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Show HN: Pls Fix – Hire big tech employees to appeal account suspensions

• sillysaurusx 2y ago
  As of midnight CST, the board has been flooded with bogus requests. It’s unfortunate there were no moderation tools.
• kreyenborgi 2y ago
  And I suppose internal employees can also block accounts for no reason. I smell a market opportunity for a service that blocks accounts of people who are likely to be able and willing to pay $500 to get their accounts unblocked. ... (I shouldn't have to mention this, but please don't build the torment nexus.)
• cushpush 2y ago
  Satire inspires change, sometimes as a last resort.
• hackburg 2y ago
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• hackburg 2y ago
  [dead]
• hortonangela901 2y ago
  [dead]
• 6510 2y ago
  Put an LLM on the website that answers all kinds of google/facebook related questions. Create that customer service service they should have build themselves years ago.
• jdub6 2y ago
  [flagged]
• jdub6 2y ago
  [flagged]
• kirstenndb 2y ago
  How do you verify employees? Are they really going to sign up to this?
  • jpdpeters 2y ago
    For now, I'm verifying them via their work email. So far, I've gotten decent feedback from my former colleagues and friends in big tech. Most of them take some sort of compensation for helping restore Insta / ad accounts - this is just a more direct way.
    • tdb7893 2y ago
      I'm shocked people take compensation for that. I would've felt super weird taking money for it (not least because with how much I make charging for a favor feels like an incredibly crass thing to do)
      • killingtime74 2y ago
        So you'd do it for free?
        • tdb7893 2y ago
          Yeah, if was someone who I wouldn't want to do a favor for I just wouldn't do it. I make so much money that the idea of taking money from friends for a pretty simple favor comes across as weird and miserly.
        • superb_dev 2y ago
          Yes, of course I would. Would you not?
    • consumer451 2y ago
      Do you vet the client side of the transaction as well?
    • throw20240511 2y ago
• deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
• skeptrune 2y ago
  Lmao, this is a fantastic idea. Extremely needed.
  • jpdpeters 2y ago
    Thanks!
• ashrafsam 2y ago
  we've been struggling with verifying our business on Meta and tried many ways to get around it with no success, do you think you can help with it? can you reach out to founders@activepieces.com?
  • ryanmcdonough 2y ago
    I reckon advertising the fact you're willing to pay to get around this, which I expect is probably against ToS and the employment agreement with the company name isn't the best choice.
    • ashrafsam 2y ago
      we're not willing to do anything against the ToS, I haven't checked them yet and we'll do things in compliance with policies, I'm just posting a problem and looking for a valid credible solution. thank you for the note!
  • jpdpeters 2y ago
    I just shot you an email
• marklar423 2y ago
  This is a real problem that needs solving, but I can see this sort of thing at scale leading big tech companies to not allow their employees to do this anymore.
  • jpdpeters 2y ago
    It's definitely a grey zone. I am definitely keeping all tech employees' info private, nothing is displayed on the site. If it becomes large, I imagine big tech companies would try to fight it, but let's cross that bridge when we get to it.
    • kyle-rb 2y ago
      Won't tech companies just post honeypot bounties and see who bites?
    • hluska 2y ago
      I find this disingenuous. You explain how you verify that the employees work for big tech on your FAQ. It would be trivial for companies of this size to go backwards. I’m sure your motives were good, but I’d urge you to think this through.
    • gertop 2y ago
      Hehe, you've learned well the SV way of doing things. After all, your former employer is the one who coined "move fast and break things".
• ilrwbwrkhv 2y ago
  Yes this is excellent. companies usually provide these services anyway to large clients. This is a win win for both the small clients and the lowly worker drone at Google.
  • jpdpeters 2y ago
    Having been one of those drones, I can attest that it will be very popular. :D Thanks!
    • gertop 2y ago
      Oh, you're former tech support? That makes so much more sense that you or your colleagues would accept such small amount of money for these favors, then. Most of the comments in this thread are likely from the perspective of developers who make AT LEAST 250k. But your target pawns are the lower drones, possibly outside the US?
• Terr_ 2y ago
  [Gripe] Viability/ethics of the program aside, I'd love to have this for Reddit, where my decade+ account was randomly thrown into an inconsistent Kafkaesque censored limbo. In short: One more morning I woke up and it was shadowbanned for no discernible reason, I used the appeals page, the appeal was granted with an apology... but it wasn't actually fixed, and I can't contact anyone because the appeals page says my account is already back to normal and refuses to accept any input. ... Oh, and reusing an old throwaway account to ask for help led it to be killed the exact same way. Well, at least I'm spending more time on other hobbies I guess.
  • DANmode 2y ago
    I'd love the anecdata on what type of commenter you were.
    • Terr_ 2y ago
      Almost never posted links/text submissions, but daily comment-discussions to the tune of 524k comment karma. Everything done on one account except for some resume-review throwaways. Interestingly "new" Reddit shows everything on my user-page as [Removed], but on *cough* proper Reddit you can still see content, although if you try following a permalink you'll see (or rather not-see) that it's shadowbanned. (In some cases they've hidden/removed comments that replied to me, which is exta-weird.) https://old.reddit.com/user/terr_/ https://old.reddit.com/user/terr_/
      • DANmode 2y ago
        Politically interested, Deus Ex, Birds Aren't Real, could read and write beyond cat memes — starting to see why they didn't "want yer kind around" there!
  • immibis 2y ago
    I've had the same problem. Oddly the only Reddit account I can use is the one that shares cookies with my original one that got banned (for participating in Save3rdPartyApps), so they know it's ban evasion. Any other account I make gets shadowbanned very quickly, seemingly no matter which device, browser and Internet connection or VPN is used. My use of reddit drastically declined around the CEO tantrum.
• MingFengLiu 2y ago
  What a wonderful, terrible thing.
• maxrmk 2y ago
  On one hand: an action virtually guaranteed to get you fired. On the other: $150 I used to work at FB and they have a team that tries to catch employees selling access like this. I can’t imagine risking that for what is essentially an hours pay for most tech roles there.
