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The mineral riches hiding under Greenland's ice
- drekipus 10mo agoI guess we should be praying for Jens-Frederik Nielsen's family now
- Y-bar 10mo agoHe shouldn't have terrorized USA with stuff like Hygge and Ozempic and those Vestas cancer-causing wind propellers!
- adamtulinius 10mo agoJens-Frederik Nielsen is the PM of Greenland, while all the things you mention are from Denmark.
- hopelite 10mo agoDon’t worry, he will be bought off and will profit quite nicely with a nice looking pile of dollars, if he hasn’t already accepted.
- wewewedxfgdf 10mo agoGreenland is set to be the greatest show on earth. Interesting times.
- hopelite 10mo agoHow do you figure? This show is actually going to be rather boring. The setup has long been completed and Europe will not even squeal all that much. What, with the Ukraine trap and the narrative hole of Russia marching on Paris, Europe is going to do what against America for taking Greenland? Europe walked itself into a trap and it has no clue it’s even happening. There is a tiny chance something else is being done, but it’s such a small chance it’s not even worth mentioning. Reality is that this thing we still call America is starving hungry and it smells European blood in the water, and is furiously rubbing its hands over Greenland’s resources and Arctic access. And no, Europeans, the Democrats will also devour you now that they’ve also smelled the money in the Potomac. The Empire must eat. No, Europe is already drugged, muzzled, and strapped to the table… it will be over soon, Europe.
- renegade-otter 10mo agoHold on. In a few days we are going to find some narco-terrorists there as well.
- abdusco 10mo agoIt has enough oil and gas reserves to warrant some freedom™. People there need democracy for God's sake!
- Y-bar 10mo agoThe whole meme of "America isn't a country, it's three corporations wearing a trench coat" seems to have been mostly correct, albeit that trench coat is starting to look a lot less like a modern trench coat and more like an actual Trench Coat.
- oneeyedpigeon 10mo agoThe Emperor's New Trench Coat
- kotaKat 10mo agoSome say Maduro's long-lost Danish cousin lives there.
- globalnode 10mo agoor wmd, or poor locals need saving from chemical weapons attacks from their own govt. the funniest spin i heard was some clown trying to say that by taking greenland the us would be strengthening nato!
- arethuza 10mo agoSpeaking of wmd - there are probably secret nuclear missile bases buried under the ice... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camp_Century https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camp_Century
- willwade 10mo ago.. and fentanyl for sure right? surely its the largest producer of fentanyl.. or is it cocaine? hold on whats that drug ICE? ah thats it..
- arethuza 10mo agoWell flying over it the place does seem covered in white powder?
- fny 10mo agoThere are a few things that confuse me about this potential acquisition: 1. You won't govern it. Greenland has it's own Self-Government Act. [0] 2. You won't own the land. Almost all land is owned by the State. [1] 3. The Danes have no special land ownership rights. [2] 4. Land use rights, however, are granted for different activities (fishing, mining) subject to approval. [3] I'd imagine none of this changes under a new owner. Why the can't the US just sign up for mining rights already? It seems like that's exactly what it would have to do post acquisition--unless of course the US also plans to bulldoze Greenland's sovereignty. I'm genuinely interested if anyone can provide color. [0]: https://english.stm.dk/the-prime-ministers-office/the-unity-of-the-realm/greenland/ https://english.stm.dk/the-prime-ministers-office/the-unity-... [1]: https://www.city-journal.org/article/learning-from-greenland https://www.city-journal.org/article/learning-from-greenland [2]: https://www.thelocal.dk/20251114/greenland-limits-foreigners-rights-to-own-property https://www.thelocal.dk/20251114/greenland-limits-foreigners... [3]: https://govmin.gl/exploration-prospecting/get-an-exploration-licence/mining-act/ https://govmin.gl/exploration-prospecting/get-an-exploration...
- spaniard89277 10mo agoWhat I wonder is about the second order effects. I mean, I'm pretty far from Denmark but here the talk is pretty much like an existential crisis. Even if the US does nothing about it, seems that many people has finally realized that Europe has no allies. This has a lot of implications regarding the Pax Americana, the US/EU financial system, Eurasia, and many others. I don't see any positive outcome for the west in general. Europe in particular is screwed but besides short-term gains I don't think the US is going to be able to sustain anything but very fragile and transactional alliances, if any.
