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Australia Mourns the End of Its Car Manufacturing Industry
- tinbad 9y agoInteresting detail is that the, for American market created, Chevrolet SS was basically a rebadged Holden Commodore built in Australia. Together with the Dodge Charger, it was the "cheapest bang per buck" performance sedan with a V8. Although the Charger still for sale, the Chevy SS died with the closure of that plant making the 17' model year it's last.
- sp332 9y agoI got really confused for a minute because I confused the Holden Commodore with the Hudson Commodore! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hudson_Commodore https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hudson_Commodore
- okreallywtf 9y agoAnother great story from NYT in a similar vein that does a great job (I think) of humanizing all of the people involved: https://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/14/us/union-jobs-mexico-rexnord.html https://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/14/us/union-jobs-mexico-rexn... This is a tough issue for me because I consider myself a liberal, and in theory I am OK with globalization but it obviously has negatively impacted many economies in similar ways. I want to be pro-globalization but to me you really only have two (vastly simplified) options: 1. Be more isolationist or micromanage global trade to maintain your own industries even though they can't compete globally. 2. Find a way to make globalization benefit everyone, not just the owners of companies who can cut costs and increase profits. This most likely means some kind of universal income and large education investment and vocational training built on top of the profits of globalization. We appear to be moving towards #1 and I'm afraid we'll all suffer as a result. My biggest issue with globalization is that, while it makes sense in theory, in practice most of the "efficiencies" come from dirt cheap labor due to exchange rates, poor workers rights and working conditions, and lack of environmental regulations (among others). Not because other countries have developed better ways to make things better or faster, they can just abuse their workers in a way they can't here. You would think we would all benefit in some ways even if we're just consumers by cheaper goods, but are they really cheaper or cheap enough to offset the reduction in good jobs? Does anyone know of some good data-sources for the prices of consumer goods vs household income over time? My guess is our purchasing power has gone down in general for the middle-class. I can see honestly how this issue has given rise to nationalism in America, I somehow hoped that people would see that isolationism is not the answer and we instead need to rethink our economic model. Somehow Americans have been sold (among many other things) that something like universal income is a handout. I'm afraid we'll take the route that the UK is moving towards of being poorer overall and reducing globalization out of spite without it actually benefiting us. I feel like as a liberal in America I live in a game of political jenga. Want to stop abortions? We can only do it in a way that doesn't involve decent sex ed or contraceptives (which leads to personal responsibility). Want to prevent gun massacres? We can only do it in a way that doesn't restrict access to guns at all and doesn't cost any money (which leads to more personal responsibility). Want to help out those impacted by globalization or those who have never been on sound economic footing? We can only do that in ways that don't involve wealth redistribution (which pretty much means personal responsibility of people to despite the fact that that already happens in many ways (so we're left with more personal responsibility and people like Shannon are responsible for a late-in-life pivot to a new job with anemic vocational assistance). A lot of the people that have been hurt by globalization are the same people that support the party in our system that has taken most of the solutions to our problems totally of the table. We're in a straightjacket and could get out any of 10 ways but those would involve tools, all of which are (claimed to be) morally/philosophically unacceptable. I know this was a rant but its been stewing since I read the first NYT article and this one just compounds it.
- jopsen 9y agoAutomation probably eleminated most of the jobs. Globalization just removed the few remaining jobs. In the US you don't need universal income. Universal healthcare and free education would be massive wealth redistribution programs. In fact, the ACA (ObamaCare) for all it's flaws still is a wealth redistribution program. So if you fix your political system, it could happen...
- deleted 9y ago[deleted]
- okreallywtf 9y agoAgreed, for that matter a progressive tax system and government services are a wealth redistribution system (which is why its so insulting and infuriating when the right says "thats wealth redistribution!!" when any solution is proposed.
- snarf21 9y agoGlobalization is definitely a challenge but #1 isn't a long term solution either. Even in the US, companies moved from Detroit to Kentucky just for cheaper labor. The other point is that these jobs would have been automated even quicker if it were not for globalization. Look at how much automated welding happens on these assembly lines even 10 or 20 years ago. I agree we don't yet have a good plan on how to give people access good jobs globally. I think it is just going to be a challenge until we can get automation to a really high level and power costs super low with solar so things don't really cost. Then UBI and service jobs (if you want them) might work. Very interesting to contemplate though..
