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I’m so confused by Lego’s market share. They sell cheap plastic at insane premiums. Why is there not more competition?

• sgtnoodle 3y ago
  Lego pieces are unique in their extreme manufacturing precision. It's very difficult to replicate at a large scale. You're paying for their engineering.
  • local_crmdgeon 3y ago
    You'd think that concept would be more popular here, but I guess the desire to consume overrides everything. I think that engineering like Lego is gorgeous in and of itself. Like a Swiss watch at scale.
• dontupvoteme 3y ago
  They use extremely high quality mechanical tooling. It's some of the most expensive plastic you can buy.
  • samstave 3y ago
    As someone who has many thousands of dollars in lego, and one who, in the course of my life has owned many many hundreds of pounds of lego.... Where the FUCK are they all? microplastic in the environment, no. it wast towed outside the environment to another environment where there are just fish, birds, sea and lego... anyway... as much as I love lego, they need to curb their roll on the plastics they put into the environment. No, not that one. The one where the lego doesnt fall off.
    • frosted-flakes 3y ago
      I believe they plan to switch entirely to plastic derived from plant sources within a decade.
      • tonyedgecombe 3y ago
        My understanding is they are struggling with that.
    • crazygringo 3y ago
      I don't think Legos are a big environmental problem. Seeing as they're expensive and the individual pieces have tons of value, people often resell them or donate them. Or even for those who toss them in the garbage, they are buried in a landfill. But it's hard to think of any kind of plastic that actually gets reused more than Legos are. My nephews are now playing with the same Legos I played with 40 years ago, together with some new sets. Not a lot of toys (or objects generally) you can say that about. They're not a major concern for polluting the environment. The kinds of plastics that are of concern for pollution tend to be food-related (bags, utensils, lids) which people actively use and lose and discard outdoors (and blow away from trash cans etc.) and plastic commercial fishing equipment which is similarly used, lost and discarded in the ocean.
• outlace 3y ago
  As someone with young kids who recently bought a $70 Lego set, it’s not just the plastic blocks, it’s a whole design. My daughter built this awesome Lego tree house with over a thousand pieces. She followed the instructions and built it step by step over a few days, which was fun for her in and of itself, and now that it is complete she continues to play with it. So sure the plastic pieces are easily reproduced but clearly Lego does great work on architecting some really cool designs. (I have no affiliation with Lego company to be clear)
  • sharkweek 3y ago
    And honestly the pieces aren’t even that easily reproduced. Our son got a knock off brand as a gift and it was horrible to build compared to a LEGO set.
    • samstave 3y ago
      This is actually a trade secret of lego. They build to such tight tolerances that others cant compete in the interlocking... it is a known thing of theirs, and honestly - we should be building that into actual construction mediums
      • callalex 3y ago
        They also have the exclusive patent for the raised dots being slightly dome/cone shaped so any competitors are doomed to be worse no matter how well made.
        • Dylan16807 3y ago
          "The last significant patent for Lego bricks expired in 1978."
  • Sivart13 3y ago
    yeah 41703 and a lot of the rest of the Friends line is awesome Consider Andrea's Theater School as well (https://www.lego.com/en-us/product/andrea-s-theatre-school-41714 https://www.lego.com/en-us/product/andrea-s-theatre-school-4...) though it's a little pricier ($100)
• NegativeLatency 3y ago
  Tight tolerances and good quality control cost money. I remember trying to play with my friends megablocks as a kid and they just wouldn’t stay together well There are also some Chinese companies making decent compatible bricks now
  • shadowgovt 3y ago
    For a long time, that was a function of patents: LEGO bricks actually have slightly concave pegs, like inverted cones. Those patents only recently expired, which is one of the reasons they pushed so hard into licensing to distinguish their brand.
• delecti 3y ago
  There are, lots of em, but they aren't as good. LEGO charges a premium, but their manufacturing precision really is phenomenal. Also, LEGO's premium isn't that extreme. Their sets have worked out to about 0.10 USD per piece for decades, they've just gotten bigger and more elaborate. The other brands also don't have the same brand deals, I can't get an X-Wing set from Mega Bloks, for example. Though notably you can only get Pokemon sets from Nanoblock, and the experience of assembling one will make you appreciate the work LEGO puts into their instructions and manufacturing precision.
