58 ms·

CPSC calls for full recall of all Onewheel self-balancing electric skateboards

275 points by alden5 4y ago

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
salad-fan 4y ago
- bilsbie 4y ago
  Seems uncalled for.
  - salad-fan 4y ago
alden5 4y ago
onewheels suffer from a problem known as nosediving in which the board shuts off when it can't supply enough power to support the rider, as the board is self balancing this is a problem intrinsic to the board's form factor. The board works in a similar fashion to balancing something like an umbrella on your hand, as the rider leans forward it creates an imbalance that requires the board to accelerate in order to keep the rider upright. The only possible safety feature to prevent nosedives is to inform the rider that they're approaching the board's limits, this is done with "pushback" where the board elevates the nose making the rider uncomfortable, signaling that they should slow down. Newer boards are more aggressive with pushback, it's definitely a balancing act giving the user the most power from their board while also preventing them from nosediving, future motion faced significant backlash when their new flagship board implemented extremely strong pushback at a speed lower than a prior discontinued model
- aksss 4y ago
  Good summary. I would just add that "can't supply enough power" is a state the board can enter into either in lower battery levels or (more often) when a rider has put their center of mass too far forward, causing the board to work harder to stay under them, while also moving at a higher rate of speed or accelerating - the board can't give enough power to maintain this. Pushback is to be respected, but the user can also ignore it and carry on. It's literally the board telling you that you need to get ready to run if you don't stop, but many will just ignore and keep on keepin' on, often at speeds faster than they are capable of running. Watch this in action here: https://www.reddit.com/r/onewheel/comments/ywq655/the_scorpion_queen/ https://www.reddit.com/r/onewheel/comments/ywq655/the_scorpi... I've said before that Onewheels are the Lawn Darts of our generation, we're lucky to enjoy them before the nannies start taking our toys away. They are super fun though - so much fun.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - js2 4y ago
    When I was a teenager I rode my skateboard down a parking lot ramp when I realized I was going way too fast, was about to enter the street and the only way to bail was to jump off and run. It looked about like that video. I didn’t realize these one wheels have top speeds of 16-20 mph. That’s faster than most people can sprint. 16 mph is a 3:45 mile. 20 is a 3:00 mile. > we're lucky to enjoy them before the nannies start taking our toys away See also three wheelers: https://www.hotcars.com/this-is-why-the-3-wheeled-atv-was-banned-from-the-usa/ https://www.hotcars.com/this-is-why-the-3-wheeled-atv-was-ba... But I dunno, where do you draw the line? As a 50 year-old who makes a living typing I chose not to buy a table saw last year because I decided it was inherently a riskier tool that I ever wanted to use. I ended up with a track saw instead. I think that was a good decision but not sure it’s one I would have been wise enough to make in my younger years. Now I’m not advocating for banning table saws: my point is that Onewheel can put every warning and disclaimer in the world on their product and some people will still not appreciate the risks involved. That said, 4 deaths over 2 years doesn’t seem out of line with other products in the same category. I wonder if something else is going on to draw the CPSC’s ire.
1attice 4y ago
With thunderstorms, you count seconds 'twixt bolt and boom. With the current golden age of electrified last-mile transport, we're seeing the gap between innovation and regulation opening up wide -- now several years. Real-world impact: I routinely get up to speeds on my e-bike that are, quite simply, dangerous. It's not that I never hit 25 miles an hour on my old road bike, it's that I spend so much more time hanging out at ~25mph on my ebike that potholes have gone from annoyance to mortal danger. The risk is somewhat mitigated by the enormous tires and superior build quality on the braking system, but not entirely. I'm glad to have taken a motorcycle license training course, and heartily recommend that other early adopters think about voluntarily seeking out additional training (and I imagine e-* specific courses are available now, if not soon.) Not all good ideas come with mandates :D
- FpUser 4y ago
  >"heartily recommend that other early adopters think about voluntarily seeking out additional training" Alternatively one can stop being an idiot and ride at safe speed. I bet that "additional training" would require at least this kind of sanity
  - thomastjeffery 4y ago
    Safety is conditional to a lot more than speed.
    - 1attice 4y ago
      ...and yet the future continuity of your consciousness itself depends on at least a minimum-viable level of safety! What a diabolical tradeoff :D something-something anthropic principle
  - bombcar 4y ago
    People assume a "bike" is safe, and a "motorbike" can be dangerous, but there's no real difference between them. I've reached 35 MPH downhill under pedal power; if I had wiped out I would have been in a world of hurt, or dead, depending on how it had gone.
izzydata 4y ago
Do segways have a similar problem or is the vehicle large enough that it can always counter balance your weight?
- ars 4y ago
  I think the pole in the center prevents your body from leaning forward more than the Segway will tilt (i.e. it can just tilt backwards, and push your body back where it belongs). With the Onewheel you can just lean forward as much as you like, and the board is supposed to accelerate to bring your center of balance back into the middle.
- duskwuff 4y ago
  The Segway had a shorter platform, so the user wouldn't put it as far out of balance under typical use, and it had handlebars which allowed the user to pull it back if they started losing their balance. It also had a lower top speed of 10 mph (12.5 on later models); the Onewheel could run at 15-20+ mph. (I use the past tense because Segway production ended in 2020.)
  - jollyllama 4y ago
    It's a real shame that they've been forced to end production while these more dangerous technologies have proliferated.
    - duskwuff 4y ago
      "Forced" is a strong word. I don't think there was anything breathing down their neck to discontinue it, just market forces -- the semiconductor shortage of 2020 probably just pushed them over the edge into discontinuing what was already a low-demand product.
      - jollyllama 4y ago
        Yeah, I wasn't sure how else to word it.
- 4y ago
s17n 4y ago
I'd be curious to know how many onewheels have been sold - my guess is that 4 deaths represents a very high risk of death relative to eg snowboarding, but without a denominator, there's no way to know.
- bombcar 4y ago
  https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/50-million-miles-onewheel-achieves-micromobility-milestone-301309592.html https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/50-million-miles-on... and https://www.imarcgroup.com/one-wheel-electric-scooter-market https://www.imarcgroup.com/one-wheel-electric-scooter-market might be able to get a rough number.
  - mackmgg 4y ago
    4 deaths per 50 million miles means it’s just under 1 death per 10 million miles. That would put riding a one wheel for 1 mile at the same risk as biking 1 mile, walking 2 miles, or driving 25 miles[1]. That is of course only looking at death and not serious injury. Still, as other people have mentioned there are solutions Future Motion has been avoiding that would significantly lower the risk. Adding small wheels on each side in case of nosedives, or adding a loud audible warning in case of low battery or max speed being reached rather than just a subtle physical alert are two that have been suggested here and seem like they would make a big difference. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Micromort https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Micromort
  - frankus 4y ago
    It looks like most death rates for transportation products are measured in deaths per 100 million passenger miles. So 8 deaths seems like a reasonable estimate. By comparison, cars are about 1.5 deaths, and motorcycles are 25-30. For the car number, I'm willing to bet that OneWheel riders skew younger and male-er than the general driving population. I'd bet the risk difference mostly disappears if you're comparing similar demographics. For the motorcycle number, keep in mind that you can't legally ride a motorcycle without a license and some training and/or non-trivial testing. And most riders wear much more extensive PPE than the average OneWheel rider. And they're still at something like 300–400% of the risk. I think it kind of comes down to whether you think of a OneWheel as a toy, a recreational product, or a form of transportation. It's ridiculously unsafe compared with, say, a boardgame, and probably on par with recreational products like skateboards and jet skis, and somewhere in the middle between driving a car and riding a motorcycle for transportation.
taylorlapeyre 4y ago
The physics of Onewheels are actually super interesting, and Future Motion published an extremely well-made video recently which explains the issue that the CPSC is referring to. It goes into detail about why "nosedives" happen, and how to prevent them. Really interesting stuff! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WGn7iPN07XI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WGn7iPN07XI
- krackers 4y ago
  That's pretty impressive, do you know if this was produced by the company itself or just a licensed reupload of a video by someone else?
  - wjamesg 4y ago
    Looks like the company itself
- toxik 4y ago
  It seems to me that the correct behavior to encourage braking from the user is TILT FORWARD, i.e., show that you are nearly at the limit but do it before you're outside of controllable phase space.
drcode 4y ago
There should be a place for adults to purchase equipment for dangerous hobbies, as long as the risks aren't covered up.
- unethical_ban 4y ago
  Agreed. If this is a problem inherent in the form factor, it should be advertised as such and we continue on, like we do with motorcycles, skateboards and so on.
  - closetohome 4y ago
    There are warnings on the box, in the manual, on a piece of cardboard you have to remove to ride the board, and laser marked on the board itself.
    - strix_varius 4y ago
      Disagree. All the warnings suggest rider error. I suspect that if they published, "We've determined that, on average, approximately once every N miles, a onewheel is likely to briefly fail to deliver power to its motor, throwing its rider at whatever speed it's moving," they would sell far fewer of these items.
      - closetohome 4y ago
        It's amazing how hard it is for people to take responsibility for the accidents they cause. Their first instinct is always to blame the board.
      - aksss 4y ago
        Yeah but that’s not the case. You see a lot of the injuries because people on Reddit and YouTube and discord like to show them off, but in grand scheme of things most of these riders will tell you they were being idiots (like riding drunk at night, pushing 30 down a hill, trying to hop curbs at speed, ignoring pushback, etc), and many hop back on their board as soon as they can. The few that weren’t being idiots, well a fraction were lousy or inattentive riders and some fraction suffered a failure. What you’re not seeing is all the riders and boards with zero problems.
easygenes 4y ago
