16 ms·

Bigscreen Beyond – Small VR Headset

170 points by dmarcos 4y ago

ladberg 4y ago
To summarize for anyone not wanting to click around their website: - $999 - Molded to your face - 2560 × 2560 per eye (higher than the HP Reverb and nearly every other headset, lower than PIMAX 8K) - 90° × 93° FOV (lower than most other headsets) - 127g (excluding strap/cord, MUCH lighter than any existing headset) - Does not come with controllers or trackers (compatible with existing lighthouses, bring your own)
- CursedUrn 4y ago
  Wow, that's an astonishing improvement in weight compared to other VR headsets. Here's Meta's line-up for comparison: https://i.imgur.com/JoTt10p.png https://i.imgur.com/JoTt10p.png
  - rpdillon 4y ago
    Meta's lineup isn't a fair comparison IMO, since those include significant compute power to a actually run the software, battery, inside out tracking, and are completely untethered, all for about half of what this costs. This is a tethered display that relies on separate controllers, lighthouses, and computation. That said, lightweight is awesome. I think getting weight out of the headset is going to be really important for any sort of casual use of VR, but I don't think this product is good example of that, just because of all the other requirements.
    - sandworm101 4y ago
      I'll pay the extra to keep my face free of meta stickers. I don't care to share my viewing habits with that beast.
      - stephc_int13 4y ago
        Same, I would not buy/use any Meta product if I can choose. I have a very mild interest in VR but if the tech really improves this is something I could try. Past experiences have been disappointing.
        smoldesu 4y ago
        It's not very likely anyone will offer a privacy conscious VR product, at least any more than we have now. You can run a relatively "Open" VR stack with Proton and Linux, but that's not really marketable to major audiences. Even selling it to Windows users didn't really work. The last chances of a truly privacy-respecting VR experience dried up when "The Industry" walked away from OpenXR and other efforts to treat VR like a first-class technology and not a toy. Maybe not the worst choice in hindsight, but it's also the one that lead us down this road of "product-ized" virtual reality.
        CursedUrn 4y ago
        There is a big difference between Facebook having cameras inside your house and someone like Valve. We know that Valve makes money primarily from software sales, whereas Facebook's core business is collecting user data for targeted advertising, so you know they will taking advantage of every camera and microphone you give them. Facebook also has a terrible ethical history: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_Facebook https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_Facebook
        smoldesu 4y ago
        Well, we need "someone like Valve" to make Open VR a reality at-scale. Otherwise it's just going to become another ad-infested content pipeline.
- ben174 4y ago
  I do believe one of the reasons VR has been slow to gain traction is because of the bulkiness/awkwardness of the headsets. This definitely takes care of the weight, but it still looks ridiculous. I don't foresee people sitting on the train wearing these. The right headset is around the corner, but this isn't it.
  - dvngnt_ 4y ago
    unless i lived in a very low crime rate area like japan, i would never wear a vr headset on the train
  - rajman187 4y ago
    Anecdotal but I was on a flight recently and the fellow seated behind me brought his Quest2 for the flight. He said it was much better for watching movies than the poor quality of the in-flight screens. Makes sense since you can also download movies via Netflix or Amazon Prime
  - crazygringo 4y ago
    Sure you're not gonna wear one on your commute. But on a long-distance train or a long plane flight? I could totally see people reclining and wearing this to watch TV and movies. (Honestly, the gigantic IMAX-sized cinema screen in VR is kind of the killer app nobody is talking about. Not to mention it's the highest quality 3D movie experience you can get, if you want to watch something like Avatar.) Obviously nobody's going to be playing games on a VR headset on public transportation, at least not ones that require moving controllers in space.
    - llampx 4y ago
      I actually asked for experiences of people with VR headsets for movie watching. No one said they would recommend it. I was kind of surprised. Do you think they are good for that use case?
      - crazygringo 4y ago
        They're amazing. You really need to have the right software though. I've got a Quest 2, and the app to use is Skybox, and I watch stuff over SMB on my local NAS. The key things are being able to adjust the size of the screen and the angle of the screen. I can literally lie on my back on bed and watch TV on the ceiling. And the visual quality tends to be somewhere between 720p and 1080p -- you can make the screen big enough to resolve all 1080p detail, but it's kind of too large at that point. I think I mostly watch around an "850p" level of detail. I also watch it with my AirPods Pro paired up, and the app lets me manually adjust the audio sync by 100 ms to compensate for the Bluetooth delay. Watching TV through various specific apps can be more hit or miss, as they won't allow you to adjust the angle of the screen for example, so you can watch comfortably while reclining, or the Bluetooth audio delay. I assume they'll all figure this stuff out eventually. So the tech is absolutely all there, but the UX can be very app-dependent.
- potatolicious 4y ago
  > "- Does not come with controllers or trackers (compatible with existing lighthouses, bring your own)" This feels like a dealbreaker for me, and I should be firmly in the target demo for this product (PC VR user, flight sim enjoyer) - putting up Lighthouses on my walls so I can do some basic VR gaming is IMO a pretty tall order. There's a really good reason inside-out tracking has practically fully displaced stuff that requires you to install new stuff in a room.
  - buggy6257 4y ago
    I have a vive, and my lighthouses are on collapsible tripods that sit in corners of my living room when i'm playing. Takes ~5 min of time to set both up, point them in the right direction, and setup room boundaries in Steam. Works really well, if you prefer to do it that way! I think I would still prefer inside-out tracking, but I have very specific reasons for only using the Vive, so that's what I'm stuck with. I think it's a problem that can easily be overcome if you're interested in this headset, without having to drill holes into walls! It's definitely an extra expense though. However, if their whole goal was "smallest lightest headset" then you can't really blame them for removing every single piece of tech from the headset they possibly could and outsourcing it to another device to maintain that claim. The right call? I dunno. But if this headset can be a drop-in replacement for my Vive one, I will buy the hell out of that. It's a strict upgrade for me with basically no extra expenditure of effort/money beyond the cost of the headset. To each their own though!
    - potatolicious 4y ago
      > "However, if their whole goal was "smallest lightest headset" then you can't really blame them for removing every single piece of tech from the headset they possibly could and outsourcing it to another device to maintain that claim." Sure you can - IMO (and of course reasonable minds can disagree) - you can surely blame a product when they've optimized to the point of going below-MVP. I get the desire to be smaller and lighter than the rest, but IMO inside-out is table stakes and is part of the "minimum viable" requirement... I've seen the portable lighthouse setups, but IMO that's even worse. I've done the lighthouse setup back when it was I had the Oculus CV1 - and those didn't even need to be positioned high on the walls, and IMO it was a huge pain the ass. I think I ended up using them a total of 5 times because of how much fiddling was required to get into VR. PCVR is already a vanishingly small market, this particular quirk of the spec IMO puts the product below minimum viability.
- dTal 4y ago
  So "lightest ever VR headset" is a lie. The LG R100 pips it at 113 grams. It's inferior in every other respect, but that wasn't the claim...
