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Sounding the alarm: How noise hurts the heart (2021)

• trentgreene 5y ago
  I just want to throw out that in ear ear plugs, applied correctly, are the reason I can sleep in a multi-person appt in SF. Serious, probably best qol improvement I’ve made
• grog454 5y ago
  Multi-pane windows. https://www.google.com/search?q=decibel+drop+from+multi+pane+window https://www.google.com/search?q=decibel+drop+from+multi+pane...
• drstewart 5y ago
  This is one of the things I struggle with the most in life. I feel like most people don't seem to care about noise pollution and zero care is put into designing living spaces or cities to minimize it. I've moved into apartments and nearly cried because I realized that there was some noise pollution that wasn't apparent when I visited it (e.g. a water boiler that ran constantly at night, road noise during the day, etc) and would have to deal with it for a year. One of the few countries I've been to that takes noise pollution seriously is Switzerland. A beautifully peaceful and quiet country.
  • The_rationalist 5y ago
  • ggm 5y ago
    When earbuds came on the market, Audiologists said "this is going to be a disaster in 20 years time" and guess what: tinnitus and high frequency hearing loss levels are through the roof. I think its to one side of your concern, but related: we truly don't socialize the needed guarding of our eardrums. It's a vicious cycle: unexpected mechanical noises stop us sleeping, leads to weight gain, diabetes, heart problems, high BP which in turn feeds tinnitus, hearing loss... I wake early for other reasons. Sunrise birdsong is lovely. But dump-truck and recycling truck noises are pretty clashy.
    • eliseumds 5y ago
      Yep, I joined the tinnitus bandwagon in the beginning of the pandemic. I was locked up at home and neighbouring dogs wouldn't shut up all day, so I resorted to earplugs and here I am now. Surprisingly I met at least 5 other people with the same problem recently, and they were all told by doctors that it was due to stress and not earplugs/headphones. I call it BS.
      • nanidin 5y ago
        Earplugs gave you tinnitus? Do you mean earbuds? Earplugs are typically hearing PPE.
        • eliseumds 5y ago
          I've done pretty much everything I could imagine to try to identify the root cause, no doctor could give a reasonable diagnosis. My tinnitus started after a night with earplugs, but it could have been a coincidence since I also used noise-cancelled Sony headphones. Who knows ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
          • Zircom 5y ago
            Not to be rude but you ascribing an equal likelihood of causing tinnitus to one night of using earplugs(which BLOCK sound from your ears) vs presumably regular/sustained use of noise cancelling headphones(which BLAST sound into your ears) borders on ridiculousness and make me think you're just trolling..
            • Izkata 5y ago
              Earplugs go into the ear similar to earbuds, but are squishy and meant to be rolled thin so you can get them in a bit further (then they decompress halfway inside your ear and fill in the gaps). If you push them in too far I imagine they can damage the eardrum, which could cause tinnitus. After trying earplugs myself a few months ago, I decided it was too risky to sleep with them due to the pressure I felt in my ear (the one against the pillow) when I lay on my side.
  • nicolas_t 5y ago
    I've learned the hard way to be very careful about noise when visiting apartments, so I'll try to ask other residents of the building I'm interested in and will do multiple visits at different time of the day to better understand how the noise situation is. Especially important now that I live in Hong Kong where a lot of apartments don't even use double pane windows.
    • drstewart 5y ago
      That'd be ideal, but in some markets that's not possible. One of the apartments in question was in SF and I literally had to put my application in <10 minutes into the showing to get the place, otherwise I wouldn't have gotten it. There's no way to do any kind of actual inspection of a unit in those circumstances.
      • nicolas_t 5y ago
        It's a bit similar in HK, what we do though is research the different buildings a few months before our lease is over. That allows us to visit units in those buildings without being pressured to make an offer and once we're seriously looking we have a much better idea of the market.
        • angled 5y ago
          In HK, the further south you go the better it seems to be… bar TST of course! I agree about the lack of double glazing here, if we ever buy, that will be one of the first things I’d try to change. I imagine Penny’s Bay is quiet!
          • nicolas_t 5y ago
            Yes, we moved to Tai Hang which is quite nice in terms of noise (much much better than Kennedy Town where we used to live). We actually get bird chirping at night and early mornings and barely any traffic noise.
  • deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  • shados 5y ago
    Not only do people not care, they actively push down and belittle people who do. They'll say it's just something that's notmaly and anyone trying to change it should move. Most source of noise pollution wouldnt be that hard to fix. Society just doesn't want to.
    • throw__away7391 5y ago
      It's because almost all the noise in the modern world is caused by cars and motorcycles, and in the United States are prioritized over all other life forms.
      • Gigachad 5y ago
        Imo it should become regulation that all cars have to have some audio transparency tech like headphones have. Then we would be able to lower the volume of emergency sirens which are obscenely loud to penetrate cars.
        • ben-schaaf 5y ago
          Massively reducing car usage is a much better solution with much more wide-spread benefits.
          • Gigachad 5y ago
            That as well. But it does feel very wrong that combustion engine users can emit huge amounts of noise and pollution while sitting in sound proof, HEPA filtered boxes.
            • jeffbee 5y ago
              The horn on automobiles should be mounted inside the cabin. They can make it as loud as they need to make it, but the person who hears it the loudest should be the driver.
              • 5y ago
  • ne0flex 5y ago
    On a somewhat related note, I've been living in NYC for the past 7 years or so. I noticed that whenever I go to visit my parents house in Canada, the lack of noise kind of stresses me out. The first few nights when I try to sleep, it's just too quiet and something feels weird.
  • ghotli 5y ago
    Sometimes out of a similar desire I will wear noise cancelling earbuds inside of noise cancelling over the ear headphones. No music no sound, pure silence. Obviously not a cheap solution but doubling up is better than any earplugs I've ever used.
    • jamiek88 5y ago
      I’ve thought about this, does it actually work? I worried there would be weird feedback issues.
      • trentgreene 5y ago
        Works great for me, also see wearing ear plugs inside of noise cancelling head phones
        • quantum_magpie 5y ago
          That's my airplane remedy!
    • lkbm 5y ago
      The first time I tried my friend's hearing protection for shooting I was absolutely amazed. I've always gone to headphones built for listening, with the noise cancellation a secondary consideration. Professional grade heading protection is really good. (MPOW HP102A is the only brand/model I personally know, but I suspect if you ask people who hunt, they'll have good recs. A quick Google search finds things with higher "Noise Reduction Rating" ratings.) For sleeping, I used the Bose QuietComfort for a long time. I'm a side-sleeper, so large headphones were a challenge.
    • everybodyknows 5y ago
      For a cheap (and zero maintenance) solution, double up plugs inside a pair of hardware store "leaf blower" headphones. Very effective, no dead-battery surprises.
  • Gigachad 5y ago
    I wish we would take car caused health impacts as serious as we did covid. We have a never ending stream of research and yet no one cares. We can’t even take action against modded motorbikes and cars which damage peoples health for zero functional gain.
    • sooheon 5y ago
      Humans fear novelty more than actual danger itself. This is also why nuclear consistently fails to gain traction while fossil fuels continue the status quo of killing millions.
    • dylan604 5y ago
      I wish we'd turn into something positve the data learned when the world shut down for a few weeks in 2020 to see how clear the air got, how quiet the neighborhoods got, how still the ground got all from the massive amounts of cars not being used.
    • Synaesthesia 5y ago
      Maybe we should have a system which looks at human needs first and tries to address them, rather than as a side effect of making profit.
    • goodpoint 5y ago
      > as serious as we did covid Is that sarcasm? Human society utterly failed at handling Covid.