It seems lax of CPSC to issue such a damning statement without an accompanying comparative analysis to other board or motor sports. What’s the injury rate vs other similar sports and how much of that is to blame from undereducated or reckless riders? Also, what’s the rationale for the recall if the issue is people ignoring the obvious warnings the thing is giving that the battery is about to die? This doesn’t seem to be a matter of system failures or inherent design flaws. Paramotoring is risky, but no one is chasing all paramotor manufacturers to recall their products. Similar for dirt bikes. It seems somehow these are getting singled out due to their uniqueness and being a product from a single company, not because there’s a flaw in the design that makes them inordinately risky.
- sometimeshuman 4y ago
  It's the single point of failure with no preventative maintenance plan that makes it more dangerous. When the power suddenly cut-out on my "one wheel" (it was a different brand) I was instantly airborne. I can inspect my skateboard periodically to ensure the wheels don't fall off. If my dirtbike engine suddenly cut-out I still have momentum and brakes. But with a onewheel the wheel slips behind you and you are smashing the pavement when the electronics fail. For the record, I love my recently purchased Onewheel Pint and installed fangs in case the power cuts out unexpectedly.
- mikestew 4y ago
  The device tips its nose forward and dumps its rider on their head. There is no need to compare to anything if a device has this behavior. If the battery runs out, I expect the device to come to a stop, not throw me on my ass. I'm pretty sure even a paramotoring rig that runs out of fuel isn't going to immediately hurt me, and those things fly.
  - aksss 4y ago
    It does come to a stop. You get thrown on your ass because of the laws of motion. Your last statement - are you talking about using a fan with a parasail, which is a stable glider without power? If you want to use that analogy, this is more akin to taking too sharp a turn in a parasail, where the sail can't sustain and collapses in, causing you to fall like a rock because of the law of gravity. In a nosedive on a Onewheel, it also happens when the rider is asking too much, goes outside the performance envelope, and reaches a failure point. After the rider has been warned by the board that it's approaching that edge, physically and audibly.
0_____0 4y ago
One issue I've noticed with these new forms of electric wheeled transport (longboard, transverse and longitudinal one-wheelers) is that the people riding them often don't come from a sports background. They aren't "safe" devices exactly - it takes skill to pilot them, and when things inevitably go awry, it takes good reflexes to avoid damage. Novices to action sports often throw their arms out to catch themselves when they bail instead of rolling through the fall. They also don't know how to navigate obstacles via strategic weighting and unweighting of their implement. The energies involved are also substantial -- to put it bluntly, some of these things fuckin' rip, which is super fun, but also makes safety gear a good idea. You can take a lot of trauma and abrasion bailing at 25mph+, potentially life-changing or fatal in the worst cases. There's a reason why downhill longboarders and an increasing number of electric wheel riders wear a fullface and leathers.
- taylodl 4y ago
  Yup - and by the time you don all the safety gear appropriate for motorcycle riding it's just not quite as much fun anymore, is it? Seriously though, you should at least be wearing a 3/4 helmet when riding these things and it wouldn't hurt to wear a riding jacket. It's all fun and games until you inevitably fall.
- deeblering4 4y ago
  Very true. If you've never been able to cruise on a skateboard, you might not realize how much damage an unexpected pebble or sidewalk crack will do. Riding is a constant balance of scanning the pavement for inconsistencies and making corrections to mitigate them. I don't know if that's even possible at 20+ mph.
  - 0_____0 4y ago
    Your latter point is why I'm not really sold on electric longboards. Your control authority on a longboard is pretty low, and you need a lot of control authority to react to surprise obstacles/maintain stability after encountering one. Sure, DH longboarders exceed 25mph regularly, but they ride in semi-controlled environments (scout the descent for gravel etc before hitting it) and are exceptionally skilled. Putting random noobs on electric longboards is a recipe for road rash and broken bones. A few years ago, three people in my office got Boosted boards, and I believe we saw two instances of pretty bad road rash and a broken bone among them.
thembones 4y ago
Never been able to understand why these don't come by default on the Onewheels: https://land-surf.com/products/new-fangs-gt-built-tough-to-roll-smooth https://land-surf.com/products/new-fangs-gt-built-tough-to-r... I put these on mine and love em. They work well and prevent exactly what's being described.
- birdman3131 4y ago
  But then it would be a 5 wheel.
  - unstatusthequo 4y ago
    Probably 3. I am not sure who puts them on both ends ;)
- alden5 4y ago
  I personally don't like fangs as when the bumper drags on the ground during a nosedive it slows the board down quickly, when I first nosedived at 3k miles the friction caused me to slow down to about 5mph before I had to run it out, I was going downhill and if I had fangs I would have continued accelerating, eventually you need to bail and with fangs wouldn't have been able to run it out.
- unstatusthequo 4y ago
  I have these. Not sure if they offer a false sense of security or not. But, to me, it increases the chances of me not having a catastrophic injury. I also don’t try to go 30mph downhill without protective gear. Full TSG Pass Pro helmet & wrist guards. Still fun.
robocat 4y ago
There's a heap of videos showing serious crashes on youtube. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Ys3ivCUxIvY https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Ys3ivCUxIvY is titled "OneWheel — The Deadliest EV" and it is was published two years ago. It shows many short clips of some crashes in the first minute, however, beware, it is very uncomfortable viewing if you empathise with accident victims (I don't watch American pratfall TV programming for the same reason). That video also talks about another design/usability flaw at 8 minutes 30.
jgalentine007 4y ago
They made 3-wheelers illegal, Onewheels seem not much safer.
themagician 4y ago
I can not believe it took this long. After trying one for a bit I always wanted to get one, but never felt fully safe riding it. I even asked them repeatedly if they ever had a plan to introduce a board with some kind of additional set of wheels or bearings on the ends to let you "roll out" in the event of a power failure. The issues has always been that, in the event of a loss of power for any reason, because you are usually leaning forward, the board grinds to an almost immediate stop and you just go flying. Happened to me once in the sand and even that hurt. The board basically decelerates to zero instantly. I thought long and hard about buying one and modifying the skid plates with a row of large ball bearings or maybe even small skateboard wheels. You just need something so that if the power fails you at least can attempt some kind of recovery. The way it is now, if the power fails, you are simply getting launched. I always wondered how they hadn't been sued into oblivion, always thinking to myself, "Someone must have died from this by now." I guess at least four people have… but somehow they've been able to produce and sell these for nearly a decade.
- evan_ 4y ago
  you can get a kit to put little casters on ("fangs") but since they lower the front end they can snag on stuff that wouldn't be a problem otherwise
- LeifCarrotson 4y ago
  Onewheel started with a 2014 Kickstarter with 400 units that had 5 miles of range and a 13 mph top speed. The 2017 XR and 2020 and later GT and Pint versions that can go 20+ miles at 20+ miles per hour are incredibly new as far as transportation tech goes. 2021, when the most recent death was reported, was literally just last year. That's light speed for a bureacracy. Technology is far faster than regulation - this is true with respect to Uber, Twitter, Onewheel, AirBNB, and a dozen other new tech companies.
julienb_sea 4y ago
This reminds me of the Juul ban, which flagrantly ignored the trivial availability of competing vape products. Then again, the Onewheel system is rather unique. I would be curious to see a safety comparison of Onewheel versus the much more common self-balancing unicycles.
teekert 4y ago
4 deaths in all those years? Much safer than most forms of transport then? Of course I didn’t do the math but it seems like very little, perhaps there also aren’t that many out there?
- advisedwang 4y ago
  "four reported deaths between ... after the product failed to balance the rider or suddenly stopped while in motion" These are deaths specifically from the scooter suddenly stopping mid-ride and throwing the rider off. It's not including deaths like getting hit by a car. This is the product spontaniously killing people!
  - easygenes 4y ago
    Yes, but it is unclear that there was a product failure involved in any of those cases. If the electronics failed that’s one thing. If the battery died because the user ignored it repeatedly haptically nagging them that the battery would die soon, that’s another very different thing.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- kube-system 4y ago
  4 deaths might be quite a lot for such a relatively low volume product. By comparison, some car models have recently had their death rates drop to zero after nobody died in them over similar periods of time. And these figures are mostly user error. Deaths due to product failures of automobiles are usually pretty notable and are acted upon by regulators.
- Havoc 4y ago
  There are an alarming amount of “me too” in this hn comment section (non fatal obv)
celestialcheese 4y ago
Reading this warning, I don't understand why now? Is there a bug with onewheels that are causing this injury/death? Or is it just rider error doing a dangerous activity? Is the CPSC going to start warning against purchasing Rossignol skis or Santa Cruz mountain bikes because their respective activities are dangerous? Participation in action sports and high-speed transportation will result in a higher expected mortality rate over the mean. I don't know who in their right mind would think flying down a street at >15mph on a single wheel would be _not_ incredibly dangerous. Let adults make stupid decisions - whether that's jumping off a building with a parachute, riding a bike down a recklessly steep hill or hurtling my body down Main St. on a sideways unicycle.
- latchkey 4y ago
  > Is there a bug with onewheels that are causing this injury/death? Yes. https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=onewheel+injuries https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=onewheel+injuri... Edit: I should have explained this more. There are whole threads on YT on how these things are super dangerous and causing a lot of injuries. Especially with random lockups. There are videos about the poor construction, lockups, dangerous to self repair, etc. I found them when I started to look into buying one of these myself. Here is a reddit thread full of stories... https://www.reddit.com/r/onewheel/comments/robnkf/lets_talk_about_our_one_wheel_injuries/ https://www.reddit.com/r/onewheel/comments/robnkf/lets_talk_... Old, but Casey Neistat broke his collar bone... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ay5M82IcUI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ay5M82IcUI Lawsuit over wrongful death: https://gearjunkie.com/news/onewheel-wrongful-death-lawsuit https://gearjunkie.com/news/onewheel-wrongful-death-lawsuit Nosedives: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=24T4xrSf1Dg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=24T4xrSf1Dg Electronic issues: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6G3ddOMvBws https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6G3ddOMvBws https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T5b3fHL6ko0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T5b3fHL6ko0 Onewheel CEO SBF moment: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2PrcgfsX14 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2PrcgfsX14
