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Why some US restaurants are banning tips
- deadbabe 1mo agoRetail stores should also ban tips.
- hombre_fatal 1mo agoIt's insane how it takes advantage of good people who feel like they're doing something wrong for hitting "no tip" in settings where nobody was asked to tip just 5-10 years ago.
- quchen 1mo agoOn the other hand, lots of people have the liberating experience of discovering that "no tip" is a sensible default to press, and from then on we're out of the tipping game. Bots don't guilt trip me anymore, hooray!
- deadbabe 1mo agoFlip the script, you're a greedy ASSHOLE for asking people to tip in this economy! Now it becomes easier to hit 0 tip. Even try negative tip, some devices allow this bug.
- ginko 1mo agoTipping in stores is a thing now?
- thinkharderdev 1mo agoIt is pretty common to be prompted to tip by the PoS system in any place you can buy made-to-order food. This includes stores that are normal retail stores but also have some sort of made-to-order food. Like a fancy wine shop or gourmet food store that also sells sandwiches. But this isn't really a new phenomenon either. It's just that there used to be a tip jar sitting by the register, but now the PoS system prompts you because nobody carries cash anymore.
- venzaspa 1mo agoWhy would you tip at a retail store?
- phreeza 1mo agoNext also include sales tax in label prices.
- daef 1mo agowelcome to europe, where tips are optional and sales tax is denoted
- YeahThisIsMe 1mo agoTips are optional everywhere, but the reactions to not receiving one will be different.
- ajsnigrutin 1mo agoSomehow the "tip culture" is spreading over here too, especially in touristy areas, even the POS terminals now ask you for a tip.
- arjie 1mo agoInteresting. What POS terminals are common there? I am curious about culture spreading through technology defaults and wonder if it's effectively driven by whatever Square chose and whomever else decided to ape the incumbent or whatever.
- ajsnigrutin 1mo agoThere's a bunch of them, but the tip offers are usually on the newer touchscreen (probably android based) ones. The old ones (never seen the tip option on those... for now): https://www.simple-shop.si/en/pos-terminal-tcpip-en https://www.simple-shop.si/en/pos-terminal-tcpip-en and eg https://www.unicreditbank.si/si/podjetja/upravljanje-z-denarjem/pos-terminal.html#posterminal https://www.unicreditbank.si/si/podjetja/upravljanje-z-denar... The new ones: https://www.sumup.com/sl-si/karticni-citalec-terminal/ https://www.sumup.com/sl-si/karticni-citalec-terminal/ and https://besteron.com/si/pos-terminali/ https://besteron.com/si/pos-terminali/ (both support tips) + many other in similar designs (full front touchscreen) I don't think square supports slovenia for now, but POS vedors add the tip option, and our restaurant owners enable it, because it doesn't cost them anything, any many (especially foreign) guests "feel bad" for choosing the zero on the screen.
- _zoltan_ 1mo agofinally. they should pay employees a better wage instead of relying on patrons to pay the tips (which might or might not end up with the employees...)
- xienze 1mo agoI think you'd be very surprised to learn that in a lot of cases, tipping pays much better than whatever a "reasonable" hourly wage for taking an order and carrying food to a table would be. If you're serving three tables that each have $100 checks and you get at 15% tip, that's $45/hour... yes it may average out higher or lower but you're not gonna like how much eating out costs if employers are expected to pay the higher end of what a server can make (spoiler: waiters will demand that). A famous recent example, the South Park guys bought a restaurant and eliminated tips with a very nice $30/hour wage. Seems pretty good, doesn't it? Guess what? The waiters demanded a return to tipping[0]! 0: https://www.restaurantbusinessonline.com/workforce/casa-bonita-workers-demand-return-tipping https://www.restaurantbusinessonline.com/workforce/casa-boni...
- LastTrain 1mo agoFrom the article: “Of 256 employees, 93 were a part of the shift and only two said they were unhappy about it, management said at the time.”
- _zoltan_ 1mo agoin Switzerland we almost never tip.
- pvaldes 1mo agoHow much do you pay for a standard cup of coffee?
- _zoltan_ 1mo agoaround 3 to 5 CHF, depending on the place, and what kind of coffee you want to drink. remember, this is Europe - the coffee is not made the same nor looks or tastes the same as you get in the US. it's mind boggling to me that people get a 16oz "cup of coffee", black.
