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I've had several chances to switch positions for considerably more than I make now (40-50% on my current six figures), each time I've turned them down. I am ha

I've had several chances to switch positions for considerably more than I make now (40-50% on my current six figures), each time I've turned them down. I am happy and content where I am at, the job has good work life balance, it is for a good cause, and I make enough to provide comfortably for me and my family, this employer is also very stable so I don't have to worry about economic uncertainty. All in all I could make more money but I have found a level of contment and peace and it has allowed me to persue other hobbies outside of tech and serve in my local community. So maybe I am stupid and leaving money on the table, but I have found peace for now. For those who feel they need to make more I tell them congratulations that is awesome for you. But for now I am happy.

aprdm 4y ago
I was in a similar place and changed jobs for 2x the pay. It has been a bit challenging and I do miss the culture/people/role at my previous place, but let’s see where this goes. I’m hopeful still! I feel I can always go back if it gets really bad. Ultimately 2x pay, say from 200 to 400, makes a huge difference to me, mainly with the current house prices.
pcthrowaway 4y ago
I am happy and content where I am at ... I have found a level of contment and peace ... I have found peace for now ... But for now I am happy. Tell us you're happy and have found contentment and peace one more time just so we know you really mean it. Joking aside, there's nothing wrong with staying with a job you like if it doesn't quite pay market, but take care not to end up getting underpaid to the point you don't have a cushion. Curious if by "several chances to switch positions" you just mean recruiters have reached out to you though, because that's not quite the same thing.
dominotw 4y ago
higher pay doesn't equate to less work life balance. This is major misconception that has no basis in reality.
- Viliam1234 4y ago
  It can even be the other way round. The cheapest company will try to extract as much work from you as possible, while the company with tons of money will hire more employees so you get better work-life balance. In my experience, the companies that paid least were also the most stressful, and the ones who paid most were a mixed bag.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
bad_username 4y ago
It is completely valid to optimize your life for metrics other than just income.
pwinnski 4y ago
I know the received wisdom is to always keep moving, and never accept counter-offers. You've found happiness in staying in place. I've done both at different times. I think everybody has to make judgments based on where they are and what they're looking for, and a general rule might not apply in every case. To broadly generalize, when I was younger I think it made more sense to move up by switching companies, and I'm not sure I really valued a stable team with great coworkers as much as I should have. When you find a really good team, that's worth staying in place.
m463 4y ago
I've know folks who leave, have a change of heart, and return to the same company (for more money).
- Rebelgecko 4y ago
  I've worked at multiple companies that independently developed jokey sayings along the lines of "The quickest way to get promoted is to work somewhere else for a few years and come back"
  - chii 4y ago
    with the exception of gaining experience working elsewhere, i just don't understand the reason why a company doesn't promote internally and pay higher, over hiring anew (even if such hires turned out to be an ex-employee). But it's true for all anecdotal evidence and circumstances i can see. It just boggles the mind why such simple inefficiencies don't get fixed up.
    - vkou 4y ago
      Because a lot of good people are comfortable and complacent and won't play this game, and continue to get underpaid. And why wouldn't they? If you're happy with your work and your team and your boss, why gamble it away by going somewhere else? A bit more money is great, but may not be worth it if the new job sucks.
    - hashtag-til 4y ago
      In practice, it is very easy to justify a bigger salary for a new hire and very difficult to get upper management acceptance for consistent/real salary raises for internal people. It makes no sense at all, but that’s what I experience being a somewhat new manager in a tech company.
      - fendy3002 4y ago
        It's the exact reason, and a natural one. Why hurt yourself with increasing wage of existing, content employees rather than using it to expand the workforce with newer, (assuming) more powerful candidates? If you play any management games with employees you'll do it too, granted that the game doesn't have any employee happiness or resign when underpaid. But yeah, game and real world situation is not the same.
psygn89 4y ago
You're not stupid for that, you've found contentment in your life that those who perpetually seek for more may never find. They may even pay for it later when the stress impacts their health and well-being.
newbie2020 4y ago
Do you already own a home?
- buscoquadnary 4y ago
  It's not paid off, but ya I have a home in a small town that I love with my family.
  - orzig 4y ago
    This highlights really important factor in all discussions; employees can be in a very different life situation which naturally leads to different priorities. Congratulations on yours!
    - BlargMcLarg 4y ago
      Give employees a decent worklife balance and guaranteed access to a home, most jobhopping would stop and the headhunter population would be an order of magnitude smaller. That's really what's happening here, people job hopping to keep the status quo of the previous generation(s).
- yohannparis 4y ago
  I'm curious about why this matter? As an european, owning is not a goal in my life. I would love to, but for now, I still want flexibility on my wereabouts.
  - hansvm 4y ago
    Owning gives you a different kind of flexibility. Renting is usually pretty restrictive in the US, and if you want to put up a fence for your dog, grow a garden, paint your walls, or whatever you usually can't.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
Vanit 4y ago
Really healthy mindset imo, am happy for you :)
W-Stool 4y ago
As a 60+ geezer who is back to doing what made me happy in this business before career climbing and salary chasing took me into a bad place or two, let me commend you on realizing that contentment is what life is really all about. I truly wish I had understood this at 30 rather than finally and fully realizing it at 60.
- ivanstojic 4y ago