  - CrimsonRain 4y ago
    By that logic, a sunglass with 3D stickers is even lighter
    - dTal 4y ago
      Not really. They're qualitatively the same product: a head mounted binocular USB-C display with accelerometers/gyros. It's much easier to make such a thing than a full tracking VR system. If this is a VR headset, then so is the LG R100. (Admittedly this product does include lighthouse sensors, slightly reducing the amount of third party equipment you need to implement a 6dof system.)
      - ladberg 4y ago
        IMU-based and lighthouse-based 6DOF tracking are so far apart in fidelity that the LG R100 is unusable for anything beyond watching videos and I wouldn’t consider it a real player in the VR space.
- dmonitor 4y ago
  should also mention: 90Hz refresh rate <144Hz sounds suboptimal for a VR headset
rpdillon 4y ago
Interesting. Lightweight, $1000, iPhone only (for face scanning), but tying into the SteamVR/Index ecosystem. No inside-out tracking. They advertise shareability via magnetically removable foam, but also say they've reduced weight by making 15 different versions for IPDs between 58mm and 72mm, suggesting sharing will only work well among those with similar IPDs. Not super compelling IMHO unless you own a modern iPhone and you're already heavily invested in a gaming PC and the Steam ecosystem (which, admittedly, many are!)
- ladberg 4y ago
  To clarify, the face scanning part can be done with a friend's iPhone and it's a one-time thing.
  - MikusR 4y ago
    It still requires you to have a friend and have a friend with the specific iPhone.
    - adammarples 4y ago
      Or be anywhere near an apple store. How else would you rather they took a custom face scan
      - MikusR 4y ago
        You know that apple stores are not in every country?
    - dymk 4y ago
      "specific" being any iphone made in the last 4 years (iPhone XR)
- reaperducer 4y ago
  a modern iPhone It uses an iPhone XR or above. The XR was released five years ago.
- 4y ago
meltyness 4y ago
- Wired - 90 FOV No thanks! Compelling though, if your use-case is viewing 2D content on virtual screens -- the metaverse app Bigscreen makes, a virtual environment for sharing 2D content.
dougmwne 4y ago
Bigscreen is a VR app that’s been on the market for quite a few years. It focuses on VR movie watching in virtual theaters with other people. It works “ok” with current gen headsets. It feels like going to the movies wearing heavy ski goggles. The weight, comfort, resolution and optics of current VR headsets are not there yet. Looks like they sat down and designed the perfect VR headset that would showcase the experience they always wanted users to have in their app.
- ben174 4y ago
  One cool often overlooked thing about BigScreen VR is the fact that 3D movies work perfectly. It's a great experience watching a 3D movie on a giant virtual screen.
- ozten 4y ago
  I've rented a few 3D movies. The biggest limitation for me was the limited catalog and my dis-interest in action movies. It is such a great solo watching experience, I would spend more money on a more diverse catalog.
- iinnPP 4y ago
  There's a player called HereSphere that works a whole lot better than any other VR video player on the market. Nothing I have tried comes even close to the level of smoothness, even over SMB on a crappy external drive. https://heresphere.itch.io/heresphere-vr-video-player-quest-2 https://heresphere.itch.io/heresphere-vr-video-player-quest-... The demo is limited only by a nag screen if you want to check it out.
  - ancientworldnow 4y ago
    The big sell on bigscreen is you can watch the videos with friends (and their avatars) in the theater. It's a social experience first and a video player second.
christiangenco 4y ago
Bigscreen VR is the most disappointing VR app I've ever used. Please stop wasting time making hardware and make your app better. I see the potential and I experience the need regularly: I want to watch movies with friends remotely in a cool VR environment that feels like we're watching together in a theater. In practice my options are to: - pay to watch "a vast movie selection" of 140 films, the majority of which are anime[1] - run the buggy (and so aptly named) Bigscreen Beta PC client[2] which will probably crash during weird unlikely edge cases like your screensaver turning on and critically depends on your internet upload speed for a good movie watching experience for everyone. Get ready for frequent "wait is it showing a black screen for you guys?" troubleshooting. It only runs on beefy PCs right now but don't worry: a macOS version is being worked on circa 2019[3]. - send the video file to everyone and get them to download it to a folder of their headset (which involves running Android File Transfer; nontechnical friends will struggle) then start a shared room. Arguably the least painful option with the best overall quality. When it works though it's so good. Watching a film in Bigscreen feels like watching a film in an actual theater. Their drawing and popcorn throwing features are hilarious and fun. Their spacial audio is a blast. Their selection of virtual theaters is plentiful. Here's the experience I want to watch a film with friends in Bigscreen: - log into my Netflix/Hulu/Disney+ account through Bigscreen - create a new room - pick a movie - share an invite code I understand for that to work Bigscreen would need to make complicated partnerships happen, so in the meanwhile I'd like to be able to: - drag and drop a video file into bigscreen.com/newroom - see an invite code I can join from my headset and share with other people Please someone create this experience. You can use WebXR[4] to do the whole thing with the web stack you already know and you could probably just download a ready-made 3D model of a movie theater[5]. 1. https://www.bigscreenvr.com/movies/catalog https://www.bigscreenvr.com/movies/catalog 2. https://store.steampowered.com/app/457550/Bigscreen_Beta/ https://store.steampowered.com/app/457550/Bigscreen_Beta/ 3. https://www.reddit.com/r/OculusQuest/comments/c7kx2n/bigscreen_vr_and_macos/ https://www.reddit.com/r/OculusQuest/comments/c7kx2n/bigscre... 4. https://immersiveweb.dev/ https://immersiveweb.dev/ 5. https://www.turbosquid.com/Search/3D-Models/free/theater https://www.turbosquid.com/Search/3D-Models/free/theater
- layer8 4y ago
  > the majority of which are anime[1] I don’t see any anime on that page. Would actually be a plus for me.
vyrotek 4y ago
These look light enough and have high enough resolution per-eye to possibly use them as a PC monitor.
- abracadaniel 4y ago
  I feel like that would be my killer app to get me into the space. But I wonder if it’s worse for your eyes than staring at a monitor all day, or if the optics make it no different because you’re still focusing at a distance.
  - pivo 4y ago
    Good point! With a monitor you can easily glance away and focus on objects in the distance to exercise your eye muscles, something my eye doctor always has recommended. Probably not so easily done with these, which means it won't happen as often. That said, I'd love to have something like this that's compact and provides the equivalent of a big, 4K or better, monitor. It's also too big of a gamble for me to plonk down $1K to find out, and it looks like it won't support an M1 MacBook Pro due to the video card requirements anyway, so I'll have to wait.
- mrguyorama 4y ago
  That's the entire business of the company behind this headset, which is why this headset makes the compromises it does.
deleted 4y ago
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rideontime 4y ago
The face-scanned insert sounds nice. Can you just sell me one of those for my $300* Quest 2? *when I purchased mine
dvngnt_ 4y ago
Only 90hz though which is less than the valve index, but it has a higher resolution
- tmikaeld 4y ago
  Maybe it's a limitation of Displayport?
rapnie 4y ago
"An Apple iPhone XR or newer is required for the 3D Face Scan. Bigscreen Beyond is manufactured based on this 3D Face Scan, and cannot be manufactured without it. If you do not own an iPhone, you can complete your 3D Face Scan by borrowing a friend's iPhone or using an iPhone at an Apple Store."
- Karsteski 4y ago
  A bit of an insane requirement honestly. I guess they're assuming their target demographic would be wealthy enough to either have an iPhone, or be around people who would have an iPhone? Kinda rubs me the wrong way still, even though I'd be able to get it done if I so choose...
