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Liz Truss resigns as UK prime minister
- ndsipa_pomu 4y agoI think it's now down to the public to hold a general strike until a general election is called. Otherwise we're just going to suffer again with the Tories infighting between centrists and far right.
- rhodorhoades 4y agoWhy does it feel like in western culture it’s becoming more and more treasonous/ taboo to suggest things of this nature? If you suggested that every take their money out of banks as a mass movement l, would that be treason?
- gigatexal 4y agoI’m not sure what is more of a shit show: the GOP seeking to control every aspect of a woman’s life and undermine democracy or UK governance. It’s insane. What’s next? They bring back Boris?
- aembleton 4y ago> They bring back Boris? There's a good chance that will happen.
- rdtwo 4y agoDid not outlast the lettuce. Lettuce wins
- danans 4y agoTo be fair, I've not seen a lettuce that lasts 44 days and is still edible. Cabbage yes, lettuce no.
- checkyoursudo 4y agoI don't know this meme, so I can only assume the lettuce has already been harvested? If from seed, you can still have fresh lettuce at around 44 days. :)
- geek_at 4y agoso the lettuce [1] won. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sm-RE95lKJ0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sm-RE95lKJ0
- mkoryak 4y agoCan you elaborate for those of us not hip enough for this meme(??)?
- sebzim4500 4y agoSomeone set up youtube stream with a picture of Liz Truss and a lettuce. People in the chat could discuss what was likely to last longer, the lettuce or Liz Truss.
- raesene9 4y agoIt was the daily star, one of the UKs tabloid newspapers, who often have "irreverant" approaches to the news, this one paid off for them I'd guess.
- capableweb 4y ago"Someone" being the Daily Star, a British tabloid
- loloquwowndueo 4y agoClick on the link? The video description explains it.
- mkoryak 4y agoClicked it, but didn't notice the video description, did see a huge amount of people talking and saying mostly nonsense. I did go back to find it. It's 2 clicks away from clicking the link.
- ChuckNorris89 4y agoThat newspaper started a live feed pitting a lettuce against the PM seeing if she could last longer in office than the lettuce.
- IdealeZahlen 4y agoThe shortest serving British PM was George Canning who was in office for 119 days(1827). And now she made history.
- samwillis 4y agoGeorge Canning died in office, he wasn’t pushed out for being a miserable failure who crashed the economy.
- mcv 4y agoAccording to the article: > The second shortest serving PM was George Canning, who served for 119 days after dying in 1827. Sounds like the UK has had an undead PM.
- gpderetta 4y agopaging cstross
- deleted 4y ago[deleted]
- kamaal 4y ago>>a miserable failure who crashed the economy. Can somebody from the UK tell us what did she do that the economy crashed, in just under two months?
- klelatti 4y agoLost the confidence of the market for UK government debt pushing up borrowing costs for government and for others (as well as causing problems for pension funds who own that debt). She did this by launching a series of unfunded tax cuts and doing so without an assessment of the impact on the UK's finances.
- usefulcat 4y ago
- mynameishere 4y agoAn obvious fall guy. Rather shameful maneuver.
- loloquwowndueo 4y agoGal.
- raesene9 4y agoFrom what I saw it was Truss and Kwarteng who caused the immediate issues, so not really a fall person, so much as the people who caused the problem leaving. They came up with the disasterous "mini-budget" which kicked it all off, they dismissed a senior treasury civil servant right before that, they didn't co-ordinate with the bank of england. Sure there are deeper problems that are not of their making but they made them a lot worse.