  We should recognize that there are universal needs for geezers and kids: we want some form of personal security. For a lot, that means home ownership. Let’s look at data: If the geezer is 60 and paid off their loan today, they got it 30 years ago (in 1992). The median price of single family freestanding homes in LA county in 1992 was 221k. Today it’s 860k. In 1992 the median household income was 32k and in 2020 (last available data point) it’s 76k. I understand that “the geezers” have something to teach us with a perspective of a lifetime and the needs all humans share. At the same time, we have to acknowledge and account for the economics having totally changed.
- Varqu 4y ago
  Perhaps you can strike a balance between the 2 options of the spectrum? I would not imagine still working in the company where I started as a Junior (and only receiving a 5% raise per year). In the same time, after jumping a few times, my salary increased 7x and I found a place where I felt really happy working, too. (before starting my own business)
  - Gareth321 4y ago
    >Perhaps you can strike a balance between the 2 options of the spectrum? Exactly. This doesn't have to be one extreme or the other. I believe you can have a good job and a good wage.
  - Tainnor 4y ago
    > my salary increased 7x That's simply not an option in most areas of the world. I agree that a balance between the extremes is healthy, but I don't think that you're a case in point.
refurb 4y ago
Your position doesn't seem stupid at all. You clearly need to balance all of the benefits of a job - compensation is just one aspect. If you're looking for work-life balance, it doesn't make much sense to jump ship for a 50% increase in comp if your work week goes from an easy 6 hours/4 days per week to 12 hours days and working on weekends.
- enraged_camel 4y ago
  It might make sense to make such a jump if you’re young and early in your career. Young people have fewer commitments and they also have more energy, so they can handle those types of workloads more easily. And due to the way compounding (interest) works, choosing to make more money earlier in life is not such a bad idea. The other benefit is that early in one’s career, a high salary can be a good boost of self esteem, and set one up for even higher salaries later.
  - refurb 4y ago
    That's why I prefaced my comment with "If you're looking for work-life balance...." If you have other goals (just money), then the trade-offs might be worth it.
drewcoo 4y ago
- dang 4y ago
  Hey, please don't be a jerk on HN, no matter how annoying you find another comment. There are always annoying things floating around—not getting reactive to them is key to having this place function as intended. If you wouldn't mind reviewing https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and taking the intended spirit of the site more to heart, we'd be grateful. Edit: it looks like you've unfortunately been making a habit of posting unsubstantive comments and otherwise breaking the site guidelines, and we've had to ask you more than once not to do this. Can you please fix this? I don't want to ban you, but that's what we'll end up having to do if this keeps up.
lentil_soup 4y ago
As a side comment to this I always think that a lot of developers are very lucky that we can ride the balance of making good money AND have a comfortable life. But a lot of the time the promise of even more money makes us make choices that unbalance this and we end up working for companies we don't like, building things we don't support, living in cities we don't care about. In a way not reaping the real rewards of our luck. I guess it's related to the hedonic treadmill (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hedonic_treadmill https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hedonic_treadmill)? There's something unique about being in a position where you could exchange that extra money for other great comforts and STILL have plenty to do alright.
_fat_santa 4y ago
When I first started in tech it was always money money money, didn't care who I worked for or the work environment was like, all I saw was dollar signs. I did this from the time I started my career about 5 years ago until I joined my current job. With my current job I know I could go elsewhere and make $50k more, but at what cost? It really started to make me consider, how much is remote work worth to me, how much is a laid back environment worth to me. For now even though I could be making more, the value in having the control over my time like I do not is worth more than what companies have been offering.
- dixie_land 4y ago
  your mindset would definitely be different when early in your career 50 might be a 50% pay bump but now it’s less than 10%
  - entropicdrifter 4y ago
    You're suggesting that with 5 years' experience, the person you're replying to is making over 500K/year?
    - dixie_land 4y ago
      yeah if “money money money” had been your plan for 5 years it’s totally feasible to land at a senior role at this stage. while the market definitely has shifted very drastically in the recent few months, at beginning of the year 500k for a senior that interviews well is not an uncommon offer.
      - rank0 4y ago
        It is absolutely uncommon. What percent of senior engineers do you think make 500k?! Maybe if you do some funny math with assumed stock option prices and price in value of PTO, etc you might get a few percent…
polygotdomain 4y ago
I'm certainly more in this camp of not looking to switch, but in the past I've moved jobs in the 2-3 year range. Right now, I feel that I'm well compensated, at a place that offers great work-life balance, is tackling interesting problems, and just lets me do my job. Part of the reason I'm not interested in leaving is that this is the first place that really has all four of those things, and given it took me 9-ish years to land at a place like this, there's going to have to be a significant jump in salary (like an extra 25-35%) to get me to move because of factors beyond my bottom line take home pay. That being said, I've "hopped" jobs earlier in my career, but more in the 2-3 year window rather than 6-8 months. I can only imagine what I'd be making if I was still at the first two places I worked. It'd probably be 2/3rds of what I'm making now at best. I don't think it's as clear as "always stay" or "always hop". At a certain point in your career, hopping may be looked at as a liability, and staying in a position that's a bad fit or doesn't advance your career doesn't make sense. Ultimately a job and your career is more about numbers, and you've got to optimize for more than just that. Understand when you are leaving money on the table, and when you've got something worth sticking around for.
thenerdhead 4y ago
I can relate. I have turned down many roles that would pay me more and in turn would have me taking on excess responsibilities (More than a single person can take on). Any company that allows me to define my own WLB and pursue my passions outside of it brings me tranquility. I cannot imagine the stress is worth it. It eats at you faster than you think. Then you'll be looking for another job two years later.

