 persons startup working for one year and then closing is also a waste of 50 years, not yet talking about the vc money.
- ttapp 4y agoThe "I don't like it, therefore it's crap" rude comments are so disappointing. I'm no art buff at all, my personal definition of art is "useless & captivating". I'd like to visit this one. The creator must be obsessed and crazy, which is like it should be. I expect it to give otherworldly, abstract melancholic vibes when being on-site. Case in point, during the years I lived in Mexico City, I went several times to the Teotihuacan site, a great experience when there are few visitors: https://cdn.kastatic.org/ka-perseus-images/9c44c543a72dbe1873981b344a79cc504313fdbb.jpg https://cdn.kastatic.org/ka-perseus-images/9c44c543a72dbe187...
- rikroots 4y agoI felt this way too. This structure is a single artist's vision, made solid over the course of 50 years. I can't get a feeling/reaction from it just by looking at photos but, maybe give the chance to visit, I expect I'd be able to prod the artist's vision, see if it resonates with me. Then again, I can get joy/awe/wonder/ennui/whatever from wandering around abandoned villages, ancient ruins (even the partly reconstructed ones), cemeteries, woods, wastelands, abandoned infrastructure, etc. Or even working places/venues, but at times of least activity. The key thing, for me, is that there must be few/no people around me - to let my mind unleash itself from the trivia and go roaming - that, for me, is when the 'art' (whatever 'art' is) happens. I could get jealous of the financial support the artist has received over the years as he strives to make his vision solid. But I have a suspicion that he would probably built something even without support. It reminds me of Outsider Art in that way: people driven to create despite the barriers others put in their way. That such people exist gives me hope for the species. I spent my 40th birthday wandering around Uxmal. No crowds; no tourists coached in on the hour. Just me and my partner and a collapsed civilisation surrounding us. Best birthday I've ever had! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uxmal https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uxmal
- veltas 4y agoRespectfully, and not to start an argument, but I think you don't need to defend the artist or say people shouldn't comment if they want to criticise. I don't think artists who do this stuff care if people think it's pointless or bad. That other people can enjoy it at all is something. Artists who created things this big aren't overly sensitive people, if they were they would have stopped decades back, after the first thousand people said it was an expensive waste of time. So I think people should be honest and say if they think it's crap. And the artist may get a kick out of it, or not care. Likewise don't say nice things about it if you think it's crap, just be honest.
- rcarmo 4y ago2500 years in the future, archeologists will wonder if it was meant to be a follow-up to the Nazca lines...
- kbns 4y agoELI5 please
- dotsam 4y agoI used to dream of being an artist, thinking it was an intrinsically noble endeavour. But after a lot of hard work and soul-searching of my own motivations, I eventually reframed my artistic pursuit as a means of solving the problems of 'how to get praise, attention, money and leave a legacy'. These are not bad things to want, but I felt like there were better and less self-indulgent ways of getting there than producing art. A mega-sculpture in Nevada sounds extremely indulgent, and whilst the project seems to have solved many problems for the artist, I can't help but think that the $30 million endowment could have solved a lot more pressing problems elsewhere.
- pengaru 4y ago> I can't help but think that the $30 million endowment could have solved a lot more pressing problems elsewhere If you consider the construction used primarily on-site materials, it appears the money largely went into laborer's hands. It's not like the region is teeming with employment opportunities for those folks, and they surely didn't just set fire to their compensation. My guess is it fed and housed a bunch of area families, not a total waste - but sure, the labor could have built something more useful. Now the area is a national monument and will draw tourism, creating jobs and growing the economy in a desert.
- dotsam 4y ago> The foundation has built a $30 million endowment to care for City. The money is in an endowment for a charity to maintain the project, not for the costs of building it. Yes the money will pay for peoples' jobs, and yes it will bring tourism. But honestly, is this what the world really needs? I know that this is an unpopular view, but such projects do seem hubristic when we are walking into a climate crisis. Particularly when it is built in a desert! If I were the artist I would not be able to see $30 million go towards a charity for preserving my work, when the money could instead be put towards a charity that worked to ensure there is actually a longterm future for humankind (and therefore people to see and enjoy art for generations to come). If you are capable of executing something this big, I think you are capable of aiming higher and going for a bigger positive impact on the world. So what I see is a lack of vision, not something awe-inspiring.