- easytiger 4y agoI think it's arguable that the minibudget overreaction wasn't remotely rational reporting or accurate as the cause of the gilt coupon drop. Certainly that day a load of people made money on them as it was very obvious they'd be fine. But in the cloud of noise that followed, with even the nations top economic journalists regurgitating nonsense... i doubt 0.5% of the adult population could even tell you what happened to any degree of accuracy. I'd argue she shouldn't have been choosen as she is weak in media terms, always has been, and was always going to be an easy target for the screaming minority of people. And yes, timing was unlucky, but a prudent leader would have seen that
- raesene9 4y agoI'd say that all economics at a national level is about confidence. If the markets have confidence in what you're doing they don't react badly, if they don't have confidence in what you're doing, they react badly. By not laying the ground properly for their "mini-budget" they (Truss and Kwarteng) caused the markets to lose confidence in them, causing the problems that occurred. It doesn't really matter what most people thought of it, as they don't run the financial markets :)
- nemo44x 4y agoImagine rising to the ranks of prime minister of one of the most influential countries ever and for your legacy to be a head of lettuce out-survived your reign. That the Queen literally died the day after meeting you. Unbelievable.
- tomalaci 4y agoI think she is one of the best politics speedrunners. Managed to rack up a lot of attention for a lot of different things, finishing with a grand exit. She will be enjoying that lettuce now.
- gonzo41 4y agoYep, she was so reprehensible the queen died! And then off that great distraction she did the job that baldy she almost tanked the world economy. Now falling on her sword and claiming the shortest tenure in British history. I would feel very poorly about the tory gang in London if I were say from the North Irish area or Welsh, or Sottish at the moment. This isn't good for European stability either. Hopefully the money and support continues to flow without issue to Ukraine.
- DharmaPolice 4y agoMost of London isn't fond of the Tory gang either. Of the 73 seats that London has, the Conservatives only hold 21 of them.
- cassianoleal 4y agoAnd the King was already fed up with her as well: https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/oct/13/king-charles-greets-liz-truss-dear-oh-dear-uk-prime-minister-weekly-audience https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/oct/13/king-charles...
- akudha 4y agoBritain, Brazil, Australia, Philippines, India, Turkey, U.S … it is mind numbing that of all the good, talented people these countries have, only the dumbest, worst of the worst end up in positions of power. Depressing. At this point, we can just randomly pick a citizen to be President or PM. We might have better chances that way
- uniqueuid 4y agoNow if only there was an instrument to create legitimacy for leaders, something where the entire population could make their own choice heard in a binding way. We could call it election.
- iLoveOncall 4y agoThe entire population was able to vote to elect the party, and the party then elected her as PM. Her position was 100% legitimate, whether you like it or not.
- castis 4y agoLegitimate only means that the :rules: were followed and nothing more. It does not mean that the rules or the system they reside in are just.
- iLoveOncall 4y agoI never claimed otherwise. I just answered to the comment stating that she was illigetimally in her position, as if the UK was a dictatorship, which isn't the case.
- klelatti 4y agoI think that there is a bit more nuance needed if you claim 100% legitimacy. Winning an election on one manifesto, being chosen by 100k members, and then ripping the manifesto up and trying to implement a set of completely different policies would strike most, I think, as not 100% legitimate even if it's legal. And just to add that she campaigned with members on ripping up the manifesto.
- mannykannot 4y agoThe word legitimacy can be interpreted in either a normative way or a “positive” (see positivism) way. The first meaning refers to political philosophy and deals with questions such as: What are the right sources of legitimacy? Is a specific political order or regime worthy of recognition? As such, legitimacy is a classic topic of political philosophy. https://www.britannica.com/topic/legitimacy https://www.britannica.com/topic/legitimacy While I agree with you that it would be incorrect to baldly dismiss Truss' premiership as illegitimate, I feel that uniqueuid's comment was using the term according to the above usage, suggesting, perhaps, that the law of the land is anachronistic, or less than optimal according to democratic principles.
- edmcnulty101 4y agoCan anyone explain why??
- andrea76 4y agoIt's politics, my dear.
