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Nvidia Unveils 144-Core Grace CPU Superchip
- MrYellowP 5y agoWow! 144 cores combined with the power of ARM assembly ................ This is amazing! What a game changer! The software rendered demos one could code on this thing! I want one! :D
- KennyBlanken 5y ago
- Nicksil 5y agohttps://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=false&query=nvidia%20grace&sort=byDate&type=story https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=false&qu...
- reitzensteinm 5y agoOne thing I've long wondered is whether Nvidia would make a CPU and price it very aggressively, just to weaken Intel and AMD. Commoditize your complements. If you kill the x86 monopoly, CUDA could easily be the last proprietary lock in for general purpose compute. Not a bad place to be.
- ChuckNorris89 5y agoWe already have cheap comodity ARM chips, it's called the Raspberry PI . It didn't make much of a dent in the X86 market. It's a niche of it's own in the consumer tinkerer and industrial embedded devices, but desktop computing is a tough market to crack, as explained by Linus Torvalds. Having (non-Apple) ARM assault the X86 ecosystem will take a lot of out of the box thinking and, most importantly, cooperation for standardization amongst the HW vendors for open standards, which is exactly what Nvidia doesn't like to do, as they always prefer the locked down ecosystem approach, contrary to the openness that lead the comodization and popularity of the IBM PC clones.
- adventured 5y ago> We already have cheap comodity ARM chips, it's called the Raspberry PI . No we don't, and no it's not. At least not as far as the mass consumer is concerned. Show me where a consumer can walk into Best Buy and purchase a PC with a decently powerful and inexpensive ARM processor powering it in place of Intel or AMD. That's something that Nvidia can actually make happen given its resources. The organization behind the Raspberry PI is microscopic by comparison, they have no resources to manage such an enormous consumer front (not even remotely close in fact). Your premise about the Raspberry PI is like techies on HN pretending that there's no need for x y z product/service, because you can just run your own social network on a machine in your closet at home, you can just run your own file server, you can just run your own mail server. No, consumers are never going to do that en masse. And consumers are never going to lean on the Raspberry PI to assemble their own machines either in massive quantities; that has to be a comprehensive, packaged product sold to them via retail that they plug in and use with zero assembly or hands-on customization required. It has to be relatively inexpensive and powerful enough to undercut and compete with what Intel and AMD bring to the table. Raspberry PI isn't even in the discussion.
- einpoklum 5y agoWhile I agree that Raspberry PI is not the same being able to buy PCs with an ARM chip - I must say you are over-reaching with your argument. Have a look at: https://www.raspberrypi.com/products/raspberry-pi-400/ https://www.raspberrypi.com/products/raspberry-pi-400/ this is a small PC, fitting inside a keyboard, based on the Raspberry PI. No assembly needed other than connecting it to peripherals - but that's like any other PC. Other than the keyboard housing it, it comes with a mouse and a PSU. It costs 100 USD and available from many vendors around the world, e.g.: https://chicagodist.com/products/raspberry-pi-400-kit?src=raspberrypi https://chicagodist.com/products/raspberry-pi-400-kit?src=ra...
- liamwestray 5y agoUhh. The ARM-based M1 Mac mini is literally sold at Best Buy for under $700. It will run circles around any desktop PC within the same price range. And yes, the Raspberry Pi 4/400 is perfectly usable for general desktop computing for students. The default desktop OS is intuitive and it includes modern browsers, can watch Netflix/Disney+ DRM media, and run LibreOffice or WPS Office. Similarly, the Pine64 Pinebook Pro is actually quite serviceable for general desktop use at < $250, but you can also buy a $999 M1 MacBook Air at Best Buy if your needs cannot be satisfied by sub $250 computers.
- ip26 5y agoAt the cost of developing & manufacturing a competitive chip, would that make sense? I mean, if developing that chip takes half your opex, can you just give up margin on so much of your spend?
- reitzensteinm 5y agoI don't think something like Graviton would come close to half their opex. Ampere, linked elsewhere, made a competitive chip with just half a billion in total funding, and most of that was to scale up after the prototypes were built. Who knows, though. Nvidia's R&D expenses skyrocketed over the last five years and maybe Grace is a large part of it.
- downrightmike 5y agoProbably why they wanted to buy ARM and got shut down.
- mlindner 5y agoThey can make their own ARM chip without buying ARM.
- urthor 5y agoWell as we have seen, NVIDIA probably has got a killer ARM chip in the lab for release in 24 months.
- perfopt 5y agoThey have tried and failed - Tegra
- terafo 5y agoIt failed in a tablet (which isn't that big outside of iPads to begin with TBH) and smartphone markets, but Tegra X1 chip is incredibly successful. Nintendo sold more than a 100 million of their Switch consoles, and they all are powered by Nvidia Tegra. And they never tried to do a full desktop chip.