- anovikov 1mo agoThese are reasonable prices for a place much cheaper than SFO. This is what people pay in Eastern Europe. 2500 CZK for a set - around $120 - won't be at all surprising or perceived as high in Prague, for instance. It can go up to 8000 or so.
- swiftcoder 1mo agoYeah, I'm kind of surprised by both restaurants tasting menu prices. Those seem downright reasonable for their locations.
- Tajnymag 1mo ago2500 CZK per person is definitely perceived as high in Prague. What are you talking about?
- Rygian 1mo agoAs a foreigner in the US, I've made the faux-pas of assuming waiters and waitresses were being paid a full salary by their employer. I even suspect that I received sub-par service from some of them, who may have identified me as a "no-tip risk" from the first moment.
- jacobgorm 1mo agoYou were lucky to get out alive.
- delta_p_delta_x 1mo agoThreatening assault on a paying customer for not knowing tipping norms is just one of the many reasons why American society is in the state it is. I've seen similar things like 'be glad I didn't spit in your food', 'next time they are getting trouser food'. This is despicable.
- i_no_can_eat 1mo agoWhat a lovely country.
- ponector 1mo agoGod bless America! Land of the free! Free to tip everyone you exchange money with.
- snayan 1mo agoI'm not saying they're right to do so, but it sounds like their intuition was honed well if they pegged you correctly during your faux-pas era? Fascinating, wonder what the tell was.
- NoboruWataya 1mo agoIf you are a foreigner I imagine your accent can give you away pretty quickly. Europeans would be far less likely to tip (or tip generously).
- ciconia 1mo agoFWIW France has it right: there's no tipping, service is always included.
- sylvainkalache 1mo agoI am french, living in the US: yes, service is always included in France, but service is usually not that good. At least, definitely not as good as in the US.
- CamelCaseName 1mo agoMany countries have far better service without tipping, China and Japan come to mind.
- mytailorisrich 1mo agoThe market works better in China: Competition is fierce and nowadays with online reviews most restaurants are so scared of a bad review that they go the extra mile and staff go all out as soon as you raise a slight concern.
- fendy3002 1mo agoJapan is amazing in some places, that you can order with a tablet apps then you pick up your food yourself when it arrived. Very minimum interaction and employees needed.
- donohoe 1mo agoIf I go to a restaurant and it’s all handled through a tablet I leave. I can get that treatment at the airport.
- manarth 1mo agoIt's good for some neurodivergent people. Overly-solicitous hospitality staff can make me tense. At the far end of the scale are bathroom attendants who want to help me wash/dry/moisture my hands after using the facilities.
- nkrisc 1mo agoI never thought about paying staff via tips being a tax dodge for the restaurant if it lets them avoid raising prices and thus taxable revenue.
- NoboruWataya 1mo agoIf the price increase is actually linked to higher wages for the staff, there should be no increase in taxable revenue for the restaurant, because the wages are deductible expenses. But there is still the matter of sales tax (paid by the customer), and the tax payable by the employee on their wages (not sure if tips are technically taxable income already, but regardless, you can bet most staff aren't paying taxes on them).
- sgerenser 1mo agoThey used to be taxable income, but now thanks to Trump’s “no tax on tips” campaign promise they aren’t. Effectively nobody paid taxes on cash tips anyway, but nowadays cash tips are relatively rare and credit card tips definitely show up on paystubs/W2s.
- Scaled 1mo agoTrue about federal, but state level tax is sometimes done on gross receipts instead of profit.
- bell-cot 1mo agoThe BBC article's "sales tax" reason sounds good - unless you know that several US states do not have sales tax. The actual history of tipping: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tipping#History https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tipping#History And a bit on Sales Taxes: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sales_tax#In_the_United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sales_tax#In_the_United_States From old family stories, I figure the real reason for tipping service workers is that both employers and customers want there to be plenty of service workers available - but the demand for their labor (restaurant customers, whatever) is very unpredictable compared to factory, farm, or gov't work. And service industries can't afford to keep a lot of idle workers around at full pay. So tipping is a simple revenue-sharing scheme, wrapped in social niceties, that boosts/cuts the service workers' income based on whether business is currently fast or slow.
