7 ms·
45% of enthusiasts 'seriously considering' leaving Sony for PC
- downrightmike 4mo agoLiterally no point to specific hardware
- ticulatedspline 4mo agoNot sure why. looking at the polls it would seem the primary points are 1) Sony ending physical disks 2) potential high price of next gen. 1 is hilarious, even games that come on physical disks are already mostly useless without internet. I had a ps4 and bought "Last of Us" and the game is literally unbeatable without an internet connection. It has a game breaking bug that isn't patched on disk. Many other games are crap or broken without patches. Also jumping to PC where there hasn't been physical media in ages and 99% of games have DRM is just out of the frying pan into the fire. based on the market share for GOG I can assure you only a small fraction of gamers actually care about "owning" their games. 2 is kinda stupid, they mentioned a price point of $1,000, not sure you can build a next-gen-console comparable PC for that price. My current computer's GPU cost more than that by itself and anything but a pittance of RAM will too. I mean go for it, more PC gamers the better (it's my chosen platform) but if you weren't already on board years ago not sure anything has really changed.
- sylens 4mo agoPhysical disks were one of the last differentiators that consoles had. 20 years ago, you could buy a game, take it home, put it into the console, and begin playing straightaway. Now it has to be installed first to storage, which of course the console has a finite amount of and will cost you more money to expand it. There's also been a complete shift from local multiplayer and dedicated servers/server browsers to gating online play behind subscriptions and forcing everyone through matchmaking in order to serve up cannon fodder for more experienced players.
- emdash 4mo agoI am fine with not having physical media for games on Steam because I trust Steam to do the right thing. I already know for a fact that Sony won't do the right thing because they have always done the worst possible thing at every chance.
- nubinetwork 4mo agoWhy? It makes no sense really... you buy into a console and stay with it until the next release... Last time I checked, the ps6 hasn't been announced, there probably won't be a Xbox one X/S/pro/whatever successor any time soon, and PC hardware is expensive or hard to get right now. Just stay the road for 6 months and see how the market shakes out.
- nottorp 4mo agoYou missed the part where Sony is going download only, which means any attempt to collect playstation games in the long run becomes impossible.
- nubinetwork 4mo agoI'm aware of that announcement, but its just words until they have a console to back it up with.
- nottorp 4mo agoThey will drop discs for the ps5 too starting 2028. They don't need a new console.
- nubinetwork 4mo agoThey tried dropping discs when they launched the ps5, but I don't think many people bought the online only version because North American internet still sucks.
- everdrive 4mo agoGaming is getting too expensive. This feels like sort of an accident of complex systems. Budgets for games are skyrocketing, graphics requirements are skyrocketing. But, some of the most fun games in the world were made 30 ago. From a pure "can we have good entertainment?" standpoint there's no reason for this cost creep. In practice, companies are pushing it, and although it probably does not apply to the HN crowd, but consumers are also demanding better graphics. The industry and its fans are its own worst enemies. However, if you don't go bonkers over recent AAA games, gaming has never been more accessible or cheaper. I didn't buy a game this steam sale for more than $3, and each game would run on more or less anything.
- aprilthird2021 4mo agoI do wonder if a studio that made a lot of smaller games with less technical specs but spent all the money in fun gameplay design and character design and stories would outcompete major AAA game studios. I think I'm just describing mobile game studios pre-gachafication
- alex43578 4mo agoI think you’re also describing the indie/lower-budget scene that does very well on Steam. There’s plenty of games that break out via streaming, for instance.
- trial3 4mo agothis is sorta the Blumhouse model
- dashmeet 4mo agoIsn’t this Nintendo? Pretty sure they’ve proven that you don’t need the latest in graphics (always a generation behind) to make engaging games.
- everdrive 4mo agoIt's very interesting. I played that new-ish Marvel: Cosmic Invasion game and recently played Fight 'N Rage. I believe both are built in the exact same game engine. Fight 'N Rage, which is undoubtedly the better of the two games (although both are quite fun) had a tiny roster. I think there was a single primary developer, and then one guy did the music and maybe 1-2 other people helped with things. The Marvel game was made by a "real" studio and had tens (hundreds?) of staff to build what was effectively a slightly lower quality game. (although the Marvel game had a much smaller staff than anything like a modern AAA release.) Famously, Doom and Quake were made by quite small teams. I don't know what the answer is, but there just seems to be unavoidable bloat all around. Staff, cost, complexity, system requirements, etc.
