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This is going to be an interesting experiment: A widely used social network across the world WITHOUT american content. Until now, the closest thing we had like

This is going to be an interesting experiment: A widely used social network across the world WITHOUT american content. Until now, the closest thing we had like this were national our regional networks like Russia's vk, but Vk was never truly popular outside Russian speaking countries. Now we, for the first time ever, will have the situation where a social network has global reach but without american content. Will it keep being a english first space? Will it survive/thrive? How the content is going to evolve? What does this means in terms of global cultural influence? Will we see internationalized Chinese content dominating it? Will this backfire for the US?

hshshshshsh 2y ago
Instagram and Facebook is more popular outside the US and China than TikTok.
- schroeding 2y ago
  At least in Germany, for Gen Z, Facebook is quite dead and Instagram co-exists with TikTok, both with >70% of the cohort [1] using them. There is no clear winner. Anecdata, but for freshmen, TikTok is way more popular. TikTok-based social media campaigns also e.g. managed to unexpectedly swing an election in Romania (for Georgescu, was later annulled). [1] https://www.absatzwirtschaft.de/tiktok-vs-instagram-ein-vergleich-262319/ https://www.absatzwirtschaft.de/tiktok-vs-instagram-ein-verg... - sorry, I only found a German source
  - gunian 2y ago
    Why do you think Instagram is immune from being used in social media based campaign? The only difference between TikTok and Instagram is the recommendation engine they use
    - schroeding 2y ago
      ... I do not think that it's immune? I don't see where I implied this, sorry if I was unclear. ^^' This specific campaign was done via TikTok, though, and had massive impact, which shows that TikTok has heavy usage and is popular, outside of the US and China. (I'm not American, I have no horse in this "ban foreign TikTok" race. :D)
      - gunian 2y ago
        Sorry me neither english no good the thing I'm trying to understand why do you think they used TikTok over YT shorts or Instagram Reels? What makes it better suited from a coding POV usage numbers suggest comparable MAUs for all three
        schroeding 2y ago
        That it was done via TikTok was widely reported by news outlets on all sides of the political spectrum where I live. Why they've done it via TikTok - I simply don't know. :D Maybe better discoverability via the For You page?
        gunian 2y ago
        aw man disappointing was hoping someone had a dataset for rating discoverability, platform bias etc tired of news from all spectrums :) maybe next Christmas if I'm not on the Santa naughty list
        schroeding 2y ago
        Yeah, actual comparable hard data would be nice, agreed :D
- SuperManifolds 2y ago
  Facebook? lmao, you are completely out of touch
  - hshshshshsh 2y ago
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_social_platforms_with_at_least_100_million_active_users https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_social_platforms_wit...
raincole 2y ago
> This is going to be an interesting experiment: A widely used social network across the world WITHOUT american content. For whom? UK users? TikTok users who use the Chinese version are not consuming content from US creators. They won't notice this ban at all.
- zapzupnz 2y ago
  > For who? UK users? Literally every TikTok user from around the world? There's more than just the US, UK, and China, y'know.
  - Retric 2y ago
    2/3 of the global population doesn’t speak English.
    - JumpCrisscross 2y ago
      TikTok content is mostly visual. My YouTube shorts are frequently foreign language with AI subtitles. Also, TikTok is banned in India and—ironically—China [1]. [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Censorship_of_TikTok https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Censorship_of_TikTok
      - Retric 2y ago
        A valid point, but I doubt people are going to notice if “clips of people slipping on ice” suddenly exclude Americans post 2024.
        yamazakiwi 2y ago
        There will be a small category of content that will disappear. For instance, my fyp was full of Chinese fashion content (by choice) so I'm sure there are other categories of content that non-Americans consume that are American. Whether it's Movies or Music or whatever.
    - 2y ago
graeme 2y ago
Tiktok is actually surprisingly national in how it serves its content. If you're outside the US you don't see most American accounts except the ones that go very viral. Edit: I should clarify. This might mean most content you see is English, if you're interested in English content. However it matters where the video was geographically uploaded from. If you upload a tiktok video and check the stats you'll see most views are from your region or country. Tiktok shows videos locally, then regionally and then finally worldwide if yoo have a big hit. It would be interesting to know what fraction of the English content people see is posted geographically from within America.
- fouronnes3 2y ago
  The question is, was this a conscious human design decision or did the algorithm learn to do that by itself?
  - moralestapia 2y ago
    You don't deserve the downvotes from the immature peeps around here. Your question is 100% valid. I would lean for the latter, the simple explanation may be that people just prefer local content.
  - jrflowers 2y ago
    Considering the algorithm did not crawl out of the primordial ooze unbidden by man I am going to guess the former.
    - markeroon 2y ago