- FartyMcFarter 1mo agoGood. Tipping creates so much mental overhead and unnecessary bad feelings on everyone's part.
- criddell 1mo agoI hate that some workers depend on tips and that creates an obligation on me, but I do like to tip because I know how great it feels to get one. At work I sometimes get a bonus and what’s that if not a tip? I benefit too. It’s a way for me to express gratitude.
- xyzelement 1mo agoExactly! Thank you for expressing this so consciley. The fact that some people can't imagine enjoying giving (and receiving) a nice tip is really gross.
- kakacik 1mo agoWe prefer paying proper price for the meals with all costs included, to see those prices upfront, knowing that workers are paid fairly already and they just do the job expected from them. It means they can have decent lives regardless of their physical attraction, race, if they are sick or any other reason disadvantaging them compared to others. It also means I don't need to ever worry if waiter spit in my burger just because I look like somebody who won't tip enough. Do you also tip every single time bus driver, colleague, bureaucrat handling your request or your child because they did their work as expected? Because why stop at some imaginary border.
- criddell 1mo agoI think everybody (except maybe some unethical employers) want to see employees paid a fair and livable wage for their work. Everybody has different ways of expressing gratitude. That bus driver may be well paid and just doing their job, but I'm still grateful they are doing it and will thank them as I get off the bus.
- 1mo ago
- qsera 1mo agoI am against the popular opinion and I actually tip if the hotel is somewhat cheap (ie food does not cost a small fortune). I do it out of selfish reasons. When I order chicken, I want them to bring me a good piece. Or if I order Porotta, I want them to bring me the most fresh one. Or sometimes when I get a very tasty meal, I just tip them to share them some of the happiness that they brought me. But totally depends on how strapped for cash I currently am... This is India, and not US, by the way..
- RugnirViking 1mo agoAny recommendations for tipping in India? (Amounts etc) I was warned against tipping too much by locals who worried it could distort local economies toward tourists and away from local people.
- qsera 1mo agoI usually do like something between 30-50 Rs (around 10% of the cost of food). It is not a lot, but I don't think anyone would expect to be tipped more than that..
- dmurray 1mo agoSounds like you talked to the locals who might end up being expected to pay tips. The ones who might expect to receive tips would have a different point of view.
- RugnirViking 1mo agoof course any individual person will want to be paid as much as possible. There is a reason that people protest when their town becomes a tourist destination, despite the seeming money they bring, though. They get locked out of any dream or purpose other than serving foreigners. No reason to try and build anything that doesn't cater to them, and if your skills aren't useful to them, then you literally just have to leave or become destitute
- Grombobulous 1mo ago
- chistev 1mo agoMr. Pink doesn't tip in Reservoir Dogs - https://youtu.be/M4sTSIYzDIk?si=VkoIHgKpIFz-eMOJ https://youtu.be/M4sTSIYzDIk?si=VkoIHgKpIFz-eMOJ
- getfacl 1mo agoThe biggest barrier to ending tipping in the USA is that restaurants are almost always over staffed there. The owner wants the maximum ratio of servers to customers possible. In the typical USA system, being paid primarily in tips means the server is highly incentivized to upsell the customer as much as possible and do everything they can to increase the total bill, and therefor increase their tip. Essentially a commissioned sales person but the customer pays the commission. This is the least efficient way to run a restaurant with regard to staffing. European restaurants typically use a team service model, which greatly reduces the number of staff needed. Every front of house worker can take orders, make and serve drinks, run food to tables, etc. Instead of checking on the customer every few minutes they rely on the customer to ask if you need something. There is no pressure to run up the bill or clear out quickly in this model.
- rock_artist 1mo agoIt depends and also is culture based. In Spain you can find some places (eg coffee place) with 1-2 workers. Sometimes it takes a lot of time to get your order at rush hours, but the culture tolerates patience and waiting.
- ricardobayes 1mo agoOne of the biggest cultural differences - for Spain - is that servers are seen as equals, not as a client-provider relationship. This reflects heavily in the language often used - "when you can, bring me X". Just one of the quirks of a low gini coefficient society.
- xyzelement 1mo agoJust yesterday there was a story on HN about Spain's dying villages and a commenter who I assumed was Spanish attributed theow beth rate to income inequality. Which is it - low gini for talking to a waiter, high gini for starting a fam?
