5 ms·

US Government demands access to European police databases and biometrics [video]

138 points by DyslexicAtheist 10mo ago

smegma2 10mo ago
Is there a link to a primary source with more details? I skimmed the video and see some quotes but couldn’t find the policy that they come from
- Havoc 10mo ago
  Found this but it’s quite old so seems the US has been trying to get hold of it for a while https://etias.com/articles/us-demands-direct-access-to-eu-databases-for-traveler-screening https://etias.com/articles/us-demands-direct-access-to-eu-da...
Havoc 10mo ago
10 years ago this wouldn’t have been a big deal but don’t think the US in its current form should be given access
- hulitu 10mo ago
  > 10 years ago this wouldn’t have been a big deal Famous last words
  - DaSHacka 10mo ago
    Multiple countries have already been sharing this information between eachother and the U.S. to some capacity for some time now and hardly anyone raises a stink about it [0] except us old-man-yells-at-cloud folk. I think GP is right that if not for Trump, no one would care. Like the majority of the U.S.'s over-reaching policies that have largely only come under scrutiny in recent times (at least, amongst this audience). [0] https://www.biometricupdate.com/202406/five-eyes-biometric-data-sharing-increases-by-over-100x-with-little-transparency https://www.biometricupdate.com/202406/five-eyes-biometric-d...
  - jandrewrogers 10mo ago
    That ship sailed for the most part. This data is already commonly shared between countries.
- deleted 10mo ago
  [deleted]
- Hizonner 10mo ago
  10 years ago this would have been a big deal, because the US (or any country) can always change "forms". Actually that's why you shouldn't create databases like that to begin with.
- LightBug1 10mo ago
  Mate, 10 years ago I would have raged about this ... and I'm ready to rage now.
- DANmode 10mo ago
  > 10 years ago this wouldn’t have been a big deal 2015 is later than 2013, which means you were all sorts of late, then.
- ronsor 10mo ago
  I like how your take-away is "the US is untrustworthy now" instead of a more general "tracking databases will always be abused eventually."
  - ben_w 10mo ago
    "One of the current big supporters of freedom may hate and oppose your freedom during your lifetime" has always been a very hard sell. Show them examples of a free place becoming unfree? "Oh, we're different, that can't happen here".
blitzar 10mo ago
[flagged]
- nradov 10mo ago
  How does this have anything to do with freedom or lack thereof? If foreign countries want to participate in the travel screening program for visa-free travel then they have to provide certain data. This is nothing new. Countries can opt out of this program and then individual travelers will have to apply for visas in order to enter the USA.
letmetweakit 10mo ago
In Belgium, our Minister of Defence talks about buying services from Palantir, and wants to let Oracle build a cloud for the Defence department. He even dares to say that this will result in our own Sovereign Data Streams [1]. I can imagine this is a guy that will have not a single issue sharing the requested data with the US Government, even in the face of the recent hostility of the US towards the EU. [1] https://x.com/FranckenTheo/status/1975429782432055712 https://x.com/FranckenTheo/status/1975429782432055712
- wolvoleo 10mo ago
  And that's the country that hosts the EU. What could go wrong :(
  - hulitu 10mo ago
    > could ? did.
- volleyball 10mo ago
  A quick glance at his twitter - you would think he is a minister of some middle-eastern country rather than Belgium. I didn't know about this man before but your comment about "A European minister shilling for Palantir and Oracle" was enough. I am sorry to say your defence minister has a foreign paymaster and it isn't Russia or even the United States.
- hermanzegerman 10mo ago
  Germany's Defence Ministry awarded the contract for their sovereign Cloud to Google Cloud. We really have the biggest morons representing us https://www.heise.de/news/Bundeswehr-setzt-auf-Google-Cloud-10397414.html https://www.heise.de/news/Bundeswehr-setzt-auf-Google-Cloud-...
MassiveSchtick 10mo ago
Wait, so they want unrestricted access to all databases or only access the entries for those that travel to the US?
- scyzoryk_xyz 10mo ago
  They're presenting the Visa Waiver Programme as conditional so my read is that it's access pertaining to ESTA applicants. Sounds like another drive-by meant to burn another bridge with EU.
  - econ 10mo ago
    That is the cover story. Really is direct database access for the usual pay to play
pjc50 10mo ago
So .. is this reciprocal or just a demand?
- belter 10mo ago
  Dont be naive.
  - dystopiandevel 10mo ago
    Don't be rude. Provide a thoughtful response.
    - belter 10mo ago
      One way only right now... https://www.statewatch.org/news/2025/december/us-access-to-eu-citizens-biometric-data-ministers-approve-eu-negotiating-mandate/ https://www.statewatch.org/news/2025/december/us-access-to-e... EU is trying to negotiate the other way, it will get nowhere.
    - stuaxo 10mo ago
      Just look at precedent, and there is no reason to think it would be reciprocal.
isodev 10mo ago
Maybe we should give it to them, and they will all be redacted
bpodgursky 10mo ago
This is for the visa-free travel program (VWP). The US wants to check whether people who show up for vacation without a visa have a criminal record. If European countries don't want to grant access that's their right, but it's not at all an unreasonable thing for the US to want access to, if the data exists and is easy to check. If someone is a convicted sex trafficker or drug dealer or whatever, I'm fully in favor of not letting them into the country.
- cowpig 10mo ago
  "The US" is an ever-changing collection of millions of people. Each with their own individual capacities to do good and bad and everything in between. When you create systems that are easy to abuse, some of the people in the system will abuse the system.
- WarOnPrivacy 10mo ago
  > The US wants to check whether people who show up for vacation without a visa have a criminal record ... it's not at all an unreasonable thing for the US to want access to It might not be an unreasonable request for a gov with a long history of abiding to agreements - and w/o a long history of misusing data for the benefit of Gov & gov partners. Which means it is a fully unreasonable request by the US Gov (of any administration). But a request by a US Gov that gifts its citizens' most sensitive data to one of the world's least ethical data brokers so that vulnerable people can be mistreated in bulk? Burn the paper the request is written on. Threaten to kill the next messenger they send. And brick up the door they knocked on.
- Kim_Bruning 10mo ago
  > The US wants to check whether people who show up for vacation without a visa have a criminal record. Surprisingly, (at least some) European countries will tell you directly whether someone has a specific criminal record (given that someone's consent.) If that's what the US wanted, then that could be given directly. But that's not what the US is asking for.
  - bpodgursky 10mo ago