  - threeseed 4y ago
    They are using the FaceID depth sensors. And right now the only phone with them and that has a usable API is apparently the iPhone. This was covered in a walkthrough with a VR YouTuber: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yvih_ljVc_w https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yvih_ljVc_w
  - jjcm 4y ago
    Is it insane if it's for a custom mold? Personally I would rather borrow a friend's phone than go into a physical store for a scan or have them send me a plaster mold kit.
  - NoPicklez 4y ago
    It rubs me the wrong way this continued idea that only the wealthy have an iPhone, or atleast it does when people just assume that's the motive. That may have been the case around 5+ years ago when flagship Samsung phones were significantly cheaper than iPhones. Then Samsung (for example) moved away from plastic screens and chassis to glass and aluminum, the prices went up. Here in Australia the flagship iPhone 14 pro is from $1,899 with the flagship Samsung $1,949. With the Samsung fold at a whopping $2,499. A normal Samsung S23 and iPhone 14 both go for the same price. Of course we're just talking flagships, with both brands offering lower priced phones around that half price.
corysama 4y ago
Is this a repackaged "Megane X"? https://en.shiftall.net/products/meganex https://en.shiftall.net/products/meganex If so, that's great! Previously it looked like Shiftall had a great product, but no budget to bring it to a large market.
- ladberg 4y ago
  Doesn't look like it, the Megane X has inside-out tracking which the Beyond doesn't.
- koolala 4y ago
  It weighs twice as much.
Karsteski 4y ago
Very cool, don't care for the iPhone requirement for the custom fitting but I'm not sure how they'd get get around that since most people don't have an accurate 3D scanner just sitting around.
FloatArtifact 4y ago
Eye tracking is must for fauviated rendering
- dopidopHN 4y ago
  Foveated? It seems to be the orthography, nifty improvement yes.
  - FloatArtifact 4y ago
    Oh yes, speech to text can be a real pain in the VR
mpsprd 4y ago
I have a lot of respect for products taking bold decisions to excel in 1 axis, in this case weight. Going for fixed IPD and producing 15 different size displays this commitment. Compare this 127g to Valve index's 809g, anybody owning an headset knows the impact on immersion, especially mass away from the center of gravity (like the display)
ozten 4y ago
Being Mico OLED, this display has better blacks and a large dynamic range than Quest 2, Index, etc which are LED based.
ramesh31 4y ago
So they compromised FOV for a lighter headset. Not a great choice IMO. From using countless headsets, I can say the number one thing that distracts from presence is low FOV; far more so than bulkiness or wires. And presence is the goal above all else.
- modeless 4y ago
  Presence is not the only thing that matters for VR, once you get past short demos. Comfort is actually huge and this is clearly going to be the most comfortable headset available by a long way (once the hard strap is available). The spec sheet FOV may not be the absolute largest available, but it doesn't seem that compromised. FOV is tricky to measure and just looking at numbers to compare two headsets may not give the whole picture (pun intended). The custom fit and prescription optics allowing the lenses to be at the optimal position for your eyes without needing glasses may make the FOV better in practice than other headsets with a larger theoretical peak FOV which isn't achieved due to imperfect fit. Norm from Tested[1] and Brad Lynch[2] are two of the most knowledgeable and experienced VR reviewers out there and they've both used it and did not report that FOV was noticeably worse than Quest. The clarity of the optics, the resolution, and the contrast ratio will be much better and could easily make up for a couple of degrees of FOV. I'm surprised I haven't seen people talking about using this as a monitor replacement for laptops or desktops. People talked about it for Quest Pro but this has significantly more pixels per degree and is much more portable (for 3DOF use at least) and comfortable, which could address the biggest issues with Quest Pro for that use case. I would definitely buy this over Quest Pro if I was interested in monitor replacement. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z3k0T1mvahY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z3k0T1mvahY [2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yvih_ljVc_w https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yvih_ljVc_w
  - glumreaper 4y ago
    For monitor replacements there are already dedicated devices. Lenovo ThinkReality glasses for example: https://www.lenovo.com/us/en/thinkrealitya3 https://www.lenovo.com/us/en/thinkrealitya3
    - 4y ago
ianbutler 4y ago
This makes me want to try and prototype something I've been thinking about for a while. Keep the lens and display assembly + tracking cameras on headset but power and computing is USB-C to an android device. So same concept software wise as the Go but not strapping a phone to your face. With pancake lens and all I think you'd get a very thin and light headset with the same computing power as a Quest 2 with a better profile and something people might actually be comfortable wearing for many hours.
- corv 4y ago
  Like the Nreal Air?
- neodymiumphish 4y ago
  Not to mention upgradeability from a graphics perspective. If your phone is the processing unit , this would also mean software that's almost always up to date. I hate that I get hit with an update about half the time that I put the headset on.
  - chaostheory 4y ago
    This issue with going this route is that smart phones are about to lose a physical connection port. At least the Apple ones will be first, but more will follow.
- modeless 4y ago
  Magic Leap has a "compute puck" like this. Apple's headset was also rumored to tether to iPhones. I'm not sure what the most current rumor is.
  - chaostheory 4y ago
    The current rumor with the Apple headset is that it will be standalone and Apple will sell it at cost at $3000. It will run on an M chip though so they can justify it. No controllers needed. Supposedly, Ive’s last decision was to kill the puck or hub which is why Apple’s headset is shipping so late, but the new rumors dispute that
koolala 4y ago
It looks amazing - an uncanny leap into the next gen computer displays. Can't wait till the leap after! This headset could be the beginning of normal computer users (like Hacker News readers) starting to use XR displays. Maybe... we are 1 headset away but we are close!
yieldcrv 4y ago
I'm glad people are using "resolution" terms again, it was super cringe when enthusiasts were justifying low quality visuals by saying the terms were different. old headset criticism: "hey the resolution is pretty bad" its not resolution bro, headsets use this other term that doesn't address your actual observation at all. fun fact, nobody cares! so now we have high quality visuals, the same quirky new terms that more closely match some technological aspect that nobody cares about, and equivalent resolution terms that manage expectations pretty perfectly!
- scheeseman486 4y ago
  Raw panel resolution remains a pretty useless number on it's own since it doesn't take into account field of vision which can radically effect perceived sharpness, nor the quality of the optics. 2.5K per eye is impressive but not new, it's the quality of the optics and form factor that are the differentiators here.
- charcircuit 4y ago
  >"hey the resolution is pretty bad" its not resolution bro, headsets use this other term that doesn't address your actual observation at all. That's backwards. PPD (pixels per degree) and MTF (modulation transform function) are much better measurements to use to compare the optics between different headsets because they actually measure the resolution and sharpness that your eyes actually see instead of just the resolution of one part of the optics stack. >fun fact, nobody cares! This is true. Resolution numbers are purely for marketing purely because people think bigger number = better product. >and equivalent resolution terms 2560x2560 tells you nothing about if the actual image is a blurry mess or if there is screen door effect. It doesn't tell you if that resolution is being spread over a small portion of your view to be super high resolution or if it's being stretched over your entire field of view for an okay resolution.
