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Apple Vision
- nynx 3y ago> It really is one of the best product names in Apple history: Vision is a description of a product, it is an aspiration for a use case, and it is a critique on the sort of society we are building, behind Apple’s leadership more than anyone else. I agree that “Vision” is a good product name, but “Vision Pro” just feels intensely pedestrian. Why is it called “Pro?” Is there a non-Pro version?
- shafyy 3y agoThey probably plan on releasing a non-pro version later. Importantly, adding "Pro" also has the psychological effect of better justifying the higher price.
- flir 3y agoSeems like in this space, the Air version would be the premium one (smaller, lighter).
- matt-attack 3y agoI found it odd that they started out with Pro. I think “Apple Vision” would have sufficed. Leaves room for the future to add “Pro” when they go to 8K/Retina or whatever. Plus just saying “Apple Vision” is kinda nice.
- r00fus 3y agoWhen Apple wants a mainstream product, they'll release one at a mainstream (for them) price. Right now they can't sell a non-pro for probably less than $2k, so why not just sell the pro at 3.5k and use the insights from that to create a real mainstream (but high end) non-pro with better chips/software etc next year?
- prawn 3y agoBesides cheaper hardware, what could they remove for a non-Pro version? Maybe make it always tethered, and the power brick is +$150. Cutting the display quality kills their pitch. Reducing the headband hits viability also. Maybe they remove the front-facing display? And the ability to record?
- xattt 3y agoVision Air is a nice homonym for visionnaire.
- iainmerrick 3y agoIt just means "more expensive" (implying a later "less expensive" version).
- NLPaep 3y agoYes, a non-Pro version is arriving later.
- andsoitis 3y agoWhat will the non-Pro version not have, compared to the Pro?
- mrcwinn 3y agoIt could be the other way: Vision Pro will advance faster (field of view, compute power, some new feature) and Vision will become a lower price point full of rad hand-me-downs.
- prawn 3y agoThey could remove the front-facing display and the camera/ability to shoot 3D content. Both strike me as non-essential for a base device geared around content consumption and basic work. The front shield then becomes a plain piece, and quickly differentiates a user from Vision and Vision Pro. If they swap metal for plastic, the cheaper version would become lighter and that would be a selling point. They can't go with lower-resolution screens. Poorer quality headband would make the thing uncomfortable to wear.
- slivanes 3y agoIt won’t be as “magical”, “delightful”, and “inspiring”.
- jsheard 3y agoThe "eye passthrough" display is something that could be trimmed quite easily to get the price down. It's not like any other VR device has it.
- PaulHoule 3y agoThis has passthrough https://simulavr.com/ https://simulavr.com/ but I don't think it is as nice.
- nashashmi 3y agoiView was better and more clever. Or iScreen. Literally anything that begins with i
- corobo 3y agoWhen was the last time they branded something with a little i?
- matt-attack 3y agoiPad I think.
- nashashmi 3y agoiMac too?
- matt-attack 3y agoThe “i” stuff feels really outdated now. The Apple Watch was not the iWatch. There are too many competitors who use it to mean too many cheap things.
- esskay 3y agoAgreed. If you pop into any dollar/pound type store the shelves are filled with cheap cables and car phone holders that use the 'i' name. It's become synonymous with cheap junk now.
- nashashmi 3y agoAnd anything imperfect like iPedal.
- nashashmi 3y agoI can agree with this sentiment. But god, this goes around the eyes. Calling anything with an I- is absurd, but this is so darn on point.
- vasco 3y agoIt's like adding "tactical" to a product that is black on the title on Amazon. You'll be able to charge more money for the same thing. It also signals you might eventually launch a lower end model.
- sanitycheck 3y agoIt seems lazy to me, do a Google search for "Vision Pro", excluding results from the past couple of days, and it seems there were already a ton of products and services with the same name. Perfect time to bring back the "i", though they already have "iSight". "iBorg"?
- whermans 3y agoiWear if it didn't clash with the watches. iBorg / "I, Borg" would probably not land well with Trekkies. iPiece?
- LudwigNagasena 3y agoApple became a victim of their own success in relation to the “i”. It is now associated with Apple, but it is too pedestrian to be registered as a trademark.
- AnonC 3y agoDo this search a year from now and I’m sure Apple would’ve done (and gotten done) enough SEO for its device to be the top or among the top results.
- soylentcola 3y agoiGlasses, obviously.
- kgwgk 3y agoiEyes
- sebastianconcpt 3y agoiWon'tUseIt
- euroderf 3y agoiStrainAndNeckPain
- SamuelAdams 3y agoPro is consistent with other product lines that Apple produces. IPhone Pro, MacBook Pro, etc. They could change the convention, but weren’t y’all just complaining about how naming conventions for things like Windows, Intel, Nvidia, etc are not consistent?
- rsynnott 3y ago"Pro", in AppleSpeak, means "the expensive one". They've actually done this before; the MacBook Pro (first Intel Mac) launched some time before the MacBook (first consumer-oriented Intel Mac). This feels like fairly clear signalling that there'll be a cheaper more consumer-oriented one along later.
- justin66 3y agoApple's problem is that the "pro" version is not just twice as expensive as the "consumer" version needs to be in order to be a market success, it's ten times more expensive than the consumer version needs to be. edit: the fanatics are really out with the downvotes today
- rsynnott 3y agoI'd assume any credible consumer version will be a few years down the road, anyway.
- justin66 3y agoI think that's definitely true. To get to that point, Apple's multifaceted problem seems to be knocking a huge amount off the price of the thing while convincing a significant number of users to buy and actually use it (instead of putting it on a shelf after a few uses as so many Oculus users have done over the years), and also to convince a few excellent software developers to create worthwhile stuff for it. They can throw a ton of money at that problem, but I wonder how effective that can possibly be.
- WorldMaker 3y agoThe Day One Disney+ and Disney interest in the keynote to me reads like Apple are hinting that they have a much more aggressive consumer timeline than "a few years down the road". I'm very curious what Apple is thinking/betting here.
- DrammBA 3y agoIs it really a problem if it works and people buy it?
- bigwheeler 3y agoI forgot that Apple was having an event yesterday, and when I saw “Apple Vision Pro“ in headlines everywhere, my first thought was that they were opening an eyeglass store…
- soylentcola 3y agoWell, if you normally wear glasses, you will need to order special Zeiss lenses to use the Vision Pro.