  - shockeychap 4y ago
    This is not a link to a video describing a specific bug in the product. It's just a link to a search of "onewheel injuries" in YouTube, which presents a variety of videos detailing all manner of injuries that come from operator error and the inherent dangers of OneWheel operation. Try searching for "mountain bike injuries" and see what you get. Is there anything else? (I'm sincerely interested. The CPSC article clearly infers a situation in which it suddenly stops. Is this confirmed?)
opwieurposiu 4y ago
One issue with the skateboard style of e-wheel is that your feet are perpendicular to the direction of motion. This means when the wheel quits or you hit a big bump you will have to turn 90deg before you can run. The unicycle style where your feet are parallel to the direction of travel is much easier to "run-out" if the motor quits. The unicycle style also allows a larger wheel and larger batteries. I think reason the unicycle configuration is less popular is that it does not look as cool as the skateboard style. My wife calls mine the dorkmobile.
- themagician 4y ago
  Skateboarders train themselves to run out in this situation pretty much immediately. With OneWheel you never really "train" to fall, instead you try to avoid it. So if you don't come from a skateboarding background you have no muscle memory.
  - cwkoss 4y ago
    Skateboarders train themselves to run out early in their practice, in front of the garage when they hit a pebble at <5mph. And get frequent future practice. I imagine if your first skateboard fall was at 15+mph after a month of complacency, skateboards would be attributed to a whole lot more concussions.
  - thelopa 4y ago
    It’s much easier to run after bailing from a skateboard than to run after a nosedive. I’ve been casually longboarding for ~12 years, and I rode an electric longboard for my commute for ~3 years. Learning to run out after bailing (or at least slow yourself down for a few steps before you lose your footing) is an essential skill, and you learn to do it automatically. Having the right stance helps a lot to ensure that when the board stops you can handle it. Realizing you need to hop off is a luxury you don’t always get. When my OneWheel nosedived, I was completely thrown for a loop. It stops abruptly (more so than a skateboard usually will), your stance is heavily restricted (due to the balance requirement), and the board messes with your trajectory and balance as it tips. It kind of throws you toward the pavement while a skateboard just throws you forwards. I love it, but it is definitely a vehicle you need to be careful with.
rainsurf 4y ago
I strongly disagree with this recall. I own a Onewheel (XR) and have ridden nearly ~1,000 miles on it in a variety of conditions. I've only had one incident and it was entirely my fault (riding at night without proper lights and hit a pothole). The Onewheel definitely has a learning curve. Like most things in life if you are patient in learning it and respect the limits it is entirely safe. I think the safeguards Onewheel has implemented are completely adequate (primarily pushback). I think the big problem is people not wearing safety gear and/or maxing out the board (speed specifically) too early.
- themagician 4y ago
  Have you ever had the power fail?
  - rainsurf 4y ago
    I assume you mean the board fully power off while riding? If yes, then no. It is possible to overload the motor by going over the maximum speed or going uphill by at too high of a speed but in that case the board will not actually power off. The only way the board may turn off is if is fully charged and you immediately ride it downhill (regenerative breaking). To protect the battery from overcharging the board it will turn off in that case but the app will warn you before that happens and for newer boards they have implemented the ability to charge to less than 100% if that is how you start your route.
    - themagician 4y ago
      It's possible that the board just fails for any number of reasons. I had a Boosted Board fail on me once. No idea why. It just powered off randomly while I was riding. Wasn't going downhill, wasn't full battery, wasn't a depleted battery. It was a bit scary to suddenly feel the power go out, but I was able to safely come to a stop. I was probably going about 15 MPH. I never figured out what happened. It turned right back on. This was the first time the board gave me pause. I kept riding for a few months until I did actually get hurt—100% on my own stupidity. I tried to go over some train tracks while leaning too much on the front trucks and was going fast, but not quite fast enough to cruise over them, and the wheels properly got stuck in the tracks, so I got to experience the fun of flying. Fortunately I was not critical injured, just extreme bruising. Helmet 100% saved my life though. This is the same kind of thing that can happen with a OneWheel—only no user error is needed for it to happen, merely a power failure. OneWheel either needs an integrated solution that allows you to roll out in the event of a power failure, or some kind of redundancy to ensure the probability of a power failure is effectively zero. Anything less leads to (preventable) death.
latchkey 4y ago
Oh good. I live near the beach where a lot of people ride and I've seen a few people take nose dives on them when they suddenly stop for no reason.
colechristensen 4y ago
Title does not match link. Nowhere does it say a recall was ordered, it does say the manufacturer is refusing to comply with what I assume is a suggestion for a voluntary recall. Does the CPSC have the authority to order unilateral recalls? I'm honestly considering buying one while I still can, they seem like fun and I'm just fine with the risks as long as there isn't some hidden failure or manufacturing defect.
acomjean 4y ago
On the one hand people seem to get good enough on them to be able to race down mountains. But they do seem somewhat dangerous when in the mix with cars,bikes and pedestrians. There is I imagine a learning curve. https://www.onewheelracing.com/ https://www.onewheelracing.com/ They're fairly uncommon here around Boston, and usually riders are wearing motorcycle style helmets. I see a lot more electric scooters zipping around (like the Bird and Lime ones, but privately owned). The only device I've seen someone fall off of was an electric skateboard (No particular reason (they were coming to a stop at a light and fell foward.).
idatum 4y ago
My inner twenty-something and my not-twenty-something body will benefit from a report like this. I'm still reasonably athletic and those things look dang cool, but the pause a report like this gives is healthy. I also agree with other comments related to motorized bicycles. I wear motorcycle gear even when riding locally and under 40 mph. Electric bikers can benefit from "gearing up".
jshzglr 4y ago
Let’s recall all cars. I hear people get injured in them as well.
- kube-system 4y ago
  We do recall cars when design flaws endanger or kill users. This happens literally hundreds of times per year in the US.
  - jshzglr 4y ago
    Yes when there is a legit defect. People getting injured on onewheels are pushing the board to the max, ignoring the warnings and face planting when the board tops out.
    - kube-system 4y ago
      Posting a warning is not a license to sell anything. Lots of products, including cars, that used to have safety warnings have been recalled or are no longer sold.
      - jshzglr 4y ago
        It’s literal feedback from the board. No reading necessary. The board has push back to basically tell you to chill out.
    - closetohome 4y ago
      This is the real issue. People don't read the instructions and push the board out of its safety envelope, then they crash, get angry, and complain about it online. I've read hundreds of crash reports, and never seen more than a handful that weren't a direct result of the user's actions. Actual system failures are vanishingly rare, and most nosedives are only as bad as they are because the rider is traveling at an unsafe speed and has not invested in the training or equipment to fall safely.
ok_dad 4y ago
I never realized how fast 25mph was until I fell off my two wheeled electric scooter going that speed and was slowed down by a bus-head impact after I braked a bit. Luckily I was wearing a helmet and long pants, but I still broke my back in several places. A cop that saw me whiff it said I was probably only going 10 by the time I hit the bus. I believe all of these electric whatever should be lawfully mandated to go below at least 15mph if not lower. I don’t believe that people are able to grasp just how unsafe those speeds are.
- kevin_thibedeau 4y ago
  They are already largely illegal in the US when operated on public roads.
- Havoc 4y ago
  The EU has speed limits on ebikes. 20kmh I believe (while not pedalling) which is just under your 15
  - MivLives 4y ago
    US has this too for not peddling, in some states. In the US a class 2 is throttle only (no pedaling) hit 15. A class 3 is up to 25 as long as you're peddling.
  - danhor 4y ago
    It's 25kmh for pedelecs. Most countries also limit E-Scooters to 25kph, but (for example) Germany limits them to 20kph.
- MivLives 4y ago
  You're probably right. I'm in Seattle and the street scooters all cap at 15, my personal one caps at 20. That 5mph is a surprisingly big difference.
parkingrift 4y ago
I don't know why the CPSC has singled out Onewheel. If they're going to try and regulate this new class of mobility they need to do better than phoning it in. This feels just as random and absurd as the clampdowns on Juul. Don't buy Juul, but do feel free to buy flavored nicotine from these thousands of other less scrupulous vendors. There are absurdly under braked e-bikes with 30+ mph motors, electric scooters with 40+ mph motors, "unicycles" with 40+ mph motors, and even competing "onewheel" type products. Based on the arguments provided in the linked article these are all worthy of regulation. I disagree with the premise, but if they're going to regulate one they should regulate all.
- MivLives 4y ago
  I've been on a bunch of these. They should regulate them all, in a consistent way across all states. One Wheels are unique in that they're a USA company that is pretty well known and has a very obvious failure mode. EUCs still suffer that dorky rep for whatever reason. Ebikes motor dying won't cause a crash. Same with most escooters. Anything that goes above 20 with a motor has no place in a bike lane. Yes I know bike riders can go over that. Over 20 is when you start needing to look into moped safety gear instead of bike and knowing what you're doing.
danboarder 4y ago
I own and ride a Onewheel Pint (17mph max) and found it limiting, so moved up to an EUC (electric unicycle) that goes 30mph. I always wear a helmet and come from an extensive background riding BMX on ramps and jumps, skateboarding, snowboarding, and mountain biking. I agree with some other comments here that there is a learning curve and these are relatively dangerous for new riders, just like a skateboard is dangerous. But I do not think these are inherently more dangerous than a normal skateboard or bike. It's just that the self balancing and electronic assistance can give an unearned sense of confidence where the rider is less cautious than they should be.