    • m0llusk 5y ago
      And there have been proposals to make electric cars produce engine noises for safety. It makes sense to consider this, but making loud warning noises seems like a huge problem. This also comes up with back up beepers and garage exit activity warning buzzers.
      • pandemicsoul 5y ago
        God that shit infuriates me. I used to live downtown in a city and only realized after moving into my apartment that I was close enough to hear a crosswalk beeper nearby. Now, I know that it needs to be there for blind accessibility, but I'll never understand why it needed to beep EVERY cycle (basically every minute it would beep for 30 seconds) instead of just when someone pushed the button. It's like, how did no one who set this thing up think about all the people living nearby who'd have to listen to this incessant beeping from 6am to 10pm???
  • seattle_spring 5y ago
    People are so unbelievably disrespectful with noise in the US. Peaceful hike? Here's Katy Perry crackling out of my iPhone at full blast! Luxury apartment at $4k a month? No insulation between units, and the guy above you comes home at 2am and never takes his shoes off. Small country street? Here comes Chad with his straight-piped civic with the muffler removed!
    • gotaquestion 5y ago
      Want to go to the beach? Well here's Toby Keith on your left, Christian Radio on your right, Mariachi in front of you, and Ye behind you. I want all beaches to be public, but then I hate public beaches. meirl.
    • gonehome 5y ago
      I find by far the biggest disruption in US suburbs is lawn equipment. Suburbs are louder than cities imo because there is always a leaf blower, lawn mower, and weedwacker going at all times during the day within 100 yards of you. Often for hours. Moving from Palo Alto to SF things got way quieter.
      • Forgeties79 5y ago
        It drives me absolutely insane. I can’t record audio virtually anywhere unless I treat the hell out of the room. I shouldn’t have to turn my room into a soundproof bunker to be able to record some voiceovers. It’s ridiculous. My previous home office had spray foam insulation with double layer sheet rock and bass traps on the walls, yet I still had to have a small homemade box around the microphone when I was doing any sort of voice work that wasn’t more informal.
        • gonehome 5y ago
          Yeah - the joke is people say they move to suburbs to get 'peace and quiet' compared to a loud city, but city life is so much quieter (at least where I live). I'm sure that's not always the case, but I really hated the lawn equipment. Sure in a city a loud motorcycle may go by, but that's like 10 seconds of noise? Compared to a revving leaf blower for an hour (and usually there are a bunch of them going). They're even banned in Palo Alto, but it's not enforced.
  • Karrot_Kream 5y ago
    It all comes back to code. Noise abatement materials are not part of most residential building codes in the US because most residential buildings are expected to be single family homes with detached lots. If you don't live in that situation then tough luck. Very little effort is spent politically trying to improve quality of life in any other form of domicile. Concretely I suggest reaching out to your city council and trying to push for using more noise abating materials in code depending on the classification of residence (e.g. for dense residential.) My partner and I live in a condo run by an HOA and noise abatement material (underflooring, between walls, etc) up to certain spec is mandated by our HOA. We only hear our neighbors when they're having drywall work done in the home.
    • vegetablepotpie 5y ago
      Calling city council sounds simple. I will say that if you want to get anywhere with local policy, you either need to have money, or lots of people asking for your policy. Both of those things come from organizing, which is a months to years long effort. That’s what you’re signing up for when you want to change laws. You may get better mileage hiring a contractor, if you own a home, or talking to your property manager if you rent for upgrades to your dwelling.
  • bigDinosaur 5y ago
    It's also possible to surface roads such that cars on them are significantly quieter. This is more expensive, but you'd think it'd be done in at least some places in North American style cities. To my knowledge it really is not, although I'd be curious if anyone could tell me if it's used anywhere.
  • tropdrop 5y ago
    It was strange the article focused so much on airport noise when there is another kind of noise pollution for city residents so much more widespread – ambulances/emergency vehicles. I've lived in San Francisco for awhile (and still come back to live there some of the time), and this is the thing that I notice increases my heart rate every time I come back. In SF, they're so loud! Even late in the evening! I didn't pay too much attention to it until my grandmother (living in a different and European country) was on the phone with me one day, and hearing the alarm from a fire truck comme ambulance, she asked – what is that highly disturbing noise? I thought about it and realized she was right. The wail was very disturbing and did make my heart beat faster when I heard it. I wish San Francisco lowered the noise of the ambulances later at night. The noise ricochets off the buildings so much that I wonder if we can't introduce legislation to make the vehicles automatically lower the volume of ambulance noise used when leaving the highway. I understand it needs to be that loud on a busy freeway or LA-esque (very wide) street, but in an alley in Chinatown? Can't we consider the heart palpitations of the residents subjected to it day in day out if they live near either a hospital or a fire department?
    • brobinson 5y ago
      I wonder why they don't exclusively use the alternate low-band siren at night. I've heard it a few times in the Bay Area, but it was always in conjunction with the standard siren tone.
    • spacemadness 5y ago
      I hate how loud the sirens are in SF. Absolutely obnoxious for how dense of a city it is and there is a complete lack of noise insulation in any housing there. It’s barbaric. However, I have to thank the fire department in my old neighborhood for waiting until they were blocks away from the station before turning on their sirens. So some people are mindful at least.
  • Beltalowda 5y ago
    After months of being effectively homeless I moved in to a new place 3 weeks ago. There's this stupid air ventilation system making noise 24/7 and it's already driving me up the walls, and that's with the windows closed. It's like having a car idle outside your house all day and night. Because it's newly built I couldn't have a viewing; normally I would have just passed, but I was kinda desperate. Been trying to contact them about it for 3 weeks too. At this rate I'd rather lose the deposit than live here for a full year. Road noise a silent hum is fine, but constant "brrrr" is just ... ugh ...
    • throwaway378037 5y ago
      With you there buddy. Moved into a place at short notice because I was desperate and squeezed, only to find it is next to the plumbing for the whole building’s heating system. 24/7 noise of radiator pipes and boiler running filling the apartment. And I have the same equation: fuck this shit, not worth it, they can keep my deposit
      • Beltalowda 5y ago
        It's almost €4000 though, so quite a lot :-/ Not the kind of money I can miss at the moment, but we'll see how things are in a few months, and/or if I can convince them to do some sort of deal (although usually these type of real estate types operate according to the Rules Of Acquisition; e.g. "one you have their money, don't give it back").
  • trutannus 5y ago
    I found Iceland to be very quiet as well. Likely since there's so few people to make noise in the first place.
  • vmception 5y ago
    One of my favorite privileges is renting in coveted neighborhoods or propertied for 10-30 days just to see what its really like A “tour” or walkthrough doesn't assist with this at all
  • pastaguy1 5y ago
    This isn't exactly what you mean, but as someone who also has not a great reaction to that type of thing, i can't believe how accepted it's become to just fire up tiktok _anywhere_. I'm aware the internet and phones made noises before tiktok, but something about this app compels people to forget the sound-vironment is a shared space, it seems.
    • calvinmorrison 5y ago
      I see you're not a connoisseur of socially-inept subway phone DJ's
  • bogomipz 5y ago
    I feel like the proliferation of cheap and loud bluetooth speakers has contributed to the scourge of noise pollution significantly in the last two years. The parks are filled with them. People also seem to walk and bike around cities confident that everyone around them really wants to hear their music above all else. It's a truly bizarre and recent-ish phenomenon, and it's full-grown adults. I'm guessing the prices maybe hit a tipping point or the personal public soundtrack is now a statement? I'm at a loss for how to explain it.