- wildpeaks 3y agoIt implies a possible cheaper non-Pro version in the future (like iPhone Pro and Macbook Pro) without promising it might exist. Or simply to distinguish from their existing Vision software that has nothing to do with the headset: https://developer.apple.com/documentation/vision https://developer.apple.com/documentation/vision
- layer8 3y agoThe “Pro” moniker is mainly to make the price more palatable.
- moogly 3y agoI guess the Apple Vision Pro Max Ultra will be $10,000
- agentgumshoe 3y agoUnfortunately reads like a massive paid ad.
- brookst 3y agoIt’s definitely a theme of our times that we have all come to believe that any opinions contrary to our own must be for corrupt motives. I’m ready for that part to be over.
- haswell 3y agoWhen Ben Thompson writes something that you could also interpret as a massive paid ad, that says something really interesting about the product he’s writing about.
- draw_down 3y ago[dead]
- risyachka 3y agoFortunately it reads like one. Says a lot about the product.
- m3kw9 3y agoIf he say the product sucks what are you gonna say? It was paid by Meta?
- trey-jones 3y agoI understand that I have a pretty large bias in the opposite direction that Mr. Thompson claims. That is, I think VR is stupid and I don't understand the use case for it, at least in the incarnations we've seen so far. I also remember the failed Google Glass, and think, "If people wouldn't wear that comparatively less-cumbersome and less-stupid-looking thing, why the hell would they wear this one?". So my immediate reaction was also to mistrust the motives of the author. However, I can recognize this bias in myself and be OK with being wrong. My track record is not exactly pristine, after all. I felt pretty much the same way about the iPad.
- 5350-uiop-1130 3y agocurious how typing on a keyboard will work don't recall seeing that on the presentation.. also 2hrs battery, on a flight can you carry those... inconvenient (impractical?)
- moolcool 3y agoMost planes have power at the seats though, I don't think it'd be too hard to wear this on a plane.
- simse 3y agoYou look at the letters on the keyboard, and "tap" by pinching your fingers. You can also just look at an input and start speaking.
- sidibe 3y agoSo like a HL2. Typing on Hololens sucks using voice or eye tracking. You'll want a Bluetooth keyboard about 5 minutes after you get this thing
- leesalminen 3y agoAccording to MKBHD’s video, you just look at the key you want on the on-screen keyboard and then click it by touching your thumb and index finger. They also mentioned in the keynote you can connect a Bluetooth keyboard and type on that.
- sidibe 3y ago> you just look at the key you want on the on-screen keyboard and then click it by touching your thumb and index finger. This has been used on many other devices and is miserable, it's like using the joystick to type on a game console
- whynaut 3y agoWatch Marques Brownlee's video on it. It's vastly better than anything before it in both hand- and eye-tracking.
- samwillis 3y agoAnyone here that was there yesterday and used it, what's it like looking "through" it at the world, how does focusing on near and far work? Are the cameras adjusting focus based on where you are looking?
- whynaut 3y ago> Are the cameras adjusting focus based on where you are looking? Yes. Marques Brownlee describes this in his latest video.
- ncr100 3y agoI was not there and have read a few media outlets first hand 30 minutes demo summaries. None answered your questions about focus. One did say, I think either from CNET or from creative solutions, which you can find on YouTube, that pass through cameras where the highest quality they had ever seen. And they are experts. It was CNET, now that I remember. And he talked about looking at his wrist watch and being able to make out the detail on his watch's text. https://youtu.be/_USrtT3chs0 https://youtu.be/_USrtT3chs0
- Oras 3y ago> Apple, meanwhile, isn’t even bothering with presence: even its Facetime integration was with an avatar in a window, leaning into the fact you are apart, whereas Meta wants you to feel like you are together. [was with an avatar in a window] And how Meta is fixing that exactly?
- sebzim4500 3y agoPresumably with an avatar outside of a window
- matt-attack 3y agoMy understanding is that the term “presence“ is more about your feeling of being truly immersed in the VR space.
- bullen 3y agoThis is pretty bad for VR. It will most likely flop because it has no reliable input. So far FrankenQuest 2/3 is on top: http://move.rupy.se/file/FrankenQuest.png http://move.rupy.se/file/FrankenQuest.png Let's see what Valve can do...
- mustacheemperor 3y agoVideogaming seems like such a small market for Apple to chase individually. They make almost as much revenue on airpods every year as Sony has ever sold in PS5s. I feel like I’ve read this comment verbatim in at least one other thread in the last day or so…am I in the vr simulation already?
- gh02t 3y agoIsn't apple like one of if not the largest videogame retailers because of the App Store? A quick search suggests they made more money on videogames than Activision Blizzard, Sony, and Microsoft combined in 2019. It's still a big piece of money pie. And with this headset they control both the hardware and software platform so they get to double dip on profits.
- brookst 3y agoApple makes a lot of money from games on iOS, but nobody would say the iPhone is a gaming device. I expect the headset to be the same: it will have the GPU power to support games third party devs will make games, Apple will make money from distributing games, and it will still not be considered a gaming platform.
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- gh02t 3y agoI disagree, I consider the iPhone to be a gaming device. By many metrics it might even be the most popular gaming device ever. It's not only a gaming device, but it can be more than one thing. That said, I suspect that the price tag on this generation of the Vision is probably gonna shut out most casual users; maybe we will see marquee, platform-selling games on it in later generations but I have a hard time imagining many people buying it for that until they become more affordable. I suspect that this will be a hard sell to the crowd that has $3K to spend on a gaming device (which granted, lots of people who play PC games spend that much), so it may be a chicken-and-egg problem. That said, having used Hololens 2 and Magic Leap I saw the potential for AR to be something really cool. I'm certainly rooting for Apple to finally deliver something polished and compelling, both for professional and consumer users.
- kumarvvr 3y agoApple has managed to combine AR and VR, by simply re-creating the AR inside the VR. The idea is simple but profound. However, for a company that prides itself on "shared" experiences, the VR is for "lonesome" experiences (watching a movie, watching vacation photos, etc) in some cases, but bang on for others (especially at work) This will spurn the industry, just like the iPhone did, and hopefully, we will have a lot of use cases. To list a few. 1. Watching your family from afar, by linking two VR devices in real time. 2. Incredible engineering and design advances, with the combination of real time sharing, AR and VR merging. 3. A whole new way to experience content. Honestly, the idea of an unlimited screen size is appealing. 4. Incredible potential for gaming.
- masklinn 3y ago> Apple has managed to combine AR and VR, by simply re-creating the AR inside the VR. The idea is simple but profound. The Quest Pro does that, just badly.