- MivLives 4y ago
  Been wanting to go over to an EUC. How have you found the transition. I have like 1.5k miles on a onewheel xr but switched to scooters after people I knew kept getting injured. Hate to say the scooter is... too safe but it's sorta just standing there and hitting a button.
  - danboarder 4y ago
    The learning curve/transition from Onewheel to EUC for me was about a week to get up to speed, I watched a few videos and practiced along a building wall, as well as in a parking lot for about two hour sessions a few times for a couple days before I actually commuted on it on the streets. For the commuting I do, an EUC has been great - I ride an older Begode Tesla V2 (current version is T4) it has been perfect for riding in traffic with the quick acceleration, higher top speed, and great in bike lanes too. Also for longer rides I prefer riding facing forward on an EUC (like skis), vs the snowboard style stance of my onewheel. Begode Tesla T4 (newest version of the size wheel I ride, now comes with suspension) https://eevees.com/products/begode-tesla-t4 https://eevees.com/products/begode-tesla-t4 Some EUC riding tips: https://youtu.be/vR-OYR5ziSQ https://youtu.be/vR-OYR5ziSQ
dghlsakjg 4y ago
I love riding my onehwheel, but it is incredibly, stupidly, dangerous and the company DOES NOT CARE. Out of the box, mine was prone to runaway/ghosting where it would continue riding even if no one is on it. Kind of dangerous for a 25 pound device to go careening into the world. I contacted the manufacturer and the response was basically: 'not our problem, you're probably using it wrong' until I sent them a video that I had posted on social media. I have also had the nosedive thing happen. Yes, it happens when you are exceeding the power output of the board. No, it is not clear when it will happen, for me anyway. There is the pushback 'feature' where the front of the board is supposed to elevate, but as a 200 lb guy, it is pretty easy to miss. I suspect that smaller people might get a stronger feeling from it. It is also possible to exceed the power limit of the board at lower speeds where pushback won't happen. In reality, the board should, at minimum, have an audible warning that you are nearing the power limit before sudden failute.
- MivLives 4y ago
  35 pound, that thing is heavy and solid, it's a missle when you crashed. One Wheel XR needed more indicator lights (what is my battery without the app), and a more audible feedback for a pushback. As another 200 lb guy, you could feel the pushback if you weren't trying to split the weight between your feet and instead pushing down. This is a very unintuitive thing at first.
gttalbot 4y ago
Honestly if the CPSC existed when motorcycles were invented, they might not exist. I gotta go with the Onewheel people on this one.
danielodievich 4y ago
My children's grandfather is very good at sports and balancing and has been riding onewheels for as long as they've been around. My kids learned from him quite a while ago. Couple of years ago they each got a Pint from grandmother as a gift. They always wear helmets but we had a hard time getting them to wear wrist guards, that is, until one of my kids pushed it to the limit downhill in a park, rode over the pebble, wiped out and broke his wrist. His app said he hit 17mph. Since then, there hasn't been a ride without helmet and wrist-guards and they ride around quite a bit, to a store, around the city, to the park, just for the hell of it. Breaking his wrist sucked for him but was a great teaching moment for the rest of his life, to wear right equipment for the job. They always comment on people tooling around without helmets on those wheels or scooters. We as parents have a small success right here.
- MivLives 4y ago
  Glad you got them on wrist guards. I found that as long as the wrist guard was relatively easy to wear and didn't look hyper dorky people would wear it. I was using fingerless Hillbilly wrist guards, and they just look like fingerless gloves to most people. Made people more likely to wear them when I lent it out.
galoisscobi 4y ago
One time I ran into someone who ran a consulting firm in the Bay Area at a meet up who told me that Onewheel had raised capital but had horrendous engineering when they came to this consultant. The consultants turned it into a product that could be sold. I don’t know how true the story is, but whenever Onewheel comes up, I revisit that conversation, wondering if what that consultant said was true.
supernova87a 4y ago
I have watched closely on my commute every day how people use these (SF/Mountain View, etc), and I am stunned at how close to disaster some people are. They put their hands deep in their pockets with the controller, don't wear helmets, have precarious backpacks that change their balance, etc. You are one larger-than-expected crack in the road from being thrown off the wheel under a bus. At one point I rode scooters to work, but after one such incident (fairly benign but I could see where it was headed) I swore off anything so unstable.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
oxplot 4y ago
One wheel scooter are generally more dangerous than their two or more wheeled counterparts because upon software bug or power loss, all control is lost. At higher speeds, serious injury is very likely.
blobbers 4y ago
Onewheel is a bit of a special case in the sense that if it stops balancing, you tend to "nosedive" (tip forward) causing the front of the board to hit the ground and stop very suddenly, ejecting the rider forward as the back foot lifts and the front foot drops. Given that electronics do stop functioning at some point in their life, if the onewheel is in motion when that happens it will be very bad for you, especially if you lack safety gear.
rlt 4y ago
I guess they should recall all skateboards too.
- Havoc 4y ago
  They don’t tip over and instantly dig into the ground.
willk 4y ago
I had my Onewheel take a nose dive for no reason. I had just started moving forward on it, was probably going 8-10mph. I broke my arm. I contacted support, and they told me nothing was wrong with board that they could see in their diagnostic. I haven't ridden it much since as I can't trust it.
throwawaaarrgh 4y ago
What's hard for me to get over is they cost as much as a used Honda Civic.
- unstatusthequo 4y ago
  But way more fun imho
prirun 4y ago
A guy at my gym was on one of these, it stopped suddenly and threw him. He broke his pelvis and is still rehabbing a month later, probably a couple months left to go. Guess he's "lucky" he didn't die.
zoklet-enjoyer 4y ago
4 deaths in 3 years for a motorized vehicle sounds good to me
clolege 4y ago
The Onewheel seems so obviously dangerous. Any vehicle that dumps its passenger when losing power eventually will. It’s just a matter of cycles before the lithium ion battery starts dying fast. While it seems like a simple mitigation could be to make the “pushback” mechanism more obvious (i.e. slowly decrease the top speed as the battery loses power), it makes me wonder what’s the point? Can’t we let Darwinism do it’s thing here?
reiderrider 4y ago
I purchased the OneWheel XR in 2016 and think it’s an engineering marvel. It has on occasion glitched while riding which has led to some falls. Speed and torque have degraded but it has outlasted my last 3 laptops combined. Anytime you get on a skateboard you are taking a risk.
randyrand 4y ago
Cars, Motorcycles, Bicycles, Snowboards, Skateboards I fail to see how this is more dangerous without real statistics.
- iancmceachern 4y ago
  The issue is that a product defect/failure causes preventable accidents. It's just like the GM ignition key thing.
MivLives 4y ago
I'm a former rider of a Onewheel XR. I stopped due to not wanting to end up in a hospital during covid. The nose diving thing has been known in rider groups for awhile. It's always been a sporadic issue though. Some caveats to One Wheels. Everyone mods these things. New tires, fenders, fangs, colored panels for protection, different back and front pads to stand on, and skid plates were pretty common on most One Wheels I saw. More extreme stuff like battery mods (one involved removing some of the battery protective plating to fit more battery in) isn't normal but it does exist. Future Motion sorta shut down the repairability of the newer One Wheels from my understanding. How many of these could be prevented by replacing a shot battery pack, or swapping in a new front pad? Not all of them of course, but if you're relying on this thing to keep you upright, why make regular maintenance take shipping a 35 pound board in? I had to do a tire swap after about 800 miles, and I did 3 in my time owning the board.
akulbe 4y ago
I have a good friend who wrecked while on one of these, and he broke his collarbone. I'm very surprised it took this long to recall them.
puffoflogic 4y ago
> There have been at least four reported deaths between 2019 and 2021 If it were invented today the bicycle would be illegal.
causi 4y ago
I'd be sad about this, but OneWheel is a godawful company and they absolutely deserve to go out of business.
achenatx 4y ago
the software on my pint is glitchy for sure. I have multiple steep hills to get out of my street, the pint will often times slowly lose its balance point meaning the nose gets closer and closer to the ground. When going downhill it is a disaster. Ill ride it around casually on the grass, but wouldnt use it for serious commuting. It often times wont run with a battery overheating error when the app clearly shows the battery temp as fine.
gennarro 4y ago
Not at all shocking; a similar product was recalled in 2018! https://recall.report/recall/843219020/ https://recall.report/recall/843219020/ Also a one-wheel, Electric skate board.
jillesvangurp 4y ago
Vehicles like this are not actually road legal in a lot of places precisely because of the risks to their users and other traffic. That being said, I think a recall is a bit harsh though. People falling off these things are going to have injuries and occasionally pretty severe ones resulting in death. In the same way, snow boarding is not without risk. I think you can make a strong case for that being expected and just part of the risk that you accept using these things.
AtillaBosma 4y ago
I just wish more countries had the dutch biking infrastructure. I just bike to the city for 30/45m on a long, bike only road that's completely safe for everyone involved. If I had to instead use devices like this on a road that can also easily have people walking on them, I can easily see crashes and many injuries happening. There is just a need for making roads for cars smaller, and creating 2 extra separate roads for pedestrians and bikes/electrical vehicles (would rather have 3 roads, electric bikes can be annoying, but it's not always possible).
Mikhail_K 4y ago
The onewheel is an inherently bad, unsafe design. The long board that a rider stands on is ever liable to stick into the ground and throw a rider. Compared even to a monowheel (not the safest mode of transportation in itself), it is downright scary. Generally, rider of a unicycle or similar self-balancing device puts his life and limb in the hands of an unknown microcontroller programmer. The software on those things should be regulated as strictly as the airplane autopilots.
rasz 4y ago
I dont see anything about a recall in this press release, just a warning for consumers. Looks like CONSUMER PRODUCT SAFETY COMMISSION (they call themselves in all caps) doesnt have any power.

