8 ms·
Dog Aging Project
- abc-1 2y agoLast I heard this had tens of millions of dollars allocated to it and yielded little to no results, unfortunately. Is that not the case?
- mahkeiro 2y agoThe publication page of the site seems to contain quite a few publications. What do you mean by no result?
- abc-1 2y agoNothing useful to improving human quality of life.
- worthless-trash 2y agoI thought I had narrow definitions of usefulness.
- abc-1 2y agoThat was stated as the main goal of the project: improve quality of life in dogs and hope the results transfer to humans. It didn’t achieve that goal so far. I really don’t know what you want me to say.
- scott_w 2y agoBeing a little facetious: If my dog lives an extra 5 years of high quality life then that would improve my quality of life immeasurably.
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- 542354234235 2y agoExploring unknown paths that turn out not to lead anywhere useful is still worthwhile, since we can't possibly know beforehand what unknown information will or won't be useful. We don't even know what research might become useful based on new information from some other field or line of research.
- abc-1 2y agoGreat, so there’s no way to “fail” and they can keep asking for money indefinitely. See the problem here? You’d stop shoveling money into research that hadn’t yielded any results either, especially if it was $24 million dollars that could have gone to better avenues.
- insane_dreamer 2y ago?? It's about improving the lifespan of dogs, not humans. But if you must, well, dogs living longer (while healthy) == happier human dog owners.
- urronglol 2y ago[dead]
- aitchnyu 2y agoAre there other examples of innovations flowing from veterinary medicine to human medicine?
- victorbjorklund 2y agomalaria parasite discovered when researching cattle disease.
- Qem 2y agoEuthanasia.
- JumpCrisscross 2y ago> other examples of innovations flowing from veterinary medicine to human medicine “As microbial and genetic discoveries were made, pathogenesis studies were required to integrate the new knowledge into useful clinical advances. Those advances include a creative model of enteric bacterial disease (Moon), demonstration of the transmissibility and pathogenesis of scrapie, a proposal that human kuru was a transmissible spongiform encephalopathy (Hadlow), and the isolation of bovine leukemia virus (Miller) and bovine immunosuppressive retroviruses (Van Der Maaten)—5 years before AIDS and HIV appeared. Now modern molecular and genetic sciences and their applications in integrative, whole-animal biology make possible exciting advances for the benefit of both animals and people” [1]. (Counterfactual: “major methodological limitations of the animal research and evidence of widespread publication bias” limit translatability [2].) [1] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK22905/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK22905/ [2] https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC2746847/ https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC2746847/
- goda90 2y agoDog cancer is considered pretty similar to human cancer and sometimes treatment trials are done in dogs after they are done in mice and before they are done in humans.
- casenmgreen 2y agoI don't know, but if you find your dog is now immortal at the human equivalent of 25 and you're getting old and grey, everything hurts, and the babes don't look at you any more, you're probably going to want something to get done about it, pronto.
- akdor1154 2y agoUrgh some ungodly JavaScript is hijacking the scrolling, I wish the site wasn't so ineptly written.
- aziaziazi 2y agoAnd no « reader mode » possible. Totally unusable for me!
- 0_____0 2y agobahaha usually when HN people are complaining about a website I think they're being dramatic but the way this was scrolljacked, it's almost like it's designed to frustrate you
- qb1 2y agoI participated in this project with my dog for two years. I stopped as the clunkiness of the web ui and lengthiness and frequency of the surveys. The experience left me dubious as to the project's methodologies.
- oyashirochama 2y agoThe best part is running this on a potato PC and watching the JavaScript kill itself.
- LorenDB 2y agoI think it's actually worse that this site breaks inertial scrolling only half the time instead of all the time. At least be consistent!
- jasdi 2y agoAnimal domestication is really wild. So we first select for neoteny (playfulness, dependency on caregiver, physical features people like) basically prolonging the juvenile state. Then we put them in controlled environments of abundance, were all their needs are met. Which further diminishes need to reach adult state (with traits like aggressiveness to compete for resources). This abundance causes them to mature/breed earlier and reproduce more than in the wild. Basically a population of children that can produce children. Then we want this population of children to live longer.
- throw839298 2y ago> neoteny What domesticated animals were bread for "cuteness"? Cats are mice hunters. Most popular dog breeds were selected for killing and dog fight! That "big smile" is not for laughter, but to crush bones! And many domesticated animals can not even reproduce without human assistance. How they would survive in wild?
- trimethylpurine 2y agoChihuahua.
