14 ms·

Apple Pencils don’t draw straight on replaced iPad screens

141 points by dataflow 3y ago

dataflow 3y ago
Note: I slightly edited the title for accuracy. In particular, it appears "third-party replacement screens" doesn't refer to third-party-manufactured screens, but merely replacements performed by third parties using genuine Apple screens. And we simply know that they don't draw straight lines, not that they "can't". More reading: https://www.reddit.com/r/gadgets/comments/15cxwaa/apple_pencils_cant_draw_straight_on_thirdparty/ https://www.reddit.com/r/gadgets/comments/15cxwaa/apple_penc...
- KennyBlanken 3y ago
  My god, the narrative. "Apple is doing this just to fuck with users, fuck apple" etc over and over despite zero evidence as to their intention here. One sane person comes up with the more likely explanation: > That implies to me the calibration is unique to each screen and a proper repair has a calibration setup step? And someone just dismisses that perfectly logical explanation completely out of hand, declaring 'all the hardware is identical' > No that is not the case. Its not a calibration that really happens here because the screens and the hardware are identical. Tell me you don't know anything about mass production without telling me you don't know anything about mass production... Their reply is further sense: > If Apple wanted to prevent unauthorised replacements they would have no reason to cause erratic behaviour, they could just disable it. I am so tired of people who interpret Apple's actions purely as anti-consumer fuckery. Even to this day, people still claim that "apple made people's phones slow down as they got older, so they would have to buy new ones" despite it being widely covered that Apple, like other phone manufacturers, slows down the CPU when they detect the battery's internal resistance rising to prevent brownouts so that the phone is usable for a longer period of time and all you have to do to restore original performance is replace the battery, apple or no. You point that out and without admitting they were wrong, they shriek "well apple should have TOLD people that's what they were doing." No other manufacturer was telling people, either. Plenty of Android handsets just randomly start crashing as the battery's internal resistance goes up. I had one. A Google Nexus 6. It took me months and multiple re-installs of the OS to figure out what was going on before I read others saying that new batteries fixed their crashing. You just can't win. Don't get me started on how superior the lightning connector is for daily use - predominantly charging - compared to USB-C, but apparently Apple are "dicks" for not going to a more fragile connector literally designed to break just like every USB connector before it. People even have the nerve to complain about Apple "taxing" cable manufacturers and their burdensome certification, ignoring the whole "random USB-C cables will fry your laptop and phone" problem and the fact that the USB alliance charges a license fee on every single product that bears the USB logo.
  - Fnoord 3y ago
    > I am so tired of people who interpret Apple's actions purely as anti-consumer fuckery. But it is because they don't care about it working after a third party repair. They're trying to profit twice: once from sale, once from hardware repair support which is very expensive (lol, 600 EUR to replace a MBP 2014 screen ..) inflates the price and warrants the higher price of a new device. > Don't get me started on how superior the lightning connector is for daily use - predominantly charging Depends on the device. You can charge a smartphone wirelessly, too, and you might want to use wired for transferring data. Yes, I know, it is a cloud world but that isn't my choice. And if you want to transfer data via lightning... prepare for the fun experience of 480 mbit/sec called USB2. > People even have the nerve to complain about Apple "taxing" cable manufacturers and their burdensome certification, ignoring the whole "random USB-C cables will fry your laptop and phone" problem and the fact that the USB alliance charges a license fee on every single product that bears the USB logo. Indeed, I do, because Apple wants to earn large margins on everything. I also recommend against using random cables, see e.g. O.MG cable.
  - xw4002 3y ago
    > you just can’t win This is correct. On the internet you really can’t win because it’s not a debate, or even a conversation with another individual. You’re talking to an anonymous mob of unknown size and composition.
    - deleted 3y ago
      [deleted]
  - HumblyTossed 3y ago
    > I am so tired of people who interpret Apple's actions purely as anti-consumer fuckery. Even to this day, people still claim that "apple made people's phones slow down as they got older, so they would have to buy new ones" despite it being widely covered that Apple, like other phone manufacturers, slows down the CPU when they detect the battery's internal resistance rising to prevent brownouts so that the phone is usable for a longer period of time and all you have to do to restore original performance is replace the battery, apple or no. What they did was chase thinness and so they didn't include an adequate power source for the processor they were using.
voyagerfan5761 3y ago
Avoidant as I am of Apple's ecosystem, I can only imagine the "security" justification for serializing a display panel. Covert exfiltration of sensitive information from password managers and such? At any rate, I continue to be unamused by how difficult it is for normal people to service their own Apple devices.
- redeeman 3y ago
  > their own Apple devices. thats a slightly different interpretation of the situation than what the mighty apple has :) and I suspect thats where most of the "confusion" is :)
- randomuser23423 3y ago
  > Avoidant as I am of Apple's ecosystem, I can only imagine the "security" justification for serializing a display panel. Covert exfiltration of sensitive information from password managers and such? They're a more valuable target for theft the more parts that can be "cleanly" sold.
  - hsbauauvhabzb 3y ago
    Are ipad thieving gangs really breaking down and on selling stolen components?
    - TillE 3y ago
      If you make Apple devices totally worthless to thieves, you discourage theft. Make them bricks which can't even be harvested for parts. That's the goal apparently, and it makes sense.
      - can16358p 3y ago