    • InCityDreams 5y ago
      Years ago when boom boxes were popular i remember someone saying "It doesn't matter how cool your music is, someone thinks you're a cunt". So true, still true.
  • SpicyLemonZest 5y ago
    I don't know if it helps you, but as someone who's very annoyed by road noise, one thing I've found makes a huge difference is replacing the window stripping with as much and as thick foam as you can fit. Most apartments are built with thin stripping in the first place and routine maintenance almost never replaces it. The first time I did it, my apartment bedroom at the time went from the loudest I've ever had to the quietest I've ever had.
  • Sinidir 5y ago
    My dream is to build some kind of app to actually give a resonable noise estimate of a place and warn against potential problems. I also struggle a lot with noise pollution. Shity neighbours, random building noises in the dead of night, Buses that accelerate right in front of my window at 6 in the morning, etc.
  • dt3ft 5y ago
    I lived in Switzerland, Zurich for over 6 years and I hardly experienced the peace and quiet in this city. We had people (not a single person but entire packs of skaters) skating down our street at 2 am and that made a ton of noise. Stay away from Rigistrasse :)
  • patrickk 5y ago
    Germany too. You can find noise maps[1] with measurements for all kinds of noise, including car noise, aircraft noise, industrial noise, etc. This allows you to make a more informed decision when renting or buying a new home. In the area around Frankfurt airport (FRA) there is ongoing noise monitoring[2] to make sure that the noise doesn't constantly exceed the agreed limits. The aircraft can only fly between 6am-11pm daily, in one of Europe's busiest airports. The local residents won a court case against the airport, so they are entitled to free triple-glazed windows, and a device installed into the wall to extract CO2-heavy air from the house interior (important for sealed off bedrooms). There are restrictions on noisy activities you can do at certain hours[3], such as hoovering your place, blasting your Hi-Fi or car stereo. Initially, I thought it was overly restrictive, but it's the best way of ensuring people can live densely and not go insane from inconsiderate neighbours. Finally, apartments are generally thick concrete walls with high-quality windows and doors, both interior and exterior. Interior doors are usually solid material, with a rubber-lined bezel creating an acoustic and thermal seal between the door and the frame. I wasn't used to that before moving to Germany, it's quite impressive and definitely improves your living quality in an apartment. [1] https://laerm.hessen.de/mapapps/resources/apps/laerm/index.html?lang=en https://laerm.hessen.de/mapapps/resources/apps/laerm/index.h... [2] https://www.fraport.com/en/environment/noise-abatement.html https://www.fraport.com/en/environment/noise-abatement.html [3] https://www.german-way.com/many-kinds-of-noise-vielerlei-laerm/ https://www.german-way.com/many-kinds-of-noise-vielerlei-lae...
    • ricardobayes 5y ago
      Central Europe rocks. They are the best places for quality housing with tons of insulation and people are generally pretty respectful of each other.
    • mft_ 5y ago
      Yep. A big road near us (2-3 lanes in each direction; also a major route into a large city) recently dropped from an 80km/h limit to 60km/h - and I understand the reason is noise pollution for nearby residents.
      • bombcar 5y ago
  • lemax 5y ago
    Noise is also a big part of certain cultures/contexts though. Blanket rules around noise levels could be unfair if they don't provide a venue for noisey folks somewhere. In Brooklyn, for example, there are neighborhoods and entire buildings that revolve around loudness, inhabited by musicians, artists, and boisterous young people who stay up all hours. For example, in the McKibbin lofts in Bushwick, Brooklyn, like many buildings in the area, people are implicitly party to a social contract of accepting noise levels unacceptable to most people. If noise becomes more regulated, room must be kept for the nuances and exceptions that are culturally significant to smaller communities within larger cities. A lot of important cultural production comes out of these spaces.
    • shados 5y ago
      Noise should be zoned like construction is (ok, probably better). Some cities have intricately designed noise ordinances that account for this, but most just have some kind of blanket "After 11pm no more than 50db". Sometimes they'll add "or 5db above ambient". At my previous place, the noise ordinance was the same if you lived in a residential neighborhood in the middle of nowhere, or in the bustling middle of a commercial district. In lieu of nuances, the city enforcers would just use their own opinions and discretion on enforcement, which generally left people unhappy on both side. Just have "loud" parts of town and "quiet" parts of town. Then people can live where it suits them. Enforce it appropriately (so if someone live in the loud part and bitch about noise, tell them to move. If someone is loud in the quiet part, fine the shit out of them). Though generally "quiet" areas get gentrified, and prices rise a lot, because they are far more in demand from people with more money (read: older and/or privileged), so I guess that wouldn't work so well.
  • vihren 5y ago
    I have the same problem. I have recently moved to Switzerland and I am so grateful for the culture here. Noise is not tolerated, as it should be.
    • Foobar8568 5y ago
      If only, it really depends where you live. We have an alarm going on any times during the day and night, police is not interested and agency doesn't care much. Same problem with skaters when it's sunny. No really, people just don't care. Swiss german might be different tho.
  • cjbgkagh 5y ago
    Some people are more noise intolerant than others so normal people may not be as bothered by noise. I have a genetic mutation, a form of hEDS, which has a high degree of noise intolerance. It’s unfortunate for me that housing bubble has made it so expensive to buy and soundproof a place. I keep waiting for the market to deflate and it keeps not happening. Dogs are the worst for me. I don’t know how other people can sleep through that. Drives me nuts. I have thought seriously about moving to Switzerland.
  • seer 5y ago
    I think you'll be very interested in the "Not Just Bikes" channel as he talks a lot about urban planing. There's a lot of political will and momentum for making living spaces ... livable in Europe. Places like The Netherlands and Denmark in particular. A video specifically about noise pollution and how European cities are trying to solve it - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CTV-wwszGw8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CTV-wwszGw8
  • brainzap 5y ago
    hearing decreases or changes with age (see story on children and handdryer)
  • sampo 5y ago
    > Switzerland. A beautifully peaceful and quiet country. I visited a research institute in Garmish, Southern Germany. The building was next to a cow pasture, and all cows had really loud cowbells, constant noise even with windows closed. Does this happen in Switzerland, too?
  • bingohbangoh 5y ago
    Lithuania is also spectacularly quiet
  • newbamboo 5y ago
    “would have to deal with it for a year.” Who can afford to move every year with rent inflation at 25 yoy? Clearly you aren’t living in the gilded state with its luxurious rent control provisions.
  • throwaway378037 5y ago
    For what it’s worth I empathise so deeply with you here. I have what I believe is referred to as sensory processing disorder, or hypersensitivity, but I would call normal and reasonable noise-caused stress. At my last address I struggled with helicopters hovering overhead all day. I just moved into a new place and have building plumbing running 24/7 next to my flat. Over time I’ve accustomed to wearing either NC headphones or earplugs every hour of the day, but it just upsets me so much to have to do that. Yet nobody takes it seriously and I’m considered ‘weird’, or told that I’ll ‘get used to it’. Well, I don’t. I’ve taken to using float tanks for occasional hours of total silence and I’m once again looking for a new place to live, and considering leaving to go live in a cabin in the woods or something..
  • hinkley 5y ago
    We occasionally talk here about when it's appropriate to abort an interview cycle early, and the most recent anecdote I have is walking into a place with a ridiculously loud ventilation system that was bad enough that I could feel it affecting my ability to think. I ended up phoning in about half of that interview and felt guilty for wasting their time. Something I've noticed about real estate agents and especially leasing agents is that they tend to try to keep the conversation up, and in an empty house that can be a couple decibels louder than normal conversation. If you have a partner, take them with you and collude so that the more sensitive person can escape to the other end of the space and just listen. If you are single, take a friend who is 'helping you' house/apartment hunt and use them as a meat shield. Something I keep saying I'll do and never actually do is take a day off and just be in the neighborhood outside, because some places are quiet during business hours and a cacophony during rush hour or due to night life.