  • TulliusCicero 2y ago
    Yeah, as someone who works for one of these companies, no fucking way would it be worth the risk to me.
    • dylan604 2y ago
      Here's my question not to you specifically but the royal you of any bigTech employees reading this forum or similar: why do the employees not stand up at all hands meetings and raise this issue as a serious problem. Of course I know the answer in they just don't care and their personal paychecks are too high for them to risk becoming a squeaky wheel. However, it is obvious that management does not intend to fix this issue. They clearly do not feel the negative comments on some techy nerdcentric boards or twitter followers amounts to enough to cause a negative impact on the bottom line. So instead, people with respect lose respect for those "yous" that work at bigTech.
      • TulliusCicero 2y ago
        > why do the employees not stand up at all hands meetings and raise this issue as a serious problem. This definitely happens for all kinds of problems at big tech companies. But you might be absolutely shocked to learn that many times, random engineers complaining about something doesn't result in management taking immediate action to fix the issue. > Of course I know the answer in they just don't care and their personal paychecks are too high for them to risk becoming a squeaky wheel. Stuff like this does get brought up by employees, especially Google has a lot of internal memes criticizing various aspects of Google's culture or policies. But executives mostly just deflect or ignore it, probably because they don't see the money in fixing it. > So instead, people with respect lose respect for those "yous" that work at bigTech. I guess the more ignorant ones do? I figured it was common knowledge that when something is broken policy-wise at companies, and they're clearly avoiding fixing it, it's rarely the non-management employees that are the problem. Almost always, it's a strategic decision by management to not address the issue (or sometimes they do address it, but poorly).
• constantcrying 2y ago
  Seems insane. Surely every single company would fire you for doing that. If you put this in its proper term it is "corruption" and you should definitely worry about the legal implications of doing this.
  • leokennis 2y ago
    My employer used to have an internal "ambassador app" for employees. If someone I knew used our products and had a complaint, I could put their details and the details of the issue in that app, and they would get contacted on priority. Basically it was a way to positively channel in-person complaints to a structured solution.
  • JohnMakin 2y ago
    For meta/facebook at least it’s long been an open secret that the fastest way to get something done on the platform is to have a connection that works at meta.
    • romanhn 2y ago
      Depends on what "something" is. When I was at FB, they were very clear that you can request account help internally only for your immediate family (and maybe closest friends, I forget) - you are, in essence, vouching for them with your employment as collateral. Helping random strangers or even acquaintances was out of the question. In the early days it was possible, but the team responsible for this stuff got overwhelmed. On the other hand, after I left, I once needed help with a developer-facing page that was broken. For the life of me I could not figure out how to get in touch with a human, so reached out to an ex-colleague and the issue was resolved within a few days. I don't love having to resort to this for many reasons.
      • ethbr1 2y ago
        'Fix it for me and those after me' seems like a positive version of this. I.e. improving documentation, drawing attention to edge cases, etc.
      • 2y ago
• kentbrew 2y ago
  Oh, great. Simjacking as a service.
• multjoy 2y ago
  How do you verify that the requestor isn't just some Joe/Joeline Schmo who's account has been blocked for no reason, as opposed to someone who has been legitimately blocked, say for CSAM or other legislative reason, or is otherwise operating against the service's TOS? When Mike Meta gets canned because he's tried to un-suspend an actual terrorist account (because you know that they're monitoring internal mentions), are you on the hook for that?
  • xyst 2y ago
    I suppose as a "verified employee" at the company. You could do your own investigation prior to filing the appropriate paperwork. But that would often result in its own paper trail getting generated and leading back to you anyways. Honestly, the risks here outweigh the benefits. Not sure why anybody would do this in the first place. "6 figure job with stable income" vs "one time payment of $100 from rando on the internet" It's a no brainer. Honestly smells like a sting operation to me.
  • deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
  • verteu 2y ago
    The same way problems get resolved when someone's sob story goes viral? Presumably an employee sees it and files a ticket that says "hey this stranger is having problem XYZ." Then a support person investigates and takes the appropriate action. (Just a guess, I don't know the process at Meta.)
  • omoikane 2y ago
    Also, my understanding is that a common cause for an account to become frozen is that the account has been (perceived to be) taken over by someone else. Having an accelerated side channel to restore access to those accounts needs to be implemented with great care.
• hurutparittya 2y ago
  I had to check if it was April Fools' Day. This is one of the most disturbing posts I've seen in a while. I sincerely hope that people who profit off of this will get fired at the very least.
  • DEADMINCE 2y ago
    Honestly I see it more as giving some rights back to the common man that these giant tech companies don't feel the need to respect.
  • MrDarcy 2y ago
    If you’re one of the employees who sign up for this, beware. Facebook will surely sue this guy and the payment paper trail will be the first thing he’s required to give over in discovery. I don’t see how he can guarantee you’ll be anonymous for long.
    • matsemann 2y ago
      On what grounds could they sue?
      • bee_rider 2y ago
        The employees are clearly engaging in fraud by doing non-work activities on the clock. The companies know this because they haven’t hired anyone to do customer service.
        • matsemann 2y ago
          But the person said they could "sue this guy". I can see how they would have a beef with their employee doing this, but don't see what grounds to sue "this guy"? Mind you, I know little of the US legal system outside Suits and other probably as incorrect shows.
          • bee_rider 2y ago
• wojciii 2y ago
  This is no different than corruption .. caused by terrible design from the likes of shitter etc.. I'm sure it will be popular. I fucking hate shitter for locking me out of my account but I refuse to pay ransom to get it back. I instead stopped using social media besides anonymous social media and my mental health improved immensely.
  • closewith 2y ago
    Based on the anger in this comment, maybe the anonymous sites aren't for you either?
• RcouF1uZ4gsC 2y ago
  There is a big difference between helping a friend or acquaintance just being nice to doing something for money. Once you add money into something, there is a whole level of scrutiny and legal and ethical implications. Like others have been saying, this is the type of thing that will get you fired immediately. You are not allowed to take your internal access and go into business for yourself selling it.
