7 ms·
A nearly perfect USB cable tester
- Onavo 7mo agoI just want one that tells me the maximum voltage and current supported by a USB C cable.
- wolfi1 7mo agothere are several: one that is moderately priced and which I consider myself to buy is the JOY-IT UM120
- contingencies 7mo agoGot this recently for USD$3 on sale: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005006848187940.html https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005006848187940.html
- fmajid 7mo agoThe Treedix will tell you that, as it is a feature of the eMarker chip (no chip means 60W).
- SAI_Peregrinus 7mo agoAssuming the chip isn't fraudulently added. Like in the article, some manufacturers are shady & will sell cables with e-marker chips for capabilities the cable can't actually support.
- fmajid 7mo agoYes, but the only way to test for something like that would be to put the rated load and see if the cable smokes. Not something a family-friendly tester would do.
- SAI_Peregrinus 7mo agoNo need to check for smoke, just need to check the voltage drop between source port & sink port. You need a >5A output power supply, two voltmeter channels (for source & sink), one ammeter channel (to sense applied load), an electronic DC load (actively cooled FET that uses the ammeter to set a constant current), a microcontroller, screen, some buttons, and software to run the whole thing. Or the manual version: Lab power supply, some USB connector breakout boards, a DC load, optionally a multimeter, a pencil, and some graph paper. Set the power supply current limit over 5A, voltage to 5V, set the DC load to 500mA, and measure the voltage at the power supply & DC load every 100mA as you increase it up to 5A load (or 3A if the cable isn't marked for 5A capability). If the sink drops more than 0.6V below the source, the cable is not compliant.
- fmajid 7mo agoRight, but you can't expect a pocket sized tester like the Treedix to implement that, even if it is the USB standard test for compliance. The Treedix does measure resistance on the cable, however, so if a cable exceeds 250mΩ it would also flunk your more accurate test.
- Gigachad 7mo agoThe thing that has been bothering me for a while is that the USB spec allows for software detection of capabilities. You can read the emarker data and see the supported protocols, speeds, voltages, etc. But there is not standard for usb controllers to present this data to the OS. So it’s stuck in the low level firmware and never passed up. In theory we could have a popup box that tells you that both your computer and other device support higher speeds/more power, but your cable is limiting it. Apple seems best able to do this since they control the hardware and OS, yet they aren’t doing it either. Users are just left to be confused about why things are slow.
- avian 7mo ago> In theory we could have a popup box that tells you that both your computer and other device support higher speeds/more power, but your cable is limiting it. I'm pretty sure my old Dell XPS laptop with Windows 10 had pop-ups just like this. "This device can run faster" or something.
- LoganDark 7mo agoEven Apple now has one of those, when you plug something into the USB 2 port on the MacBook Neo.
- Gigachad 7mo agoThere’s still nothing when you plug a usb3 device in using a usb2 cable.
- Vogtinator 7mo agoAFAIK that's just when plugging in a USB 3 device into a USB 2 port or using a USB 2 cable.
- mrandish 7mo ago> that's just when plugging in a USB 3 device into a USB 2 port Dell XPS laptops (and some others) can also warn if the charger isn't providing the full wattage the laptop is rated for. This warning is an option that can be turned off in the BIOS settings. I usually turn it off because I sometimes intentionally do day trips with a smaller/lighter portable charger which delivers 45w to my laptop which can need up to 65w due to having a discrete GPU. However, 45w is more than sufficient to charge the laptop during normal use on the Balanced power plan with iGPU. I only need more than 45w when gaming with the discrete GPU active.
- Modified3019 7mo agoI’ve had one for a while as well. I don’t use it often, but frankly I couldn’t sort my cables without it.
- amelius 7mo agoI want one that sends a pseudorandom data stream and tells me the bit error rate.
- deleted 7mo ago[deleted]
- the_biot 7mo agoYup, that's the sort of thing that's typically missing from cable testers. I have a USB cable that normally works fine, but introduces errors when doing full blast USB 2.0 bulk transfers. I keep it around just in case I ever come across a tester that can show me this in hard numbers.
- HDBaseT 7mo agoProducts that do exactly that do exist, although are prohibitively expensive. [0] It is difficult to send 10Gbps, 20Gbps, 40Gbps or even 80Gbps, then receive it, then validate it. [0] - https://www.totalphase.com/products/advanced-cable-tester-v2/ https://www.totalphase.com/products/advanced-cable-tester-v2...
- Dylan16807 7mo agoI'm sure it's hard to do a detailed eye analysis at those speeds. But come on, I can get a hub that does 10Gbps per lane (so 20Gbps equivalent) for $13, 40Gbps SSD enclosures for $40, and 80Gbps SSD enclosures for $150. Making that signal do a loop, maybe adding some artificial attenuation, and checking how many bits get corrupted shouldn't need fancier hardware than that.
