6 ms·

I read recently that PlayStation users are moving to PC en masse, and also Xbox has been gutted by layoffs, and there's a backlash against Nintendo for the swit

I read recently that PlayStation users are moving to PC en masse, and also Xbox has been gutted by layoffs, and there's a backlash against Nintendo for the switch 2 pricing. Is the age of the console finally coming to an end?

ryanm101 3mo ago
To be fair had RAM prices not screwed up the steam machine consoles would have been dooms earlier. They are about to enter a slow decline before death
- inigyou 3mo ago
  Consoles are suffering from the RAM price crisis just as much as PCs.
- ColdStream 3mo ago
  Maybe, they still aren't going to have the same economy of scale or the business loss leading tendency of some consoles. Valve doesn't want to be subsidizing hardware that can be used as a desktop. that puts them on the back foot. But I suspect Xbox is eventually going to go the path of Steam cube and end up licensing out hardware/software spec and let multiple vendors make hardware. The 3DO sales model may rise again some 35 years after the fact.
treyd 3mo ago
Consoles made sense as a product category where specialized graphics hardware was not generally available for consumer PCs. We have this now, every PC has some kind of graphics hardware, and has for many years. Consoles have been riding on their momentum of their brands, but the technical justification for their product category hasn't existed for 15+ years now.
- dpoloncsak 3mo ago
  The main thing consoles have going for them, imo, is the standardization of hardware. It's very easy to say "Yes this game will run on my console at 60 FPS because its identical to the other consoles where it runs at 60 FPS." Differing builds and drivers are not really a concern in the console world, where-as they are in the PC world. Some console gamers seem to think PC gaming requires hours of fiddling with settings and drivers. I think we've all had that experience on PC (cough Bethesda cough), but I doubt to the degree the console-side would have you believe. Most AAA games will self-optimize their settings to a playable state, and indie games don't tend to demand more than your standard gaming laptop can provide...but I'm sure we've all been burned some 10-odd years ago buying a Steam game that just wouldn't run on your iGPU...that experience sticks around in the brain a while
  - robertlagrant 3mo ago
    That's one thing. The other is price. Consoles can be sold at a loss, particularly early in their 10-year cycle, when early on the loss is high, but close to the end of the cycle the loss is minimal, and so they appear much cheaper.
    - dpoloncsak 3mo ago
      Oh, for sure! It's not getting any better with PC part prices lately either... I've never considered that my old 360 was probably sold at a loss, knowing I'd buy LIVE and all the games they take a cut/license fee off of, but that makes complete sense to me
    - nemomarx 3mo ago
      Given recent price rises for console hardware I think they're struggling with that too though. The model doesn't work as well if the components get more expensive over time and not less?
      - Narishma 3mo ago
        But PC parts are also getting more expensive, so the difference is still there.
        nemomarx 3mo ago
        Yeah I mean specifically the "sell at a loss, wait for costs to get lower over the generation" thing. if it's at a loss at the start of the generation and component costs only rise, it'll still sell for a loss at the end but also it'll be more expensive for customers. this puts the company in a hard position. a lot of gamers are also used to waiting until the end of the life of a console and getting games used, which might no longer be an option
    - Tsiklon 3mo ago
      This cycle is different. Prices have increased for both Sony and Microsoft’s consoles and no higher efficiency versions have been released (ala the PS3, X360).
- bluescrn 3mo ago
  Consoles don't have true 'generational leaps' any more either, the huge leaps forward in tech used to drive excitement/sales. Now we get incremental improvements, cross-generation games, and backwards compatibility. And AAA game development isn't exactly doing well these days.
  - throwaway613746 3mo ago
    [dead]
  - trencedamp 3mo ago
    Exactly. Indie development is where it's at. The best game I played in the last five years was probably A Short Hike. It moved me and inspired me to get back into game dev and it was made by one person
- moger777 3mo ago
  I think they still make sense for the non technical user. Having an idiomatic control makes setup far easier than on a PC and the UI for a console is designed to be used with a controller instead of a keyboard and mouse. This makes dealing with a television easier. I don't see consoles disappearing ever for those reasons.
  - cwnyth 3mo ago
    -----
    - nirvdrum 3mo ago
      I don’t think the appeal is just to the less technically inclined masses. I’m a developer with a MacBook Pro and a Linux workstation. Proton has come a long way, but consoles just work for the most part; I never have to question whether the game will function and perform well on the console (setting aside the random buggy messes we see). Then there’s the convenience. I don’t want to play games where I work. I want to play on my TV. I have no interest in moving my workstation into my living room. Streaming with Moonlight works well enough, but there’s still lag. Even if I wanted to move my PC to the living room, the setup isn’t as nice. The Steam Machine has HDMI CEC and can power on with a controller — all the major consoles have had that for years. Even if I accepted all that, no one else in my household could play anything while I’m working on my computer. Things are a little weird now. If I’m going to have to go all digital, Steam Family is by far the best option of those with DRM. But, due to the astronomical cost of components, consoles are still pretty attractive.
      - inigyou 3mo ago
        > I never have to question whether the game will function and perform well on the console Thanks to recent moves by Sony, this is no longer the case!