- deleted 4y ago[deleted]
- adhesive_wombat 4y agoI think this looks pretty. Complex One has some Cold War and Hyperion Time Tombs vibe to it, and the whole thing feels like the garden of the drone Hassipura Plyn-Frie in the Hydrogen Sonata. It generally reminds me of what the Banksian Culture allowed by its post-scarcity: exploration of grand artistic endeavours for no other reason than that's what the artist wanted to create. I've always had a soft spot for architectural and land art. Though this kind of brutal sterility has its beauty, Arcosanti[1] has a more human appeal. [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arcosanti https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arcosanti
- christkv 4y agoI always wonder what will anyone think in a 1000 years if they dig it out of the desert. Will there will be wild speculations on the religious significance of the structures and how the proportions line up to x natural or universal constants. Did aliens build it? :)
- adhesive_wombat 4y agoSame for lots of structures maybe. Imagine finding the remnants of CERN near an ancient ruined city if you're part of civilisation that's regressed technologically. What would pre-nuclear people make of a kilometres-wide perfectly circular tunnel full of strange items? At least I think they'd probably try to excavate the centre of the circle, assuming there to be something important there (and come up empty).
- ethbr0 4y ago> What would pre-nuclear people make of a kilometres-wide perfectly circular tunnel full of strange items? "Ooh! Copper!" (And niobium-titanium superconducting wires)
- adhesive_wombat 4y agoBut do you dare to anger King Bremsstrahlung by plundering from his crown?
- yellowapple 4y agoI think this is really cool. I'm tempted to pony up the $150 to go see it, but it'd have to be in winter; I live in Nevada and there's no way in hell that'd be a pleasant experience in summer. Zero shade, zero plants, just heat, for 1½ miles on foot. Even in spring/fall, I'd definitely hydrating beforehand and bringing lots of water.
- onionisafruit 4y agoMy kid is going to see it this year, and they are waiting for winter for just this reason.
- telesilla 4y agoI can imagine it gives a similar feeling as when exploring San Juan Teotihuacán outside Mexico City. https://whc.unesco.org/en/list/414/ https://whc.unesco.org/en/list/414/ Why not build things, and interesting things, things that get us to talk about these things with each other? I love the energy this project creates among us. Edit: having read the NY Times article, clearly inspired by the ancient neighbours in the south.
- gpjanik 4y agoI'm surprised noone has written "Death Stranding" in the comments yet. Death Stranding.
- seumars 4y agoNow it's Turrell's turn to finish Roden Crater.
- yakshaving_jgt 4y agoI like art. I don't like this work, but that should be ok. It should be ok to not like stuff. I've spent a fair bit of time in art galleries. I enjoy it. I don't enjoy the art snobbery though. I don't know why people gaze endlessly into paintings and try to discern the meaning or whatever. It's not that deep. I don't understand the hype around the Mona Lisa. I don't understand why people stand in line for hours and then crowd around this one — in my opinion — bland painting to snap that shot and check it off their list that they've seen that one piece. The Centre Pompidou is just down the road and it's full of way more interesting stuff! My father is an artist, and any time his work is featured in a gallery he is asked to describe the meaning, the inspiration, the message, and countless other pretentious questions intended to draw in a totally unnecessary air of sophistication. His response is the same every time. "I don't know. I see shit and I paint it." I'm massively into wine. Similarly, I find wine snobbery frustrating. I have enjoyed the world's best wines. From Ukraine, from Georgia, from Moldova, Italy, France… But the people who clutch their pearls when you pair a dry red with your grilled salmon? Fuck those people especially. What's beautiful about art, and wine, and music, is that there's an entire universe of it. There's something for everybody. And it's definitely ok to not like some of it.
- christkv 4y agoMona Lisa only got famous because it was stolen and then recovered. Before that nobody cared
- robofanatic 4y ago> people who clutch their pearls when you pair a dry red with your grilled salmon? Fuck those people especially. Bang on! I also hate the people who lecture on how to hold a wine glass.
- beowulfey 4y agoThis provides some perspective to our paleoarcheology of today. Imagine we find something odd from a past civilization that we can't explain (like a large complex of concrete with rolling forms and sharp angles in the desert). The natural tendency would be to assume this was a collective thing, a place built by many for some mysterious purpose. But humans have been doing art almost as long as they have been around. I would guess it's just as possible that we sometimes come across something from a single individual, built with the express purpose of making people think. It's kind of interesting.
- twobitshifter 4y agoI wonder how long those sharp angles will stay sharp when subjected to the elements?
- doctorhandshake 4y agoHaving had my mind changed when visiting some massive and site-specific art, my recommendation to those who say from photos that they don’t like it: withhold judgement until you’ve been there. Immersion in something of this scale, in a setting like this, in a place so remote that getting there is a journey, is likely to have an effect on you that aerial photos you look at on your phone do not.
- CPLX 4y agoExactly. It’s literally the core concept to consider when considering art. You have to actually see the real thing to experience it. That doesn’t mean you’ll like it there’s an excellent chance you won’t. But experiencing art in real life is fundamentally different than seeing images of it, and this is doubly true for larger scale or more installation oriented pieces. A good example that’s a little closer to home and easier to experience for many is DIA Beacon outside of NYC.