275 points by alden5 4y ago

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

salad-fan 4y ago

bilsbie 4y ago
Seems uncalled for.
- salad-fan 4y ago

alden5 4y ago

onewheels suffer from a problem known as nosediving in which the board shuts off when it can't supply enough power to support the rider, as the board is self balancing this is a problem intrinsic to the board's form factor. The board works in a similar fashion to balancing something like an umbrella on your hand, as the rider leans forward it creates an imbalance that requires the board to accelerate in order to keep the rider upright. The only possible safety feature to prevent nosedives is to inform the rider that they're approaching the board's limits, this is done with "pushback" where the board elevates the nose making the rider uncomfortable, signaling that they should slow down. Newer boards are more aggressive with pushback, it's definitely a balancing act giving the user the most power from their board while also preventing them from nosediving, future motion faced significant backlash when their new flagship board implemented extremely strong pushback at a speed lower than a prior discontinued model

aksss 4y ago
Good summary. I would just add that "can't supply enough power" is a state the board can enter into either in lower battery levels or (more often) when a rider has put their center of mass too far forward, causing the board to work harder to stay under them, while also moving at a higher rate of speed or accelerating - the board can't give enough power to maintain this. Pushback is to be respected, but the user can also ignore it and carry on. It's literally the board telling you that you need to get ready to run if you don't stop, but many will just ignore and keep on keepin' on, often at speeds faster than they are capable of running. Watch this in action here: https://www.reddit.com/r/onewheel/comments/ywq655/the_scorpion_queen/ https://www.reddit.com/r/onewheel/comments/ywq655/the_scorpi... I've said before that Onewheels are the Lawn Darts of our generation, we're lucky to enjoy them before the nannies start taking our toys away. They are super fun though - so much fun.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- js2 4y ago
  When I was a teenager I rode my skateboard down a parking lot ramp when I realized I was going way too fast, was about to enter the street and the only way to bail was to jump off and run. It looked about like that video. I didn’t realize these one wheels have top speeds of 16-20 mph. That’s faster than most people can sprint. 16 mph is a 3:45 mile. 20 is a 3:00 mile. > we're lucky to enjoy them before the nannies start taking our toys away See also three wheelers: https://www.hotcars.com/this-is-why-the-3-wheeled-atv-was-banned-from-the-usa/ https://www.hotcars.com/this-is-why-the-3-wheeled-atv-was-ba... But I dunno, where do you draw the line? As a 50 year-old who makes a living typing I chose not to buy a table saw last year because I decided it was inherently a riskier tool that I ever wanted to use. I ended up with a track saw instead. I think that was a good decision but not sure it’s one I would have been wise enough to make in my younger years. Now I’m not advocating for banning table saws: my point is that Onewheel can put every warning and disclaimer in the world on their product and some people will still not appreciate the risks involved. That said, 4 deaths over 2 years doesn’t seem out of line with other products in the same category. I wonder if something else is going on to draw the CPSC’s ire.

1attice 4y ago

With thunderstorms, you count seconds 'twixt bolt and boom. With the current golden age of electrified last-mile transport, we're seeing the gap between innovation and regulation opening up wide -- now several years. Real-world impact: I routinely get up to speeds on my e-bike that are, quite simply, dangerous. It's not that I never hit 25 miles an hour on my old road bike, it's that I spend so much more time hanging out at ~25mph on my ebike that potholes have gone from annoyance to mortal danger. The risk is somewhat mitigated by the enormous tires and superior build quality on the braking system, but not entirely. I'm glad to have taken a motorcycle license training course, and heartily recommend that other early adopters think about voluntarily seeking out additional training (and I imagine e-* specific courses are available now, if not soon.) Not all good ideas come with mandates :D

FpUser 4y ago
>"heartily recommend that other early adopters think about voluntarily seeking out additional training" Alternatively one can stop being an idiot and ride at safe speed. I bet that "additional training" would require at least this kind of sanity
- thomastjeffery 4y ago
  Safety is conditional to a lot more than speed.
  - 1attice 4y ago
    ...and yet the future continuity of your consciousness itself depends on at least a minimum-viable level of safety! What a diabolical tradeoff :D something-something anthropic principle
- bombcar 4y ago
  People assume a "bike" is safe, and a "motorbike" can be dangerous, but there's no real difference between them. I've reached 35 MPH downhill under pedal power; if I had wiped out I would have been in a world of hurt, or dead, depending on how it had gone.

izzydata 4y ago

Do segways have a similar problem or is the vehicle large enough that it can always counter balance your weight?

ars 4y ago
I think the pole in the center prevents your body from leaning forward more than the Segway will tilt (i.e. it can just tilt backwards, and push your body back where it belongs). With the Onewheel you can just lean forward as much as you like, and the board is supposed to accelerate to bring your center of balance back into the middle.
duskwuff 4y ago
The Segway had a shorter platform, so the user wouldn't put it as far out of balance under typical use, and it had handlebars which allowed the user to pull it back if they started losing their balance. It also had a lower top speed of 10 mph (12.5 on later models); the Onewheel could run at 15-20+ mph. (I use the past tense because Segway production ended in 2020.)
- jollyllama 4y ago
  It's a real shame that they've been forced to end production while these more dangerous technologies have proliferated.
  - duskwuff 4y ago
    "Forced" is a strong word. I don't think there was anything breathing down their neck to discontinue it, just market forces -- the semiconductor shortage of 2020 probably just pushed them over the edge into discontinuing what was already a low-demand product.
    - jollyllama 4y ago
      Yeah, I wasn't sure how else to word it.
4y ago

s17n 4y ago

I'd be curious to know how many onewheels have been sold - my guess is that 4 deaths represents a very high risk of death relative to eg snowboarding, but without a denominator, there's no way to know.

bombcar 4y ago
https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/50-million-miles-onewheel-achieves-micromobility-milestone-301309592.html https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/50-million-miles-on... and https://www.imarcgroup.com/one-wheel-electric-scooter-market https://www.imarcgroup.com/one-wheel-electric-scooter-market might be able to get a rough number.
- mackmgg 4y ago
  4 deaths per 50 million miles means it’s just under 1 death per 10 million miles. That would put riding a one wheel for 1 mile at the same risk as biking 1 mile, walking 2 miles, or driving 25 miles[1]. That is of course only looking at death and not serious injury. Still, as other people have mentioned there are solutions Future Motion has been avoiding that would significantly lower the risk. Adding small wheels on each side in case of nosedives, or adding a loud audible warning in case of low battery or max speed being reached rather than just a subtle physical alert are two that have been suggested here and seem like they would make a big difference. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Micromort https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Micromort
- frankus 4y ago
  It looks like most death rates for transportation products are measured in deaths per 100 million passenger miles. So 8 deaths seems like a reasonable estimate. By comparison, cars are about 1.5 deaths, and motorcycles are 25-30. For the car number, I'm willing to bet that OneWheel riders skew younger and male-er than the general driving population. I'd bet the risk difference mostly disappears if you're comparing similar demographics. For the motorcycle number, keep in mind that you can't legally ride a motorcycle without a license and some training and/or non-trivial testing. And most riders wear much more extensive PPE than the average OneWheel rider. And they're still at something like 300–400% of the risk. I think it kind of comes down to whether you think of a OneWheel as a toy, a recreational product, or a form of transportation. It's ridiculously unsafe compared with, say, a boardgame, and probably on par with recreational products like skateboards and jet skis, and somewhere in the middle between driving a car and riding a motorcycle for transportation.

taylorlapeyre 4y ago

The physics of Onewheels are actually super interesting, and Future Motion published an extremely well-made video recently which explains the issue that the CPSC is referring to. It goes into detail about why "nosedives" happen, and how to prevent them. Really interesting stuff! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WGn7iPN07XI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WGn7iPN07XI

krackers 4y ago
That's pretty impressive, do you know if this was produced by the company itself or just a licensed reupload of a video by someone else?
- wjamesg 4y ago
  Looks like the company itself
toxik 4y ago
It seems to me that the correct behavior to encourage braking from the user is TILT FORWARD, i.e., show that you are nearly at the limit but do it before you're outside of controllable phase space.

drcode 4y ago

There should be a place for adults to purchase equipment for dangerous hobbies, as long as the risks aren't covered up.

unethical_ban 4y ago
Agreed. If this is a problem inherent in the form factor, it should be advertised as such and we continue on, like we do with motorcycles, skateboards and so on.
- closetohome 4y ago
  There are warnings on the box, in the manual, on a piece of cardboard you have to remove to ride the board, and laser marked on the board itself.
  - strix_varius 4y ago
    Disagree. All the warnings suggest rider error. I suspect that if they published, "We've determined that, on average, approximately once every N miles, a onewheel is likely to briefly fail to deliver power to its motor, throwing its rider at whatever speed it's moving," they would sell far fewer of these items.
    - closetohome 4y ago
      It's amazing how hard it is for people to take responsibility for the accidents they cause. Their first instinct is always to blame the board.
    - aksss 4y ago
      Yeah but that’s not the case. You see a lot of the injuries because people on Reddit and YouTube and discord like to show them off, but in grand scheme of things most of these riders will tell you they were being idiots (like riding drunk at night, pushing 30 down a hill, trying to hop curbs at speed, ignoring pushback, etc), and many hop back on their board as soon as they can. The few that weren’t being idiots, well a fraction were lousy or inattentive riders and some fraction suffered a failure. What you’re not seeing is all the riders and boards with zero problems.