        nirvdrum 3mo ago
        Can you please elaborate? The recent moves I’ve seen have been announcing a shift to digital-only and another about clawing back movie purchases. Neither are appealing to me, but also aren’t related to game performance or compatibility.
- naravara 3mo ago
  Specialized graphics hardware hasn’t been the selling point of having a console since at least 2002 with the first XBox. The selling point of consoles is that they’re a software platform, with development incentives, standardized hardware, standardized UI conventions, and a centralized storefront to be able to conveniently and natively play stuff on your TV without fussing about. Valve has barely started to muscle in on the platform benefits of gaming on a PlayStation or XBox, but the more they start to do so the more they end up making design trade-offs that start to look like another console.
  - ColdStream 3mo ago
    I will give it to Sony with the Ps3, at least the Cell was an attempt at something different hardware wise. But they also learned the lesson that building walled gardens of technology can keep people out just as easily as they try to keep them in.
- mvkel 3mo ago
  > Consoles made sense as a product category where specialized graphics hardware was not generally available for consumer PCs. This has almost never been true. GPUs existed, and were being used, before the N64. Your comment also begs the question that the console consumer has transitioned to a gaming pc. They haven't. Gaming PC sales (and hardware) are at all-time lows, except for GPUs, which should probably be renamed to Model Training Units. I would posit that what we're seeing is a reflection of a content problem, not hardware. Video games have gone the way of Hollywood, with sequels and derivatives, and an uninterested consumer base. People would rather watch a YouTube video of someone playing a video game than play a video game.
  - Chinjut 3mo ago
    What PC GPU was in mainstream consumer use before the N64?
    - ssl-3 3mo ago
      The 3dfx Voodoo1 was very mainstream (and market-defining, even). It predates the N64.
      - Sohcahtoa82 3mo ago
        This is incorrect. N64 came out in the USA in September 1996. 3dfx Voodoo was released to consumers in October 1996.
        ssl-3 3mo ago
        Oh noes!
      - redsocksfan45 3mo ago
        [dead]
  - Sohcahtoa82 3mo ago
    > GPUs existed, and were being used, before the N64. Video cards existed, but 3D accelerators didn't really catch on until the 3dfx Voodoo, which came out about the same time as the N64. Even Quake II which came out a year later still offered software rendering. > Your comment also begs the question that the console consumer has transitioned to a gaming pc. They haven't. I'm only a single point of data, but I was a console gamer that transitioned to PC gaming, but that transition happened during the N64/PSX era. It was near the end of the PS2 cycle that I was full PC. > Gaming PC sales (and hardware) are at all-time lows Because prices are at all-time highs. I have a monster PC that I probably spent around $6,000 building, but with prices skyrocketing, it'd run me $10,000 to build it today. A few months ago, it would have been $11,000. > Video games have gone the way of Hollywood, with sequels and derivatives, and an uninterested consumer base. In the AAA world, this is true. So many gamers that only play Call of Duty, Fortnite, Minecraft, or a sports game. For CoD and the sports games, they reliably buy the latest release every year despite the lack of anything really being different. But the Indie world is huge and full of innovation. Balatro, Stardew Valley, Disco Elysium, Slay the Spire, Cuphead, I could go on. > People would rather watch a YouTube video of someone playing a video game than play a video game. I don't think that's true at all. Maybe for high-level play, or if the streamer has highly entertaining commentary, but otherwise definitely not true.
- afavour 3mo ago
  That doesn't really make sense. Consoles have always occupied a different space to PCs, not least because they plug into living room TVs. Very few people are going to trade that for a (considerably more expensive) PC. Gaming PCs also require specialized knowledge, more maintenance, etc etc. Consoles are pick up and go. I very much doubt they're dead yet.
  - Rohansi 3mo ago
    You'll likely see a lot more Steam Machine-like PCs because of this. SteamOS fixes most of the problems you mention. Price is the new normal and you should expect next gen consoles to come closer to it. It's not a bad deal anyway when you consider the bigger library, cheaper games, and no subscription required. https://store.steampowered.com/sale/steammachine https://store.steampowered.com/sale/steammachine
    - afavour 3mo ago
      At that point I’d say we’re talking about a PC/console hybrid anyway so the distinction gets a little less useful.
      - Rohansi 3mo ago
        But why? The Steam Deck and Machine are pick up and go like consoles by default. Only a small minority care that it's actually a PC you can use for things other than games. The only thing that sets them apart is Steam's hardware isn't locked down.
  - WhyNotHugo 3mo ago
    > Gaming PCs also require specialized knowledge, more maintenance, etc etc. If you want to build it yourself: sure. But less technically inclined folks can just buy one pre-assembled from a computer shop.
    - afavour 3mo ago
      You still need to stay on top of requirements as time passes though. Will game X run on my machine? By comparison a console game is for a generation of a console or it's for the next.
- mschuster91 3mo ago
  The thing with PCs is... they are open. Open means piracy and more importantly it means cheats. A console is a far easier thing to defend against cheaters than a PC - absent true hardware vulnerabilities (which become more and more expensive, now that stuff like voltage glitching, clock cutting and whatnot is all known and accounted for), you are basically limited to botted input and AI-assistance based on what can be seen on the screen.
- dabinat 3mo ago
  Another appeal of consoles is being able to sit on a couch and play. Most PC chairs are not as comfortable.