138 points by DyslexicAtheist 10mo ago

Is there a link to a primary source with more details? I skimmed the video and see some quotes but couldn’t find the policy that they come from

Havoc 10mo ago
Found this but it’s quite old so seems the US has been trying to get hold of it for a while https://etias.com/articles/us-demands-direct-access-to-eu-databases-for-traveler-screening https://etias.com/articles/us-demands-direct-access-to-eu-da...

Havoc 10mo ago

10 years ago this wouldn’t have been a big deal but don’t think the US in its current form should be given access

hulitu 10mo ago
> 10 years ago this wouldn’t have been a big deal Famous last words
- DaSHacka 10mo ago
  Multiple countries have already been sharing this information between eachother and the U.S. to some capacity for some time now and hardly anyone raises a stink about it [0] except us old-man-yells-at-cloud folk. I think GP is right that if not for Trump, no one would care. Like the majority of the U.S.'s over-reaching policies that have largely only come under scrutiny in recent times (at least, amongst this audience). [0] https://www.biometricupdate.com/202406/five-eyes-biometric-data-sharing-increases-by-over-100x-with-little-transparency https://www.biometricupdate.com/202406/five-eyes-biometric-d...
- jandrewrogers 10mo ago
  That ship sailed for the most part. This data is already commonly shared between countries.
deleted 10mo ago
[deleted]
Hizonner 10mo ago
10 years ago this would have been a big deal, because the US (or any country) can always change "forms". Actually that's why you shouldn't create databases like that to begin with.
LightBug1 10mo ago
Mate, 10 years ago I would have raged about this ... and I'm ready to rage now.
DANmode 10mo ago
> 10 years ago this wouldn’t have been a big deal 2015 is later than 2013, which means you were all sorts of late, then.
ronsor 10mo ago
I like how your take-away is "the US is untrustworthy now" instead of a more general "tracking databases will always be abused eventually."
- ben_w 10mo ago
  "One of the current big supporters of freedom may hate and oppose your freedom during your lifetime" has always been a very hard sell. Show them examples of a free place becoming unfree? "Oh, we're different, that can't happen here".