- miiiiiike 4mo agoSure. Until the first FromSoftware PS6 exclusive is released. Child, six, seriously considering running away from home after parents refuse to serve dinner on dinosaur plate. People realize that Steam doesn't use physical media, right? The real issue is the lack of consumer friendly regulation, not the medium.
- zetanor 4mo agoSome people like disc cases and the actual disk itself, but the main gripes I've seen with digital only games on consoles were: 1) without a disc you can't give/trade/sell the game, 2) without a disc the game can be taken away from you, 3) if you can't make an offline backup copy of the game and transfer it from console to console, most/every copy of a game will eventually disappear. Steam has issues, and you certainly can't (legally) trade or sell your library, but nearly no single player games on the platform have DRM. Thus, you can have as many off-Steam backups as you want (which can't be remotely deleted/disabled), and you could certainly "give" the game to a friend (but don't copy that floppy), or otherwise preserve it for posterity.
- weezing 4mo agoSteam provides awesome services tho. PSN is utter shit.
- emdash 4mo agoI've been using Steam for 15 years and in that time they have never done me wrong. I trust Valve to do the right thing. On the other hand, I know for a fact that sony will do the worst possible thing over and over again every time they have the chance to. Remember that time Sony took away features from the PS3 that were advertised selling points? Remember when modders added the features back and Sony sent them to prison?
- dayvid 4mo agoConsoles have been on their last gap as the difference between what consoles and PCs offer have converged. PS2 had significant sales because it was many customers first DVD player. With everything digital and console prices coming close to mid-tier Gaming PCs, where's the benefit of buying a console? Nintendo was smart for making the Switch a hybrid console.
- sylens 4mo agoIf I were Sony, I would worry just as much about the people who bow out of playing games altogether, or just retreat into retro games especially with all the new Android handhelds targeting them.
- righthand 4mo agoI for one recommend building an i7 box and really anything from that generation are still really good CPUs if youre making a gaming box. Otherwise you may run into RAM costs or some other high hardware costs.
- haunter 4mo ago>an i7 box and really anything from that generation That doesn't mean anything at all. The i7 is a family of CPUs which can be anything from a 2009 i7-860 (with DDR3 support only) to a 2023 i7-14700k (with DDR5 support). Insane performance difference.
- ThunderSizzle 4mo agoI think the point is that an i7, even from ~15 years ago, is probably sufficient for most gaming needs, especially if the game is primarily GPU-bound. As long as you give the older CPU enough RAM, an SSD, and a good GPU, it probably is sufficient unless your doing sim-heavy games where you want the simulation speed to be maxed out (e.g. HoI4 later years max speed simulation)
- haunter 4mo agoThe CPU will be a bottleneck even if you use ~7 years old RTX 2060. Anything newer just wouldn't work. Honestly buying a 15 years old CPU is just an own goal when it will be outperformed by any modern budget i3
- righthand 4mo agoSorry my comment is about finding hardware that affordably allows you to build a good gaming rig if that’s the sole purpose. There are plenty of previous gen cpus that will give most gamers 90% of what they want to play no need for the LATEST hardware. That dream is dying.
- haunter 4mo agoI think it's driven more about piracy than anything else. Steam is not an alternative if you hate digital only games. PC as a platform (and that can mean anything from Windows to Linux to Mac) is an alternative as cheaper gaming becasue 1, you can pirate games easier 2, you can emulate older games. It really comes down to the next PS6 exclusive, would people buy a console just to play Dark Souls 4? That's the billion dollar question
- 4chandaily 4mo agoThere is also the fact that games on steam get (much) cheaper (much) faster than console games. Discounts are more common, also.
- MYEUHD 4mo ago> Steam is not an alternative if you hate digital only games. GOG is the alternative. It sells DRM-free games
- haunter 4mo agoThat entirely depends on the games you want to play. Check the most played games on Steam and how many of them are available on GOG. 1 out of 10 or even less.
- AngryData 4mo agoTo be fair many of those are multiplayer games with required updates and anticheat.