- Auracle 3y agoThe Quest 2 does it even worse. That said it seemed to be a major upgrade point on the announced Quest 3, so we’ll see how it compares.
- masklinn 3y agoDoes the quest 2 do it at all? I was under the impression that it only has low-ish resolution IR (or possibly monochrome) cameras, I don't think it ever pretended to be an AR/MR device. The cameras were for controller detection, and passthrough mode was only added because it could be (and that was better than nothing).
- joshstrange 3y agoIt's monochrome and grainy. Passthrough half-works. It's great to have /something/ but it falls far short of really usable. You can drink from your water bottle or look around to find where the dog is but that's about it. God forbid you walk more than a few feet outside your guardian (boundary you draw) or for more than a minute, if you do it can disconnect you from your game, kill the running app, and/or lose your guardian boundaries even once you walk back. If I'm playing VR with friends it really sucks if you need to get/refill your drink, go to the bathroom, or take the dog out. I wouldn't try taking the dog out with the headset on but the other two I would (because taking off the headset almost guarantees you will be disconnected and Meta's party-type/game-joining features are absolute shit), it's hit or miss.
- aqme28 3y agoAll these "relive your memory" videos are incredibly awkward, because of how downright sad it is to strap this on your head during your kid's birthday just to relive it on repeat like Tom Cruise in Minority Report. The real usecase is porn, but they're too tactful to say it.
- shp0ngle 3y agoApple has the walled garden approach to apps, and they don’t let porn in. (Except for reddit app, which has porn allowed, to the complaints of Tumblr) But maybe it will be possible through the Safari browser or something.
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- haswell 3y agoThe only thing an app needs to do is replay videos. No adult designation required.
- endisneigh 3y ago> The real usecase is porn, but they're too tactful to say it. I don't know why people keep projecting their own desires onto others, lol.
- brookst 3y agoLeaving personal desires out of it, the relationship of porn and tech goes back at least to VHS vs Betamax, probably further. It’s not unreasonable to believe that does not stop with XR headsets.
- endisneigh 3y agoSure, but what's the relationship post Blu-Ray? Serving video in general has been important, but not pornography in particular. Ridiculous to say porn is the real usecase. If you have some articles about how porn in particular has driven cutting edge tech please do share. My understanding is that it's been more military, video games and space that have driven cutting edge tech (along with serving ads, of course).
- pavlov 3y ago"The company was fairly mum about how it planned to make those cameras and its format more widely available, but I am completely serious when I say that I would pay the NBA thousands of dollars to get a season pass to watch games captured in this way. Yes, that’s a crazy statement to make, but courtside seats cost that much or more, and that 10-second clip was shockingly close to the real thing." The author was shown a 10-second clip and is ready to hand over thousands of dollars. A few paragraphs later he acknowledges that it was just a 10-second clip, but there was also another clip, so a total of 20 seconds - surely enough to write an opinion piece of thousands of words. The reality-shaping power of Apple's demo maestros is truly admirable. I'm an XR believer too and I'm very happy that Apple is entering the market with a high-end device that's not for gaming. At the same time, we have to recognize that the history of this form factor is littered with amazing 10-second demos that failed to deliver actual user value, from recent failures like Magic Leap going all the way back to the late 1980s and Jaron Lanier's VPL Research.
- intev 3y ago> demos that failed to deliver actual user value Does Apple have a a history of doing this? I think that's why people are excited.
- pavlov 3y agoNewton, Power Mac Cube, iMac G4 "Sunflower", and solid gold first-gen Apple Watch come to mind as Apple hardware products that failed to live up to the hype. On the software side there are more misses, but also the stakes are lower. It's a great track record for thirty years, of course. All the other big tech companies have graveyards full of half-assed product launches.
- intev 3y agoOther than the watch, all the products you mentioned are before 2002. Anything in the past 20 years that have been huge misses in delivering up to expectation? Also how is the 1st gen watch a failure? It sold millions immediately, and was a huge commercial success. It pretty much started a gold rush for digital watches again. I think it's fair to say the new "Apple" (last 15 years or so), has been pretty good with exceeding expectations and breaking through barriers that other companies just couldn't.
- creakingstairs 3y agoI probably won’t buy Apple Vision for a while but will eagerly follow it. Like the author, I’m mainly excited about using this for work/ productivity. I’ve tried out working in VR using oculus and immersed. I’ve really liked the experience but the blurry text was a deal breaker. From the reviews so far, that might not be a problem anymore.
- ncr100 3y agohttps://youtu.be/OdHbQpg4pOA https://youtu.be/OdHbQpg4pOA 4K per eye could simply be a magical tech thanks which enables immersion, and we're in the midst of passing that milestone now, in 2023.
- PartiallyTyped 3y agoI have already imagined myself tony-stark style viewing complex systems as a hologram going up and down in levels of abstraction at the flick of my wrist, having notes pop up, select the pieces of info I need and view everything holistically.
- endisneigh 3y agoas usual what matters is the user experience. technology is only a conduit for such. the difference between Apple and many other tech companies is they prioritize the former over the latter, and when the latter is available it exists mainly to amplify the former. this problem is most obvious in video games, where eye watering graphics are prevalent but gameplay sucks. Once it gets to 8K per eye with decent FoV, it will truly look pretty close to reality.
- blantonl 3y agoI'm curious if anyone will be able to develop in it (i.e. write code with virtual desktops etc) I'm also curious about how which unexpected consequences people will experience with such devices (nausea, etc... other unknown illnesses cropping up)
- shp0ngle 3y agoThey didn’t show any virtual keyboard I think.
- ncr100 3y agoIt should be high res enough, and there should be no screen door effect. See https://youtu.be/OdHbQpg4pOA https://youtu.be/OdHbQpg4pOA for a discussion of related display panel types.
- goda90 3y agoA number of people have written blog posts about doing their work in VR with other headsets, including development. Unless Apple's walled garden gets in the way, then it'll definitely be possible in the Vision too.
- jillesvangurp 3y agoIf it's comfortable enough to wear for prolonged of times it might be superior to most common multi monitor setups that users have these days. Nausea would be induced by lack of visual references and latency issues. AR with good responsiveness should address that. Eye fatigue and headaches might be another issue. Too early to tell but this might not be that much of an issue. Otherwise, it looks all good.