terrycody 4y ago
So excited for the future VR products like this! Btw, does it consider the myopia users?
- wlll 4y ago
  Most VR headsets allow you to wear glasses, this one no idea. I've had a couple of VR headsets and am -6.5 each eye, no issue with glasses myself. There are some places that do custom lenses for the popular headset models too but I've never tried them. If you're excited for VR products I recommend checking out the existing competition. My old Valve Index (sold to help pay for a boat), has been available for a few years now and is comparable. Different refresh, resolution etc. and importantly a higher FOV. Were I in the market I'd probably consider another Index over this.
  - AnIdiotOnTheNet 4y ago
    > Most VR headsets allow you to wear glasses "Allow". Trust me, these things are not at all designed to be worn over glasses. It is uncomfortable as fuck and getting everything aligned properly so you can actually see is a pain too. Buying prescription inserts is basically a requirement if you can't manage without your glasses.
    - wlll 4y ago
      > "Allow". Trust me, these things are not at all designed to be worn over glasses. It is uncomfortable as fuck and getting everything aligned properly so you can actually see is a pain too. I don't need to trust you, I've owned three headsets so far, an Oculus Rift DK2, a HTC Vive and a Valve Index. I have a fairly large head (to the extent that many glasses don't fit me) and yet have never had an issue with glasses in any of the headsets. I also have -6.5 in each eye so can't use the headsets without vision correction. It's not as convenient as not wearing glasses for sure, I had to guide the glasses into place in the headset, but I've played hundreds of hours of games in each headset, including many multi-hour stints in Fallout 4 VR which requires a lot of movement and Elite: Dangerous, and wearing glasses just wasn't an issue. > Buying prescription inserts is basically a requirement if you can't manage without your glasses. My experience would suggest it's not a requirement at all.
kekkidy 4y ago
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yodon 4y ago
I don't understand the logic of the custom face fitting step. Sure, it's nerdcool and might get you a slightly better fit to your face, but it makes it much harder for people to try their friend's headset and say "whoa! I need one too!" Optimizing for virality as a consumer product designer is pretty much always the right business decision.
- stephc_int13 4y ago
  They very likely took that into account. This is a design tradeoff. The few times I tried VR headsets I have to say that I was annoyed by the adjustments and the cheap/weak materials that was used, also I noticed some drift after a very short time (likely due to wear for a demo headset, but still) Not sure if custom made is necessary, but like with any eye wear, the correct size and alignment should probably be built into the device itself, it is more practical and durable.
- theschwa 4y ago
  I believe they've said that this was a choice to reduce the size and the weight, and it lets them bring the device closer to the users face. It also means that it can stay comfortably with just the one strap.
- peteforde 4y ago
  It's not just a custom face fitting; they also take your lens prescription and craft a unit that is specifically for you. I haven't been anywhere near one of these units, yet, but I found this explanation highly compelling: https://youtu.be/mieWJ9vupqw?t=228 https://youtu.be/mieWJ9vupqw?t=228
zmmmmm 4y ago
This is just the beginning of the wave of next gen headsets that are employing microOLED + pancake lenses, both technical breakthroughs that have only become available recently in the VR / AR space. Expect to see a lot more like this over the next 6-12 months (including Apple), especially once XR2 gen2 chips are widely available (this one not requiring it because it's entirely dependent on an attached PC). In fact, to some extent, I would say what we are seeing now is a rush to forward-announce by those trying to get in ahead of the big players that will be rolling out this tech. Hence why shipping is in Q3. This is one of the reasons why I think the people discounting VR/AR are misguided or at least basing their thinking on incorrect assumptions. These breakthroughs will fundmentally change some aspects of the value proposition.
- stephc_int13 4y ago
  I think you are right about the timing strategy and about the tech improvements. Displays and optics have been some of the blockers. 6DOF tracking seems to be mostly solved (albeit in a very costly manner) and seemingly settled on inside-out tracking. Controls are IMHO a very weak point with no clear line of sight path to a solution. Software could help, but so far I think that poor engineering did not help to highlight the hardware qualities of the various prototype we've seen (I've not tried everything but I would not call any of those a mass-market product) Industrial design could be the magic sauce, this is why people have been hoping for Apple to save the day. Given their recent track record I am not convinced this will happen.
  - threeseed 4y ago
    Apple can bring far more than just industrial design. a) Have acquired [1] a ridiculous number of AR/VR companies including Limbak [2] who have conceptual lens designs which are far better than anything on the market today. b) Proven supply chain and expertise with LiDAR, MicroLED, Photonics, Glass, Custom Silicon, Batteries, Power Management, Wearable Fabrics etc. c) Up to version 6 of their ARKit SDK [3] and decade of experience in building ultra low power operating systems e.g. Secure Enclave OS, watchOS etc. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_mergers_and_acquisitions_by_Apple https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_mergers_and_acquisitio... [2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dIr4Em03B5s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dIr4Em03B5s [3] https://developer.apple.com/augmented-reality/arkit/ https://developer.apple.com/augmented-reality/arkit/
TaylorAlexander 4y ago
Nice video overview of this headset from "Sadly its Bradley", a youtuber who has been testing this product under NDA for a couple years. Bradley has a lot of insider knowledge and makes good videos. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yvih_ljVc_w https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yvih_ljVc_w
- anonred 4y ago
  Worth calling out that Bradley has insider info partially because he bribes engineers at VR companies to leak stuff like full CAD models of unreleased headsets.
  - agar 4y ago
    Worth calling out that Bradley has denied that claim entirely. > The source in question came to me with a prepared information package. I did not personally seek out this person or attempt to bribe or entice them into leaking trade secrets. Full clarification post here: https://twitter.com/SadlyItsBradley/status/1625197883308838942 https://twitter.com/SadlyItsBradley/status/16251978833088389...
    - SquareWheel 4y ago
      This is perhaps the wrong question, but how is it that he was able to create such a long tweet?
      - charcircuit 4y ago
        Twitter has a subscription that you can buy which gives you extra perks like longer tweets.
        ChrisRR 4y ago
        Woah twitter 2.0 is really here guys.
        SquareWheel 4y ago
Kukumber 4y ago
with more and more tech being put next to the brain i wonder if we'll see an increase of brain cancer cases this decade..
hatsunearu 4y ago
Wow, I'm usually patient through slow "reveal" videos but I was surprised to feel disgust at how slow the pacing of that video is within 5 seconds. The very first non-black half second where it just showed the outline subconsciously triggered something that made me realize that this video is going to have terrible pacing.
- purplecats 4y ago
  odd, i felt the same way at that specific moment! i did end up enjoying the rest of the video though.
ranguna 4y ago
90° FOV is a no go for me. I already have a bit of imertion break on the index, these would just feel like crap. Wake me up when we have at least 180 without early adopter prices.