- UqWBcuFx6NV4r 1mo ago
- walrus01 1mo agoWe need to at least normalize not tipping for counter service. Given the current wage structures and labor laws in the US and Canada, if I sit down at a table and I receive table service, I'm going to tip 15% unless the service was abhorrent. I am not going to tip if I order and take my food from a counter and serve myself (and then almost certainly clear my own table as well), or I buy any other form of product standing up. Basically, if I'm standing for the entire customer service transaction, it's not tippable.
- Tyr42 1mo agoAnd you are tipping before you even see the service in that case, as you pay before the food. Of course, the staff also see how you tio before they prep your food...
- walrus01 1mo agoUsing the example of my local chipotle as a typical stand up and order and pay at counter arrangement, the food is made before I get to the POS terminal.
- account42 1mo agoIs that really typical though? IME there are more places where you order and pay and then wait for your food to be made than there are places where your food gets put together while you are ordering and you pay afterwards.
- walrus01 1mo agoI guess it depends? Subway, Chipotle, lots of other places (poke bowls?) you choose your stuff and the food is made and then you pay. Taco Time as a randomly chosen fast food example, you pay at the time you order and then someone in the kitchen (not the cashier) makes the food. Both seem common.
- ryandvm 1mo ago> Of course, the staff also see how you tio before they prep your food... Lol. Yeah, that's where the game theory breaks down for me. I'm all for not tipping people that don't interact with you directly until I start thinking about how the 17-year-old making my pizza feels about tipping on pick-up orders...
- palata 1mo ago> the problem of going tip-free is that customers struggle to get their heads around the maths. Maybe they should show the price "without tip" next to the full price, so people can compare. Paying employees with tips is an insane concept, fundamentally abusive. If it wasn't, then the owner would also get paid from tips. "The meals are all free, and we count on you to pay them through tips". Obviously no owner would take that risk, because it is insane. They make their employees take that risk because they can abuse them, that's all.
- tdeck 1mo ago> If it wasn't, then the owner would also get paid from tips. Actually it's quite common for owners to take some of the tips, even though that's not legal.
- palata 1mo agoI meant "solely from tips", obviously. And yeah, on top of abusing the employees by not paying them (and relying on the customers to pay the employees directly), stealing from the tip is even more abusive. And let's not even talk about those delivery (and similar) apps that also abuse the tips in their algorithms.
- tdeck 1mo agoI think the ability to steal tips is part of the appeal for some employers unfortunately.
- hammock 1mo ago> I meant "solely from tips", obviously. That was not obvious. Nor is that a common practice
- Fargren 1mo agoLet me restate what the OP said. (quotes used for paraphrasing, not for quoting) "Restaurant owners set a price on their dishes, because if everyone payed at will, the owners know they would make less money. Therefore we can assume owners know that paying at-will does not optimize earnings. Therefore, it's insane that they make their staff work for pay that's at-will".
- yanhangyhy 1mo agowho invent this shit? +1 reason not to travel to USA
- KellyCriterion 1mo agoVery often regarding those articles, you read in the comments different varieties of "good service": - may I ask: What does this actually mean? I have never been to a "high class" or "fine dining" location, so maybe my expectations are in general not high. My expectations are just simple: Give me the menu quickly, let me order quickly, let me eat and let me pay quickly. Thats it. What do I miss? EDIT: Im located in EU.
- ricardobayes 1mo agoThat's a good question. Good service is something important to the overall dining experience, so much so, higher end places regard the "maître d'hôtel" aka the service/restaurant manager equal to the chef. Great service is generally about "reading your mind": e.g. providing you with a replacement fork that you dropped without you needing to ask. Also, coordinating that "timing" you are after, perfectly. Good service is attentive without being overly present. If you ever ate somewhere in a sitdown restaurant and thought after "wow that was a great meal", service contributed to that.
- jmull3n 1mo agoGood service is mostly invisible. Courses paced to how you're eating, not fired all at once or giving you 20 minute gaps between mains. Drinks refilled, plates cleared without asking. Reading the room and knowing when I want to chat or be left alone. Staff that know what their serving, whats in it, how it's cooked, what wine pairs well, etc.