- kmos17 3y agoThis is a really good in depth review, the fact that the vision is recreating everything digitally is really amazing and creepy at the same time. I am in awe of the technology, but the last part of this article also highlights what will certainly be a one of its major drawback and weaknesses, how isolating it is (which previous VR headset also suffer from). While the AR aspect of it helps somewhat, I did note also during the presentation the ridiculous clip with the father wearing the headset at his child's birthday party, and especially how all the examples uses except in a professional setting were for individual lonely users. Both exciting and terrifying at the same time.
- samwillis 3y agoIt's interesting that Magic Leap took $3.5 billion in investment, and had a very similar vision and almost identical demos. But they failed to deliver. I wander what the R and D cost for the Vision Pro is, 10x Magic Leaps investment, $35 billion over last 5 years? Seems plausible... Their total R&D expense is about €100B in same time period.
- danpalmer 3y agoThere's no way this has cost $35bn. Tech companies label a lot of stuff as R&D, it's almost more likely that the €100B value includes all the macOS/iOS/etc development as well. I expect until the last year or so this has been well under $1bn per year (based on 1000 people at $300k/yr, $300m). This will have ramped up as they begin figuring out mass production, but I'd still be surprised if this is more than single-digit billions for the last year, as it's not like they're reserving enough manufacturing or supplier capacity to make 100m of these devices yet.
- samwillis 3y agoI think if you start to include the cost of developing Vision OS on top of iOS, and cost of all the custom silicone Apple have in this, then you can approach that figure. They have the advantage that they had a lot of this in place for their portables. Magic did not and had to start from scratch. I suppose it's hard to judge how much of the R&D cost for Apple silicone, their cameras, LiDAR and iOS should be counted as costs for the Vision Pro.
- danpalmer 3y agoIf you include the development of iOS and the A/M series chips then sure I guess it gets close, but it seems obvious to me they would have been doing those things anyway. I guess it depends whether you want an all-in cost to compare to Magic Leap, in which case you could argue that most of the history of Apple has set them up for this – if you want to make a great VR headset, just make the best phone ever first – if you want to make the best phone ever, just make a great personal computer first, just acquire NEXT first, etc. I don't know where you draw the line. More useful I think is to say what did it cost the companies above what they were already doing. For Magic Leap it's the whole business, for Apple it's not much, for Microsoft it's somewhere in the middle, for Meta it's maybe closer to Magic Leap.
- i386 3y ago“Pro” just means there’s a cheaper one in the pipeline. I’d wait.
- keiferski 3y agoAm I the only one that is surprised they went with the "all in the glasses" design? (Minus the exterior battery and cable.) I was expecting an extremely lightweight pair of glasses that wirelessly connects with a stationary device that provides most of the computing power for the VR/AR. That device could even be the new generation of iPhones... The design as-is looks better than 95% of other headsets, but still strikes me as a bit clunky.
- brookst 3y agoThe display and optics are a lot of the bulk. Hard to move that off device.
- dgs_sgd 3y agoSeems like they needed a plethora of cameras and sensors up in the glasses to watch your eyes, hand gestures, and the environment. This is too big to fit in a lightweight pair of glasses.
- gwd 3y agoAdd that the R1 chip almost certainly needs to be right next to the cameras and the display to get that 12ms response time, and about the only thing you could move off the device is the CPU and SSD... at which point, probably, why bother?
- euroderf 3y agoHmm, thermal regulation. I'll bet there were early versions of Vision Pro you could cook an egg on.
- gwd 3y agoRight, but that R1 chip is going to be doing work constantly, and can't be moved without increasing the latency (decreasing quality and increasing issues with vertigo); so you have to work on thermal regulation within the headset anyway. So comparing the whole package of "R1 in the headset, M2 somewhere else" vs "R1 and M2 both in the headset", is the slight reduction in heat to be diffused from having the M2 elsewhere worth all the hassle of having to figure out where to put it? It sounds like Apple's engineers have gone with "no". Time will tell.
- PaulHoule 3y agoI find his gushing about the centrality of phones to be annoying. Verizon, AT&T and T-Mobile choose not to serve the valley I live in, why should I reward them by buying an expensive plan? From time to time I've had a Tracfone but after a few years I wind up with 3000+ minutes because my average mobile call lasts under 2 minutes. Practically I use an iPad to do almost everything people use phones for, even making telephone calls with Skype. I'm just waiting for them to shush me at the public library and point out the sign that says using a phone isn't allowed and tell them I'm not using a phone, I'm using a tablet. (My typical call is so short though they don't have time) I constantly complain about "phonishness" invading the PC and other computing platforms, like Reddit trying to push you to use their mobile crapp. I still see the phone as a step backwards in computing, not a step forwards, particularly if you are forced to use that other mobile OS that has a trashcan as its logo.
- canes123456 3y agoMaybe it a step back for you but look around. The phone won. Tablets, laptops, etc will never make a comeback to be nearly as important or popular as the smart phone. The only question is when a new thing will replace it. IMO it is not going to happen for a really long time
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- tikkun 3y agoWhen do people anticipate the Vision Pro will be available in an Apple Store to be tried? And is there another way to try one sooner.
- crazygringo 3y agoWhen it goes on sale. I don't think Apple has ever had public demos of products not yet available for sale.
- RandallBrown 3y agoThey're going to have developer previews available in certain cities around the world. You'll be able to take your app and run it on the hardware to see how it works outside of a simulator.
- anonymouse008 3y ago> The Vision Pro as Novelty Device Lord. Watch any of the D#'s and hear Walt, Steve and Kara talk about things. Steve's Apple is just matter of fact simple, no heady logic - just bare sense. Listen to how many times he says "you want to do this, how we want to do that" - everything at Apple was perfecting what we innately wanted to do but just didn't know how to. If you hear anything other than: 'We make the best things for the things we want to do everyday' - please reply it here. There was also a moment where he spoke directly to not making a PDA because the phone is what we already had, already understand to use, and implicitly know what would be amazing if we saw it. The PDA is VR/AR, glasses are the phone* *one could argue glasses are not even the goal and to that I'm not sold
- endisneigh 3y agoI doubt this tech will be the size and weight of regular eyeglasses anytime soon. Probably 2050 at the earliest. It would require sub-nanometer lithography. In regular I disagree with your assertion. As long as these end up being cheaper than a couple 4K monitors, which I imagine will happen by the end of the decade, it would be worth it for that alone. And that is to speak nothing of the onboard compute.
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- dgs_sgd 3y agoDoes anyone think the military would be interested in using vision for training purposes, like a fully immersive combat experience? Seems like a market that the article missed.
- YA_Scratch 3y agoThe Mil has Vision Pro 10 already.