- acomjean 4y agoDia beacon is a really great museum and fun to explore. The subject artist Michael Heizer artist has a piece there. https://www.diaart.org/collection/collection/heizer-michael-north-east-south-west19672002-2003-174-1-4 https://www.diaart.org/collection/collection/heizer-michael-... Walking through the Richard Sera pieces was a trip. https://www.diaart.org/exhibition/exhibitions-projects/richard-serra-exhibition https://www.diaart.org/exhibition/exhibitions-projects/richa...
- i_am_jl 4y ago>A good example that’s a little closer to home and easier to experience for many is DIA Beacon outside of NYC. Just want to add, if you're heading to DIA Beacon and the weather is nice, don't miss Storm King on the other side of the river.
- doctorhandshake 4y agoYeah def had Serra and Beacon in mind as well as Naoshima, Teshima, Turrell, etc.
- elhudy 4y ago>“This is a masterpiece, or close to it” Come on guys, the artist himself has proclaimed it a masterpiece, we can end our silly squabbling and all go home now. This is decided.
- morelisp 4y agoHe's obviously using the historical definition of "masterpiece" here inviting judgement of it - not the pop culture one, which means almost the opposite in placing it beyond casual judgement.
- elhudy 4y agoOh so it's a a piece of work presented to a medieval guild as evidence of qualification for the rank of master? Unless you're saying he's using a definition of the word that literally doesn't exist in the dictionary?
- junon 4y agoHeh, I love it. Funny how subjective art is. Going to try to go see it.
- penjelly 4y agolooks like a movie set, wonder if itll be used that way in the coming years
- thepasswordis 4y agoI’m sick of pretending I don’t “get” art: https://www.vice.com/en/article/ppvwby/im-sick-of-pretending-i-dont-get-art https://www.vice.com/en/article/ppvwby/im-sick-of-pretending... I get this art, and I STILL don’t like it. I thjnk there is a sort of societal sickness where we’ve stopped making things that are beautiful and glorify humanity and instead make things which are bland and ugly and depressing. And sure some post modernist can say “ha that’s what the artist is saying!” Yeah I know. I just think he’s saying it in a boring, ugly way. The reality of this type of art is that it’s really easy to make. Most of the “skill” required to do stuff like this is the networking required to find somebody who will pay for it.
- camillomiller 4y agoThere is an underlying acceptance in the Art World that all you need to have to become an artist is not really talent. It's a network.
- naasking 4y agoSure, if "artist" is merely a career and not an aspirational achievement in finding creative ways to reveal truth.
- starkd 4y agoIt's where the concept of equity for all leads. When no one is inherently worse or better than anyone else, it becomes mere bigotry to pass any kind of judgment.
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- maj0rhn 4y agoThat is exactly the thesis of a recent book [0], summarized, more or less, as: "When there is no objective method to rate performance, then the social network becomes the measure of performance." [0] https://www.amazon.com/Formula-Universal-Laws-Success/dp/0316505498 https://www.amazon.com/Formula-Universal-Laws-Success/dp/031...
- dbg31415 4y agoAn art exhibit containing mounds of dirt in the middle of the Nevada desert with a $30M endowment to keep people out... They did check for bodies, yeah?
- wonderwonder 4y agoI don't really get the art. But with that said I can very much appreciate that someone devoted their life to this and that it will likely live on and signal their existence long after they pass. All of us should have such a purpose and be so lucky.
- bobabob 4y agoLooks like a place I'd like ride my dirt bike and that's all I can appreciate about it.
- vlunkr 4y agoOne of the people paying for it said: > “Over the years I would sometimes compare Michael Heizer’s City project to some of the most important ancient monuments and cities,” Govan said in a statement. “But now I only compare it to itself.” We can argue the merits of the art itself, but I think we can agree that the self-congratulation is nauseating.
- solardev 4y agoWho is this guy and why do we care that he built some concrete in a desert...? Teenagers in Minecraft make more interesting things every day, lol...
- Phenomenit 4y agoI'm mostly impressed by the fact that he stuck with it for 50 years. I can't fathom having a concrete(pun intended) concept that survives 50 years of new information and experiences. I call this record art. It's nice and I don't mind the naked concrete but if this was made in a smaller scale over a shorter period of time I can't imagine it would make such a splash.
- fuzzfactor 4y agoIt can be amazing what one person can do. Especially focusing over a period of decades. That's an art in itself. Looks almost like it was built by one person's idea who then did all the work except that which physically required a helping hand. Some of these things fit into a shoebox, some of them don't.