• throw_me_up 5y ago
  Anyone know where the map image in the article is from? I'd love an interactive map of noise pollution.
  • h4waii 5y ago
    https://maps.dot.gov/BTS/NationalTransportationNoiseMap/ https://maps.dot.gov/BTS/NationalTransportationNoiseMap/
  • deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
• TaupeRanger 5y ago
  More informative and accurate title: noise worsens sleep, which can have many bad health effects
• sammalloy 5y ago
  > road noise during the day My understanding is that the vast majority of road noise is caused by vehicles outfitted with non-standard tires. Where I live, 90% of the road noise is caused by lifted trucks using massive off-road tires on local roads and highways. It isn’t clear if this against the law all over the country, but in various US states, the police will issue tickets. There are several employees of local businesses who commute nearby and wake up the neighborhood when they go to work and when they return with the sound of their huge off-road tires getting on and off the highway. I’ve driven next to them on the highway several times and the noise is deafening. I can’t see how this is allowed. Next time I drive past them, I will run the NIOSH SLM app and record the decibels.
  • kfarr 5y ago
    Yes, and same with modified exhaust systems and mufflers.
    • causality0 5y ago
      As well as motorcycles and noisy diesel trucks.
    • goodpoint 5y ago
      I heard that in US some people pollute more on purpose and call it "coal rolling". Is it the same crowd with modified exhaust? Are they increasing the noise on purpose?
      • grvdrm 5y ago
        Coal rolling is the most disgusting and obnoxious behavior
      • mastercheif 5y ago
        Yes. They’re IRL anti-social trolls looking to maximize the number of people they can piss off. They look for loopholes in the “social contract” of what behavior they can get away with without facing serious consequence. If loud car exhausts were aggressively policed they wouldn’t bother. As it stands, police departments view it as a “we have better things to do” offense and these trolls take advantage of it.
• arthurcolle 5y ago
  I moved to Miami in October of last year and holy shit some people have no respect for personal noise emissions. People in Lambos deliberately revving their engines for no reason other than flexing decibel levels, others in motorcycles doing the same thing - it is truly insane. That, combined with airplanes flying into and out of MIA really make it a fundamentally noisy place to live. I imagine it even causes issues with local ecosystems that are equally or even more susceptible to disturbances due to loud sounds. Need to move to North Beach or something away from the crowds... lol
• paisawalla 5y ago
  If we in CA could achieve compliance with the already standing laws against loud exhaust to anywhere near the levels we have with, say, plastic straw riddance, the resulting benefit to society would be drastically superior. I can't think of anything with a lower cost/benefit ratio than just the wholesale confiscation and ban of Harleys.
  • everybodyknows 5y ago
    A generation or so ago vehicle noise laws actually were enforced in California, and now it seems they effectively are not. No obvious technology change behind it, rather somehow the will to enforce has eroded, and/or the burden of proof has shifted away from the perps.
    • tayo42 5y ago
      I think it's attitude. Being loud is rude, but some how also calling others out in their rude behavior is more rude so you can't do it.
      • scruple 5y ago
        I really want to know what this phenomenon is. I have seen and personally experienced it quite a few times. It's pretty insane.
    • refurb 5y ago
      Laws in general in California aren't enforced much these days, but that seems to be true across North America.
    • zip1234 5y ago
      Enforcement of almost all driving offenses is next to nonexistent in the US. Need more automated enforcement in my opinion.
      • Plasmoid 5y ago
        Sadly, Oakland has decided to stop enforcing any traffic rules. This has resulted in incredibly dangerous streets where actively malicious drivers terrorize everyone nearby.
• cameronh90 5y ago
  I haven't read the underlying studies but I wonder if this applies to consistent noise or just intermittent sounds, like the airplanes and railway line examples they focus on. Personally I can't sleep in a quiet room, so I put on white noise generator plus usually music or podcasts. I find that subjectively I sleep better with some relaxing sounds. However, it could be possible that my brain isn't properly turning off and I'm just unaware of it. Their possible explanation is that the brain is waking up to process whether a sound is dangerous, which makes sense for intermittent sounds, but you would imagine we're adapted to sleep properly in the presence of semi-intermittent/constant sounds which would be normal in nature.
  • wildrhythms 5y ago
    I bought an "acoustic white noise generator" which is effectively just a small fan in an overlapping enclosure that you can rotate to find a pleasant tone, and it has been a game-changer for my sleep.
  • Gigachad 5y ago
    I don’t find that I am bothered by constant noises. I have an air purifier in my room and find the constant fan noise to be not disruptive at all. It probably even drowns out the outside noises a little.
  • powersnail 5y ago
    I think it depends on how loud the noise is. I live in an apartment where 2 out of 5 days, someone steam wash their carpet, which means a van would park outside the building, making a loud, constant, humming noise for an hour. I can't nap to it; I can't work with it; it's as disruptive as leaf blowers and explosive-driven motorcycles. At some volume, we just don't adapt to it anymore.
    • cameronh90 5y ago
      I'm not sure where you live but I found when I traveled to the USA, I was appalled at the level of noise disturbances you put up with. For reference, I live on one of the busiest roads in London, so I'm not particularly noise sensitive. But in the USA, it was just constant sound everywhere I went. Cars honking when unlocked, multiple sirens within earshot most of the time I was in any large city, people leaving their cars to "warm up" on their driveway, leaf blowers, shouting. It's constant, all hours of the night. In London, we still very much aren't a 24/7 city. At around 11pm the traffic really dies off and most people are on their way to bed. You still get the odd lorry or ambulance, but even ambulances don't run their siren unless necessary.
• QuikAccount 5y ago
  Anecdata but I recently got headphones with noise cancelling and my quality of life shot through the roof. According to my smartwatch, my heart rate is lower and stress levels are down. Unfortunately, I have to take my headphones off to go to sleep and I'm immediately reminded of the shoddy fridge in my apartment, vent noises, and my neighbor who doesn't realize it's 11:30 PM.
  • primitiveape 5y ago
    I was able to sleep with bose noise cancelling earbuds
  • victor9000 5y ago
    Earplugs can help if you want something less bulky when you sleep
    • drdeadringer 5y ago
      On top of that, if anybody knows of similar for folks who sleep on their side I would like suggestions//insight.
      • dinkleberg 5y ago
        I’m a side sleeper and have slept with ear plugs in for nearly the past decade (hard for me to sleep without them now). I currently use Mack’s ear plugs, but I imagine they are pretty much all the same. Just look for some foam ones. The first couple of times it feels strange, but you get used to it quickly.
        • throwaway378037 5y ago
          Mack’s are amazing! I only just discovered them recently
      • malthaus 5y ago
        i'm a side sleeper who could never use plugs until i found those (not affiliated): https://www.happyearsearplugs.com https://www.happyearsearplugs.com they advertise heavily but for me it's the only ones that dont bother me when im turning at night and they hold forever.
• gotaquestion 5y ago
  Anyone who has ever lived next to someone with a barking dog knows how the spikes of adrenaline at random times of the day and night can raise stress levels significantly.
  • victor9000 5y ago
    I had this problem before and a handnote to the neighbor did the trick. It turns out they were keeping their dog crate next to the window for entertainment, but in reality it was stressing the dog out, because he could see all the people walking past on the sidewalk. They relocated the crate and the problem was solved. And if direct engagement leads you nowhere then I would reach out to the landlord.