• throwaway81523 2y ago
  There's an old joke(?) where a guy yells to his neighbor, "Sam! My house is on fire! Quick, who do you know at the fire department?"
  • mtnGoat 2y ago
    This seems too apply to healthcare and legal matters in most of the US as well.
• antifa 2y ago
  For budgeting purposes, I'm trying to amortize the cost of freespeech. Twitter keeps it simple, free speech is $8/month there. How much do you think I should budget monthly/yearly for account suspension appeals? Do you plan on offering a subscription option?
• alchemist1e9 2y ago
  Plot twist - this a honeypot operation by a group of tech companies to find employees to fire.
• mtnGoat 2y ago
  Maybe the folks at these companies writing the corny AI that bans people for posting pictures of cups and flowers, are the same ones getting kickbacks for fixing the problem? I’m sorry, I just can’t help but be cynical about this. These platforms have next to zero actual customer support, the AI inmate is running the asylum and the users suffer the most.
• camillomiller 2y ago
  We think your tone deafness is so outrageous it’s almost comical.
• icedchai 2y ago
  This site is bad, but what's worse is it may be the only way to get your problem solved!
  • jcul 2y ago
    Yeah I almost feel like it is tongue in cheek / a joke. Doesn't seem like a real service, what employee would risk their job for a few hundred dollars. Maybe it is a dig at how the customer support for these huge companies is so poor that this seems like a real thing.
  • swozey 2y ago
    I've posted about it a few times, a few years ago my entire Google account was locked out for "fraud" with Google Pay. Lost my email, DNS, GoogleFI (my CELLPHONE) access. Sent them a picture of my license 3 times on a form they make you fill out (which you have to google, they don't tell you anything, you just can't log in). Never received a response. I'd kind of like this for stuff like that. Bypassing horrendous or non-existent customer support. I never once received a response from Google. I tested my account maybe a year later and it was unlocked.
    • icedchai 2y ago
      That's terrible! I'm curious if you pay for any Google services, do you get better support? For example, I know people who pay for Youtube Premium just so they don't have to watch ads, or spend a few dollars on GCP for personal projects.
      • dan_atem17 2y ago
        [dead]
      • swozey 2y ago
        Nope. Zero difference. I was a paying Google DNS, GoogleFI, and Gmail user. Maybe more. The first thing that happened was my Google Wallet/Pay account was marked as fraud. I didn't know this until my OTHER accounts stopped working. My OTHER accounts stopped working because I couldn't update my credit card at Google Pay to change my recurring bills for all of those services to keep paying for them. I was in the middle of SELLING A HOUSE, literally happened that week. My Gmail was made back when Gmail first started so I have so much mail I have to pay for it to receive mail. I had to migrate everything THAT week to another provider (fastmail). Miserable experience. I couldn't even use my cell phone. I think that might have been cut off immediately. I forget. I don't use Google for anything but SSO now and even then I try to use Apple instead if available. edit: Oh, yeah, I didn't know any of this was broken until I stopped getting email at my private email (via gmail DNS) Gmail account when I was selling the house. Literally nothing told me I was banned.
• xyst 2y ago
  This has to be a sting operation. No way would I risk my stable 6-figure job for some random to get their account unlocked. Especially not for "$100" lol. If the account was locked for fraudulent activity or worse, something illegal like CSAM. That paper trail will easily lead back to you. Bye bye job and possible investigation by authorities. On the upside, at least you will get "free" security from the FBI when you are put on the watchlist.
  • 8f2ab37a-ed6c 2y ago
    This is a great fit for a call center support person in an emerging economy for whom 150 bucks is a big deal, I doubt this would entice a staff eng doing 500k tco.
    • loeg 2y ago
      > staff eng doing 500k tco With the stock flying high, even the L5s who stayed during the 2022 doldrums are making that kind of money.
      • loeg 2y ago
        Which is to say: > the company stated that its median employee made just over $379,000 in 2023 https://www.businessinsider.com/meta-median-yearly-pay-employee-2024-4 https://www.businessinsider.com/meta-median-yearly-pay-emplo... and then check the stock price since 2023: https://www.google.com/finance/quote/META:NASDAQ?window=1Y https://www.google.com/finance/quote/META:NASDAQ?window=1Y
• flipbrad 2y ago
  EU law to the rescue: https://www.eu-digital-services-act.com/Digital_Services_Act_Article_20.html https://www.eu-digital-services-act.com/Digital_Services_Act...
• Euphorbium 2y ago
  Seems like something from darknet.
• laweijfmvo 2y ago
  The reason asking an employee is the only way to get an account unblocked is because it solves the most difficult part of the process: verifying the user is who they say they are. When internal employees fill out that form, you're agreeing SEVERAL times that you are 100% sure you know the person and they aren't compromised. This service throws all of that out the window.
• pugworthy 2y ago
  Please add… Emergency Room staff willing to get you looked at faster because you think you are “really sick” Building inspectors willing to sign off on your home house wiring because you’ve “done it for years and it’s fine” Burning Man ticketing because you swear your internet was fine but died at noon on the sale day. Dang because your downvoted comment was just misunderstood and deserves more upvotes. /s
  • pugworthy 2y ago
    Despite the sarcasm tag, I’d argue my first two examples are not really that different than the service advertised. This service places no responsibility on the requester to prove they have a real case. And in some cases (like the second) there is potentially true and measurable harm if in fact the petition should in fact be unequivocally banned or blocked from a service.
• robxorb 2y ago
  If this makes money, big tech could open a lucrative market for themselves, suspending more and more accounts, and requesting higher and higher "priority fees" to unsuspend them. (Hmm... somehow reminds me of organised crime...)
  • mxuribe 2y ago
    I think the phrase you might be thinking of is as follows: "Hey, that's a nice account ya got there...Be a shame if something were to happen to it!" ;-)
  • bee_rider 2y ago
    Imagine if some competitor showed up that skipped the middleman and made a business model where you pay them a recurring bribe and they just keep your account open.