- SideburnsOfDoom 4y ago> why? "How did you go bankrupt?" "Two ways. Gradually, then suddenly." - Ernest Hemingway, The Sun Also Rises UK politics became intellectually bankrupt in 2016. Promises no longer needed to have a connection to reality. Isolationism could be sold as "pro-growth" etc. The disconnect has been growing gradually. The voters loved the pie-in-the-sky promises. So each leader's promises were more unrealistic than the last. They selected for ever more ideological belief, over pragmatism and admitting the downsides of choices. But who would be holding the can when the bill came due? The responses that "She was terrible" are not wrong, but you have to also ask why such a charmless, incompetent-and-unaware-of-it character came to be in power. This is the culmination of the Brexit ideology, make no mistake. This is the "Suddenly" phase.
- bowsamic 4y agoBecause she caused fast, massive damage to the UK economy with her economic plan on which she was already advised was untenable even during her leadership race with Rishi. Yesterday there was a vote on banning fracking with a three-line whip on Tory MPs to vote no, but which many Tory MPs are very much for, which was very controversial, with bullying and forced voting using physical means (physically pushing the MPs into the side to vote no by force). Suella Braverman yesterday also resigned as Home Secretary leaving a letter calling out the UK government as basically incompetent...
- tialaramex 4y agoThe Fracking thing was just simple tactical incompetence and thus definitive proof Liz wasn't up to the job. I think this might cause some second thoughts, at first for Tories, about whether it's actually a good idea to ask their membership who should be Prime Minister. Many of these MPs knew Liz wasn't fit for this post from the outset, but their own party's rules said they should allow ordinary members (a few thousand people who are disproportionately old, white and male IIRC) to decide from the best two put forward by MPs. The members, in effect, picked the woman who said the things they wanted to hear, even if those things were nonsense. If those members were your general electorate, then arguably the country gets what it deserved - but they're not, they're just the party members. If you thought US party primaries were a bad idea, well, yeah, that.
- raesene9 4y agoWhat happens next will be interesting. At this point, a general election would be the obviously correct solution. It's clear that the conservative party don't have a platform and can't agree major policy points amongst themselves. However that would require conservative MPs to vote for it, which is the turkeys voting for Christmas so unlikely to happen, so I'd expect we'll have to wait till 2024 for that election. The best likely outcome is that a set of senior people in the party agree a policy platform and try to steady things for now.
- bsenftner 4y agoEvery time I think the USA is completely ruined, I remember how much worse the citizens of the UK have it. I remote worked for a London based CTO for years, with a science Phd, and to hear him discuss UK politics gave me an insight how effective propaganda and being immersed in a culture impacts one's judgement.
- mannykannot 4y agoFrom here in the US, I'm holding off from any attempt to rank the two for at least three weeks.
- jlangenauer 4y agoReminds me of an old joke. Back in the 60s, a Soviet diplomat ran into an American diplomat on the sidelines of some conference. "I want to congratulate you Americans", says the Soviet diplomat, "your propaganda is amazing, it's much better than ours". "What do you mean?", replies the American. "We don't have propaganda?" "See what I mean!"
- hnfong 4y agoStill true today.
- truculent 4y agoFunnily enough, in the U.K. you’ll hear the inverse refrain!
- archhn 4y agoWhy aren't bonuses for bankers more popular with the hoi palloi?
- lincw 4y agoYes, Prime Minister.
- MonkeyMalarky 4y agoWikipedia has a new candidate for whose photo to put in the glass cliff article.
- blkhawk 4y agoI don't think this fits - she didn't become prime minister in this crisis - At least whatever state of crisis existed became so much worse that it is its own crisis now because of her ideological bent decisions.
- rayiner 4y agoTories should have gone with Rishi.
- rvz 4y agoThere you go. But took the opportunity to buy the pound after it crashed at one of it lowest levels and made a killing out of it, rather than screaming here over a lettuce. Everyone saw that resignation coming after the rejection of their tax cuts by the markets.
- sbuk 4y agoSomehow, I think he would have been worse!