- specialist 7mo agoYes and: If a cable has any faults, of any kind. I can't believe I'm still swapping cables and ports, trial and error, trying to determine if the cable, the port (eg iPhone's charging port), or both, are failing. Not knowing the USB specs; I assume each head of a cable can do a loop back test, determine if can even see its other head, etc.
- atoav 7mo agoOne thing to realize is that especially for high resolution video cables these cheap testers can't really deliver. The way to test them is a eye diagram (see: https://incompliancemag.com/eye-diagram-part2/ https://incompliancemag.com/eye-diagram-part2/ ) and testers with that capsbility cost upwards of 10.000 Eurodollars.
- deleted 7mo ago[deleted]
- jmalicki 7mo agoSo you're saying there is something to audiophile grade HDMI cables?
- HPsquared 7mo agoWith digital signals and ECC, the cable need only be "good enough" to get perfect data transfer through the system.
- jmalicki 7mo agoHis link made very clear the issues of jitter and flickering.
- tom_alexander 7mo agoThese two statements aren't mutually exclusive. The link is looking at the analog signal through an oscilloscope. The person you replied to is pointing out that after decoding and applying error correction, you can still end up with the same digital signal output. So the eye diagram charts are useful for detecting the quality of the cable, but as long as the quality is past a certain threshold, it does not matter.
- SAI_Peregrinus 7mo agoAnd that threshold is "baked in" to the eye mask pattern you load into the tester. If the eye stays out of the masked areas, it passes, if it goes into the masked areas it fails. Oscilloscopes capable of eye diagram testing can trigger on failure, so if it passes an eye test it'll reconstruct correctly with proper timing.
- Eisenstein 7mo agoHopefully they used connectors with a high mating cycle rating.
- seanalltogether 7mo agoI wasn't surprised to learn that when Linus Tech Tips released those new usb-c cables, that they all sold out almost instantly. They put their entire reputation on the line to claim (and label) the exact capabilities of their usb cables. Isn't that all we really want?
- MaxikCZ 7mo ago[flagged]
- argsnd 7mo agoLTT are fine. I would strongly consider their products if they had any warehousing in Europe to make shipping here cheaper.
- AngryData 7mo agoYeah I don't see any problems with their stuff. It ain't exactly cheap, but a large part of that is their work in making sure you aren't just getting some random 2 dollar trash.
- bryanhogan 7mo agoThe video: https://youtu.be/OT_iyvOy0Tk https://youtu.be/OT_iyvOy0Tk Of course they are advertising their own new USB cable, but as someone who didn't know much about USB cables I find it quite interesting.
- AceJohnny2 7mo agoThey lost me at "our conductors are coax!". USB is designed around differential signaling, which is what twisted pair excels at.
- Dylan16807 7mo agoTwisted pair is good but it only gets your losses so low at these speeds. Keep in mind that USB cables have a very small budget for signal loss, and at 40Gbps they're carrying frequencies 25x higher than 10gig ethernet.
- ChrisMarshallNY 7mo agoThis isn't a Beagle. When I first read the headline, I was hoping that it would be more than a smart continuity tester. It seems to be a more comprehensive "Make sure the lines go where they are supposed to" tester. Looks pretty good. But the devices that test things like transmission speed, are a lot more expensive. I think that many of the issues that this device tests, can be mitigated by simply buying cables from reputable sources.
- Liftyee 7mo agoOnce in the realm of signal integrity, it's true that the price goes straight into lab grade levels. Even in my reputable cables, there are a couple with suspicious continuity issues. I wonder if this could find them. You could probably build a data transfer tester using an FPGA and some signal processing.
- mwexler 7mo agoWasn't aware of this level of testing. $1300 for a Beagle is a big step up.
- ChrisMarshallNY 7mo agoThat's a cheap one. Some of the analyzers can go into 5 figures. Don't forget the speeds at which modern serial interfaces go. Being able to look at the data, at that speed, requires some serious kit.