easygenes 4y ago

It seems lax of CPSC to issue such a damning statement without an accompanying comparative analysis to other board or motor sports. What’s the injury rate vs other similar sports and how much of that is to blame from undereducated or reckless riders? Also, what’s the rationale for the recall if the issue is people ignoring the obvious warnings the thing is giving that the battery is about to die? This doesn’t seem to be a matter of system failures or inherent design flaws. Paramotoring is risky, but no one is chasing all paramotor manufacturers to recall their products. Similar for dirt bikes. It seems somehow these are getting singled out due to their uniqueness and being a product from a single company, not because there’s a flaw in the design that makes them inordinately risky.

sometimeshuman 4y ago
It's the single point of failure with no preventative maintenance plan that makes it more dangerous. When the power suddenly cut-out on my "one wheel" (it was a different brand) I was instantly airborne. I can inspect my skateboard periodically to ensure the wheels don't fall off. If my dirtbike engine suddenly cut-out I still have momentum and brakes. But with a onewheel the wheel slips behind you and you are smashing the pavement when the electronics fail. For the record, I love my recently purchased Onewheel Pint and installed fangs in case the power cuts out unexpectedly.
mikestew 4y ago
The device tips its nose forward and dumps its rider on their head. There is no need to compare to anything if a device has this behavior. If the battery runs out, I expect the device to come to a stop, not throw me on my ass. I'm pretty sure even a paramotoring rig that runs out of fuel isn't going to immediately hurt me, and those things fly.
- aksss 4y ago
  It does come to a stop. You get thrown on your ass because of the laws of motion. Your last statement - are you talking about using a fan with a parasail, which is a stable glider without power? If you want to use that analogy, this is more akin to taking too sharp a turn in a parasail, where the sail can't sustain and collapses in, causing you to fall like a rock because of the law of gravity. In a nosedive on a Onewheel, it also happens when the rider is asking too much, goes outside the performance envelope, and reaches a failure point. After the rider has been warned by the board that it's approaching that edge, physically and audibly.

0_____0 4y ago

One issue I've noticed with these new forms of electric wheeled transport (longboard, transverse and longitudinal one-wheelers) is that the people riding them often don't come from a sports background. They aren't "safe" devices exactly - it takes skill to pilot them, and when things inevitably go awry, it takes good reflexes to avoid damage. Novices to action sports often throw their arms out to catch themselves when they bail instead of rolling through the fall. They also don't know how to navigate obstacles via strategic weighting and unweighting of their implement. The energies involved are also substantial -- to put it bluntly, some of these things fuckin' rip, which is super fun, but also makes safety gear a good idea. You can take a lot of trauma and abrasion bailing at 25mph+, potentially life-changing or fatal in the worst cases. There's a reason why downhill longboarders and an increasing number of electric wheel riders wear a fullface and leathers.

taylodl 4y ago
Yup - and by the time you don all the safety gear appropriate for motorcycle riding it's just not quite as much fun anymore, is it? Seriously though, you should at least be wearing a 3/4 helmet when riding these things and it wouldn't hurt to wear a riding jacket. It's all fun and games until you inevitably fall.
deeblering4 4y ago
Very true. If you've never been able to cruise on a skateboard, you might not realize how much damage an unexpected pebble or sidewalk crack will do. Riding is a constant balance of scanning the pavement for inconsistencies and making corrections to mitigate them. I don't know if that's even possible at 20+ mph.
- 0_____0 4y ago
  Your latter point is why I'm not really sold on electric longboards. Your control authority on a longboard is pretty low, and you need a lot of control authority to react to surprise obstacles/maintain stability after encountering one. Sure, DH longboarders exceed 25mph regularly, but they ride in semi-controlled environments (scout the descent for gravel etc before hitting it) and are exceptionally skilled. Putting random noobs on electric longboards is a recipe for road rash and broken bones. A few years ago, three people in my office got Boosted boards, and I believe we saw two instances of pretty bad road rash and a broken bone among them.

thembones 4y ago

Never been able to understand why these don't come by default on the Onewheels: https://land-surf.com/products/new-fangs-gt-built-tough-to-roll-smooth https://land-surf.com/products/new-fangs-gt-built-tough-to-r... I put these on mine and love em. They work well and prevent exactly what's being described.

birdman3131 4y ago
But then it would be a 5 wheel.
- unstatusthequo 4y ago
  Probably 3. I am not sure who puts them on both ends ;)
alden5 4y ago
I personally don't like fangs as when the bumper drags on the ground during a nosedive it slows the board down quickly, when I first nosedived at 3k miles the friction caused me to slow down to about 5mph before I had to run it out, I was going downhill and if I had fangs I would have continued accelerating, eventually you need to bail and with fangs wouldn't have been able to run it out.
unstatusthequo 4y ago
I have these. Not sure if they offer a false sense of security or not. But, to me, it increases the chances of me not having a catastrophic injury. I also don’t try to go 30mph downhill without protective gear. Full TSG Pass Pro helmet & wrist guards. Still fun.

robocat 4y ago

There's a heap of videos showing serious crashes on youtube. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Ys3ivCUxIvY https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Ys3ivCUxIvY is titled "OneWheel — The Deadliest EV" and it is was published two years ago. It shows many short clips of some crashes in the first minute, however, beware, it is very uncomfortable viewing if you empathise with accident victims (I don't watch American pratfall TV programming for the same reason). That video also talks about another design/usability flaw at 8 minutes 30.

jgalentine007 4y ago

They made 3-wheelers illegal, Onewheels seem not much safer.

themagician 4y ago

I can not believe it took this long. After trying one for a bit I always wanted to get one, but never felt fully safe riding it. I even asked them repeatedly if they ever had a plan to introduce a board with some kind of additional set of wheels or bearings on the ends to let you "roll out" in the event of a power failure. The issues has always been that, in the event of a loss of power for any reason, because you are usually leaning forward, the board grinds to an almost immediate stop and you just go flying. Happened to me once in the sand and even that hurt. The board basically decelerates to zero instantly. I thought long and hard about buying one and modifying the skid plates with a row of large ball bearings or maybe even small skateboard wheels. You just need something so that if the power fails you at least can attempt some kind of recovery. The way it is now, if the power fails, you are simply getting launched. I always wondered how they hadn't been sued into oblivion, always thinking to myself, "Someone must have died from this by now." I guess at least four people have… but somehow they've been able to produce and sell these for nearly a decade.

evan_ 4y ago
you can get a kit to put little casters on ("fangs") but since they lower the front end they can snag on stuff that wouldn't be a problem otherwise
LeifCarrotson 4y ago
Onewheel started with a 2014 Kickstarter with 400 units that had 5 miles of range and a 13 mph top speed. The 2017 XR and 2020 and later GT and Pint versions that can go 20+ miles at 20+ miles per hour are incredibly new as far as transportation tech goes. 2021, when the most recent death was reported, was literally just last year. That's light speed for a bureacracy. Technology is far faster than regulation - this is true with respect to Uber, Twitter, Onewheel, AirBNB, and a dozen other new tech companies.

julienb_sea 4y ago

This reminds me of the Juul ban, which flagrantly ignored the trivial availability of competing vape products. Then again, the Onewheel system is rather unique. I would be curious to see a safety comparison of Onewheel versus the much more common self-balancing unicycles.

teekert 4y ago

4 deaths in all those years? Much safer than most forms of transport then? Of course I didn’t do the math but it seems like very little, perhaps there also aren’t that many out there?

advisedwang 4y ago
"four reported deaths between ... after the product failed to balance the rider or suddenly stopped while in motion" These are deaths specifically from the scooter suddenly stopping mid-ride and throwing the rider off. It's not including deaths like getting hit by a car. This is the product spontaniously killing people!
- easygenes 4y ago
  Yes, but it is unclear that there was a product failure involved in any of those cases. If the electronics failed that’s one thing. If the battery died because the user ignored it repeatedly haptically nagging them that the battery would die soon, that’s another very different thing.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
kube-system 4y ago
4 deaths might be quite a lot for such a relatively low volume product. By comparison, some car models have recently had their death rates drop to zero after nobody died in them over similar periods of time. And these figures are mostly user error. Deaths due to product failures of automobiles are usually pretty notable and are acted upon by regulators.
Havoc 4y ago
There are an alarming amount of “me too” in this hn comment section (non fatal obv)

celestialcheese 4y ago

Reading this warning, I don't understand why now? Is there a bug with onewheels that are causing this injury/death? Or is it just rider error doing a dangerous activity? Is the CPSC going to start warning against purchasing Rossignol skis or Santa Cruz mountain bikes because their respective activities are dangerous? Participation in action sports and high-speed transportation will result in a higher expected mortality rate over the mean. I don't know who in their right mind would think flying down a street at >15mph on a single wheel would be _not_ incredibly dangerous. Let adults make stupid decisions - whether that's jumping off a building with a parachute, riding a bike down a recklessly steep hill or hurtling my body down Main St. on a sideways unicycle.

latchkey 4y ago
> Is there a bug with onewheels that are causing this injury/death? Yes. https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=onewheel+injuries https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=onewheel+injuri... Edit: I should have explained this more. There are whole threads on YT on how these things are super dangerous and causing a lot of injuries. Especially with random lockups. There are videos about the poor construction, lockups, dangerous to self repair, etc. I found them when I started to look into buying one of these myself. Here is a reddit thread full of stories... https://www.reddit.com/r/onewheel/comments/robnkf/lets_talk_about_our_one_wheel_injuries/ https://www.reddit.com/r/onewheel/comments/robnkf/lets_talk_... Old, but Casey Neistat broke his collar bone... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ay5M82IcUI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ay5M82IcUI Lawsuit over wrongful death: https://gearjunkie.com/news/onewheel-wrongful-death-lawsuit https://gearjunkie.com/news/onewheel-wrongful-death-lawsuit Nosedives: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=24T4xrSf1Dg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=24T4xrSf1Dg Electronic issues: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6G3ddOMvBws https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6G3ddOMvBws https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T5b3fHL6ko0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T5b3fHL6ko0 Onewheel CEO SBF moment: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2PrcgfsX14 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2PrcgfsX14
- shockeychap 4y ago
  This is not a link to a video describing a specific bug in the product. It's just a link to a search of "onewheel injuries" in YouTube, which presents a variety of videos detailing all manner of injuries that come from operator error and the inherent dangers of OneWheel operation. Try searching for "mountain bike injuries" and see what you get. Is there anything else? (I'm sincerely interested. The CPSC article clearly infers a situation in which it suddenly stops. Is this confirmed?)