- owebmaster 10mo ago> Even if the US does nothing about it, seems that many people has finally realized that Europe has no allies. Indeed. But just because EU thinks too high of themselves and is turning down their last natural allies that is the South American/Mercosur countries. So whatever happens to EU is their own fault
- ArcHound 10mo agoCan we please wait till at least Q2 with another historic event? I'm getting tired.
- sensanaty 10mo agoAt this point I'll even accept 1 single week without any historic events...
- krapp 10mo agoWe've got two more years of this at least, buckle in.
- hopelite 10mo agoIt all hinges on the midterms. Things will become clearer as to how they are going in about the next 6 months or so. There is a real chance that Trump’s faction may have finally caused to much damage for even his base. But never underestimate the impulse for knee-jerk voting or the opposition’s capacity to save its enemy from its own mistakes. We will see how much that holds this midterm. Trump has wrecked so many things though, it’s hard to tell how things will go, cling on out of desperation or throw him overboard to the sharks?
- thrance 10mo agoI have literally zero hope for the democrats to step in and make things right, even if they get Congress, which they probably will.
- ludicrousdispla 10mo agoYeah, I need to catch up on my reading of the Epstein files.
- cybrox 10mo agoAbsolutely worth invading allies over. I have no possible idea how this could backfire for the whole world.
- hliyan 10mo agoThe events of the past 12 months, culminating in Venezuela and now Greenland, has made me reevaluate a lot of my beliefs about unimpeded competition between free agents (i.e. a free market) leading to the best and most peaceful outcomes. Clearly, a few participants becoming disproportionately powerful is a failure mode. The way I've tried to reconcile my beliefs with what are clearly contradictory observations in the real world is: markets/competition are dependent on a substrate of social contract, and that substrate must precede market dynamics and must not be subject to them. When market dynamics leak into the foundation on which the market is built (the social contract, culture, law, norms), then the system starts moving toward raw competition, which is the same as war. Which is what I think what's happening now.
- deleted 10mo ago[deleted]
- renegade-otter 10mo agoThat's right. Entities must be acting as CITIZENS, first and foremost, bound by laws, norms, and shame. Shame, the glue of civilization, as I call it, is quickly disappearing. The Nothing Matters LOL world is bound to decompose.
- hliyan 10mo agoI wonder whether this is a side effect of the self esteem movement, and the whole "don't care about what others think of you" ethos.
- TrackerFF 10mo agoPer Greenlandic laws, they own the mineral rights. They can license rights to others, and Denmark will also receive a portion of the profits. Unfortunately, this is the model that American conservatives and billionaires hate. The idea that a country is entitled to their own resources is repulsive to them. This is also one of the things fundamental things where American vs Nordic mindsets are worlds apart. It is arguably also the real reason why US attacked Venezuela.
- hopelite 10mo agoYes, those crazy Americans who are so loyal to America and not any other country at all, really hate it when other people have things that God promised to them instead.
- kombine 10mo agoThis is Crimea 2.0. The ideological basis behind the annexation is identical in both instances.
- gbuk2013 10mo agoThere is no similarity whatsoever.
- kombine 10mo agoYou are clearly wrong. Both Trumpism and Putinism are reactive ultra-conservative ideologies. Annexation of Crimea was motivated largely by Russia's "legitimate security concerns". Russian propaganda was busy convincing the population that Crimea gives strategic control over Black Sea region and if Russia didn't intervene, there would have been NATO bases on the peninsula after the Maiden revolution. Trump and his sycophants are saying the same thing: American security, Arctic, and American geopolitical foes: China and Russia.
- flr03 10mo agoOne similarity is, if I'm correct, Russia claimed that the naval base of Sevastopol was vital for Russian security. The protection of the population and the illegitimacy of the current government was an argument developed by Russia at the time, it has not been yet by USA but I suspect this might start develop in the next few weeks. The common ingredients to justify an invasion/annexation is a mix of: - Self-Defense, security - Historical, Geographical claims - Protection of the population - Moral sugar coating (we had no choice)
- madspindel 10mo agoAs a Swede I must confess I don't know much about Greenland. But if Denmark goes all-in on Greenland, you can bet the other Nordic countries will be involved too. Not sure how this will play out. Really strange situation and as I said I don't even know how much Denmark cares about Greenland. Any Danes here that can tell us more?