    • wantlotsofcurry 5y ago
      This sadly only works when your neighbors aren't outright assholes and only using their dogs as protection and to scare people from their house.
    • zabzonk 5y ago
      > dog crate sorry, what is that?
      • mechanical_bear 5y ago
        A little home for your dog within your home. It helps them feel secure and that they have a space that is their own.
        • zabzonk 5y ago
          So, a kennel? Forgive me, I am not a dog person, though I quite like my cleaning ladys little doggie.
          • chaps 5y ago
            Some dogs love them for their feeling of security, some dogs hate them because they feel confined.
• fennecs 5y ago
  • kQq9oHeAz6wLLS 5y ago
  • andai 5y ago
    Perhaps if you and others who feel the same way would form your own communities around these common values, you could experience the lifestyle you prefer without it being forced on others. (Alternatively, you may enjoy living in Europe, most cities here you don't even need a car. I get along fine with a bicycle!)
    • ben-schaaf 5y ago
      In a lot of places it's strictly illegal to build car-free places. Minimum parking requirements, strict euclidean zoning, etc. The car-free or low-car places that do exist are hideously expensive due to high demand. If anything the car lifestyle is being forced on people.
      • Tade0 5y ago
        > The car-free or low-car places that do exist are hideously expensive due to high demand. If anything the car lifestyle is being forced on people. There's an additional component to this and I've seen it play out over the years in my area: cars, having a relatively unpredictable route comparing to public transport serve as a counterweight against rising real estate prices. Of course over the years you often pay the difference (and more) in fuel costs and maintenance, but at least here that's not what drives (heh) people into the suburbs - it's the ineligibility for a mortgage on anything other than a tiny apartment.
• Sciz0r 5y ago
  there's a muscle called the tensor tympani the way I learned conscious control was through yawning. this muscle can be strengthened then can protect from hearing damage.
  • unrealp 5y ago
    Can this be learned? i see that on hearing loud noise there is a reflex that uses this muscle to protect the ear. Can one learn to do this consciously?
    • jbjorge 5y ago
      I discovered that I could control it in my teens. I rather opt for earplugs - the muscle gets tired as all other muscles during use, and the amount of dampening is negligible in my case.
    • somebodynew 5y ago
      I learned to consciously control this after reading about the reflex years ago. The easiest way to "find" the muscle is to swallow slowly and pay attention to the feeling in your ear canals. Most people naturally use these muscles slightly when chewing or swallowing. I can hold it for several seconds before it starts to feel like an exertion. You'll know that you've got it when you can voluntarily hold a quivering/vibrating sensation in the ear along with external sound dampening. It is not a substitute for earplugs around dangerous sounds and you cannot hold it for hours to block out the sound of an airplane engine. The only time I ever had a practical use for this was when I heard someone leaving a movie theater start to discuss what was obviously about to be a major spoiler with their friend as I was entering. The utility there comes purely from it being socially unacceptable to interrupt a stranger or suddenly cover your ears, while nobody else can see if you're using your tensor tympani.
• deleted 5y ago
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• jmugan 5y ago
  Why do we still have the beep, beep, beep when trucks back up? We have backup cameras now. Everyone within half a mile is continually alerted that there's a truck backing up or a piece of construction equipment moving.
  • reidjs 5y ago
    This is one noise that I’m absolutely ok with them keeping for safety reasons.
    • gretch 5y ago
      But like is it actually keeping anyone safe? If we disabled that noise across the board, would ppl actually die from being backed into by big trucks?
    • mellavora 5y ago
      I'm all for worker safety, but I'd like to see evidence that this beeping is actually an effective measure vs a less annoying sound or the use of back-up cameras?? Seriously, where is the evidence of accidents avoided? Vs other measures? side note: had to live next to a construction site for 2 years. The beeping started in the morning at sunrise and ran for 12 hours straight. And I'm wondering what it is like for construction workers; for the noise to provide a safety measure, they would have to pay attention to it. But that means it can't be a constant. Which it is.
  • ornornor 5y ago
    There is a version that does kssssh kssssh kssssh instead. It’s a lot less obnoxious but not standard yet so only a few trucks have it. It’s much nicer.
    • reom_tobit 5y ago
      I forget where I’ve heard this so sorry in advance for the unsourced claim, but I think white noise is much better for humans to place in space. Higher frequency beeps can bounce around much more than a broad spectrum white noise blast. Anecdotally they tend to travel much less, and generally be less annoying too. I can hear a beeping truck from ages away in my flat, but not once have I thought “god I wish that kssh kssh would stop”.
• jmugan 5y ago
  And helicopters, those are incredibly loud. I don't understand why we allow non-emergency trips in those things.
  • throwaway378037 5y ago
    I had them hovering overhead when I lived in the city centre for many hours every day, just going in circles low over the city, sometimes even at 3am. It was so depressing. Hardly slept at all those years
• ab-dm 5y ago
  I recently worked through a bout of stress induced sleep onset insomnia, which my sleep psych suspects was triggered by a series of sleep interruptions over 3 years from horrendous neighbors in the last few years (a party that started at 3 am apparently was what broke the camels back) It took me a month of CBT to break the back of it, and everything is (mostly) back to normal now, but it just blows my mind how insensitive people are to those around them. I just don't understand it.
  • wildrhythms 5y ago
    Call me an authoritarian, but 'bad apartment etiquette' is one area where I wish there was a social credit score to impact.
    • deleted 5y ago
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• zabzonk 5y ago
  > One of the few countries I've been to that takes noise pollution seriously is Switzerland Not in my experience. From my rented flat overlooking Geneva, when I was working there as a consultant, I used to get the (happy) screams of the kids in the school next door, the thump of heavy metal from the next flat, the whine of aircraft coming in to the airport and the clank of rubbish going down the waste disposal system. All in all, I would rate it noisier than my flat in Wood Green, North London.
  • ornornor 5y ago
    The difference in my experience is that sundays are quiet days all day and people respect that (even glass recycling drop offs are “closed” on sundays). And if you report noise to the police, it will be investigated and dealt with in my experience. But yes car noise is a big problem here in my opinion, not to mention gas leaf blowers. And cigarette smoke. Everywhere. That’s such a shame for a country where we think “mountain pure air” which has in reality an ashtray smell everywhere you go.
• triggercut 5y ago
  I did some research on this as part of my undergrad in the early 00's I skimmed the article but it seems to align with the literature back then. The thinking was during our evolution that high volume low frequency sounds would represent a precursor to mortal danger (avalanches, earthquakes, stampedes, thunder, wind) so we were attuned to secreting stress hormones in early response. Unfortunately, much of our urban built-environment is full of (human-made) constant low-frequency sources, although we appear to have adapted to a degree (HVAC systems in buildings, traffic, industrial process plants, airports and air traffic, explosions, concerts). What isn't mentioned here, that I remember finding particularly concerning, was that while we seem to adapt, it's over our own time, as children we secrete more cortisol to low frequency noise than when we are adults... maybe some form of long term CBT I don't know. I have no idea where my old paper is but I remember (and someone with more time might want to check/confirm this) one important study showed cortisol levels of children at schools close to Heathrow compared to out in the UK countryside and how this affected standardised testing. There were limitations, and of course you had to control for a range of factors, socio-economic, teaching staff etc, but there was some measurable negative effect (again no idea if this was repeated/corroborated). The actual research I was doing was into our auditory perception of urban spaces. We took recordings of various urban settings and had participants listen and rate their emotional responses, if it felt "hot" or "cold" (and other adjective pairs), we also had them draw something to represent what they were listening too. Our "findings" were pretty limited for a short undergrad project but it was interesting how we generally appreciate background chatter and live-music and generally fearful and cold from large flat surface reflected sound (empty city plazas).