- ttcbj 3y agoI find it much easier to imagine commercial uses (perhaps visualizing a planned building in its real environment) than personal uses.
- mrcwinn 3y agoIt’s impressive, I admit, but I’m skeptical Vision Pro will outdo the legacy of iPod Socks.
- cyclecount 3y agoThe "relive your memories" is maybe less dystopian than commenters are thinking because you can presumably also view footage from other 360 cameras, like action cams used during sports, or simply placed more discretely in a room (yes, porn is the obvious use case that Apple won't say).
- jmbwell 3y agoThis article is dead on, all the way to the end. Takes a few minutes to read, but its observations on the market position of the device, all the way to the individual/social ramifications and the relevance vis a vis Meta, are as sharp as anything I’ve read about this yet. If it seems like he’s gushing, he is. He’s speaking as someone who has seen lots of these devices and, in his view, this hardware and software outclasses anything else available. If that bothers you but you push past it, I think you’ll find that whether you like this device or not, it could reflect or represent changes in how we incorporate technology in our lives that we might not yet fully appreciate.
- eep_social 3y ago> If it seems like he’s gushing, he is. This is how he writes. If you ever read him on a topic where you are an actual expert, you’ll probably never bother reading him again.
- CharlesW 3y ago> This is how he writes. Maybe, but Marques Brownlee gushed about it as well (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OFvXuyITwBI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OFvXuyITwBI), and he's not a person that pulls punches. This is an extremely ambitious, qualitatively different device than anything that's come before.
- eep_social 3y agoCompletely agree about MKBHD. My point was strictly that Stratechery is trash. I cannot argue with Apple’s ambition but as has been hashed over in these, and many other comments I am skeptical of the adoption story. The [i]VP is a snazzy product without a market. It remains to be seen whether it will create the market in the way gpt3 did or if it will be another flop like glass, oculus, and every other attempt in the space.
- ymolodtsov 3y agoI will probably save a link to this discussion to check in on you in 5 years.
- thedangler 3y agoI'm definitely not going to be keeping my hands in the air to type on a virtual keyboard. I can tell you right now that won't work and your arms will get too tired. Must be only for minor tasks. But I can't afford the thing anyways so doesn't matter.
- YA_Scratch 3y agoIt supports the Magic Keyboard and I presume other wireless boards.
- thedangler 3y agoTrue, add on another $1000 lol jk
- DrThunder 3y agoAlso, hand movements lack tactile feedback. This makes them very useless for a lot of tasks. Even with my Quest 2 I notice the lack of push back in the hand controllers during motion, for things like flying games, and fps makes it very difficult to use. You almost always need an attachment to make it feel better.
- seydor 3y agoMy bet would be completely the opposite. No matter how good these devices get they lack in input bandwidth. My keyboard beats all VR , and it seems to easily beat apple's VR too. The headset is clearly targeted to static environments, entertainment. The apps are like ipad apps, looking cute but when people want to do serious work fast, they use a laptop because it has a keyboard. It is overengineered. There are a lot of gimmicks in the device like the 3d avatars which imho are worse than simple zoom chats. We are humans, we like faces. And the (mandatorily positive) reviews from people who used it are not hinting to this new era of computing. I see this as an early-era Tesla car, but without the long term prospect. A lot of people will buy it because it is expensive. It's something that happens with most apple products
- vlovich123 3y agoYour keyboard works just fine in VR. What’s the problem? I think a real display replacement (in terms of shrinking down your monitor/TV to something you can trivially carry around with you) seems like a real use case.
- seydor 3y agoit doesnt exactly work as a screen replacement because it is stricly personal. Good for using in airplanes and maybe when alone but like other VR glasses, it doesnt fit well in other circumstances
- elcomet 3y agoYou'll certainly be able to share screen with others later.
- WorldMaker 3y agoNot even necessarily "later". They showed that the visionOS already supports existing Continuity and SharePlay functionality in iOS/iPadOS applications, which are features already built for sharing views of the same apps across devices and/or between people. It's somewhat limited which applications support those APIs today, but it is still an interesting amount more than "nothing". (ETA: That seemed a subtle theme across the WWDC keynote to me, as increased SharePlay support in first-party apps and select third-party partners was many of the things they demoed across the iOS, iPadOS, Car Play, and macOS updates.)
- dkrich 3y agoMy first impulse when I come across a memory or photo in my camera log on my iPhone is to send it to my wife. Photos are really rarely a personal experience. A major reason why most famous paintings find their way from personal collections into museums so we can all enjoy them together. It is that human nature that makes me believe that any device like this that doesn't have real-time interactions baked-in, no matter how cool they are, will always default to media consumption because media consumption is the main use case where you don't necessarily want to have a shared experience. This device seems absolutely amazing and likely much more in the same vertical as home theater than personal computing. FWIW, I also don't buy into the work aspect of this, either. Partially because most people aren't in the Apple ecosystem for productivity apps, but mostly because as another person stated, nobody is going to use a digital avatar in a work setting. A static image or even just being on camera wearing the headset would feel much more normal. Sure, I could see it being great for certain applications like email but not enough of a catch-all to be the only device you use in a work setting.
- exabrial 3y ago> Meta is focused on social No, Meta is focused on intrusive advertising, abating the law, and recording history about people against their explicit desire.
- victor106 3y agoThis is a really good article although i don't fully agree with the conclusion. Thinking that Meta's quest is a social headset whereas Apple's is a solitary ignores the fact that social interactions and integrations can and will be developed into the VisionPro.