170 points by dmarcos 4y ago

To summarize for anyone not wanting to click around their website: - $999 - Molded to your face - 2560 × 2560 per eye (higher than the HP Reverb and nearly every other headset, lower than PIMAX 8K) - 90° × 93° FOV (lower than most other headsets) - 127g (excluding strap/cord, MUCH lighter than any existing headset) - Does not come with controllers or trackers (compatible with existing lighthouses, bring your own)

CursedUrn 4y ago
Wow, that's an astonishing improvement in weight compared to other VR headsets. Here's Meta's line-up for comparison: https://i.imgur.com/JoTt10p.png https://i.imgur.com/JoTt10p.png
- rpdillon 4y ago
  Meta's lineup isn't a fair comparison IMO, since those include significant compute power to a actually run the software, battery, inside out tracking, and are completely untethered, all for about half of what this costs. This is a tethered display that relies on separate controllers, lighthouses, and computation. That said, lightweight is awesome. I think getting weight out of the headset is going to be really important for any sort of casual use of VR, but I don't think this product is good example of that, just because of all the other requirements.
  - sandworm101 4y ago
    I'll pay the extra to keep my face free of meta stickers. I don't care to share my viewing habits with that beast.
    - stephc_int13 4y ago
      Same, I would not buy/use any Meta product if I can choose. I have a very mild interest in VR but if the tech really improves this is something I could try. Past experiences have been disappointing.
      - smoldesu 4y ago
        It's not very likely anyone will offer a privacy conscious VR product, at least any more than we have now. You can run a relatively "Open" VR stack with Proton and Linux, but that's not really marketable to major audiences. Even selling it to Windows users didn't really work. The last chances of a truly privacy-respecting VR experience dried up when "The Industry" walked away from OpenXR and other efforts to treat VR like a first-class technology and not a toy. Maybe not the worst choice in hindsight, but it's also the one that lead us down this road of "product-ized" virtual reality.
        CursedUrn 4y ago
        There is a big difference between Facebook having cameras inside your house and someone like Valve. We know that Valve makes money primarily from software sales, whereas Facebook's core business is collecting user data for targeted advertising, so you know they will taking advantage of every camera and microphone you give them. Facebook also has a terrible ethical history: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_Facebook https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_Facebook
        smoldesu 4y ago
        Well, we need "someone like Valve" to make Open VR a reality at-scale. Otherwise it's just going to become another ad-infested content pipeline.
ben174 4y ago
I do believe one of the reasons VR has been slow to gain traction is because of the bulkiness/awkwardness of the headsets. This definitely takes care of the weight, but it still looks ridiculous. I don't foresee people sitting on the train wearing these. The right headset is around the corner, but this isn't it.
- dvngnt_ 4y ago
  unless i lived in a very low crime rate area like japan, i would never wear a vr headset on the train
- rajman187 4y ago
  Anecdotal but I was on a flight recently and the fellow seated behind me brought his Quest2 for the flight. He said it was much better for watching movies than the poor quality of the in-flight screens. Makes sense since you can also download movies via Netflix or Amazon Prime
- crazygringo 4y ago
  Sure you're not gonna wear one on your commute. But on a long-distance train or a long plane flight? I could totally see people reclining and wearing this to watch TV and movies. (Honestly, the gigantic IMAX-sized cinema screen in VR is kind of the killer app nobody is talking about. Not to mention it's the highest quality 3D movie experience you can get, if you want to watch something like Avatar.) Obviously nobody's going to be playing games on a VR headset on public transportation, at least not ones that require moving controllers in space.
  - llampx 4y ago
    I actually asked for experiences of people with VR headsets for movie watching. No one said they would recommend it. I was kind of surprised. Do you think they are good for that use case?
    - crazygringo 4y ago
      They're amazing. You really need to have the right software though. I've got a Quest 2, and the app to use is Skybox, and I watch stuff over SMB on my local NAS. The key things are being able to adjust the size of the screen and the angle of the screen. I can literally lie on my back on bed and watch TV on the ceiling. And the visual quality tends to be somewhere between 720p and 1080p -- you can make the screen big enough to resolve all 1080p detail, but it's kind of too large at that point. I think I mostly watch around an "850p" level of detail. I also watch it with my AirPods Pro paired up, and the app lets me manually adjust the audio sync by 100 ms to compensate for the Bluetooth delay. Watching TV through various specific apps can be more hit or miss, as they won't allow you to adjust the angle of the screen for example, so you can watch comfortably while reclining, or the Bluetooth audio delay. I assume they'll all figure this stuff out eventually. So the tech is absolutely all there, but the UX can be very app-dependent.
potatolicious 4y ago
> "- Does not come with controllers or trackers (compatible with existing lighthouses, bring your own)" This feels like a dealbreaker for me, and I should be firmly in the target demo for this product (PC VR user, flight sim enjoyer) - putting up Lighthouses on my walls so I can do some basic VR gaming is IMO a pretty tall order. There's a really good reason inside-out tracking has practically fully displaced stuff that requires you to install new stuff in a room.
- buggy6257 4y ago
  I have a vive, and my lighthouses are on collapsible tripods that sit in corners of my living room when i'm playing. Takes ~5 min of time to set both up, point them in the right direction, and setup room boundaries in Steam. Works really well, if you prefer to do it that way! I think I would still prefer inside-out tracking, but I have very specific reasons for only using the Vive, so that's what I'm stuck with. I think it's a problem that can easily be overcome if you're interested in this headset, without having to drill holes into walls! It's definitely an extra expense though. However, if their whole goal was "smallest lightest headset" then you can't really blame them for removing every single piece of tech from the headset they possibly could and outsourcing it to another device to maintain that claim. The right call? I dunno. But if this headset can be a drop-in replacement for my Vive one, I will buy the hell out of that. It's a strict upgrade for me with basically no extra expenditure of effort/money beyond the cost of the headset. To each their own though!
  - potatolicious 4y ago
    > "However, if their whole goal was "smallest lightest headset" then you can't really blame them for removing every single piece of tech from the headset they possibly could and outsourcing it to another device to maintain that claim." Sure you can - IMO (and of course reasonable minds can disagree) - you can surely blame a product when they've optimized to the point of going below-MVP. I get the desire to be smaller and lighter than the rest, but IMO inside-out is table stakes and is part of the "minimum viable" requirement... I've seen the portable lighthouse setups, but IMO that's even worse. I've done the lighthouse setup back when it was I had the Oculus CV1 - and those didn't even need to be positioned high on the walls, and IMO it was a huge pain the ass. I think I ended up using them a total of 5 times because of how much fiddling was required to get into VR. PCVR is already a vanishingly small market, this particular quirk of the spec IMO puts the product below minimum viability.
dTal 4y ago
So "lightest ever VR headset" is a lie. The LG R100 pips it at 113 grams. It's inferior in every other respect, but that wasn't the claim...
- CrimsonRain 4y ago
  By that logic, a sunglass with 3D stickers is even lighter
  - dTal 4y ago
    Not really. They're qualitatively the same product: a head mounted binocular USB-C display with accelerometers/gyros. It's much easier to make such a thing than a full tracking VR system. If this is a VR headset, then so is the LG R100. (Admittedly this product does include lighthouse sensors, slightly reducing the amount of third party equipment you need to implement a 6dof system.)
    - ladberg 4y ago
      IMU-based and lighthouse-based 6DOF tracking are so far apart in fidelity that the LG R100 is unusable for anything beyond watching videos and I wouldn’t consider it a real player in the VR space.
dmonitor 4y ago
should also mention: 90Hz refresh rate <144Hz sounds suboptimal for a VR headset