- amiga386 1mo agoThat also includes accomodating guest preferences and allergies, and the staff being empowered to act. For example, let's say you're allergic to nuts. Not only should the menu list all allergens, but also you should be able to say "I'm allergic to nuts. Can I have the beef cheek without the walnut garnish?" and the waiter should know if that's possible or not, and if there are any other nuts hidden in there, without having to ask the chef. They can say "let me check with the chef", but if they don't need to check because they already know the dishes well enough, that's great service. It goes without saying: - if you can and do order it nut-free, the dish served to you should be nut-free - the waiter shouldn't freak out like this is the first guest with allergies they've ever had to accomodate - they shouldn't refuse to serve you anything at all because "there are nuts in the kitchen", even if you explain that you're ok with the presence of nuts in an area provided they're not deliberately part of the food - they shouldn't hand you a binder of laminated pages marked "ALLERGENS" and make you find the menu entry yourself Also, if you're doing a tasting menu with a party of six and the restaurant has already agreed to accommodate your allergies, but you sit at a different seat at the table, they shouldn't reliably serve the nut-free dishes to the wrong person, sitting in the seat they decided the allergic customer would be sitting at, for every course.
- zoobab 1mo agoBeen to Santa Cruz visiting the bike factory, went to the bar next door to drink with some mountain bikers. They had 'Brussels IPA' and 'Belgian IPA', I ordered those beers coming from Brussels and did not knew those beers. The waiter looked at me strangely. I did not gave any tips.
- DiggyJohnson 1mo agoI think you might be missing a couple words because it’s not clear what you grievance is. Not tipping a waiter in the USA is poor form regardless of your individual opinion on tipping culture.
- olsondv 1mo agoHe probably looked at you strangely because you don’t seem to know much about beer. Do you think all beer called a pilsner is imported from Czech Republic or all Vienna Lager is from Austria?
- neya 1mo agoTipping is a weird phenomenon that's only an issue in the Americas. I have traveled extensively all over Asia and even the same chain/restaurants which are US based don't actually have the concept of tipping. Sure, you can always tip if you want. However, the issue with tipping culture is the blatant entitlement. I always tell rude waiters who literally demand tips for shitty services this: A tip is a token of gratitude, should the customer choose to offer. It is not an entitlement. I get it, their wages aren't great. However, that is a discussion to be had with their employer, not me. Of course, I want them to get paid a fair wage too - the only way to fight against this culture is taking a stand against tipping. If enough people don't tip, hopefully the restaurant will struggle to find staff and eventually - either close down or increase the wages. But, don't try to run a restaurant when you clearly can't afford to pay your staff a decent wage. That's just running a business on hopes and dreams. It's not my job to subsidize your poor financial and business planning.
- mpweiher 1mo agoI always thought "paying" your staff via tips was primarily a tax dodge. Yes, the staff are supposed to declare all their untraceable cash income, but...yeah. So at least some of that income is untaxed, meaning higher net for same gross, meaning total prices even including tip can be lower.
- oldsklgdfth 1mo agoI grew up in a restaurant in the US. Tipping is a counterintuitive evolution in wages, I’ll probably dig in more. Anecdotally, a waitress could easily earn more than minimum wage during a shift. Sometimes easy clearing $100 when minimum wage was $7/hr (it was $2.15/hr for wait staff). Add to that the tip reporting was lax and no there’s no tax on tips, waiting is on par with minimum wage. An interesting side effect is that adding waitstaff is marginal cost to an operator.
- vorticalbox 1mo ago> The people breaking their backs and minds in the kitchen - often the least visible and the least celebrated - were taking home a fraction of what the front staff made on tips for the same hours Why not put all tips into a pool and just share it out between everyone?
- asfodelsu 1mo agoThis is what many restaurants do in my country. It's fair but it creates many issues. How you split it, who decides that, and there is always someone that is suspect of stealing. Another issue is that if Americans tip, then you start to expect tipping from everyone make the experience more expensive and worst from anyone else. PS. I don't own a restaurant or work at one, but I have friends that do both.I live in Greece, that counts also as "Europe" I guess
- vorticalbox 1mo agowell if the TIP is on the POS system then I personally would just do amount/staff but then I guess staff paid more do they deserve less of the tip?
- analog31 1mo agoThe POS handles it automatically. The workers know how the tips are split. Remember that tip income is offset by a lower base wage. They do expect tipping.