- screye 3y agoNow I am a lowly programmer + VR enthusiast, so my opinion does not count. But, how do big companies allow Apple to get away with such easy wins !?? Apple said : "We are going to throw infinite money at a pilot product that's basically a tech demo, and convince the market that this tech is for-real-for-real." Meanwhile, Facebook refused to create a balls-to-the-wall VR headset for years and still ended up with a conservative 1500$ device even though they knew no one will purchase it. T̶o̶ ̶b̶e̶ ̶f̶a̶i̶r̶,̶ ̶C̶a̶r̶m̶a̶c̶k̶ ̶h̶a̶d̶ ̶b̶e̶e̶n̶ ̶p̶u̶s̶h̶i̶n̶g̶ ̶f̶o̶r̶ ̶a̶n̶ ̶a̶l̶l̶-̶o̶u̶t̶ ̶d̶e̶v̶i̶c̶e̶ ̶b̶u̶t̶ ̶g̶o̶t̶ ̶s̶i̶d̶e̶l̶i̶n̶e̶d̶ ̶b̶y̶ ̶Z̶u̶c̶k̶'̶s̶ ̶p̶u̶s̶h̶ ̶t̶o̶w̶a̶r̶d̶s̶ ̶c̶h̶e̶a̶p̶ ̶a̶n̶d̶ ̶s̶c̶a̶l̶e̶.̶ (I might have mis-remembered) Apple's strategy is dead obvious. Of course. When you want people to change how they have consumed information for decades, you HAVE to blow their socks off. Samsung understood this with the 2000$ Fold devices. The first computers cost tens-of-thousands of 2023 dollars. Car manufacturers understand this with Halo cars. Facebook had a 7-8 year head start, and it never struck them to lead with a 'Halo VR device' ? Meta has among the best ML teams in the world who could produce 'Apple quality' face renders with ease. Sadly, the entire group was strapped down due to limitations of the kind of compute you can fit into a 400$ device. premature optimization is the root of all evil -Knuth Amen Donald, Amen. ____________ What makes Apple great: All big companies have competent employees. Competent employees come together in dysfunctional manners. 100 good ideas produce 1 terrible one and the final result looks worse than any of the initial solutions. Apple somehow manages to preserve their obvious wisdoms & the brilliance of the best ideas across their development (product and software) process. The constant erosion caused by committees, meetings & standard communication friction does not atrophy the seed that was the initial idea. It seems like faint praise. But, despite sounding easy, Apple seems to be the only company that's able to do this on a consistent basis with physical electronics. (video games, cars, construction projects achieve this in their field, but consumer electronics seems to completely lack this, barring Apple)
- mattnewton 3y agoMy hot take from a random person spending time in the trenches: Meta leadership is focused on a _meta_ problem, namely that they do not own a major platform and are constrained from further growth compared to Apple and Google who do own major platforms. They are perfectly happy to be the android to whatever the next iOS is. From that perspective, a halo device is a risky bet because it doesn’t let you onboard a lot of people quickly and start building platform.
- layer8 3y ago> the ability of the Vision Pro to take “pictures” — memories, really — of moments in time and render them in a way that feels incredibly intimate and vivid. This reminds me of the following two scenes from Brainstorm (1983 film): https://youtu.be/cOGAEAJ4xJE?t=34m37s https://youtu.be/cOGAEAJ4xJE?t=34m37s https://youtu.be/cOGAEAJ4xJE?t=49m50s https://youtu.be/cOGAEAJ4xJE?t=49m50s
- secondcoming 3y agoDoes this stuff work if you don't have 20/20 vision?
- azinman2 3y agoThere are prescription glasses you can add. It was in the original presentation.
- boringg 3y agoIs stratechery still doing high quality content? I remember reading their content a couple years ago and really enjoyed it but it's a tough business building constantly interesting content on a consistent basis. Honestly curious -- it's a challenge for most podcasts / content producers.
- lm28469 3y ago> This system was, at the beginning, dismissed by most high-end camera users: sure, a mirrorless system allowed for a simpler and smaller design, but there was no way a screen could ever compare to actually looking through the lens of the camera like you could with a reflex mirror. Fast forward to today, though, and nearly every camera on the market, including professional ones, are mirrorless: not only did those tiny screens get a lot better, brighter, and faster, but they also brought many advantages of their own, including the ability to see exactly what a photo would look like before you took it. Even in 2023 EVFs aren't as nice to look through as OVF from the 80s though. I'm always surprised when I pick up my old film nikon after shooting digital for a while. No matter what you do, real life will always look better than a screen, especially if said screen sits 2cm from your eyeball
- Auracle 3y ago(Old) optical viewfinders are great in bright light. I’ll take my Z8’s EVF if a dimly lit situation any day though.
- Ataraxy 3y agoGet back to me when the tech gets shrunk down to a normal pair of glasses I can use as every day eyewear.
- fndex 3y agoSee you in a decade then.
- gigatexal 3y agoGruber is even a fan, too! https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36207705&p=2#36211404 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36207705&p=2#36211404
- gnicholas 3y agoI agree with the critique about recording videos using the headset — what an odd experience that will be. But I also assume a future iPhone will be able to record these 3d videos and photos.
- taeric 3y agoShow me you've never used non tactile responses for interfaces, without telling me you've never used them. I love the VR experience of Gran Turismo for driving. It is truly immersive in ways that is hard to communicate and makes me glad I have the VR. Even with that, the game is not nearly as fun without a force feedback steering wheel. Not even close. To the point that a moderate screen with the steering wheel is a better experience than the VR without. To the point that the idea that I will do any elaborate hand/arm gestures to interact with something I can't feel, just doesn't seem like something that will fly. Do I like that it has the ability to work without a controller? I mean, sure? But I also have no problem using controllers for gaming, and I don't see that going away anytime soon for a lot of games.
- gavinmckenzie 3y agoThankfully it does pair with a Bluetooth keyboard and trackpad for the scenarios where you want to use it to do “work”.
- taeric 3y agoThis makes me realize that the gestures it is being demonstrated with are going to be hilarious if they are misidentified. I'm /assuming/ that the thing will not pick up gestures between you and someone else. Such that if I pick up a paper with a similar hand shape as their "pinch and move things" gesture, it will realize it wasn't the same. Or will this be akin to how siri does a shit job understanding anything that is not mechanical in speech? Will be absolutely hilarious if it has a hard time recognizing non-light skinned hands for the gestures. Really hope they don't make that mistake.
- gavinmckenzie 3y agoHopefully the troubles with Siri are understood enough in Apple that they won’t make that mistake, because Siri is truly awful on my HomePods for thinking I’m talking to Siri when I’m not. Thankfully many of the people in the demo videos were people of colour, so I’m fairly confident Apple has gotten that bit right and hopefully their gesture detecting cameras have IR or dot-pattern emitters to work in the dark as well.
- killjoywashere 3y agoI really worry that if AR/VR like Apple Vision takes off, we are going to find ourselves even more alone, isolated, and depressed than ever, separated from the physical humanity we all evolved to live in. Putting a screen between everything is the theme of so many dystopian movies I don't even know where to start. I mean, I get it. I really, really do. But, man, is this healthy, really?
- asim 3y agoIt's not healthy. It's not healthy because as devices and software improves people who are in isolation use it as a further form of isolation. It's easier to escape into technology than it is to go out and interact with real humans. Life is messy, it's hard but it's entirely rewarding and what we need. But everything we've now come to know in the past three decades has taken us in a different direction. The technology has its valued when used for specific purposes. But when it becomes the all consuming thing that people use to attempt to solve those deeply troubling problems, that's when we have an issue. So I think part of this only exacerbates escapism. Getting back to true reality is going to require a fundamental jolt to humanity.