  • aceazzameen 3y ago
    This is true. My kids and I have sets from all various brands, including some Lego compatible (knockoffs) directly from China. Only the the true LEGO brand blocks have precision in every block. Their sets are the most satisfying when clicking together.
• haunter 3y ago
  Apart from what the others said is the licensing too. They have exclusives from Star Wars to Doctor Who to Mercedes trucks. Hard to compete against that from 0. Btw Aliexpress has countless chinese fakes.
• deleted 3y ago
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• casion 3y ago
  Because they are the best quality, in every dimension, and when something is almost purely a hobby then many people are willing to pay a premium for a friction-free experience. There are other brands that are just fine, but you will occasionally get missing pieces, poor fitment, poor/strange construction etc... With LEGO you'll not get any of those (except the occasional strange construction). I used to buy ~50/50 LEGO/Clone, and despite improvements in clones, it's 95/5 now. The LEGO experience is simply disproportionately better relative to the cost. It's simply worth it. signed, Owner of A LOT of of LEGO kits/bricks _and_ clones.
  • magnuspaaske 3y ago
    Also, the "cheap plastic" thing is clearly said by someone who don't know plastic. NASA included a bunch of pieces on one of their Mars crafts to check the cameras since they knew the parameters of the LEGO pieces losing their color better than the cameras. LEGOs are durable. Also, even if the unit cost of injection molding plastic might not be super high, the cost of making the molds is. I've heard discarded molds are used in the concrete for new buildings as a way to know where they are and ensure they're not suddenly in the wrong hands (although that might be a rumor)
    • sidewndr46 3y ago
      all you'd have to do to a mold is overheat and deform it or crack it. Way easier and super easy to verify it. Suggesting someone dispose of it in concrete sounds like something the mafia would do.
      • tomcam 3y ago
        I for one am glad the FBI was able to get Mafia mold crackers under control. I’m afraid the Mexican cartels may have taken over that business in recent years.
  • tonyedgecombe 3y ago
    Yes, we still have the lego from my childhood. After nearly fifty years it is in excellent condition.
• lnsru 3y ago
  I am the guy, who thinks, that Lego is heavily overpriced. But then I bought some competition products. No one of them had nice Lego experience where parts just fit. Earlier the parts used to fall off and now they are still enough different to cause frustration while building. So yeah, only Lego knows how to make it right and can get away with premium pricing.
• thatguy0900 3y ago
  It's not cheap plastic, that's why it's a premium. They have plenty of competitors that actually do sell cheap plastic, they all suck to play with.
• post_break 3y ago
  If you look on Amazon or Aliexpress there is definitely competition, just not in stores. I have a few not lego kits that are fantastic.
  • deleted 3y ago
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  • sprak 3y ago
    Do you remember any of the brand names that was of good quality?
    • bombcar 3y ago
      Iirc there are some that are literal direct ripoffs (exact same sets with a ELGO or some obvious ripoff brand) that appeared at a time, and were pretty obviously run off of a Chinese Lego line (I believe Lego got them shut down by winning a copyright case in China). The quality of off-brand is way up in the last 20 years but it’s still not the same; they run the molds way too long.
    • cardanome 3y ago
      Just to add my own two cents: Cobi produces exclusively in the EU and with superior quality than Lego, albeit focused mostly on adult market with military stuff. There is Mould King, Cada, Bluebrixx which also have more decent sets but you need to do your own research and specific sets. Newer sets are generally higher quality than older ones as Lego competition as drastically improved in recent years.
• jasode 3y ago
  >Why is there not more competition? I didn't downvote your comment but there does seem to be competitors unless I'm misunderstanding this list: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lego_clone#Brands https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lego_clone#Brands It's just that the LEGO is the most well-known. Probably due to the quality plastics, licensing deals (Star Wars, Marvel movies themed kits, etc), famous advertising campaigns, and so on.