- paganel 4y agoProbably the most obvious choice at this moment. If he accepts, that is.
- domh 4y agoWould he want it now? I'm not so sure. I thought they were gunna keep Truss in over winter and replace in the new year when the worst of the energy crisis has passed.
- ndsipa_pomu 4y ago
- charlieyu1 4y agoThe most Chinese friendly candidate in the current global politics? As a Hongkonger living in UK he really instilled lots of fear among our people
- Lio 4y agoYep, I think he'd be a terrible choice. I think he's ambitious for his own sake but I don't think he really cares about the country long term. I base that on the fact that his wife didn't pay tax here until it threatened his career and that he retained a US green card as a "plan B" for after he'd finished being in power. I feel he had no skin in the game.
- ushakov 4y agoWill the pound recover now?
- ricardonunez 4y agoSome just because of the news, but Tories still on power and still have no clue of what they are doing. It will need a bit more stability and a better plan to fully recover.
- mr_sturd 4y agoI guess we should count ourselves lucky that once MPs are done selecting their next vacuous blowhard, it won't go to the smooth-brained party members who were responsible for the final vote to install Truss.
- eis 4y agoAn impressive speed run. I wonder if it counts as tool assisted.
- 8293048883 4y agoIt invoked a pretty significant crash so it's a definitely a special category
- durnygbur 4y agoAs a smug continental European the next thing I predict regarding UK is that they exit NATO and form a government in exile in Spain.
- AndrewDucker 4y agoThat has to be a record for least effective Prime Minister ever. Comes in, makes stupid decisions, gets forced to reverse stupid decisions, quits.
- ceejayoz 4y agoDon't forget "kills the Queen a couple days in".
- coryfklein 4y agoI really really should not be laughing at this comment.
- thih9 4y ago“Her resignation as Prime Minister will become effective upon its acceptance from King Charles III.” [1], does this mean she’ll have access to the king now too? [1]: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liz_Truss https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liz_Truss
- pluc 4y agoYesterday she said: "I'm not a quitter. I'm a fighter." Hahaha.
- 5350-uiop-1130 4y agoso Uk about to have the 2nd unelected PM in as many months. lets hope the next one can get your house prices pumping again.
- drexlspivey 4y agoYou don’t elect a Prime Minister in the UK, you elect a parliament
- deleted 4y ago[deleted]
- flintchip 4y agoIf only the electorate knew that
- foldr 4y agoI think they do? The UK's electoral system is far from ideal, but it's at least very straightforward. No-one outside of Boris Johnson's constituency saw the name 'Boris Johnson' on their ballot paper, so you'd hope it would be clear to averagely intelligent people that they weren't voting directly for him.
- tibbydudeza 4y agoAt least she will be memorable during quiz nite at the local pub.
- domh 4y agoOnly 45 days in the post; shortest in UK history. She tanked the economy quicker than anyone before. It's quite impressive how you can mess up this bad. Borrowing money to pay for tax cuts for the rich... Unbelievable.
- UltraViolence 4y agoThe sad part is that there's a can of worms just like her in the Conservative Party. She's merely the one that got sacked for it, but the next Tory PM will most likely have the same agenda, although he / she will most likely tread more carefully. After leaving the EU the UK economy has become extremely unstable, with strikes occurring almost on a weekly basis, just like we had in the 60's and 70's before the UK became a EU member state. Mind you that the UK isn't self-sufficient in terms of food (hasn't been for more than 120 years) and economic dire straits could actually lead to food shortages and famine!
- jacooper 4y ago> Mind you that the UK isn't self-sufficient in terms of food (hasn't been for more than 120 years) and economic dire straits could actually lead to food shortages and famine! Let's be realistic, this is never going to happen.