- deleted 10mo ago[deleted]
- SanjayMehta 10mo agoWhat do you mean by all-in? Military action?
- madspindel 10mo agoYes. Something like moving parts of the Nordic Air Force closer to Greenland (maybe Iceland, or even Greenland itself?): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpGhd90y-BE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpGhd90y-BE That would deter even the United States, I believe. The problem I see if it's worth it. As I said, as a Swede I don't really care about Greenland, but Denmark is part of the Nordic Family.
- SanjayMehta 10mo agoInteresting. This is the first I've heard of this combined airforce. (Aside: it might deter the rational elements in the US military but they're led by this chap Trump.)
- arethuza 10mo ago"other Nordic countries will be involved" I can't help wondering if that's really what all of this is about - the Nordics can't really fight the US and Russia at the same time (though given their history I suspect they'd try).
- ponector 10mo ago
- WhereIsTheTruth 10mo agoWhat could become an economic boom will become a century of humiliation for Europe Well done Europeans, catering to Trump
- azan_ 10mo agoCould you please explain how does Europe cater to Trump and how does it make him more likely to invade Greenland?
- Y-bar 10mo agoI would guess it is a reference to EU conceding to Trump's tariffs such as https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/czxpdv5x54ko https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/czxpdv5x54ko and general lax treatment of how cosy he and Putin is with each other.
- VMG 10mo agoHigh-res versions of the map https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/cms/asset/f40c2c69-ba01-46f7-8d65-21b2c3ba969c/grl67410-fig-0002-m.jpg https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/cms/asset/f40c2c69-b... another map https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/cms/asset/7658bbc3-7c7b-40a1-8975-167074ca3ccd/grl67410-fig-0003-m.jpg https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/cms/asset/7658bbc3-7... source https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1029/2023GL107357 https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1029/2023GL10...
- derelicta 10mo agoCan't wait for the CNN headlines: "DANES CHEER AS TYRAN PRIME MINISTER CAPTURED", "DANES WELCOME FOREIGN LIBERATORS", "DANISH ECONOMY TO BOOM WITH FREE MARKETS REFORMS"
- joakleaf 10mo agoThis doesn't really align with CNN's view, but may apply to another even more popular US news channel that seems to be much more aligned with the current administration... Greenland and Denmark are not the same. Greenland is a self-governed territory under the Kingdom of Denmark. The US administration wishes to take over Greenland from Denmark completely. So you should replace your headlines with "Greenland" and "Greenlanders". Note: There have already been discussions about making Greenland independent from Denmark, but there is uncertainty over how to handle economic and defense situations. Greenland currently receives significant support (about $10000-15000 per capita yearly) from Denmark. So it is not clear how the country would run without that.
- TMWNN 10mo ago>Greenland currently receives significant support (about $10000-15000 per capita yearly) from Denmark. So it is not clear how the country would run without that. Greenland absolutely positively cannot run without outside subsidy. Pacific islands (barely) function as independent countries because their tiny populations are commensurate with their small areas. Greenland's 50,000 people live on an island three times the size of Texas. Currently that subsidy comes in the form of €600 million in annual funds from Copenhagen. Now Washington has emerged as a potential outbidder.
- ivan_gammel 10mo agoAn investment broker comes to an old German still keeping money in a bank. - Look, Americans announced plans to get Greenland and extract all the resources! It's time to invest in the stock market! - But what if Denmark disagrees? - Don't worry! America will just take it anyway! - And if Denmark resists? - Then America will invade! - But what if NATO collapses when America attacks a member state? - Well... then America won't survive alone in a hostile world. - And if America collapses? - Mein Herr... then surely it's worth losing a few thousand euros just to watch that spectacle, no?
- Ginden 10mo agoMining in Arctic is a technical nightmare. Typical alloys become brittle in these temperatures, darkness severely limits operations and/or workplace accidents, transport requires ice-breakers, permafrost is fundamentally unstable (heat from buildings melts it, causing sinking), and you need to pay people a lot to work there.
- ChoGGi 10mo agoI wouldn't be too worried, ICE is collecting the workforce as we speak.
- mothballed 10mo agoThis is unironically the plan some Norwegian politicians came up with. They were thinking about sending asylum seekers and/or difficult to eject immigrants to Svalbard. https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/norwegian-politicians-propose-putting-refugees-on-svalbard-remote-arctic-islands-with-more-polar-bears-than-people-10498859.html https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/norwegian-po...