- p_j_w 3mo ago
  >Consoles have been riding on their momentum of their brands This is entirely wrong. Consoles have been riding consistency and ease of use. Sure, if you look just at the spec sheet consoles make no sense. But when you look at the whole experience combined with price, this is where consoles have always won. It's always been easier to hook my console up to the TV and start playing. The Steambox closes this gap with the overall experience, but still loses out on price. If consoles continue to enshittify, this might change.
- ColdStream 3mo ago
  The last generation where there really felt to be a big advantage to consoles was with the Xbox 360. Having Xbox live integrated at an OS level for cross game chat, messaging and music control was something that felt genuinely unique at the time and something that could only come from top down strategy. But Steam caught up with all of that and consoles didn't really innovate forwards from that either. The last big thing on consoles would have been the standard high speed SSD's and even then it hasn't been exploited as much as one would have liked. Ratchet and Clank : Rift apart did, but it feels like an exception, even then it works pretty well on the PC version even without the custom compression hardware.
bluescrn 3mo ago
PC gaming isn't exactly in a healthy place either (at least when it comes to hardware pricing/availability). Post-Covid GPU prices were bad enough even before the AI bubble ruined everything.
- cryo32 3mo ago
  Yeah. I gave up a couple of years ago after Epic broke my account and I lost my purchases irrecoverably. I have actually started playing board games with people now. This is so much better for me. And cheaper. And you can't taken them away.
  - bluescrn 3mo ago
    Retro gaming is an increasingly popular option, too. These days I have more fun messing with Amigas, C64s, and cheap emulation handhelds than big modern games. Retro hardware prices have been going up fairly significantly though, especially for Amiga stuff.
    - ColdStream 3mo ago
      In 2020 I ended up selling most of my retro stuff, turns out it was a good time to do it due to the lock downs and a brief period of high prices for that stuff. But the main reason I sold was because I just wasn't interested in doing ongoing hardware maintenance. Emulation while not perfect was good enough for me. I see many retro machines nowadays that have HDMI port, USB controllers/memory cards, SD card disk readers, new power supplies etc. You start to realize that other than the motherboard and external case, it has all been replaced. They were built like commodity hardware and it shows, they aren't made to go decades. And that is with the popular stuff, if it is more obscure then your options are limited.
Hitton 3mo ago
I wouldn't be surprised if consoles got replaced by video game streaming. Not the next generation and probably not even the generation after that, but that will be most likely it.
- zarzavat 3mo ago
  Video game streaming requires a high quality internet connection to a nearby data center. It can work in certain places but there's always going to be places where it doesn't work, and consoles don't have that problem.
  - DiskoHexyl 3mo ago
    Well Sony is actively working on that problem- the plebs in these internet-starved countries won’t be playing anyway, as with no optical drive in the future ps6 users are going to be tied to PSN which isn’t available on half the planet. Jokes aside I do agree that streaming doesn’t work reliably for all game genres and client geographies, mostly due to latency
  - vel0city 3mo ago
    The question is, when does the market that does have that access start to completely crowd out the market that doesn't have that access? In a lot of the metro area where I live cloud gaming over 5G wireless is actually very feasible. I do it from time to time. I've tried it in a few other cities as well, with generally positive results. There are some games that just don't work well over cloud streaming though.
- ColdStream 3mo ago
  I have been hearing that since 2009 with Onlive and it still seems just as far away now as it was then. Current streaming services struggle at times to deliver consistent performance and quality, having low latency input involved in it just makes the problem worse.
add-sub-mul-div 3mo ago
People age out of wanting to sit in their bedroom with a handheld and become adults who have living rooms. For home gaming there will always be demand to play games on a real sized screen.
- inigyou 3mo ago
  Yeah so get a PC and install some games
- saidinesh5 3mo ago
  I think the steam deck proved otherwise too.. I haven't had enough motivation to sit on my couch and game after a long day .. But the same game, in bed, on my deck was so much nicer.. All I can now say is having a dedicated device, that's not your laptop/computer to play games is definitely a market - be it Steam machine (/custom builds), hand held gaming, or just regular consoles..
- trencedamp 3mo ago
  Some adults then lose that living room to their offspring and have to go back to playing in the bedroom. I speak from experience
rrgok 3mo ago
I would say the future is cloud gaming.
- nazgulsenpai 3mo ago
  Sadly, I agree with you. I don't like it, but it seems pretty clear.
- trinsic2 3mo ago
  The cloud gaming echo chamber has conveniently arrived to save the day by mimicking the solution to fix the problem the same industry created. Problem, Reaction, Solution.
- criddell 3mo ago
  Sadly, the future might be phone gaming. The mobile gaming market is as big as the console and PC markets combined.
  - naravara 3mo ago
    These are basically different markets that only compete with each other because there are finite hours in the day to engage with media, not because they’re offering variations on the same thing. It’s similar to comparing Netflix to the Criterion Streaming platform. Technically you’re doing the same thing, sitting on the couch watching a big screen, but the experience being pitched is a totally different one and the target customer doesn’t really overlap.
    - ssl-3 3mo ago
