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I have humanities academics on both sides of my family tree (dad and maternal grandfather, both tenured with long careers at good schools) and classics as an om
by shermantanktop 1y ago
I have humanities academics on both sides of my family tree (dad and maternal grandfather, both tenured with long careers at good schools) and classics as an omnipresent topic in my growing years. Out of my undergrad program, I got accepted to the University of Chicago’s Committee on Social Thought. I opted instead to get a history degree at a smaller school and dropped out after my MA.
It became clear to me along the way that the world that a young humanities academic would have joined in the 1960s just didn’t exist anymore. Departmental politics, publish or perish, shrinking funding, and the declining prestige of the fields meant the gravy train was over.
It also became clear that unhappy academics are amongst the most miserable, impotent, and self-loathing people around.
- alexander2002 1y agoSTEM has eaten the world (in a good way!)
- PeterStuer 1y agoI hate to inform you "Departmental politics, publish or perish, shrinking funding, and the declining prestige of the fields" has applied to STEM just the same as the humanities.
- shermantanktop 1y agoI’ve noticed that, but I think it hit the humanities in the 1980s and arrived at STEM more recently. It’s just the MBA-driven financialization and enshittification of everything. But it’s ultimately down to the fact that a college degree is no longer a ticket to the middle class, so it matters a lot what degree and from which school.
- bonoboTP 1y agoIt was a fundamental confusion of cause and effect. People noted that the college educated earned more, so assumed that expanding college will confer that same status to all that obtain that pledge. But it inflated its value. Similarly if you squeeze everyone through high school and look the other way even if they don't match the criteria, you just inflate the value of the high school diploma instead of giving the previous high school graduate prestige to everyone. Then the same happened with undergrad. More students, less requirements and then surprise that you don't get an automatic college wage premium for having studied English literature or psychology or communication at some low tier college.
- terminalshort 1y agoSome people just don't seem to understand that the value of a credential rests entirely on the fact that other people don't have it.
- bonoboTP 1y agoIn part, but that wouldn't be enough. The value is that only/mostly people with certain skills and talents have it.
- immibis 1y agoPartially. If everyone can read and write, this doesn't make a certificate of being able to read and write meaningless. Well, it makes the certificate meaningless. But the skill is still there and it's good that everyone has it.
- LarsDu88 1y agoSTEM has the same issues as humanities when it comes to academia, but the difference is that for graduate students, there's often (although not always) a straighter path into industry.
- rightbyte 1y agoIn a bad way. If we didn't have such hubris maybe we wouldn't have fed the capital with our souls?
- AfterHIA 1y agoIt's worth noting since the STEM explosion the world has gotten more violent and inequality has gotten much worse. They might not relate but perhaps they do.
- imtringued 1y agoThat's just economics burying obvious problems under the rug. Economics has become a clown science to me personally, because you can even tell them that you have a method to accomplish everything they claim happens automatically through a handful of policies and they will laugh you out of the room, while they keep juggling (and sometimes dropping) chainsaws and telling you that you just need to hold them right.
- AfterHIA 1y agoI'm not sure that I get your point but I dig your style. I too am skeptical of economists especially after reading the Nassim Taleb books. Elaborate friend.
- nradov 1y agoThe mistake you're making is confusing confidence for intelligence and insight. Taleb has a few good ideas but most of his writing consists of arguing against strawmen and making invalid assumptions about fields where he lacks any practical experience. It's mainly suckers who admire his writing.
- AfterHIA 1y agoI'm actually not a follower of Taleb although I do like his, "talk mad shit" style of engagement. In many ways I agree but this isn't speaking to the point of my previous comment.
- nradov 1y agoCitation needed. The rate of violent deaths per capita worldwide is at a historically low level.
- alexander2002 1y agoKeep down voting stem haters.
- InsideOutSanta 1y agoPeople here don't hate STEM, they just understand that STEM is not the only thing that matters.
- tom_ 1y agoIf you want the reader to do something, it's polite to say please.
- thisoneisreal 1y agoI had the same experience and also dropped out after my MA. It's pretty sad. One of my professors told me, "You should have been here in the 70s, you would have loved it."
- cobertos 1y agoWhat was it like in the 70s that we are now missing?
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- stackskipton 1y agoFunding.
- etempleton 1y agoColleges and Universities have, out of necessity, started thinking more like a company. Part of that is often new accounting models. One such way of modeling costs anscribes indirect costs to programs (utilities, building maintenance etc). Low enrollment graduate and doctoral programs look really bad on a balance sheet when you factor in these indirect costs and they will never look good. In fact they will always lose millions per year under this model. It is frankly an inappropriate budgeting model for colleges to adopt because academic programs are not product lines, but here we are.
- honkostani 1y ago[dead]
- ironman1478 1y agoIt seems like it's just poor management. I understand they are not product lines, but a university has bills to pay. They have to pay people salaries, benefits, maintain those builds, labs, libraries, etc. The money to do that has to come from somewhere and in the hard times, the fields with the least likely chance of generating revenue to keep the university afloat will see hits. It seems like the university though has put itself in the hard times by taking on a large amount of debt: https://chicagomaroon.com/43960/news/get-up-to-date-on-the-universitys-financial-issues/?ref=stanfordreview.org https://chicagomaroon.com/43960/news/get-up-to-date-on-the-u.... It seems like its less malicious and just risk taking gone wrong. It's not that different in the corporate world. Lots of companies make bad bets that then lead to layoffs, but not always in the orgs that actually were part of the bad bet. I've seen many startups take on too much risk, then have to perform layoffs in orgs like marketing, recruiting, sales, HR, etc. even if those orgs weren't responsible for the issues that the company is facing.
- AfterHIA 1y agoSimilar but less prolific experience. I had this idea that I could make a career out of loving books and ideas and sharing those things with other people in a spirited way. What a stupid fucking idea that was!
- lukan 1y ago"What a stupid fucking idea that was!" It is a great idea. We just don't live in a great society where your naive thinking would have been fitting.
- bonoboTP 1y agoFind a patron who finances it, as it always was. There never was a society that would fund everyone full time just for having neat fun chats. Alternatively take up a day job like everyone else and join a philosophy / arts / book club as a hobby. We have more access than ever to the materials.
- lukan 1y ago"There never was a society that would fund everyone full time just for having neat fun chats." That was not the request, nor claim.
- nradov 1y agoIt's totally possible to make a career out of loving books and ideas, and sharing those things with other people in a spirited way: create a YouTube channel. Here are a couple I found at random but there are many more. https://www.youtube.com/@EllieDashwood https://www.youtube.com/@EllieDashwood https://www.youtube.com/@QuinnsIdeas https://www.youtube.com/@QuinnsIdeas
- bonoboTP 1y agoLol that's like saying you can make a career out of your love of playing and releasing music. Sure, get to the end of the line. Or playing games and streaming it. Yes, a few make money that way. But theres a vast vast oversupply of people who would want to do that. You have to be very good, work hard, and be very lucky in addition.
- tokai 1y agoDepartmental politics has always been bad. That is nothing new. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microcosmographia_Academica https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microcosmographia_Academica
- throwaway2037 1y agoThis is an insightful response. Thank you to share. Your last sentence: > It also became clear that unhappy academics are amongst the most miserable, impotent, and self-loathing people around. ... reminded me of Sayre's law: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sayre%27s_law https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sayre%27s_law > Academic politics is the most vicious and bitter form of politics, because the stakes are so low.