- phonescreen_man 4y agoSome of the sentiments on this thread: It’s shit, definitely not Art. It’s decent, what is art anyway. I like it. Modern Artists are elitists. My take. It’s shit. It’s art. It’s some rich dude and his buds finding meaning so good for them. It’s bland. And it fails to challenge society at large in any meaningful way unless you count not being able to get there to see it easily as an artistic merit. Meh.. Proof of artistic merit or get the frick out!
- anonymousiam 4y agoOnly 167 miles away from me. Maybe I'll visit someday. https://goo.gl/maps/uMdNT9wwPm3o2zYD9 https://goo.gl/maps/uMdNT9wwPm3o2zYD9
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- seabird 4y agoI'm a bit confused as to how people have so much trouble "getting" this. I might even go as far to say that the whole thing is uniquely low-brow. It's like a realization of a kid thinking "what if there was a skate park, but it went for miles?", or an early-2000s amateur CGI render, or a CS:S surf map 30 years before that string of words was a twinkle in anybody's eye. Yes, 50 years and tens of millions of dollars is extreme, but there's all sorts of impractical things that are still cool in spite of how little practical sense they make.
- dmix 4y agoA better analogy might be a grand garden without the flowers and with a mix of sculpture and architectural style.
- sixQuarks 4y agoI personally think complex engineering projects are some of the highest elevation of art. Getting 30,000 people together to create self landing rockets that will take humanity to Mars is the type of inspirational art that I admire.
- sfvegandude 4y agoExperiencing art takes work in itself. If you are inclined to look at 2D photos of a 1.5 mile work of art and make your final decision about its merits, I don’t think you’ve done the work to experience it. That makes your opinion valid but uninteresting overall.
- zahma 4y agoAh yes the “work” to travel to a remote part of the country and stand amazed at the concrete erections of this is great man. The work that only few of the inclined can afford. Of course, this installation requires space, and choosing it to be “out there” affords it some additional conceptual credit, but who is this meant to impress except for a certain class of people who have the time and means to do “the work” and actually interpret its profound artistic message? Your comment seems to me to prioritize the artist’s prerogative, and with a $30 million endowment for this installation, I’d say quite a few people agree with you. But shouldn’t we also afford the beholder some respect? I’m quite skeptical of this installation, but I’d go see it if I was ever in Central Eastern Nevada, which I’m guessing, like many people, won’t be any time soon. We shouldn’t discount anyone’s opinion for having not seen it in person because who is it really speaking to in the first place?
- sfvegandude 4y ago> But shouldn’t we also afford the beholder some respect? Yep. As I said: the opinion of the observer, in whatever capacity they have observed, is valid. But uninteresting overall. In the same way I don’t value the literary criticism of the student who only read the Cliff’s Notes. Moreover, the “work” need not exclusively be traveling to the site itself. The work was just unveiled. Everyone here heard about it for the first time today. How much context have you taken in about this work?
- cercatrova 4y agoI wonder what future archaeologists will think of this structure in the middle of the desert. Maybe they'll think it was ritual or religious, much like how we think of Stonehenge today.
- frozencell 4y agoDid you lose your mind, future archaeologists might be neural networks capable of going back in time or light-fast investigation unless some extinction happens and back to the basics, or you refer to alternative geometric and conceptual future universes /s ^^
- glitcher 4y agoFrom the Triple Aught Foundation website http://tripleaughtfoundation.org/ http://tripleaughtfoundation.org/: > City will soon begin to receive visitors on September 2, 2022. Only short day trips will be possible for a maximum of six visitors, with prior reservations only, and only in favorable weather. City is on private property in rural terrain, and it has no habitable structures. Visiting without a pre-arranged visit is thus potentially dangerous, and it is strictly prohibited and is trespassing. > Visitors will be accommodated on a first come, first serve basis, and visitations will end for the 2022 season on November 1. The price of a visit is $150/adult, $100/student... I applaud the vision and perseverance of the artist, although it's not necessarily my cup of tea. But I dislike the exclusivity aspect often present in the art world. It's not high brow in this case so much, as it is manufactured scarcity. The artist probably thinks a crowd would destroy the feeling of isolation he wanted to achieve, but only 6 visitors at a time???
- thenoblesunfish 4y agoI can't help but picture it once it's been abandoned. Cracks, graffiti, tire tracks, garbage.
- istjohn 4y ago"This is democratic art" says creator of art project in the middle of nowhere admitting only 6 visitors per day.
- kart23 4y agoI think it’s cool, but if they’re actually only allowing 6 people a day and charging $150, it’s stupid. let people visit as they wish, if someone’s dedicated enough to get out there, they should be able to see the piece.
- chmod775 4y agoIt is oddly pleasing to look at. There is something special about flawless results of considerable time investment and discipline. I get a similar feeling from looking at mistake-free notes taken in neat handwriting with precise illustrations. The kid in me just wants to run around and over those shapes though.