      They compete for finite dollars, too. There was a time when regular families had desktop computers at home. The marketing was intense, the machines were expensive, and the sales numbers were real. The PC was the gateway to all of the spoils of the internet and things were booming. Now families tend to have a collection expensive personal pocket supercomputers, instead. It's hard to justify the cost of a properly-stodgy computer when everything is online and the machines that everyone already has in their pockets are Good Enough to get things done (including entertainment).
redwall_hp 3mo ago
It's just loud Internet people. The Switch 2 is the second fastest selling game system of all time, and is keeping up with the trajectory of the first Switch, which shipped the most units of any gaming system. It'll probably get further boosts as Splatoon Raiders comes out (Splatoon is huge in Japan) and other anticipated titles. https://www.nintendolife.com/news/2026/06/switch-2s-first-year-hardware-sales-for-the-us-have-been-revealed https://www.nintendolife.com/news/2026/06/switch-2s-first-ye... I can't say I know anyone IRL who has any interest in leaving PlayStation. Nobody buys movies there and people who care about physical games are a minority...there are already Slim models without optical drives and GameStops are mostly Funko Pops because most people buy games online. It's too soon to have actual concrete data besides useless internet sentiment reporting though. And a lot of that is just vague anger about prices for all computing hardware being up...and everything else in the US. We're also at the ending stages of the PS5 lifecycle, but before a PS6 announcement. (With an unprecedented price increase this late in the cycle.) So there's no buzz about what's next, a large base of people who already have the existing thing, and an expectation that it will cost more. Meanwhile, the anticipated Grand Theft Auto 6 is on the way, and a PC release isn't on the table anytime soon.
- JauntyHatAngle 3mo ago
  >I can't say I know anyone IRL who has any interest in leaving PlayStation As a counterpoint to that. Most of my 30+ year old dad gamer friends (all of us are the type to own a PC, switch and ps5 pretty much) all are considering whether this will be our last sony generation as most of us are either physical copy people or suspect the pricing will be bad without a second hand market to compete. I don't think there is a mass exodus coming up, but a slow decline in console gaming for certain types of gamers, peaking in ps6 and digital only coming out is possible - whether that is more of a hit than the control of the market Sony will get from digital only is another question though. For example I doubt it'll stop many playing GTA 6, but general purchases on Sony vs PC may be weighted to the latter a bit more now than previously as that physical collection part is dead now for Sony, and arguably worse than the PC market in terms of there being only one store front for digital.
  - 3mo ago
mghackerlady 3mo ago
Nintendo will always exist, which I'm mostly okay with
- ColdStream 3mo ago
  They have their faults but they still seem to have their same goals in mind.
qwerpy 3mo ago
That backlash was nearly entirely on that other social media website that HN hates being compared to. And yet again, not representative of actual people. The xbox part may be true. I’d be extremely surprised if any PlayStation users in volume move to PC, that might be another loud opinion from that crowd due to the physical disc outrage. They would pay twice as much, have a less seamless experience, and still have worse graphics/performance. I say this as a primarily pc gamer. It’s not for most people.
fg137 3mo ago
> PlayStation users are moving to PC en masse Source? Is that reddit? It simply doesn't make sense.
- rvz 3mo ago
  HNers continue to never know that they are in their own bubble. The same reason why Linux on the Desktop is an ongoing meme.
  - ColdStream 3mo ago
    Pretty much. Like Linux on the desktop, until I see it, I don't believe it. Don't get me wrong, I only run Linux personally but until I see it at random offices, supermarkets and my parents place... its not taking off like it looks online.
alexchantavy 3mo ago
> PlayStation users are moving to PC en masse PC is even more digital-only than Playstation. No one buys physical games on PC. The only difference is that Valve has been a very good steward over Steam. Theoretically, PC can get as enshittified as PS. I guess there are other DRM-based purchasing platforms, and there's also DRM free ones like GOG so PC gamers have choice, but those feel niche mostly.
- trencedamp 3mo ago
  The difference is that there is no one steward. You don't need steam, there are lots of other ways to get your games. GoG, Itch.io, Windows Store, or just the developers webpage. On PlayStation, switch, or Xbox you have only one gatekeeper, and they do not respect you
- saratogacx 3mo ago
  The thing about PC though is that there is no exclusivity. Steam built an extremely well respected brand but if that were to turn, the moat is shallow, install a competing client and buy games from there instead. The only internal competition for consoles is digital or physical retail (Or I guess buying game codes could be pseudo-digital).
ColdStream 3mo ago
I get where you are coming from but that is a little reductionist. PlayStation I think is just going to have a slow bleed as the benefits to the platform seem to be... A new God of war in a few years? Xbox is being scrapped for parts and is now a zombie console. I suspect they are going to try the 3DO model and try to out source the hardware to any company that wants to buy their SOC and OS licence. Switch 2, actually doing damn well. Credit to Nintendo, they can be a little rough on pricing something's but they know how to stick to the core of the business. They have managed to keep the momentum between generations and that is difficult to do. It is a shame, if it wasn't for the high hardware costs, the Steam cube could have made a real don't in Sony/MS but that is not the world we are in. But a PC in a box that isn't locked down can never achieve the same kind of margins that a console can.