- analog31 1mo agoBoth of my kids are tipped workers in the US. The places where they work do this exactly. One place is a very popular restaurant with counter service. The other is a bar. I also earn tips playing music on the side.
- SkiFire13 1mo agoThe thing that bugs me about tips is the fact they are a percentage. Why am I supposed to tip more if I ordered something more expensive but the service is equally good?
- Ekaros 1mo agoAs engineer I question why don't they present me in seconds time they spend on me. Then I could calculate fair rate to tip. Say altogether they spend 6 minutes on me. 2€ or 20€ an hour sounds reasonable enough if it was good work... Then again this probably should be included so maybe not that much.
- xyzelement 1mo agoIn general a higher bill is a proxy for a larger meal of more people in a more high-end establishment so it tracks well. I agree if you had the $200 sea food tower by yourself it deviates from that otherwise perfect proxy. But that's already a weird situation so just pay the tip and move on.
- xxs 1mo agoA massive price difference would be the drinks (also the most of the profit) - realistically opening a bottle of expensive wine vs the bog standard cabernet serves as no proxy to anything. Likely certain single malts vs jim beam.
- SkiFire13 1mo agoIt's not a good enough proxy for more people. If you compare the least and most costly items on a menu, even adjusting for size, you'll find that there's often a 2x to 4x difference between them. If I pick one over the other I will also have to pay 2x to 4x in tip. That just doesn't checkout. Also, why do you need a proxy for the number of people when you can just count them? In Europe a service charge is relatively common and it's a per-person fixed charge.
- malthaus 1mo agoit's time for a worldwide reset on tipping culture / assumptions. america was always weird - the tipping practice leads to over-the-top fake service, is abusive to staff and only benefits restaurant owners. and they turned all that up to 11 over the last few years. how americans can cherish and even defend this, i can't get my mind around it. meanwhile in europe, american practices are imported by way of POS terminals asking in outrageous use cases for outrageous amounts of tips. no, im not tipping 30% for an item i pick from a shelf in a store. add to that the awkward interaction at a bar or so when you have to select a tip under the watchful eye of the server. people are shamed into tipping in all manners of ways and let those abusive practices plow over them. it's a disgrace. i wish for a world where all prices, including tips & taxes, are on the label / menu when i buy them and asking / giving anything on top is illegal. we would all be better off, even though americans for some reasons can't accept it - i have little trust in the headline of the linked article becoming a bigger phenomena.
- Razengan 1mo ago"Tipping culture" has always been the most bizarre and stupid looking aspect of American society.. ..and the most hilarious example of how the capitalist overlords keep the peasants fighting over pennies amongst themselves No. The customer pays your boss → your boss pays you. Stop being bitches and demand your bosses to pay you a proper salary.
- seanclayton 1mo agoNo tips for the wealthy! Sucks to be poor in America, get rich losers!
- sanjay_dev 1mo agoI heard it is mandatory to give them tip, is this true ?
- neom 1mo agoAmericans have hated tipping almost as long as they’ve practiced it: https://www.nationalgeographic.com/history/article/tipping-history-united-states https://www.nationalgeographic.com/history/article/tipping-h...