        This. As a user I'm okay with using only authorized components if it makes theft virtually impractical as there wouldn't be much to use even if the device is stolen. It will give me more peace of mind as no one will have the incentive to steal an iPad anymore.
spdustin 3y ago
Seems to me like it might be a calibration issue, and third parties aren’t able to perform the calibration.
- dataflow 3y ago
  I have no way to verify this, but this Redditor claims it's due to the serial number being different, not calibration (also see the grandparent comment that they posted): https://www.reddit.com/r/gadgets/comments/15cxwaa/apple_pencils_cant_draw_straight_on_thirdparty/jtztu2g/ https://www.reddit.com/r/gadgets/comments/15cxwaa/apple_penc... That said, I see a generous explanation that I can't rule out based on what they're describing. It seems like the only test this Redditor mentioned was that you can modify the serial number and cause it to go from correct behavior to misbehavior. But I would think the reverse direction is the real test, since otherwise this could just imply that the device is looking up some embedded calibration information for that serial number and not finding it, and therefore falling back to some default behavior?
  - KennyBlanken 3y ago
    That redditor says it's just serial number matching, complains at length about how this issue is destroying their business while in the same breath saying that reprogramming the screen's serial number on a working unit will bring up the same problem. So, if it's just a matching serial numbers problem, why aren't they programming the new screens with the serial number of the old screen, and thus the problem goes away?
    - dataflow 3y ago
      It's a reasonable question; I don't know the answer. It might require damaging the device too much to return it to the consumer at that point? Or maybe they can't due to contractual reasons? It might be worth asking them on Reddit.
    - realusername 3y ago
      That's exactly what their "calibration" procedure on iPhone does, it just changes the serial number pairing, nothing else, you don't even have to touch on the screen.
a2tech 3y ago
[flagged]
alden5 3y ago
A while ago there was an issue that when replacing a camera on an iphone 12 it would cause the camera to become unresponsive. The problem was later solved with a software update without much fanfare; Backing up the fact that it was a glitch, the problem never occurred on the 12 pro. but yea i definitely hate the serialization, especially considering it looks like their hardware design is becoming more repairable with the 14's back glass becoming removable, it makes their software lockdowns make even less sense.
LocalH 3y ago
A modern version of what Oliver Stiller did in Amica Paint for the C64. https://www.pagetable.com/?p=860 https://www.pagetable.com/?p=860
ChrisArchitect 3y ago
[dupe] Discussion from a few days ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36903865 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36903865
anyfactor 3y ago
Tangential rant. Has tablet computer really improved since the last Google Nexus 7 tablet, which was released in 2013? Seriously, I was in the market for an affordable tablet, and quite bizarrely the tablet computers today have significantly underwhelming spec compared to a phone of the same price point. There is no budget tab from known manufacturers. Even at IPad level prices, the android counterpart is quite underwhelming. I don't how it happened by it seems like IPad is the only tablet computer to get. For people on a budget there is no other viable option then to get a used IPad and news like this makes me kinda mad. What the heck is even going on? Like in 2012-15 era there was bunch of variations of tablet computer of different price points. These days everyone from toddlers with their padded covers and graphics designers with an apple pencil is using an IPad.
- freitzkriesler2 3y ago
  It's because Google dropped the ball on Android smartphone app sizing for phones vs tablets. This IS changing now that Google has a pixel foldable smartphone.
  - kccqzy 3y ago
    Couldn't you say the same thing for iOS/iPadOS though? It's up to the developers to manually support iPads. To date, very well known and popular apps like Instagram still run as iPhone-sized. Which is especially perplexing because there are seriously good photographers on Instagram whose work should be enjoyed on a bigger screen.
  - Gigachad 3y ago
    Google picks up and drops tablets semi frequently. It wouldn’t surprise me if the manager who came up with the idea of doing tablets again gets promoted and then the idea gets abandoned shortly after.
- dotnet00 3y ago
  Not exactly a budget tab, but I've found the S8 Ultra (and the S7 FE before that) to be pretty great. The S8U managing to make having a laptop entirely unnecessary (since I'd only need a laptop away from home and I mainly WFH). With Android there has been a long period of stagnation with only Samsung doing custom stuff like DeX, multi-tasking stuff and striking deals with various productivity apps for Android ports to make Android viable for tablets, otherwise they're only very recently starting to come out of it with Google working on a Pixel Tab.
otterley 3y ago
Not all replaced iPad screens. Only non-OEM (third party) replacements.
- menus 3y ago
  Wrong. https://www.youtube.com/shorts/0sWmBNj6Eok https://www.youtube.com/shorts/0sWmBNj6Eok A genuine screen from another iPad will cause this issue until you swap the chip from the old screen to the new screen.
  - otterley 3y ago
    Ah, thanks for the link. The story this post is linked to said only aftermarket screens had this issue. I don’t have any inside knowledge but I suspect authorized Apple repair centers have access to a tool they can use to recalibrate the screen after replacement that the mom-and-pop shop doesn’t have.
    - menus 3y ago
      Apologies for coming off rude. Apple's anti-repair stance is a sensitive topic for me.
userbinator 3y ago
That looks like deliberate sabotage, and not merely a "the screen wasn't calibrated correctly" which I suspect Apple is going to try to spin this as, especially if using the existing controller with the new screen as the video claims causes this to be fixed. Watch the video - it's very short. More disturbing is the realisation that there are people working at Apple to implement stuff like this.
- userbinator 3y ago
  No counterarguments, just downvotes? "Truth is found in the weeds" ;-)