ryanm101 3mo ago

To be fair had RAM prices not screwed up the steam machine consoles would have been dooms earlier. They are about to enter a slow decline before death

inigyou 3mo ago
Consoles are suffering from the RAM price crisis just as much as PCs.
ColdStream 3mo ago
Maybe, they still aren't going to have the same economy of scale or the business loss leading tendency of some consoles. Valve doesn't want to be subsidizing hardware that can be used as a desktop. that puts them on the back foot. But I suspect Xbox is eventually going to go the path of Steam cube and end up licensing out hardware/software spec and let multiple vendors make hardware. The 3DO sales model may rise again some 35 years after the fact.

treyd 3mo ago

Consoles made sense as a product category where specialized graphics hardware was not generally available for consumer PCs. We have this now, every PC has some kind of graphics hardware, and has for many years. Consoles have been riding on their momentum of their brands, but the technical justification for their product category hasn't existed for 15+ years now.

dpoloncsak 3mo ago
The main thing consoles have going for them, imo, is the standardization of hardware. It's very easy to say "Yes this game will run on my console at 60 FPS because its identical to the other consoles where it runs at 60 FPS." Differing builds and drivers are not really a concern in the console world, where-as they are in the PC world. Some console gamers seem to think PC gaming requires hours of fiddling with settings and drivers. I think we've all had that experience on PC (cough Bethesda cough), but I doubt to the degree the console-side would have you believe. Most AAA games will self-optimize their settings to a playable state, and indie games don't tend to demand more than your standard gaming laptop can provide...but I'm sure we've all been burned some 10-odd years ago buying a Steam game that just wouldn't run on your iGPU...that experience sticks around in the brain a while
- robertlagrant 3mo ago
  That's one thing. The other is price. Consoles can be sold at a loss, particularly early in their 10-year cycle, when early on the loss is high, but close to the end of the cycle the loss is minimal, and so they appear much cheaper.
  - dpoloncsak 3mo ago
    Oh, for sure! It's not getting any better with PC part prices lately either... I've never considered that my old 360 was probably sold at a loss, knowing I'd buy LIVE and all the games they take a cut/license fee off of, but that makes complete sense to me
  - nemomarx 3mo ago
    Given recent price rises for console hardware I think they're struggling with that too though. The model doesn't work as well if the components get more expensive over time and not less?
    - Narishma 3mo ago
      But PC parts are also getting more expensive, so the difference is still there.
      - nemomarx 3mo ago
        Yeah I mean specifically the "sell at a loss, wait for costs to get lower over the generation" thing. if it's at a loss at the start of the generation and component costs only rise, it'll still sell for a loss at the end but also it'll be more expensive for customers. this puts the company in a hard position. a lot of gamers are also used to waiting until the end of the life of a console and getting games used, which might no longer be an option
  - Tsiklon 3mo ago
    This cycle is different. Prices have increased for both Sony and Microsoft’s consoles and no higher efficiency versions have been released (ala the PS3, X360).
bluescrn 3mo ago
Consoles don't have true 'generational leaps' any more either, the huge leaps forward in tech used to drive excitement/sales. Now we get incremental improvements, cross-generation games, and backwards compatibility. And AAA game development isn't exactly doing well these days.
- throwaway613746 3mo ago
  [dead]
- trencedamp 3mo ago
  Exactly. Indie development is where it's at. The best game I played in the last five years was probably A Short Hike. It moved me and inspired me to get back into game dev and it was made by one person
moger777 3mo ago
I think they still make sense for the non technical user. Having an idiomatic control makes setup far easier than on a PC and the UI for a console is designed to be used with a controller instead of a keyboard and mouse. This makes dealing with a television easier. I don't see consoles disappearing ever for those reasons.
- cwnyth 3mo ago
  -----
  - nirvdrum 3mo ago
    I don’t think the appeal is just to the less technically inclined masses. I’m a developer with a MacBook Pro and a Linux workstation. Proton has come a long way, but consoles just work for the most part; I never have to question whether the game will function and perform well on the console (setting aside the random buggy messes we see). Then there’s the convenience. I don’t want to play games where I work. I want to play on my TV. I have no interest in moving my workstation into my living room. Streaming with Moonlight works well enough, but there’s still lag. Even if I wanted to move my PC to the living room, the setup isn’t as nice. The Steam Machine has HDMI CEC and can power on with a controller — all the major consoles have had that for years. Even if I accepted all that, no one else in my household could play anything while I’m working on my computer. Things are a little weird now. If I’m going to have to go all digital, Steam Family is by far the best option of those with DRM. But, due to the astronomical cost of components, consoles are still pretty attractive.
    - inigyou 3mo ago
      > I never have to question whether the game will function and perform well on the console Thanks to recent moves by Sony, this is no longer the case!
      - nirvdrum 3mo ago
        Can you please elaborate? The recent moves I’ve seen have been announcing a shift to digital-only and another about clawing back movie purchases. Neither are appealing to me, but also aren’t related to game performance or compatibility.
naravara 3mo ago
Specialized graphics hardware hasn’t been the selling point of having a console since at least 2002 with the first XBox. The selling point of consoles is that they’re a software platform, with development incentives, standardized hardware, standardized UI conventions, and a centralized storefront to be able to conveniently and natively play stuff on your TV without fussing about. Valve has barely started to muscle in on the platform benefits of gaming on a PlayStation or XBox, but the more they start to do so the more they end up making design trade-offs that start to look like another console.