- artur_makly 1mo agoI'm from New York City and I've lived in Buenos Aires, Argentina, since 2006. I go back and forth between the two cities every year, and I can unequivocally say they couldn't be any more different when it comes to service. I'd say both locations expose extremes on opposite sides of the spectrum. In New York City, there's a burning need to turn tables and seats over as fast as possible, which really sucks for the customer experience. However, their service efficiency—especially when you're in a rush in a place like NYC—does have its benefits. Can you simply hang out and people-watch, or have a deep conversation with a friend without feeling pressured to leave, order something else, or be constantly interrupted every five fucking minutes? Nope. In Argentina, tipping is not part of the culture. Socialism from back in the Perón days still lingers, although it's quickly changing now under the new government. Mentally speaking, though, employees feel entitled to do the least amount of work possible once their three-month grace period ends. They walk around the restaurant or bar with a "cara de culo" (literally "ass face"), sending you a clear message: Don't even bother me. You're not worth my time. I have zero incentive to make you a happy customer or make you want to come back. However, if you become a regular, they warm up to you—especially if you ask their name, tell them yours, take the time to ask about their life, and share a bit about yourself. About ten years ago, when the Venezuelan immigration wave hit, almost 50% of establishments quickly replaced their workers with happier Venezuelan immigrants who were cheaper and much more grateful for their jobs. For the first time, the industry finally had cheerful servers and staff, a change that was pleasantly welcomed by both business owners and customers. My feeling is that there should be a happy medium somewhere in between, though I'm not entirely sure what that is. I like the gesture of tipping, and as a business owner, I like providing incentives and meaning to my staff. In the end, though, this seems to be a deeply embedded cultural quirk that starts when you're a child learning how to relate to other children and adults. Personally, I prefer the laid-back Argentine style. I can sit down at any table in a café and enjoy five to ten minutes just to decompress, without someone immediately getting in my face to take my order. I need time to unwind. I need time to peruse the menu and check my Instagram feed. I need time—not everything is "time is money." I also need time after finishing a meal to take it all in, maybe journal a bit, notice my surroundings, and be in the present moment without any pressure to leave. Hell, if I want to open my laptop and keep working for another two hours, it's no problem—I'll just order another beverage. I get it. For me, this city moves at a much more natural, human pace than any other city I've ever lived in. Ping me if you're in the barrio!
- datagreed 1mo agoAmericans
- ipython 1mo agoIt’s so out of hand that staff have a euphemism for it. you stand at the counter in front of the Toast POS, tap your card, and … then the phrase … “The system will ask you a few questions”. Bam I’m supposed to tip 25% for standing at a counter to order and take my food.
- dboreham 1mo agoThe way I look at this is that I get to pay for socialism in the USA. We'll never get it via the government, but at least I can improve some low paid workers' lives a bit.
- kvemkon 1mo ago> Wine waiter Caroline Kraetzer earns $40 (£30) an hour Is this before taxes or what remains after?
- xyzelement 1mo agoEvery time tipping comes up there's a vocal contingent of anti tippers, coming from one of these perspectives: European pride, cheap fuckery, or faux labor concerns. It's important to remind that American restaurants work well - we have promp and good service as a rule, the majority of Americans are fine with and enjoy tipping and the vast majority of service workers enjoy getting them and are ahead financially vs European counterparts. This is our culture and we by and large like our culture. It's fine to experiment with other options and it's (of course) fine to disagree and complain but it's also an important baseline to acknowledge that things mainly work and people mainly like it.
- mfcl 1mo agoI've traveled to places where I would not tip and I don't remember the experience being very different. I say what food I want and get a plate with such food.
- yuye 1mo ago>European pride Europeans tip, just not as crazy as Americans. >It's important to remind that American restaurants work well Japanese service is top-notch and tipping is generally frowned upon there.
- xyzelement 1mo agoThat's fine. I am pointing out that the American system works well. Other systems can work too.
- mchusma 1mo agoI’ve never met someone who didn’t think tipping was too widespread and too high. You say a majority of people are happy with the state of US tipping?
- eagerpace 1mo agoThe bigger story for me is tipping fatigue. Almost every service worker requests a tip now. It seems to be from the rise in digital payments where everyone just turns on that feature. As a consumer, I have no idea if the worker’s compensation model is tied to tips or not and it feels like the ones who aren’t have hijacked my generosity.
- JohnFen 1mo ago> Almost every service worker requests a tip now. That it's become ubiquitous has made me able to decline tips without feeling weird about it.
- kittikitti 1mo agoThe waiters are usually more racist the more dependent they are on tips. After the racially profile you, they adjust their service based on expected tip. This system in America is indefensible. Pay them a living wage!
- ChrisMarshallNY 1mo agoIn Japan, I think the servers are paid well, and they don't accept tips. If you leave money on the table, they will chase you down, and give it back. And the service is incredible. Japanese service culture is pretty amazing, if you are used to the US. You really want to tip them -much more than in the US. I think the US underpays waitstaff pretty badly. They desperately need the tips, but in some places, they can do fairly well. I know lots of [former, mostly] bartenders, and they tell stories of bringing home hundreds of untaxed dollars, every night.