  • triggercut 5y ago
    I got curious and tried to find the original but I think might be: Haines, M. M., Stansfeld, S. A., Job, R. F. S., Berglund, B., &Head, J. (2001a). Chronic aircraft noise exposure, stress responses, mental health and cognitive performance in school children. Psychological Medicine 31, 265-277. And features in a brief meta analysis which some may find interesting: Matheson, M., et al. "The effects of chronic aircraft noise exposure on children's cognition and health : 3 field studies." Noise and Health, vol. 5, no. 19, Apr.-June 2003. Gale OneFile: Health and Medicine, link.gale.com/apps/doc/A164796669/HRCA?u=googlescholar&sid=bookmark-HRCA&xid=afd7e60c. Accessed 11 Apr. 2022. [https://go.gale.com/ps/i.do?p=HRCA&u=googlescholar&id=GALE|A164796669&v=2.1&it=r&sid=HRCA&asid=afd7e60c https://go.gale.com/ps/i.do?p=HRCA&u=googlescholar&id=GALE|A...]
• irjustin 5y ago
  I'm not in a super quite place - apartment building so we will still hear neighbors occasionally - dragging chairs, kids running back and forth (nothing unreasonable). One that that's helped a lot for us is white noise, good earplugs, and eye cover. Since adopting this 4+ yrs ago I've not even thought about the neighborhood at night. I do wonder if white noise can be considered a stressor, but personally I believe I've had a lot better sleep.
• zaptheimpaler 5y ago
  Highly recommend getting awesome noise cancelling headphones if you’re sensitive to it, i looove mine (Sony WH1000XM4s) and basically wear them all day. They even do a decent job at low frequency cancellation.
  • _ink_ 5y ago
    I have the XM3, but these are producing quite some whitenoise when they do not play something while noise cancelling is active. Would you say that is true for the XM4 as well?
    • jbjorge 5y ago
      I have the WF XM4 (earplugs) - they have no white noise when not playing. They are garbage for phone-calls though, so wouldn't recommend them if you plan on using the mic.
    • zaptheimpaler 5y ago
      A tiny bit yeah, but less than others i've tried so far.
• 71a54xd 5y ago
  This is why I left New York City. For some reason, being inside / covid lockdowns did something to my head and now I'm super sensitive to noise. Prior, I lived in Boston for six years generally in very loud (third to fifth floor) apartments with reasonable amounts of street / city noise. Oddly, for a time it actually calmed my ADHD and distracted me enough that I felt I could focus. Initially I was lucky and had a great deal on a 26th floor apt in Hell's Kitchen with decent roommates - something clicked a few years later and I could no longer stand roommate noise (kitchen / dishes / gaming past midnight) and / or late night garbage collection / horns at all hours. I had enough, moved to CO. Have my own space - it's quiet and I get measurably better sleep. Does this make me feel old at 27 - yes. Do I care - no.
  • vanilla_nut 5y ago
    Where in Colorado? I previously lived in NYC, moved to Denver. Noise was much much better here during 2020, but vehicle noise has gotten awful this year. Well, that and all of the people who drive around without catalytic converters because they've been stolen...
  • axolotlgod 5y ago
    Man, I'm right there with you. I'm 26, and feel like none of my friends care about these things. I am quite sensitive when it comes to input like light and sound, and I would love to live in a quieter place than the city I do now. Everyone wants to be around stimulation and novelty when they are young, and I used to understand, the pandemic has sort of shifted my priorities I feel. Part of getting older, I guess.
  • geenew 5y ago
    I think the same thing has happened to me. I’ve lived in the same apartment for a few years. Pre Covid I did notice noise, but it never rose to the level of a problem. Now, I cannot stand the noise from the refrigerator, the baseboards heaters, or some loud neighbours, and am moving in large part to get a quieter place. Something about being stuck in a place for however long lockdown lasted has changed what were minor annoyances into major stress inducers. My pet theory is that we have a certain level of tolerance that is worn down and replenished in normal, free-movement circumstances. Forced subjection to annoyances simply wears down any tolerance that exists, and once that is gone it is hard to get it back. That, or simply the mental categorization of the noises changed from something we voluntarily endure to a kind of punishment.
• 1270018080 5y ago
  One liner I always think about: Cities aren't loud, cars are loud.
• todotask 5y ago
  At some point for a few weeks and months, there is a strong vibration in my whole block and my entire floor for 24 hours, it's a terrible nights that I couldn't sleep.
• nayuki 5y ago
  I don't know what to do about airplanes, but I want to see cities be designed to rely much less on motor vehicles. "Cities Aren't Loud: Cars Are Loud" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CTV-wwszGw8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CTV-wwszGw8 "The Suburban Traffic Contradiction" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dqQw05Mr63E https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dqQw05Mr63E
  • ornornor 5y ago
    I remember very vividly these couple days a year where Toronto would close some of its main streets for the day and people could go out, bike, meet each other, and activity for kids were organized in the street. It was lovely and I remember being so surprised you could actually hear the birds like in the woods! Any other day it was so loud it could be difficult to even talk to each other (not to mention the stench) And yet it was a major struggle to keep this happening every year with people and counselors fighting the event organizers every single year because how are we ever going to survive without our cars for 12h on a weekend once a year? Same city where I couldn’t get anyone to do anything about the garbage trucks picking up and loudly banging metal trash containers at 3am. Fuck this noise (literally), I’m never living in a city again.
• thisistheend123 5y ago
  No one here has mentioned the most horrific noise that has come into existence only a few years ago. I am talking about apps like Facebook, Instagram suddenly playing sound of a video at full blast when it scrolls into view in a feed. God I hate these apps and this thing called smartphone that has taken over our lives. Fuck all this modern shit. We should have never come out of the caves.
  • hans1729 5y ago
    Then just don’t use those apps? I don’t, and nobody above 30 in my circle does. No need stay in caves, just adapt some culture.
    • thisistheend123 5y ago
      I don't do, but can't stop my spouse sitting beside me from doing that ... Hence the problem .. :-)
      • quickthrower2 5y ago
        I hear you! Literally. And its the first 4 or 8 bars of a song (usually a modern cover or remix of older song) on a loop. It is waterboarding for the ears.
  • AngryData 5y ago
    Autoplay videos themselves need to stop being a thing.
• DantesKite 5y ago
  I live next to a car alarm that randomly goes off every day. It definitely stresses me out and an important factor for where I'll live next.
• bogomipz 5y ago
  Relatedly, I was surprised that the noise radar that went up in Paris a couple of months ago didn't get more attention. see: https://www.nytimes.com/2022/02/21/world/europe/france-street-noise.html https://www.nytimes.com/2022/02/21/world/europe/france-stree... and https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/paris-inaugurates-its-first-noise-radar-bid-quieten-its-streets-2022-02-14/ https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/paris-inaugurates-its-f...
• vishnugupta 5y ago
  This is obvious to those (like me) who get stressed out with excessive noise. Despite having born and brought up in India I could never get used to constant white noise. It stresses me out like crazy. I realised the value of silence the first night in Netherlands. I could physically feel heart go down and mental peace. They take noise levels seriously and it shows! Edit: Details.