- htk 5y agoSeems to be a great fit for Genetic Programming.
- The_rationalist 5y agoAsking the real question here: will Nintendo use those Grace CPUs for the Switch successor?
- my123 5y agoGrace is a very big Tegra, it's just not intended for that. NVIDIA has small Tegra chips too, with the Jetson Nano next coming next year. That might use the same SoC as an upcoming Switch. (and Orin/Atlan as more medium-sized Tegra)
- chockchocschoir 5y agoThe doesn't seem very rational, Nintendo doesn't aim for prettiest graphics or best hardware, they aim for best family friendly game experience, without focusing on graphics or hardware. The Switch prove that their strategy works out as well, so they are unlikely to suddenly change tactics. PlayStation and Xbox do aim for best graphics with the best hardware though, so they are more likely to go with this than anyone else.
- The_rationalist 5y agoYes that was their strategy up to now, but they are increasingly obscolete. Nintendo is stuck in the past, the Switch (2017) has games with lower visuals than the PS3 (2006). (I believe the switch CPU to be on par or superior but the GPU to be noticeably inferior) People are tasting the incredible graphics of the PS5 and in contrast the switch is irrelevant. I agree that games can be fun without needing realistic graphisms however for maximizing fun a PS4 level performance is the bare minimum.
- detaro 5y agoNot really seeing it, the switch is targeting and reaching a lot of people who won't buy Playstations. A next-gen Switch with better performance wouldn't need to compete head-to-head with the Playstation on visuals either to be successful. (Given you rank Switch below PS3, if visuals were so important, shouldn't Switch have been handily beaten even by the PS4?)
- fulafel 5y agoSeems the 1.5x vs EPYC claim is from SPECrate_2017_int_base benchmark.
- hrgiger 5y agoafaik that bench still widely used but the epyc rome they mentioned is zen 2. As i understand it is still slightly faster than milan series but the power consumption is half of it. Here is benchmark result of 7713p https://www.spec.org/cpu2017/results/res2021q4/cpu2017-20210927-29554.html https://www.spec.org/cpu2017/results/res2021q4/cpu2017-20210...
- ip26 5y agoIt seems like 2P Milan would be the suitable comparison, based on core count, wattage, CXL link, and so on.
- hrgiger 5y agoyou are right here 7763 result searchable when selecting processor 870ish in general, btw CXL not there yet https://www.spec.org/cgi-bin/osgresults?conf=cpu2017 https://www.spec.org/cgi-bin/osgresults?conf=cpu2017
- TooKool4This 5y agoAND it seems to be based on a simulation which can be fudged in all sorts of ways. Nvidia’s track record with cpus is spotty at best. Not sure how much weight to put on these claims, at least until there is a shipping product. > Nvidia based this claim on a pre-silicon simulation that predicts the Grace CPU at a score of 740+ (370 per chip).
- fb03 5y agoHow far are we from just having very nice and power efficient arm computers and laptops? I don't care about the X86 legacy, if I want something there I can simply buy a machine with that processor. I just want a beefy ATX form factor PC or even a laptop with "standard components" that can run Linux and maybe some light office work or gaming. Is this asking too much? Why are we still using X86 on the !OSX stuff?
- phyalow 5y agoM1 arm64 Macbooks exist and are incredible.
- pjmlp 5y agoFor those that happen to live in first world countries or have the luck to have their employer sponsor their work laptops.
- XCSme 5y agoAn M1 Macbook Air is 900euros, not a lot more than a similar specs Windows laptop.
- pjmlp 5y agoMost people are just fine with a 300 euro Windows laptop. 900 euros can be several months of salary in less fortunate countries.
- XCSme 5y agoI understand, but in that case I don't think we should compare/expect state of the art technology and build quality in that price range (unless there are specific discounts/incentives for those regions). I think that the point of your initial comment was not related to the subject, which was more about the performance part than the pricing part.
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- petra 5y agoWhat kind of benefits would using large amount of HBM3 memory would have on the Grace CPU ? How big of an improvement in common tasks ? Or is it just an overkill for a CPU, in general ? Have they solved the "Memory Wall" for CPU's with their current implementation ?
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- mirekrusin 5y agoHow do they know that it's going to be the fastest chip in one year? Frankly announcing anything about chip that (maybe?) will appear in one year is a bit... too far in the future, no?
- wmf 5y agoPrevious discussion from 4 days ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30768704 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30768704
- moralestapia 5y agoIt feels like the age of "personal" supercomputers is coming now :D!
- grecy 5y agoI will be very interesting to see what Apple come up with for the MacPro...
- agumonkey 5y agoDid they hire Chuck Moore ?