aprdm 4y ago

I was in a similar place and changed jobs for 2x the pay. It has been a bit challenging and I do miss the culture/people/role at my previous place, but let’s see where this goes. I’m hopeful still! I feel I can always go back if it gets really bad. Ultimately 2x pay, say from 200 to 400, makes a huge difference to me, mainly with the current house prices.

pcthrowaway 4y ago

I am happy and content where I am at ... I have found a level of contment and peace ... I have found peace for now ... But for now I am happy. Tell us you're happy and have found contentment and peace one more time just so we know you really mean it. Joking aside, there's nothing wrong with staying with a job you like if it doesn't quite pay market, but take care not to end up getting underpaid to the point you don't have a cushion. Curious if by "several chances to switch positions" you just mean recruiters have reached out to you though, because that's not quite the same thing.

dominotw 4y ago

higher pay doesn't equate to less work life balance. This is major misconception that has no basis in reality.

Viliam1234 4y ago
It can even be the other way round. The cheapest company will try to extract as much work from you as possible, while the company with tons of money will hire more employees so you get better work-life balance. In my experience, the companies that paid least were also the most stressful, and the ones who paid most were a mixed bag.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]

bad_username 4y ago

It is completely valid to optimize your life for metrics other than just income.

pwinnski 4y ago

I know the received wisdom is to always keep moving, and never accept counter-offers. You've found happiness in staying in place. I've done both at different times. I think everybody has to make judgments based on where they are and what they're looking for, and a general rule might not apply in every case. To broadly generalize, when I was younger I think it made more sense to move up by switching companies, and I'm not sure I really valued a stable team with great coworkers as much as I should have. When you find a really good team, that's worth staying in place.

m463 4y ago

I've know folks who leave, have a change of heart, and return to the same company (for more money).