  • seanmcdirmid 3y ago
    Megablocks (??? I forget the name) has a licensing deal with transformers, Pokémon, and hot wheels. I think Halo also, still not a very strong competitor. They are sold at Fred Myer in my locale, but they keep distance from the Lego section. I guess Lego has that Optimus prime set now, so maybe not exclusive to transformers anymore.
• skeeter2020 3y ago
  look at where their focus lies - exclusive tie-ins to every possible mass-market cultural event. Sure, they make the best bricks, but they make their money with Star Wars, Super Mario, Jurassic Park, etc.
• bragr 3y ago
  You can get knock-off or "compatible" bricks much cheaper from other companies but they suck. Lego bricks have incredibly good tolerances which allows you to build large structures without them going all banana on you, not to mention consistent holding power and material quality. Get some Alibaba bricks and you'll see right away.
• brookst 3y ago
  Why do CPUs cost $400 when they only have about $1 worth of sand, aluminum, and other elements in them? Raw material cost is not a good proxy for end user value of finished goods.
  • gjsman-1000 3y ago
    People make this mistake all the time. “The iPhone sells for $999, but only costs $320 in materials!” Well, sure. But you aren’t including shipping costs, storage costs, training costs, labor costs, marketing costs, office costs, employee costs, research and development costs, legal costs, patent licensing costs, wasted material costs, environmental costs, electricity costs, packaging costs, margins for resellers, distribution costs…
    • cedilla 3y ago
      This isn't even the mistake. Price has very little relation to costs - except that most products can't be sold below cost, at least not for long. The price of the iphone is a good example. All the costs that you name exist, but they are completely irrelevant. Apple sells the iPhone for a thousand dollars because enough people still buy them at that price.
      • brookst 3y ago
        Yes. Commodities are priced at cost plus. Differentiated goods are priced based on value delivered.
        • lotsofpulp 3y ago
          >Differentiated goods are priced based on value delivered. I prefer “perceived utility” rather than “value delivered”.
          • brookst 3y ago
            Sure, I enjoy semantic rhetoric as much as anyone does.
• bluetomcat 3y ago
  The quality of the bricks is generally high, but set design is something they capitalise on. Instead of selling themed playsets with minifigures and encouraging kids to build new adventure worlds, nowadays they sell mostly pop-culture-referenced plastic display models with tiny finicky 1x1 pieces that are of not much use for general building. These models employ complex building techniques, but are not easy to turn into something else. They create an incentive for people to collect all the models rather than unlock creative potential.
  • elpool2 3y ago
    I helped my kid put together a lego kit recently that did something interesting. It was a spaceship but the instructions were kind of a story, and there were parts where it just went “ok, now it needs to go faster, what can you add to do that?”, and there were lots of extra pieces (wings, boosters, other spaceshippy things) to allow for a bit of extra creativity. My kid loved it.
• grrdotcloud 3y ago
  As mentioned the quality is amazing. I've been playing with them for thirty years. Same set thirty years ago has the same quality and matches perfectly to the identical pieces purchased today. Despite different types and audiences the quality remains.
• LegitShady 3y ago
  1) Entrenched market leaders 2) Leader in terms of quality 3) Good product design and successful branding deals 4) Difficulty of starting a dedicated competitor includes high startup costs (mold making is veeeery expensive) 5) There are competitors, but since startup costs are high even they aren't super cheap, and some have quality control problems, not as much piece variety, etc.
• mejutoco 3y ago
  They were having more and more competition, and they focused on licenses: star wars, harry potter, etc. Others can copy lego (with less quality) but the licensing deals protect them. Very wise.
  • GalenErso 3y ago
    Lego is also often the only game in town. Star Wars' Kenobi TV show had this sleek black ship to transport the Imperial Inquisitors. Lego made a set of it. No other toy manufacturer has, so if you want to play with your own Inquisitor shuttle, Lego is the only choice. Why, I wonder? There are Star Wars toys that are not Lego, so why are those toy makers not jumping on the opportunity? I honestly don't get it. Unless Lego has a deal with Disney to be the only ones authorized to make toys of certain vehicles/scenes/characters.