- okreallywtf 9y agoAgreed, I realize now it seems like I think its an actual solution, I think it is what some people think is a solution but I don't think it will actually work. The only solution I see is a stronger social safety net that can allow the entire population to be more flexible and respond to changes in the workforce. As it is, if you happen to pick the wrong job in the wrong part of the country, you could invest a lot in something you have no control over when it leaves. That being said, people also need to get over the idea of having a forver factory job, I understand and empathize with people who suffer as a result but culturally we've got to get over it and take care of each other and move on (I think).
- georgeecollins 9y agoThe Chevy SS is a great car for the price, but most people in the US would mistake it for an Impala. In California I think the reputation of a car is more important than the actual performance.
- nradov 9y agoWhich is logical, because traffic here is so bad that regardless of how powerful your car is you can't drive any faster than the jerk hogging the road in front of you. So why pay more for a Chevy SS?
- cag_ii 9y agoWhere is "here" for you? California is a big state, and outside some major cities traffic is not the issue you make it out to be. CA also has world class roads for enthusiasts.
- vinay427 9y agoAlong with mostly great weather that doesn't rust cars and regulations that allow lane splitting for motorcycles.
- bluedino 9y agoIt’s supposed to be a low profile vehicle
- georgeecollins 9y agoThat's why they sell it in orange and purple paint..?
- verytrivial 9y agoCan we at least get a [paywall] tag on these posts? Edit: Down votes. Really? I give up.
- T2_t2 9y agohttps://www.google.com.au/search?q=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.nytimes.com%2F2017%2F10%2F20%2Fworld%2Faustralia%2Fholden-automaker-factory-closes.html&oq=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.nytimes.com%2F2017%2F10%2F20%2Fworld%2Faustralia%2Fholden-automaker-factory-closes.html&gs_l=psy-ab.3...1929.2063.0.2664.2.2.0.0.0.0.171.171.0j1.1.0....0...1.1.64.psy-ab..1.0.0....0.2TDAn0Z5IqY https://www.google.com.au/search?q=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.nytimes... click the link from google.
- imron 9y agoIt's not paywalled. Just turn on cookies.
- verytrivial 9y agoI don't turn off cookies.
- amyjess 9y agoRight click, 'Copy link address', ctrl-shift-N, ctrl-L, ctrl-V, enter. Make sure to ctrl-W when you're done.
- verytrivial 9y agoThanks.
- PhantomGremlin 9y agoIn the many years the NYT has had its most recent firewall I have never been blocked. My secret: Firefox: clear history when Firefox closes (including clearing cookies and cache). Also NoScript: no JS allowed on NYT website For real laughs, an earlier incarnation of NYT paywall allowed access to everything except for the editorials. Wow. Talk about tone deaf. If there's anything from the NYT I would pay for it would be to block all their editorials.
- Overtonwindow 9y agoI've always wanted a Holden Ute. Shame they couldn't find a way to keep it in Australia.
- dzhiurgis 9y ago> Ute oh god why?
- dariusjs 9y agoA changing taste, competition from European cars and more disposable income is what killed this off. They’re really fun cars I will miss them.
- tallblondeguy 9y agoI studied abroad in Melbourne in 2008 and it's crazy to see this happen. I guess I left a few months before the GM bailouts got started in the United States and the whole recession kicked off after that. It was really neat to see a uniquely Aussie car culture that felt really vibrant. I loved that El Caminos and Rancheros, long gone in the US, were alive and well as Holden and Ford Falcon Utes. It was neat that Toyota had its own Camry-ish car, called the Aurion, made in Australia. It was neat that Pontiac in the US was getting the Commodore, which was a great-looking car. Even though it was still Ford, GM, and Toyota on some corporate level, they had their own unique thing that I was able to discover while I was there.
- danieltillett 9y agoAurion is not quite a Camry-ish car - it is a bit more up market and more importantly came with a much more powerful engine. The Aurion was probably the best car ever made in Australia, although it was never a great success.