Rebelgecko 4y ago
I've worked at multiple companies that independently developed jokey sayings along the lines of "The quickest way to get promoted is to work somewhere else for a few years and come back"
- chii 4y ago
  with the exception of gaining experience working elsewhere, i just don't understand the reason why a company doesn't promote internally and pay higher, over hiring anew (even if such hires turned out to be an ex-employee). But it's true for all anecdotal evidence and circumstances i can see. It just boggles the mind why such simple inefficiencies don't get fixed up.
  - vkou 4y ago
    Because a lot of good people are comfortable and complacent and won't play this game, and continue to get underpaid. And why wouldn't they? If you're happy with your work and your team and your boss, why gamble it away by going somewhere else? A bit more money is great, but may not be worth it if the new job sucks.
  - hashtag-til 4y ago
    In practice, it is very easy to justify a bigger salary for a new hire and very difficult to get upper management acceptance for consistent/real salary raises for internal people. It makes no sense at all, but that’s what I experience being a somewhat new manager in a tech company.
    - fendy3002 4y ago
      It's the exact reason, and a natural one. Why hurt yourself with increasing wage of existing, content employees rather than using it to expand the workforce with newer, (assuming) more powerful candidates? If you play any management games with employees you'll do it too, granted that the game doesn't have any employee happiness or resign when underpaid. But yeah, game and real world situation is not the same.

psygn89 4y ago

You're not stupid for that, you've found contentment in your life that those who perpetually seek for more may never find. They may even pay for it later when the stress impacts their health and well-being.

newbie2020 4y ago

Do you already own a home?

buscoquadnary 4y ago
It's not paid off, but ya I have a home in a small town that I love with my family.
- orzig 4y ago
  This highlights really important factor in all discussions; employees can be in a very different life situation which naturally leads to different priorities. Congratulations on yours!
  - BlargMcLarg 4y ago
    Give employees a decent worklife balance and guaranteed access to a home, most jobhopping would stop and the headhunter population would be an order of magnitude smaller. That's really what's happening here, people job hopping to keep the status quo of the previous generation(s).
yohannparis 4y ago
I'm curious about why this matter? As an european, owning is not a goal in my life. I would love to, but for now, I still want flexibility on my wereabouts.
- hansvm 4y ago
  Owning gives you a different kind of flexibility. Renting is usually pretty restrictive in the US, and if you want to put up a fence for your dog, grow a garden, paint your walls, or whatever you usually can't.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

Vanit 4y ago

Really healthy mindset imo, am happy for you :)

W-Stool 4y ago

As a 60+ geezer who is back to doing what made me happy in this business before career climbing and salary chasing took me into a bad place or two, let me commend you on realizing that contentment is what life is really all about. I truly wish I had understood this at 30 rather than finally and fully realizing it at 60.

ivanstojic 4y ago
We should recognize that there are universal needs for geezers and kids: we want some form of personal security. For a lot, that means home ownership. Let’s look at data: If the geezer is 60 and paid off their loan today, they got it 30 years ago (in 1992). The median price of single family freestanding homes in LA county in 1992 was 221k. Today it’s 860k. In 1992 the median household income was 32k and in 2020 (last available data point) it’s 76k. I understand that “the geezers” have something to teach us with a perspective of a lifetime and the needs all humans share. At the same time, we have to acknowledge and account for the economics having totally changed.
Varqu 4y ago
Perhaps you can strike a balance between the 2 options of the spectrum? I would not imagine still working in the company where I started as a Junior (and only receiving a 5% raise per year). In the same time, after jumping a few times, my salary increased 7x and I found a place where I felt really happy working, too. (before starting my own business)
- Gareth321 4y ago
  >Perhaps you can strike a balance between the 2 options of the spectrum? Exactly. This doesn't have to be one extreme or the other. I believe you can have a good job and a good wage.
- Tainnor 4y ago
  > my salary increased 7x That's simply not an option in most areas of the world. I agree that a balance between the extremes is healthy, but I don't think that you're a case in point.

refurb 4y ago

Your position doesn't seem stupid at all. You clearly need to balance all of the benefits of a job - compensation is just one aspect. If you're looking for work-life balance, it doesn't make much sense to jump ship for a 50% increase in comp if your work week goes from an easy 6 hours/4 days per week to 12 hours days and working on weekends.