- pixl97 3y ago>Getting back to true reality I agree and disagree with this at the same time. Does true reality mean tossing ourselves out in the plains of Africa with a stick fighting off wild animals? I mean ever since that point human intelligence has been on a divergent path from animal intelligence. We create fields and towns and societies that subject us to new realities. Why is one particularly different from another? At the same time individual divergent realities means society stops existing. What will society look like if we have our own individual universes we can occupy? If you want to take this to an extreme, one could imagine a matrix we voluntarily hook ourselves up to where the machines are left to care for the physical world.
- asim 3y agoI think there's a distinction between the physical and the digital. One might say it's electrons at the end of the day but if you think about how we came into this world and how we've operated for a millennia, putting a veil over our eyes to deny the real world is not part of that. It came much later. Look I'm an engineer like everyone else here. I've grown up on the internet, I've played games consoles since I was a child. I've lost myself to endless hours watching TV, movies, roaming the internet and building software till the odd hours. I'm also closing in on 40 so what I value now is not the same as what I thought was important 20 years ago. Living in some sort of matrix was really appealing back then but as my mortality becomes more apparent I reflect more on our existence and reason for being. In my opinion it's not to defer all of our faculties to a screen strapped to our faces. We are so far from the truth is crazy. But hey we'll keep going in that direction and like all technology there will be the pendulum of extremes and moderation. I will likely not use one of these devices for a long time and only when there's a compelling reason to do so and for limited periods of time. I think that's how all technology should be used, in limited capacity for the betterment of our lives. I do not want to stare at a screen for hours on end anymore and spatial computing is basically taking us further in that direction.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- fullshark 3y agoSeems like most of the use cases he's raving about are novelty VR experiences (e.g. immersive experiences watching sports), and the benefit of the AR is simply you can exit/browse these experiences without feeling like you're inside a VR void. I guess it would be nice to have infinite monitors when I'm doing work for productivity purposes if its seemless but I don't see the killer general use case yet for AR.
- retrocryptid 3y agoSo... what's the killer app for this thing? Best I can tell it's a status symbol for a particular type of computer nerd. But blather about the Apple "Vision" has replaced blather about GPT based chatbots on HN, so I am thankful for that. But I am not being facetious when I say that I don't see any application for the technology that justifies the $3500 price tag. But I'm more than willing to be educated. Is BMW going to use it to train assembly line workers? Is it going to be used to assist people living in memory care by recognizing faces of people in their field of view and displaying identity annotations? Are construction workers supposed to wear it so they can view 3D plans overlaid on top of actual construction? Maybe it's cameras can create a 3d model of existing construction to beam back to the site architect to get input about how to proceed? These all seem plausible, but none of them are consumer apps. Is Apple now not selling direct to consumers? I just don't get the business around these things.
- duffyjp 3y agoI have a VR headset, and it lives in a cardboard box. The reason is that the only thing I'd actually use it for it does poorly. That being immersive media consumption. By the time you have a virtual movie theater the resolution remaining for the actual movie might as well be a VHS. If this is as good as it sounds like it is, that problem is solved. I won't be getting one for $3500, but if I was single or a higher earner I probably would. I'm sure they'll sell as many as they can make.
- ramraj07 3y agoThe killer feature is going to be triggered when cameras that can capture video that this device can put you into come out. I'll happily pay this price and more to be able to record moments in my life and relive them later.
- pixl97 3y ago>Apple "Vision" has replaced blather about GPT based chatbots on HN Heh, this is where you're making a mistake... GPT agents + generated worlds + Apple Vision will be the blather in another year where people go into simulated realities to check out.
- jmull 3y agoJust a side issue, but... can we drop the VR vs. AR terminology now? It just leads to pointless arguments, e.g. about whether a person said VR when they meant AR, etc. and to the awkward MR and XR terms. How much is real and how much is virtual is inherently variable, and good devices (at least for general purpose usage) will make it quite fluid.
- o1y32 3y agoThanks for saying this. It is getting ridiculous. Apple saying they are doing AR which does not mean anything. If you use the headset as a big "projected computer screen" I doubt people really care if the actual surrounding is there or if that makes any difference.
- js2 3y ago> I’ll be honest: what this looked like to me was a divorced dad, alone at home with his Vision Pro, perhaps because his wife was irritated at the extent to which he got lost in his own virtual experience. That certainly puts a different spin on Apple’s proud declaration that the Vision Pro is “The Most Advanced Personal Electronics Device Ever”. > Indeed, this, even more than the iPhone, is the true personal computer. Yes, there are affordances like mixed reality and EyeSight to interact with those around you, but at the end of the day the Vision Pro is a solitary experience. Absolutely. I can imagine myself using an Vision Pro from my home office. I can imagine myself using a Vision Pro while on a plane. So I can imagine using it either where I'm already physically alone or where I want to be physically isolated from other humans nearby. I can also imagine myself using a Vision Pro to connect with other humans who are physically distant (the FaceTime demo). What I cannot ever imagine is having the Vision Pro on my head while interacting with other people in the room (the dad watching his kids demo), nor can I even imagine using them as part of a shared entertainment experience. e.g., I cannot imagine my wife and I each having a pair of these and using them to watch a movie "together". But, watching a movie with other people when we are all physically distant from each other? Yes, that I can imagine. I can see myself buying a pair of these. I'm fascinated by the technology and by the ability to use them in my home office. I don't really see them taking the place of my home theater, but maybe... 95% of the time I use it alone because my wife prefers to read a book. > I am completely serious when I say that I would pay the NBA thousands of dollars to get a season pass to watch games captured in this way. Yes, that’s a crazy statement to make, but courtside seats cost that much or more, and that 10-second clip was shockingly close to the real thing. Personally, I think that watching a game while being virtually part of the crowd would leave me feeling lonely and isolated. It's one thing to watch a game alone, seeing the other people cheering. It seems like an altogether different experience being part of the crowd while not really being part of the crowd.
- prawn 3y agoMy wife and I usually watch different shows/movies so I could see myself using a headset like this for a lot of content consumption. Rest of the use cases I agree with. On the NBA games, I reckon it would be a matter of deciding whether being able to get a courtside experience for a far cheaper price counted for more than the isolation. And being able to get a drink from the fridge. And not having to deal with driving and parking. And for sports events which are otherwise sold out or on the other side of the world. I can see this being a huge thing if the price and functionality are right.