- jpatokal 9y agoAussie here: Good riddance. This country is at the end of Earth in terms of supply chains and export markets, has a small local market and has extremely high labor costs -- all in all, a terrible place to build the kind of megafactory you need to stay competitive these days. The only reason they managed to survive even this long is massive government subsidies, and I applaud the fact that the government had the guts to finally pull the plug. All that said, the transition away is going to have a high human cost, particularly in Adelaide which just doesn't have a whole lot else going economically. But my wife used to work for a Ford supplier in Melbourne, and that city has managed to absorb Ford's shutdown a few years ago without too much pain. (Nearby Geelong, though, had both the main factory and a steel mill, and is having a harder time.)
- megablast 9y agoI agree good riddance, but for a different reason. I hope we can start to move towards smart cities, and getting rid of cars. It is ridiculous the reliance on cars that people in cities have.
- bdamm 9y agoIt's almost too obvious but... cars aren't going away, mate.
- ferentchak 9y agoFor example the v8 interceptor will outlive all those so called "smart cities"
- stephenr 9y ago... have you ever been to Australia? It's a big fucking place with fuck all people (compared to a lot of the rest of the developed world). The solution to society's problems is not "all get rid of our cars and live in shoe boxes 1 minute walk away from each other".
- _kyran 9y ago
- stephenr 9y agoThis is hardly surprising when you know a little local history. For reference: I grew up in Adelaide, about 15-20 minutes drive (15 km.. erm 9.3 miles for you lot) from the suburb where the Holden factory is located. I remember as a student/early graduate (so, 2000 - 2003ish) having.. acquaintances who were in their early 20's, bringing home close to $AUD100K/year, for assembling commodores. People who would laugh about how funny it is to let a car leave the production line, with the wrong colour door handle fitted. Another "acquaintance" took forever to get a resolution because his 2-door ute was delivered to him with a 20cm gap in the carpet on the passenger side. It went through the factory, through QA, through a DEALER and nobody fucking noticed a 20cm gap on the passenger side of the floor. These were not high quality cars being built by well trained craftsmen. They weren't even average quality cars built by moderately trained craftsmen. They were pieces of shit slapped together by over paid idiots.
- deleted 9y ago[deleted]
- noddy1 9y agoThe typical young Australian male is a pretty special breed - lazy, entitled, willfully ignorant and undereducated - the result of having it too good for too long. I would never buy a car built by these overpaid idiots when I could get a japanese or south korean car.
- crispinb 9y agoYou've been unsurprisingly downvoted, but there's some truth to what you say, as long as 'typical' is parsed as 'stereotypical' rather than something more mathematical. Anyone who has spent any time in Australia knows the type well. My guess however is that the stereotype represents a shrinking proportion of actual Aussie males, though they're still there. We all have our own selection bias of course, but in my experience young Australian men are a pretty big improvement on their bald barrel-shaped shock-jock-addled beer-guzzling 4WDing [poofter/boong/woman/asian/tree/whatever]-hating coal-loving fathers who so despoil the Australian suburban landscape.
- billforsternz 9y agoI was reading a piece lamenting that Australia was leaving a club of only "8 other nations" where a car could go all the way from conception to mass manufacture. I will track the source down precisely if anyone expresses interest. So I started mentally listing the 8 countries: US, Japan, Germany, South Korea, China, UK, France, Italy. But surely also Sweden? India? Brazil? Spain? Eight seems low to me.
- abrowne 9y ago- Sweden: Volvo is Chinese-owned now and Saab is gone, I think, at least for now. - Spain: Is there anything other than SEAT, which is part of VW? - Brazil: I think they assemble a lot of cars, but I don't think I've heard of a local company, despite there being an Brazilian aircraft maker. OTOH, Tata Motors Cars would make India count, right?
- jpatokal 9y agoMalaysia probably also qualifies, although the local cars (Proton, Perodua) are crap.
- inferiorhuman 9y agoProton, at least, was exclusively a purveyor of badge engineered cars up until pretty recently.
- deleted 9y ago[deleted]
- billforsternz 9y agoForeign ownership doesn't disqualify since Australia was in the club until yesterday. I admit Brazil was a stretch on my part (basically I thought Brazil should be a member without any precise knowledge of how they're a member)
- nikcub 9y agoSweden is the smallest nation in the world still doing end-to-end car manufacturing. Australia was the second smallest. The difference is Sweden sells cars all over the world, and in Australia despite decades of attempts and popular Top Gear segments they could never convince anybody else to buy an Australian car
- gaius 9y agoThe Aussie economic model - export bulk raw materials to China, buy manufactured products back - is a curious inversion of the old British Empire economy. And it's one that is not even remotely viable over the long term. Countries whose only source of wealth is raw materials get eaten alive by manufacturing economies, then left to rot when the mines are exhausted. There is a ton of historical precedent.