opwieurposiu 4y ago

One issue with the skateboard style of e-wheel is that your feet are perpendicular to the direction of motion. This means when the wheel quits or you hit a big bump you will have to turn 90deg before you can run. The unicycle style where your feet are parallel to the direction of travel is much easier to "run-out" if the motor quits. The unicycle style also allows a larger wheel and larger batteries. I think reason the unicycle configuration is less popular is that it does not look as cool as the skateboard style. My wife calls mine the dorkmobile.

themagician 4y ago
Skateboarders train themselves to run out in this situation pretty much immediately. With OneWheel you never really "train" to fall, instead you try to avoid it. So if you don't come from a skateboarding background you have no muscle memory.
- cwkoss 4y ago
  Skateboarders train themselves to run out early in their practice, in front of the garage when they hit a pebble at <5mph. And get frequent future practice. I imagine if your first skateboard fall was at 15+mph after a month of complacency, skateboards would be attributed to a whole lot more concussions.
- thelopa 4y ago
  It’s much easier to run after bailing from a skateboard than to run after a nosedive. I’ve been casually longboarding for ~12 years, and I rode an electric longboard for my commute for ~3 years. Learning to run out after bailing (or at least slow yourself down for a few steps before you lose your footing) is an essential skill, and you learn to do it automatically. Having the right stance helps a lot to ensure that when the board stops you can handle it. Realizing you need to hop off is a luxury you don’t always get. When my OneWheel nosedived, I was completely thrown for a loop. It stops abruptly (more so than a skateboard usually will), your stance is heavily restricted (due to the balance requirement), and the board messes with your trajectory and balance as it tips. It kind of throws you toward the pavement while a skateboard just throws you forwards. I love it, but it is definitely a vehicle you need to be careful with.

rainsurf 4y ago

I strongly disagree with this recall. I own a Onewheel (XR) and have ridden nearly ~1,000 miles on it in a variety of conditions. I've only had one incident and it was entirely my fault (riding at night without proper lights and hit a pothole). The Onewheel definitely has a learning curve. Like most things in life if you are patient in learning it and respect the limits it is entirely safe. I think the safeguards Onewheel has implemented are completely adequate (primarily pushback). I think the big problem is people not wearing safety gear and/or maxing out the board (speed specifically) too early.

themagician 4y ago
Have you ever had the power fail?
- rainsurf 4y ago
  I assume you mean the board fully power off while riding? If yes, then no. It is possible to overload the motor by going over the maximum speed or going uphill by at too high of a speed but in that case the board will not actually power off. The only way the board may turn off is if is fully charged and you immediately ride it downhill (regenerative breaking). To protect the battery from overcharging the board it will turn off in that case but the app will warn you before that happens and for newer boards they have implemented the ability to charge to less than 100% if that is how you start your route.
  - themagician 4y ago
    It's possible that the board just fails for any number of reasons. I had a Boosted Board fail on me once. No idea why. It just powered off randomly while I was riding. Wasn't going downhill, wasn't full battery, wasn't a depleted battery. It was a bit scary to suddenly feel the power go out, but I was able to safely come to a stop. I was probably going about 15 MPH. I never figured out what happened. It turned right back on. This was the first time the board gave me pause. I kept riding for a few months until I did actually get hurt—100% on my own stupidity. I tried to go over some train tracks while leaning too much on the front trucks and was going fast, but not quite fast enough to cruise over them, and the wheels properly got stuck in the tracks, so I got to experience the fun of flying. Fortunately I was not critical injured, just extreme bruising. Helmet 100% saved my life though. This is the same kind of thing that can happen with a OneWheel—only no user error is needed for it to happen, merely a power failure. OneWheel either needs an integrated solution that allows you to roll out in the event of a power failure, or some kind of redundancy to ensure the probability of a power failure is effectively zero. Anything less leads to (preventable) death.

latchkey 4y ago

Oh good. I live near the beach where a lot of people ride and I've seen a few people take nose dives on them when they suddenly stop for no reason.

colechristensen 4y ago

Title does not match link. Nowhere does it say a recall was ordered, it does say the manufacturer is refusing to comply with what I assume is a suggestion for a voluntary recall. Does the CPSC have the authority to order unilateral recalls? I'm honestly considering buying one while I still can, they seem like fun and I'm just fine with the risks as long as there isn't some hidden failure or manufacturing defect.

acomjean 4y ago

On the one hand people seem to get good enough on them to be able to race down mountains. But they do seem somewhat dangerous when in the mix with cars,bikes and pedestrians. There is I imagine a learning curve. https://www.onewheelracing.com/ https://www.onewheelracing.com/ They're fairly uncommon here around Boston, and usually riders are wearing motorcycle style helmets. I see a lot more electric scooters zipping around (like the Bird and Lime ones, but privately owned). The only device I've seen someone fall off of was an electric skateboard (No particular reason (they were coming to a stop at a light and fell foward.).

idatum 4y ago

My inner twenty-something and my not-twenty-something body will benefit from a report like this. I'm still reasonably athletic and those things look dang cool, but the pause a report like this gives is healthy. I also agree with other comments related to motorized bicycles. I wear motorcycle gear even when riding locally and under 40 mph. Electric bikers can benefit from "gearing up".

jshzglr 4y ago

Let’s recall all cars. I hear people get injured in them as well.

kube-system 4y ago
We do recall cars when design flaws endanger or kill users. This happens literally hundreds of times per year in the US.
- jshzglr 4y ago
  Yes when there is a legit defect. People getting injured on onewheels are pushing the board to the max, ignoring the warnings and face planting when the board tops out.
  - kube-system 4y ago
    Posting a warning is not a license to sell anything. Lots of products, including cars, that used to have safety warnings have been recalled or are no longer sold.
    - jshzglr 4y ago
      It’s literal feedback from the board. No reading necessary. The board has push back to basically tell you to chill out.
  - closetohome 4y ago
    This is the real issue. People don't read the instructions and push the board out of its safety envelope, then they crash, get angry, and complain about it online. I've read hundreds of crash reports, and never seen more than a handful that weren't a direct result of the user's actions. Actual system failures are vanishingly rare, and most nosedives are only as bad as they are because the rider is traveling at an unsafe speed and has not invested in the training or equipment to fall safely.

ok_dad 4y ago

I never realized how fast 25mph was until I fell off my two wheeled electric scooter going that speed and was slowed down by a bus-head impact after I braked a bit. Luckily I was wearing a helmet and long pants, but I still broke my back in several places. A cop that saw me whiff it said I was probably only going 10 by the time I hit the bus. I believe all of these electric whatever should be lawfully mandated to go below at least 15mph if not lower. I don’t believe that people are able to grasp just how unsafe those speeds are.

kevin_thibedeau 4y ago
They are already largely illegal in the US when operated on public roads.
Havoc 4y ago
The EU has speed limits on ebikes. 20kmh I believe (while not pedalling) which is just under your 15
- MivLives 4y ago
  US has this too for not peddling, in some states. In the US a class 2 is throttle only (no pedaling) hit 15. A class 3 is up to 25 as long as you're peddling.
- danhor 4y ago
  It's 25kmh for pedelecs. Most countries also limit E-Scooters to 25kph, but (for example) Germany limits them to 20kph.
MivLives 4y ago
You're probably right. I'm in Seattle and the street scooters all cap at 15, my personal one caps at 20. That 5mph is a surprisingly big difference.

parkingrift 4y ago

I don't know why the CPSC has singled out Onewheel. If they're going to try and regulate this new class of mobility they need to do better than phoning it in. This feels just as random and absurd as the clampdowns on Juul. Don't buy Juul, but do feel free to buy flavored nicotine from these thousands of other less scrupulous vendors. There are absurdly under braked e-bikes with 30+ mph motors, electric scooters with 40+ mph motors, "unicycles" with 40+ mph motors, and even competing "onewheel" type products. Based on the arguments provided in the linked article these are all worthy of regulation. I disagree with the premise, but if they're going to regulate one they should regulate all.

MivLives 4y ago
I've been on a bunch of these. They should regulate them all, in a consistent way across all states. One Wheels are unique in that they're a USA company that is pretty well known and has a very obvious failure mode. EUCs still suffer that dorky rep for whatever reason. Ebikes motor dying won't cause a crash. Same with most escooters. Anything that goes above 20 with a motor has no place in a bike lane. Yes I know bike riders can go over that. Over 20 is when you start needing to look into moped safety gear instead of bike and knowing what you're doing.

danboarder 4y ago

I own and ride a Onewheel Pint (17mph max) and found it limiting, so moved up to an EUC (electric unicycle) that goes 30mph. I always wear a helmet and come from an extensive background riding BMX on ramps and jumps, skateboarding, snowboarding, and mountain biking. I agree with some other comments here that there is a learning curve and these are relatively dangerous for new riders, just like a skateboard is dangerous. But I do not think these are inherently more dangerous than a normal skateboard or bike. It's just that the self balancing and electronic assistance can give an unearned sense of confidence where the rider is less cautious than they should be.