- doku 10mo agoBy the time those resources are accessible, we'll be in a major flood disaster on all our coasts. Why don't we just leave this bit of resource alone for the sake of land that actually supports life.
- ArcHound 10mo agoNo. The factory must grow.
- haritha-j 10mo agoFor decades Europe has cheered on, if not actively aided as America bullied smaller nations. Now they’ve come to realise they aren’t so special.
- ivan_gammel 10mo agoThe thing is, Europe is kinda special. Cascade effects of America forcefully taking over Greenland will be by orders of magnitude more painful to Americans than Brexit was to Britain. America flipping from an ally to an adversary will trigger huge economic decoupling and it is practically certain that dollar will immediately loose its weight and USA may even default on its debt after that. Yes, Europe is going to suffer too, but I have a gut feeling that European citizens will still do better.
- joakleaf 10mo agoEurope has not just "cheered on". There were demonstrations throughout Europe against the wars in the middle east and both e.g. France and Germany openly opposed the war in Iraq. The Europeans I know (from all over) have generally been opposed to American geopolitics both in the Middle East, South East Asia, and South America. The US has traditionally been seen as an ally, but that doesn't mean we "cheer on" its actions. Because there are many financial and military interests, it is very hard to do much for e.g. the EU, and the politicians are very careful with their words. Just as it is for the rest of the world... Note: Europe is not a single entity but a continent full of different countries including (part of) Russia. Even the EU doesn't really have one single foreign policy.
- hopelite 10mo agoIt seems a distinction needs to be made between what is being discussed. The ruling class of Europe has cheered it on, even if the peasants complained; but as with so many other things, it’s wholly irrelevant what the peasants want, as you highlight. Americans also were 90%+ opposed to entering WWI and WWII and Vietnam, but that doesn’t change that it was done to serve ruling class objectives. That’s long been the system; the peasants are manipulated or forced to enter into the meat grinder for the ruling class. See the Ukraine for reference. But rejoice, soon robots and drones with fight each other instead … or maybe get rid of “useless eaters” more efficiently? It could go either way, or both.
- tock 10mo agoAmerica starting to treat Europe like it has treated the rest of the world all this time. Weird timeline.
- spiderfarmer 10mo agoAs a European. I'm starting to hate the US. Not dislike. Hate. For months I thought they can't possibly allow the orange clown to ruin their country any further. But the country is clearly spiralling out of control. And I'm starting to hate the whole culture. Now if a part of the population did anything other than comment online. If they took to the streets or did anything substantial in protest. But no. Crickets. So to me, every US citizen is at least partly complicit. For years, I already noticed I subconsciously did not like action movies that featured CIA / FBI / US Military anymore. And I gradually moved away from all US based infrastructure in my projects because it strategically made sense. But these past weeks it tipped over in actual disgust. For me, there's no difference between the US, China and Russia anymore. The US will probably take Greenland. China will take Taiwan. Russia will take Ukraine. And Europe needs to unite further and prepare for war, or risk being torn apart by the new axis of evil.
- oneeyedpigeon 10mo ago> And Europe needs to unite further and prepare for war, or risk being torn apart by the new axis of evil. As a Brit, I am praying that we rejoin the EU because it's never looked so necessary.
- spiderfarmer 10mo agoDon't ever let them tell you it can't be done.
- ajoseps 10mo agoThe No Kings protests are large and have been occurring over the last year. It’s disingenuous to imply the population is doing nothing but comment online. The US is a large country with the third largest population in the world. It’s not homogenous. Despite all that, it’s probably still prudent to decouple from the US.
- spiderfarmer 10mo agoOnly 1.2–1.8% of the U.S. population attended a No Kings Day event.