- SAI_Peregrinus 7mo agoAnd the Beagles only do digital-domain stuff, they won't get you an eye diagram or a bit error rate. Even for USB 2.0 that's quite expensive, the test fixture from Keysight¹ is about $800, the differential probe they recommend is the $11,000 N2752A², the oscilloscope in the minimum configuration that meets the >1.5GHz bandwidth requirement they sell is the DSOX6002A³ for $24,000, and you'll also need a software option license for the eye diagram testing option. Not to mention a PC to run the USB-IF compliance test software, but that's pocket change at this point in the spending. Keep in mind that's just for the 480Mib/s USB 2.0. If you want to test USB 5Gbps, USB 10Gbps, USB 20Gbps, USB 40Gbps, or USB 80Gbps you'll be spending much more money. The USB4 V2 GEN4 Electrical Compliance Test Specification⁴ requires a 25GHz bandwidth realtime oscilloscope with ≥80Gs/s sample rate or better. Not to mention a ≥25.6Gbps pattern generator/BERT, 20GHz network analyzer, & RF signal generator, all of which are "call for quote" but likely to be in the 6-digit price range. You're easily looking at the better part of half a million dollars to test the 80Gbps cables fully. ¹https://www.keysight.com/us/en/product/E2667B/usb-2-0-hi-speed-host-test-fixture-kit.html https://www.keysight.com/us/en/product/E2667B/usb-2-0-hi-spe... ²https://www.keysight.com/us/en/product/N2752A/infiniimode-active-differential-probe-6-ghz.html https://www.keysight.com/us/en/product/N2752A/infiniimode-ac... ³https://www.keysight.com/us/en/products/oscilloscopes/benchtop/advanced-benchtop-oscilloscopes/build-my-product.html https://www.keysight.com/us/en/products/oscilloscopes/bencht... ⁴https://www.usb.org/document-library/usb4-electrical-compliance-test-specification https://www.usb.org/document-library/usb4-electrical-complia...
- Raed667 7mo agoAs someone who really doesn't care about learning the details, and just want one USB-C cable that does it ALL to put in my backpack what should I buy ?
- publicmail 7mo agoA thunderbolt cable
- Raed667 7mo agoWould it work with USB-C screens and projectors ?
- bombcar 7mo agoAnd to be precise, a nice, high quality thunderbolt cable from a reputable manufacturer like Apple or OWC. Protect the cable as it will have been expensive, but it will work very well.
- mystifyingpoi 7mo agoThis is the solution, but it is 1) expensive and 2) Thunderbolt cables are quite short compared to regular USB-C.
- Gigachad 7mo agoYou don’t really want that. A thunderbolt cable is both stiff and expensive. They only really make sense to leave attached to the back of a monitor or dock. What would work better is a flexible 100w+ usb3 cable. You can’t do thunderbolt on it but it’s a tiny fraction of the cost and does everything you’d actually need on the go. If you actually do want it, this is the do everything cable https://www.apple.com/au/xc/product/MW5H3ZA/A https://www.apple.com/au/xc/product/MW5H3ZA/A
- Liftyee 7mo agoBrilliant little device. I will be picking one up ASAP!. Didn't know that lying cables were a thing but I have a ton of charge only cables?! I speculate USB B wasn't included because there are only really two types, 2.0 (regular size) and 3.0 (has an obvious extension on the connector). There also don't tend to be power-only A-B cables because they are usually found on printers, Arduino s, ... And not for charging devices. Fun fact: A Xiaomi fast charge cable (with orange plugs) has an extra contact on the A end to support USB C PD out of a USB A charger.
- dijit 7mo agoI actually purchased one of these as this article has surfaced before. It’s well worth the hype, I used it to audit all my cables (both for home and work) and it’s amazing how many thick and unwieldy cables are actually terrible for data. For example I purchased a pair of B&W Px8 S2 noise cancelling headphones, which boast a DAC if you connect via USB-C directly, the cable it came with though was thick but only rated for USB 2.0 speeds. These headphones cost more than AirPods Max, which are themselves considered overpriced, and include comforts like nappa leather; so shipping with a chunky cable that doesn’t even carry decent data feels like a bizarre oversight. Apple’s own USB-C cables manage the same power delivery at less than half the thickness with a woven shell. You’d assume a premium product would at least match that. Honourable mention to the USB-C cables that ship with Dell Ultrasharp monitors (both pre-USB4 and post). Those support basically everything except Thunderbolt 4 despite being unmarked.
- fwip 7mo agoIs there any audio you might play that doesn't fit in 400Mbps?
- dijit 7mo agoThe point isn’t really about audio bandwidth; it’s about the cable being strangely overbuilt for what it actually does. It’s rigid and thick, like a Thunderbolt 3 cable, yet only supports USB 2.0 speeds and fast charging for a device that doesn’t need fast charging. Compare that to Apple’s iPhone USB-C cable which is thin, flexible, and supports the same features. That matters because someone might grab that cable assuming it’s a “better cable”: it came with a £629 product, it’s thick and feels serious, so surely it’s capable. But it isn’t. And there’s nothing marked on it to tell you otherwise. The whole system ends up relying on presumption, which is exactly the problem the device in the article is solving.
- windowsrookie 7mo agoThe reason it is thick is because it supports 65W charging. Apple did the same with the USB-C cables that shipped with the pre-MagSafe MacBooks. It was a thicker cable that supported 100w charging but was only USB 2.0.