141 points by dataflow 3y ago

Note: I slightly edited the title for accuracy. In particular, it appears "third-party replacement screens" doesn't refer to third-party-manufactured screens, but merely replacements performed by third parties using genuine Apple screens. And we simply know that they don't draw straight lines, not that they "can't". More reading: https://www.reddit.com/r/gadgets/comments/15cxwaa/apple_pencils_cant_draw_straight_on_thirdparty/ https://www.reddit.com/r/gadgets/comments/15cxwaa/apple_penc...

KennyBlanken 3y ago
My god, the narrative. "Apple is doing this just to fuck with users, fuck apple" etc over and over despite zero evidence as to their intention here. One sane person comes up with the more likely explanation: > That implies to me the calibration is unique to each screen and a proper repair has a calibration setup step? And someone just dismisses that perfectly logical explanation completely out of hand, declaring 'all the hardware is identical' > No that is not the case. Its not a calibration that really happens here because the screens and the hardware are identical. Tell me you don't know anything about mass production without telling me you don't know anything about mass production... Their reply is further sense: > If Apple wanted to prevent unauthorised replacements they would have no reason to cause erratic behaviour, they could just disable it. I am so tired of people who interpret Apple's actions purely as anti-consumer fuckery. Even to this day, people still claim that "apple made people's phones slow down as they got older, so they would have to buy new ones" despite it being widely covered that Apple, like other phone manufacturers, slows down the CPU when they detect the battery's internal resistance rising to prevent brownouts so that the phone is usable for a longer period of time and all you have to do to restore original performance is replace the battery, apple or no. You point that out and without admitting they were wrong, they shriek "well apple should have TOLD people that's what they were doing." No other manufacturer was telling people, either. Plenty of Android handsets just randomly start crashing as the battery's internal resistance goes up. I had one. A Google Nexus 6. It took me months and multiple re-installs of the OS to figure out what was going on before I read others saying that new batteries fixed their crashing. You just can't win. Don't get me started on how superior the lightning connector is for daily use - predominantly charging - compared to USB-C, but apparently Apple are "dicks" for not going to a more fragile connector literally designed to break just like every USB connector before it. People even have the nerve to complain about Apple "taxing" cable manufacturers and their burdensome certification, ignoring the whole "random USB-C cables will fry your laptop and phone" problem and the fact that the USB alliance charges a license fee on every single product that bears the USB logo.
- Fnoord 3y ago
  > I am so tired of people who interpret Apple's actions purely as anti-consumer fuckery. But it is because they don't care about it working after a third party repair. They're trying to profit twice: once from sale, once from hardware repair support which is very expensive (lol, 600 EUR to replace a MBP 2014 screen ..) inflates the price and warrants the higher price of a new device. > Don't get me started on how superior the lightning connector is for daily use - predominantly charging Depends on the device. You can charge a smartphone wirelessly, too, and you might want to use wired for transferring data. Yes, I know, it is a cloud world but that isn't my choice. And if you want to transfer data via lightning... prepare for the fun experience of 480 mbit/sec called USB2. > People even have the nerve to complain about Apple "taxing" cable manufacturers and their burdensome certification, ignoring the whole "random USB-C cables will fry your laptop and phone" problem and the fact that the USB alliance charges a license fee on every single product that bears the USB logo. Indeed, I do, because Apple wants to earn large margins on everything. I also recommend against using random cables, see e.g. O.MG cable.
- xw4002 3y ago