- NedF 10mo ago[dead]
- TrackerFF 10mo agoMy prediction of how a hostile takeover would work out - i.e. all US offers to purchase Greenland are flat rejected: 0. USA invades Greenland by shipping thousands of troops there, Denmark does the same. I don't believe there will be any direct conflict, but rather that US simply declares they now control Greenland. 1. Denmark invokes a number of NATO articles, immediately. 2. NATO crisis, all members meet in hopes to work it out. 3. Trump won't budge. USA uses their veto right on all possible interventions. NATO still stands, but is at this point in complete turmoil, and effectively toothless. 4. Allies of Denmark, probably EU too, puts pressure on the US to step back. Economic sanctions against US. 5. Sanction war starts between USA and parts of western Europe. 6. Congress does not authorize Trumps use of military, and Trump must withdraw within 90 days. 7. Trump vetoes this. Pulls the "make me" card when threatened. Trump argues that he can use funds as he wishes, dragged to court. The case is fast-tracked to supreme court. 8. If US economy crashes, Trump might be successfully impeached and removed. If not, he'll just continue. 9. Cold front between US and Europe. China tries to strengthen economic ties with Europe to fill the gap that has been hit by US sanctions. Who knows what Russia does - likely a new European military organization has grown out of this. 10. Eventually Trump leaves office, a sooner or later a new democratic president takes over, and reverses everything. Gives back Greenland to Denmark, does everything to mend relations with Europe.
- oneeyedpigeon 10mo ago> does everything to mend relations with Europe. As a European, I don't think the relations can be fully mended, especially if points 0-9 come to pass! Even where we stand right now, I want my government—in conjunction with other European countries—to be planning for a long, slow process of decoupling our dependency on the US.
- TrackerFF 10mo agoYes, that's the dangerous thing about this. Even if most European leaders understand that Trump might be a once-in-a-century anomaly, the seed has been planted. Who knows when the next one comes around? Trump, on the other hand, is a huge stress-tester of the US system. He knows that seemingly no mater what he does, he might just face impeachment, but not removal. So his go-to strategy is to break laws, and challenge them in court. All the way up to supreme court. This is why all the checks and balances are sort-of useless at the moment. We know Trump will just ignore them, instruct people to ignore them, and challenge them. And even if he's doing blatantly illegal stuff that would land his cronies in jail, the DOJ won't go after them. Trump understands that he will never, ever serve a single day in jail. He'll argue that everything he's doing, he's doing as a president, and with the immunity that comes with it. He'll issue pre-emptive pardons for his cronies, and probably himself. Wouldn't surprise me if he ends up stepping down toward the end of his term, and Vance also issues pardons for Trump. He's emboldened, knows that he's untouchable, and is easily manipulated by his orbiters. And, frankly, I believe he has limited time left - he's not a man that will live to be 100.
- metalman 10mo agothere is good reason to believe that mineral prices would have to climb 30% above current prices and stay there, before greenland's resources would become profiable, which in the scenario bieng presented, would then also have to cover the 600 million/yr subsidy that Denmark currently provides to Greenland. there are only two active mines there, both very specialised, and quite small on a tonage basis and a handfull of somewhat promising sites that could be developed useing conventional technology, the rest is speculative, and will remain that way, sitting under miles of ice. Speaking of specualtion, it is so cold on top of the ice sometimes that people have suggested that there the possibilty of CO² ice forming naturaly, but there is no way for humans to get to those places, so it will remain an esoteric debate for now.
- jocoda 10mo agoIs this not Trump's usual negotiation strategy? Start with outrageous, totally unacceptable demands and then slowly dial back while everyone else runs around like headless chickens. Ends with him in a much better position than if he had approached things in a rational manner?
- kennykartman 10mo agoYep, it is, except Trump is a thug that also use military force, which is not negotiation at all.
- rich_sasha 10mo agoThe resources are currently under ice - but fear not. US is working hard at it by sabotaging green energy, drilling like crazy, and now also expanding it's oil reserves in the Venezuelan colony. It is a smart, pragmatic and self-consistent approach. Just for a different utility function.
- josefritzishere 10mo agoInternational law was nice while we had it.
- fifilura 10mo agoOk, so there are hardly any mines on Greenland today. Why would that change? There are easier places to put a mine and make it profitable. Look at Svalbard. There used to be mines but they closed down. And those rare earth metals. They are called that because they are heavily diluted. Not because they are rare to find.
- tsoukase 10mo agoGreenland is extremely and much more than to any other country important to the US . Close geographical proximity, similarity with and existent experience from Alaska, bridge to sensitive regions of Russia and in the end of the tunnel a rich underground that hardly any other can extract. Ongoing climate improvement play a role, may be definitive. The potential take over is relatively easy (not like Canada): 50000 indigenous people that can be bribed, terrorised, forced or persuaded. Denmark is more like a distant relative than a mother nation. It will be a fascinating scene.