      The recommendation engine is at least partially learned so it’s fairly likely that it’s the latter
  - svnt 2y ago
    Why is that the question? If it learned to do it by itself it still is being allowed to do it by humans.
  - 2y ago
jmyeet 2y ago
First, I still don't think the ban will actually happen. The current administration will punt the issue to the next and Trump has already signaled he wants to save Tiktok, whatever that means. That might be by anointing a buyer that he personally is an investor in. Tiktok may choose to still shutter in the US rather than being forcibly sold. But there's a biger issue than loss of American content should this come to pass: the loss os American ad revenue for the platform and creators. A lot of people create content aimed at Americans because an American audience is lucrative for ad revenue. If that goes away, what does that do to the financial viability of the platform?
- JumpCrisscross 2y ago
  > Trump has already signaled he wants to save Tiktok Trump can blame Biden and move on. > If that goes away, what does that do to the financial viability of the platform? Bytedance makes most of its money from Douyin.
  - throwawayq3423 2y ago
    He has a major donor that owns part of TikTok. He'll save it for corrupt reasons, ignore the real concerns about it, then move on.
    - JumpCrisscross 2y ago
      > He has a major donor that owns part of TikTok He has a major donor who owns part of Bytedance. They’re not losing their investment with this ban.
      - NickC25 2y ago
        He also has a major donor who owns Meta, and a major donor who owns Twitter/X. He also has a daughter who is the only American to hold patents in China without having to license IP to a Chinese company. We are about to see some strange mental gymnastics out of 1600 Penn.
dyauspitr 2y ago
Or Indian content. It will probably end up getting banned in a lot of places over time.
hintymad 2y ago
> This is going to be an interesting experiment: A widely used social network across the world WITHOUT american content. China has had such social networks for a long time. Their Weibo and Xiaohongshu are two prominent examples. Weibo started as a copycat of Twitter, but then beats Twitter hands-down with faster iterations, better features, and more vibrant user engagement despite the gross censorship imposed by the government. My guess is that TT can still thrive without American content, as long as other governments do not interfere as the US did. A potential threat to TT is that the US still has the best consumer market, so creators may still flock to a credible TT-alternative for better monetization, thus snatching away TT's current user base in other countries.
- myrloc 2y ago
  Are Weibo and Xiaohongshu used widely outside of China? Given the names alone I'd imagine their adoption is fairly limited to China.
  - bryanlarsen 2y ago
    Xiaohongshu is generally known as RedNote outside of China.
    - logancbrown 2y ago
      To directly answer the question, Rednote is not generally used outside China, and the point about these apps being representative of "global" social media apps is false.
      - bryanlarsen 2y ago
        RedNote was #1 on the App Store download list for a couple of days. https://www.vice.com/en/article/chinese-app-rednote-hits-1-in-app-store-as-us-tiktok-ban-nears/ https://www.vice.com/en/article/chinese-app-rednote-hits-1-i...
        2y ago
whycome 2y ago
How will YouTube shorts, and instagram stories pivot? They already aren’t seen as true rivals, but maybe they can change or spinoff a third brand. The gold in TR has always been its algorithm. Maybe they can fake it. How easy will it be to circumvent via vpn? Will other English content on tt skyrocket? Eg uk and Canada.
- redserk 2y ago
  YouTube Shorts is terrible. YouTube clearly wanted to have some answer to short-form video but without putting much effort into it. Instagram Reels is a bit better but it feels very "sanitized" and fake.
  - epolanski 2y ago
    I'm really at loss at how bad Google is at algorithms considering how pioneering they have been in selecting engineers based on their algorithmic skills and their immense contributions to the whole ML sector. I can let Spotify play on its own for hours and it will be just right...Even with songs I know nothing about, it's just very good. I tried Tik Tok once and I could see how easily it could pick content. But Youtube and Youtube Music are a disaster. Youtube Music is a decent service, but it's hard to get suggested anything really. Youtube Shorts are a disaster. Sure I like the Sopranos, I find some Joe Rogan's interview interesting and sure I like the NBA, but that's virtually all it feeds me, even if I start scrolling away to other topics.
    - licebmi__at__ 2y ago
      I feel like Youtube Shorts follows the same logic as youtube where whales skew recommendations. So yeah, you get feed the same shit over and over as the rest of users. OTOH, with tiktok I got surprised of how much "viral content" is tailored to me. I mean in the sense that I get a huge amount of videos from different trends from different creators, that indicates should be a big thing but then I realize that people around me, heavy tiktok users, barely get recommended or even not aware of.
- glenstein 2y ago
MuffinFlavored 2y ago
Is TikTok big in Europe? Is Europe big on social media?
- SSLy 2y ago
  yes on both
cm2012 2y ago
India also just banned TikTok, I wouldn't be surprised if bans became widespread outside of America with any country worried about China's geopolitical power.
rtkwe 2y ago
It will take ages for that to happen. AFAIK the "ban" only really removes it from app stores, I don't think it even requires store owners to force it off of phones that have downloaded it already.