enraged_camel 4y ago
It might make sense to make such a jump if you’re young and early in your career. Young people have fewer commitments and they also have more energy, so they can handle those types of workloads more easily. And due to the way compounding (interest) works, choosing to make more money earlier in life is not such a bad idea. The other benefit is that early in one’s career, a high salary can be a good boost of self esteem, and set one up for even higher salaries later.
- refurb 4y ago
  That's why I prefaced my comment with "If you're looking for work-life balance...." If you have other goals (just money), then the trade-offs might be worth it.

drewcoo 4y ago

dang 4y ago
Hey, please don't be a jerk on HN, no matter how annoying you find another comment. There are always annoying things floating around—not getting reactive to them is key to having this place function as intended. If you wouldn't mind reviewing https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and taking the intended spirit of the site more to heart, we'd be grateful. Edit: it looks like you've unfortunately been making a habit of posting unsubstantive comments and otherwise breaking the site guidelines, and we've had to ask you more than once not to do this. Can you please fix this? I don't want to ban you, but that's what we'll end up having to do if this keeps up.

lentil_soup 4y ago

As a side comment to this I always think that a lot of developers are very lucky that we can ride the balance of making good money AND have a comfortable life. But a lot of the time the promise of even more money makes us make choices that unbalance this and we end up working for companies we don't like, building things we don't support, living in cities we don't care about. In a way not reaping the real rewards of our luck. I guess it's related to the hedonic treadmill (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hedonic_treadmill https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hedonic_treadmill)? There's something unique about being in a position where you could exchange that extra money for other great comforts and STILL have plenty to do alright.

_fat_santa 4y ago

When I first started in tech it was always money money money, didn't care who I worked for or the work environment was like, all I saw was dollar signs. I did this from the time I started my career about 5 years ago until I joined my current job. With my current job I know I could go elsewhere and make $50k more, but at what cost? It really started to make me consider, how much is remote work worth to me, how much is a laid back environment worth to me. For now even though I could be making more, the value in having the control over my time like I do not is worth more than what companies have been offering.

dixie_land 4y ago
your mindset would definitely be different when early in your career 50 might be a 50% pay bump but now it’s less than 10%
- entropicdrifter 4y ago
  You're suggesting that with 5 years' experience, the person you're replying to is making over 500K/year?
  - dixie_land 4y ago
    yeah if “money money money” had been your plan for 5 years it’s totally feasible to land at a senior role at this stage. while the market definitely has shifted very drastically in the recent few months, at beginning of the year 500k for a senior that interviews well is not an uncommon offer.
    - rank0 4y ago
      It is absolutely uncommon. What percent of senior engineers do you think make 500k?! Maybe if you do some funny math with assumed stock option prices and price in value of PTO, etc you might get a few percent…

polygotdomain 4y ago

I'm certainly more in this camp of not looking to switch, but in the past I've moved jobs in the 2-3 year range. Right now, I feel that I'm well compensated, at a place that offers great work-life balance, is tackling interesting problems, and just lets me do my job. Part of the reason I'm not interested in leaving is that this is the first place that really has all four of those things, and given it took me 9-ish years to land at a place like this, there's going to have to be a significant jump in salary (like an extra 25-35%) to get me to move because of factors beyond my bottom line take home pay. That being said, I've "hopped" jobs earlier in my career, but more in the 2-3 year window rather than 6-8 months. I can only imagine what I'd be making if I was still at the first two places I worked. It'd probably be 2/3rds of what I'm making now at best. I don't think it's as clear as "always stay" or "always hop". At a certain point in your career, hopping may be looked at as a liability, and staying in a position that's a bad fit or doesn't advance your career doesn't make sense. Ultimately a job and your career is more about numbers, and you've got to optimize for more than just that. Understand when you are leaving money on the table, and when you've got something worth sticking around for.

thenerdhead 4y ago

I can relate. I have turned down many roles that would pay me more and in turn would have me taking on excess responsibilities (More than a single person can take on). Any company that allows me to define my own WLB and pursue my passions outside of it brings me tranquility. I cannot imagine the stress is worth it. It eats at you faster than you think. Then you'll be looking for another job two years later.