blitzar 10mo ago

[flagged]

nradov 10mo ago
How does this have anything to do with freedom or lack thereof? If foreign countries want to participate in the travel screening program for visa-free travel then they have to provide certain data. This is nothing new. Countries can opt out of this program and then individual travelers will have to apply for visas in order to enter the USA.

letmetweakit 10mo ago

In Belgium, our Minister of Defence talks about buying services from Palantir, and wants to let Oracle build a cloud for the Defence department. He even dares to say that this will result in our own Sovereign Data Streams [1]. I can imagine this is a guy that will have not a single issue sharing the requested data with the US Government, even in the face of the recent hostility of the US towards the EU. [1] https://x.com/FranckenTheo/status/1975429782432055712 https://x.com/FranckenTheo/status/1975429782432055712

wolvoleo 10mo ago
And that's the country that hosts the EU. What could go wrong :(
- hulitu 10mo ago
  > could ? did.
volleyball 10mo ago
A quick glance at his twitter - you would think he is a minister of some middle-eastern country rather than Belgium. I didn't know about this man before but your comment about "A European minister shilling for Palantir and Oracle" was enough. I am sorry to say your defence minister has a foreign paymaster and it isn't Russia or even the United States.
hermanzegerman 10mo ago
Germany's Defence Ministry awarded the contract for their sovereign Cloud to Google Cloud. We really have the biggest morons representing us https://www.heise.de/news/Bundeswehr-setzt-auf-Google-Cloud-10397414.html https://www.heise.de/news/Bundeswehr-setzt-auf-Google-Cloud-...

MassiveSchtick 10mo ago

Wait, so they want unrestricted access to all databases or only access the entries for those that travel to the US?

scyzoryk_xyz 10mo ago
They're presenting the Visa Waiver Programme as conditional so my read is that it's access pertaining to ESTA applicants. Sounds like another drive-by meant to burn another bridge with EU.
- econ 10mo ago
  That is the cover story. Really is direct database access for the usual pay to play

pjc50 10mo ago

So .. is this reciprocal or just a demand?

belter 10mo ago
Dont be naive.
- dystopiandevel 10mo ago
  Don't be rude. Provide a thoughtful response.
  - belter 10mo ago
    One way only right now... https://www.statewatch.org/news/2025/december/us-access-to-eu-citizens-biometric-data-ministers-approve-eu-negotiating-mandate/ https://www.statewatch.org/news/2025/december/us-access-to-e... EU is trying to negotiate the other way, it will get nowhere.
  - stuaxo 10mo ago
    Just look at precedent, and there is no reason to think it would be reciprocal.

isodev 10mo ago

Maybe we should give it to them, and they will all be redacted

bpodgursky 10mo ago

This is for the visa-free travel program (VWP). The US wants to check whether people who show up for vacation without a visa have a criminal record. If European countries don't want to grant access that's their right, but it's not at all an unreasonable thing for the US to want access to, if the data exists and is easy to check. If someone is a convicted sex trafficker or drug dealer or whatever, I'm fully in favor of not letting them into the country.

cowpig 10mo ago
"The US" is an ever-changing collection of millions of people. Each with their own individual capacities to do good and bad and everything in between. When you create systems that are easy to abuse, some of the people in the system will abuse the system.
WarOnPrivacy 10mo ago
> The US wants to check whether people who show up for vacation without a visa have a criminal record ... it's not at all an unreasonable thing for the US to want access to It might not be an unreasonable request for a gov with a long history of abiding to agreements - and w/o a long history of misusing data for the benefit of Gov & gov partners. Which means it is a fully unreasonable request by the US Gov (of any administration). But a request by a US Gov that gifts its citizens' most sensitive data to one of the world's least ethical data brokers so that vulnerable people can be mistreated in bulk? Burn the paper the request is written on. Threaten to kill the next messenger they send. And brick up the door they knocked on.
Kim_Bruning 10mo ago
> The US wants to check whether people who show up for vacation without a visa have a criminal record. Surprisingly, (at least some) European countries will tell you directly whether someone has a specific criminal record (given that someone's consent.) If that's what the US wanted, then that could be given directly. But that's not what the US is asking for.
- bpodgursky 10mo ago