  • evantbyrne 2y ago
    Facebook doesn't need the money. Twitter on the other hand...
• matsemann 2y ago
  This is modern art, highlighting the absurd difficulty of getting in touch with a human that can fix your issues at big tech.
• bluehatbrit 2y ago
  This could be great satire. The fact it's actually serious is both surprising and sad.
• bee_rider 2y ago
  It is seems wildly corrupt and unethical if somebody would built a business with such bad customer service that people are willing to bribe their way around it.
• djtriptych 2y ago
  Anyone who's ever worked at any big tech company has got to just have a chuckle at how fast you know you'd be fired for being anywhere near this.
• harry_ord 2y ago
  Going by the title I was hoping this was about the choice these companies have made to maze like appeals and support service. This solution solution to the problem is kinda cursed
• deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
• yumraj 2y ago
  Please stop.. I’m pretty sure people will be fired for doing this. Talk about misaligned incentives. What’s stopping employees from intentionally messing with accounts to get paid to fix them.
  • vrc 2y ago
    The old cobra bounty problem
  • StressedDev 2y ago
    If people take bribes, the deserved to be fired. Not much to say other than you are 100% right about this webs site being the wrong solution to the problem. I think people need to stop using software and services with awful support. It's legal and it sends the right message.
• neilv 2y ago
  If any FAANG employee falls for this, it's a good way for the company to weed them out, and terminate them for-cause. You might run this as a honeypot for corrupt, dumb employees. Make it more easily accessible than the outreaches from criminal enterprises.
  • endofreach 2y ago
    I really hate to phrase it like this, but i don't see another way... if a FAANG employee would be considered dumb when signing up for this... how can this not have crossed OPs mind when spending his/her time building this platform (as an ex-FAANG)?
    • mike_d 2y ago
      > how can this not have crossed OPs mind when spending his/her time building this platform You mean the two engineers on loan to the global investigations team at $techcompany?
      • endofreach 2y ago
        I'd think they would make this offer seem less sketchy... facebook & co know better than anyone how to make bad & evil stuff sound desirable. It's in their DNA. If this was actually a honeypot, i would have thought it would seem less like a "sign up for your own lawsuit"-form kinda site. Maybe they use the same technique as the "prince of nigeria" kind of emails & porn ads being made so bad on purpose, to cater to a specific target group... but i just never fully understood how this kind of stuff works out better than... just actually making something better...
    • BoorishBears 2y ago
      I'm surprised no one has considered that this is a way to get people talking more than it is a way to get accounts unsuspended...
      • endofreach 2y ago
• skilled 2y ago
  Many great comments already as to why this is a bad idea, but here is another reason it won’t work: Anyone at these companies can sign up with their @company email address, post an “urgent bounty” and 10 minutes later show up at your desk to fire you. Though I am sure that a lot of money has been made through these types of services, just not out in the open.
• evantbyrne 2y ago
  How to destroy your privileged life in one easy step!
• muppetman 2y ago
  On the flip side I'd pay for this. My Twitter account was suspended last year for no reason I can fathom. I wasn't abusive, I wasn't hacking/abusing the platform etc. Just one day I posted a comment and was then told "Your account is blocked" I'd really love to get it back as it's a 3 letter handle. Alas, despite submitting upwards of 100 appeals I hear nothing back (I guess since Elon took over there's no support staff anymore) Anyway, I can see there would be a market for this, however unethical/risky it would be for employees to participate in.
  • willsmith72 2y ago
    from the stories i've heard, even if they hired back a support team, they wouldn't be able to bring back a lot of accounts people ask for they just botched a bunch of the deletion/suspension processes, in a way that made them unrecoverable
    • muppetman 2y ago
      Interesting. I can still login, my content is still there etc (none of the images are though) so I hoped it'll still be possible. Given that almost all the people I followed etc have left, there probably wouldn't be much left, but I had that account for ~15 years before it was nuked.
      • teen 2y ago
        I am in the same exact situation.
• Plasmoid 2y ago
  It's kinda telling that there's enough demand for freelance tech support that this could exist. Imagine what would happen is Google et al actually did provide support. I'm not sure this is the win for malicious actors that people claim it is. It's gotta be cheaper to buy/make a new account that pay to recover an existing one.
• thih9 2y ago
  What’s stopping big tech from running their own plsfix pages like this and pocketing the money? In practice this would be premium plans that include some form of special treatment.
  • Ylpertnodi 2y ago
    Premium for the 'no ads' tier, of course.
  • tgsovlerkhgsel 2y ago
    1. Bad PR and everything that comes with it (e.g. the kind of unwanted attention from politicians that's bad for business) 2. Payment fraud (which also would be a huge issue on this site if it was to ever take off).
    • cvalka 2y ago
      1. Paytofix. All proceeds go to charity. 2. 2FA + identity verification
• endofreach 2y ago
  If this is not satire, then facebooks influence on society is already worse than i thought...
• LASR 2y ago
  Yeah I don’t know about this. Looks like you’re opening yourself up for a TON of liability with some very powerful businesses. But not only that, you’re likely endangering the jobs of the people who take up your offers. Seems icky. I am all about generating side-income streams by connecting people with needs to those who can fulfill them. But this is not it. I would recommend you take whatever you’ve built and apply it to a different problem. What about monetizing Reddit AMAs? Things like that are a lot more useful and apply to a much wider range of people.
• ftruzzi 2y ago
  It's sad to see all the negative comments considering that HN is often the go-to place for similar requests. This is a great idea, although I can understand how it can be risky for big tech employees. Nice work anyway. Maybe you could market it for bugs/issues rather than just account suspensions. It reminds me of https://xkcd.com/806/ https://xkcd.com/806/
• spencerchubb 2y ago
  On one hand, if you're willing to pay a large sum then it indicates you value your account highly. But on the other hand, this creates perverse incentives for tech employees, and could get them fired. What if the money was donated instead?