- blueflow 2y agoI think requiring human assistance and inability to survive in the wild are an effect of neoteny.
- JumpCrisscross 2y ago> What domesticated animals were bread for "cuteness"? Dogs. > Cats are mice hunters Cats blur the line between domestication and taming. > Most popular dog breeds were selected for killing and dog fight One can breed for more than one thing. (Dog fighting as a selection pressure is very modern and very limited.) Dogs literally evolved a muscle to make them more appealing to (and help them communicate with) humans [1]. > many domesticated animals can not even reproduce without human assistance Not an argument against neateny. [1] https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/dogs-have-special-muscle-lets-them-make-puppy-dog-eyes-180972440/ https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/dogs-have-special-...
- Ratelman 2y agoFYI limited to to US only - they refer you to their sister project: https://darwinsark.org/ https://darwinsark.org/ if you'd still like to contribute in a similar fashion but reside outside of USA.
- trallnag 2y agoWhy is the website so difficult to scroll through on Firefox on Android?
- catlikesshrimp 2y agoI am using version 133.0.3 (Build #2016060959), hg-7ed49fe90e84+ GV: 133.0.3-20241209150345 AS: 133.0 with ublock origin. And it is behaving as expected (correctly, I mean)
- trallnag 2y agoI'm on exactly the same version, also with ublock as the only extension. Weird. For me the scrolling stops immediately the moment I lift my finger off the screen
- sadeshmukh 2y agoIt's also bad with Chrome on Android.
- GrumpyNl 2y agoSo when i join the project, my dog becomes a guinea pig for testing Rapamycin?
- aziaziazi 2y agoI didn’t know that molecule. It’s an immunosuppressant, isn’t it a bit counter productive for old people that tends to be weaker?
- victorbjorklund 2y agoThe idea is to inhibit mtor which regulates a lot of processes in the body that affects aging. The immunosuppressant effects are a side-effect. If it works? It was promising but latetly it looks more unlikely.
- Engineering-MD 2y agoBetter thought of as an immune modulator than suppressant. Ultimately it’s a blunt tool when we lack more specific agents. Yes, it will have risks including infection, but the benefits may (or may not) outweigh the risks.
- JumpCrisscross 2y ago> isn’t it a bit counter productive for old people that tends to be weaker? Not if it’s running around fighting imaginary worms and generally inflaming everything.
- JumpCrisscross 2y ago> when i join the project, my dog becomes a guinea pig for testing Rapamycin? They remain a canine. But yes, they become a research subject.
- tt_dev 2y agoNeed one for cats.
- costcopizza 2y agoWe can get them to 30 with the help of Jake Perry's protocol. -A breakfast of eggs, turkey bacon, broccoli and coffee … with cream -A splash of red wine to “circulate the arteries” -Stimulation by way of nature documentaries screened in his garage-turned-theater -Lots of love and attention See: https://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/how-to-raise-a-165-year-old-cat https://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/how-to-raise-a-165-yea...
- the-chitmonger 2y agoI've seen his story across various sources - has he ever elaborated on specific quantities/ratios? I haven't seen anyone reproduce his regimen for his cats, and I'd love to see some more concrete evidence that the diet is effective (IMHO the extensive development of his home to act as a massive jungle gym feels like the more likely culprit in their longevity).
- 93po 2y agoThis seems like it'd make for a very happy cat, but that level of sodium and caffeine and any alcohol intake at all has to be pretty bad for them.
- shepherdjerred 2y agoThanks for sharing that article, it was a great read
- bsenftner 2y agoHow many of you glance at this website and think "fraud engine"? This is a fantastic vehicle to suck money out of people that love their pets, and love animals in general. I know nothing about these people, but my fraud alarms are screaming.
- goda90 2y agoWell study participants aren't charged. Maybe it's fraud against those who are funding it, but the pet owners themselves are not the current target.
- bsenftner 2y agoI'd examine this much deeper before engaging. It's far too consumer targeted, far too feel good. I would not be surprised if "becoming a partner" or "community scientist" required fees or more.
- carls 2y agoThis project is a research project out of the University of Washington, led by several of the professors there. I believe the lab is the Healthy Aging and Longevity Institute. They share a list of academic publications that have resulted from the project, and their Team page lists the full names a sizable large number of people. Their FAQ indicates that the cost of the DNA Kit and other things are covered by the project funding. [1] What made you think that it's engaging in fraud? I'm genuinely curious. I'm not involved in the project but just from looking at the site for several minutes, it seems to be a fairly reasonable research project. Or did you say "fraud" less to mean "these are people who are stealing money and e.g., hoarding it away" and more to mean "these are people engaging in a research project I disapprove of"? [1] https://dogagingproject.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/4416998516375-Does-it-cost-anything-to-be-part-of-TRIAD?utm_source=chatgpt.com https://dogagingproject.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/441699...