- OKRainbowKid 2y ago
  It probably prevents them from distributing updates though.
  - rtkwe 2y ago
    True enough but I don't think that will be fast either. The main reason to update would be features and they can keep the old version of any APIs up to support US customers. Other than that the only reason they would have to update is any breaking changes in Android/iOS which are a lot rarer these days afaik since they're both so mature as OSs.
- nickthegreek 2y ago
  The data must be hosted in the US. Oracle will have to shutdown their servers.
- jhaile 2y ago
  Although TikTok has said they are gearing up to shut the service down.
  - glenstein 2y ago
    I wonder if it's more of a deactivation pending XYZ, with a readiness to flip the on-switch back on if there's a policy change in the U.S. (which it seems like there might be).
fuzzfactor 2y ago
If a US-based alternative appeared which not only substituted performatively, but also monetized creators and influencers enough to put everyone else to shame, people could not help but notice and migrate there in droves. It would be pretty cool if there was a respectable capitalist with enough money, or if that won't do it then a bigger more-respectable political organization or something, and Tiktok would be nothing but a memory of how things used to be before they got better. Think about it, a social force or financial pressure strong enough to reverse unfavorable trends, even after they have already gained momentum. And all it takes is focusing that pressure in an unfamiliar direction that could probably best be described as "anti-enshittification". I know, that's a tall ask, never mind . . .
- bee_rider 2y ago
  I’d worry that such a platform would be used to reverse social trends unfavorable to the owner, instead of social trends unfavorable to society in general. It also seems… sort of bad if an individual has the ability to be strong enough to reverse a social trend, right? So we basically would have to expect one of the trends they should reverse to be… their own existence. In general it is unreasonable to expect individuals to be so enlightened as to work against their own existence, I think.
  - glenstein 2y ago
    This is why I can't wait for Loops to enable real federation, because it distributes this over a number of instances and isn't putting all the eggs in one basket.
  - fuzzfactor 2y ago
    >such a platform would be used to reverse social trends unfavorable to the owner, Could very well be why Tiktok appeared to begin with, as the original owner's mission. You're right, anyone who replaced it would most likely have the same mission. Otherwise, >expect one of the trends they should reverse to be… their own existence. Yeah, that won't happen. Very few could afford it anyway, probably only the usual suspects. Ah, so Confucius say "Enshittification will be its own reward". I guess that's as enlightened as things are going to get :\
cyanydeez 2y ago
Until trump lets it sink, tgis is mwaninvless. Cash bribes are how laws are define now. Is america avaluable audiemce?
franczesko 2y ago
Some other countries banned tiktok too, e.g. India
- throwawayq3423 2y ago
  And China!
ngcc_hk 2y ago
How about WeChat, little red book, … in fact the mainland version of tt, …
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
cjbgkagh 2y ago
I presume the US market is the dominant target market for ads / influencing, a quick google search suggests it is 75% of the global spend. So the other issue is not just losing US influencers but all influencers will take a haircut. I don't know how much of popular content is paid for by such revenue but taking a 75% haircut could put a real damper on content producers - especially those who make it a full time job. I don't know if that'll make it better with an increase in proportion of more organic content. I personally don't use TikTok - I waste enough time on HN. There is an additional separate issue that influencer is a coveted 'career' for many children (~30%), so not only would it wipe out many jobs it'll kill their dreams. I guess like cancelling the space program at a time when kids really wanted to be astronauts. I think there is a lot wrong with society and TikTok is part of it - but that's a much longer discussion for some other time.
- handfuloflight 2y ago
  > it'll kill their dreams. They can dream new dreams. I didn't become an astronaut—and realized I didn't actually want to become one, either.
  - cjbgkagh 2y ago
    Sometimes dreams are all they have - especially if they're young. I think we have to understand the reality that the economy today is not what it once was, not even close. I think a lot of people are looking to the influence trade since they see the corporate / political / economic future as failing them and they want to carve out something on their own while the getting is good and while they still can. Sure some just want to be famous but others appear to have a very realistic view of their prospects both as an influencer and elsewhere.
    - handfuloflight 2y ago
      But how viable is it? There's 47 active astronauts and millions of children have dreamt of becoming one.
Conscat 2y ago
> but Vk was never truly popular outside Russian speaking countries. Can't really disagree, but it's my favorite place to pirate fonts. Typing out site:vk.com <thing I want> feels like a real life cheat code.
cryptonector 2y ago
> This is going to be an interesting experiment: Unclear. Biden and Trump both have stated that they will decline to enforce this law.
- bushbaba 2y ago
  Biden never said such a thing.
gunian 2y ago