• jameslk 2y ago
  This is a clever hack to solve the problem. It’s essentially an underground market for customer support, converting company employees into clandestine customer service reps. Better than nothing, but think about how silly that sounds. Tech companies know customer support doesn’t scale and they don’t have a strong enough incentive to hire customer service people. Automating away these “cost centers” of labor is largely why tech companies have grown to have the highest market caps in the world. Until we address this incentive issue, tech companies are going to keep eliminating jobs that require lots of manual labor through automation. Or the free market will solve it for the highest bidder.
  • cqqxo4zV46cp 2y ago
    It’s not clever at all. It doesn’t solve the core issue, which is identity / ownership verification. You’re conflating clever with “something I’d find personally useful”.
    • jameslk 2y ago
      It’s clever in that it potentially helps with the problem of “I’ve been banned and there’s no customer support to help me” by incentivizing employees to perform contractually dubious customer support. The problem you’re talking about is a different one. I’m not claiming that any of these problems are being solved entirely nor ideally with this clever hack. My point is that hacks like these are symptoms of a larger problem in incentives for tech companies. We’ve exchanged humans being paid to help humans for a few tech companies that rule our lives via automated decisions.
• deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
• denisdl 2y ago
  I think this is a great idea to show how to create a product to attend a real customer pain - but only as a protest site to raise some awareness to the customer service problem of these big techs. But, if real, it's an huge unethical breach for bribery, privacy violation, and will only benefit illegal content. A real customer using this will never be accepted again on those platforms.
  • 38 2y ago
    > A real customer using this will never be accepted again on those platforms this sentence doesn't make sense
    • denisdl 2y ago
      sorry, english is not my first language. my point is if a real customer, let's say get blocked on Instagram after an account takeover try to use this service to rescue and unblock and get caught by Meta team, surely will not get their account back because of the unofficial means used to recover the account.
• djyaz1200 2y ago
  The companies should just have paid premium support.
• zbentley 2y ago
  Damn, of course there's an internal form to fill out. Google/Meta demonstrably know that there needs to be a way around broken automated ban systems. They just gate it behind access to an employee (who wants to keep their job) to prevent people from using it. So let's have a thought exercise: what would it cost, in dollars, to have a hyperscale web service that doesn't have this problem? In other words, a Facebook/Google-equivalent web service of some kind that has a public a link to a 'mistakenly banned appeal' form for anyone to use. The constraints/spirit of the exercise are that the volume of worldwide engagement with our hypothetical service needs to be equivalent to engagement with Google/Facebook (and equivalently appealing for ToS-violators to abuse, leading to a comparable volume of automated bans). Auto-ban systems and ToS are similar to Fb/Google as well. The product doesn't matter a ton. Maybe it's a social network, or an office/email suite, whatever. The difference is that ImaginaryCorp honestly strives to provide a ban-appeal process equivalent to what you get if you know someone who works at Google to absolutely everyone. Let's say they promise a verdict within a calendar month, with at least some amount of useful explanation. The review process can be automated within reason, but not if it violates the goal of reducing abuse and false ban rates to the level that a Google employee can expect when they submit their uncle Doug's marginally-suspicious banned account for internal review. ImaginaryCorp really believes in the spirit of that goal, so they're not willing to compromise on the review process much. Yeah yeah, it's implausible that belief in the spirit of the goal would be present at every level of the company. It's a thought excercise about monetary cost, just go with it. They won't half-ass it and just grant everyone's appeal because the have a similar commitment to Fb/Goog to not losing users after becoming a cesspit, are subject to CSAM etc. laws, and generally care about not being a clearinghouse for abusive content. Doing this would probably require a lot more human review (unless Google is for some reason sitting on a way better auto-ban system and not using it), and as a result would require a massive staff and process edifice to execute that, keeping false-positives to a bare minimum, on a global scale. Financially, the business has to remain sustainable with this system in place (but not necessarily successful or growing on par with competition). So the question is: how much would this cost me, the user? Even if ImaginaryCorp runs ads like Fb/Google, would that account-review edifice require subscription fees to not run the company out of money? If so, assume users act like shitty free-but-your-data-and-clicks-are-the-product users and not like paying customers, so legitimate abuse rates stay high (again, thought experiment). If there are fees, how much am I paying a month--$5? $50? $500? Or would running this review system just mean that the company is a little (or a lot) less profitable than its competitors? It's an interesting question to think about. The requirement of providing useful explanation to legitimately banned users actually complicates things a great deal, because it might lead to gaming the system. Staffing is obviously a huge challenge: high-social-context groups of reviewers would need to be present all over the world. Staffing is an even bigger challenge if you opt to solve issues "at the source" by fixing the auto-ban systems themselves (which results in needing to solve realtime moderation at scale, a notoriously intractable problem). Automation is tempting, but risks falling directly back into the issue we're trying to solve. In the real world, this would obviously never happen, but I'm interested in what you all think.
• CodeWriter23 2y ago
  Here’s the biggest problem with big tech. Too many people think this behavior is just ok. ಠ_ಠ
• mullingitover 2y ago
  I wonder if it'd be more effective to make a platform for victims of wrongful account suspensions that helped them to purchase ads targeted at likely ad buyers, highlighting the wrongful suspension of the individuals. These are advertising companies, they'll likely care if their customers are getting negative press from their victims constantly. Since obviously FB/Alphabet/etc aren't going to allow negative ads targeting their own platform, you post them on a different platform.