- CaptainZapp 4y agoA significant number of Brits will have to chose between heating their living space and food. Kids will go hungry. People who used to support food banks now need to rely on them. Food banks, which have to cut down on services because they can't afford them any more. While it's a stretch to argue that the UK as a whole will run into famine it's hard to argue that 14 years of austerity and the mess the Tories made in their time in government will not lead millions of people into literal poverty. e: logical error fixed
- ploppyploppy 4y agoHyperbole. This really reads like astroturfing/provocation. > leaving the EU the UK economy has become extremely unstable Define extremely here? Given Covid 19 lockdown policies? > Mind you that the UK isn't self-sufficient in terms of food Very few are: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_food_self-sufficiency_rate https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_food_self....
- hairofadog 4y agoI know this topic is important in substance and the thing I'm about to say is an aesthetic issue, but as an American watching this unfold I have admired the Brits for the sense of heart that still seems to be present in their politics. I'm referring to the parliamentary sessions in which, even though they're savagely roasting each other, they're doing in a way that feels somehow good-hearted and doesn't lay bare the naked resentment and hatred that seems to be all we have left in the USA. Also, less amusing but still inspiring, has been articulate criticism from politicians and pundits who seem to actually care about the thing they're talking about; on this side of the Atlantic, it's easy to get the sense that anyone in front of a camera has a pile of talking points on a set of index cards in their lap that they pull out to memorize during commercial breaks. Charles Walker, giving an impromptu interview, seems to care about a thing: https://youtu.be/Dimw572twfk https://youtu.be/Dimw572twfk Parliament roasts Truss: https://youtu.be/Zc_9Ty_-PrQ https://youtu.be/Zc_9Ty_-PrQ
- Jgrubb 4y agoFellow American, asking earnestly - are both examples just products of the media environment of their respective countries? Does the UK still have popular media outlets that aren't solely pushing corporate agendas?
- fragmede 4y agoDepends how cynical you want to be about the BBC, I suppose. The fact that the "C" in BBC stands for corporation is not lost on me, however.
- darrenf 4y agoThe BBC is a statutory corporation: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statutory_corporation#United_Kingdom https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statutory_corporation#United_K... It typically has no shareholders and its powers are defined by the Act of Parliament which creates it, and may be modified by later legislation. [...] The phrase is not used to describe a company which operates as a conventional shareholder-owned company registered under the Companies Acts.
- Yizahi 4y agoSo the Supply Side Jesus loses once again. But he will be back again the next season :) https://imgur.com/gallery/bCqRp https://imgur.com/gallery/bCqRp
- timst4 4y agoI enjoyed seeing that Al Franken was the writer of this. Platinum level satire it is.
- lvl102 4y agoI am really sick of this UK drama. They’re really the Kardashians of the world politics at this point. Trying to stay relevant constantly. Just go away.
- sanitycheck 4y agoDon't worry, Trump will be back soon enough and all eyes will be on the USA again!
- sfusato 4y agoBiden seems to be doing already a stellar job at that.
- seydor 4y agoDamn Lettuce!
- HelloNurse 4y agoThe forthcoming Italian government could last much less, with Silvio Berlusconi trying to achieve negative duration by alienating allies before a prime minister is nominated.
- gpderetta 4y agoOne can only hope.
- elforce002 4y agoI find this interesting. I've never seen politicians relinquishing power just like they do it in the UK.
- sanitycheck 4y agoShe didn't jump, she was pushed. The resignation happened immediately after a meeting with the chairman of the party's "1922 Committee" - that's the body that (to greatly simplify) gets to make the rules about how they get rid of their leaders.
- rsynnott 4y agoThis is standard in parliamentary democracies; when the PM knows that they're about to be removed, they'll leave. If she hadn't resigned, she'd be going anyway. Even in non-parliamentary democracies, see Richard Nixon; he made a lot more fuss, of course, but he did, in the end, resign.