I don't think it will survive because non American cultural exports are not quite there yet you have to be born outside the US to understand the reach of Hollywood/cultural export as an opinion shaping tool But then again Telegram survived and they had to resort to kidnapping the CEO so if it does survive the US pretty much gifted that space to a geopolitical adversary But I'm pretty sure Langley/MD folk thought about this and are betting on it not surviving
throwawayq3423 2y ago
> Will we see internationalized Chinese content dominating it? This is a weird fantasy, but it brings up an interesting point. The complete lack of Chinese influence on global pop culture. Especially when compared to Japan or Korea, countries with a fraction of the population but many, many times the influence. I wish the CCP didn't wall off their citizens from the rest of the world in the name of protecting their own power. Think of the creativity we are all losing out on.
- glenstein 2y ago
  For better or worse, I think CCP has long been on the backfoot in international propaganda just because what passes for persuasive narratives in authoritarian contexts falls flat to global audiences fluent in western entertainment and media culture. Of course they have modernized, but most actual influence obtained thus fair (e.g. international olympic committees covering up investigations, stopping the NBA from venturing criticisms) has come from projection of soft power rather than being on the cultural cutting edge.
- djtango 2y ago
  As someone who wants to learn Chinese, I think about it all the time. Watching Chinese shows just isn't as fun for whatever reason. I was telling my wife the other day I have met so many people who credit Friends for why they can speak English. That's soft power right there. I've had to resort to watching anime on Netflix with Chinese dubs - anime is good because people actually talk slower and usually use simple language. When I watched Three Body (Chinese version) the dialogue was impenetrable lol
  - wordofx 2y ago
    Taiwanese shows are better if you want to learn Chinese. They speak clearly and don’t speak fast like China shows.
    - djtango 2y ago
      Thanks I'll take a look. It will be funny if I end up with a Taiwanese accent around my Dongbei in laws but I've spent enough time in china to remember the mainland accent tbh
peoplenotbots 2y ago
There are such products. Outside of America whatsapp is a dominant social app but its use internally is almost mute despite being an american social app. Tiktok america is over 50% of tiktok revenue I think that more than anything else would choke out growth world wide.
adamanonymous 2y ago
> Will we see internationalized Chinese content dominating it? TikTok does not exist in China, they have their own version -- Douyin -- that complies with their more stringent privacy laws.
TaurenHunter 2y ago
Orkut was one American social network that barely had any American content because it was taken over by Brazilians.
qingcharles 2y ago
It will still legally have American content, but only propaganda :) https://www.kenklippenstein.com/p/biden-administration-quietly-carves https://www.kenklippenstein.com/p/biden-administration-quiet...
andsoitis 2y ago
> widely used social network across the world WITHOUT american content. As of January 2025, the countries with the most TikTok users are: Indonesia: Has the most active users with 157.6 million United States: 120.5 million Brazil: 105.2 million Mexico: 77.5 million Vietnam: 65.6 million Pakistan: 62.0 million Philippines: 56.1 million Russian Federation: 56.0 million Thailand: 50.8 million Bangladesh: 41.1 million
Waterluvian 2y ago
I think it’s going to be a lesson to Americans about just how little their content actually matters to the other 96% of the world.
davedx 2y ago
India also banned TikTok a while ago
victor106 2y ago
TikTok is banned in India too
nihonde 2y ago
I remember pre-Musical.ly TikTok here in Japan, and it was MUCH better then. In fact, it noticeably degraded when Musical.ly was folded in. American social media culture revolves around money and sex in a way that isn't as popular in Korea/Japan/S. Asia—roughly speaking, the original scope of TikTok's userbase, since Douyin has always kept Chinese users separate. Don't get me wrong, there's plenty of garbage social media content in Asia, but it's more boomers and gen-z era that consume hentai/money flexing/politics/etc., so that nonsense was almost completely absent in the early days of TikTok, when the users were mostly Asian teenagers and young adults trading choreography, in-jokes, and showing off their video editing skills.
vachina 2y ago
No more exporting of Murican culture and ideologies. Kinda cool on a second thought.
- wruza 2y ago
  Wish this was a thing for youtube as well. I’d like a breathe of fresh air from either my bubble or the logged out frontpage that s is not political and cultural propaganda, no /s. American dominance in english speaking media is really tiresome.
LAC-Tech 2y ago
I main duckduckgo, but I use Yandex more than Google these days. Incredibly useful for stuff power people in the US want to censor (and I suppose, Google is useful to russians for the exact same reason).
- Gigablah 2y ago
  Yandex is the only search engine with a working image search these days that I know of.
traveler1 2y ago
Utopia
scotty79 2y ago
I don't think US content will disappear from TikTok. Most viral creators know how to use VPN. No one's gonna leave such a huge pile of eyeballs on the table.
- bushbaba 2y ago
  You’ll have an active industry that takes/pirates US content and uploads it to TikTok for profit.
keybored 2y ago
How unprecedented. The non-United Statesians will be SHOCKED when they interact with each other unmediated by the Americans.