• jjmarr 2y ago
  Professor Robert Kiltgaard said corruption = monopoly + discretion - transparency. He wrote this about political systems and bribery, but it also applies here. https://globalanticorruptionblog.com/2014/05/27/klitgaards-misleading-corruption-formula/ https://globalanticorruptionblog.com/2014/05/27/klitgaards-m... Many tech companies have a monopoly on their market, infinite discretion, and zero transparency. It's a wonder nobody has thought of a "facilitating payments" startup sooner. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Facilitating_payment https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Facilitating_payment Everyone in the comments seems to think that this is a bad deal for the employees and that may be true at $500/unban. But imagine you're someone making $300k/year where all your accounts rely on 2fa codes sent to your email or you're someone with an social media-based business. You might pay a lot more than $500 to get your accounts back. And not everyone in Big Tech works in San Francisco. There's many people in low cost of living countries (e.g. Europe) that make half as much as Americans. Needless to say, people that earn less are more susceptible. While I'm not condoning bribery, I'm surprised that the near-unanimous reaction of other commenters is that bribing employees of social media companies is infeasible. Historically speaking, any system without transparency where employees have discretion to do things that others assign monetary value have been corrupted. Tech companies should take this more seriously, because once people are accustomed to making payments to get fair treatment from a decisionmaker, it becomes very difficult to change that behaviour.
  • mr_toad 2y ago
    The only way to win is not to play. Screw social media, it’s a plague on humanity.
    • hackernewds 2y ago
      What else is a plague on humanity that should be capriciously destroyed by bribery?
  • deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
• Crosseye_Jack 2y ago
  When you have verified employees offering “full account takeover”, are the employees just advertising their willingness to just hand over your account to anyone willing to pay?
• sgammon 2y ago
  Lawyers gonna have a great day with this one
• teen 2y ago
  No twitter? I have a very old account with a 4 letter username. I used it sparingly for years. I had made my profile pic the same as Trump and wrote proud cuckold & 45th president of the US during the election as a joke. The background was Trump golfing in unflattering photos. I lost access to the email address I created the account (I still have the email address name, the account password, nothing else has changed) because the recovery email was from college. They may have sent me a warning to that address, but I have never seen it. My account was permanently suspended. I wish I could just go in and delete the existing content / make a normal profile page / fix whatever is offensive. Elon had said there would be 1 time amnesty for all suspended accounts, but it never happened. I appealed at least 5 times over the years, but it was always upheld. I would pay for that account back.
• MerManMaid 2y ago
  Perhaps its just me, but I feel like a lot of users are missing the forest for the trees here. Services such as these only pop up when legitimate solutions prove ineffective at addressing the problem. To me, these services are more indicative of "Big Tech" failing to create effective appeal processes to meet their consumer's demand... While I'm sure there isn't a lot of money in it, it'd be great for Big Tech to examine how they could improve on this front.
  • mrWiz 2y ago
    I think the majority of HN is aware of Big Tech's failure to create effective appeal processes. It's not exactly a secret. This service is still naked corruption, though.
    • ethbr1 2y ago
      > This service is still naked corruption This service feels capitalistically egalitarian!
    • MerManMaid 2y ago
      Absolutely, I just think our time is better spent examining the source of the problem.
    • johnnyanmac 2y ago
      >Dishonest or fraudulent conduct by those in power, typically involving bribery. Don't see much dishonest. And honestly, it may fall under a bribe, but bribe implies the person in power was the one who affected you. Which clearly isn't the case here. In my eyes, this is just making a public service of something we 100% know people who make tech companies profitable already have access to.
      • mrWiz 2y ago
        This is an unsanctioned, under-the-table payment to someone in power in exchange for special treatment. You're saying this /may/ fall under bribery?
• cqqxo4zV46cp 2y ago
  This feels like some sort of HN April Fools joke. At this point it’d be impossible to actually parody this place.
• bagels 2y ago
  I read about a more entrepreneurial approach a while back: Only Fans model got their instagram account back by finding employees on linkedin and trading sex for account un-bans. https://www.newsweek.com/onlyfans-star-slept-meta-employees-instagram-unbanned-1708744 https://www.newsweek.com/onlyfans-star-slept-meta-employees-...
• justusthane 2y ago
  “We don’t need legislation, the free market will fix it” The free market: this website This website is absolutely insane, and it’s insane that the creator doesn’t seem to have any awareness of how insane it is, judging by the about page. However, I can’t lay too much blame on the creator when it’s clearly emblematic of a much larger problem.
• BxGyw2 2y ago
  No escrow?
• BxGyw2 2y ago
  [flagged]
  • H8crilA 2y ago
    It's not "moralfagging", it's just so idiotic to do this while being an employee. It is in fact so insanely stupid that one should get fired for the ineptitude alone. I am glad this service exists and exposes some of the toughest cases holed up in the corpo employment space.
    • BxGyw2 2y ago
      100% agree. Would never take money for something like this feels irresponsible. But it is a reaction to a very real problem that everyday people have all the time, and the comments all being "omg im sooo angry u deserve to be fired" instead of something useful is sad
  • lazyasciiart 2y ago
    So much what?
• noriginal 2y ago
  You've seen Silicon Valley disrupt money laundering to great success, so get excited for Silicon Valley to disrupt bribery!
• medellin 2y ago
  I love the pearl clutching on hacker news.
• dumbfounder 2y ago
  Not sure whether to laugh or cry.
• bragr 2y ago
  This is commercial bribery in most places. >California Code, Penal Code - PEN § 641.3 >(a) Any employee who solicits, accepts, or agrees to accept money or any thing of value from a person other than his or her employer, other than in trust for the employer, corruptly and without the knowledge or consent of the employer, in return for using or agreeing to use his or her position for the benefit of that other person, and any person who offers or gives an employee money or any thing of value under those circumstances, is guilty of commercial bribery. >(b) This section does not apply where the amount of money or monetary worth of the thing of value is two hundred fifty dollars ($250) or less.
  • winternett 2y ago
    If you post "locked out of my account on *" almost anywhere on social media, a bunch of bots flood you with advice on who to contact to be reinstated. From my perspective, lockouts seem to be an unchecked extortion ring run by social media employees and/or on platforms to make money... Social Media in itself has always been somewhat of a grift, and it's created all kinds of opportunities for scammers to be faceless and to coordinate activities that mislead people... It's shameful, but all part of the building story that will be epic to read when it all collapses. Social media pushed NFTs, Crypto, Influencer Culture, and all kinds of other "Fake It Till You Make It" schemes, we can really do without it and go back to independent web communities, it will be painful for a little while of course, but far better than just getting 30 views on a post promoting your business because you didn't pay them money for more views... Social Media has always kind of been extortion in a way, they want your time and money for returning very little entertainment/business value.