- ColdStream 3mo ago
  I will give it to Sony with the Ps3, at least the Cell was an attempt at something different hardware wise. But they also learned the lesson that building walled gardens of technology can keep people out just as easily as they try to keep them in.
mvkel 3mo ago
> Consoles made sense as a product category where specialized graphics hardware was not generally available for consumer PCs. This has almost never been true. GPUs existed, and were being used, before the N64. Your comment also begs the question that the console consumer has transitioned to a gaming pc. They haven't. Gaming PC sales (and hardware) are at all-time lows, except for GPUs, which should probably be renamed to Model Training Units. I would posit that what we're seeing is a reflection of a content problem, not hardware. Video games have gone the way of Hollywood, with sequels and derivatives, and an uninterested consumer base. People would rather watch a YouTube video of someone playing a video game than play a video game.
- Chinjut 3mo ago
  What PC GPU was in mainstream consumer use before the N64?
  - ssl-3 3mo ago
    The 3dfx Voodoo1 was very mainstream (and market-defining, even). It predates the N64.
    - Sohcahtoa82 3mo ago
      This is incorrect. N64 came out in the USA in September 1996. 3dfx Voodoo was released to consumers in October 1996.
      - ssl-3 3mo ago
        Oh noes!
    - redsocksfan45 3mo ago
      [dead]
- Sohcahtoa82 3mo ago
  > GPUs existed, and were being used, before the N64. Video cards existed, but 3D accelerators didn't really catch on until the 3dfx Voodoo, which came out about the same time as the N64. Even Quake II which came out a year later still offered software rendering. > Your comment also begs the question that the console consumer has transitioned to a gaming pc. They haven't. I'm only a single point of data, but I was a console gamer that transitioned to PC gaming, but that transition happened during the N64/PSX era. It was near the end of the PS2 cycle that I was full PC. > Gaming PC sales (and hardware) are at all-time lows Because prices are at all-time highs. I have a monster PC that I probably spent around $6,000 building, but with prices skyrocketing, it'd run me $10,000 to build it today. A few months ago, it would have been $11,000. > Video games have gone the way of Hollywood, with sequels and derivatives, and an uninterested consumer base. In the AAA world, this is true. So many gamers that only play Call of Duty, Fortnite, Minecraft, or a sports game. For CoD and the sports games, they reliably buy the latest release every year despite the lack of anything really being different. But the Indie world is huge and full of innovation. Balatro, Stardew Valley, Disco Elysium, Slay the Spire, Cuphead, I could go on. > People would rather watch a YouTube video of someone playing a video game than play a video game. I don't think that's true at all. Maybe for high-level play, or if the streamer has highly entertaining commentary, but otherwise definitely not true.
afavour 3mo ago
That doesn't really make sense. Consoles have always occupied a different space to PCs, not least because they plug into living room TVs. Very few people are going to trade that for a (considerably more expensive) PC. Gaming PCs also require specialized knowledge, more maintenance, etc etc. Consoles are pick up and go. I very much doubt they're dead yet.
- Rohansi 3mo ago
  You'll likely see a lot more Steam Machine-like PCs because of this. SteamOS fixes most of the problems you mention. Price is the new normal and you should expect next gen consoles to come closer to it. It's not a bad deal anyway when you consider the bigger library, cheaper games, and no subscription required. https://store.steampowered.com/sale/steammachine https://store.steampowered.com/sale/steammachine
  - afavour 3mo ago
    At that point I’d say we’re talking about a PC/console hybrid anyway so the distinction gets a little less useful.
    - Rohansi 3mo ago
      But why? The Steam Deck and Machine are pick up and go like consoles by default. Only a small minority care that it's actually a PC you can use for things other than games. The only thing that sets them apart is Steam's hardware isn't locked down.
- WhyNotHugo 3mo ago
  > Gaming PCs also require specialized knowledge, more maintenance, etc etc. If you want to build it yourself: sure. But less technically inclined folks can just buy one pre-assembled from a computer shop.
  - afavour 3mo ago
    You still need to stay on top of requirements as time passes though. Will game X run on my machine? By comparison a console game is for a generation of a console or it's for the next.
mschuster91 3mo ago
The thing with PCs is... they are open. Open means piracy and more importantly it means cheats. A console is a far easier thing to defend against cheaters than a PC - absent true hardware vulnerabilities (which become more and more expensive, now that stuff like voltage glitching, clock cutting and whatnot is all known and accounted for), you are basically limited to botted input and AI-assistance based on what can be seen on the screen.
dabinat 3mo ago
Another appeal of consoles is being able to sit on a couch and play. Most PC chairs are not as comfortable.
p_j_w 3mo ago
>Consoles have been riding on their momentum of their brands This is entirely wrong. Consoles have been riding consistency and ease of use. Sure, if you look just at the spec sheet consoles make no sense. But when you look at the whole experience combined with price, this is where consoles have always won. It's always been easier to hook my console up to the TV and start playing. The Steambox closes this gap with the overall experience, but still loses out on price. If consoles continue to enshittify, this might change.
ColdStream 3mo ago
The last generation where there really felt to be a big advantage to consoles was with the Xbox 360. Having Xbox live integrated at an OS level for cross game chat, messaging and music control was something that felt genuinely unique at the time and something that could only come from top down strategy. But Steam caught up with all of that and consoles didn't really innovate forwards from that either. The last big thing on consoles would have been the standard high speed SSD's and even then it hasn't been exploited as much as one would have liked. Ratchet and Clank : Rift apart did, but it feels like an exception, even then it works pretty well on the PC version even without the custom compression hardware.