- presentation 1mo agoI live in Japan and see signs for hiring restaurant staff at restaurants pretty often, because they’re always hiring since there’s always a shortage of labor, and the posted wages are usually at or slightly above minimum wage. In Tokyo that’s 1226 yen/hour (US$7.70 as of now) which is not much to live on. They’re not paid below minimum wage so that puts them ahead of US wait staff in one sense, but I expect that when taking into account tips, US wait staff probably come out ahead. Which makes it clear that service is not necessarily a function of compensation, and that eradicating tips does not necessarily make wait staff economically better off.
- ChrisMarshallNY 1mo ago> Which makes it clear that service is not necessarily a function of compensation This is true. Japan has its issues, but I am a fan of their culture of excellence. Everyone in Japan -regardless of their status- makes sure that they perform their job, the best that they can. I worked for a company that makes top-Quality photographic equipment. It was a difficult taskmaster, but they have also consistently made stuff that people pay top money for, and stake their entire careers on, for over a hundred years. It was quite an honor to have worked in that environment, and it taught me a lot.
- infecto 1mo agoIt’s quite funny to read the comments. Europeans consider their system one of culture. Americans don’t care about the culture but the time wasted. I am just sitting here thinking everyone is creating a reason why their system is better while trying to diminish another’s.
- lgl 1mo agoNot trying. A system where the employer pays a full decent wage to their workers and avoids having employees complain and insult customers because they didn't tip some random percentage number is the better system. Prove me wrong. Extremist capitalism is still extremism.
- deleted 1mo ago[deleted]
- burnt-resistor 1mo agoTipping in America originates from post-slavery Reconstruction adopting a then European custom, where some categories of workers were paid inferior wages and relied upon the uncertainty of goodwill of customers. https://time.com/5404475/history-tipping-american-restaurants-civil-war/ https://time.com/5404475/history-tipping-american-restaurant... https://www.bunkhistory.org/resources/the-racist-history-of-tipping https://www.bunkhistory.org/resources/the-racist-history-of-...
- tamimio 1mo agoI simply don’t tip, period. Tipping as a concept is when the waitress does an extraordinary service for you, I have been in restaurants where the waitresses live to their name and stand by your table changing plates and filling up the drinks, sure, I might tip that, but 99% of restaurants don’t provide such service, bringing plates from the kitchen is something I can do myself or hell, a robot easily does that, and I have been in some places where they ask a tip in fast food and street food! I just put zero with a dead stare.. crazy.
- GuB-42 1mo agoI think tipping is getting out of hand. Normally, tips pay for service staff, which would be about 15% of the revenue of a restaurant in a no-tip country. So, with tips of 15% or less, everyone get their fair share: service staff get a low base wage complemented by tips, kitchen staff get paid normally, owners get reasonable profits. But when tips get to 20% or more, the system breaks, service staff get more than their fair share and that's when weird things start to happen. Owners pocketing the tips, pooling the tips between kitchen and service staff, hiring more waiters for no good reason, etc... and then it comes to the logical conclusion, which is banning tips altogether.
- OutOfHere 1mo ago$40 per hour is okay for wait staff, but it doesn't make up for an absence of good healthcare benefits.
- SwiftyBug 1mo agoI'm from a country where we don't tip. Restaurant staff make a salary. The whole tipping thing makes me very anxious when I'm visiting the US. Sometimes I simply forget altogether, sometimes I'm not sure how much to tip. As an introvert, it's always a nightmare. Open-ended, unspoken rules are a nightmare.
- nunez 1mo agoI actually love tipping! I have no issues hitting the 20%/25%/30% button on the tablet, and giving someone a really nice tip after being provided with great service always makes me feel great. That said, I also sympathize with people who don't feel this way. It would be nice if we could federally ban tips and re-architect wage tables for hospitality workers so that they can continue getting paid well for what is a very intense job. The only way no-tipping works is if it's federally banned, since it's well known that FoH makes great money from tips despite the terrible legal min wage and nobody with experience will give that up for a place that doesn't allow tips.
- techgnosis 1mo agoThere are subtleties that matter a lot. For example, in Washington state (WA), wait staff are paid normal full hourly wages. There is no such thing as a "tipped employee" who makes tiny hourly wage and supplements with tips. Because of this, I am trying (with some success) to simply tip less at restaurants. Restaurant wait staff, in WA at least, is coasting on old rules and general voter ignorance.
- juancn 1mo ago20% tips assumed in the price? What if service sucks, can I get a discount?