- ilamont 4y agoThere's a scene in "The Naked Gun 2 1/2: The Smell of Fear" set in a jazz club and the camera pans across photos of various disasters ... The Hindenburg ... The Titanic ... and finally Michael Dukakis (1988 Democratic candidate for U.S. President, epic fail). I feel Truss could have a spot on that wall, too. https://youtu.be/9fpO7vN2-vY https://youtu.be/9fpO7vN2-vY
- ezequiel-garzon 4y agoShe has resigned as leader of her party, not yet as prime minister. She will do so once her successor has been chosen, supposedly in a week.
- formerkrogemp 4y agoTo beat a dead horse to a pulp, the Tories are awful at running the country and have no one to blame but themselves.
- spoils19 4y agoAnother disappointing result for conservative politics worldwide. While her character may be in question, her policies were on point. I do hope that we're not starting to see a whiplash effect where people are against good, reasoned, conservative policy for the sake of a few bad calls.
- spicyusername 4y agoI'm a little out of the loop, and not that familiar with UK politics. What policies do you think we're on point and representative of good conservatism?
- enraged_camel 4y agoBorrowing money to pay for tax cuts for the rich. Oh sorry, you said good conservatism...
- amusedcyclist 4y agoHer policies were terrible. Gutting the tax base, subsidizing energy demand in an inflationary environment. Almost all conservative policies are terrible but these ones were so bad that there was a run on the pound. I'm glad you're not running the country i live in
- ploppyploppy 4y agoA lot of us want small Government and low taxes.
- amusedcyclist 4y agoyeah and thats bad policy.
- spoils19 4y ago> Almost all conservative policies are terrible This seems hyperbolic and doesn't really fit with the HN guidelines. As most HN commenters lean conservative, I recommend reading the room first. In addition, every leader on the world stage enact primarily conservative policy because it's effective. While there are some outliers, it's easy to see just from reading the news and listening to independent thinkers what the inevitable outcome will be.
- throwaway4good 4y agoSo ... ready for Rishi?
- Symmetry 4y ago1) I really like that in the UK system if the leader is crazy the party can just kick them to the curb rather than basically having to support them even when they do terrible things. 2) The US system of open primaries where anybody can vote that we adopted in the 70s seems like a mistake in retrospect and there's a good reason no other country does things this way. The UK Conservative party's system, adopted in the 2010, of allowing people who pay party fees to vote in primaries seems like an even worse idea in terms of candidate selection though it does have the advantage of raising money for the party.
- charlieyu1 4y agoNeither is good. Too many indirect elections. It should be easier for commoners to choose their leader.
- jeffbee 4y agoPrimary election participation varies by state. The U.S. does not have a blanket open primary system, and the federal government cannot adopt one without an amendment to the Constitution.
- csours 4y agoIf I wasn't living in this timeline, the current Republican politics would be HILARIOUS. In short [0], the idea of republicanism is that the people cannot be trusted to make political decisions; you need elder statesmen to do that. In other words, you need grown-ups. To this end, we have the electoral college, which is supposed to block any egregiously populist president. Well that is not how it worked out. 0. So short that it is misleading. I won't defend anything I say here, even though I believe it in principle.
- rhodorhoades 4y agoIf you don’t have any intentions of defending your beliefs, why do you put them out there? It’s like throwing a punch with no intention of getting in a fight. You’re just bound to get your ass kicked. Not only is the UK not a republic but Republicanism isn’t about needing a grown up, it’s about time. Understanding the implications and reading through a 150 page proposal on the bill is not possible for the majority of the population.
- billpg 4y ago
- Overtonwindow 4y ago
- timbit42 4y ago> the British system of government is a disaster. No, Liz Truss was a disaster.
- photochemsyn 4y agoI think the relevant question is, why did a Thatcherite monetary policy collapse overnight in 2022 when it didn't in the early 1980s? One reason is that the British nationalized services that Thatcher sold off to private investors in the 1980s (railroads, electricity, etc.) no longer exist, other than the national health service, which the British public would riot over if it was privatized. With nothing left to cannibalize, there was no way for the government to boost the financial markets, leading to the collapse of the pound. This is good news, as it signals that the era of neoliberalism, with all its intellectual hypocrisy and disastrous outcomes, is suffering one death blow after another, and will finally be discarded on the dustbin of history once and for all.