• anchochilis 3y ago
  One major draw of Lego is their licensing of expensive creative IP. Look at the Harry Potter, Star Wars, DC, Lord of the Rings themed sets. Smaller competitors likely can not afford the same offerings. And Lego probably has deep enough pockets to ensure exclusive deals. There's also something to be said for having such a dominant, established brand. Lego is a cultural icon, beloved by multiple generations. Picking up a knockoff kit is sort of like taking your kid to a random local theme park instead Disney World. While in theory the two options have similar features (rides! characters running around in costume!) they are of course not the same.
  • routerl 3y ago
    > One major draw of Lego is their licensing of expensive creative IP. This is the real genius beyond the manufacturing (which other comments are correctly praising). Lego was/is the only brand that gets to make, e.g. both Mikey Mouse and Bugs Bunny, both Marvel and DC, etc. By making Lego versions of those properties, they've convinced those enormous IP holders that this does not compete with other products; Disney can't make Lego Star Wars themselves. Lego's corporate accomplishment is to have elevated themselves to the status of a platform. And doing so while their product isn't software or hardware is pretty unique.
    • haunter 3y ago
      > Lego was/is the only brand that gets to make, e.g. both Mikey Mouse and Bugs Bunny, both Marvel and DC, Balenciaga and Ralph Lauren etc. Fortnite does this too. They have DC and Marvel, Naruto and DBZ etc.
      • routerl 3y ago
        I think that's more similar to Burger King offering promotional branded cups.
      • aceazzameen 3y ago
        Funko Pop too. It seems like anyone can do it if they have deep enough pockets and enough clout to woo the license holders.
• diskzero 3y ago
  I am an adult who has built several Lego kits recently. These include the NASA Saturn rocket, the NASA LEM, a grand piano and a Fender guitar amp combo. The plastic parts are more than just generic shapes; many of them are custom and designed for the specific kit. The plastic itself has a good feel and is durable. The kits are unique and must have required numerous hours of research and development, prototyping and user testing. The documentation is extensive, high-quality and complete. In addition to the instructions, there is nicely researched and presented material about the subject of the model. If anyone is reasonably able to come up with a process to compete with the sum total of all of these elements, I wish them luck. I would also like to invest!
  • audunw 3y ago
    > The plastic parts are more than just generic shapes; many of them are custom and designed for the specific kit. With Lego, it's surprising how often the parts are NOT designed for a specific kit. You can look through the parts list at the end of the instruction manual. You'd be surprised how often they've re-used parts you'd think are specific to a kit. With Saturn V in particular, I was SURE the fairing must be a part specific for that kit. Turns out it's the spire from a Hogwarts castle kit. Okay, so that's the only other kit it was used, but still.. If you look at clone kits, they often have more kit-specific parts. I think this is counter-intuitively a part of a strategy based on low-cost. They spend less on extremely precise plastic molds, and designing a kit-specific part can make it easier for designers. They don't have to spend a lot of time thinking of creative ways to re-use existing parts. They don't need to have knowledge of obscure parts they could re-use either. > The documentation is extensive, high-quality and complete. And it's easy to find them online if you've lost them, and you can easily find missing parts of bricklink. So you can dump all your Lego in a box, save it for your kids, and be sure that they can still be used, and that you can rebuild the sets if you want. I saved my Lego from my childhood. I recently took them out to play with my kids and they're still perfectly good. The only thing that doesn't match with modern Lego is the electric stuff.
    • diskzero 3y ago
      > With Lego, it's surprising how often the parts are NOT designed for a specific kit. OK, that is interesting. I wonder if and or what the software used by kit designers looks like? Does Lego have a custom CAD system that references the catalog of existings parts? Are they any Lego employees here that are able to comment?
• otabdeveloper4 3y ago
  Do you have kids? You can test this empirically: buy them some Chinese Lego-compatible sets and see what comes about. (That said, you're probably better off buying second-hand, Legos don't really spoil with age.)
• zebnyc 3y ago
  I have a 5 year old who loves building blocks and legos. We are not even too particular about quality. When I buy blocks for my kid, I am looking for him to learn to have fun by himself without Mom/Dad becoming involved and that is very hard ask with lego competitors. We tried buying from lego competitors but then they are missing pieces or their instructions are lacking which is very difficult for a small child to deal with.