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Google now deleting health clinic searches from location history automatically
- beefee 4y agoI wonder how hard it would be to have my personal residence classified as one of these protected places. Incorporate some kind of business or non-profit, make sure it shows up the right way in Google Maps, then enjoy freedom from Google surveillance.
- crikeyjoe 4y agoWait, what? They were saving it all before?
- thestepafter 4y agoThey have been saving it for years. How do you think they give so much away for free? By selling the information they collect.
- Jcowell 4y agoWhen you say selling the information , do you mean actually selling the information or selling ad slots to target specific people/groups based on data.
- hotpotamus 4y agoWould it be overly cynical to say that I assume they'll do whichever gets them the most money?
- Jcowell 4y agoWithin reason. Data is valuable. You make far more money gathering data, keeping it private but selling the ability to advertise against that data , than outright selling it. Think of it as “Data-As-A-Service”. Your data loses value if you’re just outright selling it.
- lupire 4y agoIf you pushed the consent button when prompted on your Android phone, yes.
- jeffbee 4y agoIt is not as easy or silent as you are implying. If you enable Location History you get a monthly email reminding you that it is enabled, with a link at the top of the email to go turn it off if you want.
- nyanpasu64 4y agoGoogle Maps won't let you set a home or work location without enabling location history. It's bullshit tying.
- jeffbee 4y agoFalse. Prove it to yourself. Visit https://timeline.google.com/ https://timeline.google.com/ to verify that it is off, or to turn it off. Now go to https://www.google.com/maps/ https://www.google.com/maps/ , click menu → Your places → Labeled to see your home and work, or to add one.
- hnburnsy 4y agoHe might have web and app activity off, as everyone should... https://support.google.com/maps/answer/3093979?hl=en&co=GENIE.Platform%3DDesktop https://support.google.com/maps/answer/3093979?hl=en&co=GENI... Fix problems with home and work in Maps To use home and work when you search or use directions, you must turn on Web & App Activity. If you can't find home and work in Maps, learn how to turn on Web & App Activity.
- nyanpasu64 4y agoOddly enough, I do have "Web & App Activity" disabled (everything disabled except YouTube history to sync watch progress across devices), yet I'm still able to register a home address and ask the Maps Android app to route to it. ...I wish you could delete YouTube history on a 1-week basis, yet Google only allows you to delete it after 3 months at minimum. More tying.
- Tepix 4y agoThat's the juiciest data they can get, why wouldn't they?
- WheatM 4y ago
- mdp2021 4y ago> we notify people when we comply with government demands, unless we’re prohibited from doing so The interesting part here is about which cases intrinsically mandate a prohibition.
- SnowHill9902 4y agoAll of them. It’s genius corporate-speak.
- Rebelgecko 4y ago(full disclosure, I work for the Google but I think what I'm saying is equally true for Facebook, Twitter, Reddit, rsync.net, Backblaze, etc) That's not true at all. Things like FISA gag orders are relatively rare (and maybe phased out now? Haven't followed that super closely). For a typical search warrant or subpoena, the person being targeted gets an email about it. If you're familiar with "warrant canaries", they're an interesting way to track the relative frequency of unspeakable law enforcement actions.
- sneak 4y agoFISA 702 orders (PRISM) have not been phased out, but in fact scaled up. We're talking 20-50k/year.
- meepmorp 4y ago> We're talking 20-50k/year Please give a source for this. The huge range is suspect, and 702 orders aren't identical to the PRISIM program.
- sneak 4y agoApple did something like 30k per year several years ago (per their transparency report), and Google's numbers are presumably higher. Your second assertion is false.
- joemazerino 4y agoIt's nice to virtue signal for the-current-thing and all but what about Google's storage of user data for ad networks? In comparison, how is Google defending China's citizens from undue "judicial process"?
- lupire 4y agoKeeping someone out of jail is virtue doing, not virtual signalling. Google has no presence in China and so is not subject to China's judicial process.
- junofan 4y agoHuh, Google has a bunch of offices in China.
- bquest2 4y agowhere?
- jlund-molfese 4y agohttps://careers.google.com/jobs/results/?hl=en&jlo=en-US&location=China https://careers.google.com/jobs/results/?hl=en&jlo=en-US&loc... see also https://about.google/intl/en_us/locations/?region=asia-pacific https://about.google/intl/en_us/locations/?region=asia-pacif... for the actual office locations
- NateEag 4y agoVirtue signalling is about the intent behind the action, not the action itself or its results.