hshshshshsh 2y ago

Instagram and Facebook is more popular outside the US and China than TikTok.

schroeding 2y ago
At least in Germany, for Gen Z, Facebook is quite dead and Instagram co-exists with TikTok, both with >70% of the cohort [1] using them. There is no clear winner. Anecdata, but for freshmen, TikTok is way more popular. TikTok-based social media campaigns also e.g. managed to unexpectedly swing an election in Romania (for Georgescu, was later annulled). [1] https://www.absatzwirtschaft.de/tiktok-vs-instagram-ein-vergleich-262319/ https://www.absatzwirtschaft.de/tiktok-vs-instagram-ein-verg... - sorry, I only found a German source
- gunian 2y ago
  Why do you think Instagram is immune from being used in social media based campaign? The only difference between TikTok and Instagram is the recommendation engine they use
  - schroeding 2y ago
    ... I do not think that it's immune? I don't see where I implied this, sorry if I was unclear. ^^' This specific campaign was done via TikTok, though, and had massive impact, which shows that TikTok has heavy usage and is popular, outside of the US and China. (I'm not American, I have no horse in this "ban foreign TikTok" race. :D)
    - gunian 2y ago
      Sorry me neither english no good the thing I'm trying to understand why do you think they used TikTok over YT shorts or Instagram Reels? What makes it better suited from a coding POV usage numbers suggest comparable MAUs for all three
      - schroeding 2y ago
        That it was done via TikTok was widely reported by news outlets on all sides of the political spectrum where I live. Why they've done it via TikTok - I simply don't know. :D Maybe better discoverability via the For You page?
        gunian 2y ago
        aw man disappointing was hoping someone had a dataset for rating discoverability, platform bias etc tired of news from all spectrums :) maybe next Christmas if I'm not on the Santa naughty list
        schroeding 2y ago
        Yeah, actual comparable hard data would be nice, agreed :D
SuperManifolds 2y ago
Facebook? lmao, you are completely out of touch
- hshshshshsh 2y ago
  https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_social_platforms_with_at_least_100_million_active_users https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_social_platforms_wit...

raincole 2y ago

> This is going to be an interesting experiment: A widely used social network across the world WITHOUT american content. For whom? UK users? TikTok users who use the Chinese version are not consuming content from US creators. They won't notice this ban at all.

zapzupnz 2y ago
> For who? UK users? Literally every TikTok user from around the world? There's more than just the US, UK, and China, y'know.
- Retric 2y ago
  2/3 of the global population doesn’t speak English.
  - JumpCrisscross 2y ago
    TikTok content is mostly visual. My YouTube shorts are frequently foreign language with AI subtitles. Also, TikTok is banned in India and—ironically—China [1]. [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Censorship_of_TikTok https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Censorship_of_TikTok
    - Retric 2y ago
      A valid point, but I doubt people are going to notice if “clips of people slipping on ice” suddenly exclude Americans post 2024.
      - yamazakiwi 2y ago
        There will be a small category of content that will disappear. For instance, my fyp was full of Chinese fashion content (by choice) so I'm sure there are other categories of content that non-Americans consume that are American. Whether it's Movies or Music or whatever.
  - 2y ago

graeme 2y ago

Tiktok is actually surprisingly national in how it serves its content. If you're outside the US you don't see most American accounts except the ones that go very viral. Edit: I should clarify. This might mean most content you see is English, if you're interested in English content. However it matters where the video was geographically uploaded from. If you upload a tiktok video and check the stats you'll see most views are from your region or country. Tiktok shows videos locally, then regionally and then finally worldwide if yoo have a big hit. It would be interesting to know what fraction of the English content people see is posted geographically from within America.

fouronnes3 2y ago
The question is, was this a conscious human design decision or did the algorithm learn to do that by itself?
- moralestapia 2y ago
  You don't deserve the downvotes from the immature peeps around here. Your question is 100% valid. I would lean for the latter, the simple explanation may be that people just prefer local content.
- jrflowers 2y ago
  Considering the algorithm did not crawl out of the primordial ooze unbidden by man I am going to guess the former.
  - markeroon 2y ago
    The recommendation engine is at least partially learned so it’s fairly likely that it’s the latter
- svnt 2y ago
  Why is that the question? If it learned to do it by itself it still is being allowed to do it by humans.
- 2y ago

jmyeet 2y ago

First, I still don't think the ban will actually happen. The current administration will punt the issue to the next and Trump has already signaled he wants to save Tiktok, whatever that means. That might be by anointing a buyer that he personally is an investor in. Tiktok may choose to still shutter in the US rather than being forcibly sold. But there's a biger issue than loss of American content should this come to pass: the loss os American ad revenue for the platform and creators. A lot of people create content aimed at Americans because an American audience is lucrative for ad revenue. If that goes away, what does that do to the financial viability of the platform?