    • mikrotikker 2y ago
      We can dream.
  • nvarsj 2y ago
    Interesting. Does this apply to the people making 5-6 figures on paid interview prep sites?
  • tgsovlerkhgsel 2y ago
• tgsovlerkhgsel 2y ago
  The description_text that is supposed to only be visible to verified tech workers is exposed publicly in the response to one of the 'msearch' requests if you inspect the network requests using your browser's developer tools. I'm not familiar with the details of the bubble.io platform that this seems to be based on, but from a very casual look, it looks terrifying from a security viewpoint. I wouldn't be surprised if there were more data leaks.
  • hayyyyydos 2y ago
    Not the first time I've seen that kind of leak from a site using bubble.io
• stubish 2y ago
  I fully understand why this is considered unethical. I fully understand that employees will get fired for taking the bounties. But what actual law is being broken here? I suspect it is legally a bribe, because it is facilitating a non-routine action. But only because of that non-routine bit. Would it be possible to prosecute this, going into court and admitting that your suspension appeals process is non-routine? And what part of a standard employment contract is being broken here? Taking money to perform a service your employer does not offer? And interestingly, if the employer does offer the service, then it is no longer a bribe but a legal facilitation payment (so you would want a clause in the employment contract to prevent this) (Not rhetorical - looking for answers to the above questions) In many ways, this process already happens, and even expected by all concerned. More than once I've seen twitter personality manages to get some decision reversed seemingly only because they could make enough noise, often ending up on the front page here. The difference is in the currency used to pay to bypass the system.
  • lazyasciiart 2y ago
    My employment contracts have all required at minimum that I inform them of any commercial work I am doing outside my employment for them, and sometimes required that I get approval from them before beginning. Having some undisclosed second employment would definitely be grounds for firing, if they wanted.
    • grecy 2y ago
      OK sure, but is it illegal?
      • stubish 2y ago
        I asked two questions specifically because a clause like this in an employment contract is there to enable termination no matter if the act is legal or not. Also, breaking your employment contract can make you liable for damages if the employer can demonstrate them.
    • Aeolun 2y ago
      My employment contracts have never specified anything of the kind. I suspect it’s just illegal where I live.
• rossjudson 2y ago
  So it costs <$250 to identify each compromised employee? Cheap!
• labster 2y ago
  This is great news for employers! They get a highly motivated workforce focused on solving client problems and improving retention, all for free. No need to hire customer service reps and waste all that money when the invisible hand will take care of your customers for you.
• yieldcrv 2y ago
  given the legal issues people have pontificated about, I think an prediction/assassination market is better for this will @jpdpeters instagram account by restored by May 31st? the person that predicts this most correctly with the largest position was the person in control of the outcome and you can then just make a feed of these kinds of predictions to your “market” of employees
• deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
• maguito 2y ago
  This could work to hire big twitter (x?) accounts to tweet for help on your behalf to get the company's attention
• jayd16 2y ago
  Reminds me of all the upcharge bribery in Snow Crash. For only a bit more you the rent a cops will take you to the nice jail.
• tennisflyi 2y ago
  Posted earlier on HN as "FAANG support" - prolly fishing in the end
  • qingcharles 2y ago
    Thank you! I spent ages trying to find the previous submission! https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36899787 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36899787
• Narhem 2y ago
  My reddit accounts get banned instantly. Absolutely sure it's a real person too. There's a reason why and given the emails they still send I don't ever want to appeal. It's like a waste of my time anyway. The only problem being I refuse to work. Was hyping to post sexy pictures of myself to maybe get a girlfriend but that didn't happen.
• ojbyrne 2y ago
  Also former FB employee. I tried using the same internal system, for my own account, about 3 years ago. It was completely useless.
• flumpcakes 2y ago
  This is one of the most unethical things I think I've ever seen on hackernews.
  • mixmastamyk 2y ago
    Certainly more ethical than automated banishment without recourse.
• hehdhdjehehegwv 2y ago
  Isn’t this just Twitter Blue?
• ggm 2y ago
  The idea is insanely unworkable, but the PROBLEM is entirely real. Personally, I look to the FCC and like bodies to implement the required governance norms: if you offer freemium services to people, you have an obligation to implement real-person interaction on account suspension, and a mediated access path to your effects inside the locked-down digital store. These identities now fuel our access to governments, and public services. If you can't access your google account you can be blocked from legal documents. I know "caveat emptor" and all that.
  • creamyhorror 2y ago
    > the required governance norms: if you offer freemium services to people, you have an obligation to implement real-person interaction on account suspension, and a mediated access path to your effects inside the locked-down digital store. These identities now fuel our access to governments, and public services. If you can't access your google account you can be blocked from legal documents. Yes, very well stated, this exactly. If you have a hold over how people interact with others or organize their lives or do business, you should offer reasonable processes for addressing issues e.g. lockouts that could impact them seriously. It's the sort of process that should exist: if your email account got shut, what if the helpdesk refused to ever tell you why or how it could be reopened? It's too late to move (social media) providers by then.
• bilalq 2y ago
  FWIW, having friends at Google and Stripe has been critical for my startup to survive potentially extinction-level disasters. Automated systems false-positive flagging us and shutting down our payment processing with no recourse happened on both. Only by having people on the inside was I able to get my case appealed by an actual human who was capable of reasoning. I don't think I'd be okay with a platform like this. The ethics around it are questionable. But I think it's important that you don't take on a dependency unless you personally know at least a few people at senior roles at the company you'll be relying on.
  • pylua 2y ago
    This feels like a contradiction at first glance. Violates Ethics of privilege? It would be better and more fair to have everyone pay.