- ceejayoz 4y ago> I think the relevant question is, why did a Thatcherite monetary policy collapse overnight in 2022 when it didn't in the early 1980s? 40 years of seeing how they work out?
- DaedPsyker 4y agoIn essence, the sell off and loosening of financial regulation expanded the credit but where do you go from there. You can't resell off, there is limits to how far you can loosen regulation. In fact her tax cuts meant more borrowing, especially given she ruled out budget cuts (perhaps not in real terms as inflation was essentially cutting it anyway). Even the remnants of Thatcher's government considered it ludicrous.
- abigail95 4y agoIs this GPT?
- UltraViolence 4y agoGood riddance. The worst PM the UK has ever had. Completely ignorant and intent on favoring the rich she dashed into the porcelain cupboard swinging. The only good thing that can be said about her is that her reign was short.
- lordnacho 4y agoWhat the UK really needs is proportional representation. The conservatives do not belong together in one party, but because of the election system any internal differences are allowed to happen informally via whips within the party constitution instead of the formal, national constitution. Labour has the same problem, as does the US FPTP system. PR would allow different factions to negotiate under formal rules like in other countries, where when a support party loses confidence, they topple the government and cause an election. PR of course also has whips but there's the prospect of dissenters starting their own party. For a look at how that works follow the Danish election that's coming up in a couple of weeks. The old PM quit and formed his own party, another of the old ruling party did the same, and both look to be grabbing quite a large share of votes.
- ShredKazoo 4y agoThis might sound crazy... but if the UK is already de facto ruled by financial markets, in the sense that the PM has to step down if the markets don't like what they're doing, maybe it's time to try prediction market-based governance for real? What would've happened if instead of simply announcing the proposal, Truss had described the proposal and the government had sponsored a conditional prediction market on the economic effects? She could've run prediction markets for dozens of proposals, and selected a policy that was popular with both the markets and the public. (Lest this idea be seen as overly capitalist: there's no reason not to run a prediction market for "degree to which this policy will reduce inequality", and incorporate the result into decisionmaking as well. Imagine the irony: a bunch of rich hedge funds trying to figure out the best way to reduce inequality!)
- apexalpha 4y agoThis happens all the time. People close to any administration "leak" plans to the media to see how they land. Not good? Just deny it. Good? Guess we go ahead.
- mpeg 4y ago"The Thick of It" should be a mandatory watch to understand UK politics.
- ShredKazoo 4y agoInteresting! I think the reason I'm excited about prediction markets in particular is because I think the average voter, justifiably, does not have the time necessary to familiarize themselves with all the details of a proposed policy and related research on its likely economic ramifications. I see the kind of in-depth analysis of financial assets that hedge funds currently do as being somewhat wasteful. I would prefer that they switch to policy analysis in the public interest, by betting on which policies will deliver for voters.
- SilasX 4y agoThere's a term for it: Trial balloon, and Wikipedia lists "kite-flying" as what it's called in the UK. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trial_balloon https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trial_balloon
- SevenNation 4y ago> Truss's premiership has been in turmoil since her mini-budget last month, which rocked markets and was later scrapped by her new chancellor Interesting that the train was set in motion by economic trouble, particularly inflation and a miscalculation about a response. The strong US dollar is exerting effects around the world and will continue to do so. This is unlikely to be the last incident in which the dollar's strength contributes to instability in other countries. There have been many calls for the death of the dollar. Inflation will kill it. It will be killed by countries wising up that they don't need it and can trade with each other using their own currencies. And yet here we are. US CPI growth north of 8% and a dollar that's rocketing higher. Meanwhile countries like Britain and Japan are desperate to find a way out of an acute dollar shortage, tanking currencies, and uncontrollable inflation.