JumpCrisscross 2y ago
> Trump has already signaled he wants to save Tiktok Trump can blame Biden and move on. > If that goes away, what does that do to the financial viability of the platform? Bytedance makes most of its money from Douyin.
- throwawayq3423 2y ago
  He has a major donor that owns part of TikTok. He'll save it for corrupt reasons, ignore the real concerns about it, then move on.
  - JumpCrisscross 2y ago
    > He has a major donor that owns part of TikTok He has a major donor who owns part of Bytedance. They’re not losing their investment with this ban.
    - NickC25 2y ago
      He also has a major donor who owns Meta, and a major donor who owns Twitter/X. He also has a daughter who is the only American to hold patents in China without having to license IP to a Chinese company. We are about to see some strange mental gymnastics out of 1600 Penn.

dyauspitr 2y ago

Or Indian content. It will probably end up getting banned in a lot of places over time.

hintymad 2y ago

> This is going to be an interesting experiment: A widely used social network across the world WITHOUT american content. China has had such social networks for a long time. Their Weibo and Xiaohongshu are two prominent examples. Weibo started as a copycat of Twitter, but then beats Twitter hands-down with faster iterations, better features, and more vibrant user engagement despite the gross censorship imposed by the government. My guess is that TT can still thrive without American content, as long as other governments do not interfere as the US did. A potential threat to TT is that the US still has the best consumer market, so creators may still flock to a credible TT-alternative for better monetization, thus snatching away TT's current user base in other countries.

myrloc 2y ago
Are Weibo and Xiaohongshu used widely outside of China? Given the names alone I'd imagine their adoption is fairly limited to China.
- bryanlarsen 2y ago
  Xiaohongshu is generally known as RedNote outside of China.
  - logancbrown 2y ago
    To directly answer the question, Rednote is not generally used outside China, and the point about these apps being representative of "global" social media apps is false.
    - bryanlarsen 2y ago
      RedNote was #1 on the App Store download list for a couple of days. https://www.vice.com/en/article/chinese-app-rednote-hits-1-in-app-store-as-us-tiktok-ban-nears/ https://www.vice.com/en/article/chinese-app-rednote-hits-1-i...
      - 2y ago

whycome 2y ago

How will YouTube shorts, and instagram stories pivot? They already aren’t seen as true rivals, but maybe they can change or spinoff a third brand. The gold in TR has always been its algorithm. Maybe they can fake it. How easy will it be to circumvent via vpn? Will other English content on tt skyrocket? Eg uk and Canada.

redserk 2y ago
YouTube Shorts is terrible. YouTube clearly wanted to have some answer to short-form video but without putting much effort into it. Instagram Reels is a bit better but it feels very "sanitized" and fake.
- epolanski 2y ago
  I'm really at loss at how bad Google is at algorithms considering how pioneering they have been in selecting engineers based on their algorithmic skills and their immense contributions to the whole ML sector. I can let Spotify play on its own for hours and it will be just right...Even with songs I know nothing about, it's just very good. I tried Tik Tok once and I could see how easily it could pick content. But Youtube and Youtube Music are a disaster. Youtube Music is a decent service, but it's hard to get suggested anything really. Youtube Shorts are a disaster. Sure I like the Sopranos, I find some Joe Rogan's interview interesting and sure I like the NBA, but that's virtually all it feeds me, even if I start scrolling away to other topics.
  - licebmi__at__ 2y ago
    I feel like Youtube Shorts follows the same logic as youtube where whales skew recommendations. So yeah, you get feed the same shit over and over as the rest of users. OTOH, with tiktok I got surprised of how much "viral content" is tailored to me. I mean in the sense that I get a huge amount of videos from different trends from different creators, that indicates should be a big thing but then I realize that people around me, heavy tiktok users, barely get recommended or even not aware of.
glenstein 2y ago

MuffinFlavored 2y ago

Is TikTok big in Europe? Is Europe big on social media?

SSLy 2y ago
yes on both

cm2012 2y ago

India also just banned TikTok, I wouldn't be surprised if bans became widespread outside of America with any country worried about China's geopolitical power.

rtkwe 2y ago

It will take ages for that to happen. AFAIK the "ban" only really removes it from app stores, I don't think it even requires store owners to force it off of phones that have downloaded it already.