- joemazerino 4y agoIf that is true why do they concede to CCP demands? https://www.theverge.com/2020/5/26/21270290/youtube-deleting-comments-censorship-chinese-communist-party-ccp https://www.theverge.com/2020/5/26/21270290/youtube-deleting...
- bhk 4y agoTitle is inaccurate. They are not auto-deleting searches, but location history. Also, it isn't "health clinics", but a set of places that they are not being completely open about (but which does include some health clinics).
- lupire 4y agoTitle is incorrect and nonsensical. Google is removing health clinic visits from location history, not searches.
- deleted 4y ago[deleted]
- danuker 4y agoWanna bet it's just "marked" as deleted, and actually stored forever, to be served in response to any subpoena?
- jmole 4y agoI'll take that bet - announcements like these aren't made just for fun
- kortilla 4y agoNot for fun, but definitely for marketing.
- lotu 4y agoI'll take that bet. Google has lots of flaws but it is still has lots of people who are genuinely trying to do the right thing. I just don't see the people at Google implementing a feature like this designed to make people feel safer about their personal medical data only to turn around and betray them to law enforcement.
- robonerd 4y agoThey could have genuine intentions but still mess it up. Developers messing up secure and complete deletion of user data may be particularly likely since such deletions are not generally common practice (across the industry, not just at Google.)
- jeffbee 4y agoThat's not true at Google though. Google has a systematic user data removal architecture called Wipeout and Wipeout integration is a required checklist item for product launches. Wipeout compliance is systematically monitored by a central privacy group. I've worked at a bunch of companies and only Google has an organized, universal scheme for user data privacy. Everywhere else in my experience is just winging it and has basically no idea what's going on.
- 4y ago
- mrkramer 4y ago>Protecting our users’ privacy and securing their data is core to Google’s work. haha
- Spivak 4y agoYou can go haha all you want but the only thing it accomplishes is intentionally misunderstanding what they’re saying and then calling them hypocritical for something they didn’t say. Google’s whole thing is “better living through data organization.” You can criticize that mission up and down but it doesn’t change that for Google protecting privacy and the security of user data means protecting it from access by other people.
- car_analogy 4y agoGoogle's whole thing is selling ads and surveillance. Any impressions to the contrary is corporate PR working as designed. And that's a very cute perspective - for Google, privacy means protecting my data from access by not-Google. But that's not what it means for me.
- Spivak 4y ago> But that's not what it means for me. You made my own point back to me but in a tone that makes it sound like a refutation. Expecting Google to frame their mission of protecting user data in terms of someone who considers Google themselves a threat is uncharitable to the point of just wanting to be mad. Your stance makes no distinction between Google collecting data and keeping it between you two and just publishing it publicly.
- car_analogy 4y ago> Expecting Google to frame their mission They're not just framing their mission - they're redefining privacy. And there are plenty of companies that minimize the data they gather for exactly this reason ("considering themselves a threat", as you put it). Signal, Red Hat, Canonical, Duck Duck Go...
- Tepix 4y agoDon't be so foolish and do a health related search while logged in.
- speedgoose 4y agoWhat could be the risks if collecting such data without consent is illegal where I live?
- jacobsenscott 4y agoOnly a small fraction of people even know they are logged. Only a tiny fraction of people would know how to logout first. It would essentially render their phone unusable.
- nostromo 4y agoDon’t be so foolish to think logging out is making your query data anonymous or safe from a court order.
- trhway 4y agowhat about cell phone data? The cell providers don't seem to intend to follow, and that data is extremely telling. The abortion clinics would need their own GPS spoofers and Stingrays, so the data at all levels - Google's, cell providers', etc. - would clearly be showing location other the the clinic.
- katmannthree 4y agoThis comment shouldn't be at the bottom, they're right. An alternate read of these articles is that Google's building an automated system to identify abortion seekers, and you should ask yourself exactly how much you trust Google now and in the future. There are also other sources of location data which will not be following suit: AT&T's funding is the reason OANN exists at all (Google it if you're not already familiar). If certain justifications are motivated to prosecute this as some form of murder (which is certainly within the realm of possibility now), Google's location history having holes in it when other data sources indicate that someone's phone traveled to an abortion clinic may not work in their favor. They might be better off perturbing the precise location to something else nearby. This is basically trying to solve the fugitive state act with technology. Nice idea, but seems to seriously underestimate its adversaries
- programmer_dude 4y agoI watch in horror as this dystopian nightmare unfurls. Be strong America, this too shall pass.