  • zachrip 5y ago
    I moved to Amsterdam last year, it's been great for a lot of reasons except one: When we moved, it was during lockdown. We checked out the place and we knew it was in a touristy place but it's not too bad. One thing we didn't realize is the small, unassuming cafe turns into a night club Thursday-Sunday and plays extremely loud music until 4am. When we initially moved, they couldn't because of lockdown. We asked the makelaar if there was any noise we should be aware of, he just mentioned that the area is near tourist heavy spots but didn't mention anything else. Now I have to sleep across the apartment on the couch just to partially escape the noise. I'm so tired. I have to endure 7 more months of this before I can leave to a quieter place, going to do much more investigating for the next move and hopefully find peace.
    • dunefox 5y ago
      Try good nc headphones, they might help.
• punnerud 5y ago
  This is a good report that specify how to measure the link between noise and heart/health: https://www.rivm.nl/bibliotheek/rapporten/2018-0121.pdf https://www.rivm.nl/bibliotheek/rapporten/2018-0121.pdf EU now require every large train, road and air traffic change to use this guide. Short version: 1) Gather data from health records on the number of people that can be affected by noise by the change 2) Use this is the calculations for the new noise levels for the alternatives proposed 3) This calculations have to be made public, and you have to stay under certain noise levels
• malthaus 5y ago
  As someone with very high noise sensitivity - yes, please more focus on this topic. It's really tough to deal with and "just meditate" etc doesn't cut it as advice.
• ramyarjahani 5y ago
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• thewileyone 5y ago
  Open-space offices are annoying for this reason and noise-cancelling headphones are a requirement for sanity.
• jl6 5y ago
  Makes me wonder what kind of society would grow in a designated low-noise city. Electric cars only, no dogs, no lawnmowers, no amplified music after 9pm... no kids? Probably a society rife with purity spirals.
  • lnsru 5y ago
    Think about the one in the movie Equilibrium. You need to suppress somehow the the need to be an asshole with lawnmower or untrained dog. Or with a masculine motorcycle with super loud exhaust. Or listen too loud to some tasteless music.
• deleted 5y ago
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• thallukrish 5y ago
  Wrote this during the lockdown. https://thallukrish.medium.com/noise-and-well-being-a9f0b30d55a6 https://thallukrish.medium.com/noise-and-well-being-a9f0b30d...
• lynguist 5y ago
  Sometimes I put on noise canceling headphones when I go out to the street to block traffic noise as it increases my heart rate. I’m also mocked for it. When I need to sleep near a road with traffic I can only with ear wax. The worst are motorcycles.
  • tinco 5y ago
    I did earwax for a couple years, but after a while it started to gum up my ear canals and I'd have to clean them, and my canals got irritated every once in a while. I switched to silicone now, they're about as good and none of the problems. They stay clean for longer and hold quite well.
• beebeepka 5y ago
  Cars, and now when it's warmer, motorcycles. It's incredible how nothing is being done to motherfuckes emitting 10 times the noise of a packed bus. In fact, it's celebrated. How is it fair to allow a single piece of shit to emit orders of magnitude more noise than hundreds of people combined. I complain about it all the time but almost nobody else seems to care. I love motorcycles but I do loathe the majority of riders as they are well beyond inconsiderate. They will do almost anything to emit more noise.
  • globular-toast 5y ago
    I went on a nice walk in the Peak District in England a few weeks ago when we had nice weather. The worst thing was the sound of cars and motorcycles everywhere. And not just the occasional one passing by. They would pollute an entire valley with their noise for hours at a time. I reckon everyone within a 10 mile radius would be affected. I'm just trying to enjoy what's left of nature and it's like I'm at a race track.
• langsoul-com 5y ago
  I think Tom Scott did a video in UK with an area created to absorb airplane noise. The topic of noise pollution from wind turbines also seems similar.
• zeristor 5y ago
  New York’s war on noise over the last 100 years: https://archive.nytimes.com/www.nytimes.com/interactive/2013/07/13/nyregion/nyc-noise-timeline.html https://archive.nytimes.com/www.nytimes.com/interactive/2013...
• code51 5y ago
  Logically, shouldn't there also be a study taking a look at heart problems and blood pressure levels in people with congenital deafness? We would then be able to separate the effect of noise vs. life stress. Surely, for any study about stress, socioeconomic status should also be a factor.
• _ink_ 5y ago
  From my own observations, I have the feeling that noise is not very good to me. In the sense that it increases my blood pressure significantly and also puts stress on me. Is it possible to verify that somehow? Like are there devices that measure blood pressure and/or stress hormones frequent and accurate enough to see the effect?
• pgt 5y ago
  I spent a year working on an automatic volume control product[^1], but this smells of correlation...noise ~ heart damage? The most polluted and stressful places are also the noisiest. And what causes the noise? Burning of jet fuel and hydrocarbons. Leaf blowers are also some of the dirtiest burning engines ever invented. [^1]: https://wallfly.webflow.io/ https://wallfly.webflow.io/
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• anon134567dfer 5y ago
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• amin 5y ago
  I can recommend active noise cancelling headphones. Whichever one you can afford, buy it. I do not travel without it.
• mkl95 5y ago
  I live in one of the loudest areas in the planet. I'm not exaggerating when I say without my noise cancelling headphones I would barely be able to do my job. It is also one of the main reasons I don't see myself working on site again.
  • jml7c5 5y ago
    Are you able to say where? You've piqued my curiosity.
• throwaway0a5e 5y ago
  These comments just reaffirm my decision to live by a state highway intersection and within ear/nose distance of major industrial facilities on the side of a hill in an area where use of jake brakes isn't prohibited. Noise pollution will kill me a hell of a lot slower than living near people care about these sorts of things. The people who give a fuck about the obsessive lawn guy and his leaf blower or the teenager with his obnoxious exhaust tend to also give a lot of fucks about a lot of other "niceness" things that would cost me a lot of money and frustration to conform to.
• andersco 5y ago
  The sharp beeping sound made by trucks backing up, and now also basically any type of construction vehicle when it moves, is in my opinion one of the great examples of a ham-handed solution to addressing a safety issue with no regard for noise pollution. While it is supposed to warn someone in the immediate vicinity of the vehicle, I can after hear these sharp alarm-like sounds over a block away, often inside my apartment with the windows closed, where I obviously am in no danger of this vehicle. If only a bit if thought had been put into the design of this, such as having a directed sound (a physical bell?) that is clearly audible in the immediate vicinity but does not radiate long distances. What is most frustrating to me is that it seems there is no one you can complain to, no one you can point to and say please fix this, as it obviously is based on some regulatory requirement. If only those who design these type of noise-making devices would be required to also consider noise pollution. And don't even get me started on car alarms...
  • DoughnutHole 5y ago
    Improved reversal sounds have been invented - the classic beep isn't just bad from a noise pollution perspective, it's also an artificial sound that's difficult for people to process and determine its point of origin. There's been a gradual rollout of white-noise reversal beepers, which while they might seem strange are easier for people to locate aurally - as a result they can be played at a lower volume, and even if it was played just as loud is a much less unpleasant tone. Of course it'll probably be many years before old-school beepers are phased out. Tom Scott video for reference: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fa28lIGuxq8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fa28lIGuxq8
    • andersco 5y ago
      Thanks for sharing that video. The white noise solution is a huge improvement over the sharp beeps. I looked into if there is any movement in the US re requiring the white noise option but all I found was this non-committal response from OSHA: https://www.osha.gov/laws-regs/standardinterpretations/2004-05-27-0 https://www.osha.gov/laws-regs/standardinterpretations/2004-...