OKRainbowKid 2y ago
It probably prevents them from distributing updates though.
- rtkwe 2y ago
  True enough but I don't think that will be fast either. The main reason to update would be features and they can keep the old version of any APIs up to support US customers. Other than that the only reason they would have to update is any breaking changes in Android/iOS which are a lot rarer these days afaik since they're both so mature as OSs.
nickthegreek 2y ago
The data must be hosted in the US. Oracle will have to shutdown their servers.
jhaile 2y ago
Although TikTok has said they are gearing up to shut the service down.
- glenstein 2y ago
  I wonder if it's more of a deactivation pending XYZ, with a readiness to flip the on-switch back on if there's a policy change in the U.S. (which it seems like there might be).

fuzzfactor 2y ago

If a US-based alternative appeared which not only substituted performatively, but also monetized creators and influencers enough to put everyone else to shame, people could not help but notice and migrate there in droves. It would be pretty cool if there was a respectable capitalist with enough money, or if that won't do it then a bigger more-respectable political organization or something, and Tiktok would be nothing but a memory of how things used to be before they got better. Think about it, a social force or financial pressure strong enough to reverse unfavorable trends, even after they have already gained momentum. And all it takes is focusing that pressure in an unfamiliar direction that could probably best be described as "anti-enshittification". I know, that's a tall ask, never mind . . .

bee_rider 2y ago
I’d worry that such a platform would be used to reverse social trends unfavorable to the owner, instead of social trends unfavorable to society in general. It also seems… sort of bad if an individual has the ability to be strong enough to reverse a social trend, right? So we basically would have to expect one of the trends they should reverse to be… their own existence. In general it is unreasonable to expect individuals to be so enlightened as to work against their own existence, I think.
- glenstein 2y ago
  This is why I can't wait for Loops to enable real federation, because it distributes this over a number of instances and isn't putting all the eggs in one basket.
- fuzzfactor 2y ago
  >such a platform would be used to reverse social trends unfavorable to the owner, Could very well be why Tiktok appeared to begin with, as the original owner's mission. You're right, anyone who replaced it would most likely have the same mission. Otherwise, >expect one of the trends they should reverse to be… their own existence. Yeah, that won't happen. Very few could afford it anyway, probably only the usual suspects. Ah, so Confucius say "Enshittification will be its own reward". I guess that's as enlightened as things are going to get :\

cyanydeez 2y ago

Until trump lets it sink, tgis is mwaninvless. Cash bribes are how laws are define now. Is america avaluable audiemce?

franczesko 2y ago

Some other countries banned tiktok too, e.g. India

throwawayq3423 2y ago
And China!

ngcc_hk 2y ago

How about WeChat, little red book, … in fact the mainland version of tt, …

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]

cjbgkagh 2y ago

I presume the US market is the dominant target market for ads / influencing, a quick google search suggests it is 75% of the global spend. So the other issue is not just losing US influencers but all influencers will take a haircut. I don't know how much of popular content is paid for by such revenue but taking a 75% haircut could put a real damper on content producers - especially those who make it a full time job. I don't know if that'll make it better with an increase in proportion of more organic content. I personally don't use TikTok - I waste enough time on HN. There is an additional separate issue that influencer is a coveted 'career' for many children (~30%), so not only would it wipe out many jobs it'll kill their dreams. I guess like cancelling the space program at a time when kids really wanted to be astronauts. I think there is a lot wrong with society and TikTok is part of it - but that's a much longer discussion for some other time.

handfuloflight 2y ago
> it'll kill their dreams. They can dream new dreams. I didn't become an astronaut—and realized I didn't actually want to become one, either.
- cjbgkagh 2y ago
  Sometimes dreams are all they have - especially if they're young. I think we have to understand the reality that the economy today is not what it once was, not even close. I think a lot of people are looking to the influence trade since they see the corporate / political / economic future as failing them and they want to carve out something on their own while the getting is good and while they still can. Sure some just want to be famous but others appear to have a very realistic view of their prospects both as an influencer and elsewhere.
  - handfuloflight 2y ago
    But how viable is it? There's 47 active astronauts and millions of children have dreamt of becoming one.