MivLives 4y ago
Been wanting to go over to an EUC. How have you found the transition. I have like 1.5k miles on a onewheel xr but switched to scooters after people I knew kept getting injured. Hate to say the scooter is... too safe but it's sorta just standing there and hitting a button.
- danboarder 4y ago
  The learning curve/transition from Onewheel to EUC for me was about a week to get up to speed, I watched a few videos and practiced along a building wall, as well as in a parking lot for about two hour sessions a few times for a couple days before I actually commuted on it on the streets. For the commuting I do, an EUC has been great - I ride an older Begode Tesla V2 (current version is T4) it has been perfect for riding in traffic with the quick acceleration, higher top speed, and great in bike lanes too. Also for longer rides I prefer riding facing forward on an EUC (like skis), vs the snowboard style stance of my onewheel. Begode Tesla T4 (newest version of the size wheel I ride, now comes with suspension) https://eevees.com/products/begode-tesla-t4 https://eevees.com/products/begode-tesla-t4 Some EUC riding tips: https://youtu.be/vR-OYR5ziSQ https://youtu.be/vR-OYR5ziSQ

dghlsakjg 4y ago

I love riding my onehwheel, but it is incredibly, stupidly, dangerous and the company DOES NOT CARE. Out of the box, mine was prone to runaway/ghosting where it would continue riding even if no one is on it. Kind of dangerous for a 25 pound device to go careening into the world. I contacted the manufacturer and the response was basically: 'not our problem, you're probably using it wrong' until I sent them a video that I had posted on social media. I have also had the nosedive thing happen. Yes, it happens when you are exceeding the power output of the board. No, it is not clear when it will happen, for me anyway. There is the pushback 'feature' where the front of the board is supposed to elevate, but as a 200 lb guy, it is pretty easy to miss. I suspect that smaller people might get a stronger feeling from it. It is also possible to exceed the power limit of the board at lower speeds where pushback won't happen. In reality, the board should, at minimum, have an audible warning that you are nearing the power limit before sudden failute.

MivLives 4y ago
35 pound, that thing is heavy and solid, it's a missle when you crashed. One Wheel XR needed more indicator lights (what is my battery without the app), and a more audible feedback for a pushback. As another 200 lb guy, you could feel the pushback if you weren't trying to split the weight between your feet and instead pushing down. This is a very unintuitive thing at first.

gttalbot 4y ago

Honestly if the CPSC existed when motorcycles were invented, they might not exist. I gotta go with the Onewheel people on this one.

danielodievich 4y ago

My children's grandfather is very good at sports and balancing and has been riding onewheels for as long as they've been around. My kids learned from him quite a while ago. Couple of years ago they each got a Pint from grandmother as a gift. They always wear helmets but we had a hard time getting them to wear wrist guards, that is, until one of my kids pushed it to the limit downhill in a park, rode over the pebble, wiped out and broke his wrist. His app said he hit 17mph. Since then, there hasn't been a ride without helmet and wrist-guards and they ride around quite a bit, to a store, around the city, to the park, just for the hell of it. Breaking his wrist sucked for him but was a great teaching moment for the rest of his life, to wear right equipment for the job. They always comment on people tooling around without helmets on those wheels or scooters. We as parents have a small success right here.

MivLives 4y ago
Glad you got them on wrist guards. I found that as long as the wrist guard was relatively easy to wear and didn't look hyper dorky people would wear it. I was using fingerless Hillbilly wrist guards, and they just look like fingerless gloves to most people. Made people more likely to wear them when I lent it out.

galoisscobi 4y ago

One time I ran into someone who ran a consulting firm in the Bay Area at a meet up who told me that Onewheel had raised capital but had horrendous engineering when they came to this consultant. The consultants turned it into a product that could be sold. I don’t know how true the story is, but whenever Onewheel comes up, I revisit that conversation, wondering if what that consultant said was true.

supernova87a 4y ago

I have watched closely on my commute every day how people use these (SF/Mountain View, etc), and I am stunned at how close to disaster some people are. They put their hands deep in their pockets with the controller, don't wear helmets, have precarious backpacks that change their balance, etc. You are one larger-than-expected crack in the road from being thrown off the wheel under a bus. At one point I rode scooters to work, but after one such incident (fairly benign but I could see where it was headed) I swore off anything so unstable.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

oxplot 4y ago

One wheel scooter are generally more dangerous than their two or more wheeled counterparts because upon software bug or power loss, all control is lost. At higher speeds, serious injury is very likely.

blobbers 4y ago

Onewheel is a bit of a special case in the sense that if it stops balancing, you tend to "nosedive" (tip forward) causing the front of the board to hit the ground and stop very suddenly, ejecting the rider forward as the back foot lifts and the front foot drops. Given that electronics do stop functioning at some point in their life, if the onewheel is in motion when that happens it will be very bad for you, especially if you lack safety gear.

rlt 4y ago

I guess they should recall all skateboards too.

Havoc 4y ago
They don’t tip over and instantly dig into the ground.

willk 4y ago

I had my Onewheel take a nose dive for no reason. I had just started moving forward on it, was probably going 8-10mph. I broke my arm. I contacted support, and they told me nothing was wrong with board that they could see in their diagnostic. I haven't ridden it much since as I can't trust it.

throwawaaarrgh 4y ago

What's hard for me to get over is they cost as much as a used Honda Civic.

unstatusthequo 4y ago
But way more fun imho

prirun 4y ago

A guy at my gym was on one of these, it stopped suddenly and threw him. He broke his pelvis and is still rehabbing a month later, probably a couple months left to go. Guess he's "lucky" he didn't die.

zoklet-enjoyer 4y ago

4 deaths in 3 years for a motorized vehicle sounds good to me

clolege 4y ago

The Onewheel seems so obviously dangerous. Any vehicle that dumps its passenger when losing power eventually will. It’s just a matter of cycles before the lithium ion battery starts dying fast. While it seems like a simple mitigation could be to make the “pushback” mechanism more obvious (i.e. slowly decrease the top speed as the battery loses power), it makes me wonder what’s the point? Can’t we let Darwinism do it’s thing here?

reiderrider 4y ago

I purchased the OneWheel XR in 2016 and think it’s an engineering marvel. It has on occasion glitched while riding which has led to some falls. Speed and torque have degraded but it has outlasted my last 3 laptops combined. Anytime you get on a skateboard you are taking a risk.

randyrand 4y ago

Cars, Motorcycles, Bicycles, Snowboards, Skateboards I fail to see how this is more dangerous without real statistics.

iancmceachern 4y ago
The issue is that a product defect/failure causes preventable accidents. It's just like the GM ignition key thing.

MivLives 4y ago

I'm a former rider of a Onewheel XR. I stopped due to not wanting to end up in a hospital during covid. The nose diving thing has been known in rider groups for awhile. It's always been a sporadic issue though. Some caveats to One Wheels. Everyone mods these things. New tires, fenders, fangs, colored panels for protection, different back and front pads to stand on, and skid plates were pretty common on most One Wheels I saw. More extreme stuff like battery mods (one involved removing some of the battery protective plating to fit more battery in) isn't normal but it does exist. Future Motion sorta shut down the repairability of the newer One Wheels from my understanding. How many of these could be prevented by replacing a shot battery pack, or swapping in a new front pad? Not all of them of course, but if you're relying on this thing to keep you upright, why make regular maintenance take shipping a 35 pound board in? I had to do a tire swap after about 800 miles, and I did 3 in my time owning the board.

akulbe 4y ago

I have a good friend who wrecked while on one of these, and he broke his collarbone. I'm very surprised it took this long to recall them.

puffoflogic 4y ago

> There have been at least four reported deaths between 2019 and 2021 If it were invented today the bicycle would be illegal.

causi 4y ago

I'd be sad about this, but OneWheel is a godawful company and they absolutely deserve to go out of business.

achenatx 4y ago

the software on my pint is glitchy for sure. I have multiple steep hills to get out of my street, the pint will often times slowly lose its balance point meaning the nose gets closer and closer to the ground. When going downhill it is a disaster. Ill ride it around casually on the grass, but wouldnt use it for serious commuting. It often times wont run with a battery overheating error when the app clearly shows the battery temp as fine.

gennarro 4y ago

Not at all shocking; a similar product was recalled in 2018! https://recall.report/recall/843219020/ https://recall.report/recall/843219020/ Also a one-wheel, Electric skate board.

jillesvangurp 4y ago

Vehicles like this are not actually road legal in a lot of places precisely because of the risks to their users and other traffic. That being said, I think a recall is a bit harsh though. People falling off these things are going to have injuries and occasionally pretty severe ones resulting in death. In the same way, snow boarding is not without risk. I think you can make a strong case for that being expected and just part of the risk that you accept using these things.

AtillaBosma 4y ago

I just wish more countries had the dutch biking infrastructure. I just bike to the city for 30/45m on a long, bike only road that's completely safe for everyone involved. If I had to instead use devices like this on a road that can also easily have people walking on them, I can easily see crashes and many injuries happening. There is just a need for making roads for cars smaller, and creating 2 extra separate roads for pedestrians and bikes/electrical vehicles (would rather have 3 roads, electric bikes can be annoying, but it's not always possible).

Mikhail_K 4y ago

The onewheel is an inherently bad, unsafe design. The long board that a rider stands on is ever liable to stick into the ground and throw a rider. Compared even to a monowheel (not the safest mode of transportation in itself), it is downright scary. Generally, rider of a unicycle or similar self-balancing device puts his life and limb in the hands of an unknown microcontroller programmer. The software on those things should be regulated as strictly as the airplane autopilots.

rasz 4y ago

I dont see anything about a recall in this press release, just a warning for consumers. Looks like CONSUMER PRODUCT SAFETY COMMISSION (they call themselves in all caps) doesnt have any power.