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I saw it on twitter and had to go to BBC to make sure this isn't some joke or hoax. 2025 and we have National level power cuts? I know it may be rare but I thi
by ksec 2y ago
I saw it on twitter and had to go to BBC to make sure this isn't some joke or hoax. 2025 and we have National level power cuts?
I know it may be rare but I think some day we really need to move or mandate every single flat / home / apartment / living places to have a 12 - 24 hours backup battery included. Something that has 10K+ Cycles, durable and non-flammable. Not only does it make sure our modern lives without sudden interruption, it also solves the renewable energy problem.
- elric 2y agoSounds like an incredibly expensive solution to a problem that could be tackled more efficiently at a larger scale.
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- jvanderbot 2y agoDidn't we used to pump steam around for heating and now homes have individual furnaces? If the cost for this were about the cost of a furnace I don't see why this wouldn't be viable. I bought a generator for just this situation.
- Loughla 2y agoThere is a very, very appreciable difference between moving hot steam around and moving electricity around. The thing you said doesn't really make sense to me; I'm not sure it's an apt analogy.
- tomatocracy 2y agoPlenty of places still do, and in those places district heating still is usually the cheapest source of heat.
- elric 2y agoThat's a great example of why this is a bad idea. District heating is a lot more efficient than using individual heat sources. Especially so when the heat being used is heat that would otherwise go to waste (e.g. waste heat from industrial processes).
- jvanderbot 2y agoI get the efficiency obsession, this being an engineer forum, but aren't we talking about resilience?
- elric 2y agoI think we can have both? I don't think anyone is advocating for one giant battery. In my ideal imaginary world, there are medium sized battery parks near every transformer station. In that same fantasy, the foundations of wind turbines are also batteries, so I shouldn't pretend that this is hard science.
- matkoniecz 2y agoIn Polish cities there are attempts to move in exact opposite way (close individual furnaces) due to rampant pollution during winter (1000% of PM 2.5 norm level of pollution happening occasionally, over 400% PM2.5 norm lasting for weeks etc)
- fulafel 2y agoFirst-gen district heating was steam, then moved to hot water. It didn't go away [1] but there's regional differences. In cold climates there are oil based simpler backup plants that can cover for the normal CHP[2] and elctric+heat pump based generation. It's a good way to buffer and use cheap energy in periods of cheap electricty from eg high wind production[3]. [1] https://www.wedistrict.eu/interactive-map-share-of-district-heating-and-cooling-across-europe/ https://www.wedistrict.eu/interactive-map-share-of-district-... [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cogeneration https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cogeneration [3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermal_energy_storage https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermal_energy_storage
- quickthrowman 2y agoThere are plenty of places that still have district heating and cooling.
- alchemist1e9 2y agoI’ve read discussions about preparing for a strong solar flare basically simply involves having on hand spare equipment stored unconnected and that then would also immediately improve repairs and maintenance for regular issues. I don’t know the details but I believe the US is looking at providing funding to the utilities companies to acquire the duplicate extra equipment.
- UltraSane 2y agoRich countries should have a strategic transformer stockpile since they have a long lead time and should last forever in storage.
- Loughla 2y agoMandate a battery backup. Instead of requiring the power suppliers to build and maintain reliable energy. That is just shifting someone else's mistake into being my responsibility.
- littlestymaar 2y ago“How to waste money and valuable resources” in a nutshell. Like it or not but we are a species of social animals, you cannot live without relying on others. That's just delusional.
- leansensei 2y agoThere are degrees of dependence on others, you make it sound as if it's a binary choice.
- littlestymaar 2y agoI don't, the comment I'm replying to does.
- moooo99 2y agoPeople seem to love those expensive solutions though. I know so many people who invested in overly expensive battery storage systems for their solar. Power in Germany is expensive, but even with that expensive power many of those battery systems will never hit a positive ROI. But they’re still happy for the feeling of being „independent“. I’ll turn 26 in a few months. The first time I experienced a power outage in my life was two weeks ago when a construction worker in our basement drilled into the wrong wall…
- nicoburns 2y agoIt's likely that battery backup solutions won't be expensive for long. Battery prices have been falling exponentially similar to Solar, and there is no reason to think it will slow down anytime soon (there is still room for improvement just from economies of scale). I predict that home batteries will become a "no brainer" from a financial perspective (for anyone who has the upfront capital to purchase them) within the next 10 years.
- joha4270 2y agoMost of the time, the grid is reliable. How much investment do we actually want to prevent a few hours of downtime once in a blue moon? And even if we do want to invest in large amount of grid storage (which we would need to anyway, if we want to transition to renewables), I'm not sure pushing this down to the individual house is sensible. Its a great way to limit economies of scale and make maintenance/inspection harder.
- chii 2y ago> I'm not sure pushing this down to the individual house is sensible. why not? Having distributed buffers ought to make the system more resilient in most cases wont it? Not to mention that these home level batteries can be used to smooth out power usage and lower peak loads. In fact, having an EV car act as this same battery would be an even more efficient use of resources.
- UltraSane 2y agobecause installing and monitoring 1 million small batteries is vastly more work than 100 huge batteries.
- hem777 2y agoNot if 1 million people install and monitor them instead of 100 people.
- UltraSane 2y ago100 huge batteries are going to be monitored and maintained far better than 1 million.
- 12_throw_away 2y agoGiven how the average consumer monitors, maintains, and secures their home PC ... this is a level of assurance we want to put on the power grid?
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- anonzzzies 2y agoThis is very rare. Not actually worth to make that much fuss unless you are a hospital.
- everfrustrated 2y agoSpot a European at a hundred paces by their reflex that anything happens the _government_ must do something. If electricity is that important to you, buy your _own_ resilience. Tesla powerwalls and non-tesla equivalents have been available for ages.
- arccy 2y agounlike americans, people in europe don't just huddle in their own fortresses afraid to even take a step outside without riding in tanks. power cuts affect more than just your home.
- Niksko 2y agoSpot an American at a hundred paces proposing that you either have the money to buy batteries yourself, or else you should just eat it and suffer
- mr_mitm 2y agoA Tesla powerwall won't help with trains and traffic lights. Those are important to me as well.
- otikik 2y ago"Don't expect the government to do anything, give money to big corporations instead" And then he chooses the one big corporation which has a guy in the government.
- mensetmanusman 2y agoSomething that stores enough energy to bake cookies will always somehow be flammable.
- oceanplexian 2y agoGravity storage of water. Not flammable, but could definitely bake cookies.
- mensetmanusman 2y agoThe things that convert that energy as part of the full water gravity battery unit will have flammable bits :)