bluescrn 3mo ago

PC gaming isn't exactly in a healthy place either (at least when it comes to hardware pricing/availability). Post-Covid GPU prices were bad enough even before the AI bubble ruined everything.

cryo32 3mo ago
Yeah. I gave up a couple of years ago after Epic broke my account and I lost my purchases irrecoverably. I have actually started playing board games with people now. This is so much better for me. And cheaper. And you can't taken them away.
- bluescrn 3mo ago
  Retro gaming is an increasingly popular option, too. These days I have more fun messing with Amigas, C64s, and cheap emulation handhelds than big modern games. Retro hardware prices have been going up fairly significantly though, especially for Amiga stuff.
  - ColdStream 3mo ago
    In 2020 I ended up selling most of my retro stuff, turns out it was a good time to do it due to the lock downs and a brief period of high prices for that stuff. But the main reason I sold was because I just wasn't interested in doing ongoing hardware maintenance. Emulation while not perfect was good enough for me. I see many retro machines nowadays that have HDMI port, USB controllers/memory cards, SD card disk readers, new power supplies etc. You start to realize that other than the motherboard and external case, it has all been replaced. They were built like commodity hardware and it shows, they aren't made to go decades. And that is with the popular stuff, if it is more obscure then your options are limited.

Hitton 3mo ago

I wouldn't be surprised if consoles got replaced by video game streaming. Not the next generation and probably not even the generation after that, but that will be most likely it.

zarzavat 3mo ago
Video game streaming requires a high quality internet connection to a nearby data center. It can work in certain places but there's always going to be places where it doesn't work, and consoles don't have that problem.
- DiskoHexyl 3mo ago
  Well Sony is actively working on that problem- the plebs in these internet-starved countries won’t be playing anyway, as with no optical drive in the future ps6 users are going to be tied to PSN which isn’t available on half the planet. Jokes aside I do agree that streaming doesn’t work reliably for all game genres and client geographies, mostly due to latency
- vel0city 3mo ago
  The question is, when does the market that does have that access start to completely crowd out the market that doesn't have that access? In a lot of the metro area where I live cloud gaming over 5G wireless is actually very feasible. I do it from time to time. I've tried it in a few other cities as well, with generally positive results. There are some games that just don't work well over cloud streaming though.
ColdStream 3mo ago
I have been hearing that since 2009 with Onlive and it still seems just as far away now as it was then. Current streaming services struggle at times to deliver consistent performance and quality, having low latency input involved in it just makes the problem worse.

add-sub-mul-div 3mo ago

People age out of wanting to sit in their bedroom with a handheld and become adults who have living rooms. For home gaming there will always be demand to play games on a real sized screen.

inigyou 3mo ago
Yeah so get a PC and install some games
saidinesh5 3mo ago
I think the steam deck proved otherwise too.. I haven't had enough motivation to sit on my couch and game after a long day .. But the same game, in bed, on my deck was so much nicer.. All I can now say is having a dedicated device, that's not your laptop/computer to play games is definitely a market - be it Steam machine (/custom builds), hand held gaming, or just regular consoles..
trencedamp 3mo ago
Some adults then lose that living room to their offspring and have to go back to playing in the bedroom. I speak from experience

rrgok 3mo ago

I would say the future is cloud gaming.

nazgulsenpai 3mo ago
Sadly, I agree with you. I don't like it, but it seems pretty clear.
trinsic2 3mo ago
The cloud gaming echo chamber has conveniently arrived to save the day by mimicking the solution to fix the problem the same industry created. Problem, Reaction, Solution.
criddell 3mo ago
Sadly, the future might be phone gaming. The mobile gaming market is as big as the console and PC markets combined.
- naravara 3mo ago
  These are basically different markets that only compete with each other because there are finite hours in the day to engage with media, not because they’re offering variations on the same thing. It’s similar to comparing Netflix to the Criterion Streaming platform. Technically you’re doing the same thing, sitting on the couch watching a big screen, but the experience being pitched is a totally different one and the target customer doesn’t really overlap.
  - ssl-3 3mo ago
    They compete for finite dollars, too. There was a time when regular families had desktop computers at home. The marketing was intense, the machines were expensive, and the sales numbers were real. The PC was the gateway to all of the spoils of the internet and things were booming. Now families tend to have a collection expensive personal pocket supercomputers, instead. It's hard to justify the cost of a properly-stodgy computer when everything is online and the machines that everyone already has in their pockets are Good Enough to get things done (including entertainment).