- haunter 4mo ago30 is f2p from the top 100 From the remaining paid 70 there are 2 softwares (Wallpaper Engine and Crosshair X) From the remaining 67 there are 2 versions of ARK Survival and GTAV so we can count those once. That leaves us with 65 games From the 65 games 13 are available on GOG: - Baldur's Gate 3 - Cyberpunk 2077 - Factorio - Kingdom Come: Deliverance II - Mount & Blade II: Bannerlord - Project Zomboid - RimWorld - Stardew Valley - Stellaris - Terraria - The Binding of Isaac: Rebirth - The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim - The Witcher 3: Wild Hunt That’s 1 out of 5 which is better than I've guessed (1 out of 10)
- sdevonoes 4mo agoI was waiting for GTA 6… but if it’s not released in disk, then I will simply pass. If new games start to be non-physical, then I will simply stop playing new games
- dylan604 4mo agoAs soon as you put a physical disc into a console, it immediately ignores its contents and downloads all new code. In this way, the physical disc is simply a physical DRM. At some point, the game has to be saved in some state well in advance of release date to manufacture/ship said physical disc with enough time to have it be available for release date. Back when I was last involved with physical shiny round discs back in 2007, it was minimum 6-8 weeks. That's forever in game dev for changes to be made so that the content on the disc is probably just heavy assets used by whatever is downloaded.
- benbristow 4mo agoDon't really have the room for a gaming PC anymore after moving, I've got my old one but it needs some fixing up (RTX 3080). 1TB Xbox One Series X I got second hand for about $400 (also added a storage expansion for about $130) is doing me sound for any gaming needs (currency converted from GBP). All the games optimised, usually 60fps, no messing about with settings other than the quality/performance switches. Looks great on the TV with 4K/HDR. Laptop for the day to day workstation stuff. Lovely controller. Been enjoying Forza Horizon 6 and just started playing Star Wars Outlaws. Used to be pretty 'PC Master Race' but then life got in the way. I do miss stuff like modded Valve games and keyboard & mouse, but can run them somewhat on my laptop.
- DANmode 4mo agoIs keeping an Xbox and its software updated easier than a Steam Machine? Serious question.
- benbristow 4mo agoI've only ever owned a Steam Deck so can't really comment. I used it a couple times intending to use it when travelling by train then sold it because it was too wide/big to really carry around with the carry case. Didn't really see the advantage over just playing mobile games (or doomscrolling social media etc) or playing more indie/basic games on the laptop. Xbox is fine, it updates itself (firmware/OS updates only take about 5 mins) and the servers are fast enough. There's basically no maintenance. Can be annoying if it's a game you wanted to play at the moment updating but then Steam is the same.
- DANmode 4mo agoThanks - I believe Steam Deck is what I meant!
- pseudosavant 4mo agoYes. There are no launchers for games that need to be updated. Everything just automatically gets updated constantly. The biggest value prop for me with console gaming is that it just works, every time. No GPU/launcher/mod/etc updates to deal with ever. I've owned some gaming PCs and every time I've learned that I don't want a hobby of maintaining a gaming PC. I want to sit down, in my favorite comfy chair, with a controller (because I've already been on a keyboard all day), and just play.
- khalic 4mo agoSorry but gamers are the most docile customer base, this won’t translate to anything.
- case_ratchet 4mo agoDocile, sure, but if the PS6 really does launch at $1000+, I can see quite a few folks giving up on the ecosystem.
- tcmart14 4mo agoI think it depends. This will probably be true if PS6 is an outlier in price in its generation. But from the way it looking, PC gaming is also just going up in price and a xbox will probably be somewhere in the ballpark, almost all due to hardware prices. Ive read rumors the next gen xbox is speculated to also be in the $1,000 range and its pretty much known that valve wanted to do around $800 for the steam machine, but hardware prices made that non-viable for their scale. I think it'd b more accurate to predict that people won't just give up on the ecosystem, but gaming in general. Or more people will just move to gotcha phone games.
- DANmode 4mo ago“…and Tom, we’re hearing reports that those numbers are approaching 80% in groups of consumers who have been informed they can simply use a controller with a PC.”
- dreamcompiler 4mo agoI haven't bought a Sony product since 2005 when they put a rootkit on music CDs. Apparently their customer-hostile attitude hasn't changed much.
- jl6 4mo agoAll forms of entertainment are entering crisis, because there is so much of it competing for attention, and so many years of back catalog that are still entertaining and available for free-or-nearly-free. Premium gaming and premium content of any kind seems unsustainable.
- carra 4mo ago> Premium gaming and premium content of any kind seems unsustainable. That's one of the main problems of current gaming. Games have become just "content". And as such they are disposable. Why replay (and appreciate) something you liked? Just play something else.