- dalbasal 9y agoI don't think it's an inversion. The British Empire got materials from far off places like australia in exchange for manufactured goods, made in the centres of civilization where all the people are. You don't see Norway making stuff, you need more people (or less minerals) for that.
- jpatokal 9y agoThe sheer scale of Australia means that they're not about to get exhausted anytime soon though. Only something on the order of 1% of the continent has even been prospected yet.
- wycx 9y agoFrom where are you getting the 1% figure?
- drodgers 9y agoThe best data I could find is here: http://www.ga.gov.au/scientific-topics/minerals/mineral-resources/iron-ore#heading-1 http://www.ga.gov.au/scientific-topics/minerals/mineral-reso... That document lists 51GT of 'accessible economically demonstrated' iron ore, with an production rate of 0.81GT per annum, and 86GT of inferred resources (ie. yet-to-be-prospected). So there's at least half a century of ore left, even if production ramps-up steadily. 1% prospected doesn't seem supportable though; it's more in the range of 50% based on the ratio of the inferred to known figures above.
- nikcub 9y ago
- chadcmulligan 9y ago> said it was the workers over 50 that were particularly struggling to find new employment I always think it should say - there are some workers who've been cruising for 30 or so years and picking up a pay packet without reskilling. They probably won't be able to get a job without spending a bit of time learning some marketable skills
- jaimex2 9y agoFun fact: The Chevy Bolt was designed at the Holden plant, kind of poetic that they designed an EV as the industry here came to a close.
- ClassyJacket 9y agoAnd it was never sold in Australia :(
- quicklime 9y agoI used to work at Toyota in Australia, which also shut down recently. A lot of people here are saying this is about quality, but it's really about profitability. Australia's economy is heavily dependent on mining, and China's economic growth created a local mining boom. This resulted in heavy demand for Australian dollars, and at its peak in 2013 1 AUD was worth about 1.05 USD. It was at this time that Ford (the weakest of the three Australian manufacturers) made the decision to close its Australian manufacturing operations. The high value of the local currency meant the factory was unprofitable and uncompetitive with other factories around the world. The conservative government at the time, led by Tony Abbott, refused to provide subsidies to help close the gap (even temporarily). Toyota and GM Holden had similar problems, and all knew that the local automotive parts suppliers needed at least three companies to sell to. So once Ford was out, the supply chain for parts became unsustainable, and the others quickly announced that they would pull out too. It takes time to close an entire industry, which is why all three companies closed their factories in 2017. Around 2015 the slowdown in China's growth led to a slowdown in Australia's mining industry, and a drop in the AUD. It dropped to around 0.80 USD, and interestingly, Australia's car manufacturers became quite profitable again. But the wheels were already in motion and the decisions couldn't be reversed. Australia's mining industry has bought in a lot of money, but its impact on the dollar has done a lot of damage to the country's export economy. There's a term that economists use to describe this: Dutch disease. Australia has a bad case of it. Edit: s/80 USD/0.80 USD/
- emmelaich 9y ago> The conservative government at the time, led by Tony Abbott, refused to provide subsidies to help close the gap (even temporarily). It's not as if we didn't try to transition the industry to success. This Button plan was by a Labor government. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Button_car_plan https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Button_car_plan
- nl 9y agoI'm glad someone wrote this. The posts about low quality are just continuing stereotypes, and the data shows the opposite. Look at the ratings for any Australian built cars that were exported or sold in Australia, and they do really well. The thing about long supply routes is wrong too. Mass freight is just so cheap that location doesn't matter. The exchange rate killed the industry. $A1 bought $US0.5 in 2000, and $1.05 in 2013. Hard to export competitively when that happens. OTOH we did avoid mass unemployment during the financial crisis, and the economy even kept growing so I guess that is the upside.