  > you just can’t win This is correct. On the internet you really can’t win because it’s not a debate, or even a conversation with another individual. You’re talking to an anonymous mob of unknown size and composition.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
- HumblyTossed 3y ago
  > I am so tired of people who interpret Apple's actions purely as anti-consumer fuckery. Even to this day, people still claim that "apple made people's phones slow down as they got older, so they would have to buy new ones" despite it being widely covered that Apple, like other phone manufacturers, slows down the CPU when they detect the battery's internal resistance rising to prevent brownouts so that the phone is usable for a longer period of time and all you have to do to restore original performance is replace the battery, apple or no. What they did was chase thinness and so they didn't include an adequate power source for the processor they were using.

voyagerfan5761 3y ago

Avoidant as I am of Apple's ecosystem, I can only imagine the "security" justification for serializing a display panel. Covert exfiltration of sensitive information from password managers and such? At any rate, I continue to be unamused by how difficult it is for normal people to service their own Apple devices.

redeeman 3y ago
> their own Apple devices. thats a slightly different interpretation of the situation than what the mighty apple has :) and I suspect thats where most of the "confusion" is :)
randomuser23423 3y ago
> Avoidant as I am of Apple's ecosystem, I can only imagine the "security" justification for serializing a display panel. Covert exfiltration of sensitive information from password managers and such? They're a more valuable target for theft the more parts that can be "cleanly" sold.
- hsbauauvhabzb 3y ago
  Are ipad thieving gangs really breaking down and on selling stolen components?
  - TillE 3y ago
    If you make Apple devices totally worthless to thieves, you discourage theft. Make them bricks which can't even be harvested for parts. That's the goal apparently, and it makes sense.
    - can16358p 3y ago
      This. As a user I'm okay with using only authorized components if it makes theft virtually impractical as there wouldn't be much to use even if the device is stolen. It will give me more peace of mind as no one will have the incentive to steal an iPad anymore.

spdustin 3y ago

Seems to me like it might be a calibration issue, and third parties aren’t able to perform the calibration.

dataflow 3y ago
I have no way to verify this, but this Redditor claims it's due to the serial number being different, not calibration (also see the grandparent comment that they posted): https://www.reddit.com/r/gadgets/comments/15cxwaa/apple_pencils_cant_draw_straight_on_thirdparty/jtztu2g/ https://www.reddit.com/r/gadgets/comments/15cxwaa/apple_penc... That said, I see a generous explanation that I can't rule out based on what they're describing. It seems like the only test this Redditor mentioned was that you can modify the serial number and cause it to go from correct behavior to misbehavior. But I would think the reverse direction is the real test, since otherwise this could just imply that the device is looking up some embedded calibration information for that serial number and not finding it, and therefore falling back to some default behavior?
- KennyBlanken 3y ago
  That redditor says it's just serial number matching, complains at length about how this issue is destroying their business while in the same breath saying that reprogramming the screen's serial number on a working unit will bring up the same problem. So, if it's just a matching serial numbers problem, why aren't they programming the new screens with the serial number of the old screen, and thus the problem goes away?
  - dataflow 3y ago
    It's a reasonable question; I don't know the answer. It might require damaging the device too much to return it to the consumer at that point? Or maybe they can't due to contractual reasons? It might be worth asking them on Reddit.
  - realusername 3y ago
    That's exactly what their "calibration" procedure on iPhone does, it just changes the serial number pairing, nothing else, you don't even have to touch on the screen.