Conscat 2y ago

> but Vk was never truly popular outside Russian speaking countries. Can't really disagree, but it's my favorite place to pirate fonts. Typing out site:vk.com <thing I want> feels like a real life cheat code.

cryptonector 2y ago

> This is going to be an interesting experiment: Unclear. Biden and Trump both have stated that they will decline to enforce this law.

bushbaba 2y ago
Biden never said such a thing.

gunian 2y ago

I don't think it will survive because non American cultural exports are not quite there yet you have to be born outside the US to understand the reach of Hollywood/cultural export as an opinion shaping tool But then again Telegram survived and they had to resort to kidnapping the CEO so if it does survive the US pretty much gifted that space to a geopolitical adversary But I'm pretty sure Langley/MD folk thought about this and are betting on it not surviving

throwawayq3423 2y ago

> Will we see internationalized Chinese content dominating it? This is a weird fantasy, but it brings up an interesting point. The complete lack of Chinese influence on global pop culture. Especially when compared to Japan or Korea, countries with a fraction of the population but many, many times the influence. I wish the CCP didn't wall off their citizens from the rest of the world in the name of protecting their own power. Think of the creativity we are all losing out on.

glenstein 2y ago
For better or worse, I think CCP has long been on the backfoot in international propaganda just because what passes for persuasive narratives in authoritarian contexts falls flat to global audiences fluent in western entertainment and media culture. Of course they have modernized, but most actual influence obtained thus fair (e.g. international olympic committees covering up investigations, stopping the NBA from venturing criticisms) has come from projection of soft power rather than being on the cultural cutting edge.
djtango 2y ago
As someone who wants to learn Chinese, I think about it all the time. Watching Chinese shows just isn't as fun for whatever reason. I was telling my wife the other day I have met so many people who credit Friends for why they can speak English. That's soft power right there. I've had to resort to watching anime on Netflix with Chinese dubs - anime is good because people actually talk slower and usually use simple language. When I watched Three Body (Chinese version) the dialogue was impenetrable lol
- wordofx 2y ago
  Taiwanese shows are better if you want to learn Chinese. They speak clearly and don’t speak fast like China shows.
  - djtango 2y ago
    Thanks I'll take a look. It will be funny if I end up with a Taiwanese accent around my Dongbei in laws but I've spent enough time in china to remember the mainland accent tbh

peoplenotbots 2y ago

There are such products. Outside of America whatsapp is a dominant social app but its use internally is almost mute despite being an american social app. Tiktok america is over 50% of tiktok revenue I think that more than anything else would choke out growth world wide.

adamanonymous 2y ago

> Will we see internationalized Chinese content dominating it? TikTok does not exist in China, they have their own version -- Douyin -- that complies with their more stringent privacy laws.

TaurenHunter 2y ago

Orkut was one American social network that barely had any American content because it was taken over by Brazilians.

qingcharles 2y ago

It will still legally have American content, but only propaganda :) https://www.kenklippenstein.com/p/biden-administration-quietly-carves https://www.kenklippenstein.com/p/biden-administration-quiet...

andsoitis 2y ago

> widely used social network across the world WITHOUT american content. As of January 2025, the countries with the most TikTok users are: Indonesia: Has the most active users with 157.6 million United States: 120.5 million Brazil: 105.2 million Mexico: 77.5 million Vietnam: 65.6 million Pakistan: 62.0 million Philippines: 56.1 million Russian Federation: 56.0 million Thailand: 50.8 million Bangladesh: 41.1 million

Waterluvian 2y ago

I think it’s going to be a lesson to Americans about just how little their content actually matters to the other 96% of the world.

davedx 2y ago

India also banned TikTok a while ago

victor106 2y ago

TikTok is banned in India too

nihonde 2y ago

I remember pre-Musical.ly TikTok here in Japan, and it was MUCH better then. In fact, it noticeably degraded when Musical.ly was folded in. American social media culture revolves around money and sex in a way that isn't as popular in Korea/Japan/S. Asia—roughly speaking, the original scope of TikTok's userbase, since Douyin has always kept Chinese users separate. Don't get me wrong, there's plenty of garbage social media content in Asia, but it's more boomers and gen-z era that consume hentai/money flexing/politics/etc., so that nonsense was almost completely absent in the early days of TikTok, when the users were mostly Asian teenagers and young adults trading choreography, in-jokes, and showing off their video editing skills.

vachina 2y ago

No more exporting of Murican culture and ideologies. Kinda cool on a second thought.

wruza 2y ago
Wish this was a thing for youtube as well. I’d like a breathe of fresh air from either my bubble or the logged out frontpage that s is not political and cultural propaganda, no /s. American dominance in english speaking media is really tiresome.

LAC-Tech 2y ago

I main duckduckgo, but I use Yandex more than Google these days. Incredibly useful for stuff power people in the US want to censor (and I suppose, Google is useful to russians for the exact same reason).

Gigablah 2y ago
Yandex is the only search engine with a working image search these days that I know of.

traveler1 2y ago

Utopia

scotty79 2y ago

I don't think US content will disappear from TikTok. Most viral creators know how to use VPN. No one's gonna leave such a huge pile of eyeballs on the table.

bushbaba 2y ago
You’ll have an active industry that takes/pirates US content and uploads it to TikTok for profit.

keybored 2y ago

How unprecedented. The non-United Statesians will be SHOCKED when they interact with each other unmediated by the Americans.