- michaelbrave 4mo agoI would only buy consoles after they had been out a few years, mid to late lifetime of the console, the primary benefit was it's nice to have in the living room instead of on a desk. Most of the games I bought were used or on sale. All of my purchases have been long tail distribution of a system. If a console goes digital only I won't buy the console. Most of my games are on pc now anyway, none of the modern games are way better than older ones, the only reason to keep up with the times is for community and discussion around the current events of the game, but I prefered single player games in the first place. But even now I have a backlog I can never finish in my lifetime, most of which are considered good. So long story short, if Sony goes digital only, I will go back to retro and pc and I won't feel like I'm missing out that much if at all.
- emdash 4mo agoI just have a desktop computer plugged into the TV in the living room.
- 369548684892826 4mo agoI use sunshine/moonlight for local streaming
- AngryData 4mo agoYeah that is what I do with an OG steam controller. I don't really understand why so many people are resistant to the idea. It makes a far better media center than any smart tv too in my opinion.
- Pay08 4mo agoThe primary benefit of consoles is a mix of price (at least in theory) and exclusives, which Sony still does.
- phendrenad2 4mo agoI'm more surprised that one of the top Playstation-related sites only got 6k votes on a poll. Times sure have changed.
- ErneX 4mo agoI don’t think I’ll jump back to PC but I look forward seeing SteamOS getting more traction. Windows really needs to get their act together.
- dylan604 4mo agoAfter the success of the portable devices like the Switch with a dock, building a non-portable device only seems like continuing to build farming equipment for oxen.
- ErneX 4mo agoPlayStation is going to release a portable console with docking functionality too. It might even come out before the PS6.
- Mindwipe 4mo agoIt's an open poll on a website with no sampling and no detection for bad actors. For goodness sake, this is literally useless. It tells us nothing. Even a games website should be embarrassed of it's journalism trying to run this as a story.
- forshaper 4mo agoOnly problem with PC gaming is gpu & ram prices.
- bigyabai 4mo agoIt's not exclusive to PC: https://www.pcmag.com/news/another-xbox-price-increase-is-coming-buy-now-to-avoid-paying-150-more https://www.pcmag.com/news/another-xbox-price-increase-is-co... https://www.engadget.com/gaming/playstation/the-ps5-is-getting-more-expensive-again-133141514.html https://www.engadget.com/gaming/playstation/the-ps5-is-getti...
- forshaper 4mo agoI guess ssds are following, huh
- natas 4mo agoI won't make the mistake to buy any other sony product.
- dinkleberg 4mo agoPerhaps I'm overly cynical, but I would wager these survey results are completely meaningless. Being angry at Sony for ending physical games is the "correct opinion" right now and all of the social media influencers are getting big views off of the drama. And a significant number of people will just parrot the outrage they hear about even if they don't actually care. But by the time the PS6 comes out, I would bet that a significant portion of those who claim this is too far and they'll never buy from Sony again will be back buying their devices. It does suck, and you should join the PCMR. But I imagine this will blow over before long.
- ronsor 4mo agoI don't think it'll blow over as easily because the PS6 is going to be as expensive as a PC[0], at $1,000 or more. The usual things that inhibit consumer action are hassle, expense, and inertia, and Sony is dishing out all of that to its customers already. [0] https://www.notebookcheck.net/PS6-price-estimate-now-1000-and-release-date-delay-could-raise-console-s-cost-further.1330143.0.html https://www.notebookcheck.net/PS6-price-estimate-now-1000-an...
- bathtub365 4mo agoWhat PC are they going to get for a comparable price, that also has a disc drive? The Steam Machine came out more expensive than they wanted due to the current component price crisis and doesn’t have a disc drive. And even then, where is anyone buying physical PC releases?
- ronsor 4mo agoThe disc drive itself is not relevant so much as what it represents. On a PC, you have much more freedom even without a disc drive. On a PlayStation, without a disc drive, you are fully at the mercy of Sony 24/7.
- foolfoolz 4mo agototally agree. gaming is a passion industry, the fans are vocal and passionate, but also fleeting. and the vast majority of gamers today are digital only anyway
- bathtub365 4mo agoThe majority of respondents claiming this is because of Sony ending production of disc based games seems crazy to me. How do they think you get games on PC? My Steam Deck doesn’t have a disc drive and desktop PC case doesn’t even have a 5.25” drive bay.
- maxglute 4mo agoProbably net good for gamers if everything went PC long run anyways.
- JKCalhoun 4mo agoNot a "gamer", but I'm surprised that, after say the 1990's, anyone would want a console gaming machine.
- LennyHenrysNuts 4mo agoI stopped buying consoles after the PS3 and the PS Vita, with the exception of an Anbernic Cube XX. Nowadays if I game at all it's PS1 and SNES classics on the Cube XX.