a2tech 3y ago

[flagged]

alden5 3y ago

A while ago there was an issue that when replacing a camera on an iphone 12 it would cause the camera to become unresponsive. The problem was later solved with a software update without much fanfare; Backing up the fact that it was a glitch, the problem never occurred on the 12 pro. but yea i definitely hate the serialization, especially considering it looks like their hardware design is becoming more repairable with the 14's back glass becoming removable, it makes their software lockdowns make even less sense.

LocalH 3y ago

A modern version of what Oliver Stiller did in Amica Paint for the C64. https://www.pagetable.com/?p=860 https://www.pagetable.com/?p=860

ChrisArchitect 3y ago

[dupe] Discussion from a few days ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36903865 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36903865

anyfactor 3y ago

Tangential rant. Has tablet computer really improved since the last Google Nexus 7 tablet, which was released in 2013? Seriously, I was in the market for an affordable tablet, and quite bizarrely the tablet computers today have significantly underwhelming spec compared to a phone of the same price point. There is no budget tab from known manufacturers. Even at IPad level prices, the android counterpart is quite underwhelming. I don't how it happened by it seems like IPad is the only tablet computer to get. For people on a budget there is no other viable option then to get a used IPad and news like this makes me kinda mad. What the heck is even going on? Like in 2012-15 era there was bunch of variations of tablet computer of different price points. These days everyone from toddlers with their padded covers and graphics designers with an apple pencil is using an IPad.

freitzkriesler2 3y ago
It's because Google dropped the ball on Android smartphone app sizing for phones vs tablets. This IS changing now that Google has a pixel foldable smartphone.
- kccqzy 3y ago
  Couldn't you say the same thing for iOS/iPadOS though? It's up to the developers to manually support iPads. To date, very well known and popular apps like Instagram still run as iPhone-sized. Which is especially perplexing because there are seriously good photographers on Instagram whose work should be enjoyed on a bigger screen.
- Gigachad 3y ago
  Google picks up and drops tablets semi frequently. It wouldn’t surprise me if the manager who came up with the idea of doing tablets again gets promoted and then the idea gets abandoned shortly after.
dotnet00 3y ago
Not exactly a budget tab, but I've found the S8 Ultra (and the S7 FE before that) to be pretty great. The S8U managing to make having a laptop entirely unnecessary (since I'd only need a laptop away from home and I mainly WFH). With Android there has been a long period of stagnation with only Samsung doing custom stuff like DeX, multi-tasking stuff and striking deals with various productivity apps for Android ports to make Android viable for tablets, otherwise they're only very recently starting to come out of it with Google working on a Pixel Tab.

otterley 3y ago

Not all replaced iPad screens. Only non-OEM (third party) replacements.

menus 3y ago
Wrong. https://www.youtube.com/shorts/0sWmBNj6Eok https://www.youtube.com/shorts/0sWmBNj6Eok A genuine screen from another iPad will cause this issue until you swap the chip from the old screen to the new screen.
- otterley 3y ago
  Ah, thanks for the link. The story this post is linked to said only aftermarket screens had this issue. I don’t have any inside knowledge but I suspect authorized Apple repair centers have access to a tool they can use to recalibrate the screen after replacement that the mom-and-pop shop doesn’t have.
  - menus 3y ago
    Apologies for coming off rude. Apple's anti-repair stance is a sensitive topic for me.

userbinator 3y ago

That looks like deliberate sabotage, and not merely a "the screen wasn't calibrated correctly" which I suspect Apple is going to try to spin this as, especially if using the existing controller with the new screen as the video claims causes this to be fixed. Watch the video - it's very short. More disturbing is the realisation that there are people working at Apple to implement stuff like this.

userbinator 3y ago
No counterarguments, just downvotes? "Truth is found in the weeds" ;-)