- SilverBirch 4y agoThe chaos is just beginning. I know that what Liz Truss did - by blowing up the finances with a massive uncosted cut to taxes was the main cause of this, but one massive problem that the Tory party is going to have to face in the next few weeks is the Suella Braveman problem. Suella is on the right of the party, she wants immigration down to the 10s of thousands, and she's correct in saying that was actually a manifesto commitment in 2019. She's basically willing to go to war for this, but the left of the party absolutely don't want this. Similarly, the right of the party absolutely do not want to increase public spending, but the left of the party will absolutely not vote to cut the things necessary to reduce public spending. The right of the party want to frack, the left absolutely do not. Yesterday, 40 Tory MPs abstained from a whipped vote to prevent a complete ban in fracking. That's right, 40 Tory MPs defied their party, refusing to allow fracking in principle even though everyone knows that fracking can't happen in practice anyway. There is no set of policy goals that the whole of the tory party can now support, and there's no one with the legitimacy to force them into line. They can't face a general election because they know they'd lose. So their best case scenario is they do nothing for the next 2 years and hope that nothing blows up in their faces. But in reality sooner or later something will happen that will either cause the right wing of the party to blow up the party, or the left wing of the party to defect to Labour. I think at this point the most likely scenario is Boris Johnson returns, a large chunk of MPs defect to Labour, and either Johnson loses his majority or is forced to call an election anyway on the basis that he needs a new mandate to actually get anything done.
- ploppyploppy 4y ago> she wants immigration down to the 10s of thousands The country has voted several times on this promise and it's never been delivered.
- SilverBirch 4y agoYes, this is basically because it's undeliverable without doing some absolutely unbelievably stupid stuff. It'd skewer any idea of a trade deal with India (as Truss demonstrated), it would collapse our higher education sector which is heavily subsidized by international students, and it would cause massive worker shortages in both the City of London and the NHS. It's one of those "people want lower taxes" - "Ok, which public services do you want to cut?" things. They want immigration down to the 10,000s, but no one actually wants to prevent any individual migrant.
- gerhardhaering 4y agoThere was a page called something like hasliztrussresignedyet.com - it should return true now. Does anybody have the actual URL?
- whoooooo123 4y agohttps://is-truss-still-pm.uk/ https://is-truss-still-pm.uk/
- nirav72 4y agoQuestion for Brits here - Is the UK just as divided along ideological lines as the U.S is currently?
- _dain_ 4y agonope, check the most recent polls lol
- simonswords82 4y agoOver a long enough period of time it swings back and forth and the divide is somewhere near the middle. However, the right leaning Conservatives have fucked up everything for such a long amount of time starting with Brexit it's pretty much guaranteed that left leaning Labour will win the next election in two years.
- shaman1 4y agoWhat Curtis argues in his documentaries - that politicians now are mere birocrats at the mercy of the markets - seems truer than ever. There is no place for decisions that do not sit well with the markets, unless you live in a dictatorship - Russia, China, etc. That means all creative or unproven political decisions will be punished by the markets leaving us in a rather stagnant world ruled by market forces.
- gorgoiler 4y agoTo which of his documentaries are you referring? Adam Curtis, right?
- SanjayMehta 4y agoThe lettuce won: https://youtu.be/Sm-RE95lKJ0 https://youtu.be/Sm-RE95lKJ0
- vxNsr 4y agoIsn’t this the plot of an In The Thick Of It episode?
- d23 4y agoSuch a good show. Seems like a good time for a rewatch.
- MonkeyClub 4y agoWhat the UK really needs right now is a second Boris stint, this time with the bid to get the UK back into the EU. Nothing less will suffice.
- aembleton 4y agoI don't think the EU would want us back right now. There are too many who oppose the EU and they would risk Brexit happening all over again.
- t0bia_s 4y agoShortest serving UK prime minister in history during death of longest ruling monarch in UK history.