- bsenftner 2y agoHonestly, it does not appear like a research institute at all. It looks like the styling that the owners of People's Magazine or the National Enquirer would use to market their 'research nonprofit' where the actual research contribution is 3% of their revenues, while supporting fat salaries for an executive staff. It just looks too consumer and not academic, not serious. It is simply too feel good. It has the trappings of respectability, but not really. It's too slick. I also never spent the time to look deeper, the loud consumer targeted presentation drove me away.
- vouaobrasil 2y agoObviously most people disagree, but I don't think we should search for medical advances that make life significantly longer. We should search for ideas that make the finite life on this planet significantly better. A longer life is dangerous. If people could live 150 or 200 years that will make the problems on this planet much worse since the desire to accumulate wealth over that time would be insane.
- deanc 2y ago> Obviously most people disagree, but I don't think we should search for medical advances that make life significantly longer. I'd say we should search for medical advances that improve health span, not lifespan.
- typewithrhythm 2y agoIf I consider the global society I will be living in, I would prefer to see what an extra 30-50 years of high cognitive function for the people most rewarded by our current system produces, rather than trying to define what a good finite life is from some authoritarian.
- vouaobrasil 2y ago> for the people most rewarded by our current system This includes people like Elon Musk and Mark Zuckerberg, who would make the world better off by the cognitive nonexistance.
- typewithrhythm 2y agoTech billionaires are always a weird focus for this kind of sentiment... Compared to the likes of the Rothschilds (just as a well known example) they are harmless, transparent, and meritocratic.
- vouaobrasil 2y agoStill a net negative.
- irs 2y agoThere is also https://loyal.com https://loyal.com - Biotech Startup for researching/ developing longevity drugs for dogs.
- LeifCarrotson 2y agoI was also going to link Loyal, I think they came up on HN last year and had some good discussion: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38447491 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38447491 There's also https://leapyears.com/ https://leapyears.com/ - another project with similar goals. That one is associated with David Sinclair of Harvard Medical School: https://sinclair.hms.harvard.edu/people/david-sinclair https://sinclair.hms.harvard.edu/people/david-sinclair Personally, I'm optimistic about the capacity of studies and projects like these to extend our knowledge regarding aging. Human trials are fraught with ethical issues, and have very slow feedback loops (acquiring results from a study might take decades, which can be an entire career). Laboratory trials on mice and other small mammals can be more effective, but funding is hard and the results are isolated to a small academic lab. Large-scale supplements for pets can give data in a few years, have lesser (though not negligible) ethical problems, and have built-in funding. The funding process is, of course, a source of conflicts of interest, but it has to be done somehow.
- bru3s 2y ago[flagged]
- RadiozRadioz 2y agoThat AI dog image on the homepage is dreadful. Look at the inconsistency in the depth of field. And the inconsistency of the depth of the physical field the dog is sitting in, left vs right.
- modeless 2y agoUnlike futurists I have little hope of our medical system producing radical improvements to human lifespan in my lifetime. Even ASI can't cure aging if it is not allowed to do experiments or if powerful lobbies prevent it from accessing medical data or "displacing" human medical staff. If we want to get breakthroughs in lifespan extension quickly, they will have to come initially from something like this where vested interests are less strong and regulations less stifling. Not that I think this particular effort is going to do it, but something like it is the only way it could happen.
- ben_w 2y agoWhile I think that anti-aging is harder than e.g. a successful and sane brain upload, the very thing you say in your second paragraph is why I think we may get it anyway — my inner cynic says that there are many rich and powerful dictators who will be very happy to volunteer their population as test subjects.
- nradov 2y agoAging is not a single thing that can be cured. No one even agrees on what aging is. https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-024-03936-8 https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-024-03936-8 But there's nothing stopping aging related research. Ethics committees allow scientists to conduct experiments as long as those meet proper privacy and safety standards. Nothing is being blocked over concerns about displacing human medical staff so I can't imagine where you're coming up with that type of conspiracy theory. Even if all rules and regulations were removed there will be no radical improvements to human lifespan in your lifetime. This is fine. You are expendable.