rpdillon 4y ago

Interesting. Lightweight, $1000, iPhone only (for face scanning), but tying into the SteamVR/Index ecosystem. No inside-out tracking. They advertise shareability via magnetically removable foam, but also say they've reduced weight by making 15 different versions for IPDs between 58mm and 72mm, suggesting sharing will only work well among those with similar IPDs. Not super compelling IMHO unless you own a modern iPhone and you're already heavily invested in a gaming PC and the Steam ecosystem (which, admittedly, many are!)

ladberg 4y ago
To clarify, the face scanning part can be done with a friend's iPhone and it's a one-time thing.
- MikusR 4y ago
  It still requires you to have a friend and have a friend with the specific iPhone.
  - adammarples 4y ago
    Or be anywhere near an apple store. How else would you rather they took a custom face scan
    - MikusR 4y ago
      You know that apple stores are not in every country?
  - dymk 4y ago
    "specific" being any iphone made in the last 4 years (iPhone XR)
reaperducer 4y ago
a modern iPhone It uses an iPhone XR or above. The XR was released five years ago.
4y ago

meltyness 4y ago

- Wired - 90 FOV No thanks! Compelling though, if your use-case is viewing 2D content on virtual screens -- the metaverse app Bigscreen makes, a virtual environment for sharing 2D content.

dougmwne 4y ago

Bigscreen is a VR app that’s been on the market for quite a few years. It focuses on VR movie watching in virtual theaters with other people. It works “ok” with current gen headsets. It feels like going to the movies wearing heavy ski goggles. The weight, comfort, resolution and optics of current VR headsets are not there yet. Looks like they sat down and designed the perfect VR headset that would showcase the experience they always wanted users to have in their app.

ben174 4y ago
One cool often overlooked thing about BigScreen VR is the fact that 3D movies work perfectly. It's a great experience watching a 3D movie on a giant virtual screen.
ozten 4y ago
I've rented a few 3D movies. The biggest limitation for me was the limited catalog and my dis-interest in action movies. It is such a great solo watching experience, I would spend more money on a more diverse catalog.
iinnPP 4y ago
There's a player called HereSphere that works a whole lot better than any other VR video player on the market. Nothing I have tried comes even close to the level of smoothness, even over SMB on a crappy external drive. https://heresphere.itch.io/heresphere-vr-video-player-quest-2 https://heresphere.itch.io/heresphere-vr-video-player-quest-... The demo is limited only by a nag screen if you want to check it out.
- ancientworldnow 4y ago
  The big sell on bigscreen is you can watch the videos with friends (and their avatars) in the theater. It's a social experience first and a video player second.

christiangenco 4y ago

Bigscreen VR is the most disappointing VR app I've ever used. Please stop wasting time making hardware and make your app better. I see the potential and I experience the need regularly: I want to watch movies with friends remotely in a cool VR environment that feels like we're watching together in a theater. In practice my options are to: - pay to watch "a vast movie selection" of 140 films, the majority of which are anime[1] - run the buggy (and so aptly named) Bigscreen Beta PC client[2] which will probably crash during weird unlikely edge cases like your screensaver turning on and critically depends on your internet upload speed for a good movie watching experience for everyone. Get ready for frequent "wait is it showing a black screen for you guys?" troubleshooting. It only runs on beefy PCs right now but don't worry: a macOS version is being worked on circa 2019[3]. - send the video file to everyone and get them to download it to a folder of their headset (which involves running Android File Transfer; nontechnical friends will struggle) then start a shared room. Arguably the least painful option with the best overall quality. When it works though it's so good. Watching a film in Bigscreen feels like watching a film in an actual theater. Their drawing and popcorn throwing features are hilarious and fun. Their spacial audio is a blast. Their selection of virtual theaters is plentiful. Here's the experience I want to watch a film with friends in Bigscreen: - log into my Netflix/Hulu/Disney+ account through Bigscreen - create a new room - pick a movie - share an invite code I understand for that to work Bigscreen would need to make complicated partnerships happen, so in the meanwhile I'd like to be able to: - drag and drop a video file into bigscreen.com/newroom - see an invite code I can join from my headset and share with other people Please someone create this experience. You can use WebXR[4] to do the whole thing with the web stack you already know and you could probably just download a ready-made 3D model of a movie theater[5]. 1. https://www.bigscreenvr.com/movies/catalog https://www.bigscreenvr.com/movies/catalog 2. https://store.steampowered.com/app/457550/Bigscreen_Beta/ https://store.steampowered.com/app/457550/Bigscreen_Beta/ 3. https://www.reddit.com/r/OculusQuest/comments/c7kx2n/bigscreen_vr_and_macos/ https://www.reddit.com/r/OculusQuest/comments/c7kx2n/bigscre... 4. https://immersiveweb.dev/ https://immersiveweb.dev/ 5. https://www.turbosquid.com/Search/3D-Models/free/theater https://www.turbosquid.com/Search/3D-Models/free/theater

layer8 4y ago
> the majority of which are anime[1] I don’t see any anime on that page. Would actually be a plus for me.

vyrotek 4y ago

These look light enough and have high enough resolution per-eye to possibly use them as a PC monitor.

abracadaniel 4y ago
I feel like that would be my killer app to get me into the space. But I wonder if it’s worse for your eyes than staring at a monitor all day, or if the optics make it no different because you’re still focusing at a distance.
- pivo 4y ago
  Good point! With a monitor you can easily glance away and focus on objects in the distance to exercise your eye muscles, something my eye doctor always has recommended. Probably not so easily done with these, which means it won't happen as often. That said, I'd love to have something like this that's compact and provides the equivalent of a big, 4K or better, monitor. It's also too big of a gamble for me to plonk down $1K to find out, and it looks like it won't support an M1 MacBook Pro due to the video card requirements anyway, so I'll have to wait.
mrguyorama 4y ago
That's the entire business of the company behind this headset, which is why this headset makes the compromises it does.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

rideontime 4y ago

The face-scanned insert sounds nice. Can you just sell me one of those for my $300* Quest 2? *when I purchased mine

dvngnt_ 4y ago

Only 90hz though which is less than the valve index, but it has a higher resolution

tmikaeld 4y ago
Maybe it's a limitation of Displayport?

rapnie 4y ago

"An Apple iPhone XR or newer is required for the 3D Face Scan. Bigscreen Beyond is manufactured based on this 3D Face Scan, and cannot be manufactured without it. If you do not own an iPhone, you can complete your 3D Face Scan by borrowing a friend's iPhone or using an iPhone at an Apple Store."