- bArray 7mo agoWhat I'm looking for is a differential signal tester, where you can breakout any arbitrary cable or traces and test the properties of the wire with different frequencies. It should be able to measure interesting properties such as resistance, capacitance, inductance, phase/length difference, wire length, etc. One of these devices for approximately $100 would sell all day long.
- Eisenstein 7mo agoYou can do that with a nanoVNA, except for the differential part. Less than $100.
- mmastrac 7mo agoCan you rewrite the emarker chips?
- kotaKat 7mo agoSimilarly: Is there a USB-C power delivery adapter to force directionality? I needed to siphon off power from small batteries into a larger pack (that could supply more power out than the small packs) in a power outage. I absolutely could not force my larger power station to accept a charge and it kept pushing power back the wrong direction despite which ends of the cable I plugged in first.
- ssl-3 7mo agoIt's ugly, but yes: https://www.anker.com/products/a8895?variant=45839927509142 https://www.anker.com/products/a8895?variant=45839927509142 That cable has one power input (that is only an input), and two outputs (that are only outputs), and a brainbox in the middle to direct the circus. If we label the connectors as A, B, and C, then it works like this: A charges B and/or C, and other charging directions are no-op. The less-complex way is to use a USB A to C cable, if that's appropriate. With these, the A side is always the source and the C side is always the sink. --- And yeah, it's annoying. I got a cheap lithium car jump starter several years ago with some neat power bank features (like 60W USB PD in/out, on one port). So I plugged it into my phone with USB C at my desk, and discovered that they'd charge eachother seemingly randomly. While changing nothing, I'd look over and sometimes the jump starter would charge the phone, and sometimes the phone would be charging the jump starter. The conglomeration formed a heater, with more steps. (Back and forth with the same poop, forever.)
- kotaKat 7mo agoAh, yeah, I remember those. That miiiiight work for my use case... --- (I remember. The poop.)
- bean469 7mo agoSucks that there's no USB-B support. Plenty of monitors still use it and many printers do as well
- pseudohadamard 7mo agoFor older cables there's a guy who's posted a large list of test stats somewhere... ah, here we go, I remember the "long thin resistor" comment: https://www.cs.auckland.ac.nz/~pgut001/pubs/usb_cable.html https://www.cs.auckland.ac.nz/~pgut001/pubs/usb_cable.html. tl;dr, you can't go wrong with Anker. Also, there's some absolute garbage out there.
- superxpro12 7mo agowould an adapter fill the gap until support is added?
- trinsic2 7mo agoMan. I wonder if my cables are the reason why I cant get reliable transfer speeds above USB3.0 speeds on a new USB-C dock I purchased.. I didn't know there were cable testers like this, thank you.
- pugchat 7mo ago[dead]
- tetromino_ 7mo agoAttempting to access treedix.com (the advertised product) gives me > Access Denied > Sorry, you do not currently have the necessary permissions to access this site, or this site may not be available in your region. Are they geoblocking the USA from even viewing their site for some reason?
- LeoPanthera 7mo agoIt's available on Amazon in the US.
- rationalist 7mo agoExcept that I can't even load the page to see the model name or whatever to see what specific device I should search for on Amazon. I guess I could just search the brand and wade through all the different listings.
- dceddia 7mo agoI was connected to a VPN and saw the same. Went away once I disconnected. (Must say I'm not a fan of how, increasingly, taking any steps to preserve privacy is seen as deviant, or justified because bots)
- mxfh 7mo agoLike the price point and portability of the base Treedix testers. Talking about near perfect wishlist: Some standard hardware with fail-safe power connections a set of fully wired ports like in display-less Treedix USB platine tester version. On the other side powered and extended diagnostics through USB-C can then be done from any smartphone or pc providing the display and updateable extended software layer. Bonus for connectivity to some brother label printers.
- throwpoaster 7mo ago> The only downside of the USB cable tester is that I would love to support more plugs on the B side: USB-A (for my Frankencables) and USB B (which everyone but seems to think extinct). Music production peripherals, until the recent USB C transition, commonly used USB B for some reason. Anyone know why?
- marcosscriven 7mo agoI haven’t yet worked out why cheap 100W PD cables partially fail after about 6 months. They can still provide some power, but between a MacBook and official Apple power supply, they’ll keep flicking between charging and not charging.
- bennysaurus 7mo agoLikely the emarker chip in the cable is reporting higher power capabilities than the cable can support long term. It'll work initially but then can't maintain that after resistance in the wires increase with wear.
- superxpro12 7mo agoMy personal favorite is the usb-c cable that works when you rotate the connector upside-down.