    • bilalq 2y ago
      I don't think it's okay having to have relied on internal escalation either. The problem is that critical dependencies like payment processing and platform distribution can just destroy you at the whim of a false-positive flagging from an algorithm. You're then left with no recourse. Having everyone pay for support that actually delivers would be fine in theory, but that doesn't really work out either. It would just punt the problem down until you hit it again. Even if you're paying for support, you're still likely to hit a human who just regurgitates a script at you and is unable to resolve the issue. Oftentimes, escalation is needed. If your support agent is unwilling to escalate, back channels are the only option. Having internal friends raise a fuss is one method that sometimes works, but going viral on Twitter/HN are other ways that people accomplish this. The reality is that people who are more well-connected have advantages. Someone with a large social media following or a business that's more well-known will always get better support than someone unknown. I don't know what the solution to this would be.
    • Liquix 2y ago
      it would be better and more fair to either A) provide actual support for everyone or B) do away with the "internal forms" and provide zero support to everyone. there shouldn't be two hidden levels of support depending on how deep your pockets are or who you know.
• terrycody 2y ago
  Please add X/twitter platform, my account just got suspended without reasons.
• albert_e 2y ago
  > for the benefit of that other person What if I route the payment through a third party like my lawyer Mr. Cohen
  • bawolff 2y ago
    Then both you and your lawyer go to jail. When you accept money from someone, it doesn't matter who physically hands you the money, it matters who caused the money to be given to you.
  • notjoemama 2y ago
    I laughed, but I felt the need to downvote. By the rules, this is off topic, but personally, I'm exhausted by politics being injected into every other topic of conversation. Even if you and I agree politically, I think we can reduce hyper partisanship by not being political in discussions outside of politics. It's the reason this joke exists: How can you tell whether someone is a vegan or into CrossFit? Because they will tell you about it.
    • albert_e 2y ago
      I agree there should be some spaces free of politics. Will avoid. (The original point was -- if the law is strictly worded such that it is a crime only if there is demonstrable benefit for the person who is paying then the "loophole" exists where the person getting the benefit and the person making the payment can be separated. I could have said the same thing without using the most recent known example of a similar attempt.) But also crime and fraud are what they are -- whether committed by politicians or business people or those in other professions. If we are talking about something questionable done by say SBF or Elon Musk and they also have some political connections or leaning -- that might not in itself make the discussion political. Yes there are subtle ways those discussions can carry undertones and phrased to score imaginary points. In that sense avoiding references where possible is advisable - probably akin to 'defensive driving'.
  • dang 2y ago
    We detached this subthread from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40435890 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40435890 and marked it offtopic.
• noobermin 2y ago
  I don't know why we've as a society have decided these companies that work this way will be the way we organise our lives.
• qingcharles 2y ago
  This is identical to another site that was posted on HN last year offering the same service, with almost identical description. If I can find the post I'll edit my comment here. I only remember because I am still trying to get into my Gmail account for which I have the username, password and recovery email.
  • qingcharles 2y ago
    Here it is from 10 months ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36899787 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36899787 "Enter FaangSupport. FaangSupport connects you and me to verified (via email) Faang Volunteers. When complete, the main interface will be an Inbox like layout, through which you can create tickets and correspond with a Faang employee."
• dorkwood 2y ago
  My Instagram account was blocked for years for no reason. Even when I decided I no longer wanted the account, I still couldn't delete it. I posted about it here multiple times. Some posters offered suggestions -- if I was in the EU, they said, I could invoke the "right to be forgotten", and Instagram would legally have to remove my account. Unfortunately, I do not live in the EU. When Meta Verified was launched late last year with a human support feature, I paid the subscription fee and created a support ticket. They asked for screenshots and videos of the problem, but ultimately said there was nothing they could do. Stubbornly, I kept at it, and over 100 emails later they finally fixed the issue by resetting the email that was linked to my account. My question is: why didn't mine take 5 minutes?
• smsm42 2y ago
  This just shows how broken and insanely anti-consumer Big Tech is. You have to pay 200 bucks for somebody to look on the down low into your account being randomly disabled... and everybody pretty much accepts it as normal. Very dystopian.
• wg0 2y ago
  This actually speaks volumes about the ethical standing and abusive power those companies hold over commoners where genuine no-reason suspensions are impossible to apeal against.
• dotcoma 2y ago
  Is this legal ?
• Animats 2y ago
  Ah, fixers. This used to be a problem mostly in corrupt third world countries. Now ordinary Americans need them. Lawyers usually serve this role in the US.
• mensetmanusman 2y ago
  A marketplace for social engineering access to internal DBs.
• bitzun 2y ago
  FYI if you sign up as a tech employee, it lets you view requests (and seemingly respond to them? I didn't try.) without verifying your account. This includes whatever personal details the user put into the request.
• sandeep_random 2y ago
  This is wrong and risky at so many levels, not sure if using the big tech name here was a clickbait in the first place 1. Not all employees have access to account and user data in any medium+ size company 2. What one does in their own time is personal business but what one does in their own time on company IP is not personal anymore. The person might even get fired, the karma point or couple hundred are not worth the risk. 3. This just creates a channel to identify the weak links in human chain for phishing attacks Ironically instagram was not even in the list for selection for the form
• launch_it 2y ago
  [flagged]
• deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
• deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
• parentheses 2y ago
  Showed up late and the site is filled with garbage content.
• aestetix 2y ago
  I badly need something like this because Big Tech sites are awful. I tried to submit a request, but it gave me an error about sendgrid credits. I guess the site is already a huge success.
• sam1r 2y ago
  Okay, regardless of how many (or all) rules this breaks.. One must minimally respect the risk to publicly post a self-created novel concept as such. With such confidence. Awesome marketplace - I hope it helps save some time ultimately.
• gogusrl 2y ago
  I've been looking for something like this. I was an idiot and my 18 years old reddit account got hacked. Figured it out in a few hours, did a password reset, I change the password but I still get invalid password after. It's been 9 months now without a reply from support. I wished I'd have paid for reddit gold or something to have an actual legal base to do something. If anyone from reddit is reading this, it's the same username as here.