Karsteski 4y ago
A bit of an insane requirement honestly. I guess they're assuming their target demographic would be wealthy enough to either have an iPhone, or be around people who would have an iPhone? Kinda rubs me the wrong way still, even though I'd be able to get it done if I so choose...
- threeseed 4y ago
  They are using the FaceID depth sensors. And right now the only phone with them and that has a usable API is apparently the iPhone. This was covered in a walkthrough with a VR YouTuber: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yvih_ljVc_w https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yvih_ljVc_w
- jjcm 4y ago
  Is it insane if it's for a custom mold? Personally I would rather borrow a friend's phone than go into a physical store for a scan or have them send me a plaster mold kit.
- NoPicklez 4y ago
  It rubs me the wrong way this continued idea that only the wealthy have an iPhone, or atleast it does when people just assume that's the motive. That may have been the case around 5+ years ago when flagship Samsung phones were significantly cheaper than iPhones. Then Samsung (for example) moved away from plastic screens and chassis to glass and aluminum, the prices went up. Here in Australia the flagship iPhone 14 pro is from $1,899 with the flagship Samsung $1,949. With the Samsung fold at a whopping $2,499. A normal Samsung S23 and iPhone 14 both go for the same price. Of course we're just talking flagships, with both brands offering lower priced phones around that half price.

corysama 4y ago

Is this a repackaged "Megane X"? https://en.shiftall.net/products/meganex https://en.shiftall.net/products/meganex If so, that's great! Previously it looked like Shiftall had a great product, but no budget to bring it to a large market.

ladberg 4y ago
Doesn't look like it, the Megane X has inside-out tracking which the Beyond doesn't.
koolala 4y ago
It weighs twice as much.

Karsteski 4y ago

Very cool, don't care for the iPhone requirement for the custom fitting but I'm not sure how they'd get get around that since most people don't have an accurate 3D scanner just sitting around.

FloatArtifact 4y ago

Eye tracking is must for fauviated rendering

dopidopHN 4y ago
Foveated? It seems to be the orthography, nifty improvement yes.
- FloatArtifact 4y ago
  Oh yes, speech to text can be a real pain in the VR

mpsprd 4y ago

I have a lot of respect for products taking bold decisions to excel in 1 axis, in this case weight. Going for fixed IPD and producing 15 different size displays this commitment. Compare this 127g to Valve index's 809g, anybody owning an headset knows the impact on immersion, especially mass away from the center of gravity (like the display)

ozten 4y ago

Being Mico OLED, this display has better blacks and a large dynamic range than Quest 2, Index, etc which are LED based.

ramesh31 4y ago

So they compromised FOV for a lighter headset. Not a great choice IMO. From using countless headsets, I can say the number one thing that distracts from presence is low FOV; far more so than bulkiness or wires. And presence is the goal above all else.

modeless 4y ago
Presence is not the only thing that matters for VR, once you get past short demos. Comfort is actually huge and this is clearly going to be the most comfortable headset available by a long way (once the hard strap is available). The spec sheet FOV may not be the absolute largest available, but it doesn't seem that compromised. FOV is tricky to measure and just looking at numbers to compare two headsets may not give the whole picture (pun intended). The custom fit and prescription optics allowing the lenses to be at the optimal position for your eyes without needing glasses may make the FOV better in practice than other headsets with a larger theoretical peak FOV which isn't achieved due to imperfect fit. Norm from Tested[1] and Brad Lynch[2] are two of the most knowledgeable and experienced VR reviewers out there and they've both used it and did not report that FOV was noticeably worse than Quest. The clarity of the optics, the resolution, and the contrast ratio will be much better and could easily make up for a couple of degrees of FOV. I'm surprised I haven't seen people talking about using this as a monitor replacement for laptops or desktops. People talked about it for Quest Pro but this has significantly more pixels per degree and is much more portable (for 3DOF use at least) and comfortable, which could address the biggest issues with Quest Pro for that use case. I would definitely buy this over Quest Pro if I was interested in monitor replacement. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z3k0T1mvahY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z3k0T1mvahY [2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yvih_ljVc_w https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yvih_ljVc_w
- glumreaper 4y ago
  For monitor replacements there are already dedicated devices. Lenovo ThinkReality glasses for example: https://www.lenovo.com/us/en/thinkrealitya3 https://www.lenovo.com/us/en/thinkrealitya3
  - 4y ago

ianbutler 4y ago

This makes me want to try and prototype something I've been thinking about for a while. Keep the lens and display assembly + tracking cameras on headset but power and computing is USB-C to an android device. So same concept software wise as the Go but not strapping a phone to your face. With pancake lens and all I think you'd get a very thin and light headset with the same computing power as a Quest 2 with a better profile and something people might actually be comfortable wearing for many hours.

corv 4y ago
Like the Nreal Air?
neodymiumphish 4y ago
Not to mention upgradeability from a graphics perspective. If your phone is the processing unit , this would also mean software that's almost always up to date. I hate that I get hit with an update about half the time that I put the headset on.
- chaostheory 4y ago
  This issue with going this route is that smart phones are about to lose a physical connection port. At least the Apple ones will be first, but more will follow.
modeless 4y ago
Magic Leap has a "compute puck" like this. Apple's headset was also rumored to tether to iPhones. I'm not sure what the most current rumor is.
- chaostheory 4y ago
  The current rumor with the Apple headset is that it will be standalone and Apple will sell it at cost at $3000. It will run on an M chip though so they can justify it. No controllers needed. Supposedly, Ive’s last decision was to kill the puck or hub which is why Apple’s headset is shipping so late, but the new rumors dispute that

koolala 4y ago

It looks amazing - an uncanny leap into the next gen computer displays. Can't wait till the leap after! This headset could be the beginning of normal computer users (like Hacker News readers) starting to use XR displays. Maybe... we are 1 headset away but we are close!

yieldcrv 4y ago

I'm glad people are using "resolution" terms again, it was super cringe when enthusiasts were justifying low quality visuals by saying the terms were different. old headset criticism: "hey the resolution is pretty bad" its not resolution bro, headsets use this other term that doesn't address your actual observation at all. fun fact, nobody cares! so now we have high quality visuals, the same quirky new terms that more closely match some technological aspect that nobody cares about, and equivalent resolution terms that manage expectations pretty perfectly!

scheeseman486 4y ago
Raw panel resolution remains a pretty useless number on it's own since it doesn't take into account field of vision which can radically effect perceived sharpness, nor the quality of the optics. 2.5K per eye is impressive but not new, it's the quality of the optics and form factor that are the differentiators here.
charcircuit 4y ago
>"hey the resolution is pretty bad" its not resolution bro, headsets use this other term that doesn't address your actual observation at all. That's backwards. PPD (pixels per degree) and MTF (modulation transform function) are much better measurements to use to compare the optics between different headsets because they actually measure the resolution and sharpness that your eyes actually see instead of just the resolution of one part of the optics stack. >fun fact, nobody cares! This is true. Resolution numbers are purely for marketing purely because people think bigger number = better product. >and equivalent resolution terms 2560x2560 tells you nothing about if the actual image is a blurry mess or if there is screen door effect. It doesn't tell you if that resolution is being spread over a small portion of your view to be super high resolution or if it's being stretched over your entire field of view for an okay resolution.