    • cjrp 5y ago
• msrenee 5y ago
  The article is pretty good. I feel like they danced around the issue that it's noise while you're trying to sleep that seems to do most of the damage. Also, just wanted to point out this gem: "Children in loud, loud places like East Oakland are the ones who grow up saying, ‘Can I ax you a question?’" Which someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't believe that that's how that word developed linguistically. It's my understanding that "ask" pronounced "ax" has been around and popped up from time-to-time in a lot of the English-speaking world. It was seen in England pretty far back, but I don't have an exact date or location off the top of my head. I don't think there's any evidence that it's caused by noisy environments. The woman talking about her million dollar house and having to unplug her husband when he menaces their neighbors with his own leaf-blower seems like the sort of person that would be fun to chat with. Just my kind of sense of humor.
• skizm 5y ago
  This is why airpod pros or similar noise cancelling headphones are worth their weight in gold. After having them in a city environment for more than a week, I realized I'd gladly pay north of $1k for them. If I lose them I will instantly go into a physical Apple store and buy a new pair so I'm not without them for even a day. I can't go back to the normal city noise levels every again. I don't even have music or anything playing most of the time. They also serve the dual purpose of avoiding talking with strangers or panhandlers.
  • suyjuris 5y ago
    I always have earmuffs on my desk, they are great when something noise is happening outside and I need to concentrate. Also cheap. > This is why airpod pros or similar noise cancelling headphones are worth their weight in gold. In case anyone else was wondering: the weight in gold is about 500$.
• boredumb 5y ago
  It's hard to take noise pollution seriously when you so much as read the comments here after reading and agreeing with much of the article. Yes I believe living under an airport to be detrimental to anyone's sanity, but yet it devolves quickly into an agoraphobic hand wringing competition going from city sirens, to cars in general, to the neighbors dog barking sporadically. There are prices to pay for living in city centers, suburbs versus living in the woods away from society entirely. We exchange a tranquil peace of living in a shack in Montana vs living in SF/NYC/etc/etc and making more money and all the conveniences that come with living in these cities. What I gather out of a lot of HN comments about noise pollution is a spectrum of desire to be isolated from humans while living in metropolitan areas all the way to being upset that the neighbors kid drives a shitty car or they hate the sounds of animals fighting and barking.
  • gameswithgo 5y ago
  • cheschire 5y ago
    I've noticed that my reaction to other people's noises differs significantly depending on the type of noise. If my neighbor is renovating at 10pm because she's a single mom trying to flip a house while also working 2 jobs, I turn on a noise generator in solidarity. If that same neighbor starts listening to music with too much bass, my initial reaction is more negative until I realize I may be creating noise too when I'm yelling at video games or sports and she may not appreciate hearing that. I believe a strong sense of community is the missing link in a lot of these stories. Understanding is typically a necessary step before acceptance, and most of us don't have the time or take the time to establish that understanding. The world is so busy these days, and our time so filled by all forms of electronics, the only time we run into each other anymore is if we happen to be working on our gardens at similar times.
  • scythe 5y ago
    People don't move to cities for "conveniences". They do so because it's necessary for their livelihood. It's also dramatically better for the environment and economy for people to live in denser settings. Life shouldn't be so miserable, and the idea that the city is an ~aesthetic~ rather than a necessity needs to die as soon as possible.
• ones_and_zeros 5y ago
  I live on a very busy road that sees >15,000 vehicles/day, including 18 wheelers, dump trucks, busses, tankers etc. It is noisy (nevermind the air pollution) from 5:30 AM to 10:30 PM and I don't think local officials really appreciate it. I'd like to capture data, I'd even pay for it, but all of the "sound level" measuring devices are all junky and don't give accurate readings and don't store the data really well. I'm happy to pay for the right device or even better some certified service that can take measurements and create reports but I'm lost here. Any advice?
• deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
• bigblind 5y ago
  I've always wondered why there's not more R&D going into making power tools quieter, and I wonder if a "sound tax" on products could incentivize it. When selling any item that makes noise, where the noise isn't the intended result of the item (so it doesn't count for, say, speakers), you'd pay a small fee for each db over 70db, or some other level, determined to cause hearing loss, or noise pollution in a somewhat large area.
• swayvil 5y ago
  Maybe we need anti-noise insurgency in our cities. Find the noise. Smash it. Dash. Masked batmans on bikes. All it needs is to become popular. A cool name and logo. A marketing campaign. That would silence cities quick Use the social media. Encrypted text...
• dimitrios1 5y ago
  It's why the monks go to live in caves.
• jraby3 5y ago
  I tried a walking meditation on the Sam Harris Waking Up app while in a shopping mall. It is incredible the amount of background noise and lights that are there all vying for your attention. The human mind does an incredible job of blocking it out. I really couldn’t wait to be around some nature after that experience.
• chiefalchemist 5y ago
  Noise all the time. Light all the time. Both of these are counter to human living until recently. These physical stresses, plus an infinite number of low level chemical stresses and the progress of modern life feels underwhelming. That said, I have a "weekend home" in Vermont. It's dark. It's quiet. Guests, as well as myself, sleep extra well. Noticeably well.
• bittercynic 5y ago
  This is one of the top reasons for preferring single-family detached housing. I lived in apartments for many years, and when I moved to a house I felt like I could finally relax for the first time in years. For the people advocating for high density housing to alleviate suburban sprawl and all of its environmental problems, I do appreciate the importance of that, but if I can avoid living in an apartment again I am willing to go to almost any amount of trouble to do that.
  • spacexsucks 5y ago
    I feel so much relaxed cranking up the volume when i need to once in a while and not get complaints, which are fair, but i get home from work after 9. And you got ta sleep but i gotta wind down. Counter, i dont want the noise from upstairs doing god knows what. I moved out to detached and the only noise is the leaf blowers and occassional traffic
    • bittercynic 5y ago
      Ya, I forgot about that! It's great to be able to turn up the music without bothering anyone. In the apartments I couldn't really listen to music loud enough to fully enjoy it, but in the house I've tried turning it up to the highest volume I like to listen and went outside to check - I could hardly hear it 10 feet outside, and the neighbors are a bit farther than that. It's hard to overstate how beneficial it is to have a little space.
      • homonculus1 5y ago
        Having your own space that doesn't overlap with complete strangers is just essential to a life of dignity. Mankind wasn't made to live in a hive.
  • spixy 5y ago
    From provided links, 33% of US population is exposed to >70 dBA whereas only 20% of EU population is exposed to >65 dBA noises, and US average density < EU average density. So from this small resaearch I conclude there are better solutions than single-family housing. Like subways in cities, it makes zero noise but it needs population density. And more bikepaths, more walkable streets, less car lanes.
• kingcharles 5y ago
  One of the things I felt caused enormous stress when I was in jail was the ceaseless incredible intensity of the noise. The noise was so loud most of the time that with the TV set to 100% volume it still could not be heard from 1 foot away with your hands cupped behind your ears to focus the sound (a common jail technique to watch TV). I always wondered what damage it was doing, beyond the obvious damage to my hearing. [try setting your TV to 100% volume, put on the news, and sit a foot away and think how loud the surrounding noise has to be for you not to be able to hear the TV at all]
• btbuildem 5y ago
  For those who do find unnecessary, thoughtless noise unbearable, you might enjoy the movie Noise: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=87pHHFMtVE4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=87pHHFMtVE4
• meristohm 5y ago
  Relevant book: One square inch of silence : one man's search for natural silence in a noisy world, by Gordon Hempton https://www.worldcat.org/title/one-square-inch-of-silence-one-mans-search-for-natural-silence-in-a-noisy-world/ https://www.worldcat.org/title/one-square-inch-of-silence-on...
• blocks110 5y ago
  Turiment