- jacobsenscott 4y agoNot this time, I don't think. America had a good run though.
- candiddevmike 4y agoThis could start an interesting precedent of "protected locations" and hopefully lead to the abolishment of location history tracking that isn't managed by the user.
- ttyprintk 4y agoI wonder about persisting location info in the era of an over-state subpoena. Can I discover someone’s proximity to known locations via Apple?
- car_analogy 4y agoAs long as they keep blocking 99% of searches coming from TOR, any announcements about how much they protect privacy are a farce at best, deception at worst. They do their very best to leave us no place to hide, then carve out a few exceptions of their choosing for what they deem should be permitted activities.
- everybodyknows 4y ago>> Today, we’re announcing that if our systems identify that someone has visited one of these places, we will delete these entries from Location History soon after they visit. This change will take effect in the coming weeks. Wonderfully vague. Should be obvious to anyone that deleting merely the track within the parking lot isn't enough. Needs to be unwound far enough to give no clues. Which might be all the way back to home, both outbound and return.
- IncRnd 4y agoYour Honor, the person in question never visited Location History, so we never deleted the data. That's exactly how we said we would operate. Oops, sorry Your Honor, scratch what I just said. That was a mistake. I meant to say that our systems never identified the person as having visited any of those places, so we never deleted anything. That's exactly how we said we would operate.
- onionisafruit 4y agoThis goes both ways. It will protect somebody who vandalizes a clinic equally as well as somebody who visits the clinic for medical services.
- xxpor 4y agoPersonally as a utilitarian, that's a trade off I'm willing to make, as I would guess the latter is much more common than the former.
- solarkraft 4y ago
- Raed667 4y agoThe fact that they STILL don't see how this constant surveillance could backfire any day is beyond me! What if a country like the UAE or Hungary start asking for location data matching LGBTQ events or locations? How about political/media headquarters location data? At what point will they realize that surveillance data is radioactive, and manually patching categories will leave people at risk?
- turdit 4y ago
- seizethegdgap 4y agoWhat makes you think countries like UAE or Hungary haven't already asked Google for this information?
- Raed667 4y agoI didn't want to turn my comment in a did they already or didn't they debate. The fact that this data COULD be asked for should be enough to stop collecting it.
- shadowgovt 4y agoHonestly, Google doesn't have the luxury of that shortcut thinking. It's very "if man were meant to fly he'd have been born with wings" reasoning. The amount of good enabled by data collection far often outweighs the bad. Better to collect, use for benefit, and protect than to just say "This area of technology is forbidden to mankind." Besides, it doesn't solve the problem; countries can do their own data collection without Google.
- kornhole 4y agoGood for whom? It has surely been good for those who are collecting and distilling the data, but we can say the same for those being watched, manipulated, and worse.
- userbinator 4y agoI wonder if they'll do this for gun shops too... Recent related article: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31910724 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31910724
- userbinator 4y agoIt is quite clear the bias is showing on the ranking on this comment. Fuck Google. You are not the government yet you act like one, and one we didn't vote for.
- dang 4y agoRelated: Google will delete location history data for abortion clinic visits - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31956944 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31956944 - July 2022 (28 comments) Google will remove user location history for abortion clinic visits - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31954401 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31954401 - July 2022 (158 comments) Google will start auto-deleting abortion clinic visits from location history - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31953171 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31953171 - July 2022 (6 comments) Google urged to stop collecting phone location data before Roe vs. Wade reversal - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31509772 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31509772 - May 2022 (8 comments) Democrats urge Google to limit geo tracking to protect people seeking abortions - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31507351 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31507351 - May 2022 (6 comments) Lawmakers ask Google to stop collecting data before reversal of abortion rights - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31501871 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31501871 - May 2022 (12 comments)
- dehrmann 4y agoOn one hand, the deletion net is wide enough that it isn't just about abortion. On the other, the timing is suspect (visits to domestic violence shelters weren't sensitive last week?!), and it leaves out sensitive, legally similar (legality varies by jurisdiction) locations like brothels.
- cato_the_elder 4y agoIf location history is an important piece of evidence used by law enforcement, then this is tantamount to selective enforcement of law by the mercy of gargantuan corporations. Another step in the direction of anarcho-tyranny.
- Eddy_Viscosity2 4y agoI'd like them to automatically delete all the data they have on me, and then never collect any more.