terrycody 4y ago

So excited for the future VR products like this! Btw, does it consider the myopia users?

wlll 4y ago
Most VR headsets allow you to wear glasses, this one no idea. I've had a couple of VR headsets and am -6.5 each eye, no issue with glasses myself. There are some places that do custom lenses for the popular headset models too but I've never tried them. If you're excited for VR products I recommend checking out the existing competition. My old Valve Index (sold to help pay for a boat), has been available for a few years now and is comparable. Different refresh, resolution etc. and importantly a higher FOV. Were I in the market I'd probably consider another Index over this.
- AnIdiotOnTheNet 4y ago
  > Most VR headsets allow you to wear glasses "Allow". Trust me, these things are not at all designed to be worn over glasses. It is uncomfortable as fuck and getting everything aligned properly so you can actually see is a pain too. Buying prescription inserts is basically a requirement if you can't manage without your glasses.
  - wlll 4y ago
    > "Allow". Trust me, these things are not at all designed to be worn over glasses. It is uncomfortable as fuck and getting everything aligned properly so you can actually see is a pain too. I don't need to trust you, I've owned three headsets so far, an Oculus Rift DK2, a HTC Vive and a Valve Index. I have a fairly large head (to the extent that many glasses don't fit me) and yet have never had an issue with glasses in any of the headsets. I also have -6.5 in each eye so can't use the headsets without vision correction. It's not as convenient as not wearing glasses for sure, I had to guide the glasses into place in the headset, but I've played hundreds of hours of games in each headset, including many multi-hour stints in Fallout 4 VR which requires a lot of movement and Elite: Dangerous, and wearing glasses just wasn't an issue. > Buying prescription inserts is basically a requirement if you can't manage without your glasses. My experience would suggest it's not a requirement at all.

kekkidy 4y ago

[dead]

yodon 4y ago

I don't understand the logic of the custom face fitting step. Sure, it's nerdcool and might get you a slightly better fit to your face, but it makes it much harder for people to try their friend's headset and say "whoa! I need one too!" Optimizing for virality as a consumer product designer is pretty much always the right business decision.

stephc_int13 4y ago
They very likely took that into account. This is a design tradeoff. The few times I tried VR headsets I have to say that I was annoyed by the adjustments and the cheap/weak materials that was used, also I noticed some drift after a very short time (likely due to wear for a demo headset, but still) Not sure if custom made is necessary, but like with any eye wear, the correct size and alignment should probably be built into the device itself, it is more practical and durable.
theschwa 4y ago
I believe they've said that this was a choice to reduce the size and the weight, and it lets them bring the device closer to the users face. It also means that it can stay comfortably with just the one strap.
peteforde 4y ago
It's not just a custom face fitting; they also take your lens prescription and craft a unit that is specifically for you. I haven't been anywhere near one of these units, yet, but I found this explanation highly compelling: https://youtu.be/mieWJ9vupqw?t=228 https://youtu.be/mieWJ9vupqw?t=228

zmmmmm 4y ago

This is just the beginning of the wave of next gen headsets that are employing microOLED + pancake lenses, both technical breakthroughs that have only become available recently in the VR / AR space. Expect to see a lot more like this over the next 6-12 months (including Apple), especially once XR2 gen2 chips are widely available (this one not requiring it because it's entirely dependent on an attached PC). In fact, to some extent, I would say what we are seeing now is a rush to forward-announce by those trying to get in ahead of the big players that will be rolling out this tech. Hence why shipping is in Q3. This is one of the reasons why I think the people discounting VR/AR are misguided or at least basing their thinking on incorrect assumptions. These breakthroughs will fundmentally change some aspects of the value proposition.

stephc_int13 4y ago
I think you are right about the timing strategy and about the tech improvements. Displays and optics have been some of the blockers. 6DOF tracking seems to be mostly solved (albeit in a very costly manner) and seemingly settled on inside-out tracking. Controls are IMHO a very weak point with no clear line of sight path to a solution. Software could help, but so far I think that poor engineering did not help to highlight the hardware qualities of the various prototype we've seen (I've not tried everything but I would not call any of those a mass-market product) Industrial design could be the magic sauce, this is why people have been hoping for Apple to save the day. Given their recent track record I am not convinced this will happen.
- threeseed 4y ago
  Apple can bring far more than just industrial design. a) Have acquired [1] a ridiculous number of AR/VR companies including Limbak [2] who have conceptual lens designs which are far better than anything on the market today. b) Proven supply chain and expertise with LiDAR, MicroLED, Photonics, Glass, Custom Silicon, Batteries, Power Management, Wearable Fabrics etc. c) Up to version 6 of their ARKit SDK [3] and decade of experience in building ultra low power operating systems e.g. Secure Enclave OS, watchOS etc. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_mergers_and_acquisitions_by_Apple https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_mergers_and_acquisitio... [2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dIr4Em03B5s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dIr4Em03B5s [3] https://developer.apple.com/augmented-reality/arkit/ https://developer.apple.com/augmented-reality/arkit/

TaylorAlexander 4y ago

Nice video overview of this headset from "Sadly its Bradley", a youtuber who has been testing this product under NDA for a couple years. Bradley has a lot of insider knowledge and makes good videos. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yvih_ljVc_w https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yvih_ljVc_w

anonred 4y ago
Worth calling out that Bradley has insider info partially because he bribes engineers at VR companies to leak stuff like full CAD models of unreleased headsets.
- agar 4y ago
  Worth calling out that Bradley has denied that claim entirely. > The source in question came to me with a prepared information package. I did not personally seek out this person or attempt to bribe or entice them into leaking trade secrets. Full clarification post here: https://twitter.com/SadlyItsBradley/status/1625197883308838942 https://twitter.com/SadlyItsBradley/status/16251978833088389...
  - SquareWheel 4y ago
    This is perhaps the wrong question, but how is it that he was able to create such a long tweet?
    - charcircuit 4y ago
      Twitter has a subscription that you can buy which gives you extra perks like longer tweets.
      - ChrisRR 4y ago
        Woah twitter 2.0 is really here guys.
      - SquareWheel 4y ago

Kukumber 4y ago

with more and more tech being put next to the brain i wonder if we'll see an increase of brain cancer cases this decade..

hatsunearu 4y ago

Wow, I'm usually patient through slow "reveal" videos but I was surprised to feel disgust at how slow the pacing of that video is within 5 seconds. The very first non-black half second where it just showed the outline subconsciously triggered something that made me realize that this video is going to have terrible pacing.

purplecats 4y ago
odd, i felt the same way at that specific moment! i did end up enjoying the rest of the video though.

ranguna 4y ago

90° FOV is a no go for me. I already have a bit of imertion break on the index, these would just feel like crap. Wake me up when we have at least 180 without early adopter prices.