redwall_hp 3mo ago

It's just loud Internet people. The Switch 2 is the second fastest selling game system of all time, and is keeping up with the trajectory of the first Switch, which shipped the most units of any gaming system. It'll probably get further boosts as Splatoon Raiders comes out (Splatoon is huge in Japan) and other anticipated titles. https://www.nintendolife.com/news/2026/06/switch-2s-first-year-hardware-sales-for-the-us-have-been-revealed https://www.nintendolife.com/news/2026/06/switch-2s-first-ye... I can't say I know anyone IRL who has any interest in leaving PlayStation. Nobody buys movies there and people who care about physical games are a minority...there are already Slim models without optical drives and GameStops are mostly Funko Pops because most people buy games online. It's too soon to have actual concrete data besides useless internet sentiment reporting though. And a lot of that is just vague anger about prices for all computing hardware being up...and everything else in the US. We're also at the ending stages of the PS5 lifecycle, but before a PS6 announcement. (With an unprecedented price increase this late in the cycle.) So there's no buzz about what's next, a large base of people who already have the existing thing, and an expectation that it will cost more. Meanwhile, the anticipated Grand Theft Auto 6 is on the way, and a PC release isn't on the table anytime soon.

JauntyHatAngle 3mo ago
>I can't say I know anyone IRL who has any interest in leaving PlayStation As a counterpoint to that. Most of my 30+ year old dad gamer friends (all of us are the type to own a PC, switch and ps5 pretty much) all are considering whether this will be our last sony generation as most of us are either physical copy people or suspect the pricing will be bad without a second hand market to compete. I don't think there is a mass exodus coming up, but a slow decline in console gaming for certain types of gamers, peaking in ps6 and digital only coming out is possible - whether that is more of a hit than the control of the market Sony will get from digital only is another question though. For example I doubt it'll stop many playing GTA 6, but general purchases on Sony vs PC may be weighted to the latter a bit more now than previously as that physical collection part is dead now for Sony, and arguably worse than the PC market in terms of there being only one store front for digital.
- 3mo ago

mghackerlady 3mo ago

Nintendo will always exist, which I'm mostly okay with

ColdStream 3mo ago
They have their faults but they still seem to have their same goals in mind.

qwerpy 3mo ago

That backlash was nearly entirely on that other social media website that HN hates being compared to. And yet again, not representative of actual people. The xbox part may be true. I’d be extremely surprised if any PlayStation users in volume move to PC, that might be another loud opinion from that crowd due to the physical disc outrage. They would pay twice as much, have a less seamless experience, and still have worse graphics/performance. I say this as a primarily pc gamer. It’s not for most people.

fg137 3mo ago

> PlayStation users are moving to PC en masse Source? Is that reddit? It simply doesn't make sense.

rvz 3mo ago
HNers continue to never know that they are in their own bubble. The same reason why Linux on the Desktop is an ongoing meme.
- ColdStream 3mo ago
  Pretty much. Like Linux on the desktop, until I see it, I don't believe it. Don't get me wrong, I only run Linux personally but until I see it at random offices, supermarkets and my parents place... its not taking off like it looks online.

alexchantavy 3mo ago

> PlayStation users are moving to PC en masse PC is even more digital-only than Playstation. No one buys physical games on PC. The only difference is that Valve has been a very good steward over Steam. Theoretically, PC can get as enshittified as PS. I guess there are other DRM-based purchasing platforms, and there's also DRM free ones like GOG so PC gamers have choice, but those feel niche mostly.

trencedamp 3mo ago
The difference is that there is no one steward. You don't need steam, there are lots of other ways to get your games. GoG, Itch.io, Windows Store, or just the developers webpage. On PlayStation, switch, or Xbox you have only one gatekeeper, and they do not respect you
saratogacx 3mo ago
The thing about PC though is that there is no exclusivity. Steam built an extremely well respected brand but if that were to turn, the moat is shallow, install a competing client and buy games from there instead. The only internal competition for consoles is digital or physical retail (Or I guess buying game codes could be pseudo-digital).

ColdStream 3mo ago

I get where you are coming from but that is a little reductionist. PlayStation I think is just going to have a slow bleed as the benefits to the platform seem to be... A new God of war in a few years? Xbox is being scrapped for parts and is now a zombie console. I suspect they are going to try the 3DO model and try to out source the hardware to any company that wants to buy their SOC and OS licence. Switch 2, actually doing damn well. Credit to Nintendo, they can be a little rough on pricing something's but they know how to stick to the core of the business. They have managed to keep the momentum between generations and that is difficult to do. It is a shame, if it wasn't for the high hardware costs, the Steam cube could have made a real don't in Sony/MS but that is not the world we are in. But a PC in a box that isn't locked down can never achieve the same kind of margins that a console can.