- Jedd 9y agoHolden - better known as GMH or GM Holden - where the GM stands for General Motors, a famous US-based company that bought Holden in the 1930's. The other 'famously Australian' car manufacturer is Ford. Indeed. The kinds of (Australian) people that find cars interesting tend to polarise between these two manufacturers, adopting the beliefs that it's patriotic, and that it can be economic to produce (in most cases components were built overseas but assembled within AU) cars in Australia. A country with breathtakingly high labour costs, small population, and low population density. Specifically a relatively small market, container shipping costs flatten out across the country. That the designs of allegedly Australian cars, even recently, have focused on ICE sedans hasn't helped, though that presumably ties in with the nostalgia aspect for potential consumers of those types of vehicles. The Monthly published[1] an exquisitely written article middle of last year, describing the history of the Australian car industry, and the self-sabotage exhibited. It's a depressingly sober read. [1] https://www.themonthly.com.au/issue/2016/may/1462024800/richard-denniss/crunch-time https://www.themonthly.com.au/issue/2016/may/1462024800/rich...
- adrianratnapala 9y agoDing-dong the witch is dead!
- dbuder 9y agoAustralia isn't big enough to have a car manu, it has been a ridiculous politically driven process and was promised to have ended over a decade ago after one of many payoffs. We paid subsidies in excess of the total wages etc of the people employed in the industry and built cars which were sold cheaper oseas than they were here. Good riddance.
- duncan_bayne 9y agoNot all Australians. I'm glad my taxes won't be used to prop up yet another company that's "too big to fail".
- aaron695 9y agoInteresting to see how much was expensive energy costs. Australia has tonnes of gas but unlike USA has not transformed that to cheap energy and the industries that come with it.
- yuhong 9y agoWhat is fun is how if there is an oversupply of say lithium, the demand for electric cars can restore demand. If the dollar collapses though for example, it will take until car loans are restored before there are any demand.
- Ice_cream_suit 9y agoThey were just seriously bad cars with a poor reputation and worse resale value. It got to the stage where when buying cars, people I knew would check the VINs to ensure that they were not made in Australia. Fords made in Australia were particularly bad. Toyotas made in Australia were not up to the standards of the Japanese built Toyotas, but were far better than the pieces of rubbish turned out by the Australian subsidaries of American firms. Driving one of the US branded cars, was like having a big sign saying " I am a bogan" Australian slang for chav / redneck
- rdlecler1 9y agoWe asssule that protectionism is bad because the consumer has to pay a higher price when those goods are not optimally produced. The irony is that less local consumption = less local labor, reducing competition for labor and pushing down pricing power. But the second aspect of this that doesn’t often get talked about is quality. If making a 65” TV in the US is going to cost twice as much as when it’s made in China then I as the consumer will just by a cheaper TV — probably spending the same amount of money I would have. We can often buy cheaper substitutes with the same functional properties.
- dis-sys 9y agoSome facts not mentioned by the news article: 1. Australian federal and state government spent billions to save the car industry. AUD$2.7 billion tax payer's hard earned $ was spent between 2001-2013. 2. Unions asked for huge pay rises every single year. For example, in 2011, they forced car manufacturers to provide 18.3% pay rise in 3 years, that is 6% a year non-stop for 3 years. 3. Car makers were forced to continue to provide pay rises when they were weighting the decision whether to shut down their production in Australia. Take a look at the following The Australian article, you'd probably feel happy that you don't have such unions screwing local economy in your country. http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/pay-rises-at-stressed-holden/news-story/d3cb0cba03b227ef28ce35ac0bbcfae0 http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/pay-rises-a... Australian is an unique country, a ticket inspector makes $100k AUD a year ($80K USD) from his/her unskilled job. With such background in mind, it is not hard to imagine how much you need to pay those workers to build cars.
- bingobob 9y agoHolden (GM) killed themself by building cars no one wanted anymore as the Australian iconic car has 6-cylinder engines and some maybe 8 cylinder. Australian government couldn't subsidise cars that where losing sales year on year to smaller cheaper to run cars. GM just wanted the handouts to keep it running when that dry up they pull the pin John Cadogan is a bloke that called the end of the Australian Car Manufacturing many years ago and has a great video on why it died here. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_uFYW5tMoeg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_uFYW5tMoeg
- yitchelle 9y agoJust remember that at its height, Australia had at least 5 car manufacturer. We had Nissan, Chrysler, Mitsubishi, Ford, Toyota and Ford. Now we have nothing. I was with a Tier 1 supplier in Australia before transferring to Germany, the market place is so different. Looking back, it's a wonder that it actually lasted this long.