- blitz_skull 3y agoI think the point that many are missing is that Apple doesn’t announce half-baked products at nearly the rate that Google and company does. The fact that Apple took this bet isn’t indicative of the current product, it’s indicative of the future. They’re correct in almost every product bet they make. If you don’t see it, you’re probably not seeing the long game.
- jmkni 3y agoI want to believe (invoking Skully/X-files here) I'm viewing this release from Apple as, essentially, a public DevKit for more slick versions of the same kit in the future. Something with the described functionality, but the form factor of something closer to Google Glass would 100% be game-changing ie. You develop your AR apps on this, and then come out with something much more user-friendly in a couple of versions time. I'm just not convinced that most people want to walk around with this thing on their face for any extended period of time, regardless of how amazing the tech is (and it is amazing!) Time will tell, I guess.
- Pxtl 3y agoI'm just still surprised that Apple made a heavy-duty massive VR/AR product instead of something more like Google Glass - something lightweight and fashionable as a peripheral for your phone just for showing notifications and turn-by-turn directions and other kind of status updates -- an Apple Watch for your face.
- TechBro8615 3y agoBasically I'm just not gonna wear it (the goggles) I know... UGH I know ... I'm sorry! It's just that I'm not gonna wear it is all hahaha
- dang 3y agoRelated: Apple Vision Pro: Apple’s first spatial computer - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36201593 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36201593 - June 2023 (2685 comments) Also: Apple Vision predictive bio-feedback - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36210133 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36210133 - June 2023 (46 comments) visionOS - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36208735 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36208735 - June 2023 (58 comments) First impressions: Yes, Apple Vision Pro works and yes, it’s good - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36207705 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36207705 - June 2023 (437 comments) Apple's Vision Pro headset deserves to be ridiculed - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36204653 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36204653 - June 2023 (130 comments) Ask HN: At $3500 entry point who can afford Apple’s new Vision Pro headset? - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36202898 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36202898 - June 2023 (28 comments) Apple reveals Vision Pro, a AR/VR headset unlike any other - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36200958 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36200958 - June 2023 (53 comments) Apple Vision Pro Is Apple's New VR Headset - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36200884 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36200884 - June 2023 (156 comments) Apple Reveals 'Vision Pro' Headset - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36200777 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36200777 - June 2023 (159 comments) Apple’s Vision Pro AR headset is finally here - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36200708 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36200708 - June 2023 (162 comments)
- btown 3y ago> It’s going to seem pretty weird when dad is wearing a headset as his daughter blows out birthday candles; perhaps this problem will be fixed by a separate line of standalone cameras that capture photos in the Apple Immersive Video Format, which is another way to say that this is a bit of a chicken-and-egg problem. It makes me think about the article's earlier reference to the iPad's launch: > Jobs went on to list a number of things he thought the iPad might be better at, including web browsing, email, viewing photos, watching videos, listening to music, playing games, and reading eBooks. You know what else the iPad is good at? Perhaps having a wide enough frame, while in landscape mode, such that multiple back-side cameras can be far enough apart to get as good a depth-of-field as the Vision has? And, potentially, at being a preview device with good enough eye tracking (perhaps via multiple front-side cameras) to at least mimic the 3D effect when previewing, before you put Vision on for the full experience? Dad holding up this kind of "iPad Vision," or putting an iPad Vision that's capturing the memories on an (automatically swiveling and face-tracking) "TRiPod," is far superior to putting on the goggles! (Apple, please please hire me as your product naming visionary. I have many more punny names where these come from.) But I can see why Apple would sequence the releases so that Vision comes first; the iPad Vision and TRiPod and accoutrements are likely to be expensive and perhaps even clunky at first, more akin to a pro camera rig than anything previously released, and would need to be justified by a "magical" viewing experience. Make no mistake, though - Vision is just the beginning of an ecosystem that will be built around these experiences, and one that I think can complement our in-person interactions in a profoundly social and human way.
- bloppe 3y agoThroughout all this, I'm struck by the epic credibility of Apple. Any other company would have seen a much larger share price slump after making an announcement like this, but Apple managed to pull it off with only a slight dip. This is truly a super power and may very well be enough for them to achieve breakaway network effects.
- throwaway213213 3y agoMy biggest issue with Vision Pro is the extension of the App Store model to a new platform, where we could start from scratch and strike a new deal on the percentages. Unfortunately Apple has the resources to seed the most prominent developers with any help they need and once the ball get’s rolling there’s no going back. It will be interesting to see how this plays out.
- svilen_dobrev 3y agofunny, if one combines the (anti)social projections of this-and-related, and the (anti)social projections of the new generative models stuff.. so you buy a "skin-fixing" filter and your skin does not look that old and crappy anymore (to you - and also to all your registered friends if you buy the Pro version); hey lets attach a "mustache-adding" filter to that particular aunt (haha) ; f*, lets generate a new face for my partner - ah i always wanted a blondie.. yeah. but still Alone.
- allarm 3y agoThey should’ve called it eyeOS instead of visionOS
- aaroninsf 3y agoHottake having read the whole thing, I think too much is made about the "personal vs social" binning of Meta vs Apple. It's true off the bat, but, is more useful as a hook to hang philosophy about our isolated selves on, than a concrete projection of how this is going to develop. To put a sharp edge on that, I will go so far as to say I think this is quite the wrong take, and I have receipts. Maybe. The FaceTime bit about scanning your face, and presenting you sans mask in teleconferencing? Great, I look fine in FaceTime! ...the exercise left to the student to infer is that if you can appear in FaceTime, next you can appear in the space with me outside that frame. Or your AI-backed agent, which also you know, can replicate your manner of speaking and voice, because Apple has infinite hours new and old of your speech, written and verbal, on tap, right? You and proxy-you are going to be in shared space with other wearers... soon. And then well we have something world-altering to deal with, because our monkey-minds fully accept such figures as "real" and our memories filter out the virtuality of our interactions, where our analytic mind does not. The world of "Her" and Joe's "girl friend" in Blade Runner etc are all getting really close. See the clickbait about someone "marrying" their AI boyfriend yesterday? Anyway I digress, but, yeah, I think Apple is quietly collecting cards for shared virtual presence, and as per usual will take their time to make it wow on disclosure.
- euroderf 3y agoSo are we at Minority Report yet ? I note that nobody in the Apple presentation was using finger flicks to delete and rearrange windows. Which I think were kind-of-iconic UI gestures in MR.
